What's the Healthiest Diet?
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- Опубліковано 5 сер 2024
- We know it's a plant-based diet, but how much emphasis on starches versus veggies? Two medical giants, John McDougall MD and Joel Fuhrman MD, discuss and debate the question. For the full video and Expo event, go here: store.vegsource.com/collection...
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Starch for the win.
+Potato Strong I love Dr Furhman and learned a lot from his book and tried his program... I feel better longer with a 250 calorie potato than a 250 calorie giant kale smoothie...but I enjoy an occasion meal of a kale smoothie
Agree. A banana, kale, blueberry smoothie and be hungry in 30 min. Gimme the comfort food!
yes !!!!
Susan Wheeler Make sure you are adding hemp and flax.
because you need more bananas, which will give you more calories~
I started Doctor McDougall's starch diet a little over six weeks ago. If you would have told me, six weeks ago, that my super high blood pressure would drop to normal and the idea of eating meat would repulse me, I wouldn't have believed you, but that is exactly what has happened to me. I think there are some nice guys on this panel, but for the life of me,,,,all I hear is what Doctor McDougall says and I believe every word of it.
Good for you! Congratulations!
Janette Ellis wrote Hi guys have any attachments may also the best to do the best wishes and the best for you my friend is not to get a good and the way of ok
TheTexasbuddy yeah, but just know that what DR f is saying is you want to maximize the calorie nutrient ratio, because the longest living people eat about half the calories most people eat.
TheTexasbuddy Me too! I have so much energy, I can actually get up early and go for a walk, do gardening, or whatever, with NO fat in my diet, I'm only eating fruits and vegetables, mostly starch.
TheTexasbuddy im the exact same way. eating more than ever, feeling amazing, losing weight just from a month of it. yay mcdougall!!
When I turned vegan, I did the whole raw approach for a while but could not sustain it. I required a lot of food and was simply impossible to get all the calories from just fruits and veges. then I found Dr McDougall's program. Now I eat starches and veges and fruits. and getting better each day.
+Pradhyumna Gupta dawg i eat 20 bananas thats 2000 calories, how is that hard
Rusticfucker well to be honest I prefer a more savoury palette than a sweet one. Even now I don't think I can eat more than 5 bananas a day, just becomes too overwhelming.
But that's the beauty of it. I do more of a starch based diet. You can eat 20 bananas. To each his own.
+Pradhyumna Gupta eating bananas is a breeze
Blessings! SOMETHING WE MUST LEARN IN ALL SCHOOLS: Nature has not designed us to be predators - besides our bodies are very poorly developed for running, swimming, chasing, catching...have no good sense of smell, hearing and vision... MOST IMPORTANTLY we have very Long Intestines and therefore cannot digest meat well if not at all - MEAT gets stuck in our human intestines and easily rots for a very long time... Predators do not hunt and eat meat every day. They have short intestines which are highly acidic protecting predators from diseases... and they do not chew meat.
@@veranova6689 You are right except that humans are excellent at chasing. We are one of the most enduring land animals. That's why early human hunting techniques relied on chasing the prey until it couldn't run any more.
The best is to combine the two things. One can have starches to cover ones caloric need but still have a big salad, smoothie, fresh fruit, vegetables, nuts and seeds to get all the important micro nutrients
Sounds more like my style lol
God said i give you the plants....im assuming in the original form they were all nutrient dense and im sure they ate a variety. Just my theory :)
Smoothies are not necessarily the best
They are ALL right... perhaps Essylstein said it best.. to paraphrase... If you make it too hard and isolate one nutrient from the other, you will fail. Mix it up and take from ALL the categories.. fruit, starch, vegetable... stay away from anything processed and you will do fine.
Facts.
and kick the fat
I eat what the f I want in enormous quantities but according to Esselstyne rules and I'm losing 1.5 kilos (about 3lbs) a month
i agree, we are not cookie cutter people. i need more fat like avocados and nuts so there is where i disagree with macdougall
Reading through comments and went to like your comment....hahaha and I had already did it
Moderate don't eliminate
Always do our best and skip processed
My opinion as a dietitian: if you consume a plant based diet, eating a range and balance of fruit, vegetables, grains and seeds, you'll do great. Anyone and everyone will do great, contrary to popular belief. Some people thrive on higher amounts of carbs/starches/sugar, others (like me) need to balance it out. Bottom line: do what feels best, but keep it plant based. You'll live a long, healthy, comfortable life (genetics and environment permitting).
9 year update? still think the same ?
I'm with McDougall, and Esselstyn, keep it simple and doable. In Okinawa the overwhelming majority of their diet was sweet potatoes, rice and legumes, over 85% of their diet was starch, and they had the best health and max longevity in a natural population. I can't afford to eat fancy produce shipped in from all over the world, and even if I could, it is a huge waste of resources, keep it local as we always had to. I agree we all have different metabolisms, but if you tend to put on weight, fill up on a healthy soup and salad, and then your meal. You don't have to join a gym, keep active, just move, and you can't go wrong.
I think nuts and avacados are slightly unhealthy and consuming huge quatities of veggies is not a good long term strategy. Dr. Fuhrman says more veggies and more oily foods and I just think he is wrong. The native american tribes where I live survived on corn maize and rice.
@@mr.giraffe7076 Hello. It's true that many populations have thrived on starchy foods. But they also were eating certain animal based foods. So, as we are eating plants based diets, then we are avoiding foods that those healthy tribes actually eat. And that's why i thing the concept of nutrient dense foods is to important for everyone. I think both doctors have valid points. A humble opinion. Greetings
@@mr.giraffe7076Key word "survived" not "thrived" long term to a ripe old age!
No its seem more 65 % on carbohydrates
let's just agree on real whole foods.
Yes as long as they are real whole PLANT foods :)
+JustinLodes they are both for plant foods.
+Kim Black I know they are. I mean your comment. You could have also mean whole foods as in whole meats etc
+Taylor Dean meaning whole "meats" like a steak instead of a hot dog which is loaded with fillers and unnatural additives like sodium nitrate
An 8 ounce cut of grass fed beef is!
McDougall, is so confident and matter of fact.
I would LOVE to see Dr. Greger on this panel.
Same
YESSSSSSSS!!!!
*****
Huh,....never saw that. Thanks for the heads up, I will have to check it out.
Oh my gosh, johnny. I have spoken on a panel with Dr. Greger at a conference and he is definitely the highest energy person in the room. I suspect he moderates with a mainstream audience to reinforce his professionalism. He would absolutely be stellar in any panel. I believe he's featured on the holistic food cruise, and you can catch him in some of the new telesummits.
He wouldnt have entertained many senseless discussions that lead nowhere. I believe he is for both, in reality, as someone aldy said, they agree on many things.
I am on McDougalls side 100% on this. The dude has saved my life.
+Jennifer Kelly Drs McDougall, Campbell and Esselstyn is the Holy Trinity.
Jennifer Kelly, Please tell us more! How did he save your life? (Unless it is too personal and you don't want to.)
The Great Wall of China was built on white rice. I think they have done pretty well with their middle aged diet.
lisa peterson The Great Wall of China was built by slaves. White rice was not for the average person; it is a refined product that only the very rich ate during that time.
lisa peterson Lisa, The Great Wall of China was built on slavery and uncountable number of dead bodies.
lisa peterson Does not matter. The USA is the most powerful nation on earth. We may have a shitty SAD diet but we are still the world's premier superpower.
lisa peterson people in shanghai are fat. but they add table sugar to every single dish. that is why. the rest of china eats starch and no table sugar.
Fugitive136 china is
Dr. John McDougall has passed away as of June 22, 2024. He was an inspiration and a hero to us all. He had a terrible stroke at age 18, so his DNA was against him. But his diet kept him healthy and vibrant all these years. God Bless Dr. McDougall. RIP my friend.
OMG! I just pigged out for dinner, pardon the expression. Had a huge spring mix salad with red onions, walnuts, super sweet tart red cherry tomatoes, blueberries and this new strawberry vinaigrette that has no oil, no fat, no gluten, low sugar that I found at Whole Foods, Plus a heap of steamed white rice with lightly cooked mushrooms and a stack of undercooked broccoli crowns. I covered the rice in coconut aminos and a little sriracha. Plus a small glass of almond milk, hahaha! I feel like my stomach is going to explode!!!! It's the new McFurmanDougal Deluxe Diet! yeehaw!
Scot Campbell 😂
It actually sounds delicious!! Great meal!
Scot Campbell best of both worlds :) yum!
I do almost the same with my 1lb veg salad... only with 2 red potatoes, pumpkin & sunflower seeds, with some nutritional yeast, flax & chia seeds. The potato staves off hunger and that nibbly feeling for hours. If I don't have some kind of starch, the temptation to snack and nibble doesn't go away. :-) Best of Both Worlds!
sounds good to me
When Fuhrman talked about "nutritional excellence" it just made my stomach turn. That kind of statement of nutrient purity exists solely as a result of HUGE socio-economic privilege, and it just tells me that he gives no shits about a sustainable, AFFORDABLE solution for the masses.
@Sam V These foods are hard to get in some poorer minority dense areas/cities of the country. In these depressed areas there are more fast food chains and little to no farmers markets. This is America today.
Was that when he referred to them as "orientals"? .... The starch based diet is also good for the planet - something tells me that that is vital.
Cabbage is extremely cheap. Cauliflower is relatively cheap. Dr. Fuhrman is talking about the ideal diet. If all you can afford is beans & rice then eat beans & rice. You just have to watch the quanity. Dr. Fuhrman was an athlete. He is interested in maximum performance, not just good performance. People need to listen to what is actually being said.
I vote for McDougall. I think A low fat starch based diet should be the staring point. From there you can figure out what kinds of starches work best and what quantities and varieties of veggies work. You can also adjust your fat levels to whatever works best. I have lost 54 pounds so far on a Low Fat, Vegan, Starch Based diet. Potatoes FTW!
Wow...good for you!
Well said. I also vote for Dr.McDougall.His diet is very doable and reasonable and working for me in losing weight and controlling diabetes.
TeleTrans 1 McDougalls diet ruined my hormones. Hclf was a disaster that sent me into a miserable hormonal imbalance. It’s not for everyone.
Our bodies are made for fat. If you're still alive after 3 years and not completely crippled I'd be shocked.
@@VaughnMalecki Research Dr. Swank's diet. It's extremely low fat but his patients with MS still around after 35 years. Also I'm from the Philippines where we eat rice every day especially the poor and we're still alive.
WIth all love and respect for Dr Furhman and his advice, I feel the best when I add a portion of potatoes or rice in my everyday meals.
Rice is life!
Well, none of them are wrong, but McDougall is the only one who really gets it. We're so obsessed with weight loss in this culture and we've had it drilled into our heads that we need to restrict our calories to accomplish that. This weight loss dogma is so pervasive that it has polluted this discussion among health professionals. We're talking about the best and most sustainable diet for optimal health, and weight loss is a very small part of the equation. To focus on weight loss is a hindrance.
McDougall is the only one who seems to understand that you cannot sustain yourself on fucking kale and nuts (of course those foods have a place in a healthy diet), regardless of how "nutrient dense" those foods may be. He understands the human body's need for sufficient carbohydrate calories for energy. Bottom line, which is going to fill you up more and sustain you longer: a plate of kale or a plate of sweet potatoes? Your stomach would feel like it was going to explode from all the fiber before you could get enough calories from greens.
Of course this is not an all or nothing proposition. Eat the sweet potatoes AND the kale. But make no mistake, if you don't get enough calories on a vegan diet, or ANY diet, you're going to try to satiate yourself with more fat, which is not the optimal fuel, and will probably make you feel sluggish and unable to concentrate or function properly. Make carb-dense, calorie-dense foods the center of your diet. Centering a diet on starch is easier than centering it on fruit because starch has more calories per pound and you don't have to eat as much of it. If you don't do this, you will more than likely start eating a high fat diet and eventually fall back into eating animal products.
Totally nail it
Right on, you end up bloated and unhappy by restricting whole starches then you end up binging on avocados or nuts or just plain junk food, than you calorie restrict or diet again on and on and you you up and down in weight and never get healthy. I have tried Fhurman recommendations without success until I added more whole unrefined starch foods like steel cut oats and sweet potatoes.
High Carb Whole Foods, You speak the truth!
My only problem with McDougall is "Corn & Rice." Sweet potatoes and Beans are much more Nutrient dense and the primary "Blue Zone" foods.
William Gabbert what got my attention was when I noticed what foods companies like monsanto wanted to patten first; it was wheat, rice, corn, soy. They know something we don't and they are trying to go for the food jugular.
To clear this up for people. Both diets have great merit.. but. If you're an all day laborer or have a very physically demanding job, you will need greater calorie intake which will need to be met through increased starch intake. For the healthiest, nutrient dense diet, more fruits and vegetables will meet that requirement at a quicker pace, but it's unrealistic to think you will be able to sustain huge calorie deficits each day with fruits and vegetables while preserving muscle, if you are working in fields or hard labor all day. There is a reason the Roman army marched on starches including barley and not just fruits and vegetables and nuts.
Just incorporate both methods and you will do great and feel great.
I have to totally agree, the low carb type diet or meditteranean diet is good if your workload isnt so high, if doing the high carb no oil diet you stay at home then those carbs will get turned into fat via glucogenesis right?
I have a sluggish liver (fatty liver and gallbladder polyps) and when I tried to do the Mcdougal |I felt bloated from day one, but if I did much more exercise \i think it could work as long as those carbs are used up, you burn energy as you walk, move etc, metabolism increases and you burn the fat I suppose.
HermannTheGreat -very good response, I believe you're right.
Ding ding ding! I haven't been working out, so high starch wasn't working. Fuhrman's diet works for even for us sedentary folks. When you start getting more active, add more starch to your diet to make up the extra calories.
that's what fuhrman said. mcd refused to see it.
If a person is sitting all day, their risk of death and other health issues rises dramatically.
So, you all saying that you need to be active and then starch will work.... Well, yeah, that's why it does work.
McDougal works because the most optimal lifestyle is one based on that plus physical fitness. No exceptions.
Here's the take-away. Eat plants, not animals and the stuff that oozes out of them.
Aeghamedic ..... especially okra :)
Aeghamedic hahahhahaha sounds like gary said that
+Anonymous User Why do they bicker? Because its all about selling their books and seminars...
sdushdiu
yeah they do it all for nothing eh...
sdushdiu
I said "they" You just said Fuhrman is scamming selling his theory... so you agree with me... and you call my comment dumbass?...
How many books has McDougall put out?
Does he sell them.. does he get a speaking fee... is he selling something?
I think both of their opinions is very interesting and both should be considered.
Fuhrman has perfectly reasonable theories that make sense.
McDougall also has valued contribution.
Each to their own.
www.drmcdougall.com/wp/wp-content/uploads/starch_solution_front1.jpg
McDougall's the BOSS..period.
I don't know who the guy sitting next to McDougall is but I think his diet consists mainly of magic mushrooms :-)
haha, I thought the same thing.
Hilarious!
Lol
😂😂😂
Hahaha 😂🤣😂🤣😂🤣😂
I'm definitely a starch girl. I love McDougall
McDougall sells nothing but the truth which is free
I've tried it both ways. Felt like i was going to die on furmans diet. Now i include McDougals diet and feel awsome
Just as he explains with his explanation of natives eating grains before going into war
Yes I couldn't do Furman either. By day 3 I had gone back to processed unhealthy food because on Furman I felt hungry and craving. On McDougal I am content and no cravings.
I got about two weeks into the Fuhrman diet and nearly fainted. I realized I was getting about 1200 calories. You get a cup of beans and a tbsp of seeds and 2-3 fruits, and that’s about it for calories. Good luck with that.
McDougals THE WINNER 🏆
😊😊😊. 😁😁😁.😀😀😀
Agree with the other respondents. The Fuhrman diet was a nightmare for me - far too low in calories. I became super lethargic, felt negative and down, and became angry. Sure, weight was lost RAPIDLY but it's ridiculously hard to stick with it for any period of time and the crazy hunger led back to bingeing. It's not my experience that eating a super low calorie diet high in vegetables / high in nutrients would - on it's own - lead to a reduction in appetite; more calories from starch make a whole foods plant-based diet possible to sustain for me.
This is fantastic. It's like listening to an argument over what's better: gold, silver, or platinum. :) I happen to come from the Fuhrman nutritarian perspective, but I absolutely concede that they are all promoting healthy, life saving diets, any one of which would help eradicate 90% or more of the health problems Americans suffer from. I think they all offer excellent advice.
They each had a point. I MUST stick to a non-carb, not -starch diet because of my diabetes, I choose high fiber over high starch at all times. If I must eat starch it is in a form of food that naturally contains high fiber. DON'T EAT PROCESSED FOOD, don't eat anything that a machine ate first. The fellow who was talking about natural or "ancient(?)" foods was correct also, but those foods are near impossible to find any more.
@@joelalmon3088 Type 2 diabetes is caused by fat (intramyocellular lipids). You can only reverse insulin resistance with a low-fat, high-carb diet. If you have type 1 diabetes, you will still benefit from a low-fat, high-carb diet as you will need less insulin. And Dr. Fuhrman's points are proven wrong. He falls for marketing research, as Jeff Nelson said.
100% McDougall is correct!!! I've reversed MS with slight modification to John's diet.
michael lippert Wow, what modification did you make to John’s diet? Congratulations on reversing MS, how are you doing these days?
McDougall makes me feel better about where I am now, Fuhrman makes me want to strive to do better in the future.
Great explanation
Well put!
Where are you now?? What you eat ? Did you start introducing meat into your diet ??
I tend to follow Fuhrman's plan more (works well for me), but you know, one thing I've found after looking at a lot of McDougall videos is that he and Fuhrman do agree on MANY things. They may have their own approaches, but it's important to also look at what they all agree on first, as that's what we KNOW doesn't work.
For example, animal protein (and soy) stimulates the IGF-1 hormone, gives you cancer. They also agree that oils are not healthy, and that includes ALL oil. Also, caffeine is "like a drug" according to both of these guys, and they both recognize that dairy has its own risks, too, and both agree that cow's milk for baby calfs, not humans. Whether you want to eat more starch or focus on the quality of your calories is something individuals can play around with and see how it goes, but it is quite important to find what these guys all have in common.
www.drmcdougall.com/misc/2005nl/april/050400pusoy.htm
Look under "Calcium Loss and Cancer Growth from Protein Concentrates"
However, this is *isolated soy protein*. You know, like from those protein powders, or the fake meats (Like the "tofurkeys"). Soy milk, tofu, edamame, tempeh… these more traditional soy products should be fine.
Josh Jimenez I
Not soy per se, but soy isolate. Dr McDougall explicitly says it's perfectly fine to eat traditional soy products, such as tofu but to avoid anything that is fake food, such as meat replacement made from soy isolate. These aren't healthier than meat because of IGF-1.
not true about soy
Why not healthy oils? Whole 30 supports healthy oils.
Due to the human species' origin still being unknown, I think we should experiment and see what works best for us. Personally, I always mix starches and veggies. I've tried mainly veggies and it just did not work for me at all. I was tired and constantly hungry. So, I decided to go more towards the potatoes, bread, rice, pasta, etc and found my balance by adding in the vegetables and fruit and I am feeling much happier! I live in quite a cold climate, so I think that is important too! There is no straight answer. The important thing is mostly reducing or completely cutting out animal products and you will be happier and healthier.
I think this is the smartest comment I've read.
Maybe you are the one who needs to go back to class and maybe read a couple of books in your spare time instead of trolling people. We don't know 100% WHERE the human species came from, meaning the specific times and places it evolved in, where it migrated during that time, how many species existed to begin with before we narrowed it down to Homo Sapiens. There are too many theories and a lot of material. For example, some much older human species survived purely on meat. And there are societies today that only eat meat and dairy with low to no indication of heart disease. Have you ever come across these articles? Probably not. Scientists are still doing constant research to find more and more explanations to how we ended up here where we are now. So yes, we don't know for sure, and we may never know for sure. So, like I said, people need to experiment on their own to see what works for them best to lead a happy and healthy life.
@@yellowdiamonddoesntapprove6632 They DO know. And those FEW tribes (Masai) that eat meat and milk exclusively DO have heart disease. You would do well to follow your own advice and GO BACK TO CLASS.
Dr. Esselstyn is totally brilliant !
McDougall is more practical and more convincing.
practical isn't the most healthy, which is what the debate should be about
Just started the McDougall diet a week ago and have already lost 5.9 pounds and my taste buds crave whole foods now!
They both have valid points. If you can reduce starches in favor of more nutrient dense foods, you should. But you still need starches to get enough calories and enjoyment out of food.
Staches are nutrient dense.....
Uhhmmm starches are nutrients foods!
+Jo Woo not as much as fruit or vegetables
We need starch to get sustainable foods and there's no limitations about how much veggies to eat!
Greens are wonderful but miss the one ingredient our brain needs to burn and that's carbs!!! I don't really see the problem with having a base from starch and add as much veggies as we want on top of it!!
To me it's still much better than a non-vegan/fatty/american diet... we needs all what plant-based diet has to offer!!
With out starch your stomach will not fill
An ideal diet is nutrient dense and plant based. I think they all agree on that.
That's an oxymoron. Plant based isn't nutrient dense. Animal foods are nutrient dense.
@@VaughnMalecki liver milk and eggs are all nutrient dense
@@spr6577 that's a major portion of my diet. Currently reading Super Fuel and I'm going to be adding more seafood to my diet.
Didn't Fuhrman say he eats more than one bowl of starch a day? I think it's pretty evident they are talking about the same thing here. It's just a war between micronutrient vs macronutrient. The idea is to have starch as your main macronutrient while adequately getting in micronutrients in a dense way.
+Roberto Matesanz He's wrong. Many people drop weight easily eating all the starch they want. I lost 170 lbs eating amounts of starch that would make Fuhrman faint.
+adamaj74 Nice one! I'm on 1-2 kg of starch (potatoes and sweet potatoes) per day and about 1-2 kg of fruit plus vegetables and some legumes
+adamaj74 Lol!!! @ "That would make Fuhrman faint." That's a funny visual. :)
No, quite different. Eat to live recommends over 50% of calories from vegetables like kale, broccoli, spinach and cauliflower. That's over 1000 calories a day, most people would struggle with 200 calories. A huge bag of spinach is only about 70 calories, tastes horrible, and will upset your stomach. His diet is pure fad diet.
+hebince44 I bought both books on the same day and read through maybe half of Eat to Live before deciding: nope, no can do. I read The Starch Solution and while it will be a change. . . Yeah, it's clear that it's difficult to go hungry.
I strongly believe in potatoes.
you should not be eating potatoes or starches they are man made and you cant eat them in their natural state fruits are a lot more appealing due to their color and taste.
I too believe in potatos. They are complete food with protein starch potassium and vitamins
Me too theres a reason that they used potatoes in the movie THE MARTIAN.
Potatoes both white and sweet are the STAPLE of my diet. And my health and strength has never been better at 55 yeara old. Of course I eat fruits and veggies. But the POTATO is the foundation. Then I love mung beans and chick peas/lentils etc.
McDougall is a genius!
More like a shepherd leading the sheep to an early slaughter. Stay brainwashed.
Mcdougal OWNS those other doctors 😃 I love it
McDougalls diet is easier. Dr. Fuhrman is all about optimal nutrition. The most nutrients per calorie.
easier to get cancer too. fuhrman is all about fixing a problem--the damage we've done by prior misinformation
That guy derping out next to McDougal
Lol!!!
Josh Bauer
thank u for the laugh lmao
you know what they call the person who graduated at the bottom of the class in medical school? doctor.
I didnt notice until I read this comment, exactly when he was doing such a funny face XD
I have been eating tons of starch for the last month and I am losing weight.
+Ella I was losing weight like 2 pounds a week having 2 servings of potatoes in the morning, cooked spinach for lunch and black beans for dinner but once I started to add the brown rice in with the beans my weight loss stoped, I took out the brown rice and started to lose weight again, and today I decided to cut out the potatoes and add more greens to lose more weight
+phantomofoaktown Maybe it is so that your body later will adapt to the nutrient-dense foods it now gets and stop hoarding all the starch it gets. I'm opposite, can't put on muscle or even fat. Digestive-psychological-something-issue. Wanna switch? But there's always a way. Meditation and japanese natto will transform it, good luck to you too.
Equalpower thanks!
How are you now???
@@carolinareaper8089 ; Forgot their password. They haven’t touched their channel, in ages, it looks like. 🤷🏻♀️🤷🏻♂️
Joel Fuhrman is right on. This was worth watching. This should be a 5 hour talk.
I was afraid of eating a high carb diet because of my hypoglycemia, but I haven't had a low blood sugar episode since starting on the Starch Solution. I eat starch, legumes, and some non starchy veggies at every meal and I've been exceeding the DRV of a lot of nutrients that I was deficient in on a high protein, low carb diet. I'm fully satiatated after every meal as well, so I don't even feel like I need a cheat day. My taste buds have changed, too and a piece of fruit after dinner is a legit dessert to me now. I think the argument they were having was kind of silly, because McDougall doesn't say that you shouldn't eat veggies, he says that your caloric staple should be from starch and to have veggies as well.
Because my blood sugar would go up super high and then drop super low if I ate a carb heavy meal/snack before.
Both are equal
What you choose is based on your level of activity/calorie needs.
- Heavy lifter? Burn lots of calories?
Go with McDougall's approach.
- Have an office job? Spend most of your time driving/sitting?
Go for a semi-raw to mostly raw leafies and fruit-based diet.
_"...have you been to Peru?"_ - love it! ;o)))
Good point Dr. McDougall! Many don't even know that potatoes come from South America - in the US, Latin American children are made fun of in schools because they eat "rice and beans" but the Latin American diet is so much more varied than that! Everytime you eat fries or fish n' chips, remember that their main ingredient is a South American plant - the potato.
Operação Lava Toga, Lula livre e reeleito! The potatoes come from Polynesia. Thousands years ago The Polynesians created rafts and boats and moved to South America and brought the potatoes to South Americas. Thousands year later Spanish conquered Americas and brought the Potatoes to Spain.
Dr. Fuhrman is correct. It is the best diet for optimum health!
The starch solution is the only eating plan I have been able to stick to. It works. Lose weight & not starve!
Perhaps cause what you needed was to lose weight. In my case I'm diabetic and no need to lose weight, just to be healthy. My blood tests are better the less starch I eat...... :( sadly cause I'm a potato junkie lol I could eat em all day every day but... no can do :(:(:(:(
Nia LaLa
I'm a type 1 and yeah! I've heard of him and read his book too. They reverse the type 2 diabetes, ours isn't curable yet, but still it made sense to me to go vegan at least to improve my health. They're not my main food source but I do eat starchy foods occasionally though.
fi0rella Please google "type 1 diabetes dr. brian clement" and "type 1 diabetes dr. gabriel cousens" They have reversed some cases of type 1 diabetes
BTW Dr. Fuhrman has a book on diabetes (The End of Diabetes) . Might be worth checking out
SpirulinaLove
I'll check them out! Thank you ♥
McDougall lost me with his travel advice. Making assumptions about a population/culture based on a vacation there is absolutely horrible science.. it's like visiting NYC and saying, "To hell with statistics.. from my personal experience I estimate the population of the USA at 50 billion."
Thilo Savage I've never found McDougall to be all that bright. His advice may or may not be correct, but the way he argues it is really not that clever.
he lived in south amerika for long time.he also worked in health care..from my personal experience people need to learn more before even talking about McDougall Thilo Savage
It's the other way around. He's actually using population statistics to prove a point. Asians are slim are his point, and Asians eat rice mainly, a starch.
If I have any worries about not having enough nutrient density in my meals I'll simply add kale, broccoli, or spinach to my lentils and potatoes. Easy to do and hasn't failed yet.
While the points about optimum diet and natural foods are relevant they're not nearly as important as shifting folks away from animal product diets to plant diets. Do that first. If then you want to have arguments about gmo, celiac, modern hybrid plants or fruit vs starch, go for it. But see the big picture. The primary step is get on a plant based diet with a nutrient caloric ratio around 80/10/10. For those that really do have grain sensitivity issues, you can easily find plant alternatives to grains.
Watching this and eating my favorite startches...
I feel much better on a Dr Fuhrman style diet, though the MacDougall diet is easier to follow and I LOVE potatoes. Too much starch makes me bloated, while nuts and seeds really agree with me.
Same here, Sandra. I was so fine and used to nuts and seeds, with frozen fruit smoothies in the morning, a salad, best I've ever felt.
As soon I tried the starch solution, boy did I feel heavy and bloated! And the all fruit diet doesn't sit will with me because I don't really a sweet tooth.
I don't understand why you say all the fruit on a starch based diet left you bloated as he's say's you should limit them to around 4 per day and there not even an essential part of the diet but more like a desert, you could cut them out all together if you liked. Sounds like you weren't following the Mcdougall plan.
"I don't understand why you say all the fruit on a starch based diet left you bloated"
-She didn't say that.
Emi is talking about two different diets that do not agree with her: Starch solution and the all fruit diet.
I am pretty certain Emi does NOT think the starch solution is an all fruit diet...
*****
An all fruit diet is nonsense, the only time it would make any sort of sense to have a higher ratio of fruit is if you're an endurance athlete, outside of that you would have major problems unless you're a primate.
Um... what makes you think I was ever interested in an all fruit diet?
My name is not Freelee...
I love how we as vegans have our own celebrities 😂🌱🌎🌏🌍
So true!!!
Great comments from the doctors and from my own experience and others vegans that I know, eating healthy starch is important to getting enough calories unless the person is extremely sedentary with slow metabolism.
I think there is a continuum with vegan food and it's great to know that in case I want to eat comfort food, my waxy red patatoes are there waiting for me (love them) and I can have some veggie sausages too. If I want something lighter like a salad, I can have that too. Maybe there is no point to argue that out, the important thing is staying on the wagon and knowing how to handle cravings, how to be prepared. It's great to know what works for you.
I tried a raw vegan diet and it felt great but it was too hard for me, I could not stay on it. That doesn't mean I don't love to have raw or high-raw meals, I do. But having starchy vegan food as a guilt-free backup is wonderful.
Big thank you to all the lovely doctors on the panel!
Yay Dr Furhrman! You're amazing!! And it's amazing how healthy and vibrant his skin looks for his age!!!
There are way more similarities than differences between their diet concepts. So why decide for one of them? Personally I'm combining every high carb vegan concept. One day I follow starch solution, another day fuhrman's style, next day fully raw or rawtil4 etc. :)
seems like the most sensible way to go
Are you still not eating meat ??
I have been on starch based diet for a week now and I feel great. I eat as much as I want, fully satisfied and happy. Dr. McDougall makes perfect sense for me. Incorporating potato, rice, corn and all veg led me to eat good without feeling guilty.
+sarah46787 Me too! I was afraid of eating a high carb diet because of my hypoglycemia, but I haven't had a low blood sugar episode since starting on the Starch Solution. I eat starch, legumes, and some non starchy veggies at every meal and I've been exceeding the DRV of a lot of nutrients that I was deficient in on a high protein, low carb diet. I'm fully satietated after every meal as well, so I don't even feel like I need a cheat day. My taste buds have changed, too and a piece of fruit after dinner is a legit dessert to me now.
The difference between Dr. McDougall and Dr. Fuhrman on the subject of diet is small. If your more active and not a gainer you can eat more starches. Not many in the U.S. need to worry about not getting enough calories. If you are on a healthy whole foods plant based diet and can not attain a healthy weight, reduce starches.
Dr. McDougall has a fantastic program and it seems as if the others are knit picking at it...there is such a larger issue out there than buying a russet potato. People don't have russet potatoes in their carts...they deeply believe that chicken breast and olive oil are much better choices because they haven't learned what McDougall is saying. It truly is a life changer and where our focus should be.
So you Dr. Fuhrman did say nuts seeds and avocados. Few years later now in 2019 and you are not advising avocados anymore but only nuts. How long will it take now to eliminate most nuts also? You are getting there!!!
Esselstyn *owned* this little debate!
Love dr. McDougall, he changed so many lives!
This video is 16 years old, but this is what we need to see again. This type of panel.
Honestly I think if you eat either of there recommended diets your doing pretty well. We should focus on arguing against paleo and meat consuming diets rather than fighting each other.
An excellent debate. I wish more people were interested in this. Maybe health care costs and unnecessary pain could be alleviated if more were interested.
+Michael Miller Truly it would, but people only seem to follow the trends of their closest contacts. I can't just say it'd be a good change for americans anymore, bcs this have spread like wildfire, wherever fast food pops up, and people chose pre-treated foods. The weight of the western populace would drop 20% and everybody would be happy again. I wanna take it to the extreme and grow my own food, that I know what have been done with, saving me costs/earn by selling to use on ecological foods I can't grow and cultivates a connection to the Earth. I'll also make a vid of a new machine concept unlike anything that I only have on paper, that will work with wind, water or sun to do the usual tasks on a farm. No electricity involved, but can be made to harvest that as well when idle.
Dr. Furhman forgets that a lot of Americans don’t have the funds to eat the “high quality” nutritious foods. Dr. McDougall has the best advice.
Yes
No, I love that this intense discussion went on. Really interesting and really important. These men are the food and nutrition gods of our time. Each one has important points magnificently expressed.
I like Dr. McDougall's approach of simplicity, because it works and you have some real leeway with things like salt ect... The diet works and it's easy to comply with. I'll get me some avocados when I'm done taking the weight off but I certainly don't need them or nuts to thrive. started at 210lbs, down to 195 in a few weeks, and it's easy(don't worry, I'm gonna slow down the weight loss if it continues this fast). I still eat good veggies, I just don't obsess over micro nutrients and crap like that. ; )
I like a plant based diet. Be it McDougall or Furman they are both great. Has anyone tried the Hallelujah diet?!!! 85% raw 15% cooked? I lost 65 pounds. My doctor said he wished all his patients were as healthy as l was.
See my reply above.
If you’re eating a plant based diet and cut starches, you’d waste away to nothing imo. You need energy, esp if you’re exercising.
I've been researching all of these guys diets and holy crap they're all here :-D
I love this Extremely extinguished panel. You can seriously save the world.... keep doing what you are doing.
Very compelling question and debate segment,. Each doctor raises interesting points based on case studies, patients, and professional expertise.
Fuhrman has a special, magical way to baffle me with his words.
I follow Dr McDougall, I lost the weight, the medications, haven’t gained weight, don’t count calories
Long live McDougall
After years of trying every diet I have finally found the answer to my problems
Have struggled most of my life with weight
I do eat avocados and nuts
“You love starch. It’s comfort food.” My comfort foods have never been starches. Snickers bars & ice cream. Should I eat those? I definitely feel better when I limit starches and eat a variety of colorful veggies and fruit. I’ve been trying to eat rice lately, and it’s making me gain weight. I think Dr. Fuhrman’s right that some of us just can’t metabolize starches very well and do better to limit them.
my vilage diet is based on rice = no one isa fat. no one.
sabah borneo kudat.
no sugar and dairy?
But when you go to the big cities in Indonesia there are fat people. The fat people eat processed food just like in the USA. The people who are thin and healthy eat traditional diet. 🤗
I do believe there is no "one size fits all" diet.
Thank you for an intelligent and fact based debate. I feel that the information all the Doctors gave were great for me to make a choice best for my situation :) And thank you too that man who asked the question
They all had excellent points, what a fun debate! Love all those plant based doctors!
Dr Mcdougall's eating plan has changed my life. Did Dr Fuhman's eating plan first, was hungry all the time.
well both promote beans so starch is actually promoted by both
I love both of these guys. Proper balance is key, depending on the individual.
I have watched and listened to both men and they both have some good points. I have tried both and found Fuhrman approach has the edge for me. I'm a hardcore nutritarian who eats moderate whole food starches.
I'm with Dr. Fuhrman....
Starch solution that shit is lit! Dr Mcdougalls saved my life!!! #TeamMcfougalls
Mcfougalls? haha
LOL MCFOUGALLS!!!
I’ve been in the Starch Solution for six months. I’m 62 years of age, I’m a martial arts teacher for 45 years. Dr. McDougall’s diet has helped me stay lean and healthy, and really enjoy my meals. I am Puerto Rican so white rice and beans are a part of the diet of all the people. I agree with Dr. McDougall and believe him over those others.
so happy to finally see Neil Nedley being invited to these talks! where can i find the entire lecture?
Dr. Neil Nedley is outstanding and an SDA Christian.
Where can we find this full length video of this panel?
Dr. McDougall: starch is for humans to be strong and respond to high-calorie demand; Dr. Fuhrman: consume less starch and more nutrient-rich vegetables, seeds, berries and fruit to become healthier, slimmer and live longer. In sum: starch is for the common man and a nutrient-rich diet is for the Ubermensch/Superman potential in common man.
I still find this amusing in 2021. I also still agree with mcdougall...without potatoes I do not feel satisfied. More fruit in the summer is okay (in season) but the majority of the time my diet is centred around starch.
Such good points. All of them! And i guess all of them have not very good points. But for those who thrive on plantfoods they are a gold mine. I do so far. I think most people do for some years. Then you may need to ajust a bit. Like me I tend to go between more fruitbased and more starch based. I feel so blessed and privileged having choice in the matter. Thanks for all your great work!!
I follow Dr, Fuhrman. I think he did a good job explaining his protocol.
Lol the end of this video was EVERYTHING 😄 I follow them ALL and at nearly 40, I look 28 and my size is TWO; haven’t been sick for THREE YEARS
Great panel. Highly informative and insightful. Thanks very much indeed. 💐❤️🇺🇸
I couldn't survive a day without startches.
Starch!
I think simplicity is the key. I've been trying to switch to a plant-based diet. I've been finding it hard because I have very little energy and feel swamped by shopping, ingredients and cooking. I think eating ultra-simple meals at first (to the point of repetition) might be the key to unlocking energy (and, perhaps, future culinary creativity).
Furhman makes such great sense regarding most optimal diet
Dr Mcdougall makes common sense. The others are just trying to sound intelligent and make empty, useless points. Starch for the win.