Draco Ground Loop 16 Sept 2019
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- Опубліковано 15 вер 2019
- EVERYONE ONBOARD (3) OK!
Draco was departing Reno Stead this morning (16 Sept 2019) after sitting on Static Display during the Reno National Championship Air Races.
LINKS:
Mike's video of today's incident:
• I Crashed My Airplane ...
Draco walk around FF to 16:00 Blancolirio
• Reno LIVE Friday 13 Sept. - Наука та технологія
Mike (owner operator of Draco) already has a video up of today's incident. Something we can ALL learn from...ua-cam.com/video/NfctWAoDXvs/v-deo.html
That's the most regret-filled video ever.
"Don't be a show-off. Never be too proud to turn back. There are old pilots and bold pilots but there are no old, bold pilots"
Are you 100% sure that was a ground loop?
I am so Proud of Mike. He took full responsibility and everyone can and should learn from this experience. Once again JB, you are right on the spot.... Thanks, Weav
He will lose his ticket to fly, will he not?
@@sweepleader No
I'm Happy Everyone is OK!
The Loss of Draco is a Shame.
Mike will be just Fine.
Thanks Juan, Your Journalism is Above & Beyond!!
In about 1970 I got my Aeronca Chief into the roll cloud of one of those Missouri thunderstorms, flying at about 1000 feet AGL. The turbulence pushed the Aeronca almost over on its back despite me turning the control wheel all the way in the opposite direction. I had absolutely no control for a minute or so. I got out in front of the thunderstorm, headed into Illinois, and landed at a small private sod airport and tied down the airplane. After the squall line passed, decreasing ceilings and rain followed and I took off to get home. Crossing back across the river, I got into low ceilings and rain. I didn’t have any trouble navigating, however, because I was low enough to read the road signs on the interstate highway below, and managed to miss the wires (but not by much). It was also a 100% pucker factor event because the windshield wasn’t properly sealed at the bottom and rain was leaking across the top of the dash and running down on my legs. I was praying the water wasn’t going to short out the magnetos or ignition. So, Mike Patty I have that T shirt too, and those are the days you find out you aren’t Superman! Thanks to blancolirio for posting the info and best of luck to you all.
Holy smokes, it was almost surreal to watch that footage. Bummer that Draco is down but thank goodness Mike and everyone else onboard is unharmed! Man I still can’t believe it!
Thanks for the amazingly quick upload, Juan!
Thank you Jaun so much for sharing this .Iam so sorry about Draco. But even more relived that no one got hurt. Poor Mike wish him the best!!
What a shame that was a beautiful plane and he had so much work in it. Thank God no one was hurt. Thanks Juan for sharing this with us. Been praying for you my friend. Have a great day. God Bless!!!
A superior pilot uses his superior judgement to avoid having to use his superior skills.
That about sums it up.
Mind you, those skills are not genetic, at least in training they have to push the envelope, especially if the idea is to land in the bush. But I get your point and you're right.
Im sure if he would have turned entirly into the wind it wouldhave been fine. Just he didnt want to piss off the tower. Lack of judgment overall. Already admitted it in his video
@Zepherian
No... not really.
This airplane and these types of operations are about seeing how far the envelope can be pushed.
It’s not about bush flying... because plenty of pilots have and still do access the bush with far more pedestrian aircraft.
It’s like seeing a jacked up diesel pickup stuck up to the window sills in mud as I gently drive by in a front wheel drive minivan on my way to a trailhead.
Arma3 509th go back to the circus sideshow
It's actually a good thing the aircraft came apart because that absorbed a lot of energy that could have injured the passengers.
It was a ground loop, likely not much energy transfer to the occupants.
@@UncleKennysPlace It was after the right hand ground loop that I was referring to. Up on the left wing, then a straight drop to the ground. Looked kind of abrupt.
@@UncleKennysPlace it ground looped on the runway. Then side slammed off the runway.
@@TheJttv It was not a ground loop, he pointed the nose into the wind once it became airborne it then stalled his controls and rolled over, go watch mikes video on his channel he explains it all in detail.
@@FarmerFpv Dude the plane was NEVER airborne! Look again and you will see that the right wheel NEVER left the ground. So therefore on the ground and looping around = "ground loop"
Report on Aviation Safety Network says "groundloop" aviation-safety.net/wikibase/229076
A PZL-104 Draco Turbine Wilga ground looped during takeoff from Reno-Stead Airport, NV (KRTS). The pilot was attempting to depart before a weather front arrived at the airport. Winds were picking up.
The left wing lifted during takeoff and the aircraft swerved off the right side of the runway, coming down hard and causing a wing to collapse.
The occupants were reportedly not injured.
Thank you for sharing. Love your work. Keep it up.
Thanks Juan for the very timely reporting.
I really enjoy your videos Juan. I'm glad everybody is okay. These are races are crazy fun to watch. Thank you so much for covering the event. I'm sitting in the heartland of Iowa and I'm pretty sure they don't do this kind of crap in my neighborhood so your videos bring me much joy thank you so much thank you so much I'll see you next time thank
Glad everyone is ok. I enjoyed all the close up detailed stuff you Juan Browne
Hey Juan. Love watching your videos. As a tail dragger pilot, home builder and former owner of a Wilga I can tell you that even trying to keep a standard Wilga straight down the runway with the 280hp radial was difficult enough when you opened the throttle to full power. Even in low cross wind. It initially required almost full right rudder until the rudder gained authority. With that massive power and torque effect up front, the extended wings and the serious cross wind it was bound to happen. So sorry for Mike but so glad it ended well with everyone being ok. Keep up the good work bud.
Thanks Vincent!
Such a sad loss. Heart breaking to see when we think of the contagious passion and talent Mike pored into designing and building that amazing plane. Glad to see that Mike, his family and friends came out unscathed. Draco was an amazing plane until the end, saving its passengers. Thanks for the report Juan!
Really sorry to see that happen but most importantly, everyone is safe.
Thanks Juan for the best and most comprehensive happenings at Reno. Enjoying your updates.
Damn!!! great looking bird, sorry to hear about this news. I sure hope all is well with Mike and crew.
one broken nail of his wife. lucky
Thank you Juan for your accurate and respectful reporting of this unfortunate event. All safe, thank goodness.
Yet another example of the consequences of a “Got to go now” attitude. Winds gusting above the aircrafts shown rotation speed tells me there was a serious lack of judgement shown by the PIC. Tie it down and wait it out, But now this beautiful machine is totaled. Sad day in aviation for sure,
BRAWURA I LEKCEWAŻENIE AKTUALNYCH WARUNKÓW POGODOWYCH TO SĄ GŁÓWNE PRZYCZYNY TEGO WYPADKU.
Fast as ever with the news Juan, sad to see the demise of such a lovely aircraft but great they all got out. thanks for the post
Thank you for sharing your story, God bless you and your family
Talk about timely productions! Keep up the great work!
Holy crap! Thank god they all walked away! This is an aeronautical TRAGEDY, Mike has put his soul into that aircraft.
Stuart Savage watch Mike’s video. He readily admits he screwed up.
Classy of you to bash him
Stuart Savage .... Captain hindsight, thank goodness you’re here to tell mike what he readily admits was totally his fault
Don't feed the Trolls.
Insolent Stickleback
Savage
I do too, you’re a dick and a smart ass.
Glad you think you’re somebody. Ppl like you are hilarious.
@@DAllan-lz3lg just because Mike built a sick aircraft that we are all jealous of doesn't mean he can't make mistakes. Fuck draco, what if this was worse and one of his passengers had got seriously hurt. No one should be flying in 35 gusts across the runway, it's bloody reckless and he's abusing his power doing so.
Its ashame, the price for rushed confidence could have taken a vastly greater toll. Pleased all aboard are safe, glad you, Jenny and all enjoyed the week prior to Draco's brush.
Take good care of yourself. Your lovely family needs you healthy.
I will only be disappointed if it was not a learning experience. Glad we still still have Mike and no one got hurt.
Thanks for the info Juan!!! That's a shame, I follow Mike Patey's channel and Draco since he built her!
I'm very glad to hear all aboard are ok! That's great news at least! Draco has a beast of an engine at 650 hp. I know he had recently redesigned the landing gear according to a video I watched awhile ago, not that that has anything at all to do with what happened, but that left wing being higher than the right side before take off roll must have caused some concern. I'm sure he will post a video about it before too long.
Sad news!
It would have been rolling on the big tyres too. Lots of clear warning signs were missed. Poor pilot skills.
Thanks Juan - thank God all got away safely. We can fix machines 👍
So glad no one is hurt. Aircraft can be replaced. Patey I'm sure will learn much from this accident.
Wrong Mike's lovely wife broke a nail! I'm sure no-one will "learn" that building a million dollar experimental plain the can't even compete for glory! But can kill you a thousand different ways, to silly ME & me [only] demonstrates a psychotic addiction for the rush of thrill seeking & showing off how cool one is! I.E. quoting Mike "Nothing cooler or thrilling than flying 200 feet off the the ground & 400 MHP." I bet that was the last thing that went through cool dady Ron Halladay's mind, if it wasn't that pesky firewall
Thanks for the update Juan. I am a bit surprised her took off in those conditions, but that was his call. Glad they are all OK! Mike was a great guy when I met him at the AOPA LVK flyin.
Thanks for the update Juan. I just left Mike a comment on his site giving him my sympathies for the loss of his baby. Even he called DRACO his baby. And he just finished his new struts. My heart went out to him.
I work in reno, the wind was screaming this morning
@a10warthog61 no I wasnt..sorry
He did stay with it all the way to the unfortunate stop though. Gotta give the guy credit for doing what was probably the rudder pedal jig of his lifetime. Sure he couldn't save the plane at that point, it was already too late. But it does look like he tried to "crash it as gently as possible" as weird as that sounds, it can make a ton of difference for the people onboard
That incredible landing gear system he built had an enormous amount to do with that "gentle" crash. In the slow motion replay you can see the first and second hit on the gear, then the wing breaks as the left main collapses. That gear system saved their lives, but yeah buddy he was flying it until it wasn't flying anymore.
The video Mike posted should be MANDATORY viewing for all pilots but certainly every student pilot and anyone who flies a "Light-Sport" aircraft.
Thank you for the update
Oh, man.. I've been following that plane for a few years now... such a shame.. glad that everyone's ok tho.
Just after adding new wing tips too...
It's actually been just over a year since Draco was "born".
New Wing tips, gas tanks,completely new suspension
@@fisherohvf-men623 New shapes, new wrinkles, new scrapes.
@@roymoon1 yeah, I'm definitely not liking Draco's "newest" look but man I'm glad everyone walked away
@@UncleKennysPlace well like march 2018 to sep 2019 she had a good run.
So sorry to hear about this, but very relieved to see that nobody was hurt.
Thanks again Juan. I was wondering and you had the report.
Just finished watching Mike's video on this... so glad this was a "walk away".
Juan- ready for some good news lately. Love to hear a report of how the Draco rebuild is going, how everyone is doing and especially some pics of the process.
Thank you Juan. Everyone is okay! Fantastic!
Hi Juan! As you said, everybody is OK. I have followed Mike (and Mark) for some time. It's funny how you come to "know" people in this way. I was so relieved that they were OK.
Very unfortunate but glad nobody was hurt. High crosswinds, high wings, and tail draggers, make for some interesting events. Thanks for posting, Juan. 👍
Auger in solo is one thing, but Wow, and he rolled the dice with (two) other people on board? That's the REAL bad part.
very poor piloting indeed.
The Draco sure was a beautiful plane. Mike had installed bumpers on the wingtips of the plane because as he said: “Almost every Wilga in existence has been ground looped”. Mike’s fear of ground looping was well founded, unfortunately his wingtip bumpers couldn’t save him and his plane from the conditions which he found himself.
So sad. But glad everyone is okay. That's what is important. Thanks JB!
On a plus note that rain front was heading directly toward the 54K acre Walker Fire. Hopefully there's enough rain to finally contain the remaining burns.👍
Juan... Thanks for updater. Beautiful plane, custom everything
At least Mike is alright. He'll rebuild DRACO, and it will be more BadAss then it was before! 😎👌💪💪💪
They all walked away. *_That_* is the most important thing.
DRACO can be rebuilt, Mike and his passengers could not be.
@OsakaRose
You are absolutely right about that. It's hard news indeed, and painful to watch.
You say that, but Mike would probably good go at rebuilding the wetware ;) Glad no one was hurt though. Any landing you can walk away from and all that.
@Paul Carpenter
I can absolutely see Mike salvaging everything possible from DRACO, I believe he is building another STOL airplane already. I think he calls it SCRAPPY, but I'm not certain of that as I am getting the information second hand.
With the wings torn off, I think Juan is right about it being "Totaled" by the insurance company, but usually the owner has the option of buying it back for parts. At least that is how it works with automobiles, but again, I'm not certain.
As with all things, only time will tell.
@@davide.burden2043 Yes, his new plane is called Scrappy, made from a crashed, er, either a kitfox or cub, can't remember. We've seen the wings off Draco before, I would be about 95% sure that he will fly again.
@Paul Carpenter
Seems as though you have better sources than I do. That's great, thanks for the info.
Couple of guys on the flight back to Texas yesterday were talking about this. One had the video of the accident. I've since seen Mike's video, takes a big man to admit his mistakes. Thankfully no one was hurt.
Sorry I didn't get to run into you at the races, the STOL drag races are a good idea, they were a lot of fun.
What a bummer, thanks Juan for showing us that..
All of us experienced pilots (no doubt) have memories of the time we should have turned around, taxiied back, took another route, delayed, cancelled....many of us got away with close calls. It hurts to see this happen to a great guy, but no injuries, a blessing and guys like him will come back stronger than ever. Flying is unforgiving, but it is magnificent.
So sad. Thank God Mike and everyone is ok. He did an amazing video post crash...very humble. Time to get on with Draco II.
Could be the angle but right wing looked really low even before takeoff roll? Man that sucks!!
The wind was lifting the left wing, this is a major disadvantage of his long-travel off road suspension, he's talked about it in his videos. It makes it easier for a cross wind to tip the aircraft and the higher the windward wingtip goes the more cross wind gets under it. I'm just glad nobody was injured!
Good speculation, albeit still speculation ATM, but it does look like the starboard wing never gained any sufficient lift, which was a disaster based on direction of the crosswind that was pushing [the already high] port wing over.
@@Mister510 I actually did something very similar in my Skyhawk; ground up a wingtip, and folded the prop. Once the upwind wing is lifted, on a high-wing plane, the fuselage blocks all wind to the downwind wing, and at low speeds the ailerons haven't enough authority.
@@cup_and_cone - The owner discusses it in his video the wind was bottoming out his right strut before he even started his roll everything about the accident was wind induced
@@PabloGonzalez-hv3td why did he go then, seems really stupid. Especially with pax in the back. The way it's sitting even before the start of the roll.
THANK YOU JUAN....... Draco is the center of my wall photos over my desk......wow......., I am bummed out........................... SO HAPPY all were O.K. .
Go fever strikes yet again. 😔 Rip Draco 2018-2019
Such a bummer! I got to see Draco at Oshkosh this year. What a BEAST!
Dude mad respect for how he owns up to it like a man ... Just says yep 100% my fault ...dont see that to often seems like a great guy cant wait to see the other plane hes building
It could be a blessing in disguise. He may have pushed it too far in other ways in the future and not walked away.
Sorry to see Dracos demise ! Glad no one hurt ! Wilga's are uncommon for a reason . They are prone to crosswind ground looping as bone stock STOL airplanes due to their narrow track and high wing. As I recall Helio Couriers/Stallions had similar crosswind issues . Mike lavished a lot of attention and talent on improving his Wilga's performance . Its possible some of those improvements contributed to the ground loop . Flying on the edge is always risky business and Mike has taken full responsibility for the incident. Thanks for the up date Juan !
I never thought I'd see one of your crash report videos feature Draco!
What a shame. Situational awareness. Damn.
Happy to hear they are all physically ok...hope you get a big, long break from doing these crash videos soon
Gethomeitis strikes again. Such a shame. Glad everyone walked away ok!🥺
I saw that airplane at EAA in Oshkosh a couple years ago. Very impressive it was. That was an expensive ground loop.
I don’t see how it’s a ground loop. The wind got under him and the opposite of a good crosswind take off happened. Once airborne, there is no ground loop dynamic. The ground loop has everything to do with the gear, which is under braking, being forward of the cg causing a tricky instability.
so glad there wasn't a fire!! I was there but left earlier Sunday.. Looked but didn't see you Juan
Damn... That's too bad, I loved Draco.
So much blood, sweat, and tears went into that plane.
Knowing Mike though, I can't wait to see his next masterful design.
R.I.P. Draco, don't fret though, Draco V2.0 is going to be absolutely incredible!
Looks like Mike had a crosswind gust at the worst possible moment. Don't know about "totaled" though...he's the fabrication master!
well he is a master but the amount of work, it would be better to get a all new airframe and start again..
both main spars are snapped, the gears going to be bent.. the engine need to be sent out.
I don't think we'll be seeing this dragon back... if I'm correct that was a 90 degree crosswind with the extra 4 feet of wing per side just a little too much... e6bx.com/wind-components/
@@zbeast+
There are no other Wilga's available. I believe that Mike had purchased serial number 1, then later sold it and purchased the last Wilga produced, possibly serial 14 or 16.
@@gungadinn That's not true, if you have the money you can get a Wilga. Did a quick search and found several for sale.
hvachessler . Your right there are lots of Wilga's available, but unfortunately only one Draco and one Mike Patey! RIP Draco😥 . Let's get to work, Mike👍 🇨🇦
Very sorry to hear of Mr. Pateys incident today. Thankfully everyone walked away unhurt, thats the main thing. No doubt he will soon be back in the workshop working his magic. regards from the west of Ireland
Thanks for the report Juan. Like you said the only important thing is that everyone walked away. It sucks the Draco is gone but Mike is alive to build another plane.
Thanks for the report Juan ! 🇺🇸
👨✈️ error... Should have lifted straight into the wind... only takes like ten feet in the Draco to get aloft in that wind
he was having a hard time taxiing and declined to go to the other runway which would have provided less of a crosswind. tried to time the wind gusts and it all fell apart quick.
@@ded1333 He doesn't even need the runway.
@@BrilliantDesignOnline yep. go watch mikes video. he decided against just taking off into the wind. made a lot of mistakes in a very short amount of time.
That airplane was so capable, it instilled overconfidence I believe
it's that final suspension upgrade that contributed to this issue I believe, the wing was already tipping to one side before starting the takeoff
Just spoke with him briefly at the races yesterday. For those who haven't seen that aircraft up close--it's BIG.
The wind was howlin' at Stead yesterday and here at South Lake Tahoe today.
Snowed here, too.
I am so relieved that Mike Patey is okay! I don't want to leave the house today because of the cold, wind and rain. I saw Trent (I think) and three other Flying Cowboys overfly my house northbound about 0900 L this morning, heading toward Oregon. Hope they made it safely around the squall line. I have two aircraft tied down in the infield at Stead. Both are low-wing. Hope they are okay, also.
Be nice to know if he cut power as soon as he saw problems. Glad everytone walked away. Must have been a prefrontal downdraft that was invisible. Maybe put in a lidar at airport as it would have detected that gust or gusts previous to flight. Dont think they are that expensive now. I worked on Lidar in the early 70s and our sensor cost $500k and we could only go out 8 miles in the lower atmosphere. My friend developed software that would take the PDP8 data and calculate groups of wind like this puff.
Great report and video.
Oh that is just so very unfortunate. Gotta feel for the guy.
Glad everyone is ok and thanks for the update. A sudden and unexpected crosswind gust of wind I can accept however with that type of aircraft and pilot experience would there not have been the possibility of taking off from the grass more directly into the wind? Non-pilot comment.
Should have clicked on the link before commenting. Hindsight is always 20/20
Glad no injuries. I always felt Draco was pushed to the extreme virtually flight due to modified design and all the testing he did with it. Beautiful machine, sad to see that happen. Very poor conditions, every machine has it's limits. I'm sure will rebuild Draco 2.... better, faster, slower, carry more, weigh less, even more kick-ass turboprop and engine. RIP Draco! My condolences to owner.
Thank you
😣 DANG !! "main thing" (ALL OK) thanks Juan for the update!🤔
48 knot gusts will get the best of anyone, even a large aircraft
Thank goodness all are ok. Racing the weather one way or another often results in bad outcomes.
Glad he is ok. Like Juan, Mike seems like an amazing human.
a10warthog61 - what makes you think I’m a man?
a10warthog61 - I'm surprised someone like you, who makes comments such as you did, watches Juan's videos. You clearly aren't cut from the same fabric as the other viewers and so I hope you think before you write such juvenile comments in the future.
So glad everyone's OK. Such a beautiful airplane... Shame. All that hard work by Mike... Well, what matters is that noone got hurt.
I don't know if that was technically a ground loop. It appears the strong crosswind just blew it off the runway.
It was NOT a ground loop!
@@flextape9840 Loss of directional control while taking off, close enough! I do get the distinction though. The sad part is, due the crowd and the tower, (lot's of eyeballs, pressure to do not do anything that may appear too unusual) he didn't takeoff more into the that crosswind, and that was the first thing he mentioned in his video. No mystery here.....He's a real good pilot, not much question about that. Maybe a tad too traditional, in not just thinking "to hell with the tower, I'm taking off across the runway". I have no doubt that on his own, on a deserted strip, it wouldn't have happened.
@@portnuefflyer , you are correct. I have much respect for Mike. . . And he is a great pilot.
I have been watching his build, saw Draco at Airventure, glad they're ok.
Get thereitus? Guy is an amazing builder, thank god no one was hurt!
Ten Millimeter , Mike Patey owner / builder / pilot
oh man-Mike put a lot of effort,hours,and money into that aircraft. Glad he’s okay!
If any plane didnt need a runway it was Draco. I would guess it could take off using just the width if the runway but I guess that is not permitted at a conventional airport or mayhem would result. It will be fixed, Im sure . Just a glitch, hopefully
Really sad news, followed the building of draco and it’s phenomenal impact on the aviation industry. Glad mike is ok, hopefully his efforts on scrappy will accelerate now.
KOM CPT Indeed. He’ll have lots of spare parts 😂 Massive brain fart to take off but he acknowledges it and it’ll stay with him forever.
Thank you Juan. Important thing is everyone walked away.
Thanks Juan!!
Sorry I didn't get to meet you over the weekend!
You did a phenomenal job during the Stol races! Whenever I saw you, you were going 90 KPH and didn't want to interrupt.
I do hope the Stol races will be back next year at Reno!
Pls let us know how we can help contacting RARA to let them know how much we enjoyed the races.
In the past they never returned my e-mails regarding having a booth there.
Another thorough accident report, Juan. Many, many thanks. Very glad the pilot and passengers are okay. If I were the airport regulation god, I would allow the STOL aircraft to take off in any damn direction they chose whenever significant crosswinds pick up. The air traffic control guys "might" have a different opinion.
even i em glad that they are safe and sound! Thanks fore news Juan!... We are all humans and makes mistakes
but the importen ting are that no one get injured! or pay ultimate prize Thanks again Brown! Hope that u are alright Mike!...
So glad they all made it out. I have been following him for a few years. He will fix it, or he will build something else with some of the parts. His blog, he was working on some sort of landing gear improvement. He is always thinking. He is something else.
Great airplane. Sorry to hear about this. Mother Nature sets the bar.
Man! That is really disappointing. Of course very glad all on board and on the ground are ok. Having pushed the envelope more times than I care to admit, I certainly cannot fault the driver, but man o man o man, I bet rethinking that go-no-go decision will occupy many moments in the near future. God speed to future adventures Mike! I bet you put bigger ground loop skids on the wingtips on Draco II!!!
As a sailor I learned that trying to beat the weather is a recipe for ending up in a bad situation. My grandmother would often state 'Haste makes waste'. So true when you are in a hurry to get somewhere with artificial deadlines - you might end up dead instead.
OMG - poor Draco. Hope Mike can sort it out eventually and glad no injuries.
JB I see VS just did 777 that looks like it had a compressor stall. It would be great to see how you work the problems while flying the plane! We don't get many 777 emergency flights with ATC, fuel dump and single engine.