You can have any apologist to be your hero for Christ. But in the end they're all arguing for Christ. Without whom there's nothing to argue about. He gave them knowledge when they accept the Holy spirit. So all I want to say is. Let them be your guide but let your goal always be Jesus.
@@johnjaso385 I think you meant that theists have no substance and no foundation to stand on. We now know that God does not exist. This has been proven.
like how hawking thought that gravity existed outside and before the universe. or that black holes, are a portal. when we KNOW they are mass and gravity.
@@avigayilcohen5939 A Small question I keep asking our Materialist friends. How Do You Get Something From Nothing? From the answers I've gotten I can only assume they have never looked up the definition of the word Nothing.
@@stevenwiederholt7000 lack of anything. in other words, if you have space (something) you can get matter from nothing. but it is so tiny that it would impossible to even get matter the size of a grain of rice. but, that space is also something. here's another question, how would space even end? if it can't, there is a G-d.
I really like Dave Rubin. As a Christian myself, I find him to be very tolerant of people like me. I am thankful for that. He is interested in what is real and what is true.
Yes, agreed Dave and Milo are treasures and one can see their beauty masked in their current lives. They are coming out of the dark and into relationship.
@@SprayJones Dave and Milo are both basically alt-right talking point pushers at the end of the day. I wouldn't waste too much, if any, respect on those sort.
@Mas Gonderawi I'm not an Authoritarian or a Fascist so you are right, I am definitely to the left of Stalin. If you don't understand why I call them alt-right then you don't know very much about them.
I'm sure we could all be tolerant of believers if you all would keep it in your places of worship, as Dave said. Believe what you will, just don't bring it into a decidedly secular and pluralistic community by trying to impose your notions or values on others. How would you, a Christian, like living in a Islamic society that cuts heads off for insulting or betraying Islam?
I like John Lennox, would really like to meet him one day and have some conversation with him. It's very rare to find a well balanced and rounded scientist like him. I really thank God for him.
i thank God foe him too but i wonder when the westernes we prepare us, the Africans for such forum like this for we will soon need such as this reosion of faith in God is raging like wildfire and it can be contagious to get a lot on the dark side
@vikedude 123 I said "XTIAN" scholars. You conveniently ignore the fact they are xtian scholars because it means they've studied more in depth than you, which means they know that 2nd Peter WASN'T written by the apostle Peter. Gospels attributed to Peter were many after Jesus disappered. Many fakes and some have been recovered, analyzed and proven to be as fake as the canonised 2nd Peter. Materialist scholars not believing in persons/places from the past is irrelevant. Man used to believe the earth was the centre of the universe, that was ego driven but science happened. Mans (xtian) belief that God is a man is ego driven too. Many ancient traditions had the "god-man" or half animal/half huMAN god, all ego driven and ridiculous. Xtians are the holdouts, clinging to the "god-man" of antiquity. God is nothing like His creation. He gave man the slightest facsimile of His attributes, free will, mercy, kindness, anger, love etc, ( that's what "made in his image" means ) to test us in deeds. Clement sited one book attributed to Peter, there were many around at the time. Clement obviously didn't study, neither have you.
@vikedude 123 Reject the xtian scholars if you want, they still studied more than you. I don't need to know the canonization process, your xtian scholars DO and they know 2nd peter is fake. God sends Prophets to teach the people and those people are to obey the prophet and worship God alone. The "only true God" the father. (john 17 v3). An "imperfect community", like the children of Israel corrupted their scripture and killed the prophets that came to correct them. (Matthew 23) But not Jesus. "Lets say I'm an author.."? Let's say very few were literate until the start of public/secondary schools so couldn't read or control their own education. Enough time (centuries) to corrupt scripture that's already corrupted by the "killers of the prophets", and force it on, or indoctrinate illiterate peasants/peons. The persecution of xtians is no guarentee of the truth and it's clear man determined your canon, not God or a prophet of God. Canon is historical too as the councils took place IN history. Think! "Peter quotes paul", but Peter, the disciple of Jesus, DIDN'T write 2nd Peter, that's proven. You're using a forgery to prove something you can't prove. God will not accept wilful ignorance. He is one and you should worship Him alone without partners. No Greco-Roman Triad of gods, "mystery" Trinity, godhead or "god-man" hybrid. Worship Him alone. May Allah Subhanahu Wata 'ala guide you to the truth. Alhamdulillahi rabbi al'alameen
@vikedude 123 You don't care about the truth you care about your ego and emotions. Facts don't care about your emotions. Sorry 'bout that. You rely on scholars, so called "church fathers", for the early faith but chuck later xtian scholars, who have used modern science techniques and understanding to analyze your corrupted books, under the bus because you're not as educated and informed about the origins of your faith as they are. Poor you, all you have left is character assassination and pathetic tit-for-tat. Don't say, on judgement day, you weren't warned.
BriansWrld what is your definition of force? And do you think his debate partner was forcing his ideas or anybody in this comment section? Dude you were consumed by blind hate and hypocrisy... i’ve been following your comments as you were telling everyone they are forcing their beliefs on people because they want them to find what they have because they think it will make them happier. That’s not force. That’s compassion.
Me too! JP talks about the Logos (Word) a lot, but does he equate that to Jesus, or is he using it differently? I'd be interested to hear whether he thinks God might be personal, whether Jesus is in very nature God, but choosing not to exploit that, etc. JL would be a good person to present some different questions to him.
I love John Lennox. As a Northern Irish man myself it's not only amazing to hear his views and conversation (it's rare anyone of high standing is in the public eye as we're such a small country) but also about his upbringing and how he stood apart from those around him.
lennox is definitely an example of being unafraid, it motivates me to know that in college he used to debate about the subject of God and science. Especially in OXFORD! Sometimes we get intimidated by opposing views, but the knowledge God has revealed to him has helped me a lot. Thanks to God, I’ve read his books and seen his debates and no longer fear getting into the subject of science due to my lack of knowledge on the subject. This is coming from a christian from Mexico
My family and I were there live for this wonderful conversation. Lennox is a brilliant man of God who engages the mind. Rubin is full of courage and took a leap of faith out of his comfort zone for this. Much respect for all involved.
Greg Pearcey dude you’re such a piece of shit lol why are you going around insulting everybody? This guy didn’t say anything mean at all and you just insulted him. You’re just a bad person and is probably because you don’t have any moral compass because you don’t believe in god. Weird how atheist always say you don’t need God to be moral but almost all of you are terrible people. :(
Greg Pearcey wow man you’re so smart with this big words. He must have a really high IQ and that must be why you’re an atheist because you’re so smart 👏🏻
Miguel Cisneros If they debated, I agree. Professor John Lennox has debated these topics for decades. Against famous Atheist, Physicists, Mathematicians, and so forth. Although a conversation such as this would be awesome to.
Miguel Cisneros Damn dude no chill lol but yeah it kinda looks like that now although I haven’t payed much attention to Jordan at all recently. So truthfully I wouldn’t know
@Miguel Cisneros those were not debates. And they wouldn't debate. Peterson doesn't believe there is no God, and Zacharias, Craig, and Lennox have no need for debating Peterson's expertise. They all have respect for each other's studies. You can too.
Gruuvin1 Watching highly experienced Christian apologists go against ill-prepared atheists tends to become painful to watch in my opinion. I’ve seen Peterson make claims about the origins of about Christianity that are frankly painful because five minutes of research would have told him it wasn’t true. Like automatically assuming Jesus had been significantly mythologized in scripture without having done any research on relevant literary criticism. He should either stay in his field or take enough time that he can speak on it as least as intelligently as someone who has taken a couple undergraduate courses.
53:20 to 56:25 Stuff like this is what makes John Lennox my favorite apologist and speaker. The way he expresses the truth in love like from a grandfather to his grandkids... just wow 👏🏽 You can learn all the apologetics in the world, but there would never be another John Lennox
Someone needs to get Dave to read C.S. Lewis' "Mere Christianity" while he's open to the idea. That book, as simple as it is, made a world of difference for me and how I think about Christianity.
Man I hope he finds God, and it’s Jesus. Idc if he wants to stay married to a man. It’s not biblical but neither is pornography, when all Christians five that up then go after him on homosexual behavior.
@@jessejive117 What do you mean "find god"? You make it sound as if your god is missing or hiding. If god is so omni-present and powerful, its presence should be clear to all and easily theorised.
Dwywaith dair or you joking? I don’t know if you’re an atheist but that’s pretty stupid to not know what that expression means. I don’t know if you’re just trying to insult religious people and attack their ideas every turn you can but it just makes you look stupid when you act like you don’t understand something, because you clearly just misrepresented it intentionally which is a lie or you’re just being a moron... finding God means to find a believe in him and know him who he is personally and have a relationship with him. To let God change him and be a part of his life any of those is typically what that expression means.
Dwywaith dair I guess you heard some edgy atheist say that at one point and you thought it was so funny. Well making yourself look stupid isn’t funny if you want to convince people you’re right you might not want to act like you don’t understand what they’re talking about when it’s obvious. It just makes it seem like you want to attack anything religious people say and do just because their religious and that makes you look a logical and unreasonable and very very biased.
I Loved everything about this. Dave Rubin, on the hot seat as he was at times, handled it with humility, kindness, and thoughtfulness. John, in turn, sought to answer Dave's unasked questions in the most respectful, thoughtful, and least threatening manner imaginable. The moderator, while not holding back his beliefs, gave Dave plenty of respect and room to work through his thoughts and beliefs. I also want to acknowledge the guy with the sign, because sometimes the simplest method of conveyance can be the most powerful and effective. Thank you for this heartwarming and encouraging conversation.
This is SO good!!! John Lennox is painting a big red door that says “JESUS”, and pointing Rubin to choose Him. A simple, genuine presentation of the gospel to this man that God loves! 😀
David, from a 71 year old Middle Eastern follower of the messiah immigrant to US ... you’re a person integrity humility & honesty!! I am so excited for your amazing journey! Know that you ARE LOVED!
There's no flip in the tolerance of True Christians, we've always been loving and tolerant. I'm grateful that the truth is becoming evident for truth seekers.
I always tell people that Christian means like Christ, and Jesus healed the ear of the guy who was taking him to get executed... so it's a high standard to live up to because it is so extremely loving and tolerant.
Someone else nailed it as well. Romans 1:15-:30 is where Dave rubin and JLPeterson has reconstituted that society is heading. But a-theism won't get you to truth , the Truth gets you to the truth.
I love Dave's state of uncertainty and desire to learn. He's treating truth as a vector more than a destination, which is what science should do. But his attitude speaks to a deeper humility that more Christians need to hold -- a desire to know more of God's wisdom and not to think that they have it all figured out. Becoming a Christian and dedicating our lives to Christ's work is only the beginning. We need to go the entire distance.
According to the Oxford Dictionary, as a noun vector means "a quantity having direction as well as magnitude, especially as determining the position of one point in space relative to another." And as a verb it means to "direct (an aircraft in flight) to a desired point." So I don't think we should be ever learning but never arriving. However there is one rarely preached on passage that especially underscores the need for humility in learning: 1 Corinthians 8:1 "...Knowledge puffs up, but love edifies. 2 And if anyone thinks that he knows anything, he knows nothing yet as he ought to know. 3 But if anyone loves God, this one is known by Him."
@@donblosser8720 Thanks! So long as we remain in this physical universe, we will never arrive at truth. As Christ said, the truth will set you free, and the moment you arrive at truth, you are free of this physical universe. Well, that's my current understanding. And thanks for the definition of vector -- one I've read many times, and which applies as used, but with an expanded sense on the word "space." And finally, thank you for the verses. Very inspiring.
So weak, believers always want to get some backing, by asking: do you believe in god, like they always asked Jordan Peterson. They were hoping to hear, yes, I believe exactly in the same god and religion as you do. If not, they feel rejected and frustrated, even though one is a believer but of another kind. They wanted him on board as a torch carrier, bringing out their group-light to the world. It's not a sign of profound belief when you have to earn more believers to diminish your own doubts
@@j.h252 We don't feel rejected nor frustrated, after all it is not us they're rejecting but God. It is compassion that we feel for those that reject the God of love, truth and goodness. Good program, hope you saw it from beginning to end. Peace.
@@genzcappa8631 A very serious question indeed. 2,000 years ago a man asked Jesus, "quid est veritas"? Translated: "what is truth" ? The irony of that scene/question is that Pilate was staring at Jesus himself, who is The Truth, in the face - and completely missed it. Do research for yourself and once you come to the end of your search, your questions will be answered. I wish you success on your quest.
John Lennox is a very erudite man. Dave Rubin is a smart guy, who is respectful, genuinely curious, and a good thinker in his own right. I would love to meet either one of these individuals (and speak with them).
Julian W I think he is in the sense that he listens and interacts with opposing views and ideas. He processes things and discusses things. We are all at different levels of knowledge and intellect.
Excellent presentation! John Lennox is superb, and Dave Rubin is simply adorable! Love to watch him in his intellectual/ spiritual journey to which he brings a truly honest and open mind. Both fine examples of true searching in a confused, dogmatic world. Bravo!
A gay atheist having open and vulnerable dialogue with a Christian apologist in a respectful way. This is a great example of world views colliding but in an mature way. Maybe you don’t like Rubin- that’s 100% fine- but I think he is a fantastic example on what we need more of in today’s politically charged climate- discourse.
John Lennox just makes you feel calm. It really hit when he said that he tried to befriend people who have different worldviews than him. That’s a good thing to do.
Thanks dave I was just like you. I had a child out of wedlock and was living with another woman and I liked to wave at Jesus too. Until one day I decided to carry my cross like your friend Jordan says. So now I live a straight life. Oops no pun intended
How can you compare that..... Think it deeply.....peterson merely a human being just like you brother......I think you would be better than peterson. ................ But you know who CHRIST is..... HE is for PAST PRESENT and FUTURE. ............... Jeremiah 1:5 5 Before I formed thee in the belly I knew thee; and before thou camest forth out of the womb I sanctified thee, and I ordained thee a prophet unto the nations. ......... And you know for present and for future..... ................... There is nothing that have human being which is not available in GOD.....for that reason we should follow the human being. ............... JESUS LOVES you. I love you.
Very well put, Lisa. Ignore negative comments. I know exactly what you meant. Jordan Peterson can give your day to day grind a great deal of meaning. Jesus Christ, our Lord and Savior, is the best possible example of how we are to treat others.
@@brianfinnegan664 Dr Strange knows the 1 out of 14million futures where the Avengers can defeat Thanos using the time stone, why can't an all powered God who created space and time knows everyone in the past, present and future personally?
"I'm in it just like you guys, I'm trying to find some truth in the madness" DR One of the most honest statement I heard recently when it comes to our humanity, faith e our shared destiny. There might be many beliefs and understandings, many philosophical thinking and ideologies but only one planet. You have got to come back to Reason and true love! Great debate
Im happily surprise at the openness humility and affable personality of Rubin, found the guy really sharp and non-pretentious genuinely engaging , way smarter and engaging than the average pod-caste , he made this show (along with Lennox whos is a genius) really entertaining , congrats Justin.
Civil discourse of life's most important questions from two distinct world views. No one got hurt and no need for counseling. There may be hope after all!
@Md.Bahroz Badur Ali I see. Well I kind of disagree. I heard Craig call out Jordan several times in that debate. Yes, there was 3 of them up there, but it was still good for Jordan.
@@brando3342 Haha, I see. Well, I should say that you don't disagree with me considering that I agree with you on the fact that he did call him out but I want this kind of debate between them, it's better.
I hope he would but I doubt it...Christianity requires a lot of personal sacrifice, I doubt Dave would be willing to confront the sinful nature of his marriage, I hope he can but that kind of thing is a monumental hurdle.
Great Conversation John and Dave, reverberating the fact that, "common sense" becomes "uncommon sense". In discussions with like minded colleagues it would be absolutely fantastic for you John and Jordan Peterson to sit down and "break bread". In fact a round table discussion with with you Dave, John, Jordan in a meaningful debate with Michael Schermer, Sam Harris, and Richard Dawkins. A venue of the highest validity with Joe Rogan perhaps. Gentlemen I appreciate your lives....all the best
Right on! I have been praying for Dave for well over a year and he is well on his way to meeting Yeshua. Have been praying for Jordan too and he is coming in the boat also. Dave has a destiny to be a thought leader and Christian reformer. Will be watching his life just like Kanye's.
That sounds silly. Why do you have to pray for over a year? Shouldn't be a single prayer enough? Heck, with an all-knowing deity you wouldn't even need to pray in the first place. He would already know.
To think great mind are only those we can see on the surface. John Lenox's father sounds like a very interesting man. To think there are a lot of great mind out there appeared just like an ordinary people.
I love the internet. I had my red pill moment watching an episode of The Rubin Report with Ben Shapiro who introduced me to Michael Shermer who introduced me to Frank Turek who introduced me to Justin Brierly and now I’m here. My world opened up x100 since going into this rabbit hole. Eternally grateful to all these people. But most of all God for giving us our minds
Interesting - I had the exact opposite experience. I was born & raised in a Christian home and was never taught how to think but rather taught what to think. Once I looked at my reasons for “believing”, I discovered I had no good reason to believe. My red pill moment led to atheism but I still enjoy hearing both sides.
i had a cat that found me in life ,while i was too busy to see her. she taught me some simple lessons that to this day i wish i would of pet that cat. she was less than 10 lbs of pure confidence and motherhood(about 5 kittens she brought w her) she intentionally found her place at my home with more than 5 dogs while not scared of all of there threats. Dr. Lennox is a great teacher what we don't see here is the many languages he can speak to teach the places he understood the pain from.
Just like me, this patient presenter really wishes that Rubin get to at least one solid argument or decisive opinion, while mr. Lennox time and again ties all Rubin's gibberish strings together. Hats off to both mr. Lennox and the program presenter.
As a Christian I wish they hadn’t bugged Dave so much about what he believes. He made his beliefs very clear from the beginning so I can see why he was tired of it by the end of this. I’ve been watching his show for quite a while now and the evolution of faith he is undergoing is evident, and ongoing. He’s been very open about that. Let’s not badger him with the same question asked a dozen different ways.
Evolution doesnt require faith, for it is loaded with supporting evidence, please educate yourself in Science. Not all Christians Deny evolution, just the ignorant ones with their head in the sand. See Francis Collins, one of the Top Evolutionary Biologists in North America... and he's a christian. You're welcome...
@@badideass I said nothing at all about evolution requiring faith. In fact, I said nothing about evolution at all. Read my comment again. I was clearly talking about how Dave's FAITH has evolved, and is still evolving. You not only completely misunderstood what I said, but you did so while being a total jerk. Apology accepted. Now get lost.
The humility of British Christians really impresses me as an American. American Christian leaders seem to often carry a spirit of pride in knowing the truth, instead of humbly compelling those to look at the evidence and the man of Jesus. (There are exceptions obviously.)
A lovely Boxing Day watch. Dave is opening and is interacting with people who live their faith as best they can. Is that not being human: we are vulnerable and letting go of one thing that has given us a foundation and embracing a new foundation is a vast space until we embrace it and then it is an elegantly simple process. The world became flesh which we celebrated yesterday and today we begin again.
Why won't Evangelical Christians open up and interact with people who are openly gay and proud. Why don't they open up and interact with people who KNOW that homosexuality is natural and not a sin. Why does openness and interaction only go one way? From atheist to religious? From homosexuality to heterosexuality?
I love how John Lennox brings it home to God NOT being some impersonal idea but a personal unique eternal God. Jordan & other philosophers seek to dehumanize or seclarize God to a god. they seem to shrink God to merely an idea it is okay to think about. Faith in God is far different than faith in "a faith". No one should trust in a faith but there is no saving grace without a saving faith which is bound to God. This is why so many feel comfortable with talking about God, whom they actually make the generic "god", but refuse to mention Jesus.
Maybe it's just me but it seems to me, Lennox and Rubin are talking about 2 completely different things. Lennox is talking about intrinsic religion, the validity ot religion where as Rubin is talking about extrinsic religion, basically religion as means to culture andbpoltics...
You're right in many ways. Dave and Jordan Peterson see the value of Christian Laws and their benefits, while John Lennox longs for Christ Himself. Many in the church don't even get to Dave's level, let alone beyond it. I pray for our ever-deepening desire for relationship with our Creator. It's time to be the light of the world.
Ya...my thought as well. They weren't on the same page. Dave had nothing to say after John mentioned how much he appreciated jewish high holy days like Yom Kippur. John the gentile "gets it" ...for Dave the jew its still a complete mystery but he did genuinely seem to enjoy going to synagogue with Dennis Prager. I dont think Dave was actually listening to John...he was too busy thinking about things he would say next.
I think a better way to phrase it is they are talking about the same thing, but they are approaching that thing from two different angles. It seems to me that behind what they both speak about is the person of Jesus Christ, even though it seems that Dave is somewhat just beginning the journey that will eventually lead to at its Foundation the person of Jesus Christ. And I think it's somewhere beautiful that Lennox didn't try to beat Rubin over the head with that, he's talking WITH him and befriending him and allowing him to come to that realization himself, which really is the best form of persuasion. We've all learned that you can't necessarily talk someone into believing something different. People have to experience it for themselves. As Rubin points out, the plight of post-modernism is the fact that at its root is the fact that there is no Foundation to stand on, it's purely subjective. To me that means that he will continue to search for that Foundation as he has pointed out he will. So he may only be able to speak of extrinsic religion , but if he continues to search and seek the foundation of that extrinsic religion and the foundation upon which it stands, I think he will eventually be speaking the same language that Lennox is speaking. And I think Lennox wisely recognizes this.
Very open and very humble. Extremely rare to find a wise secular person like David. I find the majority of the new atheists have a personal vendetta against God, I.e. they’re in a homosexual relationship and try to intellectually debunk God to allow for their lifestyle to continue. Other atheists like Dawkins have too much to lose if they began to search for God. For some atheists, their identity, career, as well as reputation has been built on being an advocate outspoken atheist.
"If I were not a Catholic, and were looking for the true Church in the world today, I would look for the one Church which did not get along well with the world; in other words, I would look for the Church which the world hated. My reason for doing this would be, that if Christ is in any one of the churches of the world today, He must still be hated as He was when He was on earth in the flesh. If you would find Christ today, then find the Church that does not get along with the world. Look for the Church that is hated by the world as Christ was hated by the world. Look for the Church that is accused of being behind the times, as our Lord was accused of being ignorant and never having learned. Look for the Church which men sneer at as socially inferior, as they sneered at Our Lord because He came from Nazareth. Look for the Church which is accused of having a devil, as Our Lord was accused of being possessed by Beelzebub, the Prince of Devils. Look for the Church which, in seasons of bigotry, men say must be destroyed in the name of God as men crucified Christ and thought they had done a service to God. Look for the Church which the world rejects because it claims it is infallible, as Pilate rejected Christ because He called Himself the Truth. Look for the Church which is rejected by the world as Our Lord was rejected by men. Look for the Church which amid the confusions of conflicting opinions, its members love as they love Christ, and respect its Voice as the very voice of its Founder, and the suspicion will grow, that if the Church is unpopular with the spirit of the world, then it is unworldly, and if it is unworldly it is other worldly. since it is other-worldly, it is infinitely loved and infinitely hated as was Christ Himself. But only that which is Divine can be infinitely hated and infinitely loved. Therefore the Church is Divine." Fulton J Sheen ... Point Rubin made on 'Hatred'
must be a while since this was done Rubin already had Ravi on the Rubin report. He promised Ravi he would do his best to bring Jordan Peterson and him together after Ravi expressed a great desire that that would happen. Rubin is a nice guy
My note, 11:10 John Lenox's father's world view, "I believe that every person what ever they believe is of infinite value because they're made in the image of God." Gin,
![Lp. Сердце Вселенной #60 РОЖДЕНИЕ ЛОЛОЛОШКИ [Финал] • Майнкрафт](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/YoR0pAV9FVQ/mqdefault.jpg)
I love John Lennox, he’s like the cheerful Irish grandpa we all wish we had.
Megan Lukes He can come over for Christmas as long as he doesn't teach math.
Lennox is an incoherent presuppositional Christian apologist who I gather can only be understood by like-minded presuppositional Christians.
Greg Pearcey Name an incoherent statement he has made. Just one. Anything at all. Please.
Greg Pearcey Also, if you can't understand Professor Lennox... that doesn't shine well on your intelligence.
@@AudioGardenSlave123 36:15 to 39:45, for example. WTF am I supposed to take away from that rambling?
"I'm not Jewish by background, but I owe everything to a Jew" -John Lennox. Powerful statement.
lol
I'm confused by your comment. I found his statement to respectful to Mr.Rubin's heritage and deeply profound in terms of personal spirituality.
Dr. B some people feel better abt themselves by marginalizing others...ignore the nihilism?
Dr. B But Jews don’t believe that he was Son of “GOD”😂
Everybody does ... they own the banks!
John Lennox is arguably one of the best Christian apologetics of the 21st century.
You can have any apologist to be your hero for Christ. But in the end they're all arguing for Christ. Without whom there's nothing to argue about. He gave them knowledge when they accept the Holy spirit. So all I want to say is. Let them be your guide but let your goal always be Jesus.
I thought about Ravi , but learned he was not above reproach. But God still uses us.
I totally disagree. Most of his arguments have been refuted by the younger and more thoughtful atheists.
@@whittfamily1 insults are all an atheist has. No substance and no foundation to stand on.
@@johnjaso385 I think you meant that theists have no substance and no foundation to stand on. We now know that God does not exist. This has been proven.
“When people stop believing in God, they don't believe in nothing.....they believe in anything.”
GK Chesterton
👏
@William Oarlock
I have been told the Even Trolls Like Rock & Roll. Is That True?
like how hawking thought that gravity existed outside and before the universe. or that black holes, are a portal. when we KNOW they are mass and gravity.
@@avigayilcohen5939
A Small question I keep asking our Materialist friends. How Do You Get Something From Nothing? From the answers I've gotten I can only assume they have never looked up the definition of the word Nothing.
@@stevenwiederholt7000 lack of anything. in other words, if you have space (something) you can get matter from nothing. but it is so tiny that it would impossible to even get matter the size of a grain of rice. but, that space is also something. here's another question, how would space even end? if it can't, there is a G-d.
I really like Dave Rubin. As a Christian myself, I find him to be very tolerant of people like me. I am thankful for that. He is interested in what is real and what is true.
Yes, agreed Dave and Milo are treasures and one can see their beauty masked in their current lives. They are coming out of the dark and into relationship.
@@SprayJones Dave and Milo are both basically alt-right talking point pushers at the end of the day. I wouldn't waste too much, if any, respect on those sort.
@Mas Gonderawi I'm not an Authoritarian or a Fascist so you are right, I am definitely to the left of Stalin. If you don't understand why I call them alt-right then you don't know very much about them.
I'm sure we could all be tolerant of believers if you all would keep it in your places of worship, as Dave said. Believe what you will, just don't bring it into a decidedly secular and pluralistic community by trying to impose your notions or values on others. How would you, a Christian, like living in a Islamic society that cuts heads off for insulting or betraying Islam?
@@timediverx I trust you can cite a thing Dave Rubin has said that would qualify as alt-right....? I'll wait....!
I like John Lennox, would really like to meet him one day and have some conversation with him. It's very rare to find a well balanced and rounded scientist like him. I really thank God for him.
i thank God foe him too but i wonder when the westernes we prepare us, the Africans for such forum like this for we will soon need such as this reosion of faith in God is raging like wildfire and it can be contagious to get a lot on the dark side
@vikedude 123
Unfortunately, 2nd peter is considered a forgery by most xtian scholars. Now what.
Go google.
@vikedude 123
I said "XTIAN" scholars.
You conveniently ignore the fact they are xtian scholars because it means they've studied more in depth than you, which means they know that 2nd Peter WASN'T written by the apostle Peter.
Gospels attributed to Peter were many after Jesus disappered. Many fakes and some have been recovered, analyzed and proven to be as fake as the canonised 2nd Peter.
Materialist scholars not believing in persons/places from the past is irrelevant.
Man used to believe the earth was the centre of the universe, that was ego driven but science happened.
Mans (xtian) belief that God is a man is ego driven too. Many ancient traditions had the "god-man" or half animal/half huMAN god, all ego driven and ridiculous.
Xtians are the holdouts, clinging to the "god-man" of antiquity.
God is nothing like His creation.
He gave man the slightest facsimile of His attributes, free will, mercy, kindness, anger, love etc, ( that's what "made in his image" means ) to test us in deeds.
Clement sited one book attributed to Peter, there were many around at the time. Clement obviously didn't study, neither have you.
@vikedude 123
Reject the xtian scholars if you want, they still studied more than you.
I don't need to know the canonization process, your xtian scholars DO and they know 2nd peter is fake.
God sends Prophets to teach the people and those people are to obey the prophet and worship God alone. The "only true God" the father. (john 17 v3).
An "imperfect community", like the children of Israel corrupted their scripture and killed the prophets that came to correct them. (Matthew 23) But not Jesus.
"Lets say I'm an author.."?
Let's say very few were literate until the start of public/secondary schools so couldn't read or control their own education.
Enough time (centuries) to corrupt scripture that's already corrupted by the "killers of the prophets", and force it on, or indoctrinate illiterate peasants/peons.
The persecution of xtians is no guarentee of the truth and it's clear man determined your canon, not God or a prophet of God.
Canon is historical too as the councils took place IN history.
Think!
"Peter quotes paul", but Peter, the disciple of Jesus, DIDN'T write 2nd Peter, that's proven.
You're using a forgery to prove something you can't prove.
God will not accept wilful ignorance. He is one and you should worship Him alone without partners.
No Greco-Roman Triad of gods, "mystery" Trinity, godhead or "god-man" hybrid. Worship Him alone.
May Allah Subhanahu Wata 'ala guide you to the truth.
Alhamdulillahi rabbi al'alameen
@vikedude 123
You don't care about the truth you care about your ego and emotions.
Facts don't care about your emotions. Sorry 'bout that.
You rely on scholars, so called "church fathers", for the early faith but chuck later xtian scholars, who have used modern science techniques and understanding to analyze your corrupted books, under the bus because you're not as educated and informed about the origins of your faith as they are.
Poor you, all you have left is character assassination and pathetic tit-for-tat.
Don't say, on judgement day, you weren't warned.
God is pursuing you, Dave.
Is dave pushing his world view onto people
Does dave push his worldview onto people
BriansWrld Yes, I would say that Dave is a strong and relentless advocate for his world view. It is what he does for a living😂
@@zwatwashdc yes but he doesn't force it on anyone
BriansWrld what is your definition of force? And do you think his debate partner was forcing his ideas or anybody in this comment section? Dude you were consumed by blind hate and hypocrisy... i’ve been following your comments as you were telling everyone they are forcing their beliefs on people because they want them to find what they have because they think it will make them happier. That’s not force. That’s compassion.
Pray for Dave Rubin!! May God show Him the truth! Glad he is seeking again!
Which God?
Sorry, what is the truth exactly?
@@supercoupe86 There is no way to prove or disprove the existence of a god. The only truly honest answer is, "I don't know."
@@supercoupe86 One of these two statements is true: "A god exists." or "No god exists." I am afraid that is as far as I can break it down.
@@danielbassett1076 generally speaking atheists dont assert a god doesn't exist. It's not accepting the proposition that a god exists
Dave Rubin is really hitting his stride. It’s been so great to see. And of course, John Lennox is amazing. Never tire of hearing his brilliance.
I would love to watch a conversation between John Lennox and Jordan Peterson.
Me too! JP talks about the Logos (Word) a lot, but does he equate that to Jesus, or is he using it differently? I'd be interested to hear whether he thinks God might be personal, whether Jesus is in very nature God, but choosing not to exploit that, etc. JL would be a good person to present some different questions to him.
Its on jordans youtube channel now🙂
I love John Lennox. As a Northern Irish man myself it's not only amazing to hear his views and conversation (it's rare anyone of high standing is in the public eye as we're such a small country) but also about his upbringing and how he stood apart from those around him.
lennox is definitely an example of being unafraid, it motivates me to know that in college he used to debate about the subject of God and science. Especially in OXFORD! Sometimes we get intimidated by opposing views, but the knowledge God has revealed to him has helped me a lot. Thanks to God, I’ve read his books and seen his debates and no longer fear getting into the subject of science due to my lack of knowledge on the subject. This is coming from a christian from Mexico
Rubin showed great humility. God loves a humble person.
He might if he existed
Dave is gay God doesnt love him.
@@tornasukiii745 what a tolerant God it is u worship
@@brianfinnegan664 Im an atheist just like Dave is
@@tornasukiii745 me too
My family and I were there live for this wonderful conversation. Lennox is a brilliant man of God who engages the mind. Rubin is full of courage and took a leap of faith out of his comfort zone for this. Much respect for all involved.
Lennox is an incoherent presuppositional Christian apologist. You must be too if you think him 'brilliant'.
Greg Pearcey I see your commenting the same pseudo intellectual comment everywhere hahaha
Greg Pearcey dude you’re such a piece of shit lol why are you going around insulting everybody? This guy didn’t say anything mean at all and you just insulted him. You’re just a bad person and is probably because you don’t have any moral compass because you don’t believe in god. Weird how atheist always say you don’t need God to be moral but almost all of you are terrible people. :(
Greg Pearcey this guy complemented the Christian and he complemented the atheist and then you acted like a shitty person.
@@jessejive117 Read your last three posts in this thread and tell us again who is the 'piece of shit'/'bad person'.
Love Lennox! Can't wait to hear him interact with Rubin.
Maybe listen before you comment
I can barely tolerate Lennox's mostly incoherent presuppositional apologetics, and voice because of it.
@@notwhatiwasraised2b who are you talking about?
@@notwhatiwasraised2b k thanks for the incoherent input bud
Greg Pearcey wow man you’re so smart with this big words. He must have a really high IQ and that must be why you’re an atheist because you’re so smart 👏🏻
Up Next: John Lennox & Jordan Peterson
Miguel Cisneros If they debated, I agree.
Professor John Lennox has debated these topics for decades. Against famous Atheist, Physicists, Mathematicians, and so forth. Although a conversation such as this would be awesome to.
Miguel Cisneros Damn dude no chill lol but yeah it kinda looks like that now although I haven’t payed much attention to Jordan at all recently. So truthfully I wouldn’t know
@Miguel Cisneros those were not debates. And they wouldn't debate. Peterson doesn't believe there is no God, and Zacharias, Craig, and Lennox have no need for debating Peterson's expertise. They all have respect for each other's studies. You can too.
Consummate Professor vs. Irish Grandpa
Gruuvin1 Watching highly experienced Christian apologists go against ill-prepared atheists tends to become painful to watch in my opinion. I’ve seen Peterson make claims about the origins of about Christianity that are frankly painful because five minutes of research would have told him it wasn’t true. Like automatically assuming Jesus had been significantly mythologized in scripture without having done any research on relevant literary criticism. He should either stay in his field or take enough time that he can speak on it as least as intelligently as someone who has taken a couple undergraduate courses.
53:20 to 56:25
Stuff like this is what makes John Lennox my favorite apologist and speaker. The way he expresses the truth in love like from a grandfather to his grandkids... just wow 👏🏽
You can learn all the apologetics in the world, but there would never be another John Lennox
praise God for that! John Lennox really got his wisdom from God and he's convincing a lot!
The definition of faith full of love
Someone needs to get Dave to read C.S. Lewis' "Mere Christianity" while he's open to the idea. That book, as simple as it is, made a world of difference for me and how I think about Christianity.
Man I hope he finds God, and it’s Jesus. Idc if he wants to stay married to a man. It’s not biblical but neither is pornography, when all Christians five that up then go after him on homosexual behavior.
@@jessejive117 What do you mean "find god"? You make it sound as if your god is missing or hiding. If god is so omni-present and powerful, its presence should be clear to all and easily theorised.
Dwywaith dair or you joking? I don’t know if you’re an atheist but that’s pretty stupid to not know what that expression means. I don’t know if you’re just trying to insult religious people and attack their ideas every turn you can but it just makes you look stupid when you act like you don’t understand something, because you clearly just misrepresented it intentionally which is a lie or you’re just being a moron... finding God means to find a believe in him and know him who he is personally and have a relationship with him. To let God change him and be a part of his life any of those is typically what that expression means.
Dwywaith dair I guess you heard some edgy atheist say that at one point and you thought it was so funny. Well making yourself look stupid isn’t funny if you want to convince people you’re right you might not want to act like you don’t understand what they’re talking about when it’s obvious. It just makes it seem like you want to attack anything religious people say and do just because their religious and that makes you look a logical and unreasonable and very very biased.
@@jessejive117
You could use charity in your truth. That's how you touch those who haven't found the truth of Christ.
I pray that Dave Rubin gets saved by believing in the gospel at some point
Me, too!
Me too.
Throw $5 at him and he will.
What does he need to be saved from.
aarondavid826 Lol I was thinking the same thing, sadly.
I Loved everything about this. Dave Rubin, on the hot seat as he was at times, handled it with humility, kindness, and thoughtfulness. John, in turn, sought to answer Dave's unasked questions in the most respectful, thoughtful, and least threatening manner imaginable. The moderator, while not holding back his beliefs, gave Dave plenty of respect and room to work through his thoughts and beliefs. I also want to acknowledge the guy with the sign, because sometimes the simplest method of conveyance can be the most powerful and effective. Thank you for this heartwarming and encouraging conversation.
megalopolis2015 Rubin is very humble. That is so rare this days
Absolutely agree with you! God is pursuing Dave.
I found Justin off-putting. It was like he was trying to convert Dave on stage -- completely inappropriate.
This is SO good!!! John Lennox is painting a big red door that says “JESUS”, and pointing Rubin to choose Him. A simple, genuine presentation of the gospel to this man that God loves! 😀
David, from a 71 year old Middle Eastern follower of the messiah immigrant to US ... you’re a person integrity humility & honesty!! I am so excited for your amazing journey! Know that you ARE LOVED!
WOW! I love the ongoing journey where Dave Rubin is at. His energy, humility, openness, willingness, and reasoning. (12/2/19)
John Lennox is so impressive. Love his thought and speech. Great man.
This was a SUPERB matchup in terms if picking the right people for great synergy! Loved it!
It appears Dave rubin is on the possibility side. There is the hard a-Theists and the nonchalant atheists that could claim agnosticism (undecided)
There's no flip in the tolerance of True Christians, we've always been loving and tolerant. I'm grateful that the truth is becoming evident for truth seekers.
I always tell people that Christian means like Christ, and Jesus healed the ear of the guy who was taking him to get executed... so it's a high standard to live up to because it is so extremely loving and tolerant.
John Lennox is quite persuasive in his own special way and I know that God uses him in these settings.
Someone else nailed it as well. Romans 1:15-:30 is where Dave rubin and JLPeterson has reconstituted that society is heading. But a-theism won't get you to truth , the Truth gets you to the truth.
@@abashedsanctimony154 atheism is truth
@@yamnaya88 Really, explain?
@@pasainchina97 All religions are ancient lies and have no proof to back them up. Just because of that it's the most logical choice to be an atheist.
@@AnarchoPunkChad It's objectively correct you brainwashed fool.
I love Dave's state of uncertainty and desire to learn. He's treating truth as a vector more than a destination, which is what science should do. But his attitude speaks to a deeper humility that more Christians need to hold -- a desire to know more of God's wisdom and not to think that they have it all figured out. Becoming a Christian and dedicating our lives to Christ's work is only the beginning. We need to go the entire distance.
According to the Oxford Dictionary, as a noun vector means "a quantity having direction as well as magnitude, especially as determining the position of one point in space relative to another." And as a verb it means to "direct (an aircraft in flight) to a desired point."
So I don't think we should be ever learning but never arriving. However there is one rarely preached on passage that especially underscores the need for humility in learning:
1 Corinthians 8:1 "...Knowledge puffs up, but love edifies. 2 And if anyone thinks that he knows anything, he knows nothing yet as he ought to know. 3 But if anyone loves God, this one is known by Him."
@@donblosser8720 Thanks! So long as we remain in this physical universe, we will never arrive at truth. As Christ said, the truth will set you free, and the moment you arrive at truth, you are free of this physical universe. Well, that's my current understanding. And thanks for the definition of vector -- one I've read many times, and which applies as used, but with an expanded sense on the word "space."
And finally, thank you for the verses. Very inspiring.
Rubin is ever getting closer to meeting The Truth. Pray for him.
Yeah, no. I'll pray he stops supporting evil and putting kids in cages but that it.
So weak, believers always want to get some backing,
by asking: do you believe in god, like they always asked Jordan Peterson. They were hoping to hear, yes, I believe exactly in the same god and religion as you do. If not, they feel rejected and frustrated, even though one is a believer but of another kind. They wanted him on board as a torch carrier, bringing out their group-light to the world. It's not a sign of profound belief when you have to earn more believers to diminish your own doubts
@@j.h252 We don't feel rejected nor frustrated, after all it is not us they're rejecting but God. It is compassion that we feel for those that reject the God of love, truth and goodness. Good program, hope you saw it from beginning to end. Peace.
How are you so certain you know the truth?
@@genzcappa8631 A very serious question indeed. 2,000 years ago a man asked Jesus, "quid est veritas"? Translated: "what is truth" ? The irony of that scene/question is that Pilate was staring at Jesus himself, who is The Truth, in the face - and completely missed it. Do research for yourself and once you come to the end of your search, your questions will be answered. I wish you success on your quest.
Praying that Jesus keeps pursuing Dave Rubin. He seems so close!
Dave Rubin is so open. Prayers for his journey will be completed in accepting Christ❤.
He's also an openly gay man.
John Lennox is a very erudite man.
Dave Rubin is a smart guy, who is respectful, genuinely curious, and a good thinker in his own right.
I would love to meet either one of these individuals (and speak with them).
Sheldon Berg Dave Rubin isn't a thinker.
Julian W I think he is in the sense that he listens and interacts with opposing views and ideas. He processes things and discusses things. We are all at different levels of knowledge and intellect.
Lennox believes some whacky things tho
Excellent presentation! John Lennox is superb, and Dave Rubin is simply adorable! Love to watch him in his intellectual/ spiritual journey to which he brings a truly honest and open mind. Both fine examples of true searching in a confused, dogmatic world. Bravo!
I love John Lennox. He's brilliant and kind.
I really enjoy Dave. He’s so reasonable and authentic.
Are you serious? hahahahaha
Authentic like a commercial.
A gay atheist having open and vulnerable dialogue with a Christian apologist in a respectful way. This is a great example of world views colliding but in an mature way. Maybe you don’t like Rubin- that’s 100% fine- but I think he is a fantastic example on what we need more of in today’s politically charged climate- discourse.
Lol, he's a fraud.
LOL, David was such a good sport and so respectful despite all the "grilling" ;)
Can I just adopt John Lennox as my grandpa love the way he spoke so brilliantly and almost led Dave to Christ!!
I was Rubin not that long ago, a doubting Thomas, not knowing what it looks like. I pray that soon he sees as I now see, the Truth Jesus Is.
John Lennox just makes you feel calm. It really hit when he said that he tried to befriend people who have different worldviews than him. That’s a good thing to do.
Thanks dave I was just like you. I had a child out of wedlock and was living with another woman and I liked to wave at Jesus too. Until one day I decided to carry my cross like your friend Jordan says. So now I live a straight life. Oops no pun intended
I admire and great respect for Dr. John Lennox. God bless him.
Didn't expect to see these two sit down together. Very nice.
So long awaited! This is thrilling! Yes, Dave-do it every year! We would love it!
This channel is great!
I love Dave, great man. It is beautiful to see how God draws people to himself!
I love Dave's honesty and transparency in this forum. He is really on a faith journey.
I am becoming more and more a fan of Dave Rubin. You're very open-minded and I believe God is guiding your steps in the right direction.
Dave Rubin is a grifter who will say almost anything for a paycheck
So Happy for You Dave & Thank You for sharing your journey with Us ☺️💝🤗 I Love You John Lennox your helping my faith sooooooo Much 🙏💝
I’m a huge fan of both! I wish we had more people like them.
May God have mercy on Dave to open
His eye quickly before it's too late
Jesus is Lord regardless of our opinions
The words of Jordan Peterson will give you a good life on this earth, the words of Jesus Christ will give you a good life after death❤
What's a good life on this earth like?
How can you compare that.....
Think it deeply.....peterson merely a human being just like you brother......I think you would be better than peterson.
................
But you know who CHRIST is.....
HE is for PAST PRESENT and FUTURE.
...............
Jeremiah 1:5
5 Before I formed thee in the belly I knew thee; and before thou camest forth out of the womb I sanctified thee, and I ordained thee a prophet unto the nations.
.........
And you know for present and for future.....
...................
There is nothing that have human being which is not available in GOD.....for that reason we should follow the human being.
...............
JESUS LOVES you.
I love you.
Lisa Samuelson if you catch figure of out how to live your life without the help of JP, something is not right.
Very well put, Lisa. Ignore negative comments. I know exactly what you meant. Jordan Peterson can give your day to day grind a great deal of meaning. Jesus Christ, our Lord and Savior, is the best possible example of how we are to treat others.
Well said!
Jesus loves Dave Rubin
Yeah and you know it
How u know?
Because He literally died giving His life for loving Dave Rubin
@@wilsonnkwan what? He died before dave was born
@@brianfinnegan664 Dr Strange knows the 1 out of 14million futures where the Avengers can defeat Thanos using the time stone, why can't an all powered God who created space and time knows everyone in the past, present and future personally?
We love you, Dave. Thank you for standing up for sanity in an insane world.
"I'm in it just like you guys, I'm trying to find some truth in the madness" DR
One of the most honest statement I heard recently when it comes to our humanity, faith e our shared destiny. There might be many beliefs and understandings, many philosophical thinking and ideologies but only one planet. You have got to come back to Reason and true love!
Great debate
A very enjoyable chat between two kind men. Thank you for this.
Im happily surprise at the openness humility and affable personality of Rubin, found the guy really sharp and non-pretentious genuinely engaging , way smarter and engaging than the average pod-caste , he made this show (along with Lennox whos is a genius) really entertaining , congrats Justin.
YAAS, been waiting for this to finally release :DDD
Civil discourse of life's most important questions from two distinct world views. No one got hurt and no need for counseling. There may be hope after all!
John Lennox you are awesome!
From a political POV 42:55 is one of the best reasons why religion is so valuable for the USA
Who else wants Dr. William Lane Craig vs Jordan Peterson?
@Md.Bahroz Babur Ali
They already had a debate! Go check it out, it's great!
@@brando3342 I know that they have shared a stage but interaction between them is so less and they didn't really debate with each other.
@Md.Bahroz Badur Ali
I see. Well I kind of disagree. I heard Craig call out Jordan several times in that debate. Yes, there was 3 of them up there, but it was still good for Jordan.
@@brando3342 Haha, I see. Well, I should say that you don't disagree with me considering that I agree with you on the fact that he did call him out but I want this kind of debate between them, it's better.
@Md.Bahroz Badur Ali
Ahh haha got ya man 👍😄
Folks, let's pray for Dave!
He is loved by the resurrected Jesus.
I hope he would but I doubt it...Christianity requires a lot of personal sacrifice, I doubt Dave would be willing to confront the sinful nature of his marriage, I hope he can but that kind of thing is a monumental hurdle.
Wow, Rubin and Lennox, never expected this. I am a big fan of Lennox's work, I'll be reading one of his books soon
“We are now living in an information orgy” - Dave Rubin 2019
This channel is brilliant. Civilized discussions on difficult or rather, controversial subjects.
Very enlightening discussion. This has to get more views.
I love Dave sees there is more to life than meets the eye. I pray he finds the joy of joys in life.
Great Conversation John and Dave, reverberating the fact that, "common sense" becomes "uncommon sense".
In discussions with like minded colleagues it would be absolutely fantastic for you John and Jordan Peterson to sit down and "break bread". In fact a round table discussion with with you Dave, John, Jordan in a meaningful debate with Michael Schermer, Sam Harris, and Richard Dawkins.
A venue of the highest validity with Joe Rogan perhaps.
Gentlemen I appreciate your lives....all the best
Right on! I have been praying for Dave for well over a year and he is well on his way to meeting Yeshua. Have been praying for Jordan too and he is coming in the boat also. Dave has a destiny to be a thought leader and Christian reformer. Will be watching his life just like Kanye's.
Kanye is off his rocker and Dave's brain is half-dead or MIA.
That sounds silly. Why do you have to pray for over a year? Shouldn't be a single prayer enough? Heck, with an all-knowing deity you wouldn't even need to pray in the first place. He would already know.
Dave should repost this on his channel to get even more reach!
I really would have loved to hear John Lennox speak more. He is a remarkable man.
Loved this!!! Wish I could listen to another hour or two.
Dave Rubin can be described best in one word. He is honest. Truly honest.
I would like to see CONVERSATION between Jordan Peterson and Lennox.
Absolutely love Dave thank you for a great hour look forward to more
To think great mind are only those we can see on the surface.
John Lenox's father sounds like a very interesting man.
To think there are a lot of great mind out there appeared just like an ordinary people.
Brilliant, thank you so much for the conversion.🙏❤️
I love this Conversation be cause it was respectable.
Me too! Btw, that's respectful :)
A tad one sided for disrespect to blossom!!
I love the internet. I had my red pill moment watching an episode of The Rubin Report with Ben Shapiro who introduced me to Michael Shermer who introduced me to Frank Turek who introduced me to Justin Brierly and now I’m here. My world opened up x100 since going into this rabbit hole. Eternally grateful to all these people. But most of all God for giving us our minds
Interesting - I had the exact opposite experience. I was born & raised in a Christian home and was never taught how to think but rather taught what to think. Once I looked at my reasons for “believing”, I discovered I had no good reason to believe. My red pill moment led to atheism but I still enjoy hearing both sides.
This was very good and mature conversation!
i had a cat that found me in life ,while i was too busy to see her. she taught me some simple lessons that to this day i wish i would of pet that cat. she was less than 10 lbs of pure confidence and motherhood(about 5 kittens she brought w her) she intentionally found her place at my home with more than 5 dogs while not scared of all of there threats. Dr. Lennox is a great teacher what we don't see here is the many languages he can speak to teach the places he understood the pain from.
Great conversation. I'll be praying for Rubin and his journey. It's so refreshing to hear someone who's actually open to evidence, such a rarity.
All of us atheists are open to (good)evidence.
@@frankwhelan1715 So you're a Christian then! ;)
@@CaryHawkins What do you think is the best evidence for Christianity?
@Heath Farley I can present a thorough, historical case for Jesus’ bodily resurrection, if you’re interested.
@@MojoPin1983 I doubt it but feel free.
Just like me, this patient presenter really wishes that Rubin get to at least one solid argument or decisive opinion, while mr. Lennox time and again ties all Rubin's gibberish strings together. Hats off to both mr. Lennox and the program presenter.
As a Christian I wish they hadn’t bugged Dave so much about what he believes. He made his beliefs very clear from the beginning so I can see why he was tired of it by the end of this. I’ve been watching his show for quite a while now and the evolution of faith he is undergoing is evident, and ongoing. He’s been very open about that. Let’s not badger him with the same question asked a dozen different ways.
Evolution doesnt require faith, for it is loaded with supporting evidence, please educate yourself in Science.
Not all Christians Deny evolution, just the ignorant ones with their head in the sand.
See Francis Collins, one of the Top Evolutionary Biologists in North America... and he's a christian. You're welcome...
@@badideass I said nothing at all about evolution requiring faith. In fact, I said nothing about evolution at all. Read my comment again. I was clearly talking about how Dave's FAITH has evolved, and is still evolving.
You not only completely misunderstood what I said, but you did so while being a total jerk. Apology accepted. Now get lost.
@@badideass triggered much
@@daraharvey4519 why would I be triggered?
@@daraharvey4519 I know I was agreeinggwith you.
The humility of British Christians really impresses me as an American. American Christian leaders seem to often carry a spirit of pride in knowing the truth, instead of humbly compelling those to look at the evidence and the man of Jesus. (There are exceptions obviously.)
John is awesome!
A lovely Boxing Day watch. Dave is opening and is interacting with people who live their faith as best they can. Is that not being human: we are vulnerable and letting go of one thing that has given us a foundation and embracing a new foundation is a vast space until we embrace it and then it is an elegantly simple process. The world became flesh which we celebrated yesterday and today we begin again.
Why won't Evangelical Christians open up and interact with people who are openly gay and proud. Why don't they open up and interact with people who KNOW that homosexuality is natural and not a sin. Why does openness and interaction only go one way? From atheist to religious? From homosexuality to heterosexuality?
I love how John Lennox brings it home to God NOT being some impersonal idea but a personal unique eternal God. Jordan & other philosophers seek to dehumanize or seclarize God to a god. they seem to shrink God to merely an idea it is okay to think about. Faith in God is far different than faith in "a faith". No one should trust in a faith but there is no saving grace without a saving faith which is bound to God. This is why so many feel comfortable with talking about God, whom they actually make the generic "god", but refuse to mention Jesus.
Well said, "CoffeeStainedPH".
John Lennox, thank you. God bless you and your family,
Maybe it's just me but it seems to me, Lennox and Rubin are talking about 2 completely different things.
Lennox is talking about intrinsic religion, the validity ot religion where as Rubin is talking about extrinsic religion, basically religion as means to culture andbpoltics...
You're right in many ways. Dave and Jordan Peterson see the value of Christian Laws and their benefits, while John Lennox longs for Christ Himself. Many in the church don't even get to Dave's level, let alone beyond it. I pray for our ever-deepening desire for relationship with our Creator. It's time to be the light of the world.
Ya...my thought as well. They weren't on the same page. Dave had nothing to say after John mentioned how much he appreciated jewish high holy days like Yom Kippur. John the gentile "gets it" ...for Dave the jew its still a complete mystery but he did genuinely seem to enjoy going to synagogue with Dennis Prager. I dont think Dave was actually listening to John...he was too busy thinking about things he would say next.
I think a better way to phrase it is they are talking about the same thing, but they are approaching that thing from two different angles. It seems to me that behind what they both speak about is the person of Jesus Christ, even though it seems that Dave is somewhat just beginning the journey that will eventually lead to at its Foundation the person of Jesus Christ. And I think it's somewhere beautiful that Lennox didn't try to beat Rubin over the head with that, he's talking WITH him and befriending him and allowing him to come to that realization himself, which really is the best form of persuasion. We've all learned that you can't necessarily talk someone into believing something different. People have to experience it for themselves.
As Rubin points out, the plight of post-modernism is the fact that at its root is the fact that there is no Foundation to stand on, it's purely subjective. To me that means that he will continue to search for that Foundation as he has pointed out he will. So he may only be able to speak of extrinsic religion , but if he continues to search and seek the foundation of that extrinsic religion and the foundation upon which it stands, I think he will eventually be speaking the same language that Lennox is speaking. And I think Lennox wisely recognizes this.
@@megalopolis2015 *I pray for our ever-deepening desire for relationship with our Creator." - Cringe.
Very open and very humble. Extremely rare to find a wise secular person like David.
I find the majority of the new atheists have a personal vendetta against God, I.e. they’re in a homosexual relationship and try to intellectually debunk God to allow for their lifestyle to continue.
Other atheists like Dawkins have too much to lose if they began to search for God. For some atheists, their identity, career, as well as reputation has been built on being an advocate outspoken atheist.
"If I were not a Catholic, and were looking for the true Church in the world today, I would look for the one Church which did not get along well with the world; in other words, I would look for the Church which the world hated. My reason for doing this would be, that if Christ is in any one of the churches of the world today, He must still be hated as He was when He was on earth in the flesh. If you would find Christ today, then find the Church that does not get along with the world. Look for the Church that is hated by the world as Christ was hated by the world. Look for the Church that is accused of being behind the times, as our Lord was accused of being ignorant and never having learned. Look for the Church which men sneer at as socially inferior, as they sneered at Our Lord because He came from Nazareth. Look for the Church which is accused of having a devil, as Our Lord was accused of being possessed by Beelzebub, the Prince of Devils. Look for the Church which, in seasons of bigotry, men say must be destroyed in the name of God as men crucified Christ and thought they had done a service to God. Look for the Church which the world rejects because it claims it is infallible, as Pilate rejected Christ because He called Himself the Truth. Look for the Church which is rejected by the world as Our Lord was rejected by men. Look for the Church which amid the confusions of conflicting opinions, its members love as they love Christ, and respect its Voice as the very voice of its Founder, and the suspicion will grow, that if the Church is unpopular with the spirit of the world, then it is unworldly, and if it is unworldly it is other worldly. since it is other-worldly, it is infinitely loved and infinitely hated as was Christ Himself. But only that which is Divine can be infinitely hated and infinitely loved. Therefore the Church is Divine." Fulton J Sheen
... Point Rubin made on 'Hatred'
That was worth reading through. Thanks for posting.
@@bobmassey7227 not a Problem. 😀
Thank you ever so much for sharing these incredibly informative videos. The world is a better place because of John Lennox. All Glory Be To God!
Let the Holy Spirit of God touch you. Give up your will to His.
Can I choose where he touches me...
@@brianfinnegan664 Yes, it's your spirit.
@@brianfinnegan664 go away troll. If you aren’t going to be serious why waste your time.
i would absolutely love to sit down and talk to John Lennox for an hour.
must be a while since this was done Rubin already had Ravi on the Rubin report. He promised Ravi he would do his best to bring Jordan Peterson and him together after Ravi expressed a great desire that that would happen. Rubin is a nice guy
It was filmed back in early October, I believe.
I never pictured John Lennox and Dave Rubin in a setting like this, but it's not bad.
My note,
11:10 John Lenox's father's world view, "I believe that every person what ever they believe is of infinite value because they're made in the image of God."
Gin,
This is such a great show and interview!
Absolutely loved this!
God is pretty much alive 🙏