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Tips for putting wet effects (reverb and delay) in front of amps in the Line 6 Helix
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- Опубліковано 26 тра 2020
- In this video Brian talks about how to dial in your wet effects in the Line 6 Helix when placing them in front of amp blocks (rather than after the amp/cab blocks). It's a very different sound, and you definitely have to approach things a bit differently.
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I know this video is old but THANK YOU. I had to switch to helix because that's what my church uses now and i couldn't find any patches with the wet effects before the amp but finally I found this 😅
I don’t own a helix anything and this was helpful to me. Cutting low end on the verb when running your wet effects in front makes total sense. Thank you for explaining this!
Great job Brian, thanks for doing all that "homework" for us. Love your Helix patches!
My gut feeling is that the change in sound (and our opinions) is because Line 6 Helix has had numerous updates in the years since the Helix came out. So at one time (when you first tried it out), the wet effects in front of the amp didn't sound as good. But now with the updates they've put out, and now that you've tried it again, it sounds awesome!
😍😍😍thanks for this... Glory to God... God bless you more.. 😊
Not sure if anyone has commented this, but the reason you needed to up the amp gain on the pre patch is because of the split block before. If you have them panned fully left and right, you're only sending a part of the signal into each of the amps. I believe you can still get a stereo effect by removing that block, but it sounds better to me doing it the way you showed in the video. Hope that helps!
That's a good point. I actually did two takes of this video, and I forgot to address how I set up the split block in the 2nd take (which is what made it to UA-cam).
It's not a panned split (it still retains the stereo image, though). In the return of the split, path A is muted, so you're only hearing path B. This makes it so that the split actually just extends the first row and gives you space for more blocks rather than doing parallel processing.
So volume-wise (and signal-wise), it acts the same as if you just had one path. Also the clean tones are at the same level - its only when you add gain that the wet effects-after-amps patch gets louder.
I always ran tube amps with no effects loop. So, the pedalboard just went into the front of the amp. I got an Iridium and ran my wet effects after at first. I really liked it and could run the drive on the “amp” more. But, I found that the Reverb’s especially sounded super bright after, so I went back to before the amp. I just got an HX effects and am running that before the Iridium. I know it seems like I should just get a full helix. But, I enjoy the simplicity of the Iridium and already had it, so... Also, I grabbed your delays and verbs for HXFX. Good stuff! It really helped me dial in tones that work for me. Great work guys!
To my ear you can definitely hear the delay/reverbs driving the front of the amps harder when its all setup in front of the amp, which is exactly what you get when you try it with a real amp. Sometimes that's cool, but I've found that if I'm switching between delays at different levels I sometimes end up with more drive than I want (and not in a good way), because the amp has to deal with more input signal. It generally adds an over driven feel but not from an OD pedal, which means I cant control it as easily. Also, I'm not a FoH audio guy, but I would imagine running those effects in an effects loop and keeping the overall signal cleaner would be more desirable for mixing. But as always, its all about personal preference. Thanks for the thorough demonstration!
Actually running delays / reverbs after the amp is less desirable for mixing, it makes the guitars sound smaller and not fit into the mix as well. Every big P&W guitarist (that I know of) runs delay and reverb into the amp, no effects loop. The Worship Tutorials guys are an outlier in the way they do things.
Yeah, exactly what I experienced when I made the move to the Fas Ax-8.
I had to really tweak my presets and add lots of mids plus reduce the mix level of the delays and reverb to really stand out in the mix at church. I think it worked cause the sound guys and worship team loved the tone. ❤
I prefer wet effects after the amp! Thanks for walking us through that- pretty cool.
Hey Sooze! I like them after as well. Making this video only solidified my opinion, ha. I will say that I like the tones I hear from people who use them in front - like Bradford, or David Hislop for example. But personally I always end up putting them after.
The real star of this video are those '66 AC Silver Bell IRs. Whoah.
@@worshiptutorials dude I love them too! :)
When you do the comparisons can you play them directly after each other ( and even better back and forth) after you've talked about what you've changed I lose all perspective... love you video BTW.
Thanks for sharing these great tips for E. Guitar for worship!👍🎶🎸 God bless you 🙏😊
at last this new recording studio is build. I followed this from our Facebook page.
Been running my helix this way for nearly two years now. 🤘🏻
Our new WL just pointed out this video to me. Sounds awesome but, as usual, your mileage will vary when your church PA can't support stereo patches. :-) But at least I'll have less DSP ( processor power) issues.
i like the desk set up!! when i played the video i was like "ok ok fancy'" lol
David Hislop talks about putting the wet fx in front of his amps gets "his" sound but loses the "bigness" of how we're used to hearing verb and delay, so he's testing, on the Helix, putting the fx both before and after the amps to get the best of both...might try it out.
I love this format. I love a video on how to set up reverb from scratch, I'll look to see if you made one
If I’m attempting to get more realistic sounds (e.g. ‘63 Spring Reverb) I’ll put them up front. Mono delays or tremolo I tend to put in front as well. But if I need space and ambience I’ll add those after. So my approach is a hybrid one.
Cool & interesting video Brian! And it sounded great, as usual ;-) Like this format as well! Looking forward to more Helix video's!
Your voice sounds so much alike the narrator on the spider-man 2 PS2 game.. loving the videos on the other hand
Don't remember where i read this, but setting pedals Pre amp style, is geared more for a live playing situation.
Post amp style is more for studio recording setup.
It kind of makes sense, but in reality, nothing is set in stone. What ever sounds best to your tone; that's what really matters. ❤
My amp has built-in delays and reverbs in post, but I also run delay in front of the amp for slap backs and swells. It's a cool sound either way.
I am truly blessed and humbled I have learn alot watching your video God bless you sir and I need I kind request please make a acoustic tutorial video we will not be shaken by Brian Johnson
Can you do a rattle tutorial
I've tried both, I understand why they do it in front of the amp, but I can't help but still like the clarity of going into the effects loop. Just muddy's up the mix when you add band, cymbals etc in front of amp. I have setup on more board to do both depending on the track
hHis is a great Video! I am definitely going to use this! @worship tutorials was this patch posted to purchase?
When I was using a pedalboard and amp, would usually go delay, reverb, and any other modulation going into the amp. Now that I only have the Helix now, go wet effects after the amp usually.
I can tell you enjoy the post amp more. For so many years on my analog pedalboard I went pre Amp but after getting my FAS Ax-8, i could not make it sound good pre style. But as soon as i went post style the sound came alive and more open. I really think it could be exactly what you said. It maybe that pre style going into the amp eats up the stereo field. But then, why does going pre style with analog pedalboards sound so good? Mind boggling😅
Superb Video and well presented too.. You nailed the exact problem i have, I'm actually using the HX stomp in front of a 1x12 combo using the combo's own distortion, I wanted reverb but it came with (as you described, distorted trails!! ) It was those that i did'nt want, So what do i do to lose the distorted trails to make the reverb sound like reverb should? thanks for this
Super late on this one, but I hope this can help if this issue hadn’t been solved. I believe a possible solution would be to run the stomp in the amp’s effects loop similar to how you’d run delay/verb pedals to get that cleaner sound. I’m not entirely sure how to route it because I’ve never needed to (I prefer the “dirty” trails), but Richie Castellano has some pretty good videos going over effects loops!
Could you maybe talk about effective use of snapshots, footswitches, and DSP when making a non-song specific patch? Whenever I make a patch to use for a specific style or artist I always find myself struggling with putting in more effects than I have room or DSP for, and I have a hard time choosing which snapshots to use, since most genres can't be boiled down to just 8 tones (really 6 since I almost always have a clean and swells snap).
Sure - that's a great topic!
Awesome tips! Great tutorial.
808 reverb- boooooom! 😂
Thanks for making this.
Parabéns pelo seu trabalho, você seria bem-vindo pra fazer uma turnê no Brasil, com suas configurações e aulas.
I don't know if this is true or not... but for a long time I remember listening to Helix demos that just sounded terrible. And then one day, like magic... all of the demos started to sound amazing. Is it possible there was firmware update that really took the unit up a notch? Might be that when you first tried putting reverb in the front it was back during the time when all the demos were bad, LOL.
More tutorial of line 6 pod go please thanks blessings!
Wet after every time. You don’t have to worry so much about the effect driving into the amp. I am on the clean clean clean delay and reverb team. I feel like if I need some grit on those sound you can always turn on a drive pedal. This is almost like the volume pedal before drives or volume pedal after drives debate.
Hey good stuff, amigo! Could you do a “dialing in the chime” of a AC 30 when using the Stomp. I’ve been struggling to capture that tone and I haven’t found anything on how to dial it in. Thanks!
I actually just made the switch from pre to post wet effects on my board. I have loved running my wet effects into the amps but I also really like the change.
Question: should I run my delay and reverb as absolute last on my board, or does it make sense to have an eq block right after the wet effects as the last block on my board? @worshiptutorials
Question: would you recommend running my delay and
thank you
well this sounds great
I need this!
Someone help me out here.. what's the point of stereo? I understand it in a recording, but if you're playing a big church, only those in the middle will enjoy the stereo image, everyone else on the sides will get only one side of the sound. I googled the subject and apparently the vast majority of medium to big concerts are run in mono for that reason. So, help me out here, why should I have a stereo rig for playing live?
If you use in ear monitors (and have a stereo mix), it’s glorious. But your point is true - most live systems are actually mono, and in a live mix all the stereo stuff is mostly lost.
For recording/studio stuff it’s pretty great though.
So much more inspiring to play in stereo. Makes your guitar sound huge and awesome
Have you tried wet effects after amp, only one amp and mono up through the amp, followed by mono or stereo wet effects followed by a drive effect?
Curiously my pedalboard including wet effects goes straight into the HX Stomp just like my old tube amp setup, but the wet effects in the HX Stomp come after the amp.
Love this video! I use an HX Stomp for amps with my pedalboard and run my wet effects in the Stomps effects loop. I prefer the sound of wet effects into the amp but I get a hum. With the effects loop after the amps it is silent. All patch cables are good, all pedals are on isolated power. Any thoughts on what the issue could be?
Could be your input Volume. Turn down the Ch volume of your amp a good bit and boost your output volume in the output section and see if it helps..... It helped me a lot.
Not sure if you've solved this issue, but 2 things that improved this for me were first cutting fx loop block input by 3db and boosting output by 3db and second switching the fx loop send cable from a regular patch cable to a EBS ICY-30 Y cable from empire guitars. It splits the mono ouput from the hx stomp to stereo (tip and ring).
When I add a lot of verb I loose gain, maybe that has something to do with it
Is this patch in process to be made available?
Yeah we’ll be releasing it soon. Thanks!
Did you do a patch on this 😎?
9:10 so true.
Make the patch available on WT so I can just buy it and spend my time doing something else. 😂😂😂
Ha it sounds pretty great, right? I was A/B’ing it to my favorite AC30 patch in the Axe-FX 3 and I think I preferred this Helix patch 👀
hello. how can i get this presets? thanks
All our Helix presets are available here: worshiptutorials.com/helix/
Hello!How is it Helix LT?
Is there a reason you use two IRs for the post patch? My thinking is 1 IR with stereo wet effects after the IR would do the same thing right? Or am I missing something (probably). Lol
If you want wet effects in front of the amp you need two IR’s to retain the stereo image.
Worship Tutorials but what if you only want wet effects after the amp/IR? I noticed you still had dual IRs for that too. Any reason for it? Trying to learn so I appreciate it.
Isaiah Aguilera in that case you don’t need two IR’s. We do it sometimes just because it sounds better.
Are these in Line 6 customtone?
Well there's another option to make the effects sound like is before the amp! You could just put the amp head then the effects then the IR or Helix cap, the effects will stay between the amp head and the cab
How to get bethel sounds in the Helix? Buy David Hislop’s presets. Just sayin. They sound brilliant.
Do you know for a fact they are running their boards in front of the amp and not using effects loops?
David Hislop from Bethel does for sure. If you watch any rig rundown from Nigel Hendroff he’s always putting amps last in the chain.
If it’s not a live recording and they’re in the studio, then who knows...
@@worshiptutorials cool, I wasn't sure lol
Yes, the well known worship guitarists do. David Hislop, Michael Pope, Jeffrey Kunde, Brian Carl, Nigel Hendroff, James Duke, Daniel Carson.. to name a few. But adding to what Brian said in the studio, generally they end up doing whatever they think a song needs.. and can be a mix of both wet in front or in post on the same song.
Lots of digital clipping in the playing clips, guys.
No, that’s just the Helix signature sound.
I think what you guys are hearing is the reverb trails breaking up when hitting the front of the amp
@@elijahwest2468 no, its clipping. Listen closely with headphones and you can hear little fizzes and pops. Theyve set the level of the helix too high.
@@zacharykim295 I hear it as well. If you hear it on the attack of the delays, I usually increase the Headroom parameter on the offending delay(s). In this case, it sounds like there is digital clipping somewhere in the chain. Still, it's a great demo.
How do you folks afford all these expensive equipment?
I believe they get sponsored
God's blessing to great servants of the King!❤
how abot hx stomp ?
Once you put two amp blocks and two IR blocks in a stomp patch, there isn’t room for much else DSP-wise. You might be able to put a mono reverb in as well.
I’ll also add that the fact that Stomp will do stereo amps/cabs and sound this good is nothing short of amazing. That thing is incredible.
After sound much much better,after not sound good at all
First
Second!
Third
Bro that's not clean or edge of break up. That's dirty