I think the Winchesters superb health is due to them being the "Main Characters" by Chuck(God). You see that almost immediately once their "Protagonist" status is removed, they start getting sick, fatigued, sore/stiff, etc. They immediately start suffering from common human problems.
Definitely. The Winchesters were clad in plot armor. Even when they died they weren't killed off. The show, honestly, should have ended with season 6(?) - where Sam and NotDean (Adam) fell into the cage. But then we would have missed out on good comedic episodes like the Fairies, the Musical, a day in the life of Bobby, etc
Yep, that was the episode where they quite literally showed how the main characters always had plot armour. Ofcourse they dubbed it the “luck of heroes”, but it was simply plot armour.
I actually assumed that the real God is the combination of Chuck and Amara, the Alpha and Omega, the creator and destroyer. I think that the real God broke into two parts because of indecisiveness. Never being able to take a final action. An issue solved by breaking the conflicting parts into two parts.
Why not all three? Chuck and Amara are the two main pieces of God, and the shadow is essentially what's left. Whatever essence is considered uniquely God, without real form or function, just retired to the void to rest.
Exactly. It's like how Gojo's power in Jujutsu Kaisen works: When someone is caught in his domain, they gain infinite knowledge, but with all that knowledge they are paralyzed and can't move. It's the ultimate irony
The Winchesters just take a Long Rest after each episode, that heals almost everything. They only need Castiel for Greater Restoration level conditions.
I have a Chuck/God theory: Chuck when we first meet him, nerdy writer Chuck, IS human, and actually is a prophet. Later, when he comes back, he is capital G God and he’s taken on Chuck‘s form to walk around in. We see a complete change in Chuck’s character, and there’s no reason to think that human Chuck is dead necessarily, since we spend all our time on God Chuck. After all, we never see AU Sam and Dean again after they cross over universes. Or, God might’ve just killed Chuck to replace him. It wouldn’t be the first time he snapped his fingers and got rid of someone just because he wanted to. Making human Chuck a prophet let him voyeuristically watch Sam and Dean while he also watched other versions of Sam and Dean. Then he decided they were his favorite version, so he took human Chuck’s place, either by pretending to be him or just by getting rid of him.
I like it. That would make more sense to me. So when we see Chuck disappear at the end of season 5 it's God taking Chuck away so He can imitate him later.
The real reason is due to simple retcon. Fortuna, the goddess of luck knew Sam and Dean were talking about God once they confirmed Chucks physical appearance to her. This suggests that God has been using his Chuck form far longer than you would normally assume. Yet Raphael, who was with God since before creation was a thing, did not recognize Chuck as God. His whole temper tantrum at the beginning of season 5, going on about how God is nowhere to be found confirms this and leaves no room for doubt.
@@Ryan_possibly he took his unwanted nephews twisted their souls and gave them some of his grace, that’s why he’s not as powerful or scary as he was made out to be when we meet him
I mean it’s a pretty common theory and seems like that’s what the show was telling us because someone in the show even stated that “they even have his eyes”
Another thing that supports Lucifer using some of his Grace to make the princes. Is when Lucifer said he didn't give Asmodeus the ability to change his appearance. By saying that it supports the theory about using some of his grace.
@@radagast7200 - agreed I think that Lucifer imbuing a "very small" part of his grace to the Princes of Hell makes the most sense. Otherwise, other demons would steal graces from Angels and Archangels to enhance their own power.
I am sympathetic to the theories that Chuck's defeat at the end of the series was deliberately self-orchestrated. First of all, this character was introduced to us as someone who likes to playact as anyone other than himself and even "go deep" into the role. He seems to actually be living a mortal life, not just pretending to do so to mess with the Winchesters. His transition into the petulant creator who now mostly gets pleasure only out of destroying his toys is so sudden and harsh that it feels like a new role. Also supernatural beings faking their own deaths is a trope on the show: it is a primary defining trait of Gabriel, whom Lucifer tells "You learned all your tricks from me." Whom did Lucifer learn his tricks from? Although yes, unprovable or unfalsifiable from what the show gives us, the idea of Chuck being able to not just fake his own death but to fake it in a perfect way makes much more sense to me than him not having this ability: why shouldn't God be able to do this? I will admit that sometimes the show gives us supernatural beings that are compellingly uberpowerful only to come down with fatal cases of "Episode 22itis," and I wish the writers had avoided this. When Death -- perhaps the character most convincingly portrayed as being too far beyond humans to even be a villain as we understand it -- was defeated by a "yoink" maneuver involving his own scythe, I was profoundly disappointed. I agree that the episode in which Chuck is just being cruel to the alternate universe Radio Shed clerk doesn't make a lot of sense for this theory...but that's a pretty small part of the whole. Also Jack brings this guy back to life later, in an act that was certainly orchestrated by the writers to make him look heroic, so...why not orchestrated by Chuck?
So he was basically creating Jack to take over for him so he could leave and start a new game? That would make sense. I always saw him as more of a dungeon master than a writer.
It would be hard to argue free will if Chuck (God) is able to know what choice we will make with 100% certainty, so maybe Radio Shed guy was part of a backup plan to start the entire replacement hunt over again if needed. With Jack's power level if he fell taking him out might have required wiping the entire universe he existed in as collateral?
I feel like Chuck could have certainly built himself up in the minds of others with his own PR. Like he's obviously powerful, a real top-tier heavy hitter, but he's also spent untold millennia convincing his followers that he is the perfect and all knowing, all seeing, all powerful being that we had come to expect.
Yeah. He's basically bullsh*tting his way to the top. In the Bible and texts associated with Judeo-Christian lore, Yahweh got defeated by Chemosh, another deity. He also lost to Iron Chariots. Doesn't seem like all-powerful deity to me.
@@Johnny3Batonyhe is not, the all powerful one is Elohim (you know the El from Isra*el* and the end of angelic names (kasti*El), Yaweh's father. Yaweh is basically judeo mythology's Thor (war and storm's god).
It was one of the biggest/best shows during that time period, and was sort of something new in how they approached how a paranormal-themed show should be done. Plus, there are the added superfans (no pun intended) and the groups who are deeply invested in watching/talking about it because of the Winchesters, their attractiveness a lot of people etc, lol
The Shadow is God, because everything came from the void and eventually will return to the void. It’s also what kept Cass alive and the Winchesters safe by keeping Cass(their guardian angel) alive. Chuck is the personification of creation as Amara is Destruction, they are the yin and the yang in human vessels. They were created at the same moment that the void gave birth to the universe, Chuck to make new ones and Amara to be able to keep Chuck in check
It also makes sense since the Empty also just wanted to go to sleep. "And on the seventh day God finished His work that He had done, and He rested on the seventh day from all His work that He had done. So God blessed the seventh day and made it holy, because on it God rested from all His work that He had done in creation.” - Genesis 2:2-3 And, in Supernatural, they constantly referred to Chuck and Amara as the Darkness and the Light. Well, guess what? “In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. Now the earth was formless and empty, *darkness* was over the surface of the deep, and the Spirit of God was hovering over the waters. And God said, "Let there be light," and there was *light* ” - Genesis 1:1 Amara said they separated during the Big Bang. What if this was it? She also said there was no Daddy, but maybe that is just because she was so young when Big G put himself to sleep, so she wouldn't have remembered him. The same way any kid won’t remember something from their early childhood years cuz they were too young. This might explain it. OR It could be that Chuck used the Mark of Cain to strip her of her memories of the Shadow. The Mark is known to tear down what you were and replace it with something else. Lucifer, Cain, and Dean all experienced the same thing where they said that they remember who they WERE, but it feels like a lifetime since they were those people, to the point, they probably wouldn't recognize themselves if they were faced with them. So maybe the Mark stripped Amara of everything that made her who she was (including her memories, which is why she had to be reborn into a new vessel when she was set free instead of manifesting one like Chuck. ALSO Chuck is the middle child. Think about it. The Shadow is God/Daddy. Amara is big sister (and probably Daddy’s favorite). Chuck comes after Amara. And then when Chuck started creating *life*, there had to be a balance… so then the Shadow created Death. So The Shadow “I'm your father, I lay down the rules”. Amara “I enforce the rules”. Chuck “I'm the reason we have rules” Death “I'm the youngest, the rules don't apply to me” And again with Chuck and his kids: Chuck “I'm your father, I make the rules” Michael “I enforce the rules” Lucifer “I'm the reason we have rules” Raphael/Gabriel “the hoes don't apply to us” And AGAIN with the Winchesters: John “I'm your father, I make the rules” Dean “I enforce the rules” Sam “I'm the reason we have rules” Adam “The rules don't apply to me.” It's all history repeating itself. And to anyone asking, “Well, why is Lucifer and Sam their fathers’ favorites if Amara was The Shadow’s?” Again, Chuck was the middle child. Ergo, rebellious of his father and envious of his older sister. So as a way to turn the tables he was all like, “When I become a dad, I won’t ignore my middle child.” Hence Lucifer being the favorite. Then he created humanity and shit went sideways. But instead of admitting that he made a mistake in showing favoritism at all, he doubled down and repeated the cycle… in the Winchesters.
@@a.t.o.mworkshop6409if you factor in the beginning of Genesis where it said God created the firmament to separate the sky from the Earth (which was also the creation of Heaven itself in that verse), it makes sense that the Empty/God could access it and no one can stop him, because he MADE IT. Also, what if Firmament wasn’t just the natural sky that we see, but the veil that separates earth from the afterlives (Heaven, Hell, Purgatory, Death’s Library, etc.)
I have a theory that Chuck actually lost in the last season on purpose cause that was how he wanted the story to end and was actually bored by the plot line so he allowed himself to 'lose' his powers let jack become the new god and went off to a new universe to write a new story and have some new fun. And when the boys left he got up snapped his fingers and went off to have some new fun, while the Winchester story was him just goofing off some with a spin off idea cause why would Chuck leave a plan B of he knew he would win to devour the multiverse?
Yeah, there is just a 0% chance he didn't see the whole power vacuum plan coming. Everything he did was to hand craft a world that could create Jack. The fact he was tied into the system, even had a book of his life and death, (and yet Death itself didn't seem to see its own death coming) it all makes no sense for him to also be evil like that. Rather he had to have been guiding the world for the sake of creating and then training/raising Jack, turning him into a being that understands how the world should be run in Chucks eyes. Chuck goes around making mistakes so that Jack can see and even directly experience WHY they are mistakes. It was all to let Jack plug himself in, to fill the hole that God leaving would cause. Even the Winchester story can be viewed through this lens. It was a final lesson from God to Jack, that his "no interference" rule shouldn't be absolute, That he should still have a little bit of humanity even as God. Chuck created a situation that required external help that Jack had forbidden but also put those Jack couldn't easily punish to be the ones breaking the rule. When Lot's Wife turned to look at the destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah disobeying God, he turned her to salt as punishment. This was that moment for Jack. God said to not turn around, Dean turned around and looked, and where Chuck would have smited him, Jack refused to do so.
Assuming, of course, that he is capable of heading over to another universe, now that Jack took his powers and left him seemingly unable to even perform simple abilities like the clicking fingers to kill someone.
What if the four princes are demons with angel's grace. like Lucy found four angels ripped out their grace and put it into four demons. That is why they have a pale glow in their eyes and are immune to holy water. Making them angelic demons or angel-demon composite
or when Lucifer turned them he did what Michael did to hs powerup monsters he used his own grace to power them up permanently kinda mimicking chuck creating the arch angels in the first place.
There's always the gnostic route, where Chuck is just the demiurge, the architect of the physical universe. Where he takes what already exists and shapes it into anything he wants, while Amara is his opposite, the only being that can destroy things completely to the point where Chuck can't reconstruct it. The Shadow in this case would be the physical manifestation of the raw material that Chuck uses for Creation. The "Nothing" that needed to exist whenever "Something" came into being, the literal shadow of creation.
I always thought this theory for incredibly well. Not going to go in a tangent but other elements of gnostic work also line up really well with charterers like jack in a way
He wrote a system that could kill/depower him. It is odd to say the least which is why i am gravitating toward to him being demiurge from the gnostic mythos effectively the last boss from shin megami tensei, lol.
@@Raximus3000 Yeah, that's what I've always thought. He's petty, vindictive, can be over emotional etc and is pretty self-centered. He fits the Demiurge more than God.
Chuck specifically says he's erased and rewrote the universe many times. He always could have wrote it however he wanted yet the universe we follow is the one where things got OUT of his control. He definitely didn't plan it, but he sure as hell tried
Chuck was evil from the jump he even said it when they first met him. “I write things and then they come to life. Yeah, no, I'm definitely a god. A cruel, cruel, capricious god. The things I put you through - The physical beatings alone. I killed your father. I burned your mother alive and then you had to go through the whole horrific deal again with Jessica. All for what? All for the sake of Literary symmetry. I toyed with your live, with your emotions for entertainment.” -Monster at the end of this book Title was a major clue Chuck was the monster at the end of the book because he made all of it happen. He told them the truth that one time and nobody believed him because they didn’t want to. When he was finally revealed as the big bad what did he say? He said they were his favorite show. So when he said from the start that he was evil and that he toyed with them for entertainment he was telling the truth. Chuck knew Gab was alive he just didn’t wanna bother helping him. Every time something went down where they wanted his help he said it wasn’t his problem. Why would saving Gab be any different? Easier to just lie and say he was dead. He only helped Michael when he wanted to use him. And give Gabs track record with them he would have never betrayed them the way Michael did. And he lied about being able to restore jacks soul because he was afraid of him. There was a reason they had a ban on nephilim with a kill order on site. Because he knew a nephilim with a soul would be more powerful than him. Jack was never a danger to the world when soulless but he was a danger to Chuck once he got his soul back.
I’ve always wondered why the knights of hell could only be killed by the first blade but the princes of hell could be killed with the colt. Which were stronger then?
I'm pretty sure the Prince's were more powerful, technically, but the Knights were more durable. It really depends on something. Is the first blade truly the only thing that can kill a Knight?
Killing Cain required the killer to use the First Blade and take the Mark of Cain onto their body. I might be misremembering things, but I'm sure that the other Knights deaths do not require the First Blade. Also the First Blade and the Mark (they're a pair, you can't use the blade without the mark) are likely more powerful than the Colt. It's related to whatever gives the Mark its power, for example, there's a theory that the killing power of the blade/mark combination is because it draws from Amara somehow, while she's sealed behind the Mark. The same thing is theorized to be the reason that mark-bearers become more unstable and violent over time.
And the four horse men had to remove rings to kill them right.. my guess is so it makes killing all at once hard lmao. The higher the rank the more raw natural material takes to kill you?
I think personally the reason why the eyes are yellow for the princess is because they are a corrupt version of a Nephilim and that's why the eyes are different
Let’s assume Chuck WAS the capital G God, enacting some weird plan to hand power to a successor over several seasons. We encounter alternate Sam & Dean (the douchey ones) caught in between worlds, because their home universe ceased. Several other universes are introduced and then destroyed. So if Chuck’s master “plan” was to hand control over to Jack, he did it by annihilating a bunch of universes, killing/merging with Amara, and hurting enough people Jack loved just so Jack could Hoover all that Chuck + Amara power into himself, yet leaving Chuck alive as a human. Chuck in his prime needed four archangels and Cain’s curse, just to imprison Amara. And that imprisonment was so sloppy it turned Lucifer evil, lead Caine to become the first demon, and still leaked all over the place. Also, if there’s one Chuck who created many basically identical universes… there must have been only one Amara. And only one curse to imprison her… so one and only one Lucifer goes bad? So alternate universe Michael, not in the “Sword of Michael” Sam costume… why was he fighting Lucifer? Dude encounters our Lucifer, recognizes who he is, recognizes that he’s the Lucifer from some other universe, but still wants to fight. Why? That Michael’s brother Lucifer wasn’t evil.
Don't forget that the only "other" lucifer that we learn about or hear of is the apocalypse world lucifer. That universe is just a "what if" of what would have happened had Mary not of taken azazels deal to save John. So lucifer still would have taken the mark and turned evil, the only difference is with Mary not taking the deal and saving john sam and Dean were never born to stop the apocalypse.
my theory is that in that specific story or universe he let the winchesters win and let jack have his powers but only in this universe and he continues being god outside of this specific universe.
Crowley's comment about Mesopotamia doesn't have to imply him being ancient. Europeans used to call Iraq Mesopotamia until at least the 19th century. Because they were allergic to native names or something. Meanwhile the locals called it Iraq since at least 12th century.
Looking into it, you're right about the naming but for the wrong reasons. They weren't allergic to the native names... Mesopotamia is a native name... before 1958 Iraq was not united and only one area used the name of Iraq to name themselves. At least that's how I understand it.
@@TalkativeHands Mesopotamia is most definitely not a native name. It's Greek. The medieval Iraq did not cover the full area of modern Iraq, true, but that is true for many other countries in the world.
@@ArakkoaChronicles idk about the whole name thing but I think Crowley could have time traveled there for whatever reason not a solid theory but defo possible
Truth! I'm italian and we studying this kind of thing between 10/12 years old in school and is common to read about European people refer as Mesopotamia until 19 th century ! An after that we started call it iraq after around ww1
About their non-scarring and stuff, it's pretty clearly explained that God gave them plot armour for his story... So, I mean... Didn't they even make jokes about how dangerous things were after God did away with it? I mean, Dean died on their first hunt in the last episode just to make that point, from a simple little stabby stab.
I actually have my own laundry list of fan theories that I plan to weave into the all encompassing Supernatural Bestiary I've been writing (covering every species from the Supernatural and The Winchester shows, the anime, the comics, the novels and the source books), I'd love to discuss them sometime!
@stonedViking304 it's the first season in anime form. I believe Jared voices Sam but Jensen doesn't voice Dean... or maybe the other way around. It's been a while.
Imo, Chuck acting in the other universe for the purpose of fooling the audience of the show could definitely count as the act of an all-knowing omnipotent being.
I mean he is one smart guy thought it's pretty crazy to think unlike deadpool who doesn't ACTUALLY know he's being watch but ABSOLUTELY like to pretend cuz it's fun that Chuck actually knows it but isn't powerful enough to do anything about it?
When God says "Gabriel is dead and Michael is insane" yes it sound weird because he'd know they're not but remember what Castiel said "He's a writer, writer's lie"
but then, why not call on them? Having Michael (who was clearly lucid, and within easy reach) would have been of huge help in the fight. To me, it is obvious that Gabriel was supposed to have died, and Michael was never coming back, but then, Season 15 decided to bring them back. Keep in mind, God also said in S11 that he cannot rebuild Gabriel or Raphael (it would take much too long), but then just casually brings back Lucifer in S15. Which was pointless, because if all he wanted was the book, why not just teleport it over to himself? Why even bother with this middle step? These are examples of terrible writing, nothing more.
@@TheFuzzician When he casually brings back Lucifer, it is after Amara and he have merged back together. He is more powerful than he was when he made those statements in S11.
Another theory is that the "Chuck" that comes back after going away with Amara is not actually God, but rather a parasite-like being feeding off him and pretending to be him. This also explains the sudden abrupt personality shift.
So to add credence to the Chuck planned all of it theory. Go back and watch ep 20 from season 11 where he shows Metatron the ending to his story. I think he shows him the actual ending and Metatron in that moment knows he’s planning to properly die and hand the reins over permanently. Which is further explained in the song Chuck sings, calling back to the start of the episode where he says the greatest thing humanity ever created was music. I feel like that episode is one of the most crucial in the entire series.
As far as the true God theory goes: If you look at the Gnostic teachings, the "GOD" of our physical universe was known as the Demiurge. The Demiurge's qualities as described in the Gnostic Gospels describes Chucks personality pretty well in my opinion; Ultimately evil, narcissistic, spiteful, etc etc.
15:25 no, this was HIM spitballing ideas. Chuck does this throughout his time as a character. He creates a person to discuss his framework, bounces ideas, and eventually finds a narrative to spin.
Fun fact: In the supernatural anime, Azazel outright says that he was once an angel of the lord. Also, are you ever going to cover the supernatural anime?
Sam and Dean don't suffer from major injuries because Chuck blessed them, it's touched on when he turns his back on them and Dean starts getting cavities in the last season, Chuck basically gave them divine plot armour.
Also, there’s the antichrist story that was never addressed, that kid could’ve become evil chuck or changed everyone’s thoughts & memories, we need three more seasons made.
Chuck doesn't do much Godly either. The Empty theory holds water because the Empty literally existed before everything and every soul which dies in its afterlife such as demons or the death of angels return these supposed eternal beings to the Empty. We already know that Chuck likes to lock up those he disagrees with. The theory makes the most sense that the entity of Darkness' opposite is just the entity of Light; especially because Chuck doesn't really create on screen but instead claims so while also destroying just about everything whilst his opposite Amara, the supposed destroyer, is rather restrained in her attacks once she fully regains her powers. And the biggest problem of Chuck being big G god is that his struggle and union with Amara literally makes zero sense. Let me remind you that it took Chuck alongside his 4 archangels (Michael, Raphael, Gabriel, and Lucifer) to defeat and lock away Amara; yet there is a multiverse, a collective of other universes each with their own versions of the archangels. Other world Michael is even against the entity claiming to be big G god in seasons 13 & 14. There are three answers for this with issues for each: 1. It took all archangels across the multiverse to defeat Amara Problem: The existence of another world comes as a surprise to both Gabriel & Lucifer, and Metatron, who was supposedly there at the beginning, never mentions it. 2. Amara is not actually that powerful and Chuck is always in control Problem: If true, why re-absorb her? The show acts like this is some huge power boost; as tho he is reclaiming his other half. If he's significantly more powerful than her, there would be no reason to interact with her whatsoever. 3. Chuck is not big G god but rather a personified character of the line "Let there be Light" Problem: Literally everyone who sees Chuck after he reveals himself instantly recognize that he is in fact the big G god. However, more water on to the Empty is the real big G god is that Chuck is not more powerful than the Empty because he cannot grab just anyone out from the Empty's grasp. Chuck's explanation of saving Cas is that he was, at the time, a lowly angel rather than a Seraph. Chuck only demonstrates, outside of a lowly Castiel, he can only bring back Lilith of all people who gets almost immediately incinerated by Aichael. We know that Chuck can leverage and twist the minds of others of which he first did so with Casifer where Luci after leaving Cas' body goes back to being completely against Chuck. Later on, Chuck places both Aichael and Luci on his side despite neither siding with him until suddenly both do. Even better Luci's return from the Empty really only works because he was aready awake which is also not Chuck's doing. The big, huge problem with the Empty is big G god theory is that the Empty does almost nothing _and_ seems to have very little power entirely. And there's really no headcanon that can explain that away. The only real two solutions is that either big G god never shows up at all or big G god is not omnipotent and, in Supernatural, a finite being. The show really should've stuck with the original idea that Cas was big G god in disguise the whole time; have a slight rewrite where Cas and the Empty are the two halves of big G god where one has all the power with zero compassion and the other has true empathy but is vulnerable to physical harm. Not very accurate to God but Supernatural has _never_ been accurate to its own in-universe religions especially anything from the Bible.
Well, I've always thought it did kinda make sense that it took more than just Chuck to lock away Amara. It's different from just a straight up 1v1 to the death, he had to take her alive, it's always a lot more difficult. Apparently, Amara wasn't very bright though, which is disappointing. She's so easily manipulated, it's pretty ridiculous. Seems like he took the wrong approach the first time, trying to out gun her, instead of just tricking her. Either way though, making Chuck the bad guy was really stupid. There were some really awesome moments when he first came out as God. He didn't have to be the bad guy, they could've come up with a much better solution for the next, or final villain.
@Jackyll-x3o Chuck and friends caging Amara is canon to every character that appears from season 10 onward, but my question is who does that include? Obviously Chuck and Michael and Lucifer as all state of actually being there, but which Michael and Lucifer? How can there be another universe with an equally powerful Michael and siblings with Chuck as their godhead especially if Chuck and the Archangels were present at the supposed beginning unless Amara was with Chuck when he created the multiverse; yet if that's true then why did Amara only focus on the destruction of one dimension rather than the whole cosmic roadmap? The meta answer is that there was no plan in writing these furthering plots which is clearly problematic when putting everything into one timeline so that it makes sense.
I really like the Crowley angel theory! And I've never heard of it before. Personally, when it came to demons, the show tells us Lilith is the first demon created by Luci, so I just naturally thought the Princes of Hell were Luci's children with Lilith after she was a demon. The problem is that Lilith isn't that powerful comparably but hybrids are supposed to be far more powerful than their parents such as Jack & the cambion that literally vanishes from existence. But you're right, every demon sans Crowley has black smoke except for those we don't see that Asmodeus was trying to summon. Who were those guys again? Who created them? Were they really demons or something more alike to Leviathans but for Hell? Anyway, you got something wrong about why Crowley couldn't be an angel: Angel radio is _not_ on at all times. Anna only hears the voices _after_ Dean is raised by Cas in "Lazarus Rising". It's totally possible that an angel could've lost his grace and thus became the human named Fergus born to a witch. If human-born angels do have souls (of which there is nothing saying they don't especially with Gadreel healing Cas that one time), then Fergus went to Hell where he either became Crowley or remembered himself as an angel named Crowley. Honestly this would explain why he not only knows that angels can be tortured precisely but also knowing Naomi and what Luci's plan actually is in season 5. Plus he is one of the very few people who knows how to close doorways to other universes something at least two of the archangels didn't even know were a thing. Either that or Crowley somehow learned knowledge that literally no one else except the literally most powerful entities would know AND he also just so happened to know how and where to find Death in season 5 and Cain in season 9. He's also the first and only main-world character to make bullets out of angel blades. He exists in a world where multiple villains he's solely dealt with had the power to snap their fingers and kill whomsoever they please and yet Crowley went out on his own terms. Even when the show got bad, Crowley was continuously entertaining. Angel origins or not, I'm glad Mark stayed as long as he did. Last thing, if you notice Crowley, while he does take over other bodies, he always returns to the one we know. The real reason is that Crowley is Mark's character; however, what is the in-universe reason? Maybe... much like Cas with Jimmy or the Michael sword... maybe that's one of Crowley's chosen vessels when he was an angel and thus much like Cas, the vessel feels like his own skin?
I feel like for the last theory, it’s plausible if Chuck is trying to trick the viewer, since he’s God he should be able to break the fourth wall and know about our dimension
What if Chuck did know that the show itself was watched by an audience, but he is acting like he made all this stuff happen for his own enjoyment when it was really for the audience. Kind of like Deadpool in a way.
I was really disappointed that the makers of the show didn't even bother to go into real demonology. The spirits of Nephilim are considered to be demons, and also the fallen angels. The higher rank Demons should've been angels and Nephilim. Azazel is the name of a fallen angel according to some sources.
Ive always believed that Chuck has always BEEN God, simply hiding behind his own ruleset. Like, until a specific set of circumstances occur, or a point in time happens, God put himself in a quiet box in the corner of Chuck's mind. That box slowly leaks a little bit of God out of it, making Chuck a writer and giving him the ability to not only be a "prophet" and write about everything, but he also chained himself an arch angel to him in case something were to try and happen prematurely. God came out when he was needed, or he thought would make his story that much cooler.
Sadly, Chuck “losing control” isn’t his master plan. In the spinoff series, Chuck setup a fail-safe in case he lost against the Winchesters to destroy the universe/multiverses and Dean travelled the multiverses to stop the weird bug people Chuck made. If you read that and thought that sounds stupid, I would 100% agree, but sadly it is canon.
Before the apocalypse started the Archangels and other angels were keeping sam and dean alive so they could start the apocalypse, after that I believe it's a combo of Castiel healing them and maybe some witchcraft or something whenever he's not around
Chuck's Knowledge and Power, specifically in Combo, is the biggest Plothole possible. It literally made me think 'Is He Watching the Brothers right now?!' EVRY MINUTE of the least season
A cooler idea would be if Naomi and Crowley went on a timetravel adventure together which ended in them hooking up 😂😂😂. Probably to chase....some maguffin or other
One thing I always found interesting about the Supernatural anime which was a 1 season hitter has Azazel confirm he was an Angel once. It's one easy thing to deduce the theory that he was an angel however because Kripke said they didn't allow Angels in the show till season 4. Yet in a season 9 retcon, Dean Winchester tells Tessa in season 9 episode 22 he likes Tessa even though she's an Angel. This means since season one Angels have been around because of the reaper episode from season 1 episode 12. It makes sense that reapers are a class of angel. It's just a given example of how retcons are apparent that add layers to Kripke's run as a showrunner to Supernatural. I could easily see the four princes of Hell as former Angels as a middle finger to his father since Chuck created four Archangels and Lucifer in his twisted way mirrors his father.
Theory 3 - The brother's Health. When Dean is raised from the dead by Cas he says explicitly that a whole bunch of his old scars etc are now gone (the Horror movie film set episode). So at least angelic resurrection is confirmed to do that. This means a few healing resets definitely occurred such as in S5 for the boys.
Later on when Cas and Metatron are trying to talk about the angel trials, Metatron says there's only one nephilim in existence. It was the waitress. I believe the princes were actually fallen angels. The supernatural writers pulled heavily from actual biblical lore.
I think they were human that just happened to have angelic names because they are that old. Demons just gain strength the older they get. Even till this day we still have names that are angelic or biblical in origin like Rachael, Samuel, or Laurel.
You should defo do more of these I love hearing others theories and perspectives it gives me ideas my small brain probably would have never thought about lol
Here is the question that keeps me up at night. Okay so God started the universe after he fought and defeated the Darkness with his archangels. But which ones? Each version of the archangels seems to claim that they helped God lock Amara away. And if so how many marks of khain are there that corrupted Lucifer and caused him to create evil. The implications drive me nuts.
Ok so I think chuck is defo god but not Christian irl god like he’s more of a person then a omniscient being he might even have a soul and that’s why souls are confusing to him that’s also why he feels anger and disappointment and even admiration and love for Sam and dean ( even tho he tortured them lol)
8:30 I know from experience that something stupidly simple can cause so much damage. 2019 i slipped on ONE stair and managed to snap my fibula and tibia to the point the fibula broke through the skin and shattered my ankle. My ankle was literally hanging limp off my leg. Then 6 weeks ago I had a coughing fit from pneumonia and managed to have a Subarachnoid hemorrhage. Its wild how small incidents can cause a ton of damage. But i always assumed it was Chuck pulling the strings of their healing. Making sure they didn't get lasting problems.
The last theory is the only one that makes sense if Chuck is truly omniscient (which he appeared to be in earlier episodes). Season 5 also showed that Chuck manipulated the boys into taking down Lucifer and stopping the apocalypse. Thus proving he could play the long game. Also, Chuck told Medatron he was giving up (the book he wrote). Then he was convinced to change it. What if he did change it so he could reconcile with Amara and she could help Jack. It makes too much sense.
Personally I think God turned after Amara used her darkness powers to "un-do" or "recomplete" chucks Spark. This would explain why he came back darker after she left him to do her own thing. He continued spiraling and the darkness inside him grew and hungered for hers... This last part was just for fun but fr about the rest
I think it's just terrible writing, tbh. Maybe the showrunners like the idea of God as the final boss, but didn't know how to make his suddenly seem bad. The whole "I like watching Sams and Deans kill each other" makes no sense to me, and seems completely made up just to try to justify Season 15.
I do think that chuck was pretending to be a bad guy to make a believable transition of “power” but I do think he still has his power he just wants to go back to being alone. I think he wanted the winchesters to fight for their freedom and give him one last story. And I do think we will see him again. There have been talks about bringing everyone back together to do a true and final last season since the pandemic “ruined” what they wanted the last season to be. Let’s hope for the best.
Jack is the only Nephilim with yellow-ish eyes. Also the reason there are 4 prince's of hell is because in the show there are 4 archangels. The only demon close to an archangel in terms of power is a knight of hell.
No demon is anywhere near the power of an Archangel. Lilith, the first (and either the most powerful, or second after Cain), was obliterated by Michael within seconds, with almost zero effort.
Theory that i had for a long time is Baby (black 1967 Chevrolet Impala) is a divine Horse. it Just like the Four horse had there Cars, Death had a pale grey horse that was 1959 Cadillac Coupe Deville, War had a red horse that was 1966 Mustang, Famine had black horse that was 2008 Cadillac Escalade, and Pestilence had green horse that was 1972 AMC Hornet.
@@TheVampireAzriel my theory is Baby was Famine car[horse], Black Chevrolet Impala, the year fits with the other cars that are from 1959-1972 its a 1967
So the idea of the knights being nephilium makes sense. When Chuck showed up after Jack, his first response was that Jack is a problem... then he eventually killed him. So asking why the knights would be afraid to reveal their real heritage, maybe its because they knew Chuck would want them dead.
Chuck once said "Of all the Sams and Deans, you were my favorites." Which, to me, meant that he made them special. He created an adversary that COULD defeat him, but not one that necessarily would. It's like the Star Trek TNG episode "Elementary, Dear Data" when Geordi asks the computer to make an antagonist capable of defeating Data. Chuck was bored, and increased the difficulty until he got bitten in the ass for it.
For Chuck/god: Well, what if Chuck wasn't even the 'first god'? What if the 'god' is a force of sorts, primeval, not a singular entity, but something that passes from one person to another? Supernatural starts off with the approach that god has been absent, missing for so long that even the angels recognize it. That means a long time. They also recognize Chuck as a prophet. Now, that could be because god manipulated everything... But, the angels have the names of the prophets written on the insides of their eyelids or whatever, right? So, they'd always know who was the current prophet. And, they're pretty much immortal from start of time kind of thing... right? So... Chuck would have been written there for everything up to just shy of the creation of the universe. How likely is it that god, at the start of existence, chose that he would one day pretend to be Chuck so that he could 'hand off' his power to a nephilim? Not very likely... that seems... wrong in a lot of ways. However, if 'god' is a power that passes from one to another throughout time? Maybe? Think of how the power of angels handles improper vessels. It wears them out, burns out the vessel, even physically. A 'god' level of power? Even a proper vessel wouldn't last forever. It might last a LONG time, like millennia. However, what if the one who abandoned all of creation had actually died off, leaving that force just floating, unable to do anything, or help, etc? Well, it might choose, out of desparation, to possess a prophet, even if it knew it would only be for a few years. THEN, manipulate things so that the nephilim it discovers is about to be created is powerful enough, primed just right, with the proper ethics, morals, and everything else, to be its NEXT vessel? This is similar to your last theory, but goes beyond it, fleshes it out I think. This force would understand that it couldn't occupy the Chuck vessel for much longer, and already spent centuries hiding away, powerless... it would want to come back, be strong, help humanity, watch over everything, etc. But, would need a strong enough vessel, which could only come from a nephilim. But, even that vessel will some day fail. Probably millions or years, maybe just thousands, who knows. But, far more than a human prophet.
I certainly like the theory that Chuck wasn't God at all, and just some pretender, but you're right about other things like the alternate universe stuff really ruining that theory. In this particular case, I'd chock it up to the writers not thinking through the storyline that well. The other theory about Chuck and Amara being the two constituent parts of God actually sounds more likely, and would indeed make a little more sense in terms of his powers not being top of the food chain. What I'd really love, is if any supernatural type show would fully formulate their entire universe before they come up with any given story so that there would be no plot holes or inconsistencies and if there were any unanswered questions at the end of the show's run, it would only be because the show was cancelled early by the network and they hadn't had time to provide those answers by sprinkling them into the episodes.
They did seem to think out the first five seasons, the lead-up to and prevention of the Apocalypse, pretty damn well. Once they got renewed after that initially planned section, they started going a bit wonky and just throwing things at the wall to see what stuck. Personally, I didn't mind some of 6-8, there is absolute gold in those seasons, but I definitely think Season 8 would have been the perfect thematic wrap up to the show. Even with all the new ideas, the show had basically been the denizens of Hell and Purgatory causing nuisance on Earth. Having Sam, the one who so struggled with his demon blood, use the King of Hell to slam shut the gates would have bookended the show so perfectly. No more demons running around on Earth. Even Cain and Abaddon would probably have been forced into Hell as part of the spell. And Purgatory is Hell-adjacent, so I headcanon that closing the gates would help diminish the amount of things that could get out of there too. Would have left Earth in a nice place where the hunters now just need to kill off the remaining monsters left on Earth. Sam's death would have had immense meaning and have made up for any role he played in starting the Apocalypse. Dean gets to go off and live the happy apple pie life he wanted to live. Cas could have returned to heaven and helped set things right up there without them being shotgunned all over the planet and causing more havoc than the demons were. No risk to the Mark or freeing Amara... I am really struggling to push through S11. Completing the trials was such a great potential endpoint. And Sam was already right there. Dean just had to let him go this one time. Everything that came after was at least partially Dean's fault. A lot of it directly so.
@@tyrannicpuppy True, the first 5 were just about perfect. It was just the later seasons that kept having plot holes and retcons. I suppose if you're of the mind that you can have too much of a good thing, then ending it around then would've been a great ending. Although, I did mean if they were to carry it on for as long as the network allowed, thinking through the entire lore ahead of time would be the optimal way. Kind of like how cop shows don't have to think through the rules of their world when writing because the rules have already been decided for them. If the same were true for a fantasy world, where all the conceivable rules were laid out, then they'd only have to consider the history of the characters.
Chuck faking being evil makes the most sense actually, considering he is the writer for dean and sam's story. Each arc starts and ends with a new enemy, constantly leveling up. He would be their final enemy. And you cant have a heros journey without an obstacle.
Since end of S14 I had one thought about one either hole in a plot or interesting details. 1) Chuck says, that Amara is stronger then him if we are talking about pure power, but Chuck is better at strategy. 2) Chuck needed help of archangels to lock Amara 3) Nyphelym are stronger than angel father/mother 4) From third fact and a lot of things that we saw at S13 i guess, we can say that Jack is more powerful than Archangel (at least Lucy) 5) We know that Chuck killed Jack with one move of his finger 6) From all above: Chuck can with one move kill Jack, but Amara (who is stronger, than brother) cant kill archangels (that are weaker than Jack) So either it hole in a plot, that can be true, or all S11 (i guess) was a play of Chuck. He wasnt injured, world wouldnt die. I want make any deduction from this. Just leave it here.
I never thought the last couple seasons were anything other than God's plan. Prior to this he made it abundantly clear he wanted out, then pops back up to randomly become the big bad just in time for Jack to be ready and able to absorb his powers and take his place. Ultimately, that's what he expressed he wanted previously in nearly as many words.
I mean the Charmed ones have been thrown out of windows, down stairs, electrocuted, hit upside the head, stabbed and what not. But by the end of the episode they're having margs at the club. I assumed that their guardian angel Leo heals them behind the scenes, same for Ca, Sam, and Dean
The Book of Enoch is one of the coolest books related to the bible. What it depicts perpetually inspires novels. There's spacecraft and aliens and more.
The first one. The Four Princes Of Hell are the most powerful because they were the first Angels and the strongest to side with and fell with Lucifer. So they’re actually Fallen Angels. That’s why they’re so powerful. And is why their eyes glowed yellow instead of blue like Cass’s. Because they are Fallen Angels.
You know you overlooked something there Healing the boys Cass yes could heal them off screen But what about Meg? Crowley? Crowley healed Bobby from paralysis and demons can keep hosts alive after terrible injuries Also, Death He restored Bobby’s wife to life and she was cremated Something to think about
I'd like to point out that Crowley didn't have unique eyes and smoke forms until he became the King, so he likely gained power somehow from that promotion. It never seemed to be enough to roval the archangels, so maybe the demon equivalent to a Seraphim.
I always assumed any angel-healing gave you 100% optimum health. Those weren't "special glasses", they were just sunglasses. And almost no one recognizes God because almost no one has ever actually seen him. Also shapeshifting.
The princes being nephillim makes a lot of sense. They are still part human so becoming demons would still work, plus biblically a bunch of angels were in trouble for making nephillim, so i mean if they were considered that bad, they had to go to hell right?
I think that Chuck should have never become a big villain. Some characters simply works better if they are neither heroes nor villain, and the show in my opinion made some similar mistakes woth Crowley (in season 8) and Metatron (much better character when he is not the main threat).
It was pretty bad. What I could not understand was why Chuck, after obliterating Jack, didn't just rewrite the Winchester's memory, so they never know what he really did.
That's why they made him so stubborn. His biggest problem was that Sam and Dean just wouldn't do what he wrote them to do, and he never accepted that. He could've just erased their verse along with all the other ones, but he left the only ones who didn't follow the rules😅
Chuck had to become the final villain after he turned out to be God. The show pretty much set out that everything was happening at his whim. Eventually the Boy had to get fed up and square off against him.
Yeah, S14+ they just ran out of ideas and started wildly vomiting fanfiction-tier bullshit onto the page. S14-15 really were the awful plotlines that the diehard oldbies insist everything after S5 was. (Granted, S6-S13 certainly got shaky and less coherent, but they didn't feel as actively insulting and ugly as the last two seasons. There's a difference between "not as good" and "horrible nonsense.")
Is Chuck trying to convince us? Yes, maybe. Maybe he's so all knowing that he actually knows about us and our universe. He might be fully aware ( Kind of like Deadpool ) that we are watching.
What if the Princes of Hell are actually angel-demon hybrids? They could be the children of Lucifer and Lillith, but what that would make of Alister though? He had white eyes like Lillith too so he must be related to her. Maybe both Lillith and Alister were created by Lucifer at the same time and then Lucifer mated with Lillith, creating the Princes of Hell.
So I think the princes of hell are actually angels. Think about it, humans are very weak, but when they're tortured in hell and they break, and become demons, they become much more powerful. Now if an angel is tortured in hell and it breaks, does it become a superdemon? Maybe. And that superdemon might be what the princes of hell are.
If go by real life biblical lore 1 third of heavens angels fell along side Lucifer so it's very possible some of the demons are actually corrupted angels
My fan theory is that putting a P in the abbreviation of Supernatural is stupid and not how abbreviations work. Fans of the show should strive to fix this.
@@Merlewhitefire Not when you are talking in the context of the TV show, which is every single time you talk about it. No one asks "Have you watched SPN?", they say "have you ever watched Supernatural. It's a shit shorthand and should be avoided.
My theory about the princes: I think he was trying to make his own set of angels at first, but.. uhm, failed and instead made a few anti-angels. Probably due to how he made them. He probable used a lot of soul or some impure amalgam of souls.
Isn't part of the brothers great health attributed to 'plot armor'? In the episode "The Hero's Journey", Garth has to be their dentist and I think explains this is because they are no long the protagonists of the story and now have to deal with everyday ailments like regular people do.
i would be on board with the theory that chuck created events of the last seasons for someone else to take over if it was explained properly in show, if they are coming back then i would want them to explain this that's if they decide to bring the show back and base it around chuck or something
9:19 well there is an episode that says that they have been resurrected multiple times, it’s the one where they get shotguned by two hunters and end up in heaven and cas asked then to try to find god, Zachariah says that they have both been sent back down to earth and restored so while on screen deal has the most canon deaths (at something like 111 though I question that number as Sam says 120 for that episode alone) but we don’t know just how meny times the angles fixed them back up before that arc is done (like season 6 or 7 I forget the number) after that probably cass although maybe it’s just the fact that they have been in the presents of an angel for so long that the radiation is just in them.
I always figured the princess of hell were angle demon hybrids. Like that lucifer impregnated lilith after she became the first demon since she also has unique eyes.
I really like the last theory, really changes the perspective of the last few seasons so much better. They felt so rushed and it felt like they defeated God way too easy. So if it was him setting it all up it makes more sense.
Chuck having planned everything is like saying the Emperor on 40k planned everything, and all went according to his plan even if it doesnt look like so.
I don't think the four princes of hell are Nephilim, but there is a possibility that they were, but they were killed and then their souls went to hell and became demons. (I think Empty was only interested in Jack because he woke it up.) Chuck is God. Amara confirmed it and she is God's twin and this info was told by the incorruptible everyone's favorite cosmic being OG Death.
The princes of hell theory does sound promising though. I personally think of them as the Hell's version of Archangel. As for them being nephilim i doubt that. To be nephilim they have to be angel-human hibrid which would imply that Lucifer was cast down way later than Adam and Eve story. However they could be supporters of Lucifer from heaven who were also cast down with him and probably the fall corrupted them Also about the injuries i believe in one of the later seasons it was confirmed that Destiny was the one looking out for the boys, healing their injuries, keeping their bodies together and protecting them even from bad food. Once Destiny stopped protecting them, they started experiencing all sorts of everyday struggles
If that last theory were true, maybe talking to that random store clerk wasn't an act for us, but himself? To convince himself he was evil to make the act more convincing, or to make "passing on the torch" easier for him?
15:29 best answer is It’s not so much an act for no one in the other universe as “character work” getting into character on his own as to be 100% convincing or reworking/improvising his characters motivations to seem more believable, because he is a perfectionist and loves creating a good story. Wants his characters to be endearing and the idea of him off in a separate universe “in character” would be the kind of silly thing Chuck/God would do if he is putting on a show as part of a test for Jack and the gang. Very method acting. The John Doe at radio hut is his captive audience and idea board, because who else is gonna help him run lines?
I think the Winchesters superb health is due to them being the "Main Characters" by Chuck(God). You see that almost immediately once their "Protagonist" status is removed, they start getting sick, fatigued, sore/stiff, etc. They immediately start suffering from common human problems.
This is correct and was actually brought up and explained a few times in the show
Exactly. Kind of how Dean dies in the most basic way after battling superpowered beings
Plus after that he had the luck of all hero’s. Man was blessed by two gods.
Definitely. The Winchesters were clad in plot armor. Even when they died they weren't killed off.
The show, honestly, should have ended with season 6(?) - where Sam and NotDean (Adam) fell into the cage. But then we would have missed out on good comedic episodes like the Fairies, the Musical, a day in the life of Bobby, etc
Yep, that was the episode where they quite literally showed how the main characters always had plot armour. Ofcourse they dubbed it the “luck of heroes”, but it was simply plot armour.
I actually assumed that the real God is the combination of Chuck and Amara, the Alpha and Omega, the creator and destroyer. I think that the real God broke into two parts because of indecisiveness. Never being able to take a final action. An issue solved by breaking the conflicting parts into two parts.
Why not all three?
Chuck and Amara are the two main pieces of God, and the shadow is essentially what's left. Whatever essence is considered uniquely God, without real form or function, just retired to the void to rest.
Exactly. It's like how Gojo's power in Jujutsu Kaisen works: When someone is caught in his domain, they gain infinite knowledge, but with all that knowledge they are paralyzed and can't move. It's the ultimate irony
Kind of like Charlie being split into her two halves.
The impala is God
I believe that when God created light and darkness then separated them to keep them pure that's what Chuck and Amara are.
The Winchesters just take a Long Rest after each episode, that heals almost everything. They only need Castiel for Greater Restoration level conditions.
I understand this reference, and I love it.
~_~
Ive always seen Chuck as more of a divine dungeon master than a writer, so Long Rest checks out.
Isn't this basically canon? When they lose their "hero lv luck" they start having health issues lol.
Lol the hero feast is Hamburgers, pie, and alcohol
I still love how Garth outlived basically everyone, and everything of significance. The whole universe got Garth'd😂
I have a Chuck/God theory: Chuck when we first meet him, nerdy writer Chuck, IS human, and actually is a prophet. Later, when he comes back, he is capital G God and he’s taken on Chuck‘s form to walk around in. We see a complete change in Chuck’s character, and there’s no reason to think that human Chuck is dead necessarily, since we spend all our time on God Chuck. After all, we never see AU Sam and Dean again after they cross over universes. Or, God might’ve just killed Chuck to replace him. It wouldn’t be the first time he snapped his fingers and got rid of someone just because he wanted to. Making human Chuck a prophet let him voyeuristically watch Sam and Dean while he also watched other versions of Sam and Dean. Then he decided they were his favorite version, so he took human Chuck’s place, either by pretending to be him or just by getting rid of him.
THIS! its has always been my headcannon.
I like it. That would make more sense to me. So when we see Chuck disappear at the end of season 5 it's God taking Chuck away so He can imitate him later.
The real reason is due to simple retcon. Fortuna, the goddess of luck knew Sam and Dean were talking about God once they confirmed Chucks physical appearance to her. This suggests that God has been using his Chuck form far longer than you would normally assume. Yet Raphael, who was with God since before creation was a thing, did not recognize Chuck as God. His whole temper tantrum at the beginning of season 5, going on about how God is nowhere to be found confirms this and leaves no room for doubt.
Chuck was using old magic to hide himself from the angels and everyone else
@@Da1337Man Unless Raphael was directly ordered by God to not recognize that he is God unless he is told to by him.
I still like your theory that Lucifer gave the princes a touch of his grace
@@Ryan_possibly he took his unwanted nephews twisted their souls and gave them some of his grace, that’s why he’s not as powerful or scary as he was made out to be when we meet him
I mean it’s a pretty common theory and seems like that’s what the show was telling us because someone in the show even stated that “they even have his eyes”
One of them kept Gabriel around to snack on, so it would make sense.
Another thing that supports Lucifer using some of his Grace to make the princes. Is when Lucifer said he didn't give Asmodeus the ability to change his appearance. By saying that it supports the theory about using some of his grace.
@@radagast7200 - agreed I think that Lucifer imbuing a "very small" part of his grace to the Princes of Hell makes the most sense. Otherwise, other demons would steal graces from Angels and Archangels to enhance their own power.
I am sympathetic to the theories that Chuck's defeat at the end of the series was deliberately self-orchestrated. First of all, this character was introduced to us as someone who likes to playact as anyone other than himself and even "go deep" into the role. He seems to actually be living a mortal life, not just pretending to do so to mess with the Winchesters. His transition into the petulant creator who now mostly gets pleasure only out of destroying his toys is so sudden and harsh that it feels like a new role. Also supernatural beings faking their own deaths is a trope on the show: it is a primary defining trait of Gabriel, whom Lucifer tells "You learned all your tricks from me." Whom did Lucifer learn his tricks from? Although yes, unprovable or unfalsifiable from what the show gives us, the idea of Chuck being able to not just fake his own death but to fake it in a perfect way makes much more sense to me than him not having this ability: why shouldn't God be able to do this? I will admit that sometimes the show gives us supernatural beings that are compellingly uberpowerful only to come down with fatal cases of "Episode 22itis," and I wish the writers had avoided this. When Death -- perhaps the character most convincingly portrayed as being too far beyond humans to even be a villain as we understand it -- was defeated by a "yoink" maneuver involving his own scythe, I was profoundly disappointed. I agree that the episode in which Chuck is just being cruel to the alternate universe Radio Shed clerk doesn't make a lot of sense for this theory...but that's a pretty small part of the whole. Also Jack brings this guy back to life later, in an act that was certainly orchestrated by the writers to make him look heroic, so...why not orchestrated by Chuck?
So he was basically creating Jack to take over for him so he could leave and start a new game? That would make sense. I always saw him as more of a dungeon master than a writer.
It would be hard to argue free will if Chuck (God) is able to know what choice we will make with 100% certainty, so maybe Radio Shed guy was part of a backup plan to start the entire replacement hunt over again if needed. With Jack's power level if he fell taking him out might have required wiping the entire universe he existed in as collateral?
I feel like Chuck could have certainly built himself up in the minds of others with his own PR. Like he's obviously powerful, a real top-tier heavy hitter, but he's also spent untold millennia convincing his followers that he is the perfect and all knowing, all seeing, all powerful being that we had come to expect.
Yeah. He's basically bullsh*tting his way to the top. In the Bible and texts associated with Judeo-Christian lore, Yahweh got defeated by Chemosh, another deity. He also lost to Iron Chariots. Doesn't seem like all-powerful deity to me.
@@Johnny3Batonyhe is not, the all powerful one is Elohim (you know the El from Isra*el* and the end of angelic names (kasti*El), Yaweh's father. Yaweh is basically judeo mythology's Thor (war and storm's god).
@@mrptr9013 Elohim is the generic term for a god or deity.
Yahweh is gods name
@@Johnny3Batonylol god in judaism and christianity is so weak. That because the bible texts have been changed so much they lost the meaning.
True, and considering the multitude of "failed" universes he went through he's clearly not perfect.
I love that there are still channels for supernatural
same and i also love how they still lots of views for a show that’s been done for almost 5 years now
@@enzowrld supernatural created a lasting fan base for sure
It was one of the biggest/best shows during that time period, and was sort of something new in how they approached how a paranormal-themed show should be done. Plus, there are the added superfans (no pun intended) and the groups who are deeply invested in watching/talking about it because of the Winchesters, their attractiveness a lot of people etc, lol
The Shadow is God, because everything came from the void and eventually will return to the void. It’s also what kept Cass alive and the Winchesters safe by keeping Cass(their guardian angel) alive. Chuck is the personification of creation as Amara is Destruction, they are the yin and the yang in human vessels. They were created at the same moment that the void gave birth to the universe, Chuck to make new ones and Amara to be able to keep Chuck in check
I like this theory
This is a great theory.
also the fact that the void can enter into heaven (so supposedly also hell) with no problems to get Castiel. And noone can stop him.
It also makes sense since the Empty also just wanted to go to sleep.
"And on the seventh day God finished His work that He had done, and He rested on the seventh day from all His work that He had done. So God blessed the seventh day and made it holy, because on it God rested from all His work that He had done in creation.” - Genesis 2:2-3
And, in Supernatural, they constantly referred to Chuck and Amara as the Darkness and the Light. Well, guess what?
“In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. Now the earth was formless and empty, *darkness* was over the surface of the deep, and the Spirit of God was hovering over the waters. And God said, "Let there be light," and there was *light* ” - Genesis 1:1
Amara said they separated during the Big Bang. What if this was it?
She also said there was no Daddy, but maybe that is just because she was so young when Big G put himself to sleep, so she wouldn't have remembered him. The same way any kid won’t remember something from their early childhood years cuz they were too young.
This might explain it.
OR
It could be that Chuck used the Mark of Cain to strip her of her memories of the Shadow. The Mark is known to tear down what you were and replace it with something else. Lucifer, Cain, and Dean all experienced the same thing where they said that they remember who they WERE, but it feels like a lifetime since they were those people, to the point, they probably wouldn't recognize themselves if they were faced with them. So maybe the Mark stripped Amara of everything that made her who she was (including her memories, which is why she had to be reborn into a new vessel when she was set free instead of manifesting one like Chuck.
ALSO
Chuck is the middle child.
Think about it.
The Shadow is God/Daddy.
Amara is big sister (and probably Daddy’s favorite).
Chuck comes after Amara.
And then when Chuck started creating *life*, there had to be a balance… so then the Shadow created Death.
So The Shadow “I'm your father, I lay down the rules”.
Amara “I enforce the rules”.
Chuck “I'm the reason we have rules”
Death “I'm the youngest, the rules don't apply to me”
And again with Chuck and his kids:
Chuck “I'm your father, I make the rules”
Michael “I enforce the rules”
Lucifer “I'm the reason we have rules”
Raphael/Gabriel “the hoes don't apply to us”
And AGAIN with the Winchesters:
John “I'm your father, I make the rules”
Dean “I enforce the rules”
Sam “I'm the reason we have rules”
Adam “The rules don't apply to me.”
It's all history repeating itself.
And to anyone asking, “Well, why is Lucifer and Sam their fathers’ favorites if Amara was The Shadow’s?”
Again, Chuck was the middle child. Ergo, rebellious of his father and envious of his older sister. So as a way to turn the tables he was all like, “When I become a dad, I won’t ignore my middle child.” Hence Lucifer being the favorite. Then he created humanity and shit went sideways. But instead of admitting that he made a mistake in showing favoritism at all, he doubled down and repeated the cycle… in the Winchesters.
@@a.t.o.mworkshop6409if you factor in the beginning of Genesis where it said God created the firmament to separate the sky from the Earth (which was also the creation of Heaven itself in that verse), it makes sense that the Empty/God could access it and no one can stop him, because he MADE IT. Also, what if Firmament wasn’t just the natural sky that we see, but the veil that separates earth from the afterlives (Heaven, Hell, Purgatory, Death’s Library, etc.)
I have a theory that Chuck actually lost in the last season on purpose cause that was how he wanted the story to end and was actually bored by the plot line so he allowed himself to 'lose' his powers let jack become the new god and went off to a new universe to write a new story and have some new fun. And when the boys left he got up snapped his fingers and went off to have some new fun, while the Winchester story was him just goofing off some with a spin off idea cause why would Chuck leave a plan B of he knew he would win to devour the multiverse?
So hey went out a la comic Thanos then.
@@kirklanyoshinaga8953 probably
Yeah, there is just a 0% chance he didn't see the whole power vacuum plan coming. Everything he did was to hand craft a world that could create Jack. The fact he was tied into the system, even had a book of his life and death, (and yet Death itself didn't seem to see its own death coming) it all makes no sense for him to also be evil like that. Rather he had to have been guiding the world for the sake of creating and then training/raising Jack, turning him into a being that understands how the world should be run in Chucks eyes. Chuck goes around making mistakes so that Jack can see and even directly experience WHY they are mistakes. It was all to let Jack plug himself in, to fill the hole that God leaving would cause.
Even the Winchester story can be viewed through this lens. It was a final lesson from God to Jack, that his "no interference" rule shouldn't be absolute, That he should still have a little bit of humanity even as God. Chuck created a situation that required external help that Jack had forbidden but also put those Jack couldn't easily punish to be the ones breaking the rule. When Lot's Wife turned to look at the destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah disobeying God, he turned her to salt as punishment. This was that moment for Jack. God said to not turn around, Dean turned around and looked, and where Chuck would have smited him, Jack refused to do so.
Assuming, of course, that he is capable of heading over to another universe, now that Jack took his powers and left him seemingly unable to even perform simple abilities like the clicking fingers to kill someone.
@aliveandwellinisrael2507 thats the glory of the theory he has all his powers he in just let Jack think he's powerless
What if the four princes are demons with angel's grace. like Lucy found four angels ripped out their grace and put it into four demons. That is why they have a pale glow in their eyes and are immune to holy water. Making them angelic demons or angel-demon composite
This would also explain why asmodeus was able to inject himself with gabriels grace and become stronger
@@n8298906 he said this in another video as a possible theory
or when Lucifer turned them he did what Michael did to hs powerup monsters he used his own grace to power them up permanently kinda mimicking chuck creating the arch angels in the first place.
@@raymondmckay6990I would have assumed this as well. He created them to be his archdemons, four to stand over his army, mimicking the archangels.
Lucifer started a Civil War in Heaven, he was not the only Angel to fall.
Those four were former Angels. Just like the Archangel Samael.
There's always the gnostic route, where Chuck is just the demiurge, the architect of the physical universe. Where he takes what already exists and shapes it into anything he wants, while Amara is his opposite, the only being that can destroy things completely to the point where Chuck can't reconstruct it.
The Shadow in this case would be the physical manifestation of the raw material that Chuck uses for Creation. The "Nothing" that needed to exist whenever "Something" came into being, the literal shadow of creation.
I always thought this theory for incredibly well. Not going to go in a tangent but other elements of gnostic work also line up really well with charterers like jack in a way
I would imagine even without his divinity, Chuck would have been a powerful magic user. He did write the coding for it after all
He wrote a system that could kill/depower him. It is odd to say the least which is why i am gravitating toward to him being demiurge from the gnostic mythos effectively the last boss from shin megami tensei, lol.
@@Raximus3000 Yeah, that's what I've always thought. He's petty, vindictive, can be over emotional etc and is pretty self-centered. He fits the Demiurge more than God.
Chuck specifically says he's erased and rewrote the universe many times. He always could have wrote it however he wanted yet the universe we follow is the one where things got OUT of his control.
He definitely didn't plan it, but he sure as hell tried
Chuck was evil from the jump he even said it when they first met him.
“I write things and then they come to life. Yeah, no, I'm definitely a god. A cruel, cruel, capricious god. The things I put you through - The physical beatings alone. I killed your father. I burned your mother alive and then you had to go through the whole horrific deal again with Jessica. All for what? All for the sake of Literary symmetry. I toyed with your live, with your emotions for entertainment.” -Monster at the end of this book
Title was a major clue Chuck was the monster at the end of the book because he made all of it happen. He told them the truth that one time and nobody believed him because they didn’t want to.
When he was finally revealed as the big bad what did he say? He said they were his favorite show.
So when he said from the start that he was evil and that he toyed with them for entertainment he was telling the truth.
Chuck knew Gab was alive he just didn’t wanna bother helping him. Every time something went down where they wanted his help he said it wasn’t his problem. Why would saving Gab be any different? Easier to just lie and say he was dead.
He only helped Michael when he wanted to use him. And give Gabs track record with them he would have never betrayed them the way Michael did.
And he lied about being able to restore jacks soul because he was afraid of him. There was a reason they had a ban on nephilim with a kill order on site.
Because he knew a nephilim with a soul would be more powerful than him. Jack was never a danger to the world when soulless but he was a danger to Chuck once he got his soul back.
I’ve always wondered why the knights of hell could only be killed by the first blade but the princes of hell could be killed with the colt. Which were stronger then?
I'm pretty sure the Prince's were more powerful, technically, but the Knights were more durable.
It really depends on something. Is the first blade truly the only thing that can kill a Knight?
Killing Cain required the killer to use the First Blade and take the Mark of Cain onto their body. I might be misremembering things, but I'm sure that the other Knights deaths do not require the First Blade.
Also the First Blade and the Mark (they're a pair, you can't use the blade without the mark) are likely more powerful than the Colt. It's related to whatever gives the Mark its power, for example, there's a theory that the killing power of the blade/mark combination is because it draws from Amara somehow, while she's sealed behind the Mark. The same thing is theorized to be the reason that mark-bearers become more unstable and violent over time.
And the four horse men had to remove rings to kill them right.. my guess is so it makes killing all at once hard lmao. The higher the rank the more raw natural material takes to kill you?
I think personally the reason why the eyes are yellow for the princess is because they are a corrupt version of a Nephilim and that's why the eyes are different
Let’s assume Chuck WAS the capital G God, enacting some weird plan to hand power to a successor over several seasons. We encounter alternate Sam & Dean (the douchey ones) caught in between worlds, because their home universe ceased. Several other universes are introduced and then destroyed. So if Chuck’s master “plan” was to hand control over to Jack, he did it by annihilating a bunch of universes, killing/merging with Amara, and hurting enough people Jack loved just so Jack could Hoover all that Chuck + Amara power into himself, yet leaving Chuck alive as a human.
Chuck in his prime needed four archangels and Cain’s curse, just to imprison Amara. And that imprisonment was so sloppy it turned Lucifer evil, lead Caine to become the first demon, and still leaked all over the place.
Also, if there’s one Chuck who created many basically identical universes… there must have been only one Amara. And only one curse to imprison her… so one and only one Lucifer goes bad? So alternate universe Michael, not in the “Sword of Michael” Sam costume… why was he fighting Lucifer? Dude encounters our Lucifer, recognizes who he is, recognizes that he’s the Lucifer from some other universe, but still wants to fight. Why? That Michael’s brother Lucifer wasn’t evil.
maybe lucifer is just always meant to be evil one way or another in every single universe you know?
Don't forget that the only "other" lucifer that we learn about or hear of is the apocalypse world lucifer.
That universe is just a "what if" of what would have happened had Mary not of taken azazels deal to save John. So lucifer still would have taken the mark and turned evil, the only difference is with Mary not taking the deal and saving john sam and Dean were never born to stop the apocalypse.
my theory is that in that specific story or universe he let the winchesters win and let jack have his powers but only in this universe and he continues being god outside of this specific universe.
Crowley's comment about Mesopotamia doesn't have to imply him being ancient. Europeans used to call Iraq Mesopotamia until at least the 19th century. Because they were allergic to native names or something. Meanwhile the locals called it Iraq since at least 12th century.
Looking into it, you're right about the naming but for the wrong reasons. They weren't allergic to the native names... Mesopotamia is a native name... before 1958 Iraq was not united and only one area used the name of Iraq to name themselves. At least that's how I understand it.
@@TalkativeHands Mesopotamia is most definitely not a native name. It's Greek. The medieval Iraq did not cover the full area of modern Iraq, true, but that is true for many other countries in the world.
@@ArakkoaChronicles idk about the whole name thing but I think Crowley could have time traveled there for whatever reason not a solid theory but defo possible
Truth! I'm italian and we studying this kind of thing between 10/12 years old in school and is common to read about European people refer as Mesopotamia until 19 th century ! An after that we started call it iraq after around ww1
@@ArakkoaChronicles going by that Logic the Native names for that area should be Sumeria, Akkadia and Assyria
About their non-scarring and stuff, it's pretty clearly explained that God gave them plot armour for his story... So, I mean...
Didn't they even make jokes about how dangerous things were after God did away with it? I mean, Dean died on their first hunt in the last episode just to make that point, from a simple little stabby stab.
Maybe Chuck is actually Yalbadaoth, it makes sense due to Yalba is a foolish god
You mean Yaldabaoth?
ALL HAIL GRAND KARCIST ION
i hated that guy he was so mean to shulk
I actually have my own laundry list of fan theories that I plan to weave into the all encompassing Supernatural Bestiary I've been writing (covering every species from the Supernatural and The Winchester shows, the anime, the comics, the novels and the source books), I'd love to discuss them sometime!
That sounds dope I'd like to read that if possible when its done
@@thomas-stilinski8149 I plan on posting it online for free once I complete it!
I always wanted to know what Sam did with Mjolnir and why he wasn't using it all the time.
WAIT WAIT WAIT!… the anime??? 🤯 tell me more
@stonedViking304 it's the first season in anime form. I believe Jared voices Sam but Jensen doesn't voice Dean... or maybe the other way around. It's been a while.
Imo, Chuck acting in the other universe for the purpose of fooling the audience of the show could definitely count as the act of an all-knowing omnipotent being.
I mean he is one smart guy thought it's pretty crazy to think unlike deadpool who doesn't ACTUALLY know he's being watch but ABSOLUTELY like to pretend cuz it's fun that Chuck actually knows it but isn't powerful enough to do anything about it?
So final theory of the video is Chuck may have orchestrated his own Ragnarok and stacked it for his grandson to be the victor.
When God says "Gabriel is dead and Michael is insane" yes it sound weird because he'd know they're not but remember what Castiel said "He's a writer, writer's lie"
but then, why not call on them? Having Michael (who was clearly lucid, and within easy reach) would have been of huge help in the fight.
To me, it is obvious that Gabriel was supposed to have died, and Michael was never coming back, but then, Season 15 decided to bring them back. Keep in mind, God also said in S11 that he cannot rebuild Gabriel or Raphael (it would take much too long), but then just casually brings back Lucifer in S15. Which was pointless, because if all he wanted was the book, why not just teleport it over to himself? Why even bother with this middle step?
These are examples of terrible writing, nothing more.
@@TheFuzzician Yeah I can't argue with that, they really phoned it in during Season 15, ruined Lucifer as he just "forgives" God.
@@TheFuzzician When he casually brings back Lucifer, it is after Amara and he have merged back together. He is more powerful than he was when he made those statements in S11.
Another theory is that the "Chuck" that comes back after going away with Amara is not actually God, but rather a parasite-like being feeding off him and pretending to be him. This also explains the sudden abrupt personality shift.
So to add credence to the Chuck planned all of it theory. Go back and watch ep 20 from season 11 where he shows Metatron the ending to his story. I think he shows him the actual ending and Metatron in that moment knows he’s planning to properly die and hand the reins over permanently. Which is further explained in the song Chuck sings, calling back to the start of the episode where he says the greatest thing humanity ever created was music. I feel like that episode is one of the most crucial in the entire series.
The whole Crowley Mesopotamia thing is a plot whole. The writer that wrote that came out and admitted that it was a massive blunder.
As far as the true God theory goes: If you look at the Gnostic teachings, the "GOD" of our physical universe was known as the Demiurge. The Demiurge's qualities as described in the Gnostic Gospels describes Chucks personality pretty well in my opinion; Ultimately evil, narcissistic, spiteful, etc etc.
15:25 no, this was HIM spitballing ideas. Chuck does this throughout his time as a character. He creates a person to discuss his framework, bounces ideas, and eventually finds a narrative to spin.
Fun fact: In the supernatural anime, Azazel outright says that he was once an angel of the lord. Also, are you ever going to cover the supernatural anime?
It would explain why he could invade dreams and teleport not even Lilith could do that
Sam and Dean don't suffer from major injuries because Chuck blessed them, it's touched on when he turns his back on them and Dean starts getting cavities in the last season, Chuck basically gave them divine plot armour.
8:35 you forget Sam & Dean have that Luck factor about them. They actually deal with normal people stuff in the episode when they lose their luck
Also, there’s the antichrist story that was never addressed, that kid could’ve become evil chuck or changed everyone’s thoughts & memories, we need three more seasons made.
Chuck doesn't do much Godly either. The Empty theory holds water because the Empty literally existed before everything and every soul which dies in its afterlife such as demons or the death of angels return these supposed eternal beings to the Empty. We already know that Chuck likes to lock up those he disagrees with. The theory makes the most sense that the entity of Darkness' opposite is just the entity of Light; especially because Chuck doesn't really create on screen but instead claims so while also destroying just about everything whilst his opposite Amara, the supposed destroyer, is rather restrained in her attacks once she fully regains her powers.
And the biggest problem of Chuck being big G god is that his struggle and union with Amara literally makes zero sense. Let me remind you that it took Chuck alongside his 4 archangels (Michael, Raphael, Gabriel, and Lucifer) to defeat and lock away Amara; yet there is a multiverse, a collective of other universes each with their own versions of the archangels. Other world Michael is even against the entity claiming to be big G god in seasons 13 & 14. There are three answers for this with issues for each:
1. It took all archangels across the multiverse to defeat Amara
Problem:
The existence of another world comes as a surprise to both Gabriel & Lucifer, and Metatron, who was supposedly there at the beginning, never mentions it.
2. Amara is not actually that powerful and Chuck is always in control
Problem:
If true, why re-absorb her? The show acts like this is some huge power boost; as tho he is reclaiming his other half. If he's significantly more powerful than her, there would be no reason to interact with her whatsoever.
3. Chuck is not big G god but rather a personified character of the line "Let there be Light"
Problem:
Literally everyone who sees Chuck after he reveals himself instantly recognize that he is in fact the big G god.
However, more water on to the Empty is the real big G god is that Chuck is not more powerful than the Empty because he cannot grab just anyone out from the Empty's grasp. Chuck's explanation of saving Cas is that he was, at the time, a lowly angel rather than a Seraph. Chuck only demonstrates, outside of a lowly Castiel, he can only bring back Lilith of all people who gets almost immediately incinerated by Aichael. We know that Chuck can leverage and twist the minds of others of which he first did so with Casifer where Luci after leaving Cas' body goes back to being completely against Chuck. Later on, Chuck places both Aichael and Luci on his side despite neither siding with him until suddenly both do. Even better Luci's return from the Empty really only works because he was aready awake which is also not Chuck's doing.
The big, huge problem with the Empty is big G god theory is that the Empty does almost nothing _and_ seems to have very little power entirely. And there's really no headcanon that can explain that away. The only real two solutions is that either big G god never shows up at all or big G god is not omnipotent and, in Supernatural, a finite being.
The show really should've stuck with the original idea that Cas was big G god in disguise the whole time; have a slight rewrite where Cas and the Empty are the two halves of big G god where one has all the power with zero compassion and the other has true empathy but is vulnerable to physical harm. Not very accurate to God but Supernatural has _never_ been accurate to its own in-universe religions especially anything from the Bible.
Well, I've always thought it did kinda make sense that it took more than just Chuck to lock away Amara. It's different from just a straight up 1v1 to the death, he had to take her alive, it's always a lot more difficult. Apparently, Amara wasn't very bright though, which is disappointing. She's so easily manipulated, it's pretty ridiculous. Seems like he took the wrong approach the first time, trying to out gun her, instead of just tricking her.
Either way though, making Chuck the bad guy was really stupid. There were some really awesome moments when he first came out as God. He didn't have to be the bad guy, they could've come up with a much better solution for the next, or final villain.
@Jackyll-x3o Chuck and friends caging Amara is canon to every character that appears from season 10 onward, but my question is who does that include? Obviously Chuck and Michael and Lucifer as all state of actually being there, but which Michael and Lucifer? How can there be another universe with an equally powerful Michael and siblings with Chuck as their godhead especially if Chuck and the Archangels were present at the supposed beginning unless Amara was with Chuck when he created the multiverse; yet if that's true then why did Amara only focus on the destruction of one dimension rather than the whole cosmic roadmap? The meta answer is that there was no plan in writing these furthering plots which is clearly problematic when putting everything into one timeline so that it makes sense.
Amara herself said there was no empty or death during her time empty was just gasping like death was to dean in their first meeting.
I really like the Crowley angel theory! And I've never heard of it before. Personally, when it came to demons, the show tells us Lilith is the first demon created by Luci, so I just naturally thought the Princes of Hell were Luci's children with Lilith after she was a demon. The problem is that Lilith isn't that powerful comparably but hybrids are supposed to be far more powerful than their parents such as Jack & the cambion that literally vanishes from existence.
But you're right, every demon sans Crowley has black smoke except for those we don't see that Asmodeus was trying to summon. Who were those guys again? Who created them? Were they really demons or something more alike to Leviathans but for Hell?
Anyway, you got something wrong about why Crowley couldn't be an angel: Angel radio is _not_ on at all times. Anna only hears the voices _after_ Dean is raised by Cas in "Lazarus Rising". It's totally possible that an angel could've lost his grace and thus became the human named Fergus born to a witch. If human-born angels do have souls (of which there is nothing saying they don't especially with Gadreel healing Cas that one time), then Fergus went to Hell where he either became Crowley or remembered himself as an angel named Crowley. Honestly this would explain why he not only knows that angels can be tortured precisely but also knowing Naomi and what Luci's plan actually is in season 5. Plus he is one of the very few people who knows how to close doorways to other universes something at least two of the archangels didn't even know were a thing.
Either that or Crowley somehow learned knowledge that literally no one else except the literally most powerful entities would know AND he also just so happened to know how and where to find Death in season 5 and Cain in season 9. He's also the first and only main-world character to make bullets out of angel blades. He exists in a world where multiple villains he's solely dealt with had the power to snap their fingers and kill whomsoever they please and yet Crowley went out on his own terms. Even when the show got bad, Crowley was continuously entertaining. Angel origins or not, I'm glad Mark stayed as long as he did.
Last thing, if you notice Crowley, while he does take over other bodies, he always returns to the one we know. The real reason is that Crowley is Mark's character; however, what is the in-universe reason? Maybe... much like Cas with Jimmy or the Michael sword... maybe that's one of Crowley's chosen vessels when he was an angel and thus much like Cas, the vessel feels like his own skin?
I feel like for the last theory, it’s plausible if Chuck is trying to trick the viewer, since he’s God he should be able to break the fourth wall and know about our dimension
What if Chuck did know that the show itself was watched by an audience, but he is acting like he made all this stuff happen for his own enjoyment when it was really for the audience. Kind of like Deadpool in a way.
I was really disappointed that the makers of the show didn't even bother to go into real demonology. The spirits of Nephilim are considered to be demons, and also the fallen angels. The higher rank Demons should've been angels and Nephilim. Azazel is the name of a fallen angel according to some sources.
Ive always believed that Chuck has always BEEN God, simply hiding behind his own ruleset. Like, until a specific set of circumstances occur, or a point in time happens, God put himself in a quiet box in the corner of Chuck's mind. That box slowly leaks a little bit of God out of it, making Chuck a writer and giving him the ability to not only be a "prophet" and write about everything, but he also chained himself an arch angel to him in case something were to try and happen prematurely. God came out when he was needed, or he thought would make his story that much cooler.
Sadly, Chuck “losing control” isn’t his master plan. In the spinoff series, Chuck setup a fail-safe in case he lost against the Winchesters to destroy the universe/multiverses and Dean travelled the multiverses to stop the weird bug people Chuck made.
If you read that and thought that sounds stupid, I would 100% agree, but sadly it is canon.
Before the apocalypse started the Archangels and other angels were keeping sam and dean alive so they could start the apocalypse, after that I believe it's a combo of Castiel healing them and maybe some witchcraft or something whenever he's not around
Crowley is a crossroads demon aren't they all red-eyed and red smoke?
Chuck's Knowledge and Power, specifically in Combo,
is the biggest Plothole possible.
It literally made me think 'Is He Watching the Brothers right now?!' EVRY MINUTE of the least season
It reminds legit of Yugiohs fmaous 'Infinty Plus 1 Attack Pointttsss' Debacle
A cooler idea would be if Naomi and Crowley went on a timetravel adventure together which ended in them hooking up 😂😂😂. Probably to chase....some maguffin or other
One thing I always found interesting about the Supernatural anime which was a 1 season hitter has Azazel confirm he was an Angel once. It's one easy thing to deduce the theory that he was an angel however because Kripke said they didn't allow Angels in the show till season 4. Yet in a season 9 retcon, Dean Winchester tells Tessa in season 9 episode 22 he likes Tessa even though she's an Angel. This means since season one Angels have been around because of the reaper episode from season 1 episode 12. It makes sense that reapers are a class of angel. It's just a given example of how retcons are apparent that add layers to Kripke's run as a showrunner to Supernatural. I could easily see the four princes of Hell as former Angels as a middle finger to his father since Chuck created four Archangels and Lucifer in his twisted way mirrors his father.
Theory 3 - The brother's Health.
When Dean is raised from the dead by Cas he says explicitly that a whole bunch of his old scars etc are now gone (the Horror movie film set episode). So at least angelic resurrection is confirmed to do that. This means a few healing resets definitely occurred such as in S5 for the boys.
yup Cas never (unless while his grace wasn't there) did half jobs only focusing on one severe inury.
It would be weird to get healed by an angel and then suddenly be uncircumcised.
@@radagast7200 would they count that as an injury? I mean objectively it is but would the Angel see it that way? I mean they were never made young?
Later on when Cas and Metatron are trying to talk about the angel trials, Metatron says there's only one nephilim in existence. It was the waitress. I believe the princes were actually fallen angels. The supernatural writers pulled heavily from actual biblical lore.
I think they were human that just happened to have angelic names because they are that old.
Demons just gain strength the older they get.
Even till this day we still have names that are angelic or biblical in origin like Rachael, Samuel, or Laurel.
You should defo do more of these I love hearing others theories and perspectives it gives me ideas my small brain probably would have never thought about lol
A SECOND video this month?! You spoil us good sir!
Just wait for October 🎃
@@superfanatural8092 Oh the anticipation! Your channel is an inspiration and interacting with you the highlight of my day. Cheers! 🍻 👻
Here is the question that keeps me up at night. Okay so God started the universe after he fought and defeated the Darkness with his archangels. But which ones? Each version of the archangels seems to claim that they helped God lock Amara away. And if so how many marks of khain are there that corrupted Lucifer and caused him to create evil. The implications drive me nuts.
Ok so I think chuck is defo god but not Christian irl god like he’s more of a person then a omniscient being he might even have a soul and that’s why souls are confusing to him that’s also why he feels anger and disappointment and even admiration and love for Sam and dean ( even tho he tortured them lol)
8:30 I know from experience that something stupidly simple can cause so much damage. 2019 i slipped on ONE stair and managed to snap my fibula and tibia to the point the fibula broke through the skin and shattered my ankle. My ankle was literally hanging limp off my leg. Then 6 weeks ago I had a coughing fit from pneumonia and managed to have a Subarachnoid hemorrhage. Its wild how small incidents can cause a ton of damage. But i always assumed it was Chuck pulling the strings of their healing. Making sure they didn't get lasting problems.
The last theory is the only one that makes sense if Chuck is truly omniscient (which he appeared to be in earlier episodes). Season 5 also showed that Chuck manipulated the boys into taking down Lucifer and stopping the apocalypse. Thus proving he could play the long game. Also, Chuck told Medatron he was giving up (the book he wrote). Then he was convinced to change it. What if he did change it so he could reconcile with Amara and she could help Jack. It makes too much sense.
This was an Incredible Masterpiece for The Theory’s of Supernatural.
Personally I think God turned after Amara used her darkness powers to "un-do" or "recomplete" chucks Spark. This would explain why he came back darker after she left him to do her own thing.
He continued spiraling and the darkness inside him grew and hungered for hers... This last part was just for fun but fr about the rest
I think it's just terrible writing, tbh. Maybe the showrunners like the idea of God as the final boss, but didn't know how to make his suddenly seem bad. The whole "I like watching Sams and Deans kill each other" makes no sense to me, and seems completely made up just to try to justify Season 15.
@@TheFuzzician absolutely it was because of terrible writing.
To be honest, the idea of Chuck doing tests to have the Winchesters raise Jack and have him take over makes sense for Chuck becoming the heel
I do think that chuck was pretending to be a bad guy to make a believable transition of “power” but I do think he still has his power he just wants to go back to being alone. I think he wanted the winchesters to fight for their freedom and give him one last story. And I do think we will see him again. There have been talks about bringing everyone back together to do a true and final last season since the pandemic “ruined” what they wanted the last season to be. Let’s hope for the best.
Jack is the only Nephilim with yellow-ish eyes.
Also the reason there are 4 prince's of hell is because in the show there are 4 archangels.
The only demon close to an archangel in terms of power is a knight of hell.
No demon is anywhere near the power of an Archangel. Lilith, the first (and either the most powerful, or second after Cain), was obliterated by Michael within seconds, with almost zero effort.
Knight of hell are unique in that they are harder to kill but we've seen Abaddon flee by just hearing about an angel nearby which is Gadreel.
Theory that i had for a long time is Baby (black 1967 Chevrolet Impala) is a divine Horse. it Just like the Four horse had there Cars, Death had a pale grey horse that was 1959 Cadillac Coupe Deville, War had a red horse that was 1966 Mustang, Famine had black horse that was 2008 Cadillac Escalade, and Pestilence had green horse that was 1972 AMC Hornet.
This is actually a pretty cool theory, but what aspect would Baby represent? one of the four mentioned or some other lesser known aspect?
@@TheVampireAzriel my theory is Baby was Famine car[horse], Black Chevrolet Impala, the year fits with the other cars that are from 1959-1972 its a 1967
Demon princes were strong but the demon knight was on another level 🤔 Even the Colt didn't kill her
So the idea of the knights being nephilium makes sense. When Chuck showed up after Jack, his first response was that Jack is a problem... then he eventually killed him. So asking why the knights would be afraid to reveal their real heritage, maybe its because they knew Chuck would want them dead.
Chuck once said "Of all the Sams and Deans, you were my favorites." Which, to me, meant that he made them special. He created an adversary that COULD defeat him, but not one that necessarily would. It's like the Star Trek TNG episode "Elementary, Dear Data" when Geordi asks the computer to make an antagonist capable of defeating Data. Chuck was bored, and increased the difficulty until he got bitten in the ass for it.
For Chuck/god:
Well, what if Chuck wasn't even the 'first god'?
What if the 'god' is a force of sorts, primeval, not a singular entity, but something that passes from one person to another?
Supernatural starts off with the approach that god has been absent, missing for so long that even the angels recognize it. That means a long time. They also recognize Chuck as a prophet. Now, that could be because god manipulated everything...
But, the angels have the names of the prophets written on the insides of their eyelids or whatever, right? So, they'd always know who was the current prophet. And, they're pretty much immortal from start of time kind of thing... right? So... Chuck would have been written there for everything up to just shy of the creation of the universe.
How likely is it that god, at the start of existence, chose that he would one day pretend to be Chuck so that he could 'hand off' his power to a nephilim? Not very likely... that seems... wrong in a lot of ways.
However, if 'god' is a power that passes from one to another throughout time? Maybe? Think of how the power of angels handles improper vessels. It wears them out, burns out the vessel, even physically.
A 'god' level of power? Even a proper vessel wouldn't last forever. It might last a LONG time, like millennia. However, what if the one who abandoned all of creation had actually died off, leaving that force just floating, unable to do anything, or help, etc?
Well, it might choose, out of desparation, to possess a prophet, even if it knew it would only be for a few years.
THEN, manipulate things so that the nephilim it discovers is about to be created is powerful enough, primed just right, with the proper ethics, morals, and everything else, to be its NEXT vessel?
This is similar to your last theory, but goes beyond it, fleshes it out I think.
This force would understand that it couldn't occupy the Chuck vessel for much longer, and already spent centuries hiding away, powerless... it would want to come back, be strong, help humanity, watch over everything, etc. But, would need a strong enough vessel, which could only come from a nephilim. But, even that vessel will some day fail. Probably millions or years, maybe just thousands, who knows.
But, far more than a human prophet.
I certainly like the theory that Chuck wasn't God at all, and just some pretender, but you're right about other things like the alternate universe stuff really ruining that theory. In this particular case, I'd chock it up to the writers not thinking through the storyline that well. The other theory about Chuck and Amara being the two constituent parts of God actually sounds more likely, and would indeed make a little more sense in terms of his powers not being top of the food chain.
What I'd really love, is if any supernatural type show would fully formulate their entire universe before they come up with any given story so that there would be no plot holes or inconsistencies and if there were any unanswered questions at the end of the show's run, it would only be because the show was cancelled early by the network and they hadn't had time to provide those answers by sprinkling them into the episodes.
They did seem to think out the first five seasons, the lead-up to and prevention of the Apocalypse, pretty damn well. Once they got renewed after that initially planned section, they started going a bit wonky and just throwing things at the wall to see what stuck. Personally, I didn't mind some of 6-8, there is absolute gold in those seasons, but I definitely think Season 8 would have been the perfect thematic wrap up to the show.
Even with all the new ideas, the show had basically been the denizens of Hell and Purgatory causing nuisance on Earth. Having Sam, the one who so struggled with his demon blood, use the King of Hell to slam shut the gates would have bookended the show so perfectly. No more demons running around on Earth. Even Cain and Abaddon would probably have been forced into Hell as part of the spell. And Purgatory is Hell-adjacent, so I headcanon that closing the gates would help diminish the amount of things that could get out of there too.
Would have left Earth in a nice place where the hunters now just need to kill off the remaining monsters left on Earth. Sam's death would have had immense meaning and have made up for any role he played in starting the Apocalypse. Dean gets to go off and live the happy apple pie life he wanted to live. Cas could have returned to heaven and helped set things right up there without them being shotgunned all over the planet and causing more havoc than the demons were. No risk to the Mark or freeing Amara...
I am really struggling to push through S11. Completing the trials was such a great potential endpoint. And Sam was already right there. Dean just had to let him go this one time. Everything that came after was at least partially Dean's fault. A lot of it directly so.
@@tyrannicpuppy True, the first 5 were just about perfect. It was just the later seasons that kept having plot holes and retcons. I suppose if you're of the mind that you can have too much of a good thing, then ending it around then would've been a great ending. Although, I did mean if they were to carry it on for as long as the network allowed, thinking through the entire lore ahead of time would be the optimal way. Kind of like how cop shows don't have to think through the rules of their world when writing because the rules have already been decided for them. If the same were true for a fantasy world, where all the conceivable rules were laid out, then they'd only have to consider the history of the characters.
Chuck faking being evil makes the most sense actually, considering he is the writer for dean and sam's story. Each arc starts and ends with a new enemy, constantly leveling up. He would be their final enemy. And you cant have a heros journey without an obstacle.
Since end of S14 I had one thought about one either hole in a plot or interesting details.
1) Chuck says, that Amara is stronger then him if we are talking about pure power, but Chuck is better at strategy.
2) Chuck needed help of archangels to lock Amara
3) Nyphelym are stronger than angel father/mother
4) From third fact and a lot of things that we saw at S13 i guess, we can say that Jack is more powerful than Archangel (at least Lucy)
5) We know that Chuck killed Jack with one move of his finger
6) From all above: Chuck can with one move kill Jack, but Amara (who is stronger, than brother) cant kill archangels (that are weaker than Jack)
So either it hole in a plot, that can be true, or all S11 (i guess) was a play of Chuck. He wasnt injured, world wouldnt die. I want make any deduction from this. Just leave it here.
I never thought the last couple seasons were anything other than God's plan. Prior to this he made it abundantly clear he wanted out, then pops back up to randomly become the big bad just in time for Jack to be ready and able to absorb his powers and take his place. Ultimately, that's what he expressed he wanted previously in nearly as many words.
I mean the Charmed ones have been thrown out of windows, down stairs, electrocuted, hit upside the head, stabbed and what not. But by the end of the episode they're having margs at the club. I assumed that their guardian angel Leo heals them behind the scenes, same for Ca, Sam, and Dean
The Book of Enoch is one of the coolest books related to the bible. What it depicts perpetually inspires novels. There's spacecraft and aliens and more.
The first one. The Four Princes Of Hell are the most powerful because they were the first Angels and the strongest to side with and fell with Lucifer. So they’re actually Fallen Angels. That’s why they’re so powerful. And is why their eyes glowed yellow instead of blue like Cass’s. Because they are Fallen Angels.
You know you overlooked something there
Healing the boys
Cass yes could heal them off screen
But what about Meg?
Crowley?
Crowley healed Bobby from paralysis and demons can keep hosts alive after terrible injuries
Also, Death
He restored Bobby’s wife to life and she was cremated
Something to think about
I'd like to point out that Crowley didn't have unique eyes and smoke forms until he became the King, so he likely gained power somehow from that promotion. It never seemed to be enough to roval the archangels, so maybe the demon equivalent to a Seraphim.
I always assumed any angel-healing gave you 100% optimum health.
Those weren't "special glasses", they were just sunglasses.
And almost no one recognizes God because almost no one has ever actually seen him. Also shapeshifting.
The princes being nephillim makes a lot of sense. They are still part human so becoming demons would still work, plus biblically a bunch of angels were in trouble for making nephillim, so i mean if they were considered that bad, they had to go to hell right?
Would unironically love a hour long video of you talking theories
Always a treat when these pop up ❤
I think that Chuck should have never become a big villain. Some characters simply works better if they are neither heroes nor villain, and the show in my opinion made some similar mistakes woth Crowley (in season 8) and Metatron (much better character when he is not the main threat).
It was pretty bad. What I could not understand was why Chuck, after obliterating Jack, didn't just rewrite the Winchester's memory, so they never know what he really did.
@@TheFuzzician And that's why you should never use a allmighty character as main villain.
That's why they made him so stubborn. His biggest problem was that Sam and Dean just wouldn't do what he wrote them to do, and he never accepted that. He could've just erased their verse along with all the other ones, but he left the only ones who didn't follow the rules😅
Chuck had to become the final villain after he turned out to be God. The show pretty much set out that everything was happening at his whim. Eventually the Boy had to get fed up and square off against him.
Yeah, S14+ they just ran out of ideas and started wildly vomiting fanfiction-tier bullshit onto the page.
S14-15 really were the awful plotlines that the diehard oldbies insist everything after S5 was. (Granted, S6-S13 certainly got shaky and less coherent, but they didn't feel as actively insulting and ugly as the last two seasons. There's a difference between "not as good" and "horrible nonsense.")
Honestly i can see Crowley saying his whole back story is a lie. And the mccloud backstory came about when he wanted to reinvent himself.
God chuck was able do make people see him only when he wants them to see him
Is Chuck trying to convince us? Yes, maybe. Maybe he's so all knowing that he actually knows about us and our universe. He might be fully aware ( Kind of like Deadpool ) that we are watching.
i would love a mini series where bobby learns the unresolved mysteries during his time in heaven
i think all of the crossroads demons are red smoke because of their eyes, maybe not idk tbh
What if the Princes of Hell are actually angel-demon hybrids? They could be the children of Lucifer and Lillith, but what that would make of Alister though? He had white eyes like Lillith too so he must be related to her. Maybe both Lillith and Alister were created by Lucifer at the same time and then Lucifer mated with Lillith, creating the Princes of Hell.
So I think the princes of hell are actually angels.
Think about it, humans are very weak, but when they're tortured in hell and they break, and become demons, they become much more powerful.
Now if an angel is tortured in hell and it breaks, does it become a superdemon? Maybe. And that superdemon might be what the princes of hell are.
If go by real life biblical lore 1 third of heavens angels fell along side Lucifer so it's very possible some of the demons are actually corrupted angels
My fan theory is that putting a P in the abbreviation of Supernatural is stupid and not how abbreviations work. Fans of the show should strive to fix this.
SN is too easy to mistake for other things. Screen Name, Serial Number, SportsNet, Senegal...
@@Merlewhitefire Not when you are talking in the context of the TV show, which is every single time you talk about it. No one asks "Have you watched SPN?", they say "have you ever watched Supernatural. It's a shit shorthand and should be avoided.
My theory about the princes: I think he was trying to make his own set of angels at first, but.. uhm, failed and instead made a few anti-angels. Probably due to how he made them. He probable used a lot of soul or some impure amalgam of souls.
Isn't part of the brothers great health attributed to 'plot armor'? In the episode "The Hero's Journey", Garth has to be their dentist and I think explains this is because they are no long the protagonists of the story and now have to deal with everyday ailments like regular people do.
i would be on board with the theory that chuck created events of the last seasons for someone else to take over if it was explained properly in show, if they are coming back then i would want them to explain this that's if they decide to bring the show back and base it around chuck or something
9:19 well there is an episode that says that they have been resurrected multiple times, it’s the one where they get shotguned by two hunters and end up in heaven and cas asked then to try to find god, Zachariah says that they have both been sent back down to earth and restored so while on screen deal has the most canon deaths (at something like 111 though I question that number as Sam says 120 for that episode alone) but we don’t know just how meny times the angles fixed them back up before that arc is done (like season 6 or 7 I forget the number) after that probably cass although maybe it’s just the fact that they have been in the presents of an angel for so long that the radiation is just in them.
Hey! Just watched your Reaper-Video and wanted to ask where the Horsemen-Video is, because you said they would get their own video
I always figured the princess of hell were angle demon hybrids. Like that lucifer impregnated lilith after she became the first demon since she also has unique eyes.
I really like the last theory, really changes the perspective of the last few seasons so much better. They felt so rushed and it felt like they defeated God way too easy. So if it was him setting it all up it makes more sense.
Chuck having planned everything is like saying the Emperor on 40k planned everything, and all went according to his plan even if it doesnt look like so.
I don't think the four princes of hell are Nephilim, but there is a possibility that they were, but they were killed and then their souls went to hell and became demons. (I think Empty was only interested in Jack because he woke it up.)
Chuck is God. Amara confirmed it and she is God's twin and this info was told by the incorruptible everyone's favorite cosmic being OG Death.
The princes of hell theory does sound promising though. I personally think of them as the Hell's version of Archangel. As for them being nephilim i doubt that. To be nephilim they have to be angel-human hibrid which would imply that Lucifer was cast down way later than Adam and Eve story. However they could be supporters of Lucifer from heaven who were also cast down with him and probably the fall corrupted them
Also about the injuries i believe in one of the later seasons it was confirmed that Destiny was the one looking out for the boys, healing their injuries, keeping their bodies together and protecting them even from bad food. Once Destiny stopped protecting them, they started experiencing all sorts of everyday struggles
Chuck was full of ego who hated when everything didnt go exactly how he wanted......
If that last theory were true, maybe talking to that random store clerk wasn't an act for us, but himself? To convince himself he was evil to make the act more convincing, or to make "passing on the torch" easier for him?
15:29 best answer is It’s not so much an act for no one in the other universe as “character work” getting into character on his own as to be 100% convincing or reworking/improvising his characters motivations to seem more believable, because he is a perfectionist and loves creating a good story. Wants his characters to be endearing and the idea of him off in a separate universe “in character” would be the kind of silly thing Chuck/God would do if he is putting on a show as part of a test for Jack and the gang. Very method acting. The John Doe at radio hut is his captive audience and idea board, because who else is gonna help him run lines?
With that in mind couldnprolly bump it up to a B or B+