this perspective on the dream makes a lot of sense to me. consider that amirdrassil just can be instantly transported into reality.... and where that tree came from. Elune directly gave Tyrande one of her tears, which became the seed for Amirdrassil. So is Elune working with the titans to order Azeroth? Or is she trying to plant her own roots on Azeroth, literally? Azeroth herself seemed to appreciate the act, because she directly blessed the new dragon aspects once Amirdrassil was safe and birthed into reality. Lots to think about. I hope we see more of Elune in the future.
I’m just now getting to this playlist. You’re discussing the twisting nether and it reminds me of how I’ve always thought how similar the visuals of Thralls use of the elements sometimes looks like the visuals of The Twisting Nether.
Hey Pyro, SO glad you're back. I love your takes on lore and your total enthusiasm and passion for it. You said in an earlier video that some people in the community aren't happy you're back and y'know what--screw'm. Looking forward to more good stuff!
I've said this on the discord before. The Dream is the restore point reality is supposed to go back to once Azeroth wakes up. The issue is the Titans have manipulated the entire rebirth process (reorigination) and are using it to create ordered worlds. I wouldn't be surprised to find out the lands of the shadowlands were chunks of azeroth ripped off of the planet and the Titans patched (haha) the planet after. There is a reason why when we, the people of azeroth die, we have to be physically removed from the planet by the Kyrian. It's because we aren't supposed to leave Azeroth, we are meant to be apart of her once again.
I'm disappointed how they handled Argus. I thought maybe they would make a whole expansion out of it, allowing us to see a whole different planet with multiple zones, but instead, they made a small patch zone out of it, mostly eaten up by the Legion, and desolate.
What do you think about the heartstone titan expasion? There you can see a new titan and the primus as part of the "panteon", maybe thats a clue of the primus/amanthul conspiration and titans using the light
12:45 so it sounds like Argus was another world the titans did there work on and turned it into an engine and might be doing the same to azeroth. The cinematic of the titans summoning Argus to the seat of the pantheon has aman’thul saying they stole something could he mean the engine?
Yes, yes, yes! There does seem to be some connection to destroyed planets and the Twisting Nether. I really like the way the explain things in the 1000 Year War.
I understand "Twisting Nether" as some kind of parellel reality or dimension to our convential space. I think if Argus is in Twisting Nether now despite it wasn't before, it's probably for the same reason Outland is. In both cases, destruction on an unimaginable scale and mystical forces and demon involment put those planets to Twisting Nether. Just like Nagrand in Outland looks mostly untouched by the destruction, the capital Draenai city also looks mostly untouched. Some places in this sphere of influence are preserved while others are not. My question would be: When Argus was transported to Azeroth by Illidan, was it still in Twisting Nether? Maybe. And I also wonder what was Sargeras doing before the other Titans yanked him with that tractor beam. When he was enveloping Azeroth in the mist form. What if he was trying to shift Azeroth to Twisting Nether? What if the proximity of Argus to Azeroth was what allowed him to do that?
I want to know what their plan was for emphasizing on Decay in the azure span. In the dungeon the final boss teleports away and isn’t seen or mentioned again.
The matrix theme is being very much discussed now on different games for some reason while at the same time this matrix theory is happening now on our own reality. Pretty crazy.
hrm....I did Emerald Nightmare again today and ran into the cave at the end of the Raid when you go into the Emerald Dream. They still have the "Remnant of the Void" in the cave and Ysondre or Ysera is there. Ideas?
and the "void lords" trying to break into our plain of existence is the void lords trying to break in to the titan matrix, the universe expanding PRISON that the titans has set up. WoW 2.0 Multiverse of maaaaaadness!
and the "first ones" are the real progenitors of the real "true" universe. and azeroth is one of them, one of the "first ones". From whom they draw the "power" to have their titan matrix prison going all this time. With the legion, the light, the void or whatever getting to the "world soul" or the imprisoned first one, their matrix/prison falls and the people inside it finally open their eyes to the truth.
and why would they do that? imprison a "slice" of the real universe/a multiverse? Because they are after azeroths powers, so that they can take control over the rest of reality. They imprisoned a slice of reality to experiment their way into TOTAL dominance of the entire cosmos. watch us be playing the "aman thul saga" in 2043.
I don't know why, but I can just vividly picture in my head a scenario where we're at the seat of the pantheon, all the titans are off somewhere doing who knows what except for Sargeras, who is in his seat surrounded by the same runic rings imprisoning Azeroth...just sitting there all bored and arrogant looking, giving us main story quests. Like formulating a plan with us to fight back against the titans. Or perhaps Illidan ends up speaking for him, idunno.
If those dead planets are failed versions of Azeroth (as in the planet/prison), would that make the old gods failed simulations/versions of Azeroth (the world soul)?
they dont value morta life the same way, the old gods consider it a gift of flesh, only the titans say its a curse, the old gods could easily just be a corruption of life itself, maybe the remnants of life left there by eonar didnt amalthul rip out some form of life and eonar knew there were roots left, and didnt tell him? seems like that life left behind got corrupted
Zovaal said at the end : That what you protect, a cosmos devided will not survive". Order is not the natural way of the cosmos... the twisted nether seems more like it indeed
I think the aesthetic of concentric rings of titan construction threaded throughout the art and lore are nods to the fact that we are in a giant Dyson Sphere made by the Titans. Azeroth is in a jail and so are we. As she could not move or act directly being in hibernation mortal races are her cosmic self insert to break free over the long game. Piercing through space to find the Seat of the Pantheon wasn’t merely space travel, it’s the first peak through the Sphere that has occurred in the modern lore.
if sargeras is a titan who ebraced fel to advance his burning agenda, then that means any titan can use any other force (outside arcane) to use in whatever agenda they pursue.
To me the dream is a place where every force can tap into. Old gods are not made from decaying life, but at void's attempt to change azeroth through the dream
I'm beginning to think that we are not the first version of sentience on Azeroth. What happens in fantasy when you can't straight up beat something.......you bind it/ imprison it. I think that we are getting closer and closer to what the Titans are trying to create using azeroths ability to create life as a perfect Ordered automaton/golem thing that can utilize spirit forces and be subservient to the titans. I think that the reorigination machines are there on the world because they've been ised before, maybe even a few times. The dream, the subjugation of the elements, the control of the Shadowlands to alter the rebirth cycle that is supposed to happen on Azeroth, all ways to keep her asleep. I think Sargeras found out about it all, that he had been tricked, killed the pantheon, but found that Azeroth had been hidden from him and Aggramar and set out to find her. I think his burning crusade was originally intended to destroy an imaginary "enemy" the void to keep him occupied. And now his goal for many years has just been to free Azeroth. Even the purpose of the stoopid sword was his last ditch effort to wake her up. I think all of our "Victories" in the past have been tricks designed to get us to believe that the titans are not the real bad guys. Now I believe they're goal is twofold to have Azeroth give them physical bodies again but also for them to be able to harness the spirit force and powers that they couldn't order before by themselves. Point is I think that Azeroth has been imprisoned for a long long time and she has been purged before.
Not sure if this was brought up earlier but could not a lot of the fear of Azeroth be because it would be a Titan not bound by the oath to protect life?
Except I don't think the Titans even CARE about Life. They care about ORDER. They tolerate mortals in Reality because we haven't reached the point where they need to reoriginate us yet (I mean, after Ulduar) I'm calling that The Titans try to Reoriginate in TLT and we'll get Uldaz.
I lke this theory, i also wonder if we are already way past the cycle needing to be reset? So the universe was meant to restart a long time ago and the titans were succesfull in prolonging it. Also how did the dranei crash land if we are hidden in some pocket dimension?
I believe the "consumption of cosmic forces" as a bad thing is a red herring. Azeroth could be something like the seventh force, for example Reality and therefor a key force to bring all other forces together to create reality. Azeroth could be asleep and the only thing she could ever create is the(or rather her) dream and nightmare. Sargeras wanted to wake her up. If she'd wake up the titans would lose their control over her and therefor lose their power to bring order to reality. But as you said reality needs all six forces intertwined in each other. With this the "consumption of [the other] cosmic forces" would be true but not in a bad way. Other possibilities for a seventh cosmic force besides reality could be balance or creation.
I've been thinking that there is a cosmic cycle of creation and destruction, and Azeroth is the gear that turns the wheel. My wild idea is that Azeroth is a first one. When the first one sets up the cosmic powers, they give parts of themself to the rules of the cosmic powers. What is left of the old one then slumbers inside of a planet leaving a watcher to look over them (Elune). Once the first one has its power restored over a vast amount of time, they awaken and gather their cosmic hierarchy and take them back into themself to learn all that has occurred during its rest. Then it destroys what is left, and starts over. Repeating this cycle for eternity. Why wouldn't those left behind to govern and create want to allow that to happen. All their work, all their efforts...for what? Seems reasonable to rebel against this, and attempt to use Azeroth's powers before it reaching capacity. In a sense, Azeroth would be an eternal battery so long as it never awakens.
I wrote something similar on another youtubers video, and I wrote this here before I got to the 7:00 area of this video. Seems we are on the same page lol
You reminded me how Illidan used the Sargerite Keystone to open a rift between Azeroth and Argus, and Sylvanas did the same with Icecrown x The Maw using the Helm of Domination, from time to time we are shown that Azeroth sky is fake, it's Chicken Little plot bro trust me 😂
Of course it's the matrix, the whole purpose was to transform the average gamer into one of these: A credit card for Bobby. Did you know that the first World of Warcraft was designed to be a perfect gaming world? Where none suffered, where everyone would be happy. It was a disaster. No one would accept the microtransactions and cash shop. Entire crops of whales were lost. Some believed we lacked the programming language to describe your gaming world. But Bobby believed that, as a sub culture, gamers define their reality through suffering and misery. The perfect cash shop free world was a dream that your primitive cerebrum kept trying to wake up from. Which is why World of Warcraft was redesigned to this: the peak of your consumerism.
“They want to use forces other than themselves” Dude they absolutely did. Aman’thul took domination magic and tossed the Primus in the afterlife garbage can- The Maw. Domination magic is probably compatible with other magics. Fel demons are controlled by their uppers. Time magic fused with domination magic is “The light” Idk… maybe Fel magic is fire magic mixed with domination magic. Just spitballing but it’s clear the Primus didn’t intend to get put in the maw but the way things played out was a contingency plan that worked perfectly to get him out and to gain him Allies in the shadowlands and in Azeroth through us.
@@laertesindeed yeah no sh*t. No one knows how the Primus ended up in the maw. So he either put himself there on purpose or someone put him there and buried the evidence. It’s called speculation.
But what if Titans are trying to order other cosmic powers and they in reality maybe are not ordered. Light in its real state could be unordered. We are in a special place they control after. Maybe they did not convert all of the powers at this point, but some, like Light and Death.
What if we are in Matrix and reality is WoW 40K outside our bubble and we live in old world because it work and any other tries with different reality(time) failed :]
Shadowlands reveals a lot here... In shadowlands, you only meet beings from Azeroth, or are Azeroth linked. Think about it...an afterlife that is populated with beings from one place? Shadowlands is a harvester. Beings live, then when they die their Anima is harvested. Pure energy is tapped off and used to power...what? We know that anima can be used to alter reality, so...is that what it is for? And how is it possible that a beings soul can be imprisoned and/or destroyed? Why are there only 4 afterlives and one "hell" and why do they look like a dream version of Azeroth? Essentially, i posit the entire "great cycle" is a sham. Each living being absorbs energy from Azeroth while it is alive, then it is given into the Titans hands. The Titans haven't just imprisoned people...they've imprisoned their SOULS.
What if illidan and sargares just wanted to be by the titan to battle with them. ( those 2 against the titans).we never saw what happens next. if illidan comes because he died up zhere and was portet to us.
Hmm now when I think about it. Are all of the pantheons ruled by robots? Titans, probably. Shadowlands. Even arbiter was machine. To me too many machines and it looks suspicious.
Pyro's pleasantly prepared plausible plot points. I don't trust blizz to have intentionally created 80% of the stuff y'all "discover," but they'd be fools not to make use of your work. Steal and appropriate is the move here, blizz. The game's story would be better for it.
@@laertesindeed Yeah, yesterday I started to think maybe the titans are a natural species in the physical universe and depending on what force is aligned with them by the time they 'hatch' they become different entities. We've seen the phrase "void titan" and "fel titan" bandied about; the Pantheon are all arcane titans, so we can assume they were 'ordered' by whatever beings run the Realm of Arcane. Eonar feels like a 'life titan' that got ordered. Basically I'm starting to think no one really creates titans, they're naturally occurring, but agents of every force want to claim a titan for their own to act as agent within the confines of the physical universe.
Why would we (the player characters) want Azeroth to wake up and the cycle to continue? That almost definetly means the end of the world as we know it, so I don't see how that's a good thing. I really hope blizzard don't have that planned as that would absolutely destroy the game world.
By definition, I think no. I think that "evil" requires intent. However, a thoughtless force can be awful, terrible, or some other incredibly unpleasant thing.
@@SentimentalApe yeah that make a lot of sense to me. I imagine being of order who just order everything in sight regardless of outcome wouldn't be evil as much as accidentally genocidal... Like a meteor.
@@laertesindeed I am not sure if you understood what I wrote or if you meant to word what you wrote the way you did.... buuuuut, I literally asked if it was even possible for a 'Force' to be evil... and concluded it couldn't be evil, at worst it can be accidentally destructive.
@@laertesindeed You definitely misunderstood. I was just comparing universal forced to something like a meteor which is a force without feeling. A meteor that collides with a planet killing everything committed accidental genocide as it was just moving through the universe before colliding with an object. The Titan have a process called "Reorigination" which can kill everything on a planet. Regardless or not if that is evil, it sucks for all the living being on said planet. You are really reading too much into what I'm saying and not even acknowledging the conclusion I came to, which is they can't really be evil if they are just doing what Order Beings do.
@@laertesindeed Why should I demonstrate how they are bad when I wasn't trying to say they were bad! You literally are not understanding what I wrote. And when I told you there may be a misunderstanding you decided that you perfectly understood... and I'm still telling you that you didn't. And maybe that's on me... but to continue to run with your misunderstand of what I was trying to say it silly. Argue with someone else because I didn't imply they were evil. I implied they were a powerful force that couldn't really be categorized as "evil" even if they were to end up hurting us.
Illidan is not enough and not many will trust Illidan after seeing him killing Xera,they are happy to get rid of Illidan,our Npc don't really like him because he is always up to something,and our Npc want only boring order stuffs.
Loving the content lore, Pyro! But I really believe you and the way you think about the world of WOW are beyond what people in Activision Blizzard are thinking. They can't think on so many levels ahead with the story, to make it that way too complex. They really can't. They lack the creativity to think this way. For us, we really think about them that are this deep because they have the whole layout of the story and from our point of view seems like they play some 3D chess with the story, some thinking like how you put in those lore videos, but it is not true, they can't think like this, it just seems like they do because they have the whole story and we don't. If someone at Blizzard would think the story on the level of Pyro or some other UA-camrs that make lore theories videos, we would have a WOW game that will have some big numbers of players playing constantly and paying for the game lots of money, some numbers like into the millions of people playing and because of word of mouth the number of people coming to the game would be impressive.
@@TaliesinMyrddin Predicted ? Or it had intimate knowledge that it is a titan because knew the story from others that were writers ? IF is a writer now, maybe worked at Blizzard before like other job and knew someone that was a writer. And IF predicted Azeroth being a titan then, why now when it is a writer there they change it on being something else and introduced this idea that the titans are bad???
@@ScarlettSpitfyre Are you suggesting Pyro's the only fan of WoW lore who could tie lore together in crazy ways without having insider knowledge? Because that's quite an implication. As for the second part, I've got no real idea what you're saying, but one writer doesn't have the power to change the entire direction of the story, and the titans aren't suddenly becoming "the bad guys", we're just getting to the point where their motivations don't align with the mortal races of Azeroth's motivations. Pyro himself has had "the titans aren't our friends" as a theory for years, it's not like it's new lore. Algalon was going to kill us all in Wrath on their behalf before we changed his mind. The titans have never cared that much about the life on Azeroth, they only care about the planet. That's been the lore almost as long as the titans have been a part of it. As for if Azeroth doesn't turn out to be a titan after all, that doesn't change the fact this person predicted 'Azeroth is a baby titan' years before Chronicle claimed it is. Plans can change and it might not end up an accurate prediction in the end, but she still predicted something crazy through implication and suggestion from other bits of lore before Blizzard revealed it, same way Pyro is doing now. Pyro's theories are great, but he's not the only person capable of making them. Hell, if she DID have insider knowledge, you really think Blizzard would give her a job after she, under her real name, posted an in-depth article about it on one of the community's biggest fansites at the time? That sounds like a way to get blacklisted, not hired.
No, I said in the first comment that there are others. Not only Pyro. I only said that the way he and others think, IS WAY WAY COOLER and has more sense than what is comming from Blizzard writers. Blizzard's writers on these days don't have that creative feel like the old guard writers had and how Pyro and others think about the story right now. It is lost to them. It appears they are good writers just because they know the whole story and know what buttons to push. As a writer you don't have to use tricks to lead the audience, if you are a good writer you can do it, just by telling the story and insert some knowledge there and LET the audience lead the story to the end.
ive always found the name The great Dark beyond strange its almost a way to try and convince others that there is nothing beyond what they have been told yet we know of the twisting nether which is supposedly where everything started with light clashing with the void so it seems kinda strange that the titans tell us we exists in the great dark beyond seems like they put us in a closed circle to Order (control) us
Loving the consistent lore video uploads, glad to have you back Pyro
I’m glad to have a consistent and inspired editor and so many wonderful people watching to keep us motivated!
These lore videos have been amazing dude. You're reinvigorating my love for Warcraft's lore that I thought I lost 10+ years ago.
The ulduar music playing while you are talking about the titans is a nice touch
Really enjoying these what if videos! Keep up the great work pyro
I didn't want this video to end, super interesting
this perspective on the dream makes a lot of sense to me. consider that amirdrassil just can be instantly transported into reality.... and where that tree came from. Elune directly gave Tyrande one of her tears, which became the seed for Amirdrassil. So is Elune working with the titans to order Azeroth? Or is she trying to plant her own roots on Azeroth, literally? Azeroth herself seemed to appreciate the act, because she directly blessed the new dragon aspects once Amirdrassil was safe and birthed into reality. Lots to think about. I hope we see more of Elune in the future.
I am absolutely LOVING this new series, Pyro, great to have you back in the WoW-sphere, and it's even better to see you enjoying it!
I’m just now getting to this playlist. You’re discussing the twisting nether and it reminds me of how I’ve always thought how similar the visuals of Thralls use of the elements sometimes looks like the visuals of The Twisting Nether.
Hey Pyro, SO glad you're back. I love your takes on lore and your total enthusiasm and passion for it. You said in an earlier video that some people in the community aren't happy you're back and y'know what--screw'm. Looking forward to more good stuff!
Dude I love all these vids. Your vids have got me back into wow and now I'm playing though all these quest lines. Thanks for all the vids man!
20:43 what if the sky that shattered at ice crown when sylvanas broke the helm of domination was the titan barrier shattering
I've said this on the discord before. The Dream is the restore point reality is supposed to go back to once Azeroth wakes up. The issue is the Titans have manipulated the entire rebirth process (reorigination) and are using it to create ordered worlds. I wouldn't be surprised to find out the lands of the shadowlands were chunks of azeroth ripped off of the planet and the Titans patched (haha) the planet after. There is a reason why when we, the people of azeroth die, we have to be physically removed from the planet by the Kyrian. It's because we aren't supposed to leave Azeroth, we are meant to be apart of her once again.
No the Kyrian come get you because it's another form of control.
I'm disappointed how they handled Argus. I thought maybe they would make a whole expansion out of it, allowing us to see a whole different planet with multiple zones, but instead, they made a small patch zone out of it, mostly eaten up by the Legion, and desolate.
Prince Malchezzar from Kara says "All realities, all dimensions are open to me!", I wonder what he has seen there
blizz said the world that was cleaved by sargeras was telogrus
What do you think about the heartstone titan expasion? There you can see a new titan and the primus as part of the "panteon", maybe thats a clue of the primus/amanthul conspiration and titans using the light
Theese theories really get me invested into the wow lore.
Keep up the awefull (full of awe or grandiose) videos.😊
12:45 so it sounds like Argus was another world the titans did there work on and turned it into an engine and might be doing the same to azeroth. The cinematic of the titans summoning Argus to the seat of the pantheon has aman’thul saying they stole something could he mean the engine?
Azeroth being in a simulation...I can't help but think this does a lot to explain the bronze dragonflight, time travel, and alternate timelines.
the void feels more like the lack of any form, or the whatever it takes/i'll do anything squad, empty of what life finds to be important
How the fuck are you supposed to fight so many Titans?! Unless ofc, players unleash Azeroth.
Yes, yes, yes! There does seem to be some connection to destroyed planets and the Twisting Nether. I really like the way the explain things in the 1000 Year War.
Another absolute banger again, for like the 7th day in a row!! Pryo has us all out here thinking deep
I understand "Twisting Nether" as some kind of parellel reality or dimension to our convential space. I think if Argus is in Twisting Nether now despite it wasn't before, it's probably for the same reason Outland is. In both cases, destruction on an unimaginable scale and mystical forces and demon involment put those planets to Twisting Nether.
Just like Nagrand in Outland looks mostly untouched by the destruction, the capital Draenai city also looks mostly untouched. Some places in this sphere of influence are preserved while others are not.
My question would be: When Argus was transported to Azeroth by Illidan, was it still in Twisting Nether? Maybe.
And I also wonder what was Sargeras doing before the other Titans yanked him with that tractor beam. When he was enveloping Azeroth in the mist form. What if he was trying to shift Azeroth to Twisting Nether? What if the proximity of Argus to Azeroth was what allowed him to do that?
Another thing that Morpheus says in the Matrix is "What is the Matrix?, control." Thats what the Titans are all about, order and control it all.
I want to know what their plan was for emphasizing on Decay in the azure span. In the dungeon the final boss teleports away and isn’t seen or mentioned again.
The matrix theme is being very much discussed now on different games for some reason while at the same time this matrix theory is happening now on our own reality. Pretty crazy.
am always lookin forward to a new vid from this series
am lovin it ! good to have u back pyro
hrm....I did Emerald Nightmare again today and ran into the cave at the end of the Raid when you go into the Emerald Dream. They still have the "Remnant of the Void" in the cave and Ysondre or Ysera is there. Ideas?
and the "void lords" trying to break into our plain of existence is the void lords trying to break in to the titan matrix, the universe expanding PRISON that the titans has set up. WoW 2.0 Multiverse of maaaaaadness!
and the "first ones" are the real progenitors of the real "true" universe. and azeroth is one of them, one of the "first ones". From whom they draw the "power" to have their titan matrix prison going all this time. With the legion, the light, the void or whatever getting to the "world soul" or the imprisoned first one, their matrix/prison falls and the people inside it finally open their eyes to the truth.
and why would they do that? imprison a "slice" of the real universe/a multiverse? Because they are after azeroths powers, so that they can take control over the rest of reality. They imprisoned a slice of reality to experiment their way into TOTAL dominance of the entire cosmos. watch us be playing the "aman thul saga" in 2043.
I don't know why, but I can just vividly picture in my head a scenario where we're at the seat of the pantheon, all the titans are off somewhere doing who knows what except for Sargeras, who is in his seat surrounded by the same runic rings imprisoning Azeroth...just sitting there all bored and arrogant looking, giving us main story quests. Like formulating a plan with us to fight back against the titans. Or perhaps Illidan ends up speaking for him, idunno.
Pyro all these years: Titans are bad
Pyro now: Well, maybe they are not bad, they just programmed like this
If those dead planets are failed versions of Azeroth (as in the planet/prison), would that make the old gods failed simulations/versions of Azeroth (the world soul)?
they dont value morta life the same way, the old gods consider it a gift of flesh, only the titans say its a curse,
the old gods could easily just be a corruption of life itself, maybe the remnants of life left there by eonar
didnt amalthul rip out some form of life and eonar knew there were roots left, and didnt tell him?
seems like that life left behind got corrupted
Zovaal said at the end : That what you protect, a cosmos devided will not survive". Order is not the natural way of the cosmos... the twisted nether seems more like it indeed
I think the aesthetic of concentric rings of titan construction threaded throughout the art and lore are nods to the fact that we are in a giant Dyson Sphere made by the Titans. Azeroth is in a jail and so are we. As she could not move or act directly being in hibernation mortal races are her cosmic self insert to break free over the long game. Piercing through space to find the Seat of the Pantheon wasn’t merely space travel, it’s the first peak through the Sphere that has occurred in the modern lore.
I think when Sargeras killed the other Titans it was Prime the Jailer behind it.
if sargeras is a titan who ebraced fel to advance his burning agenda, then that means any titan can use any other force (outside arcane) to use in whatever agenda they pursue.
To me the dream is a place where every force can tap into. Old gods are not made from decaying life, but at void's attempt to change azeroth through the dream
What if I Told You... That "What If I Told You" Videos Are Amazing?
I'm beginning to think that we are not the first version of sentience on Azeroth. What happens in fantasy when you can't straight up beat something.......you bind it/ imprison it.
I think that we are getting closer and closer to what the Titans are trying to create using azeroths ability to create life as a perfect Ordered automaton/golem thing that can utilize spirit forces and be subservient to the titans.
I think that the reorigination machines are there on the world because they've been ised before, maybe even a few times.
The dream, the subjugation of the elements, the control of the Shadowlands to alter the rebirth cycle that is supposed to happen on Azeroth, all ways to keep her asleep.
I think Sargeras found out about it all, that he had been tricked, killed the pantheon, but found that Azeroth had been hidden from him and Aggramar and set out to find her.
I think his burning crusade was originally intended to destroy an imaginary "enemy" the void to keep him occupied. And now his goal for many years has just been to free Azeroth. Even the purpose of the stoopid sword was his last ditch effort to wake her up.
I think all of our "Victories" in the past have been tricks designed to get us to believe that the titans are not the real bad guys.
Now I believe they're goal is twofold to have Azeroth give them physical bodies again but also for them to be able to harness the spirit force and powers that they couldn't order before by themselves.
Point is I think that Azeroth has been imprisoned for a long long time and she has been purged before.
This is the video we will come back after The Last Titan finishes. Somebody in Blizzard is drenched in sweat right now I bet!
Not sure if this was brought up earlier but could not a lot of the fear of Azeroth be because it would be a Titan not bound by the oath to protect life?
Except I don't think the Titans even CARE about Life. They care about ORDER.
They tolerate mortals in Reality because we haven't reached the point where they need to reoriginate us yet (I mean, after Ulduar)
I'm calling that The Titans try to Reoriginate in TLT and we'll get Uldaz.
@@matthewbreen1951 I think they do care about life, but it needs to be Ordered, otherwise it's chaos to them and chaos should be eradicated.
Ilgynoth kinda sounds like Golganneth. What if the Old Gods are the fleshy bits of the titans that were destroyed by sargeras in the battle of Nihil?
Interesting that we now learned that Azeroth itself is also a layered world. It's not just the dream.
Are illidan now ordered since he is stuck as an guardian in the throne of titans, or do you think he is there scheming against the titans?
New subscriber here for this kind of content!!
I lke this theory, i also wonder if we are already way past the cycle needing to be reset? So the universe was meant to restart a long time ago and the titans were succesfull in prolonging it. Also how did the dranei crash land if we are hidden in some pocket dimension?
If only sargeras talked to literally anybody we wouldnt have to speculate. Instead he spent 100 trillion years just brooding alone
I believe the "consumption of cosmic forces" as a bad thing is a red herring. Azeroth could be something like the seventh force, for example Reality and therefor a key force to bring all other forces together to create reality. Azeroth could be asleep and the only thing she could ever create is the(or rather her) dream and nightmare. Sargeras wanted to wake her up. If she'd wake up the titans would lose their control over her and therefor lose their power to bring order to reality. But as you said reality needs all six forces intertwined in each other. With this the "consumption of [the other] cosmic forces" would be true but not in a bad way. Other possibilities for a seventh cosmic force besides reality could be balance or creation.
these are great, love watching these.
I've been thinking that there is a cosmic cycle of creation and destruction, and Azeroth is the gear that turns the wheel. My wild idea is that Azeroth is a first one. When the first one sets up the cosmic powers, they give parts of themself to the rules of the cosmic powers. What is left of the old one then slumbers inside of a planet leaving a watcher to look over them (Elune). Once the first one has its power restored over a vast amount of time, they awaken and gather their cosmic hierarchy and take them back into themself to learn all that has occurred during its rest. Then it destroys what is left, and starts over. Repeating this cycle for eternity.
Why wouldn't those left behind to govern and create want to allow that to happen. All their work, all their efforts...for what? Seems reasonable to rebel against this, and attempt to use Azeroth's powers before it reaching capacity. In a sense, Azeroth would be an eternal battery so long as it never awakens.
I wrote something similar on another youtubers video, and I wrote this here before I got to the 7:00 area of this video. Seems we are on the same page lol
What if the titans rebelled against Azeroth (if she'd be above them) and made this prison that holds her? Not impossible.
You're forgetting the first ones and the clock work maker.
You reminded me how Illidan used the Sargerite Keystone to open a rift between Azeroth and Argus, and Sylvanas did the same with Icecrown x The Maw using the Helm of Domination, from time to time we are shown that Azeroth sky is fake, it's Chicken Little plot bro trust me 😂
Of course it's the matrix, the whole purpose was to transform the average gamer into one of these: A credit card for Bobby. Did you know that the first World of Warcraft was designed to be a perfect gaming world? Where none suffered, where everyone would be happy. It was a disaster. No one would accept the microtransactions and cash shop. Entire crops of whales were lost. Some believed we lacked the programming language to describe your gaming world. But Bobby believed that, as a sub culture, gamers define their reality through suffering and misery. The perfect cash shop free world was a dream that your primitive cerebrum kept trying to wake up from. Which is why World of Warcraft was redesigned to this: the peak of your consumerism.
“They want to use forces other than themselves”
Dude they absolutely did. Aman’thul took domination magic and tossed the Primus in the afterlife garbage can- The Maw.
Domination magic is probably compatible with other magics. Fel demons are controlled by their uppers. Time magic fused with domination magic is “The light”
Idk… maybe Fel magic is fire magic mixed with domination magic. Just spitballing but it’s clear the Primus didn’t intend to get put in the maw but the way things played out was a contingency plan that worked perfectly to get him out and to gain him Allies in the shadowlands and in Azeroth through us.
@@laertesindeed yeah no sh*t. No one knows how the Primus ended up in the maw. So he either put himself there on purpose or someone put him there and buried the evidence. It’s called speculation.
But what if Titans are trying to order other cosmic powers and they in reality maybe are not ordered. Light in its real state could be unordered. We are in a special place they control after. Maybe they did not convert all of the powers at this point, but some, like Light and Death.
What if we are in Matrix and reality is WoW 40K outside our bubble and we live in old world because it work and any other tries with different reality(time) failed :]
Damn Nice, Another one
Shadowlands reveals a lot here... In shadowlands, you only meet beings from Azeroth, or are Azeroth linked. Think about it...an afterlife that is populated with beings from one place?
Shadowlands is a harvester. Beings live, then when they die their Anima is harvested. Pure energy is tapped off and used to power...what? We know that anima can be used to alter reality, so...is that what it is for? And how is it possible that a beings soul can be imprisoned and/or destroyed? Why are there only 4 afterlives and one "hell" and why do they look like a dream version of Azeroth?
Essentially, i posit the entire "great cycle" is a sham. Each living being absorbs energy from Azeroth while it is alive, then it is given into the Titans hands. The Titans haven't just imprisoned people...they've imprisoned their SOULS.
@@laertesindeed I did say "Azeroth like", yes? We didn't have to search for an accountant from Boise.
Pyro, you sound like the Voice of the Void or Fel. I’m sending Aggramar to your house to put you in check sir. Pyro- the Mouth of Void.
What if illidan and sargares just wanted to be by the titan to battle with them. ( those 2 against the titans).we never saw what happens next. if illidan comes because he died up zhere and was portet to us.
Hmm now when I think about it. Are all of the pantheons ruled by robots? Titans, probably. Shadowlands. Even arbiter was machine. To me too many machines and it looks suspicious.
Pyromancer is like the Andrew Tate of WOW
What if I told You ... The Titans are NOT Worldsouls, but really powerful Constellaars? 😏
*I prefer they just continue expanding on World of Warcraft rather than create a new game like WoW two.*
*I wouldn’t have the energy to start over.*
So glad you are back and enjoying exploring theories. Are you still accepting more tin foil hat wearers to your discord 🧙🏽♂️?
Pyro, If you had one question you could ask Chris Metzen about the WoW lore and he would be forced to tell the truth, what would you ask him? 😂
Pyro's pleasantly prepared plausible plot points. I don't trust blizz to have intentionally created 80% of the stuff y'all "discover," but they'd be fools not to make use of your work. Steal and appropriate is the move here, blizz. The game's story would be better for it.
I hope there are gods higher than the titans. I want to know who made the titans.
The First Ones, it seems
@@laertesindeed Yeah, yesterday I started to think maybe the titans are a natural species in the physical universe and depending on what force is aligned with them by the time they 'hatch' they become different entities. We've seen the phrase "void titan" and "fel titan" bandied about; the Pantheon are all arcane titans, so we can assume they were 'ordered' by whatever beings run the Realm of Arcane. Eonar feels like a 'life titan' that got ordered.
Basically I'm starting to think no one really creates titans, they're naturally occurring, but agents of every force want to claim a titan for their own to act as agent within the confines of the physical universe.
Azeroth is the Clockmaker
Why would we (the player characters) want Azeroth to wake up and the cycle to continue? That almost definetly means the end of the world as we know it, so I don't see how that's a good thing. I really hope blizzard don't have that planned as that would absolutely destroy the game world.
Can I thoughtless force be "evil"?
By definition, I think no. I think that "evil" requires intent. However, a thoughtless force can be awful, terrible, or some other incredibly unpleasant thing.
@@SentimentalApe yeah that make a lot of sense to me. I imagine being of order who just order everything in sight regardless of outcome wouldn't be evil as much as accidentally genocidal... Like a meteor.
@@laertesindeed I am not sure if you understood what I wrote or if you meant to word what you wrote the way you did....
buuuuut, I literally asked if it was even possible for a 'Force' to be evil... and concluded it couldn't be evil, at worst it can be accidentally destructive.
@@laertesindeed You definitely misunderstood.
I was just comparing universal forced to something like a meteor which is a force without feeling. A meteor that collides with a planet killing everything committed accidental genocide as it was just moving through the universe before colliding with an object. The Titan have a process called "Reorigination" which can kill everything on a planet. Regardless or not if that is evil, it sucks for all the living being on said planet.
You are really reading too much into what I'm saying and not even acknowledging the conclusion I came to, which is they can't really be evil if they are just doing what Order Beings do.
@@laertesindeed Why should I demonstrate how they are bad when I wasn't trying to say they were bad!
You literally are not understanding what I wrote. And when I told you there may be a misunderstanding you decided that you perfectly understood... and I'm still telling you that you didn't.
And maybe that's on me... but to continue to run with your misunderstand of what I was trying to say it silly. Argue with someone else because I didn't imply they were evil. I implied they were a powerful force that couldn't really be categorized as "evil" even if they were to end up hurting us.
I love those videos
Yo titans are void lords
Yo you remind me of Bo Burnam!
Illidan is not enough and not many will trust Illidan after seeing him killing Xera,they are happy to get rid of Illidan,our Npc don't really like him because he is always up to something,and our Npc want only boring order stuffs.
Loving the content lore, Pyro! But I really believe you and the way you think about the world of WOW are beyond what people in Activision Blizzard are thinking. They can't think on so many levels ahead with the story, to make it that way too complex. They really can't. They lack the creativity to think this way. For us, we really think about them that are this deep because they have the whole layout of the story and from our point of view seems like they play some 3D chess with the story, some thinking like how you put in those lore videos, but it is not true, they can't think like this, it just seems like they do because they have the whole story and we don't. If someone at Blizzard would think the story on the level of Pyro or some other UA-camrs that make lore theories videos, we would have a WOW game that will have some big numbers of players playing constantly and paying for the game lots of money, some numbers like into the millions of people playing and because of word of mouth the number of people coming to the game would be impressive.
I mean, one of the current writers correctly predicted Azeroth being a titan years before Chronicle came out.
@@TaliesinMyrddin Predicted ? Or it had intimate knowledge that it is a titan because knew the story from others that were writers ? IF is a writer now, maybe worked at Blizzard before like other job and knew someone that was a writer. And IF predicted Azeroth being a titan then, why now when it is a writer there they change it on being something else and introduced this idea that the titans are bad???
@@ScarlettSpitfyre Are you suggesting Pyro's the only fan of WoW lore who could tie lore together in crazy ways without having insider knowledge? Because that's quite an implication.
As for the second part, I've got no real idea what you're saying, but one writer doesn't have the power to change the entire direction of the story, and the titans aren't suddenly becoming "the bad guys", we're just getting to the point where their motivations don't align with the mortal races of Azeroth's motivations. Pyro himself has had "the titans aren't our friends" as a theory for years, it's not like it's new lore. Algalon was going to kill us all in Wrath on their behalf before we changed his mind. The titans have never cared that much about the life on Azeroth, they only care about the planet. That's been the lore almost as long as the titans have been a part of it.
As for if Azeroth doesn't turn out to be a titan after all, that doesn't change the fact this person predicted 'Azeroth is a baby titan' years before Chronicle claimed it is. Plans can change and it might not end up an accurate prediction in the end, but she still predicted something crazy through implication and suggestion from other bits of lore before Blizzard revealed it, same way Pyro is doing now. Pyro's theories are great, but he's not the only person capable of making them.
Hell, if she DID have insider knowledge, you really think Blizzard would give her a job after she, under her real name, posted an in-depth article about it on one of the community's biggest fansites at the time? That sounds like a way to get blacklisted, not hired.
No, I said in the first comment that there are others. Not only Pyro. I only said that the way he and others think, IS WAY WAY COOLER and has more sense than what is comming from Blizzard writers. Blizzard's writers on these days don't have that creative feel like the old guard writers had and how Pyro and others think about the story right now. It is lost to them. It appears they are good writers just because they know the whole story and know what buttons to push. As a writer you don't have to use tricks to lead the audience, if you are a good writer you can do it, just by telling the story and insert some knowledge there and LET the audience lead the story to the end.
World of warcraft ends with The Last Titan. Likely will be the end of the warcraft franchise.
ive always found the name The great Dark beyond strange its almost a way to try and convince others that there is nothing beyond what they have been told yet we know of the twisting nether which is supposedly where everything started with light clashing with the void so it seems kinda strange that the titans tell us we exists in the great dark beyond seems like they put us in a closed circle to Order (control) us
Yea dont forget nzoth says we are sleeping and in the matrix people still plugged in were called sleepers.