As an amateur DIY enthusiast, your videos are priceless. Thank you for all of the considerable effort you put into creating them. I don't think people realise how much work goes into producing a ten minute video - it's hours! Looking forward to the next one.
Enjoyed the video. I had a similar experience in that I bought the Smith track saw which is functionally identical to your Titan except my Smith has the 1400 watt motor and variable speed. I’ve Used it for about two years and just last month bought the TS55. My feelings pretty much mirror yours. I was impressed at how good the Smith was but in the final analysis the quality of the Festool is undeniable. Although my bank account is a little bruised.
You told us last time that you had a 24 tooth blade on the Titan and a 48 tooth on the Festool. IMO, that would account for the difference in the quality of cut. Apples and pears.
Michael Read Well, I also said that I swap out the Festool 48 tooth blade for a 28 tooth in my other saws, and there's little to choose between them. But this was all about testing the saws as they come, out of the box. Who knows, maybe there's another video in the pipeline about how to improve the cheap saw... 🤔👍😄
Thanks. Yes, that might be interesting, but this was about testing the saws as they come, out of the box. The Festool can be bought with a guiderail and most dealers offer this package - I didn't buy it like that as I have plenty of rails already. Each saw was tuned to their own rail, and the splinterguard freshly cut, so I'm pretty sure using the same rail for both saws wouldn't have changed the cut quality. Be sure to watch out for the TrackSaw Workshop series, where I'll be covering thsi ground in more detail 👍
I agree with Mr. Read. All that was compared was saw blades. Next time use the same blade on both saws to see a comparison of the saws for quality of cut.
I bought a scheppach ts55 knock-off once. I thought it was junk. It had lots of problems. Then I bit the bullet and bought the festool ts55, and that machine still doesn't seize to amaze me. After the gateway drug named ts55, i've been buying festool ever since, and loving it big time.
I’ve been using this Titan for quite a few years now and it does the job well.. I bought the best possible blade to it and it cuts nicely. I use it regularly on small finishing joinery projects or kitchen projects etc. I don’t love it either though as its bulky, heavy and rough.. but I made a carrier box dedicated for this tool and all accesories I use with it and it’s quite alright. But ofc I can’t wait to get a nicer stuff like a festool or something that’s in between in price category. This Titan is defo worth for diy guys or for someone who does multitrade, handyman stuff
Old vid. now but as I say in this and the follow-on, I'd have killed to have had something like this at this kind of price when I was starting out; fast-forward to today and it's still my favourite of all the entry-level saws, and I've added in a fair few since this vid was made! 👍
Thank you Peter for a fantastic comparison. Your demonstration, really explained, to me the deference, between lower end and high end tools. While they both look like they will do the same job, the real question in buying a tool is will they? You demonstrated well that there are other factors one must also take into consideration when purchasing a power hand tool - the handling weight, ease of being able to set up, quality of the cut on the finished the material, even the dust collection ability. While these may seem like little things, they can also add up to more work or bigger problems down the line. To love ones tools is everything. Do our power hand tools, inspire us to go fourth and create?
I’m loving your uploads and am very much looking forward to the track saw workshop uploads. I’m relatively new to woodworking and don’t have the space for, or inclination to buy a table saw. It seems to me that there are probably lots of projects that I could undertake with a reasonable track saw! (and your guidance of course)!! Thanks, David.
Thanks David! Yes, indeed, I worked wood for a living for about ~14 years before I bought a small table saw (it was on sale) and it doesn’t get much use tbh. A lot depends on what type of woodworking you’re interested in, but for the vast majority of ‘around the house’ type of work, a tracksaw makes a lot of sense, especially if you’re short on space. 👍👍
Peter, another good video. I 've had the TS 55 REQ for approx. 3 years here in Canada (Not Cheap) and you're right, it allows you to do things that would take a lot longer to set up and get it done. The bottom line is when you are building furniture is to get it done properly, and why not have the best tools out there to do it .
First time watching 10 minute workshop. Very happy I found it. Nice to have an honest appraisal in simple non technospeak. Now a subscriber and looking for more clips. Thank you
Hi Peter, I am looking right now. I am very interested to see if there are more tool comparisons as I find them a very useful guide when making purchase choices. I do not like to spend hard earned money and then feel cheated by creative advertising.
I did a little research and chose the WEN 1065 which is identical to the Titan reviewed. I found the WEN to have a binding bevel guide system which the Titan also has. My fix was to lubricate this guide way with plastic compatible grease as half is metal with other half plastic. Any play in this guide system can lock the blade with a skew in relation to the track system. When my tracks arrive I will test this & also make perfectly sure the saw blade is in line with the guide track. You should not have to do this but that is why it is a cheap saw. Over all, I think it is a good tool.
Thank you for this video. I already own the Titan, and have been using it for about a year... arguably the Festool is the better machine, but for £90 (it was £120 when I bought it) there not much room for complaint. I put a 42 tooth Freud blade in mine and am very happy with the results. Yes, that anti kickback thing is bloody annoying, but it has saved my fingers more than once, so I live with it. Looking forward to track saw school!
I just priced a Wen vs Festool on amazon / $115 vs $600! As a hobbyist I have to learn to love what I can afford. *(BTW I can't afford the Wen right now!) I am saving for the Wen 14" Band saw. Which is only about 75 bucks more expensive that Fes's unadorned saw.
Haha.. I looked into these saws a few years back..The Titan sold at screwfix is probably the cheapest apart from the Parkside sold for 50 quid at Lidl. Titan, Grizzly, Parkside, Shceppach, and some others are all generic saws made in China.. Then you have the next level of saws which is Triton, Makita both have soft start and many other features.. I currently own the Festool and Dewalt 18v Cordless tracksaw converted to run on my Hitachi 18v 6ah battery. Perfect for trimming the botton of doors down outside without worry about dust collection, However when I'm building wardrobes in situ, I always used the Festool with dust collection.. Great video mate,, lets have some more please..
For the amount of times I would use this type of tool, which is rare, I would be happy to buy the cheapie. I have never felt it was right for me to buy a festool. Actually the best festool I have ever used was a mates one. Hahaha Great video. Thanks for posting
Really enjoying your videos Peter. It seems most of your work is mdf, but the little green thing in the package is an anti-splinter guard for the off cut. It also helps with dust collection. I may have missed it, but it's unique to festool
Jeffrey Cohen Thanks! A little poetic license on my part - Festool user for 11 years - but the little green thing that comes with the TS55R is quite different from the splinter-guard of old. As you say I work mostly in MDF and Plywood, so not of much interest, honestly, but worth acknowledging that it comes with the package. 👍
Jeffrey Cohen HaHa - very true! I'm sure I'll grow to love it - right now it's a similar size, shape & name; just 'different'. And one of my first improvements to the Titan will be masking tape, lol! Thanks! Peter 👍
Peter - great video. However at the end of Part 2 you made it even greater. I want to set up a tracksaw workshop in my new shed - it is great timing that you are going to make this series.👍😀
As previous comments say the blade is key here, I've owned the titan for about 6 months now cut about a dozen worktops, countless decor ends in kitchens with great results but only with the upgraded blade as the festool had. Don't get me wrong I use the standered blade for ripping sheets of timber plus wet wall with good results. I am more than happy with the titan.
Very interesting couple of videos. I have a Festool 12 volt electric driver that I've had for about 16 years now. Its my go to driver in preference to my 18V Dewalt. Don't know why it just feels right and I guess that's the point you make. Some tools feel right others seem to fight you. Look forward to the track saw trilogy (feel a Xmas special coming on) :-) However just one observation; the Festool MFT is a significant advantage over anything else. I have look alike but without the hinged track. What I'm trying to say is the saw plus MFT makes it a pretty unbeatable combination. Thanks so much, Mike
Excellent video and now a new subscriber. Just purchased a Lidil Track saw for my new kitchen fit and it has been a God send. Im sure its not festool league,but for £70 its ace,and ive changed the blade to a 48 T so I can get a good finish on the the plinths.
Thanks, and welcome! Track saws are fantastic - I chose the Titan for this comparison only because it’s always available, whereas the Lidl Parkside is more of a ‘special buy’. 👍👍
@@10MinuteWorkshop The Parkside is extremely similar to the Titan, wouldn't be surprised if they're made in the same factory. There's only minor differences (no kickback feature etc.)
Thanks. Lidl Parkside are often re-badged Einhell, Aldi Workzone tend to be Scheppach. I have the Parkside, but haven had the chance to look at it yet. 👍👍
Once again, excellant video, you should have done Blue Peter mate lol, I like the idea of a track saw, but just don't do enough wood working at my age to buy the Festoon, I have some of the titan stuff and found it to be very good , keep posting mate, from Garry, Barnsley UK
Thanks for the comparison. I've been thinking about getting a track saw for my work. I currently use my 36 volt Makita and an edge guide. I already have a bunch of cordless Makita tools and batteries. I'm waiting for the cordless version from Makita. Looking forward to the track saw videos. Subscribed!
Thank you for this comparison. Exactly what I needed to decide whether I bought the Titan saw or something more expensive. I'm off out now to buy the Titan because I will use it only occasionally and I can put up with its obvious shortcomings for the sake of about £300 difference in price. I do think I'll be removing the anti kickback device though. That looks too annoying.
Great video, thank you. I brought the titan as for some reason I left my circular saw at home on a day I was working with wood. It's ok but cheap. It cuts nice but my tracks are awful. May just bin them and go for a better make.
Thanks for the comparison. I noticed you left the splinter guard off on the Festool. It would have performed even better than it did. Splinter guard helps with chip out and dust collection.
+Lowell Smith Thanks! I did cuts with and without the splinter guard and it didn't make any difference to the cut - yep, surprised me too - so I went for the one without as it seemed a straighter comparison.
It's rationality (end result, price/quality) against emotion (look and feel for many years). And the winner is......! But, I must say, I have deep respectfor the marketing machine of Festool. Top!
I know this is an old video but I wanted to mention that I had the Titan track saw a while back (replaced it now) and the first thing I did was remove the anti-kickback thing. There's a small screw underneath and it comes right off. It worked really well as my first track saw and it's nice that it works with Makita tracks which I ended up getting too. The long term downside to this is that the track adjustment dials to remove play are plastic and over time they wear down so you end up with nothing left. I fixed this by adding a dab of epoxy glue on the ends of them which gave me adjustment again. Totally worth the money but I wouldn't go back now from my Makita SP6000. Festool are just too eye-watering a cost. ;)
Have to say, the Titan does appeal... If you've got a good table saw, and only use a P/S on occasion, it makes a lot of sense. If there is a niggle for me, it's the likely lack of spares back up - alright, to some extent they might be supposed to be viewed as 'disposable', but 1. that isn't very Green, and 2. it simply goes against the grain ... Wonder if anyone's yet used a 1st purchase as a means of sustaining a 2nd ...?
Excellent video for a DIYer like myself. I am in the market to purchase a tracksaw for a project and as it will not get that much use after the project is completed I will buy the Titan. I will be however looking forward to watching your tracksaw workshop videos and I have subscribed.
Thanks John, and welcome! The Titan’s a great saw for the money. Tracksaw Workshop is coming, just need to get ‘out from under’ with the current job first 👍
Great video, thanks. I wonfer if you have consideted snappinhh off the anti kick back? What has been your experience of joining the two shortet Titon tracks together... i can't get a smoth run which is a big headache... i'm thinking of getting a longer makita version, so thanks for confirming that they are compatable.
Put a strip of tape over the great big hole in the Titan's cover and I think you will find the dust collection much improved. (no idea why they made it like that) And pretty much goes without saying, upgrade to a nicer blade. Also you could just remove the kickback mechanism. Would love to see a part 3 with these upgrades.
The idea was to use them stock, as they came out of the box, and compare what they can do. As mentioned in this video though, and the follow-on #074, the stock blade in the Titan is surprisingly good for a 24t blade on a £100 saw. If you want more info on this then try the Tracksaw Workshop series (videos 277-283) where I go,into all the tricks, and video 284 for More About Blades. Video #285 puts the Titan against another cheap saw from the TW series, vid. # 286 covers the role that the splinterguard plays in the process of getting the best from the blade you have. The Titan was discontinued this year, so no more videos on that one, sadly. 👍👍
I like them both Peter ,so which one you giving away ,i just use to ole tried and true strait edge board set up ,and got my first kick back just a while back ,didnt wreck the piece .but my strait edge board looks like hell ...lol
I'm just debating whether or not to buy a table saw or could I manage with a track saw! Great video again I think I'll wait until I see the track saw workshop videos, thanks!
11hoursoff Thanks! I'd say it depends on what you plan on making; I worked wood for a living for ~14 years before I bought a tablesaw; don't use it much. But the track saw I use every day 👍
What a great and helpful video, thank you!! I have handled the Festool (but not actually used it) and I have to say that as a tool guy, it feels cheap and I don't like all the plastic. Horrible thing to say I know, but there it is. Perhaps I need to actually try cutting with one. Now the Domino, on the other hand, looks and feels incredible and subjectively seems worth anything they want to charge for it - like an old sewing machine, a microtome, or a Lie-Nielsen handplane. It makes me happy just knowing that such things are still made in this modern world...
Thanks! Did you run the motor on the Festool? Sounds like a sack of spanners, too! Great saws though - I don’t buy them for looks, feel or sound, though I do appreciate all three in context. And yes, Domino is in another league of build quality. 👍👍
@@10MinuteWorkshop No I did not run the motor but I went back to the store today and they are going to have a demonstration later in July so maybe I can try it then. I must say that I was very impressed by the features on the HK55 circular saw. If it was full-size (7 1/4 inch) I would probably buy it. The guard retraction lever and positive stops were very impressive.
Please, please, do your series on a tracksaw workshop. I'd nearly given up on the idea of having a workshop capable of repeatable, accurate rips, due to the lack of space and money for a table saw. Perhaps I could lose the mitre chop saw as well (for space) and just have a tracksaw and pillar drill! Bring it on!
I love my Festool TS55 track saw, except for one problem. It will not cut along the grain very well, trying to cut Australian hard woods. The blade flexes badly. I guess the saw was made for wood that is not as hard as most of our Aust. hard woods. No matter what blade I use, always get the same problem. Took it to the Festool authorised repairer and they tried to cut the wood along the grain, but the problem persisted. Sadly I have to use a table saw to get a 90 degree perfect cut. I have tried several blades, with exactly the same result every time.
I think another video on improving the Titan saw to bring it closer to festool performance would be a good idea and popular too. Festool are obviously good quality tools but at a staggering price.
I did look for your tracksaw workshop but I see that in that series you are not using the Titan. Did it get sent back?? The WEN brand here in Canada is identical and the dreaded black numbers on a black plastic make it less than desirable to me. Of course we do not have Aldi here in Canada so I may have to find some sort of compromise between a Festool and the ultra cheap less beloved versions of track saws on the market.
No, I still have the Titan, and all the others. The idea of the Tracksaw workshop series was to take a saw from ‘out of the box’ to fully set up, and the Aldi was a good choice. I don’t recommend it over the eg Titan though - as I conclude in the series. 👍
Good review, it's human nature to never want to admit that you personally have made a bad choice when it comes to spending a lot of money, that's why anybody who owns a festool product has already convinced themselves that the product is worth the huge cost by the time they buy it, so you tube is full of festool owners saying they are well worth the money and plenty of other people thinking you must be mad to spend that much money on a particular tool, this is the same for cars, TVs, computers, watches etc. I think both have a role you always need companies like festool who will innovate new ideas and you need people who think they can justify spending that level of money, in tern the innovations eventually filter down to the more reasonably priced brands and give access to everyone.
Very good common sense based review. And very happy to follow the track saw lessons (recently I had a nasty kickback while cutting a 2 by 4 and I'd like to know how to make sure to avoid it... :-(. Thank you Peter. Eric.
Dear Peter, based on your recommendation I got myself the Titan. I need to get some guide rail clamps and wonder if the ones for Makita would be compatible. Any idea on that? By the way, I'm hating the anti kick-back thing. I am seriously considering removing it... somehow. Did you do that yourself?
Hi Gianmario. I don’t have the Makita clamps, but I’m sure they’d be fine. I’ll double-check the Festool ones on the Titan rail when I’m back in the workshop 👍 And yes, I ditched the anti-kickback thing as soon as I could!
@@10MinuteWorkshop oh, thanks a lot! In the meantime, I created a Wikipedia article for track saws - funny that there wasn't one before today: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Track_saw Here you can see my own track saw in its full glory.
Surprisingly I have found the tracks are all the same basic profile, except for the little lip on the Makita but that isn't where you clamp it. So clamps that will work in 1 brand will work with all the others. At least Makita, Festool and Titan. (didn't look at other brands though)
Hi Peter, thanks, good video again! What are your thoughts regarding the REBQ (your model, I assume) versus the slightly more economical RQ (mine)? My dealer recommended the non-electronic for someone with a focus on wood, versus the electronic for someone working with plastics and metals. Of course, soon after buying the RQ I ended up needing to cut a huge sheet of perspex... Ben
Benjamin Stephens Thanks! Always the way, isn't it? I think the main difference is in the electronic brake for the blade, which is well worth having IMHO if you're using it a lot. There's a quick 'talking head' follow-up video coming up today that addresses a couple of things (inc blade brakes) that were edited out of these two vids. Enjoy your TS 55👍
Nice video! I like your style of presentation, quite different from some other YT-video's ('though I love the cursing Canadian also). I have the Festool (old model) and gave away my table saw (Metabo) after one day of working with the Festool. It's just so easy to work with and gives perfect cuts. However, I think I'll replace the Festool with the Makita cordless track saw in the nearby future. Being able to cut without the restrictions of a power cord is very tempting (to me).
Good reviews, the only thing that sort of stuck in my mind throughout the video was that while you mentioned a few times that the Titan was about £90 you never once mentioned that the Festool cost over 5 times as much at around £540 for the kit with two tracks. My question is, is the festool 5 times better? Does it cut five times better. In the past I've found that cheaper brand tools last as long as their much more expensive name brand counterparts. I am currently in the market to buy a track saw and I am finding it hard to choose one.
The titan tracks are only 1400 combined, so it's more like a TS55 & 1 rail which is about £380. But sure, as I hope the video explained (and there's a part 3 btw) no, it doesn't cut 4x better, but is is nicer to use, lighter, quieter, with much better dust collection, it is a better tool - as you'd expect for the price. Whether it's 'better enough' to justify the cost is up to you; it was to me, but I use these saws every day to make my living, and the Festool system with the plug-it chords etc... is worth it to me. Only you can decide if it's worth it to you.
Peter I hadn't seen the third video, just watched it now, I think the Titan is good for the price but its not the one for me. I'm stuck between the TS55 and the Makita SP6000J1. I will be using the saw a lot so reliability is a factor and when you say you got 11 years use out of your old Festool I am impressed as if you even consider the initial price it only works out at £1 a week over the 11 years excluding blades but you've to replace those no matter what saw you buy.
Stephen, I don’t know anyone who’s bought the Festool and regretted it. You might also want to watch the most recent episode of this saga, here - ua-cam.com/video/v8U1VUbkbuk/v-deo.html 👍
I do the stupid things in the hope that others don’t have to, lol 😂 Haven’t decides what to do with the resurrected saw, too busy with work to think about it really, but I’m pretty sure I don’t need all four.... 🤔
I'm looking at upgrading from my Titan. Looking at Makita or DeWalt. If you have used any of these, would you say the "difference" between a Titan and a Makita/DeWalt is greater than the "difference" between Makita/DeWalt and Festool. Thank you.
Short answer, yes - you’ll see more of a difference between the step up from Titan to Makita or DeWalt than you will from either of those to a Festool. Try and get hands on with the if you can; the DeWalt has a ‘different’ plunge action that I didn’t like, personally, and they’ve gone their own way with the guide rails, which seems an unnecessary complication. 👍👍
Well, that'd be tough to do as they take slightly different sized blades, and not really sure what you'd expect that to show?? As I've said elsewhere, this was about trying out the saws as they come, out of the box.👍
The most important parameter of the saw is quality of the cut. So cut was different and not to the favor of titan. But there are different number of tooth. That might affect the quality. So the poor quality might be due to poor quality blade but not poor quality of the tool. I would buy the same amount of tooth blades of the same manufacturer to test the cut. This is only fair go.
Gotcha. I'm quoting the reply I gave to Michael Read below:-..."I swap out the Festool 48 tooth blade for a 28 tooth in my other saws, and there's little to choose between them. But this was all about testing the saws as they come, out of the box. Who knows, maybe there's another video in the pipeline about how to improve the cheap saw..." You might want to watch the Part 3 follow-up video as I do discuss this in a bit more detail, but short answer is the 24-tooth blade in the Titan did really well until it came up against a difficult surface like MFC - and even then the chipping was very slight. As I conclude, if quality of cut and price are your criteria, the Titan's a great saw 👍
You sound like you want him to do whatever he can to make the titan better in the comparison. If you add an after market blade its not a comparison of the tools. The comparison is what you get for 90 compared to a festool. Adding a blade would double the price. Which would not be the point of the comparison
I bought the Titan (first track saw for me) and it's now back in the box. I found the guide rail moved around when I used the saw. The rubber strip on the base was not gripping the melamine board underneath. Did you have this issue at all? Any suggestions to stop the guide wandering? Still using a circular saw and clamped straight edge because I was so disappointed by the initial test with the Titan.
No, no issues at all with the rails, though the festool rails are particularly grippy. On melamine I would consider clamping the rails though - the Makita clamps work well and are a bit cheaper than the Festool ones. Or upgrade the rails for eg the evolution rails - great value.
Another great video Peter! Regarding the quality of cut, as an 'out of the box' review I appreciate the comparison. Looking at the the specifications the Festool TS55 has a 48 tooth blade, where the Titan is 24 Teeth. My question is, do you think fitting the Titan with a Saxton 48 tooth blade for £12 off Amazon, would give a comparable cut to the Festool TS55? Hey, maybe you could do a video investigating budget blades!
Almost certainly would be an improvement, though as I say in the video, I do fit a 28 tooth blade to my Festools as standard without any loss of quality of cut in normal work. There is another video planned of improvements that can be made to the Titan 👍
I bought a TS55 from ebay - works perfectly, and less than standard retail price. Then had to swallow the price of a track. Wondering if the Festool TS55 will work with any of the other (cheaper!) tracks?
I have a couple of the Makita tracks, they work well, though the anti-tipping lip on the Makita track can get in the way if you want to use some of the accessories e.g. parallel guides. But I bought mine when there was a huge difference in price between Festool and everything else; Festool is much more price-comparable now though, especially for the common lengths of track; maybe try ebay for a length of used track? 👍
I was curious as to what failed on your well used original TS55? AvE did a teardown of the saw and pointed out a couple of places that he thought might be weak links in the design so I was curious if what failed on yours was one of the items he suspected.
If you haven't seen his teardown you should check it out. He does a thorough investigation and asks any viewers that have had the tool long enough for it to fail to comment on if the failure points he guessed are accurate. Not so much that the tool broke prematurely just more a curiosity if his intuition is on point.
Peter Millard it's probably just the brushes. You can do them yourself just screw off the access panel to motor and u will see them they inside spring loaded cages u just dig them out and replace if they look worn down. I would definitely send it to festool and get it serviced the parts that wear are easily replaced. they did my cxs and it came back good as new 3yrs ago it was under warranty too so no charge. Dunno how much they charge out of warranty but I would say a lot less than a new ts. Great videos by the way ure the new parfitt☺️
jrichardsonsix Thanks. Not a total noob here - I did check all the obvious things! No, brushes were in good shape, and everything else looked Ok. Electronics are all sealed in epoxy (?) so not individually accessible. And this is well out of warranty, so there'll be a £cost for sure...
Thanks for the test. I like your work pants. are the upper pouches standard? I just check Amazon, the cheapest US track saw is a shop Fox at $188. Even that is totally out of my budget.
I Sketchup, You can to Thanks! Yes, standard 'nail' pockets on the work pants - they're removable too. There's a link to them in the 'stuff I use' section at www.10minuteworkshop.com but only available in the UK as far as I can tell.
Hi Peter, thanks for your videos I am joiner two years in and I rely so much on you tubers such as your self to get through! I have a question related to your router set up, do you have dust extraction underneath the table, . I'm in the process of making a longer work bench come router table and need to improve the dust collection underneath. I love my Makita tracksaw it's a work horse for me and had little go wrong. do you sign up to the festool repair service and is it any good? Thanks again for the video's cheers scott
Hi Peter thanks for the video - when doing the guide rail trim (4:40) on the Titan would it be best to join the two guiderails together or is it ok to do separately? Many thanks
It’s OK to do them separately, but if you have the space then join them together - it’s the start of the cut that’s the tricky part, and if you join the rails together you only have to start once! 👍
Very good videos m8, personally I own festool for 2 years now and I love it even if I used only on few projects, when I was being there ware only comparison to makita or bosch. Plenty of weekend woodworkers (like me) out there :). P.s if my ts55 would break I would buy new tomorrow
It would be good to see how accurate angle is, before festool I had some cheap circular saw and cutting something to put it together was a nightmare, saying that festool could have more accurate scale pointer and 22.5 dead stop like makita have
as always enjoyed your video but just one thing that l was thinking during the comparison between the festool track saw and the titon track saw was that you were using the festool dust extraction on both test's if you only had the titon track saw and no festool dust extraction you would have more of dust problem and the dust would have been a lot worse on the titon just a though
Harry Randles Thanks! Sure. But in the interests of consistency and real-world accuracy, it was only right to use the same extractor for each saw, don't you think?
Good stuff....and honest I think. I wonder.if you had tried a Mafell track saw you would sing the praises of the Festool as much....Basically.if the Mafell saw was in this test/review/opinion...it would make the Festool second best....but..........it is also more expensive than the Festool saw...horses for courses I guess.....buy what you can afford....and see how you go... One other thing you did point out the blade difference between the two saws ...and that will have a direct effect on the quality of cut.... Triton..seems cheap and cheeful probably best for the weekend warrior...but...it does the job providing straight cuts...I suppose. Just one more thing...the test was an "out of the box" test...so to speak.....so no rails with the Festool..........so how good is the dust extraction and chipping of the material without the guide rails.....that were not in the box.....slightly unfair out of the box test....throwing in a festool rail system . Out of the box the Titan wins hands down for performing straight cuts...or straighter then the freehand cuts that you would be forced to do with the Festool,,,,guide rail free kit out of the box....ha..ha..
Thanks! Yes, I've used the Mafell, fine saw. Arguably they iterated on the tracksaw genre better than Festool, especially with the guiderails, which have clearly had some more thought put into them. I didn't buy this Festool with rails as I already have plenty, but you absolutely can get the saw & rail as a package. 👍
Hi Zaar. No, not as far as I’m aware. You can do it the other way around - run Bosch & Mafell saws on Festool tracks, but they’re not compatible both ways, I’m afraid. 🤷♂️
Peter Millard I'm keen for this series too - got the opportunity to turn an outbuilding into a workshop next year and thinking I'll base it around a track saw rather than a table saw
I wanted a high power deep cross cut capable machine. As everyone does I looked at the cheap offerings thinking well I could get the good one later, this'll do for now. But then the brain kicked in, why buy the it'll do model at all, skip the expense and buy the one you really want. Love the one you're with, not for me! My first Festool purchase the HK 85 won hands down! 2300W of real POWER!!! as a certain controversial ""car Journalist"" might put it!
Got a big job on boarding out my loft and fitting a folding wooden loft ladder! I also just bought the FSK 670 Cross cut guide rail! Can't wait to start cutting. The Grooving Block will be next some time in the future.
Do R/C! Don't disagree, but a/ not when you're wearing ear defenders (and you should be, of course) and b/. wasn't exactly a scientific test, and c/ 85Db to 87Db - they're both fcuking loud! Thanks!
In measurable metrics - quality of cut, dust collection, noise - then no, not 3 times better overall. Maybe twice as good, depending on your priorities. But in more subjective areas - how it feels, how it handles, general fit and finish, quality of switchgear, the click-stop depth adjuster etc... then as I say in the video, the Festool is absolutely the better saw. Is it better enough to justify the price? It is for me, but only you can decide if it is for you. 👍
True, those are subjective areas. And as long as you have enough money left over to buy wood, then by all means. However, it's also a subjective area how much that price difference is really worth, and what other subjective luxuries you might be able to afford for that same price difference, or what else you might be able to do with that money. I can agree with you on the subjective areas about the Festool, yet still have my own subjective judgment about what can be done with the price difference - I know that how it feels, handles, fit and finish quality, etc are better, but I also know that with the extra $1000, I can buy other "subjectively valuable" things that might have even bigger subjective value - I can put that money towards a CNC router or a CNC lathe, or something else I've always wanted. I have so many hobbies that there is ALWAYS something I want. There's always something else I would rather have than a slight improvement on an existing tool at an astronomical price, even if I agree that it has subjective value. Heck, I'd rather buy the cheaper tool and spend the extra money on quality wood. Spend the money on wood, there's an idea! The reason we chose this hobby is because we want to make cool stuff, not because we want to own cool tools, so to buy expensive tools at the expense of wood makes no sense. I never want to be the guy who buys a 20 thousand dollar CD player and then has no money left over for CD's.
Sir, the Titan track saw was one of our developments/2010(btw its developed in the UK), for sure it’s not a Festool. I loved the review, it’s unbiased and will be used when we developed a new gen. Our aim was to create an affordable track saw which is affordable for the diyer and pro-sumer. We will follow your channel!
Ostrze odgrywa dużą rolę, ale szyna jest ważna, ponieważ gumowy pasek musi pozostać w kontakcie z ciętym drewnem. (zła gramatyka dzięki tłumaczeniu google) 🤷♂️
Peter Millard that's what they told me. Even on U.K. eBay they won't ship. It looks like a great tool to add to my shop since I'm working on the cheap. The closest track saw here is over $400. Also I can plug it into a step up converter to use.
Peter Millard, thank you. I already have the titan, just purchased the tsc55, I was watching the track saw workshop and thought if the festool fits the titan track with the anti tipping profile or not, I did notice that it wasn’t in the video! Thanks for the reply. I’ll have to test it out and let you know.
Thanks Gareth. I have a video planned about guiderail compatibility - what I’ve found is that although many saws will fire each others rails, they don’t always work well. 👍👍
Hi and welcome! Tracksaw workshop will be out soon - it was started & stopped a couple of times due to work pressures. Plenty of back catalogue to work through in the meantime... 👍👍
As normal Peter,great vıdeo.Dıd I hear you rıght ın the fırst vıdeo that the Tıtan was 90 quıd.Then ın the 2nd vıdeo saıd the full package was 1900 quıd.If ım rıght what on earth ıs the full package of the tıtan.
Sorry, no, my poor diction - I'm saying "90 to 100." Titan is £99 currently, was on special at £90 not so long back - link to the current price in the description, and at www.10minuteworkshop.com as always. Thanks 👍
![Cheap vs cheapest [video #285]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/nZGt_LqR5O8/mqdefault.jpg)
As an amateur DIY enthusiast, your videos are priceless.
Thank you for all of the considerable effort you put into creating them.
I don't think people realise how much work goes into producing a ten minute video - it's hours!
Looking forward to the next one.
Thank you! Yes, roughly an hour of 'production' for each minute of video; I'm getting faster at it, not necessarily better... 😂
Enjoyed the video. I had a similar experience in that I bought the Smith track saw which is functionally identical to your Titan except my Smith has the 1400 watt motor and variable speed. I’ve Used it for about two years and just last month bought the TS55. My feelings pretty much mirror yours. I was impressed at how good the Smith was but in the final analysis the quality of the Festool is undeniable. Although my bank account is a little bruised.
You told us last time that you had a 24 tooth blade on the Titan and a 48 tooth on the Festool. IMO, that would account for the difference in the quality of cut. Apples and pears.
Michael Read Well, I also said that I swap out the Festool 48 tooth blade for a 28 tooth in my other saws, and there's little to choose between them. But this was all about testing the saws as they come, out of the box. Who knows, maybe there's another video in the pipeline about how to improve the cheap saw... 🤔👍😄
Thanks. Yes, that might be interesting, but this was about testing the saws as they come, out of the box. The Festool can be bought with a guiderail and most dealers offer this package - I didn't buy it like that as I have plenty of rails already. Each saw was tuned to their own rail, and the splinterguard freshly cut, so I'm pretty sure using the same rail for both saws wouldn't have changed the cut quality. Be sure to watch out for the TrackSaw Workshop series, where I'll be covering thsi ground in more detail 👍
korean zombie 👍
I agree with Mr. Read. All that was compared was saw blades. Next time use the same blade on both saws to see a comparison of the saws for quality of cut.
I think it was more of an out the box test, I dont automatically buy a different blade everytime I buy a brand new saw.
I bought a scheppach ts55 knock-off once. I thought it was junk. It had lots of problems. Then I bit the bullet and bought the festool ts55, and that machine still doesn't seize to amaze me. After the gateway drug named ts55, i've been buying festool ever since, and loving it big time.
Nico Smets 👍
to pricey i do not like the miter saw $$$ just German name big cashola
I’ve been using this Titan for quite a few years now and it does the job well.. I bought the best possible blade to it and it cuts nicely.
I use it regularly on small finishing joinery projects or kitchen projects etc. I don’t love it either though as its bulky, heavy and rough..
but I made a carrier box dedicated for this tool and all accesories I use with it and it’s quite alright. But ofc I can’t wait to get a nicer stuff like a festool or something that’s in between in price category. This Titan is defo worth for diy guys or for someone who does multitrade, handyman stuff
Old vid. now but as I say in this and the follow-on, I'd have killed to have had something like this at this kind of price when I was starting out; fast-forward to today and it's still my favourite of all the entry-level saws, and I've added in a fair few since this vid was made! 👍
Thank you Peter for a fantastic comparison. Your demonstration, really explained, to me the deference, between lower end and high end tools. While they both look like they will do the same job, the real question in buying a tool is will they? You demonstrated well that there are other factors one must also take into consideration when purchasing a power hand tool - the handling weight, ease of being able to set up, quality of the cut on the finished the material, even the dust collection ability. While these may seem like little things, they can also add up to more work or bigger problems down the line. To love ones tools is everything. Do our power hand tools, inspire us to go fourth and create?
Thanks you! Mine inspire me to get out and earn... 😂👍👍
I’m loving your uploads and am very much looking forward to the track saw workshop uploads.
I’m relatively new to woodworking and don’t have the space for, or inclination to buy a table saw.
It seems to me that there are probably lots of projects that I could undertake with a reasonable track saw! (and your guidance of course)!!
Thanks, David.
Thanks David! Yes, indeed, I worked wood for a living for about ~14 years before I bought a small table saw (it was on sale) and it doesn’t get much use tbh. A lot depends on what type of woodworking you’re interested in, but for the vast majority of ‘around the house’ type of work, a tracksaw makes a lot of sense, especially if you’re short on space. 👍👍
Yes, the Festool track saws are definitely tools one loves to use!
A 'Track Saw Workshop' sounds like a great idea -- hope you go for it!
Corwin D Thanks! 👍
Peter, another good video. I 've had the TS 55 REQ for approx. 3 years here in Canada (Not Cheap) and you're right, it allows you to do things that would take a lot longer to set up and get it done. The bottom line is when you are building furniture is to get it done properly, and why not have the best tools out there to do it .
Thanks, and yes, sound advice 👍
Just bought a titan yesterday in B&Q, on sale at £80.00. Used it today and really pleased with it.
Great saw for the money 👍👍
First time watching 10 minute workshop. Very happy I found it. Nice to have an honest appraisal in simple non technospeak. Now a subscriber and looking for more clips. Thank you
Thanks Simon, and welcome! Be sure to check out the back catalogue 👍👍
Hi Peter, I am looking right now. I am very interested to see if there are more tool comparisons as I find them a very useful guide when making purchase choices. I do not like to spend hard earned money and then feel cheated by creative advertising.
In the Festool/Cheap tool series I did orbital sanders a while back, and I’ve done (quite) a few bandsaw comparisons, if they’re if interest. 👍
I did a little research and chose the WEN 1065 which is identical to the Titan reviewed. I found the WEN to have a binding bevel guide system which the Titan also has. My fix was to lubricate this guide way with plastic compatible grease as half is metal with other half plastic. Any play in this guide system can lock the blade with a skew in relation to the track system. When my tracks arrive I will test this & also make perfectly sure the saw blade is in line with the guide track. You should not have to do this but that is why it is a cheap saw. Over all, I think it is a good tool.
Thank you for this video. I already own the Titan, and have been using it for about a year... arguably the Festool is the better machine, but for £90 (it was £120 when I bought it) there not much room for complaint. I put a 42 tooth Freud blade in mine and am very happy with the results. Yes, that anti kickback thing is bloody annoying, but it has saved my fingers more than once, so I live with it. Looking forward to track saw school!
Excellent, and thanks! How's the Titan holding up after a year of use?👍
I really enjoyed this video. Great information! I'm always interested to know the real differences between the cheap and the higher end tools.
Thanks! 👍
I just priced a Wen vs Festool on amazon / $115 vs $600! As a hobbyist I have to learn to love what I can afford. *(BTW I can't afford the Wen right now!) I am saving for the Wen 14" Band saw. Which is only about 75 bucks more expensive that Fes's unadorned saw.
track saw lessons is a great idea. I look forward to it.
Thanks. 👍
Haha.. I looked into these saws a few years back..The Titan sold at screwfix is probably the cheapest apart from the Parkside sold for 50 quid at Lidl. Titan, Grizzly, Parkside, Shceppach, and some others are all generic saws made in China.. Then you have the next level of saws which is Triton, Makita both have soft start and many other features.. I currently own the Festool and Dewalt 18v Cordless tracksaw converted to run on my Hitachi 18v 6ah battery. Perfect for trimming the botton of doors down outside without worry about dust collection, However when I'm building wardrobes in situ, I always used the Festool with dust collection.. Great video mate,, lets have some more please..
+cassiya100 Nice, & thanks 👍
For the amount of times I would use this type of tool, which is rare, I would be happy to buy the cheapie. I have never felt it was right for me to buy a festool.
Actually the best festool I have ever used was a mates one. Hahaha
Great video. Thanks for posting
Thanks George. The Titan’s is fantastic for the money 👍👍
Really enjoying your videos Peter. It seems most of your work is mdf, but the little green thing in the package is an anti-splinter guard for the off cut. It also helps with dust collection. I may have missed it, but it's unique to festool
Jeffrey Cohen Thanks! A little poetic license on my part - Festool user for 11 years - but the little green thing that comes with the TS55R is quite different from the splinter-guard of old. As you say I work mostly in MDF and Plywood, so not of much interest, honestly, but worth acknowledging that it comes with the package. 👍
Peter Millard nice not having to cover the hole in cover with masking tape tho ;) I too have upgraded, you'll love the R
Jeffrey Cohen HaHa - very true! I'm sure I'll grow to love it - right now it's a similar size, shape & name; just 'different'. And one of my first improvements to the Titan will be masking tape, lol! Thanks! Peter 👍
Peter - great video. However at the end of Part 2 you made it even greater. I want to set up a tracksaw workshop in my new shed - it is great timing that you are going to make this series.👍😀
Thanks! Stay tuned, and all that... 👍
As previous comments say the blade is key here, I've owned the titan for about 6 months now cut about a dozen worktops, countless decor ends in kitchens with great results but only with the upgraded blade as the festool had. Don't get me wrong I use the standered blade for ripping sheets of timber plus wet wall with good results. I am more than happy with the titan.
+Emile Kempski Thanks - appreciate the extra info 👍
Very interesting couple of videos. I have a Festool 12 volt electric driver that I've had for about 16 years now. Its my go to driver in preference to my 18V Dewalt. Don't know why it just feels right and I guess that's the point you make. Some tools feel right others seem to fight you. Look forward to the track saw trilogy (feel a Xmas special coming on) :-) However just one observation; the Festool MFT is a significant advantage over anything else. I have look alike but without the hinged track. What I'm trying to say is the saw plus MFT makes it a pretty unbeatable combination. Thanks so much, Mike
Mike S Thanks! Totally agree about the MFT/hinged rail - keep an eye out for an upcoming video, I have a few ideas about that 👍
Excellent video and now a new subscriber.
Just purchased a Lidil Track saw for my new kitchen fit and it has been a God send. Im sure its not festool league,but for £70 its ace,and ive changed the blade to a 48 T so I can get a good finish on the the plinths.
Thanks, and welcome! Track saws are fantastic - I chose the Titan for this comparison only because it’s always available, whereas the Lidl Parkside is more of a ‘special buy’. 👍👍
@@10MinuteWorkshop The Parkside is extremely similar to the Titan, wouldn't be surprised if they're made in the same factory. There's only minor differences (no kickback feature etc.)
Thanks. Lidl Parkside are often re-badged Einhell, Aldi Workzone tend to be Scheppach. I have the Parkside, but haven had the chance to look at it yet. 👍👍
Hi, Peter thanks for the vid with dust collection. I put some duck tape over the front hole and that helped a lot.
Yep - not a great deal you can do, but if it helps... TBH I used to do that with my old Festool TS55 as well 😱
Once again, excellant video, you should have done Blue Peter mate lol, I like the idea of a track saw, but just don't do enough wood working at my age to buy the Festoon, I have some of the titan stuff and found it to be very good , keep posting mate, from Garry, Barnsley UK
Cheers Garry. Yeah, posted a few vids since this one, lol! 👍👍
First video of yours I've seen Peter, and a job well done I must say! I'll be following along from here forward. Cheers!
Thanks Kyle, and welcome! Be sure to check out the back catalogue 👍
Thanks for the comparison. I've been thinking about getting a track saw for my work. I currently use my 36 volt Makita and an edge guide. I already have a bunch of cordless Makita tools and batteries. I'm waiting for the cordless version from Makita. Looking forward to the track saw videos. Subscribed!
+Paul Buckel Jr Thanks, and welcome!
Thank you for this comparison. Exactly what I needed to decide whether I bought the Titan saw or something more expensive. I'm off out now to buy the Titan because I will use it only occasionally and I can put up with its obvious shortcomings for the sake of about £300 difference in price. I do think I'll be removing the anti kickback device though. That looks too annoying.
+MrChunkyfunkymunky 👍 Glad to hear it was a useful!
Great video, thank you. I brought the titan as for some reason I left my circular saw at home on a day I was working with wood. It's ok but cheap. It cuts nice but my tracks are awful. May just bin them and go for a better make.
+Andy Hoadley 👍
Thanks for the comparison. I noticed you left the splinter guard off on the Festool. It would have performed even better than it did. Splinter guard helps with chip out and dust collection.
+Lowell Smith Thanks! I did cuts with and without the splinter guard and it didn't make any difference to the cut - yep, surprised me too - so I went for the one without as it seemed a straighter comparison.
It's rationality (end result, price/quality) against emotion (look and feel for many years). And the winner is......! But, I must say, I have deep respectfor the marketing machine of Festool. Top!
@Jon M I rest my case.!
I know this is an old video but I wanted to mention that I had the Titan track saw a while back (replaced it now) and the first thing I did was remove the anti-kickback thing. There's a small screw underneath and it comes right off. It worked really well as my first track saw and it's nice that it works with Makita tracks which I ended up getting too. The long term downside to this is that the track adjustment dials to remove play are plastic and over time they wear down so you end up with nothing left. I fixed this by adding a dab of epoxy glue on the ends of them which gave me adjustment again. Totally worth the money but I wouldn't go back now from my Makita SP6000. Festool are just too eye-watering a cost. ;)
Thanks. Fairly obviously I can’t be seen to suggest or endorse the removal of safety features in a public video, of course. 👍👍
@@10MinuteWorkshop Oh I totally agree Peter and understand!
Have to say, the Titan does appeal... If you've got a good table saw, and only use a P/S on occasion, it makes a lot of sense. If there is a niggle for me, it's the likely lack of spares back up - alright, to some extent they might be supposed to be viewed as 'disposable', but 1. that isn't very Green, and 2. it simply goes against the grain ... Wonder if anyone's yet used a 1st purchase as a means of sustaining a 2nd ...?
Excellent video for a DIYer like myself. I am in the market to purchase a tracksaw for a project and as it will not get that much use after the project is completed I will buy the Titan. I will be however looking forward to watching your tracksaw workshop videos and I have subscribed.
Thanks John, and welcome! The Titan’s a great saw for the money. Tracksaw Workshop is coming, just need to get ‘out from under’ with the current job first 👍
Great video, thanks. I wonfer if you have consideted snappinhh off the anti kick back?
What has been your experience of joining the two shortet Titon tracks together... i can't get a smoth run which is a big headache... i'm thinking of getting a longer makita version, so thanks for confirming that they are compatable.
Put a strip of tape over the great big hole in the Titan's cover and I think you will find the dust collection much improved. (no idea why they made it like that) And pretty much goes without saying, upgrade to a nicer blade. Also you could just remove the kickback mechanism. Would love to see a part 3 with these upgrades.
The idea was to use them stock, as they came out of the box, and compare what they can do. As mentioned in this video though, and the follow-on #074, the stock blade in the Titan is surprisingly good for a 24t blade on a £100 saw. If you want more info on this then try the Tracksaw Workshop series (videos 277-283) where I go,into all the tricks, and video 284 for More About Blades. Video #285 puts the Titan against another cheap saw from the TW series, vid. # 286 covers the role that the splinterguard plays in the process of getting the best from the blade you have. The Titan was discontinued this year, so no more videos on that one, sadly. 👍👍
I like them both Peter ,so which one you giving away ,i just use to ole tried and true strait edge board set up ,and got my first kick back just a while back ,didnt wreck the piece .but my strait edge board looks like hell ...lol
I'm just debating whether or not to buy a table saw or could I manage with a track saw! Great video again I think I'll wait until I see the track saw workshop videos, thanks!
11hoursoff Thanks! I'd say it depends on what you plan on making; I worked wood for a living for ~14 years before I bought a tablesaw; don't use it much. But the track saw I use every day 👍
What a great and helpful video, thank you!! I have handled the Festool (but not actually used it) and I have to say that as a tool guy, it feels cheap and I don't like all the plastic. Horrible thing to say I know, but there it is. Perhaps I need to actually try cutting with one. Now the Domino, on the other hand, looks and feels incredible and subjectively seems worth anything they want to charge for it - like an old sewing machine, a microtome, or a Lie-Nielsen handplane. It makes me happy just knowing that such things are still made in this modern world...
Thanks! Did you run the motor on the Festool? Sounds like a sack of spanners, too! Great saws though - I don’t buy them for looks, feel or sound, though I do appreciate all three in context. And yes, Domino is in another league of build quality. 👍👍
@@10MinuteWorkshop No I did not run the motor but I went back to the store today and they are going to have a demonstration later in July so maybe I can try it then. I must say that I was very impressed by the features on the HK55 circular saw. If it was full-size (7 1/4 inch) I would probably buy it. The guard retraction lever and positive stops were very impressive.
Please, please, do your series on a tracksaw workshop. I'd nearly given up on the idea of having a workshop capable of repeatable, accurate rips, due to the lack of space and money for a table saw. Perhaps I could lose the mitre chop saw as well (for space) and just have a tracksaw and pillar drill! Bring it on!
It is coming, I promise!
I love my Festool TS55 track saw, except for one problem. It will not cut along the grain very well, trying to cut Australian hard woods. The blade flexes badly. I guess the saw was made for wood that is not as hard as most of our Aust. hard woods. No matter what blade I use, always get the same problem. Took it to the Festool authorised repairer and they tried to cut the wood along the grain, but the problem persisted. Sadly I have to use a table saw to get a 90 degree perfect cut. I have tried several blades, with exactly the same result every time.
I think another video on improving the Titan saw to bring it closer to festool performance would be a good idea and popular too. Festool are obviously good quality tools but at a staggering price.
Lee Turner Yes, I have one planned 👍
I did look for your tracksaw workshop but I see that in that series you are not using the Titan. Did it get sent back?? The WEN brand here in Canada is identical and the dreaded black numbers on a black plastic make it less than desirable to me. Of course we do not have Aldi here in Canada so I may have to find some sort of compromise between a Festool and the ultra cheap less beloved versions of track saws on the market.
No, I still have the Titan, and all the others. The idea of the Tracksaw workshop series was to take a saw from ‘out of the box’ to fully set up, and the Aldi was a good choice. I don’t recommend it over the eg Titan though - as I conclude in the series. 👍
festool really does have unbeatable dust collection.
+ms3bani Amongst the best, certainly 👍
Good review, it's human nature to never want to admit that you personally have made a bad choice when it comes to spending a lot of money, that's why anybody who owns a festool product has already convinced themselves that the product is worth the huge cost by the time they buy it, so you tube is full of festool owners saying they are well worth the money and plenty of other people thinking you must be mad to spend that much money on a particular tool, this is the same for cars, TVs, computers, watches etc. I think both have a role you always need companies like festool who will innovate new ideas and you need people who think they can justify spending that level of money, in tern the innovations eventually filter down to the more reasonably priced brands and give access to everyone.
+Ross Addison Thanks. Trying to keep them balanced 👍
Very good common sense based review. And very happy to follow the track saw lessons (recently I had a nasty kickback while cutting a 2 by 4 and I'd like to know how to make sure to avoid it... :-(. Thank you Peter.
Eric.
Thanks! Yep, tracksaws aren't great for cutting e.g. 2x4s unless you can gang them together to support the track on either side 👍
Get a speed square for cutting lumber. I like the Swanson Big 12
Dear Peter, based on your recommendation I got myself the Titan. I need to get some guide rail clamps and wonder if the ones for Makita would be compatible. Any idea on that? By the way, I'm hating the anti kick-back thing. I am seriously considering removing it... somehow. Did you do that yourself?
Hi Gianmario. I don’t have the Makita clamps, but I’m sure they’d be fine. I’ll double-check the Festool ones on the Titan rail when I’m back in the workshop 👍 And yes, I ditched the anti-kickback thing as soon as I could!
@@10MinuteWorkshop oh, thanks a lot! In the meantime, I created a Wikipedia article for track saws - funny that there wasn't one before today: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Track_saw
Here you can see my own track saw in its full glory.
Surprisingly I have found the tracks are all the same basic profile, except for the little lip on the Makita but that isn't where you clamp it. So clamps that will work in 1 brand will work with all the others. At least Makita, Festool and Titan. (didn't look at other brands though)
The most interesting thing is missing IMHO: Cutting of thick hardwood. I guess this would have made a huge difference!
Why?
Hi Peter,
thanks, good video again!
What are your thoughts regarding the REBQ (your model, I assume) versus the slightly more economical RQ (mine)?
My dealer recommended the non-electronic for someone with a focus on wood, versus the electronic for someone working with plastics and metals. Of course, soon after buying the RQ I ended up needing to cut a huge sheet of perspex...
Ben
Benjamin Stephens Thanks! Always the way, isn't it? I think the main difference is in the electronic brake for the blade, which is well worth having IMHO if you're using it a lot. There's a quick 'talking head' follow-up video coming up today that addresses a couple of things (inc blade brakes) that were edited out of these two vids. Enjoy your TS 55👍
Great review Peter. It would be interesting to see if the Titan performed better with the Festool blade on it for both cut and dust.
Yes indeed; already in hand in due course 😀. This was really to establish 'out of the box' capabilities, as the saws come.👍
Nice video! I like your style of presentation, quite different from some other YT-video's ('though I love the cursing Canadian also). I have the Festool (old model) and gave away my table saw (Metabo) after one day of working with the Festool. It's just so easy to work with and gives perfect cuts. However, I think I'll replace the Festool with the Makita cordless track saw in the nearby future. Being able to cut without the restrictions of a power cord is very tempting (to me).
Thanks! This was almost 300 videos ago - check out the more recent ones and let me know if you think I’ve improved! 👍👍
Good reviews, the only thing that sort of stuck in my mind throughout the video was that while you mentioned a few times that the Titan was about £90 you never once mentioned that the Festool cost over 5 times as much at around £540 for the kit with two tracks. My question is, is the festool 5 times better? Does it cut five times better. In the past I've found that cheaper brand tools last as long as their much more expensive name brand counterparts. I am currently in the market to buy a track saw and I am finding it hard to choose one.
The titan tracks are only 1400 combined, so it's more like a TS55 & 1 rail which is about £380. But sure, as I hope the video explained (and there's a part 3 btw) no, it doesn't cut 4x better, but is is nicer to use, lighter, quieter, with much better dust collection, it is a better tool - as you'd expect for the price. Whether it's 'better enough' to justify the cost is up to you; it was to me, but I use these saws every day to make my living, and the Festool system with the plug-it chords etc... is worth it to me. Only you can decide if it's worth it to you.
Peter I hadn't seen the third video, just watched it now, I think the Titan is good for the price but its not the one for me. I'm stuck between the TS55 and the Makita SP6000J1. I will be using the saw a lot so reliability is a factor and when you say you got 11 years use out of your old Festool I am impressed as if you even consider the initial price it only works out at £1 a week over the 11 years excluding blades but you've to replace those no matter what saw you buy.
Stephen, I don’t know anyone who’s bought the Festool and regretted it. You might also want to watch the most recent episode of this saga, here - ua-cam.com/video/v8U1VUbkbuk/v-deo.html 👍
I would've kept that discovery to myself :-) Are you now selling that old TS55 by any chance ;-).
I do the stupid things in the hope that others don’t have to, lol 😂 Haven’t decides what to do with the resurrected saw, too busy with work to think about it really, but I’m pretty sure I don’t need all four.... 🤔
That anti kickback would be coming off immediately
I'm looking at upgrading from my Titan. Looking at Makita or DeWalt. If you have used any of these, would you say the "difference" between a Titan and a Makita/DeWalt is greater than the "difference" between Makita/DeWalt and Festool.
Thank you.
Short answer, yes - you’ll see more of a difference between the step up from Titan to Makita or DeWalt than you will from either of those to a Festool. Try and get hands on with the if you can; the DeWalt has a ‘different’ plunge action that I didn’t like, personally, and they’ve gone their own way with the guide rails, which seems an unnecessary complication. 👍👍
You should compare a cut with same blade.
Well, that'd be tough to do as they take slightly different sized blades, and not really sure what you'd expect that to show?? As I've said elsewhere, this was about trying out the saws as they come, out of the box.👍
The most important parameter of the saw is quality of the cut. So cut was different and not to the favor of titan. But there are different number of tooth. That might affect the quality. So the poor quality might be due to poor quality blade but not poor quality of the tool.
I would buy the same amount of tooth blades of the same manufacturer to test the cut. This is only fair go.
Gotcha. I'm quoting the reply I gave to Michael Read below:-..."I swap out the Festool 48 tooth blade for a 28 tooth in my other saws, and there's little to choose between them. But this was all about testing the saws as they come, out of the box. Who knows, maybe there's another video in the pipeline about how to improve the cheap saw..."
You might want to watch the Part 3 follow-up video as I do discuss this in a bit more detail, but short answer is the 24-tooth blade in the Titan did really well until it came up against a difficult surface like MFC - and even then the chipping was very slight. As I conclude, if quality of cut and price are your criteria, the Titan's a great saw 👍
You sound like you want him to do whatever he can to make the titan better in the comparison. If you add an after market blade its not a comparison of the tools. The comparison is what you get for 90 compared to a festool. Adding a blade would double the price. Which would not be the point of the comparison
I bought the Titan (first track saw for me) and it's now back in the box. I found the guide rail moved around when I used the saw. The rubber strip on the base was not gripping the melamine board underneath. Did you have this issue at all? Any suggestions to stop the guide wandering? Still using a circular saw and clamped straight edge because I was so disappointed by the initial test with the Titan.
No, no issues at all with the rails, though the festool rails are particularly grippy. On melamine I would consider clamping the rails though - the Makita clamps work well and are a bit cheaper than the Festool ones. Or upgrade the rails for eg the evolution rails - great value.
Spectacular difference.
+Graham Orm 👍
Nice review, I'd like to say most of my tools are from screwfix , except two my woodturning lathe and bandsaw, almost everything else is.
martkt10 Thanks! 👍
That would be good now so it would a track saw workshop I think a track saw and and a mft a id be sorted . Did it start yet ?
No, but Tracksaw Workshop is the next series I’m doing. Was delayed due to work - that stuff sure gets in the way... 🤔
Another great video Peter! Regarding the quality of cut, as an 'out of the box' review I appreciate the comparison. Looking at the the specifications the Festool TS55 has a 48 tooth blade, where the Titan is 24 Teeth.
My question is, do you think fitting the Titan with a Saxton 48 tooth blade for £12 off Amazon, would give a comparable cut to the Festool TS55?
Hey, maybe you could do a video investigating budget blades!
Almost certainly would be an improvement, though as I say in the video, I do fit a 28 tooth blade to my Festools as standard without any loss of quality of cut in normal work. There is another video planned of improvements that can be made to the Titan 👍
I have the TS55 and could never dream of buying Festool's overpriced blades. I use either CMT or Saxton blades. The Saxton blades are excellent value.
Nice one Peter - enjoyed these and think you summed it up well! Looking forward to the follow on :)
Thomas Kitchin Thanks Tom 👍
I bought a TS55 from ebay - works perfectly, and less than standard retail price. Then had to swallow the price of a track. Wondering if the Festool TS55 will work with any of the other (cheaper!) tracks?
I have a couple of the Makita tracks, they work well, though the anti-tipping lip on the Makita track can get in the way if you want to use some of the accessories e.g. parallel guides. But I bought mine when there was a huge difference in price between Festool and everything else; Festool is much more price-comparable now though, especially for the common lengths of track; maybe try ebay for a length of used track? 👍
Thanks for sharing. Useful to know that Makita or festool tracks work for the Titan. I think the anti-kick back can be removed.
Yep, long gone 👍👍
I was curious as to what failed on your well used original TS55? AvE did a teardown of the saw and pointed out a couple of places that he thought might be weak links in the design so I was curious if what failed on yours was one of the items he suspected.
+Malebolgia I may chuck it back to Festool and see, but tbh after 11 years hard use it didn't owe me anything. 👍
If you haven't seen his teardown you should check it out. He does a thorough investigation and asks any viewers that have had the tool long enough for it to fail to comment on if the failure points he guessed are accurate. Not so much that the tool broke prematurely just more a curiosity if his intuition is on point.
Peter Millard it's probably just the brushes. You can do them yourself just screw off the access panel to motor and u will see them they inside spring loaded cages u just dig them out and replace if they look worn down. I would definitely send it to festool and get it serviced the parts that wear are easily replaced. they did my cxs and it came back good as new 3yrs ago it was under warranty too so no charge. Dunno how much they charge out of warranty but I would say a lot less than a new ts. Great videos by the way ure the new parfitt☺️
jrichardsonsix Thanks. Not a total noob here - I did check all the obvious things! No, brushes were in good shape, and everything else looked Ok. Electronics are all sealed in epoxy (?) so not individually accessible. And this is well
out of warranty, so there'll be a £cost for sure...
Thanks for the test. I like your work pants. are the upper pouches standard? I just check Amazon, the cheapest US track saw is a shop Fox at $188. Even that is totally out of my budget.
I Sketchup, You can to Thanks! Yes, standard 'nail' pockets on the work pants - they're removable too. There's a link to them in the 'stuff I use' section at www.10minuteworkshop.com but only available in the UK as far as I can tell.
Nice comparison sir. Are you sure you had the dust collection turned on for the Titan. Joking of course. Thanks for sharing this.
Thanks! And oh yes! 😂👍
I'd snap one of the Titan's up in a minute if they were available here in the US...
Hi Peter, thanks for your videos I am joiner two years in and I rely so much on you tubers such as your self to get through!
I have a question related to your router set up, do you have dust extraction underneath the table, . I'm in the process of making a longer work bench come router table and need to improve the dust collection underneath.
I love my Makita tracksaw it's a work horse for me and had little go wrong. do you sign up to the festool repair service and is it any good?
Thanks again for the video's cheers scott
+Scott Baldock Thanks! No, no dust extraction underneath the router - the two hoses /split hose seems to do a good job 👍
Hi Peter thanks for the video - when doing the guide rail trim (4:40) on the Titan would it be best to join the two guiderails together or is it ok to do separately? Many thanks
It’s OK to do them separately, but if you have the space then join them together - it’s the start of the cut that’s the tricky part, and if you join the rails together you only have to start once! 👍
Many thanks Peter :} Happy New Year!
I just found this channel and I really like the content! Looking forward to future videos.
+Not my name on youtube Thanks, and welcome!
Very good videos m8, personally I own festool for 2 years now and I love it even if I used only on few projects, when I was being there ware only comparison to makita or bosch. Plenty of weekend woodworkers (like me) out there :).
P.s if my ts55 would break I would buy new tomorrow
+HITOKIRIpl Thanks! 👍
It would be good to see how accurate angle is, before festool I had some cheap circular saw and cutting something to put it together was a nightmare, saying that festool could have more accurate scale pointer and 22.5 dead stop like makita have
Wonderful comparison. Thanks.
+Dan A Thanks! 👍
U gotta fight the titan. Rail clamp can making all so much simpler to manage.
as always enjoyed your video but just one thing that l was thinking during the comparison between the festool track saw and the titon track saw was that you were using the festool dust extraction on both test's if you only had the titon track saw and no festool dust extraction you would have more of dust problem and the dust would have been a lot worse on the titon just a though
Harry Randles Thanks! Sure. But in the interests of consistency and real-world accuracy, it was only right to use the same extractor for each saw, don't you think?
Good stuff....and honest I think.
I wonder.if you had tried a Mafell track saw you would sing the praises of the Festool as much....Basically.if the Mafell saw was in this test/review/opinion...it would make the Festool second best....but..........it is also more expensive than the Festool saw...horses for courses I guess.....buy what you can afford....and see how you go...
One other thing you did point out the blade difference between the two saws ...and that will have a direct effect on the quality of cut....
Triton..seems cheap and cheeful probably best for the weekend warrior...but...it does the job providing straight cuts...I suppose.
Just one more thing...the test was an "out of the box" test...so to speak.....so no rails with the Festool..........so how good is the dust extraction and chipping of the material without the guide rails.....that were not in the box.....slightly unfair out of the box test....throwing in a festool rail system . Out of the box the Titan wins hands down for performing straight cuts...or straighter then the freehand cuts that you would be forced to do with the Festool,,,,guide rail free kit out of the box....ha..ha..
Thanks! Yes, I've used the Mafell, fine saw. Arguably they iterated on the tracksaw genre better than Festool, especially with the guiderails, which have clearly had some more thought put into them. I didn't buy this Festool with rails as I already have plenty, but you absolutely can get the saw & rail as a package. 👍
Will the Festool guide rails work together with the Titan saw?
+Nixy Gill Yes, absolutely, and the Makita tracks. 👍
Hi again Peter. If you know, can one run Festool/Makita/Titan saws on Bosch/Maffel tracks?
Hi Zaar. No, not as far as I’m aware. You can do it the other way around - run Bosch & Mafell saws on Festool tracks, but they’re not compatible both ways, I’m afraid. 🤷♂️
@@10MinuteWorkshop Looks like you are right: ua-cam.com/video/cfxF-EtfOfA/v-deo.html
Tracksaw workshop, ok, you have my attention.
+Mr2at 👍
Hi, did you ever make a tracksaw workshop video?
Started and paused it many times. It’s coming, I promise 👍👍
Peter Millard I'm keen for this series too - got the opportunity to turn an outbuilding into a workshop next year and thinking I'll base it around a track saw rather than a table saw
I wanted a high power deep cross cut capable machine. As everyone does I looked at the cheap offerings thinking well I could get the good one later, this'll do for now. But then the brain kicked in, why buy the it'll do model at all, skip the expense and buy the one you really want. Love the one you're with, not for me! My first Festool purchase the HK 85 won hands down! 2300W of real POWER!!! as a certain controversial ""car Journalist"" might put it!
+Aeneas Izichi Nice 👍
Got a big job on boarding out my loft and fitting a folding wooden loft ladder! I also just bought the FSK 670 Cross cut guide rail! Can't wait to start cutting. The Grooving Block will be next some time in the future.
That grooving block looks pretty amazing!
Great videos..many thanks👍🏼
My pleasure, thanks for watching! 👍
That track saw looks exactly like the WEN track saw.
For a moment I thought you were going to name your new show, "Cheap and Cheerful".
Paul Frederick That's an excellent idea! Wish I'd thought of it 😂
Just stumbled across you and can tell all ready you are great thanks for your time and effort
So you mean to tell me NOBODY noticed the Titan track MOVING while he was making the cut @ 5:24???
Yep, Festool tracks are the most 'grippy' of any I've used.
2db is a huge difference in sound level....
Do R/C! Don't disagree, but a/ not when you're wearing ear defenders (and you should be, of course) and b/. wasn't exactly a scientific test, and c/ 85Db to 87Db - they're both fcuking loud! Thanks!
Peter Millard yeah that's true at circular saw volumes it doesn't make that much difference.
Do R/C! 👍
great video!
Casual DIY Thanks!
Okay, so the festool is better, but is it really two or three times better? The law of diminishing returns applies here
In measurable metrics - quality of cut, dust collection, noise - then no, not 3 times better overall. Maybe twice as good, depending on your priorities. But in more subjective areas - how it feels, how it handles, general fit and finish, quality of switchgear, the click-stop depth adjuster etc... then as I say in the video, the Festool is absolutely the better saw. Is it better enough to justify the price? It is for me, but only you can decide if it is for you. 👍
True, those are subjective areas. And as long as you have enough money left over to buy wood, then by all means. However, it's also a subjective area how much that price difference is really worth, and what other subjective luxuries you might be able to afford for that same price difference, or what else you might be able to do with that money. I can agree with you on the subjective areas about the Festool, yet still have my own subjective judgment about what can be done with the price difference - I know that how it feels, handles, fit and finish quality, etc are better, but I also know that with the extra $1000, I can buy other "subjectively valuable" things that might have even bigger subjective value - I can put that money towards a CNC router or a CNC lathe, or something else I've always wanted. I have so many hobbies that there is ALWAYS something I want. There's always something else I would rather have than a slight improvement on an existing tool at an astronomical price, even if I agree that it has subjective value. Heck, I'd rather buy the cheaper tool and spend the extra money on quality wood. Spend the money on wood, there's an idea! The reason we chose this hobby is because we want to make cool stuff, not because we want to own cool tools, so to buy expensive tools at the expense of wood makes no sense. I never want to be the guy who buys a 20 thousand dollar CD player and then has no money left over for CD's.
Vlad G - I felt subjectivity was subjective. Subjectivity, subjectively subjective but that's just me being subjective, subjectively.
Can't tell if you're making fun of me or Peter..lol
surely you can unscrew the kick back clip ?
Yep, long gone. 👍
“Trash sack”. Learn something new every day.
👍
Sir, the Titan track saw was one of our developments/2010(btw its developed in the UK), for sure it’s not a Festool. I loved the review, it’s unbiased and will be used when we developed a new gen. Our aim was to create an affordable track saw which is affordable for the diyer and pro-sumer. We will follow your channel!
+Rients Bakker Thanks! 👍
"Development" ... yes kinda. you also could say, that you brazenly copied the market leaders and had it produced in china.
could you remove the anti-kick back
Sure. Probably void the warranty, but it’s just screwed in place. 👍
czy jakość linie ciecia nie zależy bardziej od Od jakości ostrza ?
Ostrze odgrywa dużą rolę, ale szyna jest ważna, ponieważ gumowy pasek musi pozostać w kontakcie z ciętym drewnem. (zła gramatyka dzięki tłumaczeniu google) 🤷♂️
Great video
+Leo Mumford Thanks!
whay did your old saw fail and how old is it?
It’s 11 years old. Keep an eye on the channel - there’s a follow-up coming soon 👍
How can I get one of these titans in the states? Seems no one in the U.K. Can ship one to America. Can anyone help out?
+grant goldstein Screwfix will ship within the EU, but not elsewhere AFAIK. Also, 240v only...
Peter Millard that's what they told me. Even on U.K. eBay they won't ship. It looks like a great tool to add to my shop since I'm working on the cheap. The closest track saw here is over $400. Also I can plug it into a step up converter to use.
For some reason no one can ship a saw to the US. I'd buy yours that you tested out if your willing to ship.
Great teacher enjoy.
+papiwe1 👍
Hi Peter. Out of interest, does the ts55 run on the titan rails? Many thanks.
It would certainly fit, but wether it works well I’m not sure as I don’t think I ever tried it, tbh. FYI the Titan was discontinued last year, sadly.
Peter Millard, thank you. I already have the titan, just purchased the tsc55, I was watching the track saw workshop and thought if the festool fits the titan track with the anti tipping profile or not, I did notice that it wasn’t in the video! Thanks for the reply. I’ll have to test it out and let you know.
Thanks Gareth. I have a video planned about guiderail compatibility - what I’ve found is that although many saws will fire each others rails, they don’t always work well. 👍👍
Amazing reviews, just how i like them, in depth, interesting and not full of bullshit like alot of the other English spoken ones are, ahemmm cough.
Thanks! And Nast cough you have there - I’d get that looked at 😆👍
Forgive me if it's already up but is the track saw workshop series still happening? I'm a new subscriber
Hi and welcome! Tracksaw workshop will be out soon - it was started & stopped a couple of times due to work pressures. Plenty of back catalogue to work through in the meantime... 👍👍
@@10MinuteWorkshop Nice one. Love the videos so far, great to see real client jobs go from plans all the way to installation.
i do i get titan machine and ship to Nigeria?
+Alamu Akeem I don’t think so, but check with the retailer www.screwfix.com 👍
As normal Peter,great vıdeo.Dıd I hear you rıght ın the fırst vıdeo that the Tıtan was 90 quıd.Then ın the 2nd vıdeo saıd the full package was 1900 quıd.If ım rıght what on earth ıs the full package of the tıtan.
Sorry, no, my poor diction - I'm saying "90 to 100." Titan is £99 currently, was on special at £90 not so long back - link to the current price in the description, and at www.10minuteworkshop.com as always. Thanks 👍