I bought a registered quarter hose gelding, 20 years old, with no vices and lots of energy last year. I paid 2500. He's a little older than I wanted, but he is absolutely perfect!!
When I was younger my dad bought me a registered Appaloosa, she was 6 weeks old and we also purchased the mare for $150, and the little filly was amazing, a gorgeous quiet little gal. She never once tried to buck, kick or throw me. I am not, was not a professional trainer nor was she professionally training but we worked and learned together, she was a magnificent horse her whole life.
You are one hundred percent right about excessive line breeding. I don't know about horses, but I am here to tell you it is a huge problem in Purebred dogs where the kennel is only interested in showing, not breeding for much else but the AKC standard and it has caused havoc in so many breeds, there is also the idiots that have puppy mills, talk about inbreeding, and last but not least the backyard breeders looking to pay the mortgage from puppy money, and they are clueless about proper care, and a whole lot more. If people would QUIT buying these horses, dogs , then the demand would stop and so would the greed of breeders.
@@claudiadickerman4218I completely agree with you. There are so many genetic diseases that have occurred in the Quarter Horse breed for exactly this reason. Plus they overbreed a lot of bloodlines using frozen semen from studs that died 20 years ago as well as embryo transfer such that a mare can produce up to four foals a year using surrogate mares. In addition, Metallic Cat himself has been cloned multiple times, and those studs are breeding too! It's gotten way out of hand, moreso in this breed than any other, which of course is the largest breed registry in the US. I much prefer how the Thoroughbred breed handles their breeding. All most be live cover only. No AI or embryo transfer is allowed whatsoever.
33-40% of the puppymills are run by the Amish in the US. YOUR TAX DOLLARS at work SUBSIDIZING CRUELTY! And before some nut makes it political, this has been going on for years thru many Administrations. They are considered a "religion" & thus pay no taxes!
Best horse I've owned was a grade QH mare I bought for $350.00 from some neighbors. You don't need to spend a fortune on a horse, just bring someone with you who has a good eye for conformation and disposition. If you want to see crazy spending with no rhyme or reason, look no further than the Cowgirl Cadillac sale. It's fun to watch, and the horses are definitely very nice, but I think they all go for at least 80% some sometimes over 100% more than they're worth in a normal situation.
I agree 100%. My boss at the brand office has a great eye for horses and he bought a grade loose horse that was destined for the kill buyer if he didn't pick it up. First year that he had him broke and ready to jackpot rope on(team roping) he made $12K in the first six months of the jackpot season on that horse. I never asked him what his year end numbers on the horse were that first year but I bet he was at or over $30K on him. That was on a $750 grade QH out of the local(in our brand district) loose horse auction. To be fair he is traveling some insane distances around the US on weekends to jackpot rope at big events with high payouts to make that kind of money but the competition is higher caliber there as well.
They are already showing up in the line breeding. There are so many cryptorchid stallions from Metallic Cat, it's crazy. I watched the sale and out of 65 horses from their ranch, 8 stallions were cryptorchid. No telling what other problems will show up. I thought they learned their lesson long ago about line breeding. So many super nice horses out there. Thanks for being honest!
Horsemen learn by losing their "own" money on horses. In the 80's I trained and raced thoroughbreds on the Kentucky circuit. One fall, we went to Fasig Tipton Fall Yearling Sales and bought two yearlings. We chose to race the filly the following summer. We bought her for a mere $2500 because she had a calcium growth on her ankle from being stepped on by her mother as a foal. Almost every decent TB runs through the fall yearling sales and their purchase prices can be found online. So, we entered her into a 2 Year Old Maiden Special Weight, $20,000 purse at Ellis Park, Kentucky for her first race ever. There was a big field of 12 fililes and she ran good, hitting the board in 4th. The third place filly beat her by 2 lengths. I looked up the 3rd place filly's yearling purchase price and it was $105,000. I rationalized that it would cost me an additonal $100,000 to run 3rd. Ever since that day, I chose to never spend big money on any horse, no matter what. After she retired, she went on the a succesful broodmare career, producing the first winners of the Hoosier Breeders f2 year old futurities. She dies peacefully in her sleep, in her pasture at the age of 22. None of our babes ever left our home.
Excellent. The horse world needs more videos like this. Popular sires have damaged many breeds, by over breeding to Trendy Studs. Too small if a gene pool creates problems like some of the other Cat lines. Don’t let it ruin the cutting world, too.
The best Quarter horse that I ever owned was a Two-eyed Jack colt that my dad traded a truck for back in 1976. Sound legs, mind and soul. I did everything with him in the English riding world,(because I was bored with the same-old - same-old western world) he excelled at three-day eventing, broke my heart when my dad sold him for drinking money. But I found out he eventually ended up with a family that used him for everything with their kids and grandkids.
Sister had a two-eyed jack mare. She did everything on her, ROM trail, youth trail, western pleasure, youth western pleasure, halter. Mare would walk thru fire for her.
YES!! I won the World TWICE on a Hobby Horse who was a granddaughter of Leo. Everyone else was riding horses that cost 5 - 10 times as much and we beat ‘em at every turn. She was the best horse I’ve ever had or had the pleasure to ride. An absolute 🦄 I’ve been around the QH biz my entire life (50+ yrs) and seen these sire fads come and implode (Impressive anyone?…). If you know what to look for, you can find a Porsche in an auction pen, a Bugatti in a backyard or even a vintage Mustang Shelby GTO that will outlast and out perform a fussy Ferrari.
Agree 100 % ! Also been in QH's that long & remember when certain bloodlines were more talked about than others but you still bred or bought the horse that suited you personally . People were proud of finding that " diamond in the rough " or buying fr. a local breeder / trainer. There was diversity in the show ring ( as the " show pen " was called then ) - it was not a competition of nearly all the horses in a class sharing the same breeding . Why show if the horses are all " cookie cutter " duplicates ? ! I remember Hobby Horse & other bloodlines of that era that produced good-minded show / using horses . My best show mare went western & hunt seat - Three Bars on top w/ Leo on the bottom . Years later , got into cuttin' as a hobby & my mare was Doc Bar bred . 🏆💛
If I wanted to buy a horse there's 2 did lines I WILL NOT have on my farm. Impressive & Man O' War. Impressive because of HYPP. Man O' War because of a killer temperament. That actually came from his great-grandmother Cinderella on his father's side of the family. His father was Fair Play, his father was Hastings, a killer stallion. Hastings killed stable boys that fit to close to his stall & he also tried to kill other horses on the track. This vicious temper came from Hastings' mother, Cinderella. She was just as bad. This temper has always bred true.
@@chrisshelp1172 Yes , I get the " do not buy " bloodlines thing . Certain ones have physical and/or mental problems that should not be passed on for generations to come , but unfortunately some people only see famous names & dollar signs ... There are a couple QH bloodlines that I'm not compatible with - but that's just me , not the bloodline ! Others love them so like everything in life , we need to find our match - breed , bloodline , disposition, etc.
Best ranch horse i have, is the cheapest horse i bought (2k) from a 1st time horse owner in town. A thinned skinned 15 hand grade mare between 8- 12 yrs? She has lots of good in her, cow smart, no buck, no flight, her try is huge. She is just very right brained and savvy. Really enjoy your Chan. Sir!
I’d love to see some working horse action on your channel. The info and perspectives you offer are great. But watching a cowboy and horse doing their jobs is also important and great entertainment value.
Hope he does. 😊 In the meantime, you might enjoy the videos on the channel Apache Cowboy. Skye, sadly, lost his cancer battle at age 33 recently. But, we can still watch him and Eagle round up some maverick cattle on the rough and rugged San Carlos Apache ranch lands. He wore a GoPro, and his videos thrill me. Another channel I enjoy is 1880 Drifters.
Just curious if you had any kickback on your comment. It’s refreshing to hear someone like you who’s knowledgeable on this subject. Too many people think that if they don’t spend big bucks on a horse then it’s inferior which is not true. Many good horses go to auction and are sold to slaughter houses. I’m thankful that there are people who save many and give them a good home and make them adoptable. I think you are helping to educate individuals looking to buy a good sound quality horse. Thank you for sharing your video.
A little kickback but not too bad. There’s a ranch locally that has a stud called Dry Smart Crocker and you can get weaklings from $2,500 to $3,000. Those colts are really pretty and work a gate on shipping day as good as anything I’ve seen and I know he’s not the only one. A lot of good genetics out there at a fraction of the price. Thanks for watching! Appreciate the support.
Best horse we ever owned was a two eyed jack mare. Unfortunately she colic wit a twisted gut and we had to put her down. She was my wife’s horse and she cried all the way. They are both in heaven now. That stallion bred some of the best horses that ever hit the ground.
Totally agree. You get one sire that dominates the market and then everthing ends up related to them. Doc Barr another example. Racing thoroughbreds another. Plus they are a high performing horse and end up being too hot for what most folks can handle. In the end a horse is what you make it.
if you are a person you like to show off and you have money buy yourself a Ferrari but if you are a mechanic buy yourself a cheap car and put time and effort on it it will work like a Ferrari
Being a retired Dairyman I can share some wisdom here. Everything in the Holstein genetics goes back to two bulls born in the 1950s and 1960s. Round Oak Rag Apple Elevation and Pawnee Farm Arlinda Chief. Round Oak produced 80,000 daughters and at least 2.3 million granddaughters, making him the most influential bull ever born. He also introduced a lethal gene into the population, responsible for an estimated half million spontaneous abortions worldwide. Chief produced 16,000 daughters, 500,000 granddaughters, and more than 2 million great-granddaughters. He also passed on a gene responsible for reduced fertility, and calves being unable to stand. In the Holstein amino acid chain found in a gene called APAF1, short for apoptosis peptide activating factor 1. If a Holstein calf inherits just one copy of APAF1 from a parent, it becomes a carrier. But if it inherits copies of the mutation from both parents, the combination is fatal. The vast majority of Holstein lineage goes back to those 2 sires. The Holstein breed lost genetic variation, which dairymen to this day struggle to overcome to this day. This system of large-scale artificial insemination, with farmers repeatedly picking top-rated bulls, has made cows more genetically similar. Meanwhile, genetic traits that existed in Holstein cows a generation ago have disappeared completely. This is a very bad thing. Avoid breeding to super stars like Metallic Cat, maintain a healthy gene diversity in the Quarter Horse breed is vital. Not to mention we dont know what's Metallic cats genetics could be hiding...
@@audreygregis8721 You're welcome. The A2 Company believes the problem is some people are unable to digest A1, a protein most often found in milk from Holstein Cows. The A2 protein which as you stated comes from Jersey, Guernsey and even many of the Asian and African cow breeds is more easily digested.
In the early 90s, everyone wanted an Impressive bred horse. My sister talked me out of it. She didn't like Impressive for some reason. I settled for what I could afford--a grade filly for $700. She was the best horse I ever had. And, then look what happened. You couldn't give an Impressive bred horse away.
Impressive bred horses are still BANNED from Australia! I had a friend that had one literally drop dead in front of her. I got talked into breeding my mare to an Impressive son. The colt was nuttier than a March Hare - even with his mama’s foundation breeding and steady demeanor!
Sir, I totally agree with you!!! It's silly because I see barrel racer decide their horse isn't fast enough when I see that the issue is in the fact that they do not know the breed of horse they're on. I know for a fact that Quarter Horses love being challenge! And if you run barrels well the horse doesn't know anything about the clock. They're not challenge by those barrels, not anything else in the arena. And these barrel racers jump on and use them only for barrels,I would get bored too. Even taking a barrel horse for a ride down the road is good because there's always something to see and interested the horse. I paid 200.00 for my state champion barrel mare! And she was my best horse ever or so far anyway. But I don't use her for barrels only. I rode her down the road,I've used her gathering cattle and in a branding pen,used her to pony other horses. And she's a dual papered mare in AQHA/APHA. And like you even if I had the money I still wouldn't spend it on a half crippled horse or on a horse who hasn't done anything besides being green broke to be worth 10,000. If I spend that much then I want it in writing that the horse has the will and want to win and of course that's not going to happen. Myself I like a horse that goes back to one of the first Stallions register in AQHA. That's just me but they have always done right by me. And here's another horse we had,my father's head horse, he paid 1000.00 for him. This horse knew his job and loved it, he was the type of horse that if he was alive today he would easily sell for 50,000 to 100,000 because the speed this horse had and his knowledge of putting the header in exactly the right spot to make a perfect throw at the steer was outrageous. If Dad had a bad day roping this horse got anger at my dad and wouldn't let Dad touch him. This is in the 70's and Dad was offered almost 10,000 for him and at that time that wasn't normal. Dad turned it down. This gelding didn't have papers, but you knew that either because he was a gelding they hadn't got his papers or they were lost he was all quarter horse with outstanding bloodlines.
I had a St.Pat's Cat daughter. Sarsaparilla Float. She was magic on the ground and a handful in the arena. Gorgeous girl! And she was a rescue. Previous owner owner ended up with a shattered pelvis after an accident with her.
Just bought a metallic cat mare and she's incredible! I also have numerous $2k horses off craigslist that are also fantastic. They each have their purpose! I strongly agree with the genetic portion of this argument - the inbreeding is going to catch up unfortunately and I'm surprised more people aren't talking about it and setting some kind of industry standards for breeding these super studs.
lol! I have no clue who or what "Metallic Cat" has done in the horsey world...I just liked your title and took a listen. Seems like you had some good points to make, for sure. No question that there are a LOT of horses in need of homes, trainers, and a place in this world.
I just got a registered QH who is 12, he comes from QH racing lines not cowy lines. He's the sweetest thing. Slightly TB vibes (he's pure QA though not an appendix) but he just has appendix vibes. I just wanted a QH because over-all they just seem like a sweet and versatile breed. I put my husband on him who had ridden but doesn't ride and he was just a sweet heart and patient. I tried some jumping on him, which I'm not good at.. totally tolerated me being awful at it. I love QH's! He was not even being sold with any video of him doing all that but I could tell when I tried him out, he was that kinda horse.
This last Saturday I went to watch my friend do cow sorting with her new QH Her horse knew what to do. She needs lessons. She pointed out all the Metallic Cat horses we live in Idaho they are everywhere. In 1978 I bought my first QH in Tehachapi Ca. And yes Impressive was the top horse back then I bought a Vandy bred mare The sweetest kind and trusting. Did what ever you asked liked her so much I bought the mother and had her bred back to Vandy’s son. I did Western English driving in 3 day eventing I could shoot off one. If I had the knowledge and the cows I probably could do that too
Totally agree. Sure it would be nice to say you have a colt outta Metallic Cat or one of the other super stars, but 99% of us don't need al that high dollar bloodline. Big didderence between "needing" and "wanting"
Thanks for the feedback and it’s a good callout! I did talk about this on another video but I had an own daughter by Smooth As A Cat out of a Freckles Merada Mare shown by Dee Craig at the Snaffle Bit Futurity, a son of Smooth As A Cat out of an Haidas Little Pep Mare, and a son of Red Hot Metal out of a Shiner Mare. Really nice horses. No knock on them, just want to see some other genetics being pursued and think if a person is handy enough, they can make a good horse out of a lot of these other lines.
It's like a lot of things...buying the brand name isn't always the best option. I don't have a Ferrari...but, I do have a Mustang (Ford). She's pretty quick...GT model. Top speed is w-a-y faster than I should drive 😉. I have read a lot of the comments here, and it seems you are right on the money 🤑...once again. Thanks for your perspective...always the wise advice.🤗
Not me watching this as my mare gets AI and flushed to Metallic Cat 😂💀 But in all seriousness I 100% agree with everything you said. My husband and I breed and train our own reining/cow horses and are typically looking/aiming for a Lvl 4 Open or NP horse. However, we have lots of relationships in the industry and nice mares so we’ve often gotten a free breeding by trading an embryo. This helps a ton. The mare we are breeding to MC was out of a 5k Genuine Doc mare and a free breeding to Platinum Vintage since our friend owned him and my husband rode him as a 2/3yo. The resulting filly came out top tier and proved herself worthy to be bred to a top industry stud. She is definitely a Ferrari and although extremely broke she is a ton of horse athletically, and I wouldn’t put anyone on her unless they are used to riding a horse of this level.
Great honest advice. I Enjoyed it. The Best thing ever happened to the quarter horse is the thoroughbred. The draft QH cross is another great example. Hybrid vigor from a great outcross is powerful very powerful.
There are many other great bloodlines that won’t kill your bank account, and honestly, there are grade horses that sit better. I hope you don’t get a lot of flack for your points 😂
It's really frustrating, I've been looking for a good trail horse forever, and these online auctions are ridiculous too, and when I contact a "seller" aka "horse trader" some of them get downright pissy if I ask what they consider are too many questions. If I had a dime for every time they say "he's as broke as the day is long" I'd move to Alaska and buy a mountain top. The BEST horse I ever had was an Arabian mutt 3 year-old, for 600.00, over 30 years ago of course. Those days are gone I'm afraid.
For me it has the most to do with the cat genetics are in what seems like everything everywhere. I love the cats but finding something solid to breed without crossing cat is getting tough. I'm starting to look for more old school big boned cow/ranch bred horses to cross on.
THANK YOU! 25 years ago I purchased a 2nd cross QH, no one wanted him, everything said about him was negative. This was a time when the cost of a horse over $800 in Australia was considered getting pricy. I paid $500 (slaughter fee) due to the instant connection with him. He was smart, too smart. He had everyone figured out in minutes. I started rodeo on him, he was great, did pony club, he loved jumping and cross country. I did a dressage competition and got sniggered at by a lady riding a $5000 horse, (back then, that was ridiculously expensive). Well, we came in equal 2nd with that horse. I looked at her and said “you paid $4500 too much seeing as mine never learnt dressage and we forgot the pattern”.
Inbreeding is why I left my beloved Arabian breed. 30 years ago you could barely find great rugged desert bred Arabians built for work. I challenge anyone to find me one today. I searched high and low a few years ago and found zilch. Now they are these crazy looking works of “art” and their minds are blown.
I managed an A. farm for a former president of IAHA ( as it was called then ) ; he bred & showed Polish Arabians back in the late 60's , 70's & a few in the 80's -great dispositions , athletic & pretty ; won many nat. top tens !! None were the " extreme " ( unhealthy ) conformation as seen in many bloodlines today . All his homebreds lived long , healthy lives in happy retirement . 💙
@@cynthiajohnston424I had a big grey Polish Arab 20 years ago. I had forgoten about those big boned Arabians. I had a tiny inky black Egyptian Arab. Now I live in high desert plains of NM and I have to consider the harsh winters. My Egyptian hated the west Texas winters. Next year buying a horse. Have done a deep dive on gaited breeds. Now looking at Halflingers and Fjords. I need a good all around horse for daily trail riding, with carriage pulling potential. My dream is doing the major rodeos (Calagary, Cheyenne, Denver, etc) with the carriage and some parades riding. Also, we live near a cemetery, and have a funeral hearse wagon. I need a hardy horse for our harsh winters, and I am small, 5' 4" and 120 lbs, so a smaller horse is better. But man, horse shopping brings back memories of listening to the cowboys on our ranch talking horse business. I am open right now and patient. Buying a horse to me is trickier than finding a good man. 😂 (40 yrs married to a superbly good man who indulges my horse habits).
Btw, I say "horse business" because those cowboys never really traded anything but man would they ever talk it. And that Polish arab was the buckingest horse I've ever owned. 😂
@@skyethewylder Started & showed many Polish Arabians - they were extremely alert & cautious when started but smart , kind , willing & very smooth rides ! I spent shorter schooling times per day on A's , going slower w/ an extended , more drawn out months-long training schedule than for my QH's . Different minds in different bodies - a good horse is a good horse ! 💟
Metallic Cat is one of the greatest sires the world has seen so people want them or breed to him. Cutter/cowhorse people tend to stay away from "line breeding" because the stud fees and such are not worth the risk. It is the Hancock lovers and people who don't care enough to register the horse the are more into/ok with line breeding. There are many great sires that do not have Cat in them such as Boon too suen, Dual Reyish, Hottish and Hickory Holly time just to name a few. I understand the point you are making but you saying that there are to many and the people are linebreeding is not real fair.
For us it’s two parts. First it’s really more of a value conversation. Metallic Cat is a great stud horse but he’s $10,000 to breed to. There are so many good options that are 25% of that price. Second is as we moved to highly specialized breeding, we get too focused on the short term and line breed. Agreed that’s just a subset of breeders but it is happening and that’s when risk for genetic disease increases.
It is 10K because the quality of horse you are breeding to. Again, there are so many other great studs out there who are not High Brows or Metallics. I don't think it's fair for you to say that people shouldn't buy a Metallic cat though.@@Stonefieldranch
Third best horse i ever bred was a king fritz stud too a pretty little grade mare my brother owned, first and second goes to a brother and sister out of the same stud and a peppy san badger mare, but that cross was dynamite in cow sense and cold backed
Great video! I love my little gelding out of Trashadeous. He was cheap because he is only 13.3 hands which is fine by 5 foot me. Anyone who pays for color deserves to pay a lot. Vain much?
I LOVE Shiney Outlaw!!!!!..especially when Sarah Dawson rode him....though I think generally MC is more considered weighted toward cutting and SO Working Cow Horse, with of course cross over. Anyway, that will be a nice baby!!
We just want a good, sound trail horse without breaking the bank. 😢 Too many breeders out there and not enough responsible horse owners. It's disgusting.
Awesomely said, more education needs to put out there, who cares about who’s feelings get hurt, people need to understand they are extremely intelligent line, and a horse trainer who doesn’t know how to introduce and proper training it’s a rodeo train wreck. Keep up the good cowboy truths you might save a life ! And that’s a truth. The buckle chasers ruining lines for fast and faster more cowboys like you are needed!
It took years for them to figure out where HERDA came from. And my aunt bred those horses for years I haven't had a stock horse in some time. I'm looking for one now. My state is not great for getting them, good bad or ugly
I agree with you 100%. Look at for example. Docks prescription horses. They floated the market. And you Goodbye two-year-old. At the horse sail for 750.
Agreed!!! Plus they are little and I wouldn’t feel comfortable tying off to a Brahman blood cow that got out and is running down the highway… now yeah up in big country setting where you got time to let rope slide on British type cattle, yeah ride a smaller more catty horse so you can sort better… but down south they need to have some legs under them with thick bone to cover the deep muddy pastures and gotta have some muscle and weight behind them to dead stop a 1500# big eared cow running Mach 3 into oncoming traffic.
This is a bold statement........Buyer beware ........So, report them if you believe they are abusing the bloodline s of metallic cat ... Repeatedly having health issues, sold to inexperienced buyers, horses used for insurance fraud.....Who carries the insurance on this breed??? breeder required to report problems with purchaser's of there stock .....best of luck
I bred my Smart Little Lena Granddaughter to one of Metallic Cat’s brothers. He isn’t as famous, but considering tongue River used to stand him he ain’t no slouch either. Got a helluva colt on that cross at a fraction of the price.
I own grays starlights one of his sons, very intelligent and athletic good minded, we are working him slow and easy, and he’s doing great loves to work. But taught him more whoa, not ready he hasn’t finished growing to speed dial him causes many injuries, and I rather my horse then wins! So many are inpatient, and breeding cross, inline, they end up selling my girlfriend died 6 months ago on a hotline metallic crossed with TB he ran so fast she flew into Tree no helmet so yes it’s dangerous ! You never know when that bred cross or inline horse will explode great awareness!
I’ve been in the horse world oh my life, you can go to an auction look over a young horse very very well. Make sure there’s nothing wrong with the legs and your disposition and stuff and you can train that horse to be anything you want it to be. It just takes time and patience. You don’t have to pay a pile of money for a good horse.
So true, I have rode Leo bred horses my life I dont compete but my father owned a 150 cows gathered them 100s of times got in heavy springers, gathered sick ones Leos are great, But this horse market is about fads, the money is in Metalic cat or Pepto bred horses on a goo note you might get a bargain on a Leo or Poco
Agree. Not everyone needs to pay this for a horse. I know I don't. I'm never going to be in the ranks of the horseman who have the skills and abilities to turn a profit out of a 60k purchase. Ack!
This was an interesting video though the caption was not entirely accurate...more like "Why you don't need a Metallic Cat". Probably his fame from the TV show makes this whole thing exaggerated. But I LOVE your point of getting a very nice quality horse from an auction....there are SO MANY nice horses out there that just need a chance. And there are VERY few people that need a ferrari...only in the ranks of the highest competitors need those. We need more videos out there that educate people about fads and trends and the longer term consequence of those things ( for example, AQHA halter horses....being unsound). Any, I do love MC but, for sure, genetic diversity is really important. Thoroughbreds are currently very much suffering from this point presently.
Yup that’s true , but no one wants a no name horse now days, everything needs to have paperwork, but even a good solid ranch horse is still pricey, horse selling and buying is ridiculous now .. but thanks for sharing this video
Do your homework and you can beat people on fancy bred horses every day. I did. Won the World twice on a horse that cost a bare fraction of every other horse in the arena 😏. One judge heard me call her Flower (her barn name) and the next year he had a young Bar Flower that looked kinda like my mare but was nowhere as good. 😂
While i agree that not everyone needs a Ferrari, if youre wanting to compete breeding is a huge component. Yes there are always exceptions but thats a little like using the powerball as your retirement strategy. Metallic Cat is Smart Little Lena top and bottom. Doc's Hickory on top and Peppy San Badger on the bottom. High Brow Hickory on top and Peptoboonsmall on the bottom. The proof is in the pudding. In competition you could easily waste more money on travel and class fees with no earnings than you would spending the extra for a Metallic Cat yearling. Its all about your need and purpose. Let's not forget they dont train and ride themselves. Even a MC colt without the right training and the right rider is just a more expensive train wreck.
Please do a segment on breeding quarter horses that are 17 hands. It is getting ridiculous and for some reason judges love them in the show ring. The enormous horses I see in the show ring are contradictory to the purpose of the quarter horse for ranch work and pleasure riding. No one can get on these horses without a three step mounting box. This is sad, because it relegates these horses to either the race track or show ring. I personally want horse that is more versatile and that I can easily mount in any situation.
Mettalic Cat was Doc Bar line bred anyway. Maybe if you crossed him with a mare with some size? You're giving up a little agility but I ddon't want to be roping bulls on a 950 pound gelding. I try to keep my working horses in that 1100-1300 pound range.
I am so tired of people running out buying their kids a horse or pony whichever it may be and they have no clue on what horses care consist of. Then people like myself has to fix all there mistakes.
There are plenty of good mustangs oit there too if have that kind of time, but you must have paid for the dun horse too.. Since duns and buckskins are the rage.
I watch the health panels when I start thinking about breeding a mare. Too many studs with herda, gbed,etc. I’m amazed these horse associations aren’t paying attention. Money talks.
Last reason I get. First two reasons are Bull shit. If the person has money let em spend it what do you care it does not affect you in any way shape or form especially if you are buying grade horses. Second if a person want a Ferrari let em buy one. Once again it does t affect you in any way shape or form. Free country.
Never even considered Metallic Cat or Peptoboonsmal(another overrated/fad sire of cutting horses). Can I afford them, sure, but why throw money at something I don't need? I don't need a pure cutting horse, I need all around using horses that can cut with if need be along with the cajillion and a half other things I need the to do. Personally I prefer older all around using lines, E.g. Two Eyed Jack, Skipper W, Doc Bar, Driftwood, Colonel Freckles, and sometimes Peppy San Badger depending on their conformation.
@@natemoncecchi6320lol I was just going to say that about skipper W horses. I’m old enough to remember them first hand. Lots of using type lines can be broncy with time off. Hancocks are well known for it, but those skipper W were good buckers every day even after riding a few hours. Dishonest knot heads. I’ve always had great luck with peppys, doc bar, wimpy, Leo, two eyed jack. One of the best using horses I’ve owned is old man on top and peppy on bottom. We’ve even had a few easy jets that were good.
@@tracyjohnson5023 I should have put Leo in my original post, love that line. In my last 45+ years of riding and ranching my very best horse had Leo and Bartender on the bottom, and King and Three Bars on top.
If you can get ahold of one. Rasmussen Quarter Horses in Corinne Utah sales Dry Smart Crocker Weanlings for $2500-$3000 and they’re the best ranch horses I’ve ever seen. Tough, athletic, pretty, and smart. Most are bay or bay roan.
You can spend five or six figures on a good horse and permanently ruin it with just one month's bad training! You can also buy a three-figure horse and turn it into an amazing creature, everyone's dream horse with wise training and hours spent in the saddle! This is why true Schoolmasters, on average, sell for 10 to 20 grand, or more. What you're paying for is the hundreds of hours of education to make that Schoolmaster into what he is. This includes his feed, his shoes, the tack he busts up in his training process, his accommodation, and the time of the trainer. It all adds up, and pretty soon, 20 grand for a dream horse is actually not so unreasonable...
I bought a registered quarter hose gelding, 20 years old, with no vices and lots of energy last year. I paid 2500. He's a little older than I wanted, but he is absolutely perfect!!
Shit the horse market in the SE I have sold 2 grades both over 15y/o this year for 5k+
When I was younger my dad bought me a registered Appaloosa, she was 6 weeks old and we also purchased the mare for $150, and the little filly was amazing, a gorgeous quiet little gal. She never once tried to buck, kick or throw me. I am not, was not a professional trainer nor was she professionally training but we worked and learned together, she was a magnificent horse her whole life.
Thank you for being honest! And for knocking the inbreeding!
You are one hundred percent right about excessive line breeding. I don't know about horses, but I am here to tell you it is a huge problem in Purebred dogs where the kennel is only interested in showing, not breeding for much else but the AKC standard and it has caused havoc in so many breeds, there is also the idiots that have puppy mills, talk about inbreeding, and last but not least the backyard breeders looking to pay the mortgage from puppy money, and they are clueless about proper care, and a whole lot more. If people would QUIT buying these horses, dogs , then the demand would stop and so would the greed of breeders.
@@claudiadickerman4218I completely agree with you. There are so many genetic diseases that have occurred in the Quarter Horse breed for exactly this reason. Plus they overbreed a lot of bloodlines using frozen semen from studs that died 20 years ago as well as embryo transfer such that a mare can produce up to four foals a year using surrogate mares.
In addition, Metallic Cat himself has been cloned multiple times, and those studs are breeding too! It's gotten way out of hand, moreso in this breed than any other, which of course is the largest breed registry in the US. I much prefer how the Thoroughbred breed handles their breeding. All most be live cover only. No AI or embryo transfer is allowed whatsoever.
33-40% of the puppymills are run by the Amish in the US. YOUR TAX DOLLARS at work SUBSIDIZING CRUELTY! And before some nut makes it political, this has been going on for years thru many Administrations. They are considered a "religion" & thus pay no taxes!
Best horse I've owned was a grade QH mare I bought for $350.00 from some neighbors. You don't need to spend a fortune on a horse, just bring someone with you who has a good eye for conformation and disposition. If you want to see crazy spending with no rhyme or reason, look no further than the Cowgirl Cadillac sale. It's fun to watch, and the horses are definitely very nice, but I think they all go for at least 80% some sometimes over 100% more than they're worth in a normal situation.
I agree 100%. My boss at the brand office has a great eye for horses and he bought a grade loose horse that was destined for the kill buyer if he didn't pick it up. First year that he had him broke and ready to jackpot rope on(team roping) he made $12K in the first six months of the jackpot season on that horse. I never asked him what his year end numbers on the horse were that first year but I bet he was at or over $30K on him. That was on a $750 grade QH out of the local(in our brand district) loose horse auction. To be fair he is traveling some insane distances around the US on weekends to jackpot rope at big events with high payouts to make that kind of money but the competition is higher caliber there as well.
They are already showing up in the line breeding. There are so many cryptorchid stallions from Metallic Cat, it's crazy. I watched the sale and out of 65 horses from their ranch, 8 stallions were cryptorchid. No telling what other problems will show up. I thought they learned their lesson long ago about line breeding. So many super nice horses out there. Thanks for being honest!
Horsemen learn by losing their "own" money on horses. In the 80's I trained and raced thoroughbreds on the Kentucky circuit. One fall, we went to Fasig Tipton Fall Yearling Sales and bought two yearlings. We chose to race the filly the following summer. We bought her for a mere $2500 because she had a calcium growth on her ankle from being stepped on by her mother as a foal. Almost every decent TB runs through the fall yearling sales and their purchase prices can be found online. So, we entered her into a 2 Year Old Maiden Special Weight, $20,000 purse at Ellis Park, Kentucky for her first race ever. There was a big field of 12 fililes and she ran good, hitting the board in 4th. The third place filly beat her by 2 lengths. I looked up the 3rd place filly's yearling purchase price and it was $105,000. I rationalized that it would cost me an additonal $100,000 to run 3rd. Ever since that day, I chose to never spend big money on any horse, no matter what. After she retired, she went on the a succesful broodmare career, producing the first winners of the Hoosier Breeders f2 year old futurities. She dies peacefully in her sleep, in her pasture at the age of 22. None of our babes ever left our home.
Excellent. The horse world needs more videos like this. Popular sires have damaged many breeds, by over breeding to Trendy Studs. Too small if a gene pool creates problems like some of the other Cat lines. Don’t let it ruin the cutting world, too.
The best Quarter horse that I ever owned was a Two-eyed Jack colt that my dad traded a truck for back in 1976. Sound legs, mind and soul. I did everything with him in the English riding world,(because I was bored with the same-old - same-old western world) he excelled at three-day eventing, broke my heart when my dad sold him for drinking money. But I found out he eventually ended up with a family that used him for everything with their kids and grandkids.
God, bless you for going thru that...would have truly broken my heart...really glad to hear he at least ended up in a good way.
Sister had a two-eyed jack mare. She did everything on her, ROM trail, youth trail, western pleasure, youth western pleasure, halter. Mare would walk thru fire for her.
I just think of the girl who won the Tevis Cup endurance race on a horse she got for FREE on Craig’s list.
YES!! I won the World TWICE on a Hobby Horse who was a granddaughter of Leo. Everyone else was riding horses that cost 5 - 10 times as much and we beat ‘em at every turn. She was the best horse I’ve ever had or had the pleasure to ride. An absolute 🦄
I’ve been around the QH biz my entire life (50+ yrs) and seen these sire fads come and implode (Impressive anyone?…). If you know what to look for, you can find a Porsche in an auction pen, a Bugatti in a backyard or even a vintage Mustang Shelby GTO that will outlast and out perform a fussy Ferrari.
Very cool! Thank you for sharing.
My horse was Rexo Leo. He was the best. I miss him.
Agree 100 % ! Also been in QH's that long & remember when certain bloodlines were more talked about than others but you still bred or bought the horse that suited you personally . People were proud of finding that " diamond in the rough " or buying fr. a local breeder / trainer. There was diversity in the show ring ( as the " show pen " was called then ) - it was not a competition of nearly all the horses in a class sharing the same breeding . Why show if the horses are all " cookie cutter " duplicates ? ! I remember Hobby Horse & other bloodlines of that era that produced good-minded show / using horses . My best show mare went western & hunt seat - Three Bars on top w/ Leo on the bottom . Years later , got into cuttin' as a hobby & my mare was Doc Bar bred . 🏆💛
If I wanted to buy a horse there's 2 did lines I WILL NOT have on my farm. Impressive & Man O' War. Impressive because of HYPP. Man O' War because of a killer temperament. That actually came from his great-grandmother Cinderella on his father's side of the family. His father was Fair Play, his father was Hastings, a killer stallion. Hastings killed stable boys that fit to close to his stall & he also tried to kill other horses on the track. This vicious temper came from Hastings' mother, Cinderella. She was just as bad. This temper has always bred true.
@@chrisshelp1172 Yes , I get the " do not buy " bloodlines thing . Certain ones have physical and/or mental problems that should not be passed on for generations to come , but unfortunately some people only see famous names & dollar signs ... There are a couple QH bloodlines that I'm not compatible with - but that's just me , not the bloodline ! Others love them so like everything in life , we need to find our match - breed , bloodline , disposition, etc.
Best ranch horse i have, is the cheapest horse i bought (2k) from a 1st time horse owner in town. A thinned skinned 15 hand grade mare between 8- 12 yrs? She has lots of good in her, cow smart, no buck, no flight, her try is huge. She is just very right brained and savvy. Really enjoy your Chan. Sir!
Thank you! Love hearing about horses like yours that are considered underdogs in the horse world.
I’d love to see some working horse action on your channel. The info and perspectives you offer are great. But watching a cowboy and horse doing their jobs is also important and great entertainment value.
Hope he does. 😊 In the meantime, you might enjoy the videos on the channel Apache Cowboy. Skye, sadly, lost his cancer battle at age 33 recently. But, we can still watch him and Eagle round up some maverick cattle on the rough and rugged San Carlos Apache ranch lands. He wore a GoPro, and his videos thrill me. Another channel I enjoy is 1880 Drifters.
Just curious if you had any kickback on your comment. It’s refreshing to hear someone like you who’s knowledgeable on this subject. Too many people think that if they don’t spend big bucks on a horse then it’s inferior which is not true. Many good horses go to auction and are sold to slaughter houses. I’m thankful that there are people who save many and give them a good home and make them adoptable. I think you are helping to educate individuals looking to buy a good sound quality horse. Thank you for sharing your video.
A little kickback but not too bad. There’s a ranch locally that has a stud called Dry Smart Crocker and you can get weaklings from $2,500 to $3,000. Those colts are really pretty and work a gate on shipping day as good as anything I’ve seen and I know he’s not the only one. A lot of good genetics out there at a fraction of the price. Thanks for watching! Appreciate the support.
You hit the nail on the head. Great video
The price of horses as got out of control it is so ridiculous , just stop paying these crazy prices people wish up
Best horse we ever owned was a two eyed jack mare. Unfortunately she colic wit a twisted gut and we had to put her down. She was my wife’s horse and she cried all the way. They are both in heaven now. That stallion bred some of the best horses that ever hit the ground.
Totally agree. You get one sire that dominates the market and then everthing ends up related to them. Doc Barr another example. Racing thoroughbreds another.
Plus they are a high performing horse and end up being too hot for what most folks can handle.
In the end a horse is what you make it.
if you are a person you like to show off and you have money buy yourself a Ferrari but if you are a mechanic buy yourself a cheap car and put time and effort on it it will work like a Ferrari
Agreed. Might be why we aren’t as handy as we used to be too.
I Raise them making a Great living.
Being a retired Dairyman I can share some wisdom here. Everything in the Holstein genetics goes back to two bulls born in the 1950s and 1960s.
Round Oak Rag Apple Elevation and Pawnee Farm Arlinda Chief. Round Oak produced 80,000 daughters and at least 2.3 million granddaughters, making him the most influential bull ever born. He also introduced a lethal gene into the population, responsible for an estimated half million spontaneous abortions worldwide.
Chief produced 16,000 daughters, 500,000 granddaughters, and more than 2 million great-granddaughters. He also passed on a gene responsible for reduced fertility, and calves being unable to stand.
In the Holstein amino acid chain found in a gene called APAF1, short for apoptosis peptide activating factor 1. If a Holstein calf inherits just one copy of APAF1 from a parent, it becomes a carrier. But if it inherits copies of the mutation from both parents, the combination is fatal.
The vast majority of Holstein lineage goes back to those 2 sires. The Holstein breed lost genetic variation, which dairymen to this day struggle to overcome to this day. This system of large-scale artificial insemination, with farmers repeatedly picking top-rated bulls, has made cows more genetically similar. Meanwhile, genetic traits that existed in Holstein cows a generation ago have disappeared completely. This is a very bad thing.
Avoid breeding to super stars like Metallic Cat, maintain a healthy gene diversity in the Quarter Horse breed is vital. Not to mention we dont know what's Metallic cats genetics could be hiding...
Wow, thank you for that history. I know a lot of people can't drink A1 milk (Holsteins), but can tolerate A2....Guernsey, Swiss, Jersey, etc.
@@audreygregis8721 You're welcome. The A2 Company believes the problem is some people are unable to digest A1, a protein most often found in milk from Holstein Cows. The A2 protein which as you stated comes from Jersey, Guernsey and even many of the Asian and African cow breeds is more easily digested.
That just goes to show you that man influenced Generations are not solid most people can't think Past their pecker or their pocketbook
In the early 90s, everyone wanted an Impressive bred horse. My sister talked me out of it. She didn't like Impressive for some reason. I settled for what I could afford--a grade filly for $700. She was the best horse I ever had. And, then look what happened. You couldn't give an Impressive bred horse away.
HYPP is a nasty disease, you probably were saved a world of heart ache by going with the grade horse vs risking ending up with an HYPP positive horse.
@@AndyTheCornbread I concur.
Impressive bred horses are still BANNED from Australia!
I had a friend that had one literally drop dead in front of her.
I got talked into breeding my mare to an Impressive son. The colt was nuttier than a March Hare - even with his mama’s foundation breeding and steady demeanor!
What is h y p p disease?
@@montanawarren8462 it's a genetic disease in quarter horses that affects horses who come from the lines of the stud named Impressive.
Sir, I totally agree with you!!! It's silly because I see barrel racer decide their horse isn't fast enough when I see that the issue is in the fact that they do not know the breed of horse they're on. I know for a fact that Quarter Horses love being challenge! And if you run barrels well the horse doesn't know anything about the clock. They're not challenge by those barrels, not anything else in the arena. And these barrel racers jump on and use them only for barrels,I would get bored too. Even taking a barrel horse for a ride down the road is good because there's always something to see and interested the horse. I paid 200.00 for my state champion barrel mare! And she was my best horse ever or so far anyway. But I don't use her for barrels only. I rode her down the road,I've used her gathering cattle and in a branding pen,used her to pony other horses. And she's a dual papered mare in AQHA/APHA. And like you even if I had the money I still wouldn't spend it on a half crippled horse or on a horse who hasn't done anything besides being green broke to be worth 10,000. If I spend that much then I want it in writing that the horse has the will and want to win and of course that's not going to happen. Myself I like a horse that goes back to one of the first Stallions register in AQHA. That's just me but they have always done right by me. And here's another horse we had,my father's head horse, he paid 1000.00 for him. This horse knew his job and loved it, he was the type of horse that if he was alive today he would easily sell for 50,000 to 100,000 because the speed this horse had and his knowledge of putting the header in exactly the right spot to make a perfect throw at the steer was outrageous. If Dad had a bad day roping this horse got anger at my dad and wouldn't let Dad touch him. This is in the 70's and Dad was offered almost 10,000 for him and at that time that wasn't normal. Dad turned it down. This gelding didn't have papers, but you knew that either because he was a gelding they hadn't got his papers or they were lost he was all quarter horse with outstanding bloodlines.
I had a St.Pat's Cat daughter. Sarsaparilla Float. She was magic on the ground and a handful in the arena. Gorgeous girl! And she was a rescue. Previous owner owner ended up with a shattered pelvis after an accident with her.
Just bought a metallic cat mare and she's incredible! I also have numerous $2k horses off craigslist that are also fantastic. They each have their purpose! I strongly agree with the genetic portion of this argument - the inbreeding is going to catch up unfortunately and I'm surprised more people aren't talking about it and setting some kind of industry standards for breeding these super studs.
lol! I have no clue who or what "Metallic Cat" has done in the horsey world...I just liked your title and took a listen. Seems like you had some good points to make, for sure. No question that there are a LOT of horses in need of homes, trainers, and a place in this world.
I just got a registered QH who is 12, he comes from QH racing lines not cowy lines. He's the sweetest thing. Slightly TB vibes (he's pure QA though not an appendix) but he just has appendix vibes. I just wanted a QH because over-all they just seem like a sweet and versatile breed. I put my husband on him who had ridden but doesn't ride and he was just a sweet heart and patient. I tried some jumping on him, which I'm not good at.. totally tolerated me being awful at it. I love QH's! He was not even being sold with any video of him doing all that but I could tell when I tried him out, he was that kinda horse.
Thanks for the information. I’ll be looking for a horse in the spring and you’re spot on… I do not need a Ferrari. A used Jeep will do me just fine.
I hope the best for all ranchers and farmers take care everyone 🤗
Well said.
So many other capable lines such as ...
Leo
High Rollin Roany
Countless others
I've never owned a bad Leo bred horse. Love that line.
Can NEVER go wrong with foundation bred horses!!
In ‘72 I bought a Leo/ Joe Hancock mare,,,,,best horse I ever owned. Common sense, true blue, good cow sense, a joy to own and ride.
The purebred livestock Industry involves wealthy breeders swapping dollars for tax purposes with the hobbyist dreaming of success.
see "Terry Bradshaw" purposely breeding Impressive horses over and over with no oversight.
Totally agree my friend!
This last Saturday I went to watch my friend do cow sorting with her new QH Her horse knew what to do. She needs lessons. She pointed out all the Metallic Cat horses we live in Idaho they are everywhere. In 1978 I bought my first QH in Tehachapi Ca. And yes Impressive was the top horse back then I bought a Vandy bred mare The sweetest kind and trusting. Did what ever you asked liked her so much I bought the mother and had her bred back to Vandy’s son. I did Western English driving in 3 day eventing I could shoot off one. If I had the knowledge and the cows I probably could do that too
Thank you , great suggestion
Totally agree. Sure it would be nice to say you have a colt outta Metallic Cat or one of the other super stars, but 99% of us don't need al that high dollar bloodline. Big didderence between "needing" and "wanting"
Thanks for the feedback and it’s a good callout! I did talk about this on another video but I had an own daughter by Smooth As A Cat out of a Freckles Merada Mare shown by Dee Craig at the Snaffle Bit Futurity, a son of Smooth As A Cat out of an Haidas Little Pep Mare, and a son of Red Hot Metal out of a Shiner Mare. Really nice horses. No knock on them, just want to see some other genetics being pursued and think if a person is handy enough, they can make a good horse out of a lot of these other lines.
It's like a lot of things...buying the brand name isn't always the best option. I don't have a Ferrari...but, I do have a Mustang (Ford). She's pretty quick...GT model. Top speed is w-a-y faster than I should drive 😉. I have read a lot of the comments here, and it seems you are right on the money 🤑...once again. Thanks for your perspective...always the wise advice.🤗
Best horse I ever owned?
A Mustang.....once she trusted me she would do anything I asked❤
I agree. Another point i would include is the mindset that if your horse isnt a "this" or "that" then it isn't ride worthy
Agreed.
Not me watching this as my mare gets AI and flushed to Metallic Cat 😂💀
But in all seriousness I 100% agree with everything you said. My husband and I breed and train our own reining/cow horses and are typically looking/aiming for a Lvl 4 Open or NP horse. However, we have lots of relationships in the industry and nice mares so we’ve often gotten a free breeding by trading an embryo. This helps a ton. The mare we are breeding to MC was out of a 5k Genuine Doc mare and a free breeding to Platinum Vintage since our friend owned him and my husband rode him as a 2/3yo. The resulting filly came out top tier and proved herself worthy to be bred to a top industry stud. She is definitely a Ferrari and although extremely broke she is a ton of horse athletically, and I wouldn’t put anyone on her unless they are used to riding a horse of this level.
Always heard that "you can't ride the papers !"
Or color
Great honest advice. I Enjoyed it. The Best thing ever happened to the quarter horse is the thoroughbred. The draft QH cross is another great example. Hybrid vigor from a great outcross is powerful very powerful.
There are many other great bloodlines that won’t kill your bank account, and honestly, there are grade horses that sit better. I hope you don’t get a lot of flack for your points 😂
Good sage advice.
It's really frustrating, I've been looking for a good trail horse forever, and these online auctions are ridiculous too, and when I contact a "seller" aka "horse trader" some of them get downright pissy if I ask what they consider are too many questions. If I had a dime for every time they say "he's as broke as the day is long" I'd move to Alaska and buy a mountain top. The BEST horse I ever had was an Arabian mutt 3 year-old, for 600.00, over 30 years ago of course. Those days are gone I'm afraid.
For me it has the most to do with the cat genetics are in what seems like everything everywhere. I love the cats but finding something solid to breed without crossing cat is getting tough. I'm starting to look for more old school big boned cow/ranch bred horses to cross on.
Also I would like to lease about 300 acres with a cabin and corral , all utilities, and hay barn.
THANK YOU! 25 years ago I purchased a 2nd cross QH, no one wanted him, everything said about him was negative. This was a time when the cost of a horse over $800 in Australia was considered getting pricy. I paid $500 (slaughter fee) due to the instant connection with him. He was smart, too smart. He had everyone figured out in minutes. I started rodeo on him, he was great, did pony club, he loved jumping and cross country. I did a dressage competition and got sniggered at by a lady riding a $5000 horse, (back then, that was ridiculously expensive). Well, we came in equal 2nd with that horse. I looked at her and said “you paid $4500 too much seeing as mine never learnt dressage and we forgot the pattern”.
Great advice! 👍🏻
Inbreeding is why I left my beloved Arabian breed. 30 years ago you could barely find great rugged desert bred Arabians built for work. I challenge anyone to find me one today. I searched high and low a few years ago and found zilch. Now they are these crazy looking works of “art” and their minds are blown.
I managed an A. farm for a former president of IAHA ( as it was called then ) ; he bred & showed Polish Arabians back in the late 60's , 70's & a few in the 80's -great dispositions , athletic & pretty ; won many nat. top tens !! None were the " extreme " ( unhealthy ) conformation as seen in many bloodlines today . All his homebreds lived long , healthy lives in happy retirement . 💙
@@cynthiajohnston424I had a big grey Polish Arab 20 years ago. I had forgoten about those big boned Arabians. I had a tiny inky black Egyptian Arab. Now I live in high desert plains of NM and I have to consider the harsh winters. My Egyptian hated the west Texas winters. Next year buying a horse. Have done a deep dive on gaited breeds. Now looking at Halflingers and Fjords. I need a good all around horse for daily trail riding, with carriage pulling potential. My dream is doing the major rodeos (Calagary, Cheyenne, Denver, etc) with the carriage and some parades riding. Also, we live near a cemetery, and have a funeral hearse wagon. I need a hardy horse for our harsh winters, and I am small, 5' 4" and 120 lbs, so a smaller horse is better. But man, horse shopping brings back memories of listening to the cowboys on our ranch talking horse business. I am open right now and patient. Buying a horse to me is trickier than finding a good man. 😂 (40 yrs married to a superbly good man who indulges my horse habits).
Btw, I say "horse business" because those cowboys never really traded anything but man would they ever talk it. And that Polish arab was the buckingest horse I've ever owned. 😂
@@skyethewylder Started & showed many Polish Arabians - they were extremely alert & cautious when started but smart , kind , willing & very smooth rides ! I spent shorter schooling times per day on A's , going slower w/ an extended , more drawn out months-long training schedule than for my QH's . Different minds in different bodies - a good horse is a good horse ! 💟
Basically the same with dressage horses, great video!
Metallic Cat is one of the greatest sires the world has seen so people want them or breed to him. Cutter/cowhorse people tend to stay away from "line breeding" because the stud fees and such are not worth the risk. It is the Hancock lovers and people who don't care enough to register the horse the are more into/ok with line breeding. There are many great sires that do not have Cat in them such as Boon too suen, Dual Reyish, Hottish and Hickory Holly time just to name a few. I understand the point you are making but you saying that there are to many and the people are linebreeding is not real fair.
For us it’s two parts. First it’s really more of a value conversation. Metallic Cat is a great stud horse but he’s $10,000 to breed to. There are so many good options that are 25% of that price. Second is as we moved to highly specialized breeding, we get too focused on the short term and line breed. Agreed that’s just a subset of breeders but it is happening and that’s when risk for genetic disease increases.
It is 10K because the quality of horse you are breeding to. Again, there are so many other great studs out there who are not High Brows or Metallics. I don't think it's fair for you to say that people shouldn't buy a Metallic cat though.@@Stonefieldranch
100%. I've spent the better of 40 years around quarter horses. Fads come and go. Buy the horse you need. Great advice.
Well said sir. Thank You
thank you for the info
Wise words for every horse discipline!
Good advice
Third best horse i ever bred was a king fritz stud too a pretty little grade mare my brother owned, first and second goes to a brother and sister out of the same stud and a peppy san badger mare, but that cross was dynamite in cow sense and cold backed
Great video! I love my little gelding out of Trashadeous. He was cheap because he is only 13.3 hands which is fine by 5 foot me. Anyone who pays for color deserves to pay a lot. Vain much?
horses are "out of" mares
Hope you don't get sued for telling the truth. Bred my mare to Shiney Outlaw 1/4 the stud fee of Metallic Cat and just as good.
I LOVE Shiney Outlaw!!!!!..especially when Sarah Dawson rode him....though I think generally MC is more considered weighted toward cutting and SO Working Cow Horse, with of course cross over. Anyway, that will be a nice baby!!
6 mo. old buckskin. Beautiful. Gunna be very kool. Sarah was the reason I bred to him.@@myronschabe
Great advice can you do one on Barrel Horses?
Thank you.
We just want a good, sound trail horse without breaking the bank. 😢
Too many breeders out there and not enough responsible horse owners. It's disgusting.
My grandpa had a stud donkey that turned out plenty of sound mules I personally like quarterhorses and Arabian horses
Awesomely said, more education needs to put out there, who cares about who’s feelings get hurt, people need to understand they are extremely intelligent line, and a horse trainer who doesn’t know how to introduce and proper training it’s a rodeo train wreck. Keep up the good cowboy truths you might save a life ! And that’s a truth. The buckle chasers ruining lines for fast and faster more cowboys like you are needed!
It took years for them to figure out where HERDA came from. And my aunt bred those horses for years
I haven't had a stock horse in some time. I'm looking for one now. My state is not great for getting them, good bad or ugly
Agreed…If you know what to look for, quality horses can be found at bargain prices. Heck, some Folks give away nice horses just to avoid extra bills…
I agree with you 100%.
Look at for example.
Docks prescription horses.
They floated the market.
And you Goodbye two-year-old.
At the horse sail for 750.
Agreed!!! Plus they are little and I wouldn’t feel comfortable tying off to a Brahman blood cow that got out and is running down the highway… now yeah up in big country setting where you got time to let rope slide on British type cattle, yeah ride a smaller more catty horse so you can sort better… but down south they need to have some legs under them with thick bone to cover the deep muddy pastures and gotta have some muscle and weight behind them to dead stop a 1500# big eared cow running Mach 3 into oncoming traffic.
This is a bold statement........Buyer beware ........So, report them if you believe they are abusing the bloodline s of metallic cat ... Repeatedly having health issues, sold to inexperienced buyers, horses used for insurance fraud.....Who carries the insurance on this breed??? breeder required to report problems with purchaser's of there stock .....best of luck
I bred my Smart Little Lena Granddaughter to one of Metallic Cat’s brothers. He isn’t as famous, but considering tongue River used to stand him he ain’t no slouch either. Got a helluva colt on that cross at a fraction of the price.
I own grays starlights one of his sons, very intelligent and athletic good minded, we are working him slow and easy, and he’s doing great loves to work. But taught him more whoa, not ready he hasn’t finished growing to speed dial him causes many injuries, and I rather my horse then wins! So many are inpatient, and breeding cross, inline, they end up selling my girlfriend died 6 months ago on a hotline metallic crossed with TB he ran so fast she flew into Tree no helmet so yes it’s dangerous ! You never know when that bred cross or inline horse will explode great awareness!
Plus, everyone is breeding to cutting horse stallions thus making very short quarter horses without enough bone.
Exactly!
I’ve been in the horse world oh my life, you can go to an auction look over a young horse very very well. Make sure there’s nothing wrong with the legs and your disposition and stuff and you can train that horse to be anything you want it to be. It just takes time and patience. You don’t have to pay a pile of money for a good horse.
I’ve bought many good horses for little to no money. And I’ve seen horses go for big dough that were nothing
So true, I have rode Leo bred horses my life I dont compete but my father owned a 150 cows gathered them 100s of times got in heavy springers, gathered sick ones Leos are great, But this horse market is about fads, the money is in Metalic cat or Pepto bred horses on a goo note you might get a bargain on a Leo or Poco
Couldn't agree more
Agree. Not everyone needs to pay this for a horse. I know I don't. I'm never going to be in the ranks of the horseman who have the skills and abilities to turn a profit out of a 60k purchase. Ack!
This was an interesting video though the caption was not entirely accurate...more like "Why you don't need a Metallic Cat". Probably his fame from the TV show makes this whole thing exaggerated. But I LOVE your point of getting a very nice quality horse from an auction....there are SO MANY nice horses out there that just need a chance. And there are VERY few people that need a ferrari...only in the ranks of the highest competitors need those. We need more videos out there that educate people about fads and trends and the longer term consequence of those things ( for example, AQHA halter horses....being unsound).
Any, I do love MC but, for sure, genetic diversity is really important. Thoroughbreds are currently very much suffering from this point presently.
Really glad you posted this. Seen these trends come and go. Definitely time for an outcross in the QH industry.
There are countless out crosses
Yup that’s true , but no one wants a no name horse now days, everything needs to have paperwork, but even a good solid ranch horse is still pricey, horse selling and buying is ridiculous now .. but thanks for sharing this video
Do your homework and you can beat people on fancy bred horses every day. I did. Won the World twice on a horse that cost a bare fraction of every other horse in the arena 😏.
One judge heard me call her Flower (her barn name) and the next year he had a young Bar Flower that looked kinda like my mare but was nowhere as good. 😂
Makes a lot of sense
Yeah don’t buy The best minded, most athletic, most trainable cowhorses. That makes tons of sense lol 😅😂
Sound advice.
While i agree that not everyone needs a Ferrari, if youre wanting to compete breeding is a huge component. Yes there are always exceptions but thats a little like using the powerball as your retirement strategy. Metallic Cat is Smart Little Lena top and bottom. Doc's Hickory on top and Peppy San Badger on the bottom. High Brow Hickory on top and Peptoboonsmall on the bottom. The proof is in the pudding. In competition you could easily waste more money on travel and class fees with no earnings than you would spending the extra for a Metallic Cat yearling. Its all about your need and purpose. Let's not forget they dont train and ride themselves. Even a MC colt without the right training and the right rider is just a more expensive train wreck.
Dual Reyish or Stevie!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Agreed
Please do a segment on breeding quarter horses that are 17 hands. It is getting ridiculous and for some reason judges love them in the show ring. The enormous horses I see in the show ring are contradictory to the purpose of the quarter horse for ranch work and pleasure riding. No one can get on these horses without a three step mounting box. This is sad, because it relegates these horses to either the race track or show ring. I personally want horse that is more versatile and that I can easily mount in any situation.
Mettalic Cat was Doc Bar line bred anyway.
Maybe if you crossed him with a mare with some size?
You're giving up a little agility but I ddon't want to be roping bulls on a 950 pound gelding.
I try to keep my working horses in that 1100-1300 pound range.
I have thought that was true, about the High Brow Cat lines.
I am so tired of people running out buying their kids a horse or pony whichever it may be and they have no clue on what horses care consist of. Then people like myself has to fix all there mistakes.
I prefer my grade roping horses over my registered roping horses with my experience grades just work and seem too really have the heart too please
There are plenty of good mustangs oit there too if have that kind of time, but you must have paid for the dun horse too.. Since duns and buckskins are the rage.
$4,500 for an unstarted 3 Year Old. Which isn’t terrible these days. I prefer to start my own colts anyways.
I watch the health panels when I start thinking about breeding a mare. Too many studs with herda, gbed,etc. I’m amazed these horse associations aren’t paying attention. Money talks.
I'd be happy with a halflinger. Cost of horses is driving the cost of care up. 1k a month for boarding is stupid.
Last reason I get. First two reasons are Bull shit. If the person has money let em spend it what do you care it does not affect you in any way shape or form especially if you are buying grade horses. Second if a person want a Ferrari let em buy one. Once again it does t affect you in any way shape or form. Free country.
Never even considered Metallic Cat or Peptoboonsmal(another overrated/fad sire of cutting horses). Can I afford them, sure, but why throw money at something I don't need? I don't need a pure cutting horse, I need all around using horses that can cut with if need be along with the cajillion and a half other things I need the to do. Personally I prefer older all around using lines, E.g. Two Eyed Jack, Skipper W, Doc Bar, Driftwood, Colonel Freckles, and sometimes Peppy San Badger depending on their conformation.
Producing 52 million dollars is not a fad or overrated
All Skipper W has produced is a bunch of knot heads
@@natemoncecchi6320lol I was just going to say that about skipper W horses. I’m old enough to remember them first hand. Lots of using type lines can be broncy with time off. Hancocks are well known for it, but those skipper W were good buckers every day even after riding a few hours. Dishonest knot heads.
I’ve always had great luck with peppys, doc bar, wimpy, Leo, two eyed jack. One of the best using horses I’ve owned is old man on top and peppy on bottom. We’ve even had a few easy jets that were good.
@@tracyjohnson5023 I should have put Leo in my original post, love that line. In my last 45+ years of riding and ranching my very best horse had Leo and Bartender on the bottom, and King and Three Bars on top.
Foundation bred everyday for me.
you probably don't read this section, but if you do, where can i buy a 2 year old good qualty ranch horse, these prices in Texas are Rediculous.
If you can get ahold of one. Rasmussen Quarter Horses in Corinne Utah sales Dry Smart Crocker Weanlings for $2500-$3000 and they’re the best ranch horses I’ve ever seen. Tough, athletic, pretty, and smart. Most are bay or bay roan.
Sad that so much is about registered horses Grade horses were wonderful but now it's a small market
Everything he said is true.
Thanks for the support on our channel, Larry! You’re a great horseman.
There are horses in Oklahoma that are the best quality and old school natural breeding program you don't have to buy junk and high dollar promises.
You can spend five or six figures on a good horse and permanently ruin it with just one month's bad training!
You can also buy a three-figure horse and turn it into an amazing creature, everyone's dream horse with wise training and hours spent in the saddle! This is why true Schoolmasters, on average, sell for 10 to 20 grand, or more. What you're paying for is the hundreds of hours of education to make that Schoolmaster into what he is. This includes his feed, his shoes, the tack he busts up in his training process, his accommodation, and the time of the trainer. It all adds up, and pretty soon, 20 grand for a dream horse is actually not so unreasonable...