The "Back Angle"
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- Опубліковано 21 лип 2024
- How to achieve this subtle "back angle" into your Cigar Box Guitar builds. A few things to note:
1. There is roughly 1/4 inch 'fall' cut into the heal portion. The neck portion under the cigar box top is thicker at the fretboard.... thinner at the saddle. 2. the corresponding shims (or blocks) under the fretboard will need to be thicker toward the end of the heal to make up for the thinner heal (and thinner towards the fretboard because the heal is thicker at the fretboard...) the reason is because you want the underside of the cigar box to maintain contact with the bridge section of the neck as well as the "shelf" near the fretboard. I hope this all makes sense...???
This is another idea I never know.Cant wait for my custom getar.Thanks for your instructions.God bless
You are so welcome
Cheers, thanks for the explanation
Shims are great! they prevent rattle from the neck and keep everything nice tight and solid!
I have a box now I am working on shimming out.. :)
Man that helps me so much, I was having a hard time visualizing what you meant by back angle!
It's a big deal... subtle yet necessary
Thanks for finally clearing up how it's mounted inside the box. That's the part that has been confusing to me. I understood the principle when you showed it in the last video you talked about it. It just wasn't clear that you shimmed it. I've been doing something similar since you showed it last year in your video- but keeping the plane on top with the box notches parallel (in the "traditional method" of accommodating the box lid) but sanding/cutting the underside of the neck to create the angle. Same affect just different was to achieve it. Now I have to figure out which way is easier and quicker to do. Thanks again for ALL your tips, my builds have gotten better and better over the last couple years primarily from tips you've posted.
Speaking of, the building now- the resonator that looks like and old radio is laid out using my snazzy new Golden Ratio Compass I built over the holidays. It's looking awesome.
Thanks for you sharing your clear and many secrets of execution. I have been using this trick for about a year because of your videos. I am always hungry for new ideas and your videos sure have good info. The level of our craft is improved with this simple act of sharing.
Thank you! I'm getting better and better building my cigarBox Guitars watching your videos! Thank you, Sir, you have my respect!
Thanks Del! Will give it a try on my next build.
Just finished my third cigar box instrument - a ukulele for my wife - and I used a back angle for the first time. It turned out really, really well and I'm going to use your back angle method on all of my future builds. Having the extra clearance between the strings and the top of the box makes a huge difference. Also, I was at Ace Hardware yesterday and saw the shutter hinge kit that you recommended in one of your other videos. The price was reduced from almost $9 to $3.99, so I bought two kits. Thanks so much for all that you contribute to the CBG community through your teaching. :)
My advice is to draw it full size, using the dimensions of the box, the action on the last fret and the string relief you want. It's much easier if you can see what you need to do before you try to do it.
I have almost always tried doing this with my Fretless builds, but never that "drastic" of an angle. That "quarter of an inch" is a great way to better explain this. As always, thanks!
Another thing I might add is that as I’m doing it I have to break it down into steps and if I do and follow the geometry it works. Once you explained the shims in the box I completely understood what you were talking about if I’m not mistaken were keeping the neck straight in the box so that the back angle is not going to be radicalized or changed which makes perfect sense once you think about it but at first it seem counterintuitive thank you so much for this information it’s fantastic
Great tip. Think I'll try that on my next build. Thanks!👍😎🎸🎶
I meant to say back angle , but thanks for the refresher video. Always wanting to learn more. Tracy McDougal
Great videos Del. I retro fitted a back angle on a six string (sorry for swearing by saying "six string") cigar box guitar. I simply used two washers on a bolt on neck and Bob's your Uncle. Instant back angle! Although the saddles are at their max height on the hard tail bridge it plays so much better than it did and the action is superb. The way the builder of the guitar had made it, even with the hard tail bridge saddles at minimum height the action was really high in the upper register. I've now got action that's about 2mm right to the 22nd fret!
Anyway, great videos and CAN even work retro fitted. Thanks Del.
it's such a subtle nuance that it often goes 'un noticed"... and consequentially many builders do not incorporate this into their builds.
You demonstrated witht the exact box I am using for my current project. It almost seems too easy since I don't have to figure out anything for myself.
you’ll still figure stuff out… i’m certain
@@PuckettCigarBoxGuitar Definitely. BTW, it came out great for just my 4th build. Too bad it is for a friend.
I’m definitely going to try the back angle your guitars always sound good so I’m sure there’s serious Validity to it
Thank you for revisiting this top[ic and walking us again through the steps! It has indeed brought more clarity to the process.
Agree. After watching both back angle videos I feel like I've got it figured out.
That make sense to me .. now ... you have a large neck on one side and a thin neck on the end of the cigar box.. after that you put on the bottom two spacers.. one thinner in the front and one large at the end... then you carve the neck in the zone that's inside the cigar box except for the part that have to support the bridge of the CBG .. so the lid can resonate but you have support for the tension of the strings ... will try this out in my next CBG.. Thanks Del from Italy
That's what I needed! So basically you're removing material from the tail end of the neck so the tuner end is lowered.
Please make a video showing how to cut that angle. Thanks.
go to youtube search bar and type in “puckett cigar box back angle”
Great video, another one of those topics best explained in a video rather than in words?
Why would you cut it if your just going to shim it
Thanks
Good!!
Hi Del, thnx for sharing, I do have a question, does the overall length of this box make a difference in how high or low the back shim is? How do you determine the correct back shim height ?
Love your videos!
Thnx
Do you have a video of how to remove the box lids? An easy, non destructive method I should say haha.
Del, I'm about to build my first CBG. Would you recommend I do this or just stick with a "flat" neck? Thanks. :)
Hey! So why not just have the bridge higher than the nut?
try it…. might work for slide work 👍🏽
Hey Del, does that angle work on all scale lengths?
this creates action at the bridge … you can play around with it and find the perfect angle for any instrument and any playing style
I get it! I saw a video and the guy was doing the opposite angle and it raised the action far to much. Another example of builders not being players
Both "overset" and "underset" are necks OK! I'm afraid you're doing a little bit of a disservice here to CBG makers, implying this is a strict standard for construction (for either CBGs or guitars in general). On a slightly different issue, I talked to a man who made all his CBGs 25.5" scale length, because both classical and Fender electric guitars were this length, he assumed it was a rule. There's no special rule like that, although it provided a good model that is easily repeated and imitated.
Likewise, it's perfectly legitimate to have a straight neck with parallel strings. You can put all the "action" in the bridge to nut heights. It's a style choice rather than a strict luthier rule. Sometimes I get tired of hearing "there are no rules" in CBG making, but it's a humbling corrective that's needed sometimes.
Hi I've just finished making my first cbg , I chose to put my head for the tuners on a different way to any I have seen, it works well, any idea why nobody else does it this way? Here's a link to a picture of it. pin.it/fhg3xbd4773re4
If the only goal of this is to create more clearance for your picking/strumming hand why not build it flat and simply make a taller bridge? Wouldn't that work as well and be faster and simpler? Or does it help to have the box top and neck not be parallel?
Turnstyles it’s something you need to try and experience for yourself in order to fully understand. It’s a subtle nuance that really makes a difference in my opinion. It’s a FEEL thing ... give it a try and then let me know your thoughts 😎
@@PuckettCigarBoxGuitar I'll have to build two then, so I can compare. I've yet to build my first. I've even designed one with a round box that I will turn on my lathe. But I've yet to start building. Trying to make a living really can get in the way of a man's hobbys.
@@turnstyles7485 let me save you some time. "Wouldn't that work as well and be faster and simpler": YES! Many (non-cigar box)electric guitars are made that way, and I'd say it's the BEST way for beginner makers. Also for maximizing profit if you can sell them as fast as you crank them out. Also, necks can be "overset" as well as "underset".
I believe the neck angle idea came from when necks would bow from string tension, and people would shorten the bridge(which can be very expensive on some guitars) to a minimum for correction. Adjusting the neck angle (specifically re-adjusting an already shimmed neck), can avoid that.
It affects the action across the entire guitar, so if you just raise the saddle without any back angle, the action over the fretboard will be high as well, making it play "worse". This achieves the desired action everywhere. Its a genius solution when you think about it because there is no nut (del usually uses a zero fret) to slot and no (easily) adjustable bridge, and the big thing is no truss rod to give any relief to the neck.
Why not just cut the heel on a slight angle? This would do away with the need for shims.
it's the top side of the heal (that's touching the cigar box top underside) that needs the angle... not the bottom side of the heal. plus you'll want to keep as much of the heal intact as you can for "strength". no unnecessary cutting is recommended. i suppose if you are going to connect your neck to just the cigar box TOP... then you wouldn't necessarily need the shims. i 'usually' connect my necks from the backside....thus the need for shims.