Good idea, but you need the exhaust gas to always be travelling downwards to exit at the lowest point. The exhaust gas will contain water vapour and acids from the combustion process. It will turn into condensation as it cools that will eventually block or restrict the gas flow and cause back pressure in the combustion chamber. You could experiment using a small size central heating radiator or a turbo intercooler from a vehicle for more surface area to heat. Again, feed gas in at the top and exit at the lowest point to avoid a condensation blockage. Any step down to a smaller bore will give some back pressure in the system, leading to possible burner malfunction. You could fit a Y piece to split the exhaust into two outlets if you have to step down it's bore. Keep checking component condition as acids in combustion gas can eventually corrode some metals and will lead to Carbon Monoxide leaks into the building.
You are correct about the condensation and acid - however will it rust copper? Or aluminum? I believe aluminum is typically used on vehicle exhaust so that should be safe, however copper I am not familiar with.
@@dhenschel4 Aluminium tends to be used on vehicle intercoolers because it is more corrosion resistant, and easily dissipates heat. It should be fairly long lasting as many vehicles inject exhaust gas into the turbocharged intake from the EGR, exhaust gas recirculation system, which contains acids etc. The alluminium intercooler then cools the hot gas before it enters the engine for maximum boost charge. The cooling veins do gum up with oily deposits, but they are usually from engine lubricating oil mixing with soot, resulting from a worn engine or failing turbocharger seals and bearings. Any residue should be minimal as these heaters tend to be fairly clean burning, and you're not recirculating exhaust gases. Burning a high percentage mix of dirty waste oil could increase the risk of gum residue building up in the heat exchanger. Copper pipe has similar corrosion resistance, but using small steel central heating radiators could see them corrode in time. You would need to at least match the machine's exhaust flow rate; so biggest bore tube and maybe twin the heat exchanger system via a Y piece. In a water filled central heating system, you have corrosion inhibitor fluid mixed in the water. Obviously not possible if it's thru-flowing with corrosive gas, so central heating radiators may need inspecting more regularly and thoroughly for rust holes and gas leaks. A CO detector above any heat recovery system and radiator is a must.
@@howardosborne8647 A CO detector fitted above where the heat recovery system runs is also a must fit. You won't see any rusty pin holes as they'll develop from inside, just like a mild steel central heating radiator eventually rusts and leaks.
Uh........ I get understand wanting to recover heat that would otherwise be dumped outside of the area he's trying to heat, hence the long pipe. What I don't understand is why in the world the end of the exhaust pipe terminates inside rather than exhausted to the outside where it's safe!
I did a similar thing in the UK , I used a large wall hung radiator and piped the exhaust into the top on one side and an exit pipe on the bottom on the other side and then out of the wall to the outside , you just have to make sure it's got a good fall on the radiator so that the condensation can drain away , it works very well and gives out a lot of heat without putting too much strain on the heater unit..... Also it's best to fit a CO alarm in the area to be safe just in case anything is leaking.... 👍
@Piccyman If it's piped up correctly as stated above, any condensation should exit to the outside via gravity, along with the exhaust gases. You shouldn't need a drain to manually open if you've eliminated any chance of condensation pooling to block the gas flow. These heaters don't have the same exhaust gas pressure push that you get from a piston internal combustion engine. There wouldn't be sufficient gas pressure to push condensed liquid through the pipes, hence why it needs to fall automatically by gravity. You will still need to regularly check any mild steel parts for corrosion as you'll not notice any pinholes that will create dangerous Carbon Monoxide in the area you're heating.
This is a great idea, if you want to improve it join the exhaust pipe to a larger diameter aluminium pipe at least 2x, this will reduce the resistance on the fan motor and reduce your current draw. It will also slow the gases and give the pipe more time to absorb the heat so you can use a shorter pipe without the need to put any bends in it, that will cause restrictions too. Keep it slightly downhill because there will be a lot of condensation dripping out.
I like your idea, but I wonder if the aluminum would tolerate the exhaust gases for very long before corroding and leaking. Copper and stainless steel seem to be better options for durability.
I think the exhaust pipe needs to be a "downward" slope so that all the moisture drips out of the pipe. Copper is a good material, I think. CO alarm might be wise.
Great idea and great video and added to the other comments it's a no brainer. I can't get over how many other videos of these heaters there are all wasting probably 50% (at least) of the heat output. In short, wider bore pipe, fewer corners, certainly no 180's and all with a slight down hill gradient. And exhausting outside obviously.
I mounted my heater outside, ran the exhaust back thru the wall into an old iron radiator turned sideways with the outlet coming out the bottom and going out the front wall of the shop. Mine has 1 heated air outlet but it heats my 24x24 shop with ease, i was surprised at how much heat was recovered from the radiator that helped warm up that corner that was always cold by the door
Great idea! Only a slight modification is required. When you have combustion you have water and carbon dioxide. So you should have a low point drain for condensation as water will build up and in a shut down situation you may have a water slug that could freeze and split the copper exhaust. Best would be a free flow from top to bottom to allow natural drainage.
Just cut the uphill part off, reconnect and punch a hole through the concrete wall to let it continue its 1/4 inch per foot descent, take care if everyone's (absolutely important) issues with least effirt
@readoryx373 ideally, you do not want any low point drain, or condensation trap points. The exhaust gas is potentially corrosive as it forms acids when it condenses as it cools. The unrestricted through flow of exhaust gas should help push out any condensation if it exits at the lowest point. Just look how vehicle exhaust systems rot away because they allow gas to condense inside. You're dealing with the same thing, but the potential for those corrosive gases to create pin holes in some metals that will allow dangerous CO leaks. It is best to get those gases outside to atmosphere as soon as you have recovered the heat from it.
I did that too and after . After 3 months of operation, the diesel heater was completely clogged with soot. a much larger exhaust pipe must be installed so that the exhaust gases can escape freely
These heaters usually hate long exhausts and was surprised this one is working fine until I got to the last few minutes of your video when you say it's continuously drawing 8 amps. Should only be drawing that amount of current on startup when it uses the glow plug should then drop to comparatively almost nothing as it's just driving the electronics and the fan. Wondering if it's detecting low exhaust flow and powering the glow plug to maintain operation ?
No it only draws that sort of current for a minute or two and then drops to almost nothing. Exhaust is fine and it is a lot wider than the tube coming from the heater, doesn't seem to be causing any problems. So far it's been fantastic and because it's drawing air from inside the house there's no condensation. Found it will run on battery for a few days before it needs charging.
I heated my old farm house 1,500 sq ft with 2 diesel heaters 2 years ago, worked good. Used just one until the temps got extra cold, then fired up the 2nd one. Now, I'm going to use some flexible dryer duct and put it around an extended exhaust (I already have both) and run a small DC fan at the bottom of the heater where the exhaust starts and split it off before it goes outside. I should be able to nearly double my heat output from 1 heater depending on the CFM of the fan. Easy and cheap way to increase efficiency.
It can be hooked up to a water jacketed heat exchanger but the golden rule with any heat recovered burner exhaust system is that the exit point must be at the lowest point to ensure condensate drains away by gravity.
That’s a great idea with the exception of the condensate? The way you have that piped,the bottom pass will FILL UP WITH ACIDIC CONDENSATION! My suggestion would be to scrounge up five or six or 8 feet of baseboard for hydronic heating systems put it on the wall with the exit going through the wall to the outside and pitch the whole thing slightly downward towards the termination! ❤️🇺🇸
Hi, thank you for showing us your heat reclaim system , a great idea. For power supply a good idea is to place a transformer that converts 120 volts AC to 12 volts DC from your garage power next to the heater. The battery is good if you are using the heater for short periods like in a truck etc.
there is a max length for the exhaust any longer it causes back pressure that reduces the burn temp producing soot the heat gained is not worth the strain on the fan {:-) PAV UK
A vertical pipe, of larger diameter would reduce the rate and restrictions on flue, and give the gases longer to transfer heat!.. it is also a good idea to always have flu rising as hot gases naturally want to rise improving combustion, yours runs down hill so fan is having to push against the hot air wanting to rise!.. thin stainless exhaust pipe works well as good radiator of radiant heat.. love what you done!..
The manufacturer's typically recommend that the exhaust should have a "negative slope" (i.e., running downhill) to allow for condensed moisture to exit from the exhaust pipe. This is especially true for a long exhaust, where a lot of cooling (and moisture condensation) can take place. There are a number of UA-cam videos on these heaters where the installation has a "low spot" in the exhaust pipe (as it snakes up and down under a vehicle), and moisture condenses and builds up in the low spot(s). Eventually the fluid prevents the heater from operating normally.
@@mobiusx8117 i totally agree! but look at a car exhaust, if they rot out, 99% of the time back box goes first, the heat these get upto i think it will only be last few feet that ae prone to condensation pulling in cold damp air as it cools. 300 + degrees Exhaust get upto, my suggestion after building rocket stoves is to pipe exhaust into a larger vertical chamber, exhaust gases enter at the bottom reduce in speed and giving longer time to transfer heat to the larger metal pipe. the whole thing could be built using car exhaust part, allow 20mm up from the bottom of the larger pipe as a condensation trap, which would dry up during operation!.. and valid points
Good idea to get some use from that wasted heat. However by extending the exhaust you increase the internal pressure in the heater, which will lower its efficency and increase the carbon production in the unit. As long as you are happy to do regular maintenance to remove the carbon buildup from the burner you should be OK. keep us updated.
I can vouch for this. I tried plumbing the exhaust through a single panel radiator - feeding it into the top right corner, and exhausting through the bottom left. The idea was to send the hot gases downwards through the radiator to slow the flow to allow maximum time for cooling through the radiator walls, and I was hoping that exhausting from the diagonally opposite corner would allow for an even temperature gradient from left to right across the radiator. I was also hoping that there would be sufficient expansion of gases when they got into the radiator to prevent significant back pressure to the heater. The result was acrid black smoke exhausting from the bottom left corner of the radiator - so clearly there was too much restriction of flow from end to end! I don't currently know if the restriction was mainly caused by the radiator itself, or whether it was due to the fact that it was necessary to make three 90 degree bends in the "anaconda" exhaust pipe between the heater and the radiator - or whether it was due to the fact that the copper fitting at each corner of the radiator narrowed the diameter that the gases could flow through - ableit for a length of less than 10mm in each case. I suspect a combination of all is responsible. Anyway, I've abandoned this approach and am exploring the EGR cooler approach - I'm waiting for a used EGR cooler from a Mondeo Diesel to arrive through the post, and have bought a cheap 12V 1100 litres/hour pump. I just need to get hold of a header/expansion tank now and I can re-purpose the radiator! Will let you know how it goes if you're interested.
I don't know if the pipes are going to have enough inclination for the condensed water to drain out. Another idea to use this heat is to place the heater higher so that a five elements radiator could be placed below it. You put the exhaust pipe in the upper entry of the radiator and use the bottom exit of the radiator to put an inclined downward pipe for the colder air and condensation to come out. I'm thinking of buying one of these because I'm currently using a blue flame propane heater and it's putting out a lot of condensation-about 1L of water per 1L of gas used - on the exterior wall and windows leading to a never-ending mould cleaning job, and oxigen depletion. If I could use both of these maybe it would be better, but I don't know.
Great idea to recover heat from the exhaust too ! I wonder if running the exhaust through a normal household radiator would work and have similar effects ? Great video youve got me thinking !
Ypu have to modify the radiator. The port to panel connection is at most 10mm which causes the burner to coke up. Ideally drill th port from the rear on a single panel right through in to the panel. Do this to all 4 ports. Intake on two and exhaust on two. ;)
It has been tried with a steel household radiator and it seems to work very well. The drawback is the exhaust fumes are rich in sulphuric acid and will rot the steel rad from the inside. Stainless or copper are far more suitable materials for an exhaust heat exchanger.
@@howardosborne8647 Aready on it regarding copper, carefull here as can emit noxious gases at temperature. Low sulphur fuel but in my case biodiesel and ethanol.
If it's any help, I tried something similar. I joined a short length (less than 100mm) of 22mm copper pipe to the end of the "anaconda" exhaust pipe by flaring the end of the copper pipe out using a pipe expander so it would fit snugly inside the end of the "anaconda" - I then used a jubilee clip and exhaust sealer to make a gas tight seal. I then soldered a longer length of 22mm copper pipe to the short length of copper pipe as an extension using a 22mm straight coupler. After a few minutes of the heater running on full, the solder in the joint melted! I took the reel of solder and touched it on to the outside of the 22mm copper pipe and found that it would melt up to approx 500mm from the end of the "anaconda" pipe. It was lead free solder with a melting point of approx 217 degrees C. Hope this helps.
Try this: a 55 gal steel drum with removable lid, has inlet and outlet pipes brazed/welded near the top and bottom. Drim is filled with 4" to 6" dia. rocks for heat accumulation. Don't forget to provide a good gasket between the lid and drum. Went it to the outside, of course. You'll love the result. Good luck on it.
must be carefull, when cooling exhaust it causes a flow /cfm reduction! this my overheat the burning chamber or cause carbon build-up! increasing the pipe size and less 180 deg. turns will help.Checking the exhaust air flow so it matches is a good thing! Adding a larger copper tube and fins to the exhaust pipe is what i have done!!
I use an old XBOX brick to power my 5kw heater, (12volts 18.5amps) These Diesel heaters exhaust water, over time your bottom run of pipe will fill and block the gases, just run it >>outside
These are great little compact heaters but, with the components and installation instructions supplied, they do waste a great deal of heat through the exhaust gasses and I applaud your efforts to reclaim this. As you say, diesel and kerosene are at crazy prices now so we want these as efficient as possible. There are many easy things that can increase efficiency and though each on it's own might be small, they all add up. Any restrictions to the inflow of combustion air and outflow of exhaust gases will decrease the overall throughput of air/gas. This will have a tendency to lead to fuel rich mixture with incomplete combustion and thus an increase in exhaust carbon monoxide. Restrictions also make the fan work harder to move the air, which increases power consumption and reduce fan life. Looking first at the combustion air inlet. The black tube 'module', often misleadingly called an 'air filter' in the instructions, is in reality an attempt to quieten the air inlet noise and has no ability whatsoever to filter air. Take it off and it runs quieter without it. It is a pointless obstruction to air flow. It has no practical use so discard it. In its place fit a largeish foam type air filter.[very cheap on eb*y] This will capture bugs and workshop dust which would otherwise block the combustion chamber air inlet or the diesel atomising gauze. In the video, the inlet has a 90deg bend to make the inlet tube vertical. It may make it look tidy but there is no valid reason for this so just straighten it out removing the bend and airflow will improve slightly. The exhaust system you have made clearly reduces temperatures very well but has many problems. Most instructions allow for a maximum of 2 metres of 25mm dia. exhaust with a maximum of 270 degrees of bends in total [ie.3 right angles] Purely as far as combustion and gas throughput is concerned, the ideal exhaust is ... no exhaust pipe. Clearly not practical, desirable or safe. Every obstruction such as bends and curves, reductions in diameter, corrugations or roughness in the exhaust pipe inner surface, will increase back pressure which has the effect of reducing gas throughput and overworking the fan. It is also a fact that the smaller the pipe, the harder it is to blow a given volume of gas through it. The first restriction, we can do nothing about. The casting of the heater exhaust port is fixed at 25mm, but as near as possible to the port, we can increase the diameter on the exhaust to increase efficiency. If the exhaust diameter is doubled to 50mm, the cross sectional area increases fourfold, thus reducing exhaust gas speed to a quarter of that in a 25mm pipe. This means that in a given length of exhaust, the gas will have four times longer in the pipe to transfer it's heat out. Also, going from a 25 to a 50mm pipe, will double the surface area available for heat transfer. Going one stage further, the exhaust can be split into two with a Y piece, and each new flow path again be divided by it's own Y coupling so we now have four exhaust streams. If 4 branches are made from 42mm pipes, say 1 metre long this will increase the total exhaust cross section from 4.9 cm2 to 38.5cm2 and give the gas 11 times longer to transfer heat. The surface area available to transfer heat from the exhaust to the air increases from 785cm2 in a single 25mm pipe, to 5278cm2 for the 4 x 42mm branch exhaust. Water is an inevitable by product of diesel combustion and the cooler to exhaust becomes, the more this will be condensed into water, rather than being discharged as vapour [ incidentally, taking a lot of heat with it ]. It is essential that this not be allowed to collect or pool anywhere in the system, and it needs be removed as fast as possible so, the exhaust is best fitted vertically and directly beneath the heater exhaust port. Gravity will do the rest for you. You should aim at a gentle curve to get the exhausts through the wall and safely outside, rather than using a 90deg bends. I have seen this kind of set up done on a system, and, probably due to the much reduced speed of exhaust gas, no silencer was fitted. If noise were to be an issue, pairs of the 42mm piped could be joined to feed into a couple of cheap scrapyard car exhausts. All this can is accomplished with minimum restriction and thus, very much reduced back pressure at the heater. Hopefully this will provide some food for thought, though I freely accept it is a fiddly job to do like this and will incur some setup costs. The pipe/fitting diameters above etc are not set in stone, but intended to give you an indication of the concept. Use what is easily available to you in your area. Though relatively easy to rig a system like this in a shed or garage, It would most probably not be practical in a caravan or motor home due to space constraints. Have fun and enjoy your heater.
I have done something similar with mine, i would recmmend adding some protective mess so noone can touch the exhaust. It is rare any of the kids visit the garage without me but better safe than sorry. This year i plan to insulate the garage, which will mean relocating the exhaust mounts and heat sheilding, poor forward planning on my part as i always planned to insulate. Take care, God bless one and all.
A byproduct of burning diesel is water vapour, It's a great idea but i'm not seeing how any water condensing can escape? I would have installed with an angle down then shoot pipe outside keeping moisture downhill. although probably done by now so it might help someone else.
i just have exhaust led into my radiator water boiler. All the heat warms the chimney...and i could not feel any heat at the top (chimney is 12 meters!) You did a good job on the pipes but the tiny fan inside the heater will not be able to push throu the air making diesel soot and burn inefficiently. May also lead to an accident....for starters turn your pipes up as heat wants to go up like many already said here....
Did you make allowances for condensation in your exhaust? Others have found buildup of condensation if the muffler is arranged with the drain at the top. Without a drain, or pointing the exhaust downward, you will build up condensation in the tubing. Good idea, as a lot of heat is lost through the exhaust and extracting it improves efficiency.
Yes it does! Orient the heater exit to a downward orientation for condensation elimination. Ha, great minds working together is absolutely frightening. .........@@jaspindersdhillon
Hi, this is a very good idea but I would've increased the heat recovery pipe to something twice the size, in UK the sizes are 28mm (my suggestion) and 35mm (expensive in copper). I think you are putting too much pressure on the fan.
Re the comments on improving the heat transfer by increasing the surface area (using a car radiator etc) - since all the heat is expelled into the room right now (you can touch the end of the pipe), I wouldn't expect any improvement is possible - am happy (and would be interested) to be corrected with a logical argument.
Unplug the extended exhaust and check your power consumption it should onkly be around 2 amps at startup cycle and cooldown same i thinbk you have a flow restriction problem
Ideally you want the pipes to got above each other as smoke and heat rises. And back pressure be high due to it pushing it down the pipe. Still great set up
Has the condensate in the exhaust been a problem? It needs to drain out, as in this setup most of the moisture will surely return to liquid as it has been allowed to cool.
I would think condensate would build up in the lowest point of the exhaust. That could be an issue... Next issue to resolve is buy a 110v to 12v transformer off Amazon. Get the 200w model and run the output wires together, that will provide ample power that you can get from a regular AC outlet.
@@jaspindersdhillon You need to increase the diameter of the copper pipe to prevent back-pressure buildup in the combustion chamber. Use a 200w solar panel and charge controller to maintain battery voltage..
Isn't this putting a lot of force on the heater itself? Will the heater hold very long is the question? Maybe a straight pipe without all these curves?
You've given me idea on how to make a efficient heat exchanger but instead of what you did there put it into a container of water for hot water on demand/hot water heating loop.
Total angle of exhaust pipe is limited to some degree, your pipe has too much angles... Exhaust should have such angle so that condensed water can leave. Take exhaust gases outside.
good job thanks for sharing , all so run with solar, when you start run it at 25 after 10 minutes when it is all on turn it down to 16 you should be good to go all so to recharge batteries yous from wall or generator but solar is great.
Smart idea. How does the heater do heating your garage? I run mine in HZ mode almost exclusively now. I did some measurements to see where the best bang for your buck is on HZ setting vs Watt draw. I think it's about 4 - 4.6hz. htz watts/hr 6.1 45 5.5 38 5.1 33 4.6 26 4 21 3.6 17 3.1 14 2.7 11 2.1 8
A follow up video would be great. High exhaust back pressure should have fried it by now. Plus carbon monoxide gases should have built up to choke the fresh air intake too if being exhausted into the garage.
Nice heat exchanger system - but be aware that gas flowing through pipes really does not like going through tight 90 degree or 180 degree bends: These act a bit like a restriction in diameter in terms of the resistance to flow they cause, so the tight bends where your copper pipes turn back on themselves could significantly reduce the exhaust flow rate, leading to incomplete combustion inside the heater, soot build-up inside the pipes and maybe even spitting unburned fuel out of the exhaust. I would recommend using one long piece of copper pipe, bent into a helical shape (like a coiled spring) with a diameter of about half a metre to ensure that the curves in the pipe are at consistently shallow angles. It can be hard to bend copper pipe like this without causing kinks, but there is a way to stop this happening: Fill the pipe with dry sand before you start bending it, and this should prevent it kinking while you are bending it - then empty the sand back out once you're finished bending it into the shape you want. A similar option is to fill the pipe with molten lead (or any other low melting point metal or alloy) and let it solidify before bending the tube into shape - then heat it back up with a blowtorch to melt the lead back out. Anyway, once you have your helical copper tube radiator, mount it upright and feed the diesel heater exhaust in at the top, then out at the bottom - this will allow any condensed water to flow out at the bottom so the tube stays clear of blockages.
You lot need to look at the factbthat this in dangerous with the gas staying in the garage instead of going outside this is not good . Restricted flow also will not help your burn chamber
I appreciate your efforts, I hope this will mesh with what others have mentioned and increase your successes in the future. First and foremost - your temperature readings are inaccurate. An infrared thermometer like that defaults to "emissivity" of 0.95 That of biological tissues. Trying to read a shiny pipe you will at least need to adjust the setting or do some math. But even then, it's not reliable. You can attach a piece of black tape if the temp is safe, or use a high temperature black paint, but the exhaust pipe is probably over 400C and will burn any paint. Others mentioned the exhaust pipe will contain water vapor and form acids and need a drain outlet. Indeed the manual offers this option if the exhaust must route vertical, to drill a couple drain holes. In addition, the length of the exhaust run is going to make it harder for combustion air to enter the burn chamber, adding stress on the motor and possibly reducing combustion efficiency. I like the idea of waste heat capture, but this is more complicated and why high efficiency furnaces require more special materials and engineering.
Lie the pipe work flat, as though it was on the floor but suspended, and the condensation that may build up inside of it will be pushed out as it won't need to climb any pipe bends. You'll just need to then vent the pipe to the outside for fume extraction.
NOT a bad idea, just get a coil of copper pipe & you wouldn't have so many pieces to solder together and more compact, I'm going to use a automotive aluminum radiator for such, and after the heater is turned off one can open the Radiator drain to let the condensation out, BUT remember to shut it before running again
Won't work in the way you have done it. Number 1 you have reduced temperature to the point of condensation so your pipe is going to fill with water and cause a cut off condition from blocked exhaust. Number 2 even if you do continue at a downward slope with your pipe( take it out the wall low instead of jumping it backup like you have that holds the condensate) you have put multiple 90° elbows thus restricting your vent which has put a higher load on your purge system and will soon burn the main control motor up. Number 3 in the event you make it past these two by removing elbows and draining low your extension is still just too much and proven by your systems use of more power. So over time you will soot the inside of heat exchanger to the point of reducing efficiency beyond a usable amount. If you truly want to pursue the line of thought of raising efficiency by removing btu's from the exhaust perhaps you should look into increasing your expanded heat exchanger to 2 or 2.5 inch with only two 90° elbows one turning down and the other turning outside. The last 10 inches of your pipe should be the same size as the first ten inches (factory size) to retain proper back presure. You will also have to put a drain in the bottom of the last elbow to prevent it from holding water and developing leaks from acidity over time.
how about running your exhaust pipe through a water tank to heat up water . I live in a caravan off grid so I will be using your idea to heat water for doing my dishes and having a shower
It supposedly clogs up the burn chamber because of increased back pressure. But I'm not sure if that's true or not. I'm wanting to do something like this
Add a turbo at the exhaust to help pull it through the 25 feet of pipe. Also put the intake outside, that way it don't burn up all your oxygen in the garage.
Look at other videos, it is not recommend to use copper pipe for the exhaust with this style heater...the copper and Co2 don't mix, create acid and carbon monoxide problems...just a thought, good idea but you need slope so condensation can flow out.
I always wondered about why the efficiency of these is so low? You water heater needs only a PVC pipe for it to exhaust. A better design should be in order in the future. But for the cost of these things ? You can't really go wrong.
Exhaust condensate will eventually eat the copper pipe and you may risk carbon monoxide entering the room. That's why gas boilers must have a plastic condensate drain pipe.
It say's that you should not have the exhaust too long. A heat exchanget would be better. A large tube around the exhaust with an air inlet with a computer fan going into the exchanger, and an exit coming out of the exchanger. Easy and safe, no fumes in the building and the oulet of the exhaust outside.
That is a great idea . Is it not dangrous to extend the exhaust? Does it not put pressure on the moter? And running exhaust fumes thru copper puts of a gas that ain't good for us . I could be wrong . Run a pipe next to pipe and fill with water and you should get atleast warm water for a little bit 👍👍👍😜🏴🦄🦕😁✌️🤞
buenos días, yo he enrollado tubo cobre para climatización de 1/4 alrededor del tubo de salida de humos ,haciendo circular agua con una bomba de 12v , en cuanto a la alimentación eléctrica te aconsejo que compres una fuente alimentación 12v/30A valen 30 euros es el mejor sistema ,consume muy poquito .saludos Good morning, I have rolled copper tube for air conditioning of 1/4 around the smoke outlet tube, circulating water with a 12V pump, in terms of power supply I advise you to buy a 12V/30A food source worth 30 euros It is the best system, it consumes very little.
I was thinking of using a small household water radiator to capture exhaust heat before venting outside.if you enter exhaust from the bottom it should prevent water build up.
Woah, the end should be going outside at the end, this is extremely dangerous!! Plus inside copper pipe will be water condensing, so the pipe needs to be lower than unit & allow water outside.
Unit sitting high up, use double radiator and feed exhaust in through top and out through bottom then pipe outside. WATER BUILDS UP IN THE EXHAUST. YOU SHOULD NOT LOOP THE PIPE.
BAD BAD idea!!! condensation will be a problem, but the length of exhaust on these heaters should NEVER exceed 1 metre in length. Better option is to lack with copper pipe and use as water heater, add a radiator or use the hot water, its still using ur waste energy safely.
my thought also. It will sure help. Make a much shorter exhaust with alufinncoolers soldered on the pipe. Those will steal alot the the heat from the tube.
I would have the end of exhaust outside. Also long exhaust might produce too much drag and choke the heater. Seen a lot using long tubes, why not bigger diameter.
(The laser thermometer won't read copper pipe accurately (without re-calibrating for the emmissivity) - need to tape something black, & ideally matte, over any patch intending to measure.
Great idea! The burner is using heated air from the room/garage/shed for combustion.... it would be even more efficient to use outside air ... which also has a higher density of oxygen.
If there wasn’t so many turns in the exhaust and it was actually vented outside it might actually burn correctly. If it can’t get enough air it’s not going to be hot or efficient
Any 150w dc power supply is sufficient for powering this heater. ie, LED Driver,LED Power Supply IP67 Waterproof Output 150W DC12V 12.5A 3-Prong Plug 4.5feet. Thanks for the heat exchanger idea.
It's good but you have to many bends in the out pipe! Better to have a larger exhaust pipe on the end of the units own one, maybe double the size? Then bend it once through the wall to the outside. Also a heat exchanger would be a good add on along the length of pipe, Remember these need to slope down slightly to drain the water!
Could you make a copper piping coil in a cylinder, like a boiler and heat water throw the exhaust gases🔥💪that would be a useful way of using the exhaust. 💯👍
Good idea, but you need the exhaust gas to always be travelling downwards to exit at the lowest point. The exhaust gas will contain water vapour and acids from the combustion process. It will turn into condensation as it cools that will eventually block or restrict the gas flow and cause back pressure in the combustion chamber. You could experiment using a small size central heating radiator or a turbo intercooler from a vehicle for more surface area to heat. Again, feed gas in at the top and exit at the lowest point to avoid a condensation blockage. Any step down to a smaller bore will give some back pressure in the system, leading to possible burner malfunction. You could fit a Y piece to split the exhaust into two outlets if you have to step down it's bore. Keep checking component condition as acids in combustion gas can eventually corrode some metals and will lead to Carbon Monoxide leaks into the building.
Exactly what you say....the end point of a heat recovery exhaust must always be at the lowest point to allow the condensate to run out by gravity.
You are correct about the condensation and acid - however will it rust copper? Or aluminum? I believe aluminum is typically used on vehicle exhaust so that should be safe, however copper I am not familiar with.
@@dhenschel4 Aluminium tends to be used on vehicle intercoolers because it is more corrosion resistant, and easily dissipates heat. It should be fairly long lasting as many vehicles inject exhaust gas into the turbocharged intake from the EGR, exhaust gas recirculation system, which contains acids etc. The alluminium intercooler then cools the hot gas before it enters the engine for maximum boost charge. The cooling veins do gum up with oily deposits, but they are usually from engine lubricating oil mixing with soot, resulting from a worn engine or failing turbocharger seals and bearings. Any residue should be minimal as these heaters tend to be fairly clean burning, and you're not recirculating exhaust gases. Burning a high percentage mix of dirty waste oil could increase the risk of gum residue building up in the heat exchanger. Copper pipe has similar corrosion resistance, but using small steel central heating radiators could see them corrode in time. You would need to at least match the machine's exhaust flow rate; so biggest bore tube and maybe twin the heat exchanger system via a Y piece. In a water filled central heating system, you have corrosion inhibitor fluid mixed in the water. Obviously not possible if it's thru-flowing with corrosive gas, so central heating radiators may need inspecting more regularly and thoroughly for rust holes and gas leaks. A CO detector above any heat recovery system and radiator is a must.
@@howardosborne8647 A CO detector fitted above where the heat recovery system runs is also a must fit. You won't see any rusty pin holes as they'll develop from inside, just like a mild steel central heating radiator eventually rusts and leaks.
Uh........ I get understand wanting to recover heat that would otherwise be dumped outside of the area he's trying to heat, hence the long pipe. What I don't understand is why in the world the end of the exhaust pipe terminates inside rather than exhausted to the outside where it's safe!
I did a similar thing in the UK , I used a large wall hung radiator and piped the exhaust into the top on one side and an exit pipe on the bottom on the other side and then out of the wall to the outside , you just have to make sure it's got a good fall on the radiator so that the condensation can drain away , it works very well and gives out a lot of heat without putting too much strain on the heater unit.....
Also it's best to fit a CO alarm in the area to be safe just in case anything is leaking.... 👍
I guess it’s worth putting a drain near the bottom of the rad
@Piccyman If it's piped up correctly as stated above, any condensation should exit to the outside via gravity, along with the exhaust gases. You shouldn't need a drain to manually open if you've eliminated any chance of condensation pooling to block the gas flow. These heaters don't have the same exhaust gas pressure push that you get from a piston internal combustion engine. There wouldn't be sufficient gas pressure to push condensed liquid through the pipes, hence why it needs to fall automatically by gravity. You will still need to regularly check any mild steel parts for corrosion as you'll not notice any pinholes that will create dangerous Carbon Monoxide in the area you're heating.
This is a great idea, if you want to improve it join the exhaust pipe to a larger diameter aluminium pipe at least 2x, this will reduce the resistance on the fan motor and reduce your current draw. It will also slow the gases and give the pipe more time to absorb the heat so you can use a shorter pipe without the need to put any bends in it, that will cause restrictions too. Keep it slightly downhill because there will be a lot of condensation dripping out.
I like your idea, but I wonder if the aluminum would tolerate the exhaust gases for very long before corroding and leaking. Copper and stainless steel seem to be better options for durability.
@@mobiusx8117 the heater is made of aluminium so i would assume it would be OK as long as its not paper thin
I purchased a 230/240v to 12 or 24v 30amps transformer on Ebay £21 works great
@@mobiusx8117CH boiler vertical flues come in alloy. I have some.
Isn't that exhaust? What a bout co2?
Brother you need to get them fumes outside! 😵
I have watched a ton of videos about exhaust heat recovery. Yours is the most simplest and best method.
I think the exhaust pipe needs to be a "downward" slope so that all the moisture drips out of the pipe. Copper is a good material, I think. CO alarm might be wise.
Great idea and great video and added to the other comments it's a no brainer. I can't get over how many other videos of these heaters there are all wasting probably 50% (at least) of the heat output. In short, wider bore pipe, fewer corners, certainly no 180's and all with a slight down hill gradient. And exhausting outside obviously.
I mounted my heater outside, ran the exhaust back thru the wall into an old iron radiator turned sideways with the outlet coming out the bottom and going out the front wall of the shop. Mine has 1 heated air outlet but it heats my 24x24 shop with ease, i was surprised at how much heat was recovered from the radiator that helped warm up that corner that was always cold by the door
Great idea! Only a slight modification is required. When you have combustion you have water and carbon dioxide. So you should have a low point drain for condensation as water will build up and in a shut down situation you may have a water slug that could freeze and split the copper exhaust. Best would be a free flow from top to bottom to allow natural drainage.
Just cut the uphill part off, reconnect and punch a hole through the concrete wall to let it continue its 1/4 inch per foot descent, take care if everyone's (absolutely important) issues with least effirt
@readoryx373 ideally, you do not want any low point drain, or condensation trap points. The exhaust gas is potentially corrosive as it forms acids when it condenses as it cools. The unrestricted through flow of exhaust gas should help push out any condensation if it exits at the lowest point. Just look how vehicle exhaust systems rot away because they allow gas to condense inside. You're dealing with the same thing, but the potential for those corrosive gases to create pin holes in some metals that will allow dangerous CO leaks. It is best to get those gases outside to atmosphere as soon as you have recovered the heat from it.
I did that too and after . After 3 months of operation, the diesel heater was completely clogged with soot. a much larger exhaust pipe must be installed so that the exhaust gases can escape freely
These heaters usually hate long exhausts and was surprised this one is working fine until I got to the last few minutes of your video when you say it's continuously drawing 8 amps. Should only be drawing that amount of current on startup when it uses the glow plug should then drop to comparatively almost nothing as it's just driving the electronics and the fan. Wondering if it's detecting low exhaust flow and powering the glow plug to maintain operation ?
Ya, I noticed that .
No it only draws that sort of current for a minute or two and then drops to almost nothing. Exhaust is fine and it is a lot wider than the tube coming from the heater, doesn't seem to be causing any problems. So far it's been fantastic and because it's drawing air from inside the house there's no condensation. Found it will run on battery for a few days before it needs charging.
I heated my old farm house 1,500 sq ft with 2 diesel heaters 2 years ago, worked good. Used just one until the temps got extra cold, then fired up the 2nd one. Now, I'm going to use some flexible dryer duct and put it around an extended exhaust (I already have both) and run a small DC fan at the bottom of the heater where the exhaust starts and split it off before it goes outside. I should be able to nearly double my heat output from 1 heater depending on the CFM of the fan. Easy and cheap way to increase efficiency.
Jaspinder, this is very important that you shared to recover ALL HEAT! THANK YOU SIR! RANDY IN North Carolina USA
You still need to vent the exhaust to the outside to prevent carbon monoxide poisoning
You and everyone who liked this comment sure didn’t watch the video! He said it was temporary until he vented it through the concrete to the outside.
I heard him say that it was temporary.
@@kakrew4764 he still ran the heater inside with no open door visible so.. Maybe already suffocated?
@@kakrew4764 They ALL say that...
You never see them completing an installation properly....
Yeah, he said he's going to do that.
Great use of exhaust gas heat loss, before it exits to outside air. It could be used with a heat exchanger I'd think. Many thanks for sharing.
It can be hooked up to a water jacketed heat exchanger but the golden rule with any heat recovered burner exhaust system is that the exit point must be at the lowest point to ensure condensate drains away by gravity.
Health and Safety would have a field day with this one.
Noted
Why?
Its not a problem if you leak test the joints and vent the exhaust outside.
Great job! Just need the exhaust exit to be lower than the exchanger so the moisture condensate is drained outside with the exhaust
That’s a great idea with the exception of the condensate?
The way you have that piped,the bottom pass will
FILL UP WITH
ACIDIC CONDENSATION!
My suggestion would be to scrounge up five or six or 8 feet of baseboard for hydronic heating systems put it on the wall with the exit going through the wall to the outside and pitch the whole thing slightly downward towards the termination! ❤️🇺🇸
Hi, thank you for showing us your heat reclaim system , a great idea. For power supply a good idea is to place a transformer that converts 120 volts AC to 12 volts DC from your garage power next to the heater. The battery is good if you are using the heater for short periods like in a truck etc.
there is a max length for the exhaust any longer it causes back pressure
that reduces the burn temp producing soot
the heat gained is not worth the strain on the fan
{:-) PAV UK
awesome idea... a great way to make these things more efficient. I am looking at doing a blue flame propane heater in my garage.
If you have an outlet near by use an old ATX computer power supply to run your heater, that’s what I use and it works great
You still need battery back up connected. If power goes out the unit wil be destroyed if it doesn't cool down.
Great heat exchanger idea however bad idea to have that exhausting into the garage.
A vertical pipe, of larger diameter would reduce the rate and restrictions on flue, and give the gases longer to transfer heat!.. it is also a good idea to always have flu rising as hot gases naturally want to rise improving combustion, yours runs down hill so fan is having to push against the hot air wanting to rise!.. thin stainless exhaust pipe works well as good radiator of radiant heat.. love what you done!..
Grateful idea 💡
because the heats cooling in the pipe so it flows down
@@lazycarper7925 so it cools quicker than fan fed combustion???.. not sure on that theory, but could be right..
The manufacturer's typically recommend that the exhaust should have a "negative slope" (i.e., running downhill) to allow for condensed moisture to exit from the exhaust pipe. This is especially true for a long exhaust, where a lot of cooling (and moisture condensation) can take place. There are a number of UA-cam videos on these heaters where the installation has a "low spot" in the exhaust pipe (as it snakes up and down under a vehicle), and moisture condenses and builds up in the low spot(s). Eventually the fluid prevents the heater from operating normally.
@@mobiusx8117 i totally agree! but look at a car exhaust, if they rot out, 99% of the time back box goes first, the heat these get upto i think it will only be last few feet that ae prone to condensation pulling in cold damp air as it cools.
300 + degrees Exhaust get upto, my suggestion after building rocket stoves is to pipe exhaust into a larger vertical chamber, exhaust gases enter at the bottom reduce in speed and giving longer time to transfer heat to the larger metal pipe. the whole thing could be built using car exhaust part, allow 20mm up from the bottom of the larger pipe as a condensation trap, which would dry up during operation!.. and valid points
Good idea to get some use from that wasted heat.
However by extending the exhaust you increase the internal pressure in the heater, which will lower its efficency and increase the carbon production in the unit.
As long as you are happy to do regular maintenance to remove the carbon buildup from the burner you should be OK.
keep us updated.
I can vouch for this. I tried plumbing the exhaust through a single panel radiator - feeding it into the top right corner, and exhausting through the bottom left. The idea was to send the hot gases downwards through the radiator to slow the flow to allow maximum time for cooling through the radiator walls, and I was hoping that exhausting from the diagonally opposite corner would allow for an even temperature gradient from left to right across the radiator. I was also hoping that there would be sufficient expansion of gases when they got into the radiator to prevent significant back pressure to the heater. The result was acrid black smoke exhausting from the bottom left corner of the radiator - so clearly there was too much restriction of flow from end to end! I don't currently know if the restriction was mainly caused by the radiator itself, or whether it was due to the fact that it was necessary to make three 90 degree bends in the "anaconda" exhaust pipe between the heater and the radiator - or whether it was due to the fact that the copper fitting at each corner of the radiator narrowed the diameter that the gases could flow through - ableit for a length of less than 10mm in each case. I suspect a combination of all is responsible. Anyway, I've abandoned this approach and am exploring the EGR cooler approach - I'm waiting for a used EGR cooler from a Mondeo Diesel to arrive through the post, and have bought a cheap 12V 1100 litres/hour pump. I just need to get hold of a header/expansion tank now and I can re-purpose the radiator! Will let you know how it goes if you're interested.
Great info, how did the EGR bit go.
I don't know if the pipes are going to have enough inclination for the condensed water to drain out. Another idea to use this heat is to place the heater higher so that a five elements radiator could be placed below it. You put the exhaust pipe in the upper entry of the radiator and use the bottom exit of the radiator to put an inclined downward pipe for the colder air and condensation to come out. I'm thinking of buying one of these because I'm currently using a blue flame propane heater and it's putting out a lot of condensation-about 1L of water per 1L of gas used - on the exterior wall and windows leading to a never-ending mould cleaning job, and oxigen depletion. If I could use both of these maybe it would be better, but I don't know.
I do believe you got if fella for getting most of the heat you can. Look forward to see what else you do next.
Thanks for positive feedback 😀
I will keep osting more ideas
@@jaspindersdhillon I will keep on watching your videos Sir.
Great idea to recover heat from the exhaust too ! I wonder if running the exhaust through a normal household radiator would work and have similar effects ? Great video youve got me thinking !
It wud starv the engine and cut it out
Ypu have to modify the radiator. The port to panel connection is at most 10mm which causes the burner to coke up. Ideally drill th port from the rear on a single panel right through in to the panel. Do this to all 4 ports. Intake on two and exhaust on two. ;)
It has been tried with a steel household radiator and it seems to work very well. The drawback is the exhaust fumes are rich in sulphuric acid and will rot the steel rad from the inside. Stainless or copper are far more suitable materials for an exhaust heat exchanger.
@@howardosborne8647 Aready on it regarding copper, carefull here as can emit noxious gases at temperature. Low sulphur fuel but in my case biodiesel and ethanol.
Great video! I was hoping you'd show us how hot the rest of the copper pipe got, especially the bit near to the exhaust thank you
If it's any help, I tried something similar. I joined a short length (less than 100mm) of 22mm copper pipe to the end of the "anaconda" exhaust pipe by flaring the end of the copper pipe out using a pipe expander so it would fit snugly inside the end of the "anaconda" - I then used a jubilee clip and exhaust sealer to make a gas tight seal. I then soldered a longer length of 22mm copper pipe to the short length of copper pipe as an extension using a 22mm straight coupler. After a few minutes of the heater running on full, the solder in the joint melted! I took the reel of solder and touched it on to the outside of the 22mm copper pipe and found that it would melt up to approx 500mm from the end of the "anaconda" pipe. It was lead free solder with a melting point of approx 217 degrees C. Hope this helps.
Try this:
a 55 gal steel drum with removable lid, has inlet and outlet pipes brazed/welded near the top and bottom. Drim is filled with 4" to 6" dia. rocks for heat accumulation. Don't forget to provide a good gasket between the lid and drum. Went it to the outside, of course. You'll love the result. Good luck on it.
must be carefull, when cooling exhaust it causes a flow /cfm reduction! this my overheat the burning chamber or cause carbon build-up! increasing the pipe size and less 180 deg. turns will help.Checking the exhaust air flow so it matches is a good thing! Adding a larger copper tube and fins to the exhaust pipe is what i have done!!
Noted
I use an old XBOX brick to power my 5kw heater, (12volts 18.5amps)
These Diesel heaters exhaust water, over time your bottom run of pipe will fill and block the gases, just run it >>outside
Condense water will build up in the copper pipe and will eventually block exhaust gasses from escaping causing co to enter the room
Yes very true the exhaust has always got to point downwards, having a heater up high then no restrictions for water to drain out would be far better
Condense water wil evaporate and be forced out.
@@leonvdm you recon
These are great little compact heaters but, with the components and installation instructions supplied, they do waste a great deal of heat through the exhaust gasses and I applaud your efforts to reclaim this. As you say, diesel and kerosene are at crazy prices now so we want these as efficient as possible. There are many easy things that can increase efficiency and though each on it's own might be small, they all add up.
Any restrictions to the inflow of combustion air and outflow of exhaust gases will decrease the overall throughput of air/gas. This will have a tendency to lead to fuel rich mixture with incomplete combustion and thus an increase in exhaust carbon monoxide. Restrictions also make the fan work harder to move the air, which increases power consumption and reduce fan life.
Looking first at the combustion air inlet. The black tube 'module', often misleadingly called an 'air filter' in the instructions, is in reality an attempt to quieten the air inlet noise and has no ability whatsoever to filter air. Take it off and it runs quieter without it. It is a pointless obstruction to air flow. It has no practical use so discard it. In its place fit a largeish foam type air filter.[very cheap on eb*y] This will capture bugs and workshop dust which would otherwise block the combustion chamber air inlet or the diesel atomising gauze. In the video, the inlet has a 90deg bend to make the inlet tube vertical. It may make it look tidy but there is no valid reason for this so just straighten it out removing the bend and airflow will improve slightly.
The exhaust system you have made clearly reduces temperatures very well but has many problems. Most instructions allow for a maximum of 2 metres of 25mm dia. exhaust with a maximum of 270 degrees of bends in total [ie.3 right angles] Purely as far as combustion and gas throughput is concerned, the ideal exhaust is ... no exhaust pipe. Clearly not practical, desirable or safe.
Every obstruction such as bends and curves, reductions in diameter, corrugations or roughness in the exhaust pipe inner surface, will increase back pressure which has the effect of reducing gas throughput and overworking the fan. It is also a fact that the smaller the pipe, the harder it is to blow a given volume of gas through it.
The first restriction, we can do nothing about. The casting of the heater exhaust port is fixed at 25mm, but as near as possible to the port, we can increase the diameter on the exhaust to increase efficiency.
If the exhaust diameter is doubled to 50mm, the cross sectional area increases fourfold, thus reducing exhaust gas speed to a quarter of that in a 25mm pipe. This means that in a given length of exhaust, the gas will have four times longer in the pipe to transfer it's heat out. Also, going from a 25 to a 50mm pipe, will double the surface area available for heat transfer.
Going one stage further, the exhaust can be split into two with a Y piece, and each new flow path again be divided by it's own Y coupling so we now have four exhaust streams. If 4 branches are made from 42mm pipes, say 1 metre long this will increase the total exhaust cross section from 4.9 cm2 to 38.5cm2 and give the gas 11 times longer to transfer heat. The surface area available to transfer heat from the exhaust to the air increases from 785cm2 in a single 25mm pipe, to 5278cm2 for the 4 x 42mm branch exhaust.
Water is an inevitable by product of diesel combustion and the cooler to exhaust becomes, the more this will be condensed into water, rather than being discharged as vapour [ incidentally, taking a lot of heat with it ]. It is essential that this not be allowed to collect or pool anywhere in the system, and it needs be removed as fast as possible so, the exhaust is best fitted vertically and directly beneath the heater exhaust port. Gravity will do the rest for you.
You should aim at a gentle curve to get the exhausts through the wall and safely outside, rather than using a 90deg bends. I have seen this kind of set up done on a system, and, probably due to the much reduced speed of exhaust gas, no silencer was fitted. If noise were to be an issue, pairs of the 42mm piped could be joined to feed into a couple of cheap scrapyard car exhausts. All this can is accomplished with minimum restriction and thus, very much reduced back pressure at the heater.
Hopefully this will provide some food for thought, though I freely accept it is a fiddly job to do like this and will incur some setup costs. The pipe/fitting diameters above etc are not set in stone, but intended to give you an indication of the concept. Use what is easily available to you in your area. Though relatively easy to rig a system like this in a shed or garage, It would most probably not be practical in a caravan or motor home due to space constraints.
Have fun and enjoy your heater.
I have done something similar with mine, i would recmmend adding some protective mess so noone can touch the exhaust. It is rare any of the kids visit the garage without me but better safe than sorry. This year i plan to insulate the garage, which will mean relocating the exhaust mounts and heat sheilding, poor forward planning on my part as i always planned to insulate. Take care, God bless one and all.
A byproduct of burning diesel is water vapour, It's a great idea but i'm not seeing how any water condensing can escape? I would have installed with an angle down then shoot pipe outside keeping moisture downhill. although probably done by now so it might help someone else.
Done it,
As I mentioned, it was just for twst purposes
i just have exhaust led into my radiator water boiler. All the heat warms the chimney...and i could not feel any heat at the top (chimney is 12 meters!) You did a good job on the pipes but the tiny fan inside the heater will not be able to push throu the air making diesel soot and burn inefficiently. May also lead to an accident....for starters turn your pipes up as heat wants to go up like many already said here....
Did you make allowances for condensation in your exhaust? Others have found buildup of condensation if the muffler is arranged with the drain at the top. Without a drain, or pointing the exhaust downward, you will build up condensation in the tubing. Good idea, as a lot of heat is lost through the exhaust and extracting it improves efficiency.
Great idea, I wonder if a car heater core or radiator would also work in the exhaust
Excellent idea
Yes it does! Orient the heater exit to a downward orientation for condensation elimination. Ha, great minds working together is absolutely frightening. .........@@jaspindersdhillon
I've used a towel rail to recover the exhaust heat
Keep recovering it but don't try with family
Hi, this is a very good idea but I would've increased the heat recovery pipe to something twice the size, in UK the sizes are 28mm (my suggestion) and 35mm (expensive in copper). I think you are putting too much pressure on the fan.
Re the comments on improving the heat transfer by increasing the surface area (using a car radiator etc) - since all the heat is expelled into the room right now (you can touch the end of the pipe), I wouldn't expect any improvement is possible - am happy (and would be interested) to be corrected with a logical argument.
Unplug the extended exhaust and check your power consumption it should onkly be around 2 amps at startup cycle and cooldown same i thinbk you have a flow restriction problem
You can add a charge controller and solar panel to your set up . That will keep the battery charged at all times .
Ideally you want the pipes to got above each other as smoke and heat rises. And back pressure be high due to it pushing it down the pipe. Still great set up
Has the condensate in the exhaust been a problem? It needs to drain out, as in this setup most of the moisture will surely return to liquid as it has been allowed to cool.
I would think condensate would build up in the lowest point of the exhaust. That could be an issue...
Next issue to resolve is buy a 110v to 12v transformer off Amazon. Get the 200w model and run the output wires together, that will provide ample power that you can get from a regular AC outlet.
Probably a good idea to have the exhaust exit below the heat exchanger. Its possible condensation will eventually block the pipe
I converted to downflow pipeTo prevent conception bulild up
@@jaspindersdhillon You need to increase the diameter of the copper pipe to prevent back-pressure buildup in the combustion chamber. Use a 200w solar panel and charge controller to maintain battery voltage..
Isn't this putting a lot of force on the heater itself? Will the heater hold very long is the question? Maybe a straight pipe without all these curves?
You've given me idea on how to make a efficient heat exchanger but instead of what you did there put it into a container of water for hot water on demand/hot water heating loop.
Grat idea but my Goal os to keep grage warm at most efficient way
Feed it into an old radiator and then out, plenty of surface area to gather heat.
If you put the exhaust on a heating radiator it will give more heat and look a lot neater.
Total angle of exhaust pipe is limited to some degree, your pipe has too much angles... Exhaust should have such angle so that condensed water can leave. Take exhaust gases outside.
good job thanks for sharing , all so run with solar, when you start run it at 25 after 10 minutes when it is all on turn it down to 16 you should be good to go all so to recharge batteries
yous from wall or generator but solar is great.
Smart idea. How does the heater do heating your garage?
I run mine in HZ mode almost exclusively now. I did some measurements to see where the best bang for your buck is on HZ setting vs Watt draw. I think it's about 4 - 4.6hz.
htz watts/hr
6.1 45
5.5 38
5.1 33
4.6 26
4 21
3.6 17
3.1 14
2.7 11
2.1 8
🙏
It self excellent but diesel ⛽️ prices crazy 🤪
A follow up video would be great. High exhaust back pressure should have fried it by now. Plus carbon monoxide gases should have built up to choke the fresh air intake too if being exhausted into the garage.
At the moment, no issue
@@jaspindersdhillongood hearing from you, glad you're ok.
Nice heat exchanger system - but be aware that gas flowing through pipes really does not like going through tight 90 degree or 180 degree bends: These act a bit like a restriction in diameter in terms of the resistance to flow they cause, so the tight bends where your copper pipes turn back on themselves could significantly reduce the exhaust flow rate, leading to incomplete combustion inside the heater, soot build-up inside the pipes and maybe even spitting unburned fuel out of the exhaust.
I would recommend using one long piece of copper pipe, bent into a helical shape (like a coiled spring) with a diameter of about half a metre to ensure that the curves in the pipe are at consistently shallow angles. It can be hard to bend copper pipe like this without causing kinks, but there is a way to stop this happening: Fill the pipe with dry sand before you start bending it, and this should prevent it kinking while you are bending it - then empty the sand back out once you're finished bending it into the shape you want. A similar option is to fill the pipe with molten lead (or any other low melting point metal or alloy) and let it solidify before bending the tube into shape - then heat it back up with a blowtorch to melt the lead back out.
Anyway, once you have your helical copper tube radiator, mount it upright and feed the diesel heater exhaust in at the top, then out at the bottom - this will allow any condensed water to flow out at the bottom so the tube stays clear of blockages.
You lot need to look at the factbthat this in dangerous with the gas staying in the garage instead of going outside this is not good . Restricted flow also will not help your burn chamber
I appreciate your efforts, I hope this will mesh with what others have mentioned and increase your successes in the future.
First and foremost - your temperature readings are inaccurate. An infrared thermometer like that defaults to "emissivity" of 0.95 That of biological tissues. Trying to read a shiny pipe you will at least need to adjust the setting or do some math. But even then, it's not reliable. You can attach a piece of black tape if the temp is safe, or use a high temperature black paint, but the exhaust pipe is probably over 400C and will burn any paint.
Others mentioned the exhaust pipe will contain water vapor and form acids and need a drain outlet. Indeed the manual offers this option if the exhaust must route vertical, to drill a couple drain holes.
In addition, the length of the exhaust run is going to make it harder for combustion air to enter the burn chamber, adding stress on the motor and possibly reducing combustion efficiency.
I like the idea of waste heat capture, but this is more complicated and why high efficiency furnaces require more special materials and engineering.
Thx, great tip.
Awesome idea thank you!!!
Lie the pipe work flat, as though it was on the floor but suspended, and the condensation that may build up inside of it will be pushed out as it won't need to climb any pipe bends.
You'll just need to then vent the pipe to the outside for fume extraction.
NOT a bad idea, just get a coil of copper pipe & you wouldn't have so many pieces to solder together and more compact, I'm going to use a automotive aluminum radiator for such, and after the heater is turned off one can open the Radiator drain to let the condensation out, BUT remember to shut it before running again
DEAD MAN WALKING !!! exhaust outside there Einstein !!
Pipes are superfluous given that you're venting the exhaust into the room anyway. The exhaust should vent outside.
Won't work in the way you have done it. Number 1 you have reduced temperature to the point of condensation so your pipe is going to fill with water and cause a cut off condition from blocked exhaust. Number 2 even if you do continue at a downward slope with your pipe( take it out the wall low instead of jumping it backup like you have that holds the condensate) you have put multiple 90° elbows thus restricting your vent which has put a higher load on your purge system and will soon burn the main control motor up. Number 3 in the event you make it past these two by removing elbows and draining low your extension is still just too much and proven by your systems use of more power. So over time you will soot the inside of heat exchanger to the point of reducing efficiency beyond a usable amount.
If you truly want to pursue the line of thought of raising efficiency by removing btu's from the exhaust perhaps you should look into increasing your expanded heat exchanger to 2 or 2.5 inch with only two 90° elbows one turning down and the other turning outside. The last 10 inches of your pipe should be the same size as the first ten inches (factory size) to retain proper back presure. You will also have to put a drain in the bottom of the last elbow to prevent it from holding water and developing leaks from acidity over time.
how about running your exhaust pipe through a water tank to heat up water . I live in a caravan off grid so I will be using your idea to heat water for doing my dishes and having a shower
Excellent, I was wondering why people were not recovering the exhaust heat.
It supposedly clogs up the burn chamber because of increased back pressure. But I'm not sure if that's true or not. I'm wanting to do something like this
Try it with a 4' radiant piece with aluminum fins to disperse the heat and save a bunch of copper.
Add a turbo at the exhaust to help pull it through the 25 feet of pipe. Also put the intake outside, that way it don't burn up all your oxygen in the garage.
I bought a 30 foot pipe, not letting all that heat go outside!
The length and bends in that exhaust must restrict the burner air flow
Nice setup,maybe running pipe through blocks which will then retain the heat
Look at other videos, it is not recommend to use copper pipe for the exhaust with this style heater...the copper and Co2 don't mix, create acid and carbon monoxide problems...just a thought, good idea but you need slope so condensation can flow out.
I always wondered about why the efficiency of these is so low? You water heater needs only a PVC pipe for it to exhaust. A better design should be in order in the future. But for the cost of these things ? You can't really go wrong.
Exhaust condensate will eventually eat the copper pipe and you may risk carbon monoxide entering the room. That's why gas boilers must have a plastic condensate drain pipe.
It say's that you should not have the exhaust too long. A heat exchanget would be better.
A large tube around the exhaust with an air inlet with a computer fan going into the exchanger, and an exit coming out of the exchanger. Easy and safe, no fumes in the building and the oulet of the exhaust outside.
That is a great idea . Is it not dangrous to extend the exhaust? Does it not put pressure on the moter?
And running exhaust fumes thru copper puts of a gas that ain't good for us . I could be wrong . Run a pipe next to pipe and fill with water and you should get atleast warm water for a little bit
👍👍👍😜🏴🦄🦕😁✌️🤞
buenos días, yo he enrollado tubo cobre para climatización de 1/4 alrededor del tubo de salida de humos ,haciendo circular agua con una bomba de 12v , en cuanto a la alimentación eléctrica te aconsejo que compres una fuente alimentación 12v/30A valen 30 euros es el mejor sistema ,consume muy poquito .saludos
Good morning, I have rolled copper tube for air conditioning of 1/4 around the smoke outlet tube, circulating water with a 12V pump, in terms of power supply I advise you to buy a 12V/30A food source worth 30 euros It is the best system, it consumes very little.
I was thinking of using a small household water radiator to capture exhaust heat before venting outside.if you enter exhaust from the bottom it should prevent water build up.
Woah, the end should be going outside at the end, this is extremely dangerous!! Plus inside copper pipe will be water condensing, so the pipe needs to be lower than unit & allow water outside.
Unit sitting high up, use double radiator and feed exhaust in through top and out through bottom then pipe outside.
WATER BUILDS UP IN THE EXHAUST. YOU SHOULD NOT LOOP THE PIPE.
BAD BAD idea!!! condensation will be a problem, but the length of exhaust on these heaters should NEVER exceed 1 metre in length. Better option is to lack with copper pipe and use as water heater, add a radiator or use the hot water, its still using ur waste energy safely.
Noted
Can you use a finned pipe just like a baseboard heat radiator to get all the heat out of the exhaust?
my thought also. It will sure help. Make a much shorter exhaust with alufinncoolers soldered on the pipe. Those will steal alot the the heat from the tube.
I would have the end of exhaust outside. Also long exhaust might produce too much drag and choke the heater. Seen a lot using long tubes, why not bigger diameter.
Try running the pipe through sand, you’d effectively create a sand battery. Which you could hear water from or generate electricity
(The laser thermometer won't read copper pipe accurately (without re-calibrating for the emmissivity) - need to tape something black, & ideally matte, over any patch intending to measure.
Great idea! The burner is using heated air from the room/garage/shed for combustion.... it would be even more efficient to use outside air ... which also has a higher density of oxygen.
If there wasn’t so many turns in the exhaust and it was actually vented outside it might actually burn correctly. If it can’t get enough air it’s not going to be hot or efficient
Any 150w dc power supply is sufficient for powering this heater. ie, LED Driver,LED Power Supply IP67 Waterproof Output 150W DC12V 12.5A 3-Prong Plug 4.5feet. Thanks for the heat exchanger idea.
It's good but you have to many bends in the out pipe! Better to have a larger exhaust pipe on the end of the units own one, maybe double the size? Then bend it once through the wall to the outside. Also a heat exchanger would be a good add on along the length of pipe, Remember these need to slope down slightly to drain the water!
Could you make a copper piping coil in a cylinder, like a boiler and heat water throw the exhaust gases🔥💪that would be a useful way of using the exhaust. 💯👍
Hey!
Is a regular radiator good?
Will be many meters and bends for the exhaust gases to travel,
also build resistance for the fan/burner or?
Use base board heater pipe it has fins and will not need so pipe, always tip down so water does not build up.
Do you know why no exhaust manufacturers make exhausts out of copper?
Suppriest it didn’t kill you? Exhaust ? Carbon monoxide? Back into your garage? Genius !! Omg 😮 did he make any other videos after that weekend lol
Amazing idea little more copper pipe and send the fumes out perfect
I got a aluminum water tank from old motor home wondering if that would work to hold some of the heat
Great veerji very nice 🌹🌹 God bless you 🌹
Thanks
is having thermostat above heat exit tube not messing with restart of the unit?