Obscure Melee Tech
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- Опубліковано 27 лип 2024
- Ever wonder why that shine didn't hit? Why did this attack invisible ceiling? Check out this video to unearth some obscure Melee tech that will probably never help you win a tournament match!
First of all I would like to thank my buddy Windwalker for being my test dummy for things that I simply could not get unranked footage for. I also wanna thank Goomy for answering all of my questions on Samus down b. And of course, I thank all of you for watching and engaging with the content, as well as reading this description (:
Looking directly below here, you will see the credits listed for borrowed footage, as well as music.
Footage Credit:
@MarlinPie
@Hibal
@stompknee
@banddgames
@ycz6
@GoomySmash
Music (in order):
Luca - Final Fantasy X
Aquatic Mine (Instrumental) - Sonic Adventure 2 Battle
Omen - Final Fantasy X
Clouds Over Flower Fields - Paper Mario
Battle Theme - Paper Mario
The Silence Before the Storm - Final Fantasy X
Soaring the Sky (Night) - Pokemon Omega Ruby & Alpha Sapphire - Ігри
Bro had a gratitude attack for a second
a love surge
Hi frank
@Jerp-gy3kj hi jerp
What the hell, I go to watch a melee video and I'm immediately shown myself getting fucked up in Slap City. This is betrayal.
bosshog moment
@@oasissharp you mean Wade Boggs?
LOL heya jackfox
I have a consistent setup for Falco's "Ghost Shine":
If you ledgehop from yoshis so that you shine as you land on the side platform, you'll get the ghost shine. This works on other stages but easiest on yoshis. Because you get the ghost shine, you can also immediately jump, allowing you to ledgehop into full hop bair or something. It's not a good coverage option, but a fun trick.
yeah it works on the way up to a platform but i don’t think i’ve seen it on the way down
^ this could be consistent with the ECB theory in this video because obviously the ECB is different on falco’s way up
you can also just short hop backwards to do the same setup as fox lol
@@silafim I thought it would!
I’m on the road rn away from a melee setup, but it looks mostly like falco’s forward/neutral jump causes him to have a different animation than fox (not all tucked in, which would affect the ecb).
It’s the sudden heightening of the ecb from a little sideways diamond to a tall diamond that causes spacies to immediately land upon shining right?
Just back hop instead of forward or neutral.
Gotta let you know knock back stacking does NOT happen in the first 10 frames it only stacks if the second hit is AFTER the first 10 frames. An obvious place to see this is when falco does a shine dair. If you hit the dair in the first 9 frames the shine knockback is completely ignored and the dair will send down at full power but if you're late the upward knockback of shine will stack and they will go downward much more slowly.
what is the difference between knockback stacking and just adding two physics vectors together?
and can you knockback stack with items?
@@NonJohns The vector math is not simply addition in all cases. Each axis is calculated separately. If the knockback direction is opposite on the axis being calculated, they are added. If it is the same direction, the knockback of the first hit is completely replaced by the second. You can read more on ssbwiki on the knockback page. Items should behave the same.
@@NonJohns @NonJohns knockback stacking is component vector addition if the vectors are opposite sign. If, for example, the Y component of both moves is the same sign then the vectors do not add and the larger of the two vectors becomes the new Y knockback. Yes it applies for items. See the B&D rundown for more info ua-cam.com/video/_j3A9CoIhfE/v-deo.html
Pretty sure this is not a melee only tech either
Once again I have to say I REALLY admire that you don’t use gimmicks and your videos are straight to the point. Thank you
very interested in your thoughts! what would you consider a gimmick? (you dont have to name anyone if you don't want to we don't wanna start something hahahahaha)
Yeet
booly baby upload another video
@@narpynkmay 6th!
@@ivymuncherwhen I say gimmicks I mean thing p much EVERY commentary channel does thinking they are soooo clever or unique. One example would be telling a joke w a sad tone or some shit and the screen goes black and white w sad music and slow zoom in. That’s a gimmick. Also the classic commentary voice that is just annoying as hell. Way too peppy. Way too annoying. Constantly goes in and out of what you actually find interesting. Often times watching commentary videos I get mad and almost want to yell at the screen “GET TO THE POINT” so this is why I love this guy. V concise. No bs gimmicks. Straight content.
The swordsman spike is something I’ve been tryna understand for weeks, thank you juice man
the horrors that box samus could bring to us in the near future....
You outta teach your daughter melee...get em started nice and young!
Dude this video absolutely slapped, and that says something considering your other melee content slaps as well. I learned a bunch about things I didn’t know & things I already knew, with no gimmicks, at a digestible pace. 10/10
that samus platforming combo shit is awesome. i see we got new things in melee since i played
I feel bad for SilentWolf for having that 4stock become such an iconic melee clip
Love the music choices in your videos. Always a nice surprise to hear classic JRPG tunes in videos like this :)
Thanks for your videos bro. Keep enjoying it, and keep being the blessing!
5:45 - You mean *_"low_*_ traction value"_
Great stuff, btw. I'm going to be on the lookout for knockback stacking in my matches against spacies now, and I'm going to learn that shine spike for sure.
This channel is criminally undersubbed.
IS THAT NEUTRAL MILK HOTEL
21:49 I get it man, sometimes I be hard.
Great explanations of what would otherwise be pretty complicated things to learn/figure out/research on your own. Its so cool how the small weird interactions we've seen in game over the years have developed
active knockback state is really annoying for ness, because his dash attack sets it up consistently (first hit knocks down, second hit locks, third hit pops up)
"Those are my real hands" won you a subscriber. Not only have I learned 3 massive things after half a decade of playing by the time that joke came up, but you made me spit up my coffee with it too. Good shit man, I look forward to what you make next.
AsumSaus has already described why the shine does not come out.
man that ghost shine shit was so fun back in the day, me and eggz made a game where you tried to see how many you could get in a row lol
I appreciate your music selections!
One thing about the invisible ceiling glitch that I saw a while ago: if the person is on the left side ( facing right) it works as you said. If they are on the opposite side, there is a timer of like a few seconds before it goes away. This means it can go away before touching the ground, but also means that if you touch it quick enough it does not disappear
Re ghost shine:
With Falco, your shine ecb is smaller than his falling ecb (neutral or forward jump) so he doesn't immediately land like fox does. But if falco jumps backwards he does a backflip and has a much smaller ecb. I don't know and can't test right now whether shining in that state with Falco leads to a ghost shine, but he should land immediately when he shines.
A cool side effect of fox and falcos smaller ecb when jumping (Falco only when back flipping) is that you can Waveland perfectly horizontally since your ecb when air dodging is larger than when you're jumping.
Another banger video!
BOSS HOG MOMENT
I've played this game since it came out and I did not know that knockback was higher against players caught charging a smash attack.
That’s my boy Kirby and his best friend, Pikachu!
Bro came out the gate swinging, gave credit to Nick All Stars Brawl but not MVS lmao
the sappy speech is what got me to sub tho
this is so good!
I'm loving all of the FFX music. I had to rewind a couple times because I got too into the songs
i think kirby can also hit swordsman spike with peach’s copied special, but i’m not 100% sure
Anyone who watched Silent Wolf's tech videos back in the day knows that a "Ghost Shine" is actually called a "Pseudo-Invisible Shine."
Pretty sure his video about it is still on his channel.
Amazing video and amazing ff10 music selection
I (unlike most players) think Roy's largely unexplored. My brother somehow made him incredibly hard to approach because he experimented with EVERY HITBOX, and found that a good portion of his sourspots aren't even weak (with sourspot d-smash downright killing like Ganon). Literally, his ONLY weak sourspot just so happens to be his f-air, which everyone who dropped him uses because they don't know how differently he plays from Marth.
He also found a reliable way to replace f-air, and that's with neutral-b.
So if you ever decide to try out Roy, just know to start with throws, then sweetspots, then sourspot juggles, then end it with stylish sourspot d-smash (oh, and always use flareblade instead of f-air).
thought id know this stuff judging by the timestamps but didnt know about the charged smash attack knockback multiplier
That's my boy luigitoilet
I haven't watched the video yet, but I want to make predictions based on the trophies in the thumbnail because it's funny.
Shine Mine, Super Wavedash, and the Swordsman Spike (ceiling glitch shenanigans)
Postwatch Edit: Hell yeah.
nice vid, really funny how a video almost as long as this could be made on exclusively obscure steve tech. for example, steve can crouch cancel his nils. when steve places a block and nils on it, hes in this block placing animation that can be interrupted by any move, but for some weird reason, steve will never interrupt this block placing state with sfair/sbair (his short hop bufferable sword aerial version of fair/bair that leads into combos way, way better than jab) unless you crouch then input sfair/sbair. crouching also lets steve jump way earlier, allowing him to spam nils way faster than normal
Yeah just in general in smash, and especially in melee, the amount of videos like this that could be made for any given character would be very overwhelming
U got soft hands brother :3
I think the fox shine thing happens because the ecbs have to adjust for fox going horizontally when he does his flip during his jump. When you shine fox immediately goes upright which snaps the ecb and fox to the ground on the same frame. With falco his ecb doesnt have to adjust at any point during his jump into a shine because he stays upright the entire time. You honestly might be able to get it to work with falco by doing a double jump and then shining on a platform at a very specific part of his animation.
we will continue to game, thank you juiceman!
3:22 is called spooky shine
Yep, or just "spooky stun" in general, since it also happens to other moves such as Sheik ftilt
tbh i thought swd was common knowledge til last year when i went to a local and broke someone's brain with it. (he didnt know it existed)
0:35 Mom I made it to Melee Juice
21:02 It would be cool to see goomy smash uploading his tases to his channel
amazing vid:)
Great vid gamer
Fantastic video
Wait does the Falco ghost shine work when you do a backflip short hop with Falco?? Kinda like how you can always do a 0 degree waveland as Fox but you can only do one with Falco if you backflip with your SH.
oh yup another banger
very cool
Thank you Juiceman c:
god i love melee, game is so absurd sometimes
Damn broski, nice hands :0
So could you Ghost Shine Grab to save landing lag frames?
I INSTANTLY recognized this scene 1:21
nice clips hehe
im a marth main and sometimes when countering succesfully an attack the invisible ceiling glitch happens. Its quite common for me. I guess theres no marth main that constantly uses counter so there may be more implications to the swordsman spike glitch that the community is unaware of.
DUDE? 48 VIEWS?
This video goes so hard why aren't people watching it? Actually really high quality video
Subscribe, like, and share his videos. That way you'll help him get more views and subscribers. Cos yeah his videos are really good and he deserves more views.
can you ghost shine with Falco while backflipping? Like being able to 0 degree wavedash with Falco while backflipping
if i had to give my twosense about the ghost shine/pseudo shine, id have to say it has something to do with aerial interupts. aerial interupts are a tech used commonly by samus and mario mains to snap to platforms by using a move to shift their ecb into the platform and become grounded quicker with less landing lag than a waveland (both of these characters do this with up air). i think this is happening with fox because fox and falcos short hop animations are different (fox flips while falco doesnt). while fox is flipping foxs ecb compresses and becomes very small, but when he shines his ecb suddenly becomes taller, it clips into the ground, and forces him to become grounded. this is likely why falco cant do this from a short hop because his ecb never becomes small enough to aerial interupt with shine. however (i might be wrong about this as i cant test it right now) falco may be able to ghost shine via double jumping and landing with a shine, as his double jumping animation has him flipping, therefore compressing and shrinking his ecb allowing him to aerial interupt. i dont actually have any idea why aerial interrupting with shine as fox removes the hitbox, it probably has something to do with the first 3-4 frames being considered a different move from the rest of the shine by the game but idk thats just a guess.
If you land from a double jump can Falco ghost shine
The ghost shine is also a thing in smash 4
I came across it like 8 years ago. Only seemed to work when hopping off a ledge and performing the shine the first frame you are back on it
In smash 4 fox does the animation of performing a shine but the blue hexagon won't show up if you do the ghost shine
Cant seem to find a video of it on youtube.. i can probably do it for proof if someone is interested
Is it possible to maybe get the ghost shine on falco when you do a shorthorp jumping back so he does the backflip? Sort of the way you can only do a frame perfect straight right\left waveland with falco when he’s doing the backflip animation but not the forward sh animation, but fox does flips on every short hop animation so can do it with every shorthop
it’s called spooky stun…
love the content, would suggest doing something about audio levels. I have to turn up my volume significantly to get a decent sound. otherwise, great stuff
*slurping sound from hongkongaton*
Anyone else feel like this is all just AsumSaus content with slightly different names?
Samus is whack and those TAS combos were sooooo sick
A ghost Falco shine might be possible on a rising platform, like randall or dk 64
Hi Dustyn
So can you do a ghost rest?
yo luigit0ilet? i didn't know anyone else knew him
Re super wavedash:
I don't think it's really 2 frames perfect inputs. Or, I think you can be holding left on frames 0 all the way to 41, as long as you then are input right on frame 42. It's much easier to input this way.
Balls for the algo
never noticed how weird samus looks while turning into a morph ball... does she become a 2d sprite briefly?
the exact reason why ghost shine happens, is cuz they rushed the game. I guess fox wasn't done being tested yet
ur hands 😳🤔
21:17 that one ain’t tas that’s just the goat uhhei on gcc
1:09 say it again please
algorithm comment
Look I know the Elon musk thing was a joke, but if people started being tas, everything would be a mindgame
big fan of your videos but PLEASE invest in a better microphone or audio setup
Here before 100k views
Hey bro. Where the fuck have you been for my UA-cam life? Lol. This is some seriously quality content and you have MORE THAN EARNED MY SUB. KEEP UP THE GREAT WORK AND MAY GOD ALWAYS CONTINUE TO BLESS YOU. ❤️❤️(人 •͈ᴗ•͈)❤❤❤❤❤❤
sub 100 views gang
20:04 i $ied
Um hello zero seconds ago
good vid but magi is NOT a woman