You can when the Kessil is more than halfway to the cost of a prime and doesn't even include the cost of a timer. If you want anything like the programming features of a prime the Kessil actually costs more since you have to buy an expensive controller. Not saying the Kessil A80 is a bad light, it just fails the value test compared to other options.
Kessil has a very interesting fan base. Of the 3 major high end LED manufacturers (Kessil, AI, Ecotech Marine) they tend to have the worst troll factor when anyone expresses anything but a stellar opinion of something with the Kessil label attached to it. Not really surprised by the reaction from them.
I definitely see your points but Kessils are designed to be set and forget which any reefer should for stability. They also have a pattern on their dense matrix which others can not replicate. ie disco ball.
True, although usually once folks with other lights find a setting that works well for them they leave it alone. I've been running the same setting on mine for going on 2 years now. As for the disco ball effect? I've never once seen it with my Hydras. I think a lot of it though is the settings. I have eyes that are pretty sensitive to visual imperfections as well.
Ive had experience with led with the same wattage ie fluval nano marine and lominie asta 20 while they can grow corals they look terrible to look at. With my kessil a80 the corals are popping even though the color is on 10k. Fluval does have that nice lights control but i feel like that one give you a fake sense of freedom because yes you can run full blue with no green or red or white but then the light is going to be weak asf and therefore can no longer grow corals, with kessil logic i could turn it all the way to actinic blue to 10k warm light and still have good corals growth.
I left last comment before I watched through and so glad I came upon this video!!! I was looking at a hipagaro, not the older 15 watt but a 78 watt one and someone said it didnt put out much disco and its fully programmable. Are you familiar I dont mind getting several of them as It looks nice versus one. He is what I am looking for : Good growth for mostly lps and some softies. also maybe a few sps at the top of tank. Not sure if I can combine that even. I want some shimmer; yes and sparkle just not a ton. I want color pop like radions give! lol.. good color spectrum with purpel uv ect and programmable. Also hate daisy chains so a mount would be nice or maybe hubby can build something. I think the hipagaro comes with mount and I think maras aqua and spectra are daisy chain. How are vipar and mars aqua with bolor pop and those other features? Is one better than the other or would you recomend prime over them? I was even considering 3 to 4 small radions after I saw BRS recommend them over the big ones. I was going to buy gen 4 used but they probably have 4 years of 10 hours a day runtime so might not be to smart to buy a used light! My tanks were used but barely and look brand new! My 72 bowfront was used as a display tank for pirate ships. i sold the ships so ended up paying 15 bucks for it! haha SCORE Plus I won a 1,000.00 gift card from unique corals and 100.00 for my 36 with skimmer and plumbed and current orbiy lights, plus so much more..hense the reason for splurging a little on lights! haha
I think I responded to the other comment, but in case it didn't go through, I would definitely look at AI Hydra 32HDs. At around $370 each to cover your planned 90 gallon upgrade it wouldn't be super cheap but it would still be a lot more affordable than a pair of Radion Pros (even XR15s by the time you factor in the controller cost). The AI lights have the big advantage of being completely programmable right out of the box with no separate controller to buy and in fact they are owned by Ecotech Marine, the company that makes the Radions (and have been for a few years now), so keep that in mind. Viparspectra and Mars Aqua aka Chinese Black Box lights are decent for coral growth but can have some longevity issues and are basically non-existent for programming features. The Mars Aqua doesn't even have a Timer, the Viparspectra has a timer and 2 channel control but that is it. AI on the other hand can Simulate Sunrise, Sunset (aka Ramp Up and Ramp Down), auto adjust for things like Daylight Savings Time and have a very consistent timer schedule once you figure out settings you want. I will say though that the lights do better when programmed directly via the myai website rather than the app.
Your comparison of a kessil to a par 38 or black box is silly. If the only metric for light quality is watt, then yea fine. But you completely ignored spectrum, blending, and spread. You know the stuff that separates cheap lights from nice lights.
The fact remains that a black box does have a complete spread for a 24 inch cube for a mixed reef and costs less than the Kessil A80. The Kessil A80 on the other hand struggles with a mixed reef for a 20 inch spread. The black box also has a huge advantage in terms of upgrading. Upgrade to a 75 gallon - 120 gallon tank and you just buy one more $140 light and are good to go. With the Kessil A80 if you upgrade you have to buy all new lights. Kessil fans seem to think this is a personal attack against all Kessil lights when it's really a criticism of the value of a light that costs $155 with the mount and with no programming that isn't really designed to cover more than a 10-15 gallon tank. As for the par38 bulbs it's true they do spotlight but on a 10 gallon tank a pair of them will do fine at a fair bit less than the A80.
@jesterscorner879 but the thing is black box got that downside of having disco ball effect.. more coverage more disco. I rather have less coverage and nice shimmer and color blend than nice coverage and more disco
This is like buying a microscope.. you have an option of 800x microscope and 1200x microscope. 1200x microscope is cheaper but what you didnt know is it got terrible lenses.. it does have 1200x but you cant see shit vs 800x microscope with premium price but the lenses are that of a high quality so you can actually use it
Agh opinions very I appreciate the video but your very wrong have you ever had one I have 2 a80s on a 100 gallon doing very well they pack a bigger punch then you think with a pretty wide spread to has a 7 to 10 year life span depending on your maintenance.. and it dose program very well on both there controllers with a lunar cycle and cloud setting witch I wouldn’t use either put 2 or 3 of them on a 100 gallon you will be surprised my green slimmer seems to love it mind you the rest of my coral are all softy’s but I think it was well worth the price I started with both on a 55 gallon and tried my luck with them when I moved it over to a 100 gallon never a problem yet should test with them before saying this
There spectrum is clashed together before even leaving the lances meaning it breaks the surface better then most lights as well you should watch kessils video they made on them ..
I couldnt believe this light is only 139 bucks! Thats a value for kessil or any light really except black box maybe. Kessil is asking like 450 or more for the 360;s or what ever they are called! Not much bigger is size so I wonder what the difference is. They dont mention wattage or anything! . I have a current orbit I got on amazon for 45 bucks. Open box and not very happy! Now I am looking for something for a 36 but soon to upgrade to 90. I figure I can just add more lights when I upgrade. Is there anything out there that isnt going to cost 3,000.00? I like the color pop my LFS gets with radions, thought about the smaller ones after I saw brs compare the 2 and they recommend going with smaller ones! I think they said 3 is good enough for 48 in tank but I may do 4. Another thing is I hate a lot of disco or real heavy shimmer! I hear kessil is better for that. What is ur opinion, I f you dont mind me asking! Thanks
Wow 36 bowfront to a 90? You are following the exact same tanks as me. I started with a 36 bowfront and then upgraded to my current 90 gallon. As for lighting, I would recommend AI Hydra 32HDs if you are looking at a 90. I run a pair of the older 26HDs over mine and love them. Keep in mind the company that makes Radions now owns AI.
As for the kessil A80, it's only 15 watts and only well suited to tanks under 20 gallons. So by the time you add in the cost of the mount and the controller (if you want programming options), you easily exceed the cost of an AI Prime 16HD plus mount. The AI Prime 16HD is 59 watts, fully programmable and has the ability to borrow power from the spectrum you aren't using and give it to what you are using. It can cover up to a 24x24 spread. The AI prime 16HD can be had new with mount for $240 or a bit less and as mentioned is fully programmable right out of the box. The Kessil A80 on the other hand runs between $160 and $170 with the cost of the mount included but virtually no programming options. You can get the controller which will make it more like an AI light for programming, but it adds another $100 to the cost, which brings the light into the $260-$270 range and even then it's a much weaker light by comparison and still can't borrow power from other spectrums. Hence my claim of a poor value compared to other options.
True, but so are AI lights and as mentioned the price difference between the A80 and the AI Prime 16HD is pretty marginal when you take a look at what you are getting for the money.
@@jesterscorner879 I would also suggest the Kessel is way better for someone new to the hobby .. because whatever you set the light at it's optimal for coral .. it's designed that way. But I would not suggest using a a80 in nothing bigger then a 10 Gallon.. it's a well made light expensive for sure but all Kessel lights are expensive including there studio lighting .depends on what you want I guess.
Interesting. So I assume the first is for the Kessil A80. So even in a 5 gallon tank the par drops off that much at the bottom? No surprise on the Current Orbit Marine. Terrible lights for Coral Growth.
Once again though if you are doing a true equal comparison you have to factor in the cost of the kessil controller which more than makes up that price difference between the two and it still isn't designed to cover the same spread. In addition the Prime also is a better investment if you upgrade to a larger tank.
Found your channel through your Living Reefs update page. Subscribed. Thanks for the content!
Thank You
Also you cant compare kessil a80 to ai prime 16hd.. you have to compare it to a160 or a360x.
You can when the Kessil is more than halfway to the cost of a prime and doesn't even include the cost of a timer. If you want anything like the programming features of a prime the Kessil actually costs more since you have to buy an expensive controller. Not saying the Kessil A80 is a bad light, it just fails the value test compared to other options.
Why are people downvoting someone taking the time to share their informed opinion. Great video
Kessil has a very interesting fan base. Of the 3 major high end LED manufacturers (Kessil, AI, Ecotech Marine) they tend to have the worst troll factor when anyone expresses anything but a stellar opinion of something with the Kessil label attached to it. Not really surprised by the reaction from them.
It's a great light dude!
It's not a bad light by any means it's just that there are better options for the money.
I definitely see your points but Kessils are designed to be set and forget which any reefer should for stability. They also have a pattern on their dense matrix which others can not replicate. ie disco ball.
True, although usually once folks with other lights find a setting that works well for them they leave it alone. I've been running the same setting on mine for going on 2 years now. As for the disco ball effect? I've never once seen it with my Hydras. I think a lot of it though is the settings. I have eyes that are pretty sensitive to visual imperfections as well.
Ive had experience with led with the same wattage ie fluval nano marine and lominie asta 20 while they can grow corals they look terrible to look at. With my kessil a80 the corals are popping even though the color is on 10k. Fluval does have that nice lights control but i feel like that one give you a fake sense of freedom because yes you can run full blue with no green or red or white but then the light is going to be weak asf and therefore can no longer grow corals, with kessil logic i could turn it all the way to actinic blue to 10k warm light and still have good corals growth.
But i do think that kessil spectral controller is over priced for basically being just a timer which is why i didnt bought it
I left last comment before I watched through and so glad I came upon this video!!! I was looking at a hipagaro, not the older 15 watt but a 78 watt one and someone said it didnt put out much disco and its fully programmable. Are you familiar I dont mind getting several of them as It looks nice versus one. He is what I am looking for : Good growth for mostly lps and some softies. also maybe a few sps at the top of tank. Not sure if I can combine that even. I want some shimmer; yes and sparkle just not a ton. I want color pop like radions give! lol.. good color spectrum with purpel uv ect and programmable. Also hate daisy chains so a mount would be nice or maybe hubby can build something. I think the hipagaro comes with mount and I think maras aqua and spectra are daisy chain. How are vipar and mars aqua with bolor pop and those other features? Is one better than the other or would you recomend prime over them? I was even considering 3 to 4 small radions after I saw BRS recommend them over the big ones. I was going to buy gen 4 used but they probably have 4 years of 10 hours a day runtime so might not be to smart to buy a used light! My tanks were used but barely and look brand new! My 72 bowfront was used as a display tank for pirate ships. i sold the ships so ended up paying 15 bucks for it! haha SCORE Plus I won a 1,000.00 gift card from unique corals and 100.00 for my 36 with skimmer and plumbed and current orbiy lights, plus so much more..hense the reason for splurging a little on lights! haha
I think I responded to the other comment, but in case it didn't go through, I would definitely look at AI Hydra 32HDs. At around $370 each to cover your planned 90 gallon upgrade it wouldn't be super cheap but it would still be a lot more affordable than a pair of Radion Pros (even XR15s by the time you factor in the controller cost). The AI lights have the big advantage of being completely programmable right out of the box with no separate controller to buy and in fact they are owned by Ecotech Marine, the company that makes the Radions (and have been for a few years now), so keep that in mind. Viparspectra and Mars Aqua aka Chinese Black Box lights are decent for coral growth but can have some longevity issues and are basically non-existent for programming features. The Mars Aqua doesn't even have a Timer, the Viparspectra has a timer and 2 channel control but that is it. AI on the other hand can Simulate Sunrise, Sunset (aka Ramp Up and Ramp Down), auto adjust for things like Daylight Savings Time and have a very consistent timer schedule once you figure out settings you want. I will say though that the lights do better when programmed directly via the myai website rather than the app.
Your comparison of a kessil to a par 38 or black box is silly. If the only metric for light quality is watt, then yea fine. But you completely ignored spectrum, blending, and spread. You know the stuff that separates cheap lights from nice lights.
The fact remains that a black box does have a complete spread for a 24 inch cube for a mixed reef and costs less than the Kessil A80. The Kessil A80 on the other hand struggles with a mixed reef for a 20 inch spread. The black box also has a huge advantage in terms of upgrading. Upgrade to a 75 gallon - 120 gallon tank and you just buy one more $140 light and are good to go. With the Kessil A80 if you upgrade you have to buy all new lights. Kessil fans seem to think this is a personal attack against all Kessil lights when it's really a criticism of the value of a light that costs $155 with the mount and with no programming that isn't really designed to cover more than a 10-15 gallon tank. As for the par38 bulbs it's true they do spotlight but on a 10 gallon tank a pair of them will do fine at a fair bit less than the A80.
@jesterscorner879 but the thing is black box got that downside of having disco ball effect.. more coverage more disco. I rather have less coverage and nice shimmer and color blend than nice coverage and more disco
This is like buying a microscope.. you have an option of 800x microscope and 1200x microscope. 1200x microscope is cheaper but what you didnt know is it got terrible lenses.. it does have 1200x but you cant see shit vs 800x microscope with premium price but the lenses are that of a high quality so you can actually use it
Agh opinions very I appreciate the video but your very wrong have you ever had one I have 2 a80s on a 100 gallon doing very well they pack a bigger punch then you think with a pretty wide spread to has a 7 to 10 year life span depending on your maintenance.. and it dose program very well on both there controllers with a lunar cycle and cloud setting witch I wouldn’t use either put 2 or 3 of them on a 100 gallon you will be surprised my green slimmer seems to love it mind you the rest of my coral are all softy’s but I think it was well worth the price I started with both on a 55 gallon and tried my luck with them when I moved it over to a 100 gallon never a problem yet should test with them before saying this
There spectrum is clashed together before even leaving the lances meaning it breaks the surface better then most lights as well you should watch kessils video they made on them ..
I couldnt believe this light is only 139 bucks! Thats a value for kessil or any light really except black box maybe. Kessil is asking like 450 or more for the 360;s or what ever they are called! Not much bigger is size so I wonder what the difference is. They dont mention wattage or anything! . I have a current orbit I got on amazon for 45 bucks. Open box and not very happy! Now I am looking for something for a 36 but soon to upgrade to 90. I figure I can just add more lights when I upgrade. Is there anything out there that isnt going to cost 3,000.00? I like the color pop my LFS gets with radions, thought about the smaller ones after I saw brs compare the 2 and they recommend going with smaller ones! I think they said 3 is good enough for 48 in tank but I may do 4. Another thing is I hate a lot of disco or real heavy shimmer! I hear kessil is better for that. What is ur opinion, I f you dont mind me asking! Thanks
Wow 36 bowfront to a 90? You are following the exact same tanks as me. I started with a 36 bowfront and then upgraded to my current 90 gallon. As for lighting, I would recommend AI Hydra 32HDs if you are looking at a 90. I run a pair of the older 26HDs over mine and love them. Keep in mind the company that makes Radions now owns AI.
As for the kessil A80, it's only 15 watts and only well suited to tanks under 20 gallons. So by the time you add in the cost of the mount and the controller (if you want programming options), you easily exceed the cost of an AI Prime 16HD plus mount. The AI Prime 16HD is 59 watts, fully programmable and has the ability to borrow power from the spectrum you aren't using and give it to what you are using. It can cover up to a 24x24 spread. The AI prime 16HD can be had new with mount for $240 or a bit less and as mentioned is fully programmable right out of the box. The Kessil A80 on the other hand runs between $160 and $170 with the cost of the mount included but virtually no programming options. You can get the controller which will make it more like an AI light for programming, but it adds another $100 to the cost, which brings the light into the $260-$270 range and even then it's a much weaker light by comparison and still can't borrow power from other spectrums. Hence my claim of a poor value compared to other options.
Because Kessel is made in the USA and they make there own LED's instead of a light made in some low wage sweatshop
True, but so are AI lights and as mentioned the price difference between the A80 and the AI Prime 16HD is pretty marginal when you take a look at what you are getting for the money.
@@jesterscorner879 I would also suggest the Kessel is way better for someone new to the hobby .. because whatever you set the light at it's optimal for coral .. it's designed that way. But I would not suggest using a a80 in nothing bigger then a 10 Gallon.. it's a well made light expensive for sure but all Kessel lights are expensive including there studio lighting .depends on what you want I guess.
Fair enough.
140 at surface 114 mid column 50 on the bottom of a 5 gallon fluval tank.
current orbit marine
65 at surface.
hydra 26
350 at surface
Interesting. So I assume the first is for the Kessil A80. So even in a 5 gallon tank the par drops off that much at the bottom? No surprise on the Current Orbit Marine. Terrible lights for Coral Growth.
Jester's Aquatics yes its pretty pathetic.
80 dollars is more than marginal
Once again though if you are doing a true equal comparison you have to factor in the cost of the kessil controller which more than makes up that price difference between the two and it still isn't designed to cover the same spread. In addition the Prime also is a better investment if you upgrade to a larger tank.