Errata: A couple of people have pointed out that the wires are likely not aluminum, and they appear to be right. While the transformer nameplate says "Wire: Al" on it, I went back and scraped some of the wires, and they look like copper under a silver surface coating. Perhaps the marking on the transformer refers only to the windings. It's fully encapsulated in resin, so I can't verify.
I could see them using aluminum for the windings. But it's very rare for wire to be aluminum as making a reliable connection requires fancy tools. Much easier to weld a copper or tinned copper wire to the end of the aluminum and make a connection to the pigtail. (this is all due to surface oxide black magic)
For the cost of that brake, I'm blown away that the manufacturers couldn't be bothered to ensure that it could be connected up to an ordinary mains supply. No-one has a regulated supply as standard.
@@scootscoot2k UK power was originally 240V +-5%, and when they harmonized with the EU they went to 230V -5% +10% (do the math, it may surprise you…). It’s really weird they’d be specced for 220 +-5%. That’s the old mainland EU standard, which harmonized to 230V -10%, +5%.
I have had one of these for almost 10 years in my aircraft shop. It is one of the most versatile sheet metal tools I own. You are only limited what it can do by your imagination and ingenuity. Loved the technical aspect of your video.
Kudos for using Wagos. As European I die a bit inside every time I see wire nuts being used. Also, kudos for selecting the proper Wago clamp type and using the Al contact paste. You did your research.
Wagos don't provide as much contact between the wires as a properly twisted wire nut connection. I've had to replace Wagos in strings of fluorescent lights. In my opinion, Wagos are for lazy electricians.
Wire nuts work quite well IF you have the correct size AND know how to use them. But knowing how to use them IS the problem. So many people think you can shove anything in there and they work as long as they're tight and that is not the case. Dissimilar types of wire like stranded and solid can be problematic, as can different sizes of wire. Also if one is stranded and tinned and the other is solid. The wire should be the same length and should NOT be twisted together before putting the wire nut on. Take a few things apart that have been worked on by people who don't know or care and you'll find the connection is often not that great. Typically the stranded wire gets run down to the bottom of the solid and has a lot less contact than expected. I'm sure the manufacturers and NEC have specifics on these but I'll admit I haven't seen them.
@@tiredoldmechanic1791 I laughed when he said "nice clean installation" then he had to squirt a bunch of noalox into each of the connectors. That stuff is like moly grease. It's black and gets everywhere.
@@tiredoldmechanic1791 Wagos are for electricians who don't want to be held liable for burned down hose, or electrocuted customer. I've seen so may loose an wonky wire twists with wire nuts, including ground wires(in US), that I'm surprised that they are still allowed and still in use. In many countries you'd probably loose your license for using wire nuts. Wagos are almost impossible to install incorrectly.
Couple tips for wagos. I’m from the uk and use them all the time. 1. If you’re using solid core wire you don’t actually have to lift the lever to insert the wire, it can just be pushed straight in. 2. For piece of mind I usually put a heat shrink sleeve over them if I’m using them in control cabinets or in your case a transformer. Also love the safety flip flops :)
Make sure you put a digital volt meter somewhere in your shop if you dont have one because the utility can change your voltage at will. They typically allow a very wide spread of allowable supplied voltage to meet their spec. Our shop regularly sees 262 volts because we are in a rural area and the utility company is over-feeding do to antiquated lined 10-15-30 miles out at the end of a line. Our CNC and edge banders will not handle that over-voltage so we have to buck via several transformers (too costly to buck the entire 600a shop feed). But we installed digital volt meters in the event the utility does ever bring the supply voltage down (they are 2 volts below their high limit allowance) we will have to re-wire but transformers as we are bucking every bit we can just to be in spec on the machines.
I've been working in embedded devices for a decade and I've never seen such a clear explanation for _why_ autotranformers are better when you don't need the isolation. That makes so much sense.
Most of my body is space aware of the surroundings. However, my toes are drawn magically to anything that will harm them if they aren't properly covered. Kudos to those of you who have intelligent feet.
Those are colloquially known in Australia as ‘Ozzie Safety Boots’ 🤣🤣🤣 Standard foot ware for all ‘Bush Mechanics’ Regards, Robert PS Your vids are REALLY informative 👍
Great job explaning how the auto transformer works. I have a rolling base on my table saw that has two of the rollers on cams that pop the saw up to roll it around. If you drop the cam, the saw sits on two rollers and two stationary legs. This makes for a very stable base when in use but it makes it easy to move. Something like this would be a good fit for the brake.
A college friend of mine bought one about 2 years ago. He absolutely loves his. In fact, he talked about that brake everyday for a month. the 275V on the moon since 69 had me rolling on the floor. LOL
The many ways you can combine the various fingers on the brake seems analogous to the many ways you can combine the taps on the transformer which drives it. There's some elegance in seeing the same pattern applied in two such different ways within the same total machine.
VA, Watts and PF explained in such a way that I FULLY understand it. I have had several attempts at trying to untangle this since I first learned that VA is not the same as Watts in college over 30 years ago. It took less than 2 mins for you to explain it AND where Power Factor comes into it. THANK YOU James !!
That's a cute little transformer. I needed a transformer that could take the power out of my home solar inverter that was galvanically isolated and would generate split phase 120V. The model I got was a 5KVA Emerson. I think the thing weighs upwards of 150 pounds. In the end I switched inverter supplier and never needed the transformer but I do remember almost blacking out trying to manhandle this thing and getting it bolted to the basement wall even with the help of a scissor lift. It's still there on the wall taunting me every time I go to check the inverter status 😀
James, even if I am french and need effort to understand all, your explanations about transformers and auto-transformers are very clear, and I learn some things today with you. It is strange to use everyday these devices and never tried to understand the principles. So thanks a lot to have light on my mean. I like this approach : buying a new machine, need a component and explain us how it works. Bravo !
This is a great video! As an electrical engineer, you're spot on about everything but the nomenclature. These are typically called step-up/step-down transformers. Buck/boost is an entirely different animal that uses active switching with a MOSFET and is typically exclusive to DC only topologies. The end goal is the same, making a larger voltage from a smaller input voltage or vise versa, but the way they do that is different. Granted, I've never worked with autotransformers before. Again, nice job keeping the voltage in spec.
The manufacturer called the transformer buck/boost which is a term I'd never heard used in pure transformer topologies. To be honest I thought the magic box would have a bunch of power mosfets in it.😀
@@vincei4252 that's what I was thinking. So I waited to comment until the end of the video thinking some jackass is about to introduce a bunch of smps on the grid.
@@conrad2468 Interesting. I just checked the Emerson transformer catalog and they're also calling them buck/boost, even the galvanically isolated models. I guess there was a memo you and I never saw.
I think you are wrong. There are two types of buck/boost voltage conversion devices. The switching type which you are referring to are typically called "buck/boost converters". The transformer types are not surprisingly called "buck/boost transformers". The main difference between the two is in the additional circuitry to increase the switching frequency in the case of converters which has many benefits, but noise related downsides.
The words "Buck Boost" are printed on the label on the transformer. A buck or boost converter is also a thing, and you're right; it's a different animal.
Wow! I found this video by responding to one of his comments on another youtube video. He said he had a video on setting up his magnetic brake. This video is awesome! I wondered why I saw transformers listed as VA but didn't really understand it. I have done electrical maintenance and mostly single phase work on commercial buildings (lighting, water heaters, AC, etc.) and have done just about everything on residential, and I do hobby electrical projects, so I know a great deal, but my primary trade isn't electrical. This video is easy to follow and right to the point as opposed to videos full of filler and crappy music. I will check out your other videos! Thanks for sharing your knowledge!
would love to see you do some tutorials in fusion 360 with their sheet metal stuff and see it out to production from plasma cutting and bending on the brake!
Yes, that is a great feature I played with a couple years ago (I built my own plasma table), but I'm not sure if the feature still works since they changed the licensing on fusion 360. My brother uses it for his cnc mill and I usually do very well with computer and tech stuff, but I just suck at fusion. It isn't intuitive at all. I'm thinking about buying a magnetic brake and I already do a little bit of powder coating and have been welding for 20+ years. I'm working on tying it all together to produce products I can sell.
I pick up probably a dozen step up/step down transformers every year from the industrial salvage place I visit. One of the biggest ones I’ve got weighs about 1500 pounds and is on casters. And I’ve seen much bigger. But don’t have a use for anything bigger than that. These big factories and manufacturing plants buy tons of them,… And then don’t use them or for some reason take them to the salvage yard while still brand new on the pallet. They are extremely useful, not to mention I have an electronics lab where I do component level board repair for industrial clients. So I can always use extra step up/down transformers. Most of the industrial duty high-end ones that I’ve seen have copper windings through and through. Usually tinplated. And I have actually seen inside some of the larger resin encapsulated transformers when they’ve been cut or busted open.
Good explanations, I think many needed that... :) Intuitive understanding is worth so much more than many think, especially when trying diagnose something that's not working later. Having a feeling of "this isn't correct" when you measure/test something can save so much time... But you could mention that the two large coils are actually pushing current "backwards", being force fed magnetic induction from the smaller coils... The 17.5A output is the sum of 16.0A pushed "through" from mains and 1.5A circulating backwards from the circuit of the large secondary coils. 16+1.5=17.5. Also, I didn't run a brake like that under water on the moon - but a reasonable advice is to always use a small scrap piece of the same thickness as the piece you're trying to bend on the other side of the clamping slit. Otherwise the top clamp will gradually over time bend into a permanent dome shape which lowers your clamping force in the middle of the table. This is true even for large, industrial scale brakes....
Love the brake too - bought mine back in 2014. My supply power is also about 245V. You got me wondering if I need to be concerned?? The manual I received with the brake makes no mention to allowable tolerance on 220V input. In fact there’s a troubleshooting section in the back if my manual that suggests the voltage readings should be 240V. So I compared my manual to the one they issue today from Baileigh’s website. Wow. I’m going to call Baileigh this week and see if they changed something, or I need to add the transformer. I’ll update my comments when I know more. Thanks James for this awesome explanation of how buck transformers work.
From what I've gathered, they had a high failure rate, and requiring the transformer has reduced it. I don't know beyond that. Have you by chance ever measured the current draw?
Bought my Baileigh mag brake in 2016 for 2335 from Elite. Placard says 220V. Page 31 of the manual says 240V and has worked fine on 240V since new. Looking at the wire diagram, it says the primary transformer coil is 220V but not sure what the secondary coil does to the voltage. Like your presentation.
What??? Those Wago connectors are awesome! I think you're channel has the highest ratio of things I've never heard of that once I've heard of it I absolutely have to have it. Seriously!
I have the non-Baliegh brand version of that I didn't realize there was some power configuration issues with these. I just plugged it, underwater on the moon of course. But still... one of my favorite shop tools!
Dusting off the cob-webs from my undergrad electromagnetic course. One of the odd things with AC current in inductors is that the maximum flux in the core is proportional to the voltage and proportional to the inverse of the frequency. Where this can get ugly is if the core saturates. When the core saturates it needs a LOT more current to keep increasing the flux in the core. This will show up as a poor power factor due to a current wave-form with a spike at the peak. This also shows up as quite a bit more heat as the inductor can end up drawing way more current than typical.
I bought a few weeks back the same type of magnetic brake but from another seller whose brake comes from the same factory. I was surprised when I looked at the manual to see that the manual says 220/240v. I had the seller ask the manufacturing plant if it had to be the 220v like baleigh writes in their manual to make sure a buck boost transformer is really required. Manufacturing plant told my seller that it was 220/240v compatible and did not require a buck boost transformer. It was also confirmed that the manufacturing plant is the same one that supplies the same units to baleigh. I have the original manufacturer manual for the machine with mine.I wonder why Baleigh who wrote their own nicer manual wrote up the buck boost transformer stuff in their manual.
An ounce of prevention= a pound of cure. Have used buck-boost transformers to boost 208 to 220 for certain applications, never to buck the voltage, you have to love those little magic boxes.
I know you're a VFD kind of guy, but it's worth noting that buck/boost transformers can be very useful for people running CNC machines from rotary phase converters. CNCs tend to be rather picky about uniform phase-to-phase voltage. Even some non-CNC machines will trip the overloads if the phases are too far off.
As a electrician,I always used Nolox (anti oxidation compound) for Al. wire. But Mike Holt on YT is a code instructor and contractor. On his channel he states using the Nolox was required in the 1970s-1980s when the Al wire composition was different? Jerry in Pa.
Thanks James! I just ordered the same brake, this is getting expensive! :) Great video and explanation. I ended up finding a buck/boost transformer like yours on ebay and the seller was local! Your video was the best explanation I could find on this issue! Thanks for your work!
Think you could look under the petticoat on that bender and see what magic circuit inside makes it so persnickety about its input voltage? It doesn't look like the sort of thing that'd have anything sensitive in it. I'd be surprised if it were the magnet coils being designed with such little overhead that they couldn't handle 10% overvoltage.
I love Wago connectors, I'm a recent convert, but have already decided that I will not use wire nuts again if I can avoid it. (I don't think I knew about the probe access though) Thanks for the really interesting informative video. The auto transformer as you describe it almost looks like an "inductive divider" (like a resistor divider), really neat. The math still bends my brain though.
I have the identical brake, which I love. But IO have found that its best when starting the pull up on the handles to pause just after it activates the high power magnet, for a second or two, then completing the bend. Otherwise with heavier material, it tends to slip.
those leverblock are called wago blocks here , there allso realy good when you need to connect a single core wire (home instalation ) to multistrand wire
So we usually use the terms "buck" and "boost" for DC circuits that actually chop up the waveform, or do sort of the reverse into an inductor to boost it. I don't know if I'd use the terms buck or boost here. Stepping down isn't bucking like in a buck converter. Step up and step down, sure.
What you are describing are buck and boost converters. What I showed is a buck/boost transformer. This is distinct from a step-up or step-down transformer, because the transformer is not handling the full power of the load--only the voltage increase or decrease. In fact, the words "Buck Boost" are printed on the label. This is a case where the same words are used to describe two very different technologies that perform similar tasks.
Nice tools, a good explanation. It is always safer to use the correct voltage, the last thing you want is a fire. This is also good for your peace of mind.
I'm wiring a similar buck transformer for my magnetic brake. Did you consider putting a switch on the transformer on the input side to turn it off. I'm thinking to prevent parasitic draw if I leave it plugged in.
Yeah. They're a little mystified, because the magnet resistance is right on spec. Amusingly, because of the terrible power factor, the average current is close to 10A. I'll reserve judgment until I have more time to investigate the current limiting circuit board.
My theory about why they said to use 220V +-5% is because of two things: lower limit is for sufficient magnet strength (if V is too low - not enough clamping pressure will cause endless complaints) and higher limit is for thermal performance (the brake should not overheat under 100% duty cycle). If it's just electromagnet, which it most likely is (don't think there's much of any other electronics, except for some relay there), then higher voltage without continuous load will not affect the brake in any way. Although running it on 275VAC under water on the moon might cause brake to became sentient and be extremely confused.
If you read the various online forums, there are discussions about how they had lots of problems with the brakes when people ran them on 240V. The manufacturer often chimes in and says that when they started recommending that people use a buck transformer, it "seemed to solve the problem." Unfortunately, they also talk about the transformer "conditioning" the voltage and use phrases like "bleed off amperage from the board" that don't give me confidence they actually know exactly what's going on.
Hi, I'm not sure you will have time to answer a couple questions, you have quite the following. I recently bought a 52" magnetic bender, like yours, it requires 220v. My shop is a consistent 237v, too much. Since your machine has the same requirements as mine, I'm looking for a transformer to lower the voltage. I'm having a problem finding exactly what you bought, but I see many other name brands. So is what I should be looking for is; high 120x240v, low 12/24 with a KVA of 0.5 or higher, is this correct? Is there any other specs that I should be looking for? Thanks
In a later video where you were using this brake, you have some feet or wheels attached to the bottom, could you provide a link or show what you are using on it...? thanks.
Do you still recommend the linked buck transformer? I believe you spec'd it on the 10A on the sticker but later found it was 17.4A. I'm looking to get one for mine and wondering if you'd still get this one if you had a do over? Awesome video as usual!
Al to Cu isn't just an oxidation issue, it's a lack of significant strain hardening in the commercially pure aluminum wire and the high thermal expansion coefficient of aluminum. These two physical properties are the downside of aluminum to any other metal mechanical electrical connection.
I was aware of the thermal expansion issue when using aluminum for home wiring, hence the need for devices rated for aluminum wire. The oxidation claim wrt. Wago connectors comes from their documentation. I don't have firsthand experience with the issue.
Would be awesome if you could do more electronics and troubleshooting videos. You shot a few last year and they are some of the best videos on UA-cam explaining how to troubleshoot circuit boards.
Very interesting. I would have done some quick math and thought I needed a gigantic transformer. Then I would have just run the machine on a 100' light-gauge extension cord and assumed the voltage drop through the cord would be sufficient. Your way seems smarter.
Right? Even UK's grid spec is 230+10%,-6%, Europe I think is 230V+-6%.That's a remarkably low overlap. 220 minus 5% is 209V, so you even miss the 208V 3 phase here in the USA. They've built a device that works basically only in China and Africa
I designed my first buck converter for the Boeing 767 in 1981. I was making $7/hour as a junior engineer. The last was a resonant buck converter for helicopter night vision in 2001. I had a fixed price contract with a statement of work. To integrate it in their system, I had to fix their problems on my own nickel.
Wow, what time does to the value of the dollar. I started working at $5 per hour for my uncle as a helper remodeling his house at age 14, then at age 15 worked with him as a building painter. That was 1995 and 1996 roughly. Gas used to be just over a dollar a gallon, in high school, from what I remember. Prevailing wage for construction labor in 2020 for California was $52 per hour and operator pay was $72 per hour (luckily, we had a job that took the entire year at that pay, so it was a great year for me). That is quite an accomplishment to have your designs on commercial aircraft! Electrical (building work) is a secondary trade for me, so this video explained VA to me.
Oh way cool! I didn't even know about those wago splices. I love that they have test tips on them. I'm assuming that's a digi key thing? Any part numbers by chance? Never mind, I just saw your links. I always forget to look there on my phone.
Menards has Wago, and so does Amazon: got an assorted box of them recently, normally $50, on sale for like 35? Came in a plastic box with dividers as expected. Not expected: the plastic box is stamped "Ideal" and "Made in USA". They didn't even cheap out on their packaging!
Hey, thanks for the great videos. Please, can you tell me if you have castors/lockable on your magnabend sheet metal brake, and if so, what brand and model?
@@Clough42 thanks! I ordered some low cost clone as well. Different brand. I just got my 1250E magnabend yesterday! My CNC plasma rig is a DIY based on the Lowrider 3 CNC motion control system. It’s working great for me. I’m super pleased.
Are screw-based terminal blocks never used in North America? I'm all for convenience, and those connectors look OK, certainly better than those death trap wire nuts which seem to be so popular over there, but a nice bit of terminal strip would be just as good, and more serviceable, and would not damage the conductors so much.
That is such a curious thing on the 220 volt requirement....I spent my career as a commercial electrician and never ran into a machine this finicky on the voltage...are there delicate electronics built into the machine? It would be interesting to see if Shandon chimes in on this one, as I know he is also in the electrical field.. I certainly don't blame you for going the extra mile to protect your investment, I would just be curious why it was built to require 220v in a 240v world... Learn something new every day I guess...great machine by the way
I would guess an unsatisfied, but heavily lawyered client (running 275 underwater on the moon) got a settlement from Bailey. Followed by changes to the spec and manual.
Interesting, didn't know those existed, but it makes sense. Could you use capacitors instead of inductors like they do for crappy LED lights? They technically can't dissipate real power just like inductors, so it should work
Bro, you squat in those sandals too ;-) Rogue rack? Looks familiar. FWIW - I'm an EE and that was educational, understood it all but I've never thought much about small step downs like that. It's a bit like a fixed VARIAC...
Hmh, interesting that it has such a tight limit on the voltage. It's hard enough to measure AC voltage accurately for professionals (requires access an accurate and expensive true RMS voltmeter), and the voltage can fluctuate quite a bit (hence the normal +/- 10% rating), which means they're basically requiring you to run it through a transformer. Over here they wouldn't get that equipment CE approved with that requirement, quite simply because all equipment that are to be connected to the grid must handle normal grid tolerances.
Well yes, if you want an accurate voltage measurement, you have to use an accurate meter. If your power is a sinewave (and I hope it is) a true rms meter isn’t strictly needed. True rms is needed for non-sine applications. And rms meters cost less than $100.
James, nicely done again. You have a gift of explaining a complex topic in an easy to understand fasion. Looking forward to more of your projects. However, every time you show a new cool tool you cost me money. I always tell me wife Clough42 made me do it. 😇
Hey CLOUGH42, the nearly twice the current of the nameplate is concerning. It's acting like it's wired for 120V, which would double the current for a fixed resistive load when run at double the voltage. Is it possible the manufacture plate has a typo and is suppose to be 120V instead of 220V?
I've been in contact with support. It's definitely supposed to be 220V. The magnet coil resistance is 28 ohms, so 10A makes sense for rectified DC. I'm still trying to figure out exactly what's going on.
I always thought "buck" and "boost" only referred to solid state converters. I always was taught to use the terms step up and step down with respect to transformers
Errata: A couple of people have pointed out that the wires are likely not aluminum, and they appear to be right. While the transformer nameplate says "Wire: Al" on it, I went back and scraped some of the wires, and they look like copper under a silver surface coating. Perhaps the marking on the transformer refers only to the windings. It's fully encapsulated in resin, so I can't verify.
Tin coated like marine grade wire perhaps.
I could see them using aluminum for the windings. But it's very rare for wire to be aluminum as making a reliable connection requires fancy tools. Much easier to weld a copper or tinned copper wire to the end of the aluminum and make a connection to the pigtail. (this is all due to surface oxide black magic)
Tinned copper. Definitely!
@@martylawson1638it is Copper coils
@@thomasjeffersoncry Copper coils
For the cost of that brake, I'm blown away that the manufacturers couldn't be bothered to ensure that it could be connected up to an ordinary mains supply. No-one has a regulated supply as standard.
In Australia it's 220v,Original Patent, 1976, Inventor: Alan Bottomley from Australia
yeah, its really interesting afaik baileigh is a UK company so would have expected it to handle 230 at least is 220v common in industrial?
@@scootscoot2k ELECTRICAL: 1 PHASE, 220/240 VAC DUTY CYCLE: 30%
@@scootscoot2k UK power was originally 240V +-5%, and when they harmonized with the EU they went to 230V -5% +10% (do the math, it may surprise you…). It’s really weird they’d be specced for 220 +-5%. That’s the old mainland EU standard, which harmonized to 230V -10%, +5%.
It does connect to an ordinary mains supply…in China.
I have had one of these for almost 10 years in my aircraft shop. It is one of the most versatile sheet metal tools I own. You are only limited what it can do by your imagination and ingenuity. Loved the technical aspect of your video.
Kudos for using Wagos. As European I die a bit inside every time I see wire nuts being used.
Also, kudos for selecting the proper Wago clamp type and using the Al contact paste. You did your research.
Wagos don't provide as much contact between the wires as a properly twisted wire nut connection. I've had to replace Wagos in strings of fluorescent lights. In my opinion, Wagos are for lazy electricians.
Wire nuts work quite well IF you have the correct size AND know how to use them. But knowing how to use them IS the problem. So many people think you can shove anything in there and they work as long as they're tight and that is not the case. Dissimilar types of wire like stranded and solid can be problematic, as can different sizes of wire. Also if one is stranded and tinned and the other is solid. The wire should be the same length and should NOT be twisted together before putting the wire nut on. Take a few things apart that have been worked on by people who don't know or care and you'll find the connection is often not that great. Typically the stranded wire gets run down to the bottom of the solid and has a lot less contact than expected. I'm sure the manufacturers and NEC have specifics on these but I'll admit I haven't seen them.
@@tiredoldmechanic1791 I laughed when he said "nice clean installation" then he had to squirt a bunch of noalox into each of the connectors. That stuff is like moly grease. It's black and gets everywhere.
@@tiredoldmechanic1791 Wagos are for electricians who don't want to be held liable for burned down hose, or electrocuted customer. I've seen so may loose an wonky wire twists with wire nuts, including ground wires(in US), that I'm surprised that they are still allowed and still in use. In many countries you'd probably loose your license for using wire nuts. Wagos are almost impossible to install incorrectly.
@@piranha32 I should have taken pictures of the melted Wagos I replaced.
Wago connectors are great. More expensive than wire nuts but much more reliable. Cool bender.
Couple tips for wagos. I’m from the uk and use them all the time. 1. If you’re using solid core wire you don’t actually have to lift the lever to insert the wire, it can just be pushed straight in. 2. For piece of mind I usually put a heat shrink sleeve over them if I’m using them in control cabinets or in your case a transformer.
Also love the safety flip flops :)
Make sure you put a digital volt meter somewhere in your shop if you dont have one because the utility can change your voltage at will. They typically allow a very wide spread of allowable supplied voltage to meet their spec. Our shop regularly sees 262 volts because we are in a rural area and the utility company is over-feeding do to antiquated lined 10-15-30 miles out at the end of a line. Our CNC and edge banders will not handle that over-voltage so we have to buck via several transformers (too costly to buck the entire 600a shop feed). But we installed digital volt meters in the event the utility does ever bring the supply voltage down (they are 2 volts below their high limit allowance) we will have to re-wire but transformers as we are bucking every bit we can just to be in spec on the machines.
I've been working in embedded devices for a decade and I've never seen such a clear explanation for _why_ autotranformers are better when you don't need the isolation. That makes so much sense.
Nice safety footwear. :^D
I also often wear flip-flops when I "shouldn't".
Most of my body is space aware of the surroundings. However, my toes are drawn magically to anything that will harm them if they aren't properly covered. Kudos to those of you who have intelligent feet.
Those are colloquially known in Australia as ‘Ozzie Safety Boots’ 🤣🤣🤣
Standard foot ware for all ‘Bush Mechanics’
Regards,
Robert
PS Your vids are REALLY informative 👍
Great job explaning how the auto transformer works.
I have a rolling base on my table saw that has two of the rollers on cams that pop the saw up to roll it around. If you drop the cam, the saw sits on two rollers and two stationary legs. This makes for a very stable base when in use but it makes it easy to move. Something like this would be a good fit for the brake.
A college friend of mine bought one about 2 years ago. He absolutely loves his. In fact, he talked about that brake everyday for a month. the 275V on the moon since 69 had me rolling on the floor. LOL
The many ways you can combine the various fingers on the brake seems analogous to the many ways you can combine the taps on the transformer which drives it. There's some elegance in seeing the same pattern applied in two such different ways within the same total machine.
Gotta love the safety sandals.
VA, Watts and PF explained in such a way that I FULLY understand it.
I have had several attempts at trying to untangle this since I first learned that VA is not the same as Watts in college over 30 years ago. It took less than 2 mins for you to explain it AND where Power Factor comes into it.
THANK YOU James !!
I was wondering if capacitors could be added to prove the power factor.
That's a cute little transformer. I needed a transformer that could take the power out of my home solar inverter that was galvanically isolated and would generate split phase 120V. The model I got was a 5KVA Emerson. I think the thing weighs upwards of 150 pounds. In the end I switched inverter supplier and never needed the transformer but I do remember almost blacking out trying to manhandle this thing and getting it bolted to the basement wall even with the help of a scissor lift. It's still there on the wall taunting me every time I go to check the inverter status 😀
Yeah, using a metal break on the moon, easy peasy, the commute however is killing.
James, even if I am french and need effort to understand all, your explanations about transformers and auto-transformers are very clear, and I learn some things today with you. It is strange to use everyday these devices and never tried to understand the principles. So thanks a lot to have light on my mean. I like this approach : buying a new machine, need a component and explain us how it works. Bravo !
Best explanation of auto transformers I’ve ever heard, and it is MUCH clearer now - thanks!
This is a great video! As an electrical engineer, you're spot on about everything but the nomenclature. These are typically called step-up/step-down transformers. Buck/boost is an entirely different animal that uses active switching with a MOSFET and is typically exclusive to DC only topologies. The end goal is the same, making a larger voltage from a smaller input voltage or vise versa, but the way they do that is different.
Granted, I've never worked with autotransformers before. Again, nice job keeping the voltage in spec.
The manufacturer called the transformer buck/boost which is a term I'd never heard used in pure transformer topologies. To be honest I thought the magic box would have a bunch of power mosfets in it.😀
@@vincei4252 that's what I was thinking. So I waited to comment until the end of the video thinking some jackass is about to introduce a bunch of smps on the grid.
@@conrad2468 Interesting. I just checked the Emerson transformer catalog and they're also calling them buck/boost, even the galvanically isolated models. I guess there was a memo you and I never saw.
I think you are wrong. There are two types of buck/boost voltage conversion devices. The switching type which you are referring to are typically called "buck/boost converters". The transformer types are not surprisingly called "buck/boost transformers". The main difference between the two is in the additional circuitry to increase the switching frequency in the case of converters which has many benefits, but noise related downsides.
The words "Buck Boost" are printed on the label on the transformer. A buck or boost converter is also a thing, and you're right; it's a different animal.
Wow! I found this video by responding to one of his comments on another youtube video. He said he had a video on setting up his magnetic brake. This video is awesome! I wondered why I saw transformers listed as VA but didn't really understand it. I have done electrical maintenance and mostly single phase work on commercial buildings (lighting, water heaters, AC, etc.) and have done just about everything on residential, and I do hobby electrical projects, so I know a great deal, but my primary trade isn't electrical. This video is easy to follow and right to the point as opposed to videos full of filler and crappy music. I will check out your other videos! Thanks for sharing your knowledge!
would love to see you do some tutorials in fusion 360 with their sheet metal stuff and see it out to production from plasma cutting and bending on the brake!
Yes, that is a great feature I played with a couple years ago (I built my own plasma table), but I'm not sure if the feature still works since they changed the licensing on fusion 360. My brother uses it for his cnc mill and I usually do very well with computer and tech stuff, but I just suck at fusion. It isn't intuitive at all. I'm thinking about buying a magnetic brake and I already do a little bit of powder coating and have been welding for 20+ years. I'm working on tying it all together to produce products I can sell.
I pick up probably a dozen step up/step down transformers every year from the industrial salvage place I visit. One of the biggest ones I’ve got weighs about 1500 pounds and is on casters. And I’ve seen much bigger. But don’t have a use for anything bigger than that.
These big factories and manufacturing plants buy tons of them,… And then don’t use them or for some reason take them to the salvage yard while still brand new on the pallet.
They are extremely useful, not to mention I have an electronics lab where I do component level board repair for industrial clients. So I can always use extra step up/down transformers. Most of the industrial duty high-end ones that I’ve seen have copper windings through and through. Usually tinplated. And I have actually seen inside some of the larger resin encapsulated transformers when they’ve been cut or busted open.
Good explanations, I think many needed that... :) Intuitive understanding is worth so much more than many think, especially when trying diagnose something that's not working later. Having a feeling of "this isn't correct" when you measure/test something can save so much time...
But you could mention that the two large coils are actually pushing current "backwards", being force fed magnetic induction from the smaller coils...
The 17.5A output is the sum of 16.0A pushed "through" from mains and 1.5A circulating backwards from the circuit of the large secondary coils. 16+1.5=17.5.
Also, I didn't run a brake like that under water on the moon - but a reasonable advice is to always use a small scrap piece of the same thickness as the piece you're trying to bend on the other side of the clamping slit. Otherwise the top clamp will gradually over time bend into a permanent dome shape which lowers your clamping force in the middle of the table. This is true even for large, industrial scale brakes....
Good points. Yes, the coils are operating "backwards" in the intuitive sense, and I neglected to mention it.
Love the brake too - bought mine back in 2014. My supply power is also about 245V. You got me wondering if I need to be concerned?? The manual I received with the brake makes no mention to allowable tolerance on 220V input. In fact there’s a troubleshooting section in the back if my manual that suggests the voltage readings should be 240V. So I compared my manual to the one they issue today from Baileigh’s website. Wow. I’m going to call Baileigh this week and see if they changed something, or I need to add the transformer. I’ll update my comments when I know more. Thanks James for this awesome explanation of how buck transformers work.
From what I've gathered, they had a high failure rate, and requiring the transformer has reduced it. I don't know beyond that. Have you by chance ever measured the current draw?
Bought my Baileigh mag brake in 2016 for 2335 from Elite. Placard says 220V. Page 31 of the manual says 240V and has worked fine on 240V since new. Looking at the wire diagram, it says the primary transformer coil is 220V but not sure what the secondary coil does to the voltage. Like your presentation.
Have you ever measured the current draw?
What??? Those Wago connectors are awesome! I think you're channel has the highest ratio of things I've never heard of that once I've heard of it I absolutely have to have it. Seriously!
They make also push wire clamps for solid wire (only!) so you may forget wire nuts and use these orange cuties instead when wiring outlets etc.
Congratulations, your life will never be the same. 👍
I have the non-Baliegh brand version of that I didn't realize there was some power configuration issues with these. I just plugged it, underwater on the moon of course. But still... one of my favorite shop tools!
Dusting off the cob-webs from my undergrad electromagnetic course. One of the odd things with AC current in inductors is that the maximum flux in the core is proportional to the voltage and proportional to the inverse of the frequency. Where this can get ugly is if the core saturates. When the core saturates it needs a LOT more current to keep increasing the flux in the core. This will show up as a poor power factor due to a current wave-form with a spike at the peak. This also shows up as quite a bit more heat as the inductor can end up drawing way more current than typical.
There are a lot of interesting things covered here; thanks.
original Magna Bend best Aussie invention ever..
I bought a few weeks back the same type of magnetic brake but from another seller whose brake comes from the same factory. I was surprised when I looked at the manual to see that the manual says 220/240v. I had the seller ask the manufacturing plant if it had to be the 220v like baleigh writes in their manual to make sure a buck boost transformer is really required.
Manufacturing plant told my seller that it was 220/240v compatible and did not require a buck boost transformer. It was also confirmed that the manufacturing plant is the same one that supplies the same units to baleigh. I have the original manufacturer manual for the machine with mine.I wonder why Baleigh who wrote their own nicer manual wrote up the buck boost transformer stuff in their manual.
a 500lbs machine on a couple moving dolly's and flip flops... I like it! Living dangerously! :)
Extremely useful and very well presented.
Hello James,
Nicely explained process for using the Buck/Boost Transformer... Interesting new machine, happy bending...
Take care.
Paul,,
I love people in sandals working in shops ! Very safe !
I have the brake and you will absolutely love working with it
Have you ever measured the current?
An ounce of prevention= a pound of cure. Have used buck-boost transformers to boost 208 to 220 for certain applications, never to buck the voltage, you have to love those little magic boxes.
I know you're a VFD kind of guy, but it's worth noting that buck/boost transformers can be very useful for people running CNC machines from rotary phase converters. CNCs tend to be rather picky about uniform phase-to-phase voltage. Even some non-CNC machines will trip the overloads if the phases are too far off.
As a electrician,I always used Nolox (anti oxidation compound) for Al. wire. But Mike Holt on YT is a code instructor and contractor. On his channel he states using the Nolox was required in the 1970s-1980s when the Al wire composition was different? Jerry in Pa.
Clear and easy to understand. Thanks. Wago connectors are great!
This is fantastic, I've been looking at getting one of these. This is just the information I've been looking for!
Thanks James! I just ordered the same brake, this is getting expensive! :) Great video and explanation. I ended up finding a buck/boost transformer like yours on ebay and the seller was local! Your video was the best explanation I could find on this issue! Thanks for your work!
What a great brake that is ! Thank you for the video and education.
Think you could look under the petticoat on that bender and see what magic circuit inside makes it so persnickety about its input voltage? It doesn't look like the sort of thing that'd have anything sensitive in it. I'd be surprised if it were the magnet coils being designed with such little overhead that they couldn't handle 10% overvoltage.
Oh, I've been inside it since day one. Still no solid conclusions. Waiting for parts.
I love Wago connectors, I'm a recent convert, but have already decided that I will not use wire nuts again if I can avoid it. (I don't think I knew about the probe access though) Thanks for the really interesting informative video. The auto transformer as you describe it almost looks like an "inductive divider" (like a resistor divider), really neat. The math still bends my brain though.
I have the identical brake, which I love. But IO have found that its best when starting the pull up on the handles to pause just after it activates the high power magnet, for a second or two, then completing the bend. Otherwise with heavier material, it tends to slip.
Good tip. Have you by chance ever measured the current draw?
@@Clough42 I have not - but now I will!
James, I added Footmaster style leveling casters to the legs on my mag-brake. Makes it easy to move and then lock down when I want to use it. 👍😎👍
Thanks! You are at least the second person to suggest that, and I have a set on the way.
those leverblock are called wago blocks here , there allso realy good when you need to connect a single core wire (home instalation ) to multistrand wire
So we usually use the terms "buck" and "boost" for DC circuits that actually chop up the waveform, or do sort of the reverse into an inductor to boost it.
I don't know if I'd use the terms buck or boost here. Stepping down isn't bucking like in a buck converter. Step up and step down, sure.
The rest seems spot on though!
What you are describing are buck and boost converters. What I showed is a buck/boost transformer. This is distinct from a step-up or step-down transformer, because the transformer is not handling the full power of the load--only the voltage increase or decrease. In fact, the words "Buck Boost" are printed on the label. This is a case where the same words are used to describe two very different technologies that perform similar tasks.
I would have loved how you followed the diagram that jefferson gives you to get the output.
hey, they only have 275V in the moon ocean i gotta use something and it has worked fine since 1969
That's good. Getting replacement parts delivered is probably quite expensive.
Nice tools, a good explanation. It is always safer to use the correct voltage, the last thing you want is a fire. This is also good for your peace of mind.
The wrong voltage isn’t likely to cause a fire. It’ll burn up the tool.
This dude is getting serious about sheet metal.
He’s serious about everything he does.🔥🔥
You might call it some serious sheet.
Very interesting and informative lesson on autotransformers thanks
I'm wiring a similar buck transformer for my magnetic brake. Did you consider putting a switch on the transformer on the input side to turn it off. I'm thinking to prevent parasitic draw if I leave it plugged in.
So it requires you to meet specs by 5% but is 75% off itself? I'd like to know what the manufacturer says about that 😄
Yeah. They're a little mystified, because the magnet resistance is right on spec. Amusingly, because of the terrible power factor, the average current is close to 10A. I'll reserve judgment until I have more time to investigate the current limiting circuit board.
@@Clough42 weird, if it's got current limiting built in, over voltage by a bit shouldn't be a big deal.
I really like those "steel toe" safety sandals you're wearing!
Bravo! Simple and clear explanation! Bravo again!
Great explanation of how a transformer works. PS.:nice to see you are wearing a pair off safety slippers.
They are pretty proud of those, It'd be nice if they made the input power a little more flexible.
My theory about why they said to use 220V +-5% is because of two things: lower limit is for sufficient magnet strength (if V is too low - not enough clamping pressure will cause endless complaints) and higher limit is for thermal performance (the brake should not overheat under 100% duty cycle). If it's just electromagnet, which it most likely is (don't think there's much of any other electronics, except for some relay there), then higher voltage without continuous load will not affect the brake in any way. Although running it on 275VAC under water on the moon might cause brake to became sentient and be extremely confused.
If you read the various online forums, there are discussions about how they had lots of problems with the brakes when people ran them on 240V. The manufacturer often chimes in and says that when they started recommending that people use a buck transformer, it "seemed to solve the problem." Unfortunately, they also talk about the transformer "conditioning" the voltage and use phrases like "bleed off amperage from the board" that don't give me confidence they actually know exactly what's going on.
@@Clough42 Interesting! Now I'm curious what the reason for such tight voltage tolerance is.
Incredibly helpful and useful information. Thank you.
Now that you've had this brake for awhile, has it been reliable? Knowing what you know now, would you buy it again? Thanks
Nice to have solid hydroelectric power.
Hi, I'm not sure you will have time to answer a couple questions, you have quite the following. I recently bought a 52" magnetic bender, like yours, it requires 220v. My shop is a consistent 237v, too much. Since your machine has the same requirements as mine, I'm looking for a transformer to lower the voltage. I'm having a problem finding exactly what you bought, but I see many other name brands. So is what I should be looking for is; high 120x240v, low 12/24 with a KVA of 0.5 or higher, is this correct? Is there any other specs that I should be looking for? Thanks
Great video, learn a few thing. Wish you had address the Buck and Boost, in phase out of phase connection, or turns directions.
I thought about it, but I don't think any of the recommended configurations have windings out of phase.
Good video. I also enjoyed the casual trolling with the flip-flops!
I do it for the engagement metrics.
Welding up a mobile base for that would be a good project to add to the list.
Love the safety shoes in the shop Haha! :)
James. I’ve used mine on Mars at 5400v every day. 9 days a week. 34-7.
Oh, nice. I'll bet that works really well in the lighter gravity.
Very nicely explained.
surprised you didnt meter the actual output and input voltage when the job was done.
In a later video where you were using this brake, you have some feet or wheels attached to the bottom, could you provide a link or show what you are using on it...? thanks.
These are the ones I'm using. They're okay--not great: amzn.to/3HyFPlu
I learned a lot from this one and I really enjoyed it. Thank you!
Do you still recommend the linked buck transformer? I believe you spec'd it on the 10A on the sticker but later found it was 17.4A. I'm looking to get one for mine and wondering if you'd still get this one if you had a do over? Awesome video as usual!
I remember that line from the movie Mr. Mom back in the 80s.
Thanks for the video, this is very useful knowledge.
Once again the wizard is at work. You make all that sound easy, but I don’t think I got it all down the first time around…lol.👏🏻🔥
Al to Cu isn't just an oxidation issue, it's a lack of significant strain hardening in the commercially pure aluminum wire and the high thermal expansion coefficient of aluminum. These two physical properties are the downside of aluminum to any other metal mechanical electrical connection.
I was aware of the thermal expansion issue when using aluminum for home wiring, hence the need for devices rated for aluminum wire. The oxidation claim wrt. Wago connectors comes from their documentation. I don't have firsthand experience with the issue.
This is a really wonderful overview of transformers and their application. BTW love the brake, been on the lookout for a Box & Pan brake for my shop.
Would be awesome if you could do more electronics and troubleshooting videos. You shot a few last year and they are some of the best videos on UA-cam explaining how to troubleshoot circuit boards.
Very interesting. I would have done some quick math and thought I needed a gigantic transformer. Then I would have just run the machine on a 100' light-gauge extension cord and assumed the voltage drop through the cord would be sufficient. Your way seems smarter.
Yeah, that would be a lot of heat.
Thanks James. you have a great way of explaining things. Great to see it work out in practice. Also loving the Chinese Safety Boots!! :)
What I don't understand is why make a bit of equipment that requires less voltage than standard mains volts or us your supply out if specification.
There are lots of opinions on the Internet about this topic.
Right? Even UK's grid spec is 230+10%,-6%, Europe I think is 230V+-6%.That's a remarkably low overlap. 220 minus 5% is 209V, so you even miss the 208V 3 phase here in the USA. They've built a device that works basically only in China and Africa
I designed my first buck converter for the Boeing 767 in 1981. I was making $7/hour as a junior engineer. The last was a resonant buck converter for helicopter night vision in 2001. I had a fixed price contract with a statement of work. To integrate it in their system, I had to fix their problems on my own nickel.
Wow, what time does to the value of the dollar. I started working at $5 per hour for my uncle as a helper remodeling his house at age 14, then at age 15 worked with him as a building painter. That was 1995 and 1996 roughly. Gas used to be just over a dollar a gallon, in high school, from what I remember. Prevailing wage for construction labor in 2020 for California was $52 per hour and operator pay was $72 per hour (luckily, we had a job that took the entire year at that pay, so it was a great year for me). That is quite an accomplishment to have your designs on commercial aircraft! Electrical (building work) is a secondary trade for me, so this video explained VA to me.
Look at income vs IQ. Then look at net worth vs IQ. You can bet Clough42 is worth $10M.
Oh way cool! I didn't even know about those wago splices. I love that they have test tips on them. I'm assuming that's a digi key thing? Any part numbers by chance? Never mind, I just saw your links. I always forget to look there on my phone.
They are the Standard for wiring in Germany. You should Even be able to get them from Amazon.
My local HomeDepot has a limited selection of Ideal brand, and Menards has the Wago brand.
Menards has Wago, and so does Amazon: got an assorted box of them recently, normally $50, on sale for like 35? Came in a plastic box with dividers as expected. Not expected: the plastic box is stamped "Ideal" and "Made in USA". They didn't even cheap out on their packaging!
Love the safety flip flops.
OSHIT approved!
Hey, thanks for the great videos. Please, can you tell me if you have castors/lockable on your magnabend sheet metal brake, and if so, what brand and model?
I'm using some cheap Footmaster clone casters, so I can lower the solid feet to make it rigid if needed.
@@Clough42 thanks! I ordered some low cost clone as well. Different brand. I just got my 1250E magnabend yesterday! My CNC plasma rig is a DIY based on the Lowrider 3 CNC motion control system. It’s working great for me. I’m super pleased.
Are screw-based terminal blocks never used in North America?
I'm all for convenience, and those connectors look OK, certainly better than those death trap wire nuts which seem to be so popular over there, but a nice bit of terminal strip would be just as good, and more serviceable, and would not damage the conductors so much.
That is such a curious thing on the 220 volt requirement....I spent my career as a commercial electrician and never ran into a machine this finicky on the voltage...are there delicate electronics built into the machine?
It would be interesting to see if Shandon chimes in on this one, as I know he is also in the electrical field..
I certainly don't blame you for going the extra mile to protect your investment, I would just be curious why it was built to require 220v in a 240v world...
Learn something new every day I guess...great machine by the way
I would guess an unsatisfied, but heavily lawyered client (running 275 underwater on the moon) got a settlement from Bailey. Followed by changes to the spec and manual.
Interesting, didn't know those existed, but it makes sense. Could you use capacitors instead of inductors like they do for crappy LED lights? They technically can't dissipate real power just like inductors, so it should work
Clicked just for the Mr. Mom reference.
I smell a nice enclosure for the grizzly coming down the way (a full CNC transformation follow that up may be?)
Bro, you squat in those sandals too ;-) Rogue rack? Looks familiar. FWIW - I'm an EE and that was educational, understood it all but I've never thought much about small step downs like that. It's a bit like a fixed VARIAC...
Hmh, interesting that it has such a tight limit on the voltage. It's hard enough to measure AC voltage accurately for professionals (requires access an accurate and expensive true RMS voltmeter), and the voltage can fluctuate quite a bit (hence the normal +/- 10% rating), which means they're basically requiring you to run it through a transformer.
Over here they wouldn't get that equipment CE approved with that requirement, quite simply because all equipment that are to be connected to the grid must handle normal grid tolerances.
Well yes, if you want an accurate voltage measurement, you have to use an accurate meter. If your power is a sinewave (and I hope it is) a true rms meter isn’t strictly needed. True rms is needed for non-sine applications. And rms meters cost less than $100.
Great video... like the Mr. Mom reference in the title.
James, nicely done again. You have a gift of explaining a complex topic in an easy to understand fasion. Looking forward to more of your projects. However, every time you show a new cool tool you cost me money. I always tell me wife Clough42 made me do it. 😇
Great videos as always! Thanks for the education 😊👍
Hey CLOUGH42, the nearly twice the current of the nameplate is concerning. It's acting like it's wired for 120V, which would double the current for a fixed resistive load when run at double the voltage. Is it possible the manufacture plate has a typo and is suppose to be 120V instead of 220V?
I've been in contact with support. It's definitely supposed to be 220V. The magnet coil resistance is 28 ohms, so 10A makes sense for rectified DC. I'm still trying to figure out exactly what's going on.
@@Clough42 remember it's mostly an inductive load not resistive.
@@theradarguy true. I think the manufacturer has the customer check the resistance as a way to check for damage to the coils.
I always thought "buck" and "boost" only referred to solid state converters. I always was taught to use the terms step up and step down with respect to transformers