Nainoa Thompson on Polynesian Wayfaring | StarTalk with Neil deGrasse Tyson
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- Опубліковано 24 вер 2019
- Watch as Neil deGrasse Tyson interviews master navigator Nainoa Thompson about techniques for using using the stars to navigate the oceans.
This originally aired on StarTalk with Neil deGrasse Tyson on the National Geographic Channel. You can listen to the full episode as a podcast here: www.startalkradio.net/show/th...
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Science meets pop culture on StarTalk! Astrophysicist & Hayden Planetarium director Neil deGrasse Tyson, his comic co-hosts, guest celebrities & scientists discuss astronomy, physics, and everything else about life in the universe. Keep Looking Up!
#StarTalk #NeildeGrasseTyson #NainoaThompson - Наука та технологія
Nainoa Thompson was taught by Mau Piailug how to navigate by stars in the 70's. Mau Piailug was one of the last master navigators left in the world at the time, navigating by the stars in the open ocean. Native Hawaiians like Nainoa Thompson, had lost the knowledge of celestial navigation in the centuries past. Native Hawaiians used to regularly navigate between Hawaii and Tahiti for 200-400 years but suddenly stopped in the 14th century. Mau Piailug's people in Micronesia still practiced celestial navigation into the 20th century because the Micronesian islands are smaller and more spread out than the Hawaiian islands, so they retained the knowledge for survival, requiring them to celestial navigate between islands.
Mahalo for this history and knowledge. Papa Mau is beyond belief - he helped to revive and preserve the Polynesian culture as we see it today. My new life's mission is to further the culture of Polynesians, Hawaiians, and the local people of Hawaii who established the Hawaiian local cuture via the sugar cane plantations.
This shows how smart Polynesians,Micronesians,Melanesia’s were
Not just smart but daring. It’s one thing to deduce something. It another thing to stake your life proving that deduction correct.
In Tonga, where my ancestors are from, the Moala and Toutai family are 2 of the many family's who are specifically in charge of navigating the King's royal vessels from ancient times even to this day. They still know how to use the old voyage techniques but it is very sacred and is not taught to anyone but those specific families in Tonga. That's why Papa Mau ended up teaching the Micronesian way of navigation as it relates more to Hawaii being so far up North. The Tongan Royals and noblemen still have the ability to navigate the old Polynesian way even to this day using Toloa (The flying duck) aka Orions belt which points to different islands according to their locations. During the day they go by the sun's movement in the sky, ocean current, water temperature, pulse of the water, fish species, bird migrations, clouds formations and colors and so much more. ✊🏾 God bless!
(Edit: Here is part of the video I wish they kept the entire thing up. Only difference is recent discoveries show Polynesia was settled by my ancestors 1000 B.C. by the Lapita migration group and not 1300 A.D.) ua-cam.com/video/DT_MGuZlcFY/v-deo.html
Your Tongan friend from Utah
Oh true bro
Malo te ma'uli mai Uvea mo Futuna toko
Its a year late but do you have any other information on these tongan navigators? Malo
samoa/tonga was settled by the lapita thousands of years ago as you say but hawaii, new zealand, easter island were only settled around 1300AD.
Love it toko. GREAT to know the practice ain't completely lost.
This ability to create a mental construct is very important problem solving tool in most of physics
Polynesian Stick Charts are another cool navigation tool they used to describe ocean current flows to easily move island from to island.
Also reading the way clouds are over land vs over sea I believe.
Tupaia’s Endeavour
Sticks charts are from Marshall Islands(Located in Micronesia).
Correct
Credit to Micronesian who still practice navigating this way and taught him.
Mahalo, Papa Mau!
@Cha Caha... Reeducated him? Mahalo Papa Mau!!! BTW are you Yapese and from Satawal?
Im not sure it's something you really have to practice to pass down. Once you got it all figured out you can basically write down how.
Much respect on that note and much Alofa from 🇼🇸
Amazing man with great knowledge that nainoa thompson. Simple man. From a simple place. My home. Hawaii. 🙏🏼
And humble also. He's a gift to us all.
With out Papa mau, his nothing! Pretty sure Micronesian Best Navigators deserve that seat!
Stars talk as we talk about the Stars 🌟
Excellent observation and comments by Nainoa Thompson!!!
Fascinating! I am certified in celestial nav and have made three voyages from the US west coast. But I never felt that the stars were internalized like this gentleman describes. I'm sure there is much more and now I am going to find out. Thanks!
Interesting.
Please, if I may ask, out of curiosity; voyaged "from the U.S. West Coast" to where?
@@dayne876 Hi Dayne. Three seperate journeys. Honolulu, Tokyo and Sydney. We have a 41' sloop. Did some bare boat chartering out of the Fl Keys and Bahamas but that's pretty much coastal cruising. It's been suck a treat to see the Southern Cross! How about you?
There is much much more. My ancestors were the greatest navigator to sail the seas. Thousands of years before Columbus. They sailed to different islands in Polynesian, Melanesia, Micronesia and Indonesia like it was driving to the store. My great grandfather used to sail this way when taking my Mom and her cousins to and from different islands in Tonga for school. 💯✊🏾 I could go on for days about majoring the old Polynesian way.
Misleading info. We navigated using the stars but not like this idiot explains. Thru voyages story telling would be efficient to make the voyage. Singing, prayers,and alot of fishing🤦🤣🤷
Even 'till now this goes on in The many Islands of "Tonga" and "Samoa".
The stars and the Cosmos were always there for the world to utilize and our people did also. Ancestor aftrr ancestors would pass down the story telling and singing and the nurturing of the generations to come to understand these critical ways and tools to survive...
Everything our people did was through and for GOD. And there their knowledge was always new.
Amazing!! Didn't know that was possible. But now I need another one. So I really hope some one is putting together future episodes and topics and what not.
Full interview please?? I’ll even pay for this interview
Hey Star Talk keep up the good work
This has made me so happy!!
Polynesians were the greatest navigators
Wow. Too short. Tell me more 💓
ua-cam.com/video/TWm52IPPZjI/v-deo.html Nainoa providing a demonstration of the technique. Fascinating.
In the details is a link to listen to the hole podcast.
Please expand on this and look at the interconnections of the varying P.I. cultures when looking at the navigation techniques and engineering.
Micronesians retaught other Islanders (that forgot) the way of navigating by stars.
Yes Mau Piailug (Micronesian) taught Nainoa Thompson (Hawaiian) and the other Hawaiian navigators on the Hokulea because my people, the native Hawaiians loss the knowledge of celestial wayfinding. Mau Piailug was one of the few master navigators left in the world at the time that was still practicing the ancient tradition of wayfinding.
@James 23 Well I guess there is not such place as Europe either since our ancestors didn't even know it existed... Pretty dumb comment, James. I mean, why did you call the Pacific the Pacific, that was the name given to it by a Frenchman. Or are you going to say the Pacific doesn't exist either? As people evolve so do languages, just because Micronesia isn't etymologically a 'nesian' word doesn't mean that the place itself doesn't exist.
Bruno Mars says who? Most Micronesians still hold onto the navigational knowledge.
Micronesia and Polynesia come from the same root of ancestry
And we are forever grateful for our cousins in the west.
That's incredible.
Knew about the wooden compass, did not know the whole story of how it worked! Cool!!!!
So if you can sail from polynesian islands to Hawaii and tiny Easter island You could also reach the Americas.
They did and there is evidence to prove it....
Awesome
Wheres the full episode
Everyone is always wrapped up in what has happened in the last 5 to 7,000 years because of religious beliefs and history. Star procession takes 26000 years and would take much longer to realize coming full circle and that knowledge would have to be passed on. I'm thinking we have been around as modern humanoids longer then they give our ancient humanoid ancestors credit.
Longer than 7000 years? Yeah, of course we have. The oldest confirmed modern human we have found is 300 000 years old, if I remember correctly, but I think the theoretical limit is twice that. Something to do with the last point when we must have split from the neanderthals.
_Writing_ is 5000 years old. That's why the last 5000 years are particularly interesting because we get an insight into their thoughts and reasoning. Not just the How's but the Why's also.
If you fill your star houses with enough stars that you can set direction any time you can see stars because something in the house is always on or near enough to the horizon that works when stars are visible. What about during the day, how accurate do you have to keep time during daylight to know how to calculate your direction considering any shadow depends on latitude and time of day?
Good question!
we have the sun the nearest star
Star navigation is one thing but it isn’t the only tool to how Pacific Islanders navigate. They use currents and wind to deduce where they are.
Where’s the full interview
where can we find the full episode in video?
This episode is only available on NatGeo’s website
stars are hot.
Yeah Sol's a hottie and Luna is pretty chill.
Polynesians are the first to travel vast distance from new zealand the samoan islands hawaii Easter island and to the Americas some say they made it as far as alaska - polynesian and native Americans DNA share the same ancestor
no, native americans have no polynesian dna.
@@eeeaten HOW DO YOU NO THAT II AM MAORI AND A LOT OF OF MAORI LOOK LIKE RED INDIANS,INDIANS,MEXICANS, INCA,WE ARE POLYNESIAN,FROM 1000+yrs A GO WE LOOK LIKE MANY MORE, EVEN PAKEHA.
@@malwalker2682 a similar look is not a genetic connection.
I use wayfaring about destinations ...not so much maps and really don't trust GPS ( in what has gotten me lost before with malfunction.) The sun is a star that one can wayfare when one wants to know direction in the day.
Not the same as ancestor wayfaring though.
That technique gives you a compass you can use on a clear night when stars near the horizon are visible. What about during the day? The sun would give only an approximate direction unless you know precisely what time it is. If you know the time, you use could use something like a sundial in reverse, but they didn’t have clocks.
More importantly, even a modern precise compass will only get you so far. Even after a relatively short passage, you could be miles off course, if you don’t have a way to determine your position. That would be disastrous trying to find a small island in the middle of the Pacific.
European style celestial navigation depends on precise timekeeping to determine longitude. Did the Polynesians have a way to determine longitude via the stars on longer passages? (They used wave swells to help locate islands when they were close.)
@@Eric14492 they already had longtitude or lat one of them anyway that was one of cooks main missions when traveling to the pacific was to chart Jupiter’s moon crossing the sun or something giving mathematical information for the missing longtitude or lat
Sun is used, position of the sun is used to determine a fair guess on time however yes you are right this left it open to on off chances be charting off course but they checked at first chance at night and see how they are traveling
Winds, current, wildlife etc also bro
Polynesian are the real Vikings
Mapping stars before it became common knowledge
#bluebackyard
I highly recommend this documentary if anyone reading is interested in learning more about Mau Piailug and wayfinding navigation in Oceania:
ua-cam.com/video/uxgUjyqN7FU/v-deo.html
Aloha 😊⛵️🤙🏼
Tonga Lapita Origin of Polynesia 😊
Holy shit! Mintaka is a real star?! I thought the Star Trek writers made that up O.O
Mintaka 3 :)
Polynesian uses star, cloud, sea movement, certain creatures as birds...
Lol okay
yup! stars for direction and latitude. clouds to see islands from further away. sea movements for dead reckoning. birds to find direction to land.
TheRock: You’re welcome.
People: Ok. We get it.
*Nainoa name in the description is wrong
Also it should say Mocronesian navigation not Polynesian
@@palmtrees2664 are you dumb
I LOVE THE PART WHERE THE GUEST TELLS NEIL DEGRASSE TYSON THAT YOU HAVE TO IMAGINE IT'S A FLAT EARTH FOR THIS TO WORK AND THEN NEIL DEGRASSE TYSON HOLD HIS ARMS OUT IN I ORDERED TO DESCRIBE WHAT THE FLAT EARTH WOULD LOOK LIKE AS YOU'RE NAVIGATIG IT WITH STARS
ABSOLUTELY FUCKING HILARIOUS SO SO HILARIOUS🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
Ancient science, not superstition.
So explain why we see the same stars our ancestors saw if our solar system is flying thru 'space'. Wouldn't we be seeing different pairs/paterns of stars if that were true. Cmon science lol.
@@raztahking we see the same stars at different locations. only nearby stars change much.
@nmarbletoe8210 It wouldn't be possible if our solar system is moving thru space.. but yet we see the same stars rising and setting that the ancients saw.
@@raztahking it's moving very slow compared to the distances between stars. but i think there are stars that have moved since recorded history -- Orion's belt maybe. didn't it used to be more straight?
WHAT SCIENTIFIC EXPERIMENT RENDERED SCIENTIFIC EVIDENCE USING THE SCIENTIFIC METHOD THAT PROVES ANY OF YOUR HELIOCENTRIC THEORIES TO BE TRUE????
Your scientific experiment only has to be done to satisfy your ego 😂😂😂 and you hit nail on the head a scientific experiment is only an experiment .. even when you think that it’s behaved the same way time and time again I’m now going to say this is in fact true and scientific fact .. something else will change it and now what ?
@@mataafa1 NO.... A EXPERIMENT IS JUST AN EXPERIMENT......
BUT A SCIENTIFIC EXPERIMENT IS IN A CLASS OF ITS OWN....... SCIENTIFIC CLASS👍🏼😎👍🏼
@@Jason_Family_Man ah actually no it’s not sorry to bust your bubble. A scientific experiment requires experiment conducted to measure the results observing and refining the variables until there are few variables to contend with and an outcome has been measured and recorded that we can then predict in future. But no experiment ever has all the variables or possibilities covered .. therefore western science relies on the basis that the result will most likely behave like the past 🤦🏽♂️
@@Jason_Family_Man class of its own 🤦🏽♂️🤦🏽♂️😂😂😂😂 yeah ok
@@mataafa1 THE PROBLEM HERE IS ....YOU DON'T UNDERSTAND THAT "EXPERIMENTS" FALL INTO MANY CLASSIFICATIONS
🤦🏻♂️🚩🤦🏻♂️🚩🤦🏻♂️
WHY DO I EVEN WASTE MY TIME TALKING TO MOMOS THAT CAN'T.... CAN'T COMPREHEND 🤷🏻♂️😴🤷🏻♂️😴🤷🏻♂️😴🤷🏻♂️ BORING AF
Remember that time a US aircraft carrier tried to intimidate a Spanish lighthouse to veer 15 degrees to avoid collision? Didn't have a star compass. 😂
Best story ever! I heard it was a battleship, but same same idea.
Funny how mix palagis tell us about our culture smh
Why should it matter which tiny island the man comes from? He has knowledge of ancient navigation. Be happy someone retained that knowledge because it nearly died out recently.
I admit it i didnt know what i was thinking writing this comment. I apologize for my ignorance.
Dr. Tyson,
You should invite Sadguru for a discussion. Fireworks for sure 🔥.
Please do consider.
Regards
Bowditch
Maori polynesians
Neil Degrasse Tyson is a black man which means his ancestors are the oldest people on earth who are the originators of navigating using stars so not only does he not know history he doesn’t know science either 🤦🏾♂️
uhm? africans never used the stars. there is no evidence of this. stop tryna copy and steal our culture smh
Nah,he is not Polynesian.Sub saharan dont have any knownledge of sea travel
Sub Saharan which are your general black Africans, have no experience ontheven seas, they have no knowledge on it and no history relating to them being seafarers … I swear black Americans just want to bite everybody else’s culture and act like it’s theirs hahaha
Polynesians were very ahead of their time when it came to mapping out the stars, not every culture was as active in engaging with the constellations as the Polynesians
BUT HE COME A CROSS THAT HE SO CLEVER.
36 doors to the 36 houses in the 12 heavens.
Rehua, keeper of the knowledge of the Universe resides in the 12th heaven.
Hawaiki nui, Hawaiki roa, Hawaiki pamamao is a constellation of 3 stars in the 1st heaven.
Ariki are those born to the nights of the full moon, when all 36 doors to the 36 houses in the 12 heavens are open...
PUNO TE KORERO BRO, OLD TRUE WORD FROM THE OLD PEOPLE.