3:20:37 "grim equanimity found at the edge of oblivion" that's an awesome line right there... admist admittedly awesome work but still it raises the bar
You gave the moment where the shell of the dead Titan coming back to life a whole new feeling, and now I can't unthink it. I need to listen to this again, a work matched only by the Mechanicus brother.
This is why the Khan is my favorite primarch. He loves his brother, and those in his chapter that were psykers. Fitting it was he who spoke to magnus and had one of the most heart-rending conversations with him after his fall.
That description of the Spire Guard preparing for a grinding house-to-house battle on the scale of Stalingrad, knowing that they are outmatched but confident in their skills...followed by the blunt statement, “they were broken in two minutes.” That made the hair on my arms stand up and my scalp tingle. After nearly 5 years of experience with the universe of 40k, I sometimes feel a bit numb to the grand-scale calamity of it all. But those little ground-level moments like the one described still remind me of why this universe still fascinates me.
Dan Carlin in his podcast “Hardcore History” does a great job of telling you the story and reigning you in regularly to force you to remember that these are all individual human beings, and we can let the story get convoluted sometimes with statistics, and strategies, and the “This happened, then that happened, then that happened…” that sometimes we can lose focus on the amazing parts of the story. My favorite was his series on the Punic Wars, where he really forces you to envision what it must have been like to be a Roman Legionnaire on the ground, looking across the battlefield and seeing a line of massive African war elephants charging at you. You’ve never even seen an elephant before, and now there’s 30 of them wearing armor and charging at you at a full sprint.
Still killed a lot of guys though...problem with 🐘 is if they get hurt or scared enough and go berserk they can end up killing some of your own guys....that's a big reason why they weren't used more...that and they are very hard to capture and train for war...
I'm going to watch this a million times on repeat so that it has the proper number of views. This is an amazing rendition of the events of Prospero Burns et others. Bravo.
The Burning of Prospero, besides being one of the most intriguing episodes in all of Warhammer lore, is I think the best example of “there are no ‘good guys’ in Warhammer”. Funnily enough, I think only Ahriman could be considered to be in the right here. Excellent work, as always
@@Demortixx aaaaaaand borrowing a pinch of daemonic power and shattering the imperial webway project, letting thousands of daemons loose in the Imperial Palace.
I feel the Thousand sons and their purge were a tragedy for all involved. From the citizens who had no hand in their own downfall. From the Thousands sons who had, but had truely good intentions. But were blinded by Hubris. To the Space Wolves. Who were used as a tool by a traitor and who lost great number during this senseless battle.
Just remember: - Big E wanted Magnus to be the one to sit on the Golden Throne and operate the Webway/Astronomicon - Tzeench teleported Magnus to Prospero when he was born, isolating him from Big E - Prospero was chosen because of its large population of Psyker outcasts, which allowed Magnus to "fit in" and climb up the social ladder - Magnus _unknowingly_ made a pact to Tzeench in an attempt to stop the Flesh-change mutation among his local Psyker population, corrupting him; Big E saw this which is why he did the Council of Nikaea The rest is self-fullfilling prophecy, very tragic, and very much in keeping with Tzeench's powers
But he wouldn't have had to sit on the Golden Throne if the webway project was completed. Big E was trying to find a way to travel without going through the warp.
It was a tragedy for all involved. Like most of the Horus heresy. Its part of the reason why its such a good story. But of all the legions that fell during the HH I feel the thousand sons were the ones that got the shortest stick and got the most foulest of destinies thrust upon them.
@@mensrea1974 I think Magnus was meant to be like Heimdall. He would be a gatekeeper because E knows that eldar or chaos for example could try to break in
All of chaos and the Imperium worked against Magnus as he was the key peice to set it all in motion. Didnt Big E make a pact on that one planet with the 4 god's? Molech? (Insane I remember the world as it's been half a decade and behind on the lore). . The man Magnus legit was ignorant and arrogant like all the Primarchs were. The sheer force to bring Magnus back was insane. A whole legion, along with many Custodes, Sisters of Silence, and IG. Even then the Sons handed an ass beating and were also blinded by their father. The HH would have been snuffed out quickly with the ability of the 1k behind them to learn what the enemy is and powers to defeat them. All the chapters became hypocrites when it came to the rules of Nikea. Big E messed up multiple times but he's playing 8d chess. Having Magnus who obviously knew fucked up could have been a boon. Magnus still could have at least made the defense of the gate easier for Imperium forces.
Knowing the Sixths very own unstable gene-seed, the use of their very own psykers/Rune Priests, makes this so cynical and tragic. To send the Wolf King to Prospero was as harsh as was Monarchia, as the Emperor must have known the very high risk that these two Legions could and would tear each other to pieces. Either the Emperor wanted this to happen, or this was a very stupid move, potentially schemed by Tzeentch. It would have been easy to send Jaghatai to Prospero. He was in good terms with Magnus and could´ve defused the situation. Even if Horus manipulated the order from capture to kill, the Warhawk would have at least asked some questions. This was such an unnecessary tragedy.
That's why I hate Prosper Burns. It just made Russ look like a fool (or tool). Even when Russ is presented with collaborating information from people within his own legion that Magnus is telling the truth he totally ignores it. No logic or critical thinking... Just Horus good, red man bad.
@@usernamunavailiablebut that's just how Russ is. And this isn't the first time he acted like this also. In fact, Russ was more of a liability for the Imperium than an asset.
The problem is that we keep hearing that Russ is this galaxy brain guy who has everyone convince that he's a retard. That would be interesting if he didn't *only* act like a retard.
No, this was worse than Monarchia. The Ultramarines evacuated the city before destroying it. They didn't exterminatus the planet, they didn't ensure every man woman and child were killed, they didn't do everything in their power to slaughter the Word Bearers. Hell, I would have a hard time saying Calth was worse than this.
@@usernamunavailiableruss was known too look up too horus like a big brother, it was unthinkable that he would betray the emperor. Magnus was someone leman had hated for decades, known to commune with "familiars" who had just betrayed the emperor and his set down rules. In addition to his wrecking havoc of mankind's future. It does make russ' actions make sense
Such a fantastic lore channel! Quality writing, nice voice to listen to, wonderful accent, cadence and inflection! I cannot stress enough how important that last part is. Many good storyteller/explainer channels fail only at this final part, making some with genuinely great content just a chore to listen to. This is precisely what exalts you over many others in my view.
In my opinion, the Burning of Prospero is truly the moment where the lie of the Great Crusade was revealed, and the fundamental flaws in the Imperium were laid bare. The flaws inherent in following a despot, no matter how powerful or charismatic. The price of self-righteousness without question or self-reflection. The sheer, all too common disasters that a lack of basic communication can bring about, especially when combined with a culture where blind loyalty is considered a virtue. All of this combined ruined not one, but COUNTLESS worlds. Had someone, anyone with power had taken the time to say "no, this is WRONG, there is a mistake", this entire crisis could have been averted and trillions of lives saved. But they did not, for every major actor in this conflict was too consumed by the self-righteous belief that "I am right and all who stand across from me are wrong". Basic, human tribalism, enhanced by psychogenetic indoctrination and a lust for power and violence and control. The Changer of Ways may have manipulated the conflict, but the Great Machinator was likely a mere opportunist taking advantage of inevitable disaster. The Heresy was and had always been inevitable; despots are always destined to be overthrown. The powder keg simply needed a spark. And the Burning of Prospero was a monumental match indeed.
@@MrLookatmyhat OH, I am absolutely condemning Magnus here too. He is NOT exempt from criticism here. By all accounts he could have easily simply flown to Terra to deliver his warning. He could have easily simply stepped out and negotiated when the host arrived at Prospero. But no. He took the actions he did out of insecurity and ego, choosing not to heed the counsel of his people, and for that billions died. While I do not condemn him as harshly as I do the Emperor and Russ, Magnus was still responsible for what happened as any other.
Solid. I think that’s the underlying point of all 40k. If people, even some of the other races, went this is wrong and lets let go of the ego… probably would fix majority of the issues and save trillions. The tragedy of 40k
You are absolutely correct here my friend and this is a perfect example of what I believe to be the settings greatest strength: taking human nature, with all its flawed ideologies, animalistic insticts and false superiorities, and scaling them to unfathomable degree, extending them to illogical extremes. Is authoritarianism a destructive, reductive system? A cursory glance at the modern imperium provides a chilling account.
Once the debriefing for the events, later referred to as _"The Burning of Prospero"_ concluded. A member of the War Council was quoted as saying. "Throne Above, what a shitshow."
Being fully aware that Magnus the Red is the only other man in the universe who can permanently take his place on the throne and prevent the eventual doom of mankind, Big E sends his executioner Lemonman Russ to escort him back alive.
Worse that Russ for whatever reason had madeup a personal beef with Magnus and his legion, so he was more than happy when Horus lied and told him Big E changed the order from apprehending Magnus to just killing him.
@@chainer8686 The theory that Big E had it all planned just seems to make more sense the more you read in the Horus Heresy series. I always find myself thinking "Wow, this guy really isn't all knowing, is he?" but it's all left up to interpretation. He just fully expected Magnus to betray him irrespective of the circumstances. His entire plan seemed to hinge on Magnus though. He was necessary to operate the golden throne. If the emperor wasn't planning to end up glued to the thing, at least. Sending Russ was really fucking stupid. Biggest L for E in the heresy.
This work of yours benefits quite considerably and absolutely excels in the longer form. Cheers for putting it up, I've listened to each part as released but revisiting it in its whole is a rather more gratifying experience so thank you, very much appreciated.
I love how you have presented the event in such a way that an actual historian would discuss the topic. Your commentary breathes true life into the setting of 40K and it keeps the tragedy of the misunderstanding and lies at the forefront of attention. This, and your other videos, and genuinely masterful.
The Unification Wars video got me hooked onto this channel. Pilgrimage To Holy Terra was hands down THE MOST MOVING 40K lore video I had ever come across... until this one. As the details of the planet-wide genocide were being recounted my heart sank and I genuinely cried. The only other channel's video to bring me anywhere close to Rho's consistency was Baldermort's The Longest Second. I love this. Thank you.
After 2 months of on and off procrastination, I have finally reached the end of this account. It is one of my favorites by far and a stirring retelling of lore that I was previously only vaguely aware of.
Congratulations on completing this series. Even without considering the subject matter, of which most of us are a fan of anyway, you are a very talented creative writer and you should be very proud.
One of the most impressive warhammer lore videos I've listened to. From the Quality of your narration (and the fine Irish lilt to your voice), to the monastic music playing in the background , everything seems perfect for the history and setting. Quality work.
The Emperor's conversation with Konstantine Valdor when he returned to Terra: E: Valdor, Horus has betrayed us and I need to face him directly. I'll need Magnus to... where is Magnus? V: He's dead, just like you wanted. E: Nooo... i wanted him brought here. I gave YOU AND RUSS orders DIRECTLY to bring him here. V: ...Yeaaah, about that "Horus has betrayed us" issue... In truth, Magnus had realised what he had done and consigned his legion's fate by sealing off most of Prospero's planetary defenses, thinking Russ would just exterminatus the planet and be done with it. Now, some people argue with me that Leman Russ and Magnus didn't ACTIVELY hate each other, and yes I use the word "hate" literally, because rather than giving Prospero a quick and painless death, Russ chose to savor the moment and killed his brother's world civilian by civilian. Russ never had any love for Magnus; in fact; he objectively despised the father of the fifteenth legion. Russ actively made sure to slaughter when he was given Prospero's destruction on a silver platter out of sheer loathing. That is like an executioner taking a prisoner out of the gallows and setting them on fire; only someone who actively hated their victim could do such a thing.
Valdor: *Glaring at the Space Wolves with more Weapons of Mass Destruction and ammo that needed* "Soo umm... What you all got there?" Russ: "A smoothie".
You think he should not fight Horus?' ‘Russ is your executioner,’ said Malcador tactfully. ‘But his axe falls a little too readily these days. Magnus felt it, now Horus will feel it.’ 'Two rebel angels. His axe falls on those deserving its smile.'
@@FoxHound-ut1hu Malcador: Then I have a question for you, smartass; how is the Webway going to work AND your plans progress if you're stuck powering the Webway, because we already know I can't run that repurposed Dolmen Gate. E: It will work because I'm in serious denial.
have you checked out the "amber king" yet? amazing channel, OI and other lore youtubers make guest appearances all the time, its like narrative lore biographies on various characters check out his video on Kurze or Khan both were some of the best 40k lore ive heard in a while.
@@bentaylor809 the kurze one is insanely good. the voice acting in it is top notch and it really brings in a humanizing look on these demi god characters in the setting helps make them more relatable and realistic.
Your writing and narration, as always, is scholarly and impressive- this retelling of the Burning of Prospero by the Censure Host was both stirring and entertaining. But your account of the resurrection and vengeful rampage of Canis Vertex was some of the best I’ve ever heard from you, or from anyone else for that matter- no word of a lie, I got chills a few times. Just incredible- congratulations on this one. I didn’t think I’d listen to it all in one sitting so soon after the recent release of the final chapter. However, I was painting my new Spartan and couldn’t think of a better tale to keep the distracting chatter of my monkey mind from ruining my focus on the task at hand. Thank you for putting this into such a towering yet still accessible format. Have a great weekend!
I find it *incredible* that a few hundred of the Thousand Sons held fast against *ten thousand* Space Wolves. Even better is the descriptions of how the Sons turned their ultimate psychic might against the invaders. (Starts a little past 2:16:00 to 2:22:00 or so)
Nice, a super long one to listen to during my courier day job!!! It was a sad day when I caught up after listening to every vid, but I sure glad with every new post! I had never known anything about Warhammer before finding you vids, there's nothing I love more than listening or reading stories about a huge fantasy universe!!!
Been watching this a lot while painting recently helped me both learn and pass the time. Really really appreciate the careful writing to depict it as a historical retelling vs a report of the events. Lots and lots of effort went into this and it’s very appreciated
Russ' hypocrisy never fails to infuriate me. His righteous anger at Magnus and Psychic abilities in general despite his own legion's continued, flagrant utilization of "rune priests" is ludicrous.
It’s almost like a blatant insult to some of his brothers with the context of Nikea and Monarchia. “Look at me brother, I get to use magic with my Rune *Priests*” “Hey Lorgar, I get to call our father *The Allfather*” “It’s not sorcery! It’s my ‘tribal tradition’” “I’m not worshipping the emperor, us silly tribals just call him that.” All while not believing that, knowing that his brothers don’t believe that, knowing that his brothers know that he doesn’t believe that. And still doing it anyways. I get to violate the rules because father loves me more than you type energy.
I love this story, and how it paints Rus as the monster on a leash that he was. No honour, no respect for anything he considers weaker than himself, be it human soldier or civilian. At least Angron had brain damage and never tried to couch his desire to murder in something like "a warrior's spirit." Logan Grimnar is quite the departure from dear old grandad. Loving these long form videos and what they add to our favorite fictional discourse.
I find this story insanely frustrating. Everyone acts so irrationally. I could accept a few mistakes or errors of judgement, here they just compond on top of one another - There's the typical Big E not telling his sons important stuff. - Magnus violates a very explicit Decree from the Emperor, in order to contact the Emperor, instead of using any number of alternatives. - He then accepts help from some shady entity in the warp, so he can bust his way through protections around Terra (boy I wonder who put those there and why). - Big E then just banishes the dude immediately without even trying to find out why he did it. - He then orders his literal Primarch executioner that hates Magnus more than anyone to go and not execute him, but bring him back safely. - Russ then also decides to violate a decree from the Emperor, to go kill a guy because he violated a decree from the Emperor. - Magnus purposely handicaps his defences and his sons, instead of just volunteering to return to Terra. But then later he changes his mind last minute because he's sons are dying and he needs to provide more defence while a spell is being cast. - Finally there are no consequences for Russ for entirely exterminating what was a loyalist home world and legion, and wasting a tonne of rare resources to do it, all because he felt like it.
@@fort809 I mean human as in for all their muscles and healing factors, bone density or heightened reactions, etc they never stopped having human biases and cognative failures.
@@fort809 It really destroys Magnus in particular. There were a good hundred ways, even after Russ was sent to collect him, that Magnus could have averted the Burning, and he chose in each case to do the exact opposite. It's like purposefully choosing all the wrong answers on a test rather than not knowing what the answers are.
I watch this video fairly frequently trying to sleep, and so over the course of the last year I have listened to all 4 hours of this probably more than once. And let me just say that this is a masterclass in storytelling, creativity, realistic extrapolation based on the universe and every time I hear these videos I can't help but feel the detached emotion of humanity in the dark times of the horus heresy. Keep up the good work my friend, I always look forward to seeing new videos pop up in my feed.
By far my favorite retelling of the Burning of prospero.. Out of all the channels that do 40k. Outside od Warrior Tier original stories, A Vox in the void voice acting and effects, as far as narrators that approach even rettelings as role playing, Oculus, the scribe of Guliman is top notch.
The plot armor of the wolves is mind-boggling. Scraped by with the assistance of custodes and SoS and still claim that they destroyed Prospero. Arguably as brain-dead and uninteresting as the Ultramarines. Yeah, I’m a Thousand Sons main. How did you know?
@@FoxHound-ut1hu *after* the sisters dismantled the Son’s main method of fighting, transportation, and effectively causing the flesh change to return. Not to mention the what? two times the custodes prevented a complete route of the wolves? yeah the wolves wouldve been wiped clean even without magnus if the custodes and their silent sisters werent there
@@Luxia-f1e the thousand sons were holding off the wolves bringing their full might to bare but it could of only last so long. We are straight up told that the legions would have completely destroyed each other so no the thousand sons wouldn't have wiped them clean.
@@FoxHound-ut1hu Im sorry guy but the wolves had no means of countering the near perfect mobility of Prospero’s teleporters and the psychic devastation of the son’s. Even the custodes took heavy casualties to their powers, and by the time the custodes intervened the wolves were at risk of losing an entire company to these tactics. this is even *without* magnus, *without* a proper defensive plan, and *without* any real warning Leman was practically handed the planet on a plate and his wolves still took colossal casualties nah, without the custodes the stubborn pride and poor planning of leman would’ve seen the wolves put down, maybe even for good. tldr: the sons fighting the sistsers is about as 1 sided as it gets like a world eater going up against a ghost
"The Thousand Sons left the world humbled a few other legions have other been" *Word Bearers start uncontrollably sobbing over Monarchia and proceed to daemonically possess some fools*
@@Lakefront_Khan They weren't there when the 13th glassed the city. When they arrived the Emperor made them kneel before him, he didn't slaughter them and murder civilians and children like Valdor and Russ did at Prospero.
@@stevepalpatine2828 Only seven people survived from Monarchia. The Ultramarines DID gun down women and children. Just in small numbers. Before glassing Monarchia In truth, they condemned the majority that DID flee to death in the wilderness. And being raided, assault, and rxped, such as what happened to Cyrene, the only female survivor of Monarchia. She was rxped in the wilderness after fleeing the safety of Monarchia, but not killed. But all her companions were rxped and killed. When Argel Tal of the Word Bearers found her, rxped, bloodied, and blind....he openly said she was one of only seven survivors, and the only female survivor. Lorgar would later make her the Blessed Lady, and openly beg her forgiveness for not being there to protect her and her people. He would also make her the Blessed Lady, as a SYMBOL to forever remind the Word Bearers....to never forget what happened at Monarchia. Don't pretend the Ultramarines didn't kill anyone. They one hundred percent did. Openly opened fire on civies, killed those who didn't leave, and condemned the rest to abuse and death in the wilderness. And they didn't JUST do this to Monarchia either. Every major city on the planet, they did the same thing, turning the planet into a death world. Monarchia was simply the capital where the most death occurred.
@@Aizen2468 That's a fair point, the 13th are total shits for what they did to Monarchia, it just wasnt to the same level or scale as Russ's savages at Prospero, at least the 13th gave them a warning first. Doesnt make it right, but the Burning of Prospero was worse.
Your reading is so extremely well balanced. Literally had several chills throughout. Its hugely inspired me to do lore videos, although for a different setting. Kudos!
I am 1 hour 55 mins in and thinking "Damn this is intense". I don't play WH40K, or really have much to do with it, but it has been appearing in my recommended. I fell asleep earlier at some other video about 40K and woke up to the start of this. Now I am totally loving it. You tell a good tale sir!
> E orders the murder of Thunder Warriors > E orders the murder of crusading Thousand Sons by other legions > Istvann V happens > surprised Pikachu Imperium
I propose an Oculus drinking game. Drink a shot every time our favourite historator uses one of his most common phrases. Some suggestions: Anything followed by "far from it" Any use of the word "occluded" "Squat/squatting amongst the stars" Any other suggestions?
Oculus, I have an idea for a video. The story of the Veritas Ferrum? Iron Hands strike cruiser meant to be in the second wave at Istvaan, too heavily damaged at Callinedes. Rescued some salamanders and Raven guard, took out 3 emperors children ships on its own, was destroyed and resurrected as a daemon ship by Madail the Undivided who later took the Veritas on to the second battle of davin in Ruinstorm
It's interesting to consider how differently this would have gone if Magnus had allowed his legion to fortify. Had the host needed to fight every step of the way to prospero, then fight a full fleet in orbit, then the legion on the surface, it really doesn't seem like they would have been victorious.
Magnus thought that doing so would seal his fate. If he offered no resistance, he thought that he'd be able to avoid summary execution and thus convince Big E of Horus's treachery.
Magnus was an Alpha + level psyker. He could have obliterated most of the Censure Fleets ships in orbit, maybe excepting the ones carrying a lot of Silent Sisters. If the XVth had prep time and fought no holds barred the Censure Fleet would have lost. The few that managed to even make landfall would have been annihilated. The Thousand Sons were arguably the most powerful legion of all, despite being one of the smallest, taking their psychic powers into account. The Wolves are just the XIIth wearing Fur Suits. At least Angron has the excuse he has a rage engine hammered into his head.
Potentially unpopular opinion: The space wolves should have been massacred by the thousand sons, and they would have, pretty easily, if Magnus didn’t let the censor fleet essentially get directly in his house before fighting back
100% agree. Home field advantage, not to mention their raw psychic power. Plus they'd have had Magnus on in the fight from the beginning. It would have been an absolute fuckin massacre. The wolves of fenris are VERY fortunate things worked out the way they did for them lol
Listening to this while I cook a Thanksgiving hog. I didn't know about the strife on Terra during Magnus' naughty behavior. The little tidbits are one of the things that keeps me coming back to this channel. Keep up the good work Oculus!
I have waited several years for Oculus to complete this story. To me, this will be his magnum opus. Oculus is the gold standard by which all Warhammer lore channels should aspire to.
As a historic curiosity of point in time and place, had the Emperor sent the Iron Warriors instead of the wolves, what would have happened? was Olympia already rebelling then? was Perturabo already sworn to the side of Horus? could Perturabo have made Magnus resign himself to be brought to Terra? or would things have gone even more different then as previously imagined?
The Burning of Prospero is one of those moments I always point to as an example of "Warhammer 40k has no good guys" when I'm introducing somebody new to the setting
This is my second time listening to it. The first was in each segment and now the full thing in a whole. By far the best lore video on Prospero by a massive amount and the depth and delivery of the epic moments was phenomenal. Hope to see more of these for Beta Garmen, Pluto, the inter War on Mars, and ultimately Terra when the Seige series is done.
This brought me near tears. If hollywood had the gutts to do so this narrative would be the best basis for a Warhammer 40,000 movie I can think of. You did deepest justice in both audio quality as well as vast and exacting study of the subject.
Gods, I never realized that the 15th abroad in the galaxy were purged without hesitation. It really reminds me of a much crueler order 66. Just ally’s turning on comrades. Such was the horror of the heresy. This was an amazing recounting of the event dude. Great work, and I’m looking forward to your future videos. Have a wonderful day.
Great video, love your voice and dedication to the character. Loved it when you gagged near the end when saying "changer of ways", like a human in the Warhammer universe might struggle to utter even a nickname of one of the chaos gods
In my childhood I remember the beginnings of the Warhammer universe and whilst I could not afford much of either fantasy or 40k I do remember reading stories of The Emperor and the Horus Heresy in White Dwarf magazine which I could just about afford with my saved up pocket money. Learning more about the lore 40 years later I've come to realise there is nothing noble honourable or respectable about The Emperor, his cruelty and disdain for life is the equal of any of the Chaos gods and humanity under him with it's xenophobic purges is the equal of the tyranid swarm.
It took that cruelty to unite and hold what the imperium became.. if he was more cruel than he was the tragedy never would have happened. Part of 40k that you're missing was the emperor trying to preserve the human race and a whole.. it never would have survived to 40ks time if he hadn't achieved way he did. Yeah alot of brutal, cruel, and cold blooded but look what he's up against in the warhammer universe..
Yeah, there are very few "good guys" in this setting. The Emperor is a neglectful narcissist and the whole Heresy was basically always bound to happen, sadly.
Something I appreciate about Occulus, is the details. Ever lore channel I can think of will talk in more broad strokes which is fine. But I can’t stop thinking about the butchering of the PDF. The last stand of the soldiers managing to hold out against *space marines* for more than 10 minutes. How Parley was requested by mortal commanders, and how the Transhuman attackers showed no mercy in kind. I remember these details. It’s a testament to the script writing and voice acting talent displayed by the man, or people, running the show.
They werent available and Emps didnt want Magnus killed. Thats part of the tragedy here, this slaughter was totally uncalled for and turned a loyal son who had made a mistake and stood down to receive his punishment into another enemy.
@@will-ob7pr its named after Nikea on purpose, warhammer 40k takes famous event names in real history all the time although really they shouldve reserved the name Nikea for a lorgar or ecclesiarchy related event
@@ultra-papasmurf That would be too on the nose. Determining a law or "canon" if you will for what to do with the most complex issue of the Pre-Heresy Imperium works pretty well as an analogue for Nicaea. Moreover, the result of both Nicaea and Nikea run in the face of what seems "logical", and were overwhelming wins for the opposition. Magnus' parallel Arius argued that Jesus had a beginning, as opposed to the dominant view, which was as part of the Holy Trinity, Jesus had always existed. To the non-Christian outside observer, the former seems self-evident. We, as the outside observers of Nikea can also see that had the Thousand Sons been permitted to continue to use their gifts, the Heresy may not have played out as it did. There is also the interesting part of Arius' argument that The Father (God) is the only one that is infinite and divine, and that his Son (Jesus) was only made into God through the actions of The Father. Sounds familiar, hm?
Russ' tragedy (if such it could be called, given how little he chafed under it) was that he was not able to freely choose to give his loyalty, for he was genetically bred to be absolutely loyal. He had no choice and thus, had no loyalty to demonstrate, only his complete subjection to his programming. The ways in which he chose to act under it, however, completely abnegate his pretensions to honour. He was always the greatest hypocrite. Historitor, I once believed Russ to be a reluctant prosecutor of Horus' duping scheme, but you have laid out here that not only did he begin his mission prepared to kill his brother Primarch, he relished that chance. As for Magnus - he sacrificed his world and most of his Legion in the pursuit of principles so lightly held, he abandoned them moments later as thoroughly as he did his people.
I come from a military family so I have a lot of relatives who were in the military but I’ll just mention the ones that fought Grandpa 1: Vietnam infantryman Grandpa 2: desert storm Combat engineer Great grandpa: Korean War Infantryman
Ok so I know there are many reasons why Russ and the stodes did what they did and magnus had plenty of mistakes but like Russ got straight duped here easily like way too easy big E usually doesn’t change orders on a whim kinda odd the Horus changed the order and leman Russ was just like ok.
I am So glas i found this chanel. First of all your vocabulary is unmatched. It paints a vivid picture and with the backround music rivals any big corporate production. Also your voice. You sound like you could be the son of Deckard Cain from the Diablo series, or some high cleric to a god of knowledge and learning in a D&D universe like The Forgotten Realms or Dragonlance (i like Fantastical fiction as much as grimdark and sci-fi lol). It's Scholarly but heavy with grave implications, full of Gravitas and somehow much more powerful than its low decibels would indicate😊. Well done sir, most definitly subscribed!
Invisible disabilities refers to things you physically cannot see (e.g. common mental health issues that go undiagnosed and untreated that render modern life too difficult to deal with, bi-polar, borderline personality disorder, severe ADHD, autism spectrum disorder, hell even depression) and people being unable to afford to even be diagnosed often turn to self medicating as a form of symptom relief which leads to addiction which after the first and second times trying a drug, is no longer a choice for most. Addiction is a physical change to your brain chemistry, it is incredibly difficult to treat even with modern medicin and should be thought of as a mental health issue instead of a willpower issue. Most of these people are not homeless by choice, they are homeless because that's what they've been led to believe is their only option left in life
In any case, having Alpha Legion confront Thousand Sons and by extension, serving with Censure Hosts and empire's most secret assets (Ordo Sinister) would be can of worms even by W40k standards....
I fell asleep and woke up to this
Me too.
Same
same
Sames
Same it was being integrated into my dream lol
Who else woke up with this playing?
Dawg litterally me right now
Same
what the fuck 😭
Literally me lmao, went to bed to a video essay about portal and woke up to this
What the fuck???
3:20:37 "grim equanimity found at the edge of oblivion" that's an awesome line right there... admist admittedly awesome work but still it raises the bar
Thousand Son: "Hey dad, you wanna come out here and talk to Russ?"
*quiet magical sobbing*
Thosand Son: "K , guess we'll all go die then."
I wish this guy would actually get to the point instead of rambling on for an hour
@@maxanders3000go away
P😊
😊😊😊😊
@@maxanders3000 You know you can just skip ahead in the video right?
You gave the moment where the shell of the dead Titan coming back to life a whole new feeling, and now I can't unthink it. I need to listen to this again, a work matched only by the Mechanicus brother.
This is why the Khan is my favorite primarch.
He loves his brother, and those in his chapter that were psykers.
Fitting it was he who spoke to magnus and had one of the most heart-rending conversations with him after his fall.
This is why Leman is my favourite Primarch.
@@julienstam lemon crust primarch
@@julienstam Man you couldn't pick a worse one short of Fulgrim or Lorgar
They need to bring back the Khan
😃😃👍👍😃🚘😮
Oculus: I must place the Lion's share of the blame...
El'Johnson: I wasn't involved, leave me out of this!
1:14:23 Valdor: *Looks at the Space Wolves with heavy ordnance* Ummm, what y'all got there?
Russ, and the whole Legion: ... A Meade Smoothie?.
@@ArchArturo hearing this in Russ's TTS vouce
@ArchArturo yeah... "mead smoothie" sounds Heretical on _a number_ of levels...
That description of the Spire Guard preparing for a grinding house-to-house battle on the scale of Stalingrad, knowing that they are outmatched but confident in their skills...followed by the blunt statement, “they were broken in two minutes.”
That made the hair on my arms stand up and my scalp tingle.
After nearly 5 years of experience with the universe of 40k, I sometimes feel a bit numb to the grand-scale calamity of it all. But those little ground-level moments like the one described still remind me of why this universe still fascinates me.
Dan Carlin in his podcast “Hardcore History” does a great job of telling you the story and reigning you in regularly to force you to remember that these are all individual human beings, and we can let the story get convoluted sometimes with statistics, and strategies, and the “This happened, then that happened, then that happened…” that sometimes we can lose focus on the amazing parts of the story.
My favorite was his series on the Punic Wars, where he really forces you to envision what it must have been like to be a Roman Legionnaire on the ground, looking across the battlefield and seeing a line of massive African war elephants charging at you. You’ve never even seen an elephant before, and now there’s 30 of them wearing armor and charging at you at a full sprint.
@@fireandiron4181 thats some real LotR shit right there... but it actually happened. Crazy...
Still killed a lot of guys though...problem with 🐘 is if they get hurt or scared enough and go berserk they can end up killing some of your own guys....that's a big reason why they weren't used more...that and they are very hard to capture and train for war...
I'd imagine they tried to do a spear phalanx against elephants and pepper them with arrows and javelin and what not
I'm going to watch this a million times on repeat so that it has the proper number of views. This is an amazing rendition of the events of Prospero Burns et others. Bravo.
He did it!
@@morbo5135 christ, I didn’t notice the views. That is impressive.
A very one sided view ladden with censure and propaganda but an entertaining one nonetheless.
@@mathdesm9306 well... its lore accurate coming from an historitor living in the imperium a few thousand year later xD
@@mathdesm9306waaaaghhh
The Burning of Prospero, besides being one of the most intriguing episodes in all of Warhammer lore, is I think the best example of “there are no ‘good guys’ in Warhammer”. Funnily enough, I think only Ahriman could be considered to be in the right here. Excellent work, as always
He permitted the use of horrific abilities, further dooming his legion
Magnus did nothing wrong except not fighting
@@Demortixx aaaaaaand borrowing a pinch of daemonic power and shattering the imperial webway project, letting thousands of daemons loose in the Imperial Palace.
The Imperium are the good guys. The Astartes are the good guys. Mechanicus/Mechanicum.
@@magnithorsson2154 they absolutely arent
I feel the Thousand sons and their purge were a tragedy for all involved. From the citizens who had no hand in their own downfall. From the Thousands sons who had, but had truely good intentions. But were blinded by Hubris. To the Space Wolves. Who were used as a tool by a traitor and who lost great number during this senseless battle.
Every battle in the grim darkness is a tragedy.
The wolves would’ve butchered regardless and have no care for human life
@@kozmo7 This. Absolutely fuck the space wolves.
The wolves are one of the legions/chapter most known to respect and protect normals
Sounds like a Magnus apologist is here
@@logandelaharpe6362 I was a fan of the wolves, and then I read burning of prospero …
It’s rough man
Just remember:
- Big E wanted Magnus to be the one to sit on the Golden Throne and operate the Webway/Astronomicon
- Tzeench teleported Magnus to Prospero when he was born, isolating him from Big E
- Prospero was chosen because of its large population of Psyker outcasts, which allowed Magnus to "fit in" and climb up the social ladder
- Magnus _unknowingly_ made a pact to Tzeench in an attempt to stop the Flesh-change mutation among his local Psyker population, corrupting him; Big E saw this which is why he did the Council of Nikaea
The rest is self-fullfilling prophecy, very tragic, and very much in keeping with Tzeench's powers
But he wouldn't have had to sit on the Golden Throne if the webway project was completed. Big E was trying to find a way to travel without going through the warp.
It was a tragedy for all involved. Like most of the Horus heresy. Its part of the reason why its such a good story. But of all the legions that fell during the HH I feel the thousand sons were the ones that got the shortest stick and got the most foulest of destinies thrust upon them.
@@mensrea1974 I think Magnus was meant to be like Heimdall. He would be a gatekeeper because E knows that eldar or chaos for example could try to break in
@@joshkardos1673 Still - can't think of Magnus in separation from his gene sons. He wouldn't be standing this watch alone.
All of chaos and the Imperium worked against Magnus as he was the key peice to set it all in motion. Didnt Big E make a pact on that one planet with the 4 god's? Molech? (Insane I remember the world as it's been half a decade and behind on the lore).
. The man Magnus legit was ignorant and arrogant like all the Primarchs were.
The sheer force to bring Magnus back was insane. A whole legion, along with many Custodes, Sisters of Silence, and IG. Even then the Sons handed an ass beating and were also blinded by their father.
The HH would have been snuffed out quickly with the ability of the 1k behind them to learn what the enemy is and powers to defeat them. All the chapters became hypocrites when it came to the rules of Nikea.
Big E messed up multiple times but he's playing 8d chess. Having Magnus who obviously knew fucked up could have been a boon. Magnus still could have at least made the defense of the gate easier for Imperium forces.
Kudos man, this whole saga was the greatest 40k lore video I’ve ever heard
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Knowing the Sixths very own unstable gene-seed, the use of their very own psykers/Rune Priests, makes this so cynical and tragic. To send the Wolf King to Prospero was as harsh as was Monarchia, as the Emperor must have known the very high risk that these two Legions could and would tear each other to pieces. Either the Emperor wanted this to happen, or this was a very stupid move, potentially schemed by Tzeentch.
It would have been easy to send Jaghatai to Prospero. He was in good terms with Magnus and could´ve defused the situation. Even if Horus manipulated the order from capture to kill, the Warhawk would have at least asked some questions.
This was such an unnecessary tragedy.
That's why I hate Prosper Burns. It just made Russ look like a fool (or tool). Even when Russ is presented with collaborating information from people within his own legion that Magnus is telling the truth he totally ignores it. No logic or critical thinking... Just Horus good, red man bad.
@@usernamunavailiablebut that's just how Russ is. And this isn't the first time he acted like this also. In fact, Russ was more of a liability for the Imperium than an asset.
The problem is that we keep hearing that Russ is this galaxy brain guy who has everyone convince that he's a retard.
That would be interesting if he didn't *only* act like a retard.
No, this was worse than Monarchia. The Ultramarines evacuated the city before destroying it. They didn't exterminatus the planet, they didn't ensure every man woman and child were killed, they didn't do everything in their power to slaughter the Word Bearers. Hell, I would have a hard time saying Calth was worse than this.
@@usernamunavailiableruss was known too look up too horus like a big brother, it was unthinkable that he would betray the emperor. Magnus was someone leman had hated for decades, known to commune with "familiars" who had just betrayed the emperor and his set down rules. In addition to his wrecking havoc of mankind's future. It does make russ' actions make sense
THANK YOU for editing this series into a compilation, what a good way to cap it off!
Such a fantastic lore channel! Quality writing, nice voice to listen to, wonderful accent, cadence and inflection! I cannot stress enough how important that last part is. Many good storyteller/explainer channels fail only at this final part, making some with genuinely great content just a chore to listen to. This is precisely what exalts you over many others in my view.
The Burning of Propero story was a tragedy, and one of the best parts of the HH lore. This video series was a wonderful coverage.
In my opinion, the Burning of Prospero is truly the moment where the lie of the Great Crusade was revealed, and the fundamental flaws in the Imperium were laid bare. The flaws inherent in following a despot, no matter how powerful or charismatic. The price of self-righteousness without question or self-reflection. The sheer, all too common disasters that a lack of basic communication can bring about, especially when combined with a culture where blind loyalty is considered a virtue. All of this combined ruined not one, but COUNTLESS worlds. Had someone, anyone with power had taken the time to say "no, this is WRONG, there is a mistake", this entire crisis could have been averted and trillions of lives saved. But they did not, for every major actor in this conflict was too consumed by the self-righteous belief that "I am right and all who stand across from me are wrong". Basic, human tribalism, enhanced by psychogenetic indoctrination and a lust for power and violence and control. The Changer of Ways may have manipulated the conflict, but the Great Machinator was likely a mere opportunist taking advantage of inevitable disaster. The Heresy was and had always been inevitable; despots are always destined to be overthrown. The powder keg simply needed a spark. And the Burning of Prospero was a monumental match indeed.
Okay, Magnus. We get it.
@@MrLookatmyhat OH, I am absolutely condemning Magnus here too. He is NOT exempt from criticism here. By all accounts he could have easily simply flown to Terra to deliver his warning. He could have easily simply stepped out and negotiated when the host arrived at Prospero. But no. He took the actions he did out of insecurity and ego, choosing not to heed the counsel of his people, and for that billions died. While I do not condemn him as harshly as I do the Emperor and Russ, Magnus was still responsible for what happened as any other.
Solid. I think that’s the underlying point of all 40k. If people, even some of the other races, went this is wrong and lets let go of the ego… probably would fix majority of the issues and save trillions. The tragedy of 40k
You are absolutely correct here my friend and this is a perfect example of what I believe to be the settings greatest strength: taking human nature, with all its flawed ideologies, animalistic insticts and false superiorities, and scaling them to unfathomable degree, extending them to illogical extremes. Is authoritarianism a destructive, reductive system? A cursory glance at the modern imperium provides a chilling account.
That's a interesting point of view, I'll make sure the Inquisition hears about you opinion.
Emperor: Now, Leman, remember, I want you to bring Magnus to me ALIVE.
Leman: Yes, Father, I know.
Also Leman: Orbital bombardment go brrrrrrrr
Horus: I pulled a little sneaky on ya
Russ tired to hail Magnus many times before they started the burning.
Once the debriefing for the events, later referred to as _"The Burning of Prospero"_ concluded. A member of the War Council was quoted as saying. "Throne Above, what a shitshow."
"The Russ? Really? The Russ?"
Being fully aware that Magnus the Red is the only other man in the universe who can permanently take his place on the throne and prevent the eventual doom of mankind, Big E sends his executioner Lemonman Russ to escort him back alive.
Worse that Russ for whatever reason had madeup a personal beef with Magnus and his legion, so he was more than happy when Horus lied and told him Big E changed the order from apprehending Magnus to just killing him.
@@chainer8686 and then massacre the civilian population... the wolves dont come out of this looking good at all
QA
@@chainer8686 The theory that Big E had it all planned just seems to make more sense the more you read in the Horus Heresy series.
I always find myself thinking "Wow, this guy really isn't all knowing, is he?" but it's all left up to interpretation. He just fully expected Magnus to betray him irrespective of the circumstances.
His entire plan seemed to hinge on Magnus though. He was necessary to operate the golden throne. If the emperor wasn't planning to end up glued to the thing, at least. Sending Russ was really fucking stupid. Biggest L for E in the heresy.
@@chainer8686
P
This work of yours benefits quite considerably and absolutely excels in the longer form.
Cheers for putting it up, I've listened to each part as released but revisiting it in its whole is a rather more gratifying experience so thank you, very much appreciated.
I love how you have presented the event in such a way that an actual historian would discuss the topic. Your commentary breathes true life into the setting of 40K and it keeps the tragedy of the misunderstanding and lies at the forefront of attention. This, and your other videos, and genuinely masterful.
The Unification Wars video got me hooked onto this channel.
Pilgrimage To Holy Terra was hands down THE MOST MOVING 40K lore video I had ever come across...
until this one.
As the details of the planet-wide genocide were being recounted my heart sank and I genuinely cried.
The only other channel's video to bring me anywhere close to Rho's consistency was Baldermort's The Longest Second.
I love this. Thank you.
If this made you sad, look up amber king's rendition, it will make you cry...
After 2 months of on and off procrastination, I have finally reached the end of this account. It is one of my favorites by far and a stirring retelling of lore that I was previously only vaguely aware of.
"I PUNCHED OUT ONE OF HIS HEARTS!! Why does no one remember that?!😭" 😂😂
Congratulations on completing this series. Even without considering the subject matter, of which most of us are a fan of anyway, you are a very talented creative writer and you should be very proud.
One of the most impressive warhammer lore videos I've listened to. From the Quality of your narration (and the fine Irish lilt to your voice), to the monastic music playing in the background , everything seems perfect for the history and setting. Quality work.
Glad you enjoyed it!
@@OculusImperia I’m bi
Ahh... 4 hours of handsome voice talking grimdark. perfect after 12 hours of mindnumbing work in the manufactorium
i woke up to this posting on my computer, no idea what it was about, but kept it playing for another hour
I feel the struggle brother
You dare diapers at doing the god emperors work? Heresy!
For real tho. Hits the spot after a long day 😂
Well-spoken and thoughtful narrative of 40k Warhammer content. This is awesome and I have been listening non-stop for hours.
The Emperor's conversation with Konstantine Valdor when he returned to Terra:
E: Valdor, Horus has betrayed us and I need to face him directly. I'll need Magnus to... where is Magnus?
V: He's dead, just like you wanted.
E: Nooo... i wanted him brought here. I gave YOU AND RUSS orders DIRECTLY to bring him here.
V: ...Yeaaah, about that "Horus has betrayed us" issue...
In truth, Magnus had realised what he had done and consigned his legion's fate by sealing off most of Prospero's planetary defenses, thinking Russ would just exterminatus the planet and be done with it.
Now, some people argue with me that Leman Russ and Magnus didn't ACTIVELY hate each other, and yes I use the word "hate" literally, because rather than giving Prospero a quick and painless death, Russ chose to savor the moment and killed his brother's world civilian by civilian. Russ never had any love for Magnus; in fact; he objectively despised the father of the fifteenth legion. Russ actively made sure to slaughter when he was given Prospero's destruction on a silver platter out of sheer loathing.
That is like an executioner taking a prisoner out of the gallows and setting them on fire; only someone who actively hated their victim could do such a thing.
I have a personal theory that Valdor is kind of maliciously compliant
Valdor: *Glaring at the Space Wolves with more Weapons of Mass Destruction and ammo that needed* "Soo umm... What you all got there?"
Russ: "A smoothie".
You think he should not fight Horus?'
‘Russ is your executioner,’ said Malcador tactfully. ‘But his axe falls a little too readily these days. Magnus felt it, now Horus will feel it.’
'Two rebel angels. His axe falls on those deserving its smile.'
@@FoxHound-ut1hu
Malcador: Then I have a question for you, smartass; how is the Webway going to work AND your plans progress if you're stuck powering the Webway, because we already know I can't run that repurposed Dolmen Gate.
E: It will work because I'm in serious denial.
Russ always came off to me as someone who *hates* Humanity but loves being the grinder in The Imperium's machine.
I woke up to this in the middle of the Night 2 Hours in. Stayed up to watch the last Hour without a single clue about 40k, liked the video 👍🏽
The best and the most consistent Lore channel on UA-cam!
have you checked out the "amber king" yet? amazing channel, OI and other lore youtubers make guest appearances all the time, its like narrative lore biographies on various characters check out his video on Kurze or Khan both were some of the best 40k lore ive heard in a while.
@@fredconney2896 they're good but have some flaws, OI is still my prefered, but not by much
@@bentaylor809 the kurze one is insanely good. the voice acting in it is top notch and it really brings in a humanizing look on these demi god characters in the setting helps make them more relatable and realistic.
Not really. He is a heretic.
Did Russ stop using his Furrcerers after the CoN or did he just go "nah uh it's not magic it's Wolf Power"?
"They are not pyskers, they are corgimancers!"
Called it wolf power and kept on keeping on. His rune priests are just as much heretics and deserving of censor as any thousand son.
@@Subject_Keter Space Puppy Corgimancers are just about the best thing ever! 🤣
He knew OFC, but he likes to troll heretics
Your writing and narration, as always, is scholarly and impressive- this retelling of the Burning of Prospero by the Censure Host was both stirring and entertaining. But your account of the resurrection and vengeful rampage of Canis Vertex was some of the best I’ve ever heard from you, or from anyone else for that matter- no word of a lie, I got chills a few times. Just incredible- congratulations on this one. I didn’t think I’d listen to it all in one sitting so soon after the recent release of the final chapter. However, I was painting my new Spartan and couldn’t think of a better tale to keep the distracting chatter of my monkey mind from ruining my focus on the task at hand. Thank you for putting this into such a towering yet still accessible format. Have a great weekend!
I find it *incredible* that a few hundred of the Thousand Sons held fast against *ten thousand* Space Wolves.
Even better is the descriptions of how the Sons turned their ultimate psychic might against the invaders. (Starts a little past 2:16:00 to 2:22:00 or so)
Nice, a super long one to listen to during my courier day job!!! It was a sad day when I caught up after listening to every vid, but I sure glad with every new post! I had never known anything about Warhammer before finding you vids, there's nothing I love more than listening or reading stories about a huge fantasy universe!!!
It’s also gonna be the background for my painting.
Been watching this a lot while painting recently helped me both learn and pass the time. Really really appreciate the careful writing to depict it as a historical retelling vs a report of the events. Lots and lots of effort went into this and it’s very appreciated
Russ' hypocrisy never fails to infuriate me. His righteous anger at Magnus and Psychic abilities in general despite his own legion's continued, flagrant utilization of "rune priests" is ludicrous.
It’s almost like a blatant insult to some of his brothers with the context of Nikea and Monarchia. “Look at me brother, I get to use magic with my Rune *Priests*”
“Hey Lorgar, I get to call our father *The Allfather*”
“It’s not sorcery! It’s my ‘tribal tradition’”
“I’m not worshipping the emperor, us silly tribals just call him that.” All while not believing that, knowing that his brothers don’t believe that, knowing that his brothers know that he doesn’t believe that. And still doing it anyways. I get to violate the rules because father loves me more than you type energy.
Bloody amazing as always mate.
Between Prospero and Vraks you really nailed these longer series. Looking forward to your future content!
Best WH40k lore and best narration…..it is super immersive
Unbelievable effort oculus, thank you for the great chronicles 🙌
The artwork with 40K is just phenomenal!!!
I love this story, and how it paints Rus as the monster on a leash that he was. No honour, no respect for anything he considers weaker than himself, be it human soldier or civilian. At least Angron had brain damage and never tried to couch his desire to murder in something like "a warrior's spirit."
Logan Grimnar is quite the departure from dear old grandad. Loving these long form videos and what they add to our favorite fictional discourse.
For the last year I have fallen asleep to this video at least once a week
I find this story insanely frustrating. Everyone acts so irrationally. I could accept a few mistakes or errors of judgement, here they just compond on top of one another
- There's the typical Big E not telling his sons important stuff.
- Magnus violates a very explicit Decree from the Emperor, in order to contact the Emperor, instead of using any number of alternatives.
- He then accepts help from some shady entity in the warp, so he can bust his way through protections around Terra (boy I wonder who put those there and why).
- Big E then just banishes the dude immediately without even trying to find out why he did it.
- He then orders his literal Primarch executioner that hates Magnus more than anyone to go and not execute him, but bring him back safely.
- Russ then also decides to violate a decree from the Emperor, to go kill a guy because he violated a decree from the Emperor.
- Magnus purposely handicaps his defences and his sons, instead of just volunteering to return to Terra. But then later he changes his mind last minute because he's sons are dying and he needs to provide more defence while a spell is being cast.
- Finally there are no consequences for Russ for entirely exterminating what was a loyalist home world and legion, and wasting a tonne of rare resources to do it, all because he felt like it.
It's VERY human though, reminds me strongly of some of the Roman civil wars but with higher tech and magic
@@Sara3346except NONE of these characters are human, they’re supposed to be ultra smart demigods. Horus heresy was so badly written
@@fort809 I mean human as in for all their muscles and healing factors, bone density or heightened reactions, etc they never stopped having human biases and cognative failures.
@@fort809 It really destroys Magnus in particular. There were a good hundred ways, even after Russ was sent to collect him, that Magnus could have averted the Burning, and he chose in each case to do the exact opposite. It's like purposefully choosing all the wrong answers on a test rather than not knowing what the answers are.
I watch this video fairly frequently trying to sleep, and so over the course of the last year I have listened to all 4 hours of this probably more than once. And let me just say that this is a masterclass in storytelling, creativity, realistic extrapolation based on the universe and every time I hear these videos I can't help but feel the detached emotion of humanity in the dark times of the horus heresy. Keep up the good work my friend, I always look forward to seeing new videos pop up in my feed.
This was incredible... You actually had me tearing up several times. Thank you so much.
By far my favorite retelling of the Burning of prospero.. Out of all the channels that do 40k. Outside od Warrior Tier original stories, A Vox in the void voice acting and effects, as far as narrators that approach even rettelings as role playing, Oculus, the scribe of Guliman is top notch.
The plot armor of the wolves is mind-boggling. Scraped by with the assistance of custodes and SoS and still claim that they destroyed Prospero. Arguably as brain-dead and uninteresting as the Ultramarines.
Yeah, I’m a Thousand Sons main. How did you know?
they 100% woukdve gotten destroyed if the silent sisters and the custodes werent keeping them alive
The wolves and Russ did the vast majority of the work.
@@FoxHound-ut1hu *after* the sisters dismantled the Son’s main method of fighting, transportation, and effectively causing the flesh change to return. Not to mention the what? two times the custodes prevented a complete route of the wolves?
yeah the wolves wouldve been wiped clean even without magnus if the custodes and their silent sisters werent there
@@Luxia-f1e the thousand sons were holding off the wolves bringing their full might to bare but it could of only last so long. We are straight up told that the legions would have completely destroyed each other so no the thousand sons wouldn't have wiped them clean.
@@FoxHound-ut1hu Im sorry guy but the wolves had no means of countering the near perfect mobility of Prospero’s teleporters and the psychic devastation of the son’s. Even the custodes took heavy casualties to their powers, and by the time the custodes intervened the wolves were at risk of losing an entire company to these tactics.
this is even *without* magnus, *without* a proper defensive plan, and *without* any real warning
Leman was practically handed the planet on a plate and his wolves still took colossal casualties
nah, without the custodes the stubborn pride and poor planning of leman would’ve seen the wolves put down, maybe even for good.
tldr: the sons fighting the sistsers is about as 1 sided as it gets
like a world eater going up against a ghost
Your "in character" suggestions to watch previous videos is wonderful. Well written and presented.
Sometimes I wish the Space Wolves meet a pissed off Nyarlatothep. War Criminals, the lot of them.
Every primarch: welp...we kinda never liked the guy anyway. Yeah I'll abstain from caring about those bad bois.
"The Thousand Sons left the world humbled a few other legions have other been"
*Word Bearers start uncontrollably sobbing over Monarchia and proceed to daemonically possess some fools*
Did the Word Bears defend Monarcha?
@@Lakefront_Khan They weren't there when the 13th glassed the city.
When they arrived the Emperor made them kneel before him, he didn't slaughter them and murder civilians and children like Valdor and Russ did at Prospero.
@@stevepalpatine2828 Only seven people survived from Monarchia. The Ultramarines DID gun down women and children. Just in small numbers. Before glassing Monarchia
In truth, they condemned the majority that DID flee to death in the wilderness. And being raided, assault, and rxped, such as what happened to Cyrene, the only female survivor of Monarchia. She was rxped in the wilderness after fleeing the safety of Monarchia, but not killed. But all her companions were rxped and killed.
When Argel Tal of the Word Bearers found her, rxped, bloodied, and blind....he openly said she was one of only seven survivors, and the only female survivor.
Lorgar would later make her the Blessed Lady, and openly beg her forgiveness for not being there to protect her and her people. He would also make her the Blessed Lady, as a SYMBOL to forever remind the Word Bearers....to never forget what happened at Monarchia.
Don't pretend the Ultramarines didn't kill anyone. They one hundred percent did. Openly opened fire on civies, killed those who didn't leave, and condemned the rest to abuse and death in the wilderness.
And they didn't JUST do this to Monarchia either. Every major city on the planet, they did the same thing, turning the planet into a death world. Monarchia was simply the capital where the most death occurred.
@@Aizen2468 That's a fair point, the 13th are total shits for what they did to Monarchia, it just wasnt to the same level or scale as Russ's savages at Prospero, at least the 13th gave them a warning first. Doesnt make it right, but the Burning of Prospero was worse.
The burning of prospero was worse only in a sense that the wolves *loved* doing it.
Your reading is so extremely well balanced. Literally had several chills throughout. Its hugely inspired me to do lore videos, although for a different setting. Kudos!
Awesome! I was looking for something to listen to as I fall asleep. This is perfect. Thank you for your wonderful, soothing voice.
I am 1 hour 55 mins in and thinking "Damn this is intense". I don't play WH40K, or really have much to do with it, but it has been appearing in my recommended. I fell asleep earlier at some other video about 40K and woke up to the start of this. Now I am totally loving it. You tell a good tale sir!
> E orders the murder of Thunder Warriors
> E orders the murder of crusading Thousand Sons by other legions
> Istvann V happens
> surprised Pikachu Imperium
"so you read the horus heresy books for lore right?"
"right?"
I propose an Oculus drinking game. Drink a shot every time our favourite historator uses one of his most common phrases. Some suggestions:
Anything followed by "far from it"
Any use of the word "occluded"
"Squat/squatting amongst the stars"
Any other suggestions?
You forgot, "Know then."
You should do a series about the Razing of Monarchia
Oculus, I have an idea for a video. The story of the Veritas Ferrum? Iron Hands strike cruiser meant to be in the second wave at Istvaan, too heavily damaged at Callinedes. Rescued some salamanders and Raven guard, took out 3 emperors children ships on its own, was destroyed and resurrected as a daemon ship by Madail the Undivided who later took the Veritas on to the second battle of davin in Ruinstorm
Man at the two hour mark when the Thousand Sons finally strike, oof that was sick.
It's interesting to consider how differently this would have gone if Magnus had allowed his legion to fortify. Had the host needed to fight every step of the way to prospero, then fight a full fleet in orbit, then the legion on the surface, it really doesn't seem like they would have been victorious.
Magnus thought that doing so would seal his fate. If he offered no resistance, he thought that he'd be able to avoid summary execution and thus convince Big E of Horus's treachery.
@@joshuafischer684nah he wanted death. He thought russ would just exterminatus everything
@@vedsingh-bp2ke In fairness, Russ did try that first.
Magnus was an Alpha + level psyker. He could have obliterated most of the Censure Fleets ships in orbit, maybe excepting the ones carrying a lot of Silent Sisters.
If the XVth had prep time and fought no holds barred the Censure Fleet would have lost. The few that managed to even make landfall would have been annihilated.
The Thousand Sons were arguably the most powerful legion of all, despite being one of the smallest, taking their psychic powers into account.
The Wolves are just the XIIth wearing Fur Suits.
At least Angron has the excuse he has a rage engine hammered into his head.
Potentially unpopular opinion:
The space wolves should have been massacred by the thousand sons, and they would have, pretty easily, if Magnus didn’t let the censor fleet essentially get directly in his house before fighting back
More like an inarguable fact
100% agree. Home field advantage, not to mention their raw psychic power. Plus they'd have had Magnus on in the fight from the beginning. It would have been an absolute fuckin massacre. The wolves of fenris are VERY fortunate things worked out the way they did for them lol
YOOOOOOO 3 HOUR VID? looks like I found my chill out vid for the night
Listening to this while I cook a Thanksgiving hog. I didn't know about the strife on Terra during Magnus' naughty behavior. The little tidbits are one of the things that keeps me coming back to this channel. Keep up the good work Oculus!
I have waited several years for Oculus to complete this story. To me, this will be his magnum opus. Oculus is the gold standard by which all Warhammer lore channels should aspire to.
As a historic curiosity of point in time and place, had the Emperor sent the Iron Warriors instead of the wolves, what would have happened?
was Olympia already rebelling then? was Perturabo already sworn to the side of Horus? could Perturabo have made Magnus resign himself to be brought to Terra? or would things have gone even more different then as previously imagined?
My Lord Magnus.... I will forever play this every night for 9 years, for 9 months 9 weeks, 9 hours and 9 seconds.
and 9 days? @:^}
Fell asleep to the fall of Roman Britton, awoke to this.
I love my algorithm
I can only imagine Emperors reaction to Burning of Prospero
He didnt give a shit. Even told Malcador one loyal son destroyed disloyal .
The Burning of Prospero is one of those moments I always point to as an example of "Warhammer 40k has no good guys" when I'm introducing somebody new to the setting
Newbies: Space Marines are the good guys!
Space Wolves: Huh, that's a funny pronunciation of 'genocidal monsters'
Wow. This lengthy video will blow away even Leutins. And I thought no one could out-length his videos!! He has now been truly out matched!!
This is my second time listening to it. The first was in each segment and now the full thing in a whole. By far the best lore video on Prospero by a massive amount and the depth and delivery of the epic moments was phenomenal. Hope to see more of these for Beta Garmen, Pluto, the inter War on Mars, and ultimately Terra when the Seige series is done.
TLDR: Russ incinerated a planet because Magnus ghosted him and didn’t reply to his DMs.
This brought me near tears. If hollywood had the gutts to do so this narrative would be the best basis for a Warhammer 40,000 movie I can think of.
You did deepest justice in both audio quality as well as vast and exacting study of the subject.
Gods, I never realized that the 15th abroad in the galaxy were purged without hesitation. It really reminds me of a much crueler order 66. Just ally’s turning on comrades. Such was the horror of the heresy.
This was an amazing recounting of the event dude. Great work, and I’m looking forward to your future videos. Have a wonderful day.
They practically *earned* Istvaan 5 with that purge.
Great video, love your voice and dedication to the character. Loved it when you gagged near the end when saying "changer of ways", like a human in the Warhammer universe might struggle to utter even a nickname of one of the chaos gods
In my childhood I remember the beginnings of the Warhammer universe and whilst I could not afford much of either fantasy or 40k I do remember reading stories of The Emperor and the Horus Heresy in White Dwarf magazine which I could just about afford with my saved up pocket money. Learning more about the lore 40 years later I've come to realise there is nothing noble honourable or respectable about The Emperor, his cruelty and disdain for life is the equal of any of the Chaos gods and humanity under him with it's xenophobic purges is the equal of the tyranid swarm.
It took that cruelty to unite and hold what the imperium became.. if he was more cruel than he was the tragedy never would have happened. Part of 40k that you're missing was the emperor trying to preserve the human race and a whole.. it never would have survived to 40ks time if he hadn't achieved way he did. Yeah alot of brutal, cruel, and cold blooded but look what he's up against in the warhammer universe..
at any cost*
And probably like your childhood, GW products are still way too expensive 😂
Yeah, there are very few "good guys" in this setting. The Emperor is a neglectful narcissist and the whole Heresy was basically always bound to happen, sadly.
2 years on and i can still listen to this without pause.
A tidy compilation. Well done!
Something I appreciate about Occulus, is the details. Ever lore channel I can think of will talk in more broad strokes which is fine.
But I can’t stop thinking about the butchering of the PDF. The last stand of the soldiers managing to hold out against *space marines* for more than 10 minutes.
How Parley was requested by mortal commanders, and how the Transhuman attackers showed no mercy in kind.
I remember these details. It’s a testament to the script writing and voice acting talent displayed by the man, or people, running the show.
True, it really fleshes out the story and makes it so much more immersive
Just think, if Big E had let his super psyker son use the gifts HE WAS LITERALLY CREATED TO HAVE, everything could've been so different
I am surprised that the Death Guard and Mortarion were not also part of the censure. Why weren’t they?
They were already loyal to horus, and committed to shedding their "dead weight" at istvaan.
They werent available and Emps didnt want Magnus killed. Thats part of the tragedy here, this slaughter was totally uncalled for and turned a loyal son who had made a mistake and stood down to receive his punishment into another enemy.
Motarion was at the council. I still think its ridiculous they call it the council of niccea that's actually a famous christian event.
@@will-ob7pr its named after Nikea on purpose, warhammer 40k takes famous event names in real history all the time although really they shouldve reserved the name Nikea for a lorgar or ecclesiarchy related event
@@ultra-papasmurf That would be too on the nose. Determining a law or "canon" if you will for what to do with the most complex issue of the Pre-Heresy Imperium works pretty well as an analogue for Nicaea. Moreover, the result of both Nicaea and Nikea run in the face of what seems "logical", and were overwhelming wins for the opposition. Magnus' parallel Arius argued that Jesus had a beginning, as opposed to the dominant view, which was as part of the Holy Trinity, Jesus had always existed. To the non-Christian outside observer, the former seems self-evident. We, as the outside observers of Nikea can also see that had the Thousand Sons been permitted to continue to use their gifts, the Heresy may not have played out as it did.
There is also the interesting part of Arius' argument that The Father (God) is the only one that is infinite and divine, and that his Son (Jesus) was only made into God through the actions of The Father. Sounds familiar, hm?
I've fallen asleep and woken up to this like 30 times. I'll make it to the end eventually!
Russ' tragedy (if such it could be called, given how little he chafed under it) was that he was not able to freely choose to give his loyalty, for he was genetically bred to be absolutely loyal. He had no choice and thus, had no loyalty to demonstrate, only his complete subjection to his programming. The ways in which he chose to act under it, however, completely abnegate his pretensions to honour. He was always the greatest hypocrite.
Historitor, I once believed Russ to be a reluctant prosecutor of Horus' duping scheme, but you have laid out here that not only did he begin his mission prepared to kill his brother Primarch, he relished that chance.
As for Magnus - he sacrificed his world and most of his Legion in the pursuit of principles so lightly held, he abandoned them moments later as thoroughly as he did his people.
Here here!
Heretic logic
I come from a military family so I have a lot of relatives who were in the military but I’ll just mention the ones that fought
Grandpa 1: Vietnam
infantryman
Grandpa 2: desert storm
Combat engineer
Great grandpa: Korean War
Infantryman
Have any of you guy played the dawn of War game that starts with a chapter called The Blood Ravens and the mystery about them?
I got a new intercessor squad to paint, Oculus has a 4 hour video, let's goooooooo
Ok so I know there are many reasons why Russ and the stodes did what they did and magnus had plenty of mistakes but like Russ got straight duped here easily like way too easy big E usually doesn’t change orders on a whim kinda odd the Horus changed the order and leman Russ was just like ok.
I am So glas i found this chanel. First of all your vocabulary is unmatched. It paints a vivid picture and with the backround music rivals any big corporate production. Also your voice. You sound like you could be the son of Deckard Cain from the Diablo series, or some high cleric to a god of knowledge and learning in a D&D universe like The Forgotten Realms or Dragonlance (i like Fantastical fiction as much as grimdark and sci-fi lol). It's Scholarly but heavy with grave implications, full of Gravitas and somehow much more powerful than its low decibels would indicate😊. Well done sir, most definitly subscribed!
Well, guess I’m gonna listen to this again!
I wish I could give this an extra like for every time I watch it. Amazing work, absolute masterpiece
It has returned! Yes!
Invisible disabilities refers to things you physically cannot see (e.g. common mental health issues that go undiagnosed and untreated that render modern life too difficult to deal with, bi-polar, borderline personality disorder, severe ADHD, autism spectrum disorder, hell even depression) and people being unable to afford to even be diagnosed often turn to self medicating as a form of symptom relief which leads to addiction which after the first and second times trying a drug, is no longer a choice for most. Addiction is a physical change to your brain chemistry, it is incredibly difficult to treat even with modern medicin and should be thought of as a mental health issue instead of a willpower issue.
Most of these people are not homeless by choice, they are homeless because that's what they've been led to believe is their only option left in life
Sweet Omnissiah, almost four hours long!?
As always, you do magnificent work, Sir!
Amazing video, thank you for putting so much passion and work into making this. By far my favorite video you've made so far! 🙏
In any case, having Alpha Legion confront Thousand Sons and by extension, serving with Censure Hosts and empire's most secret assets (Ordo Sinister) would be can of worms even by W40k standards....