Head-To-Head: 6.5 Creedmoor vs. 30-06 (Hunting)
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- Опубліковано 26 чер 2024
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In with the new, out with the old? Should the 6.5 Creedmoor replace the .30-06 in the hunting category? Not so fast! Let’s take a look.
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I have both....but the 06 is what I hunt with....I've always liked this quote "the 30-06 isn't the best at anything....but it is great for everything"...
I love both caliber's , like Gavin said here, select a proper bullet .
Plus with modern powders and bullets you can bump it up close to 300WM. I really think it is the most versatile round ever.
There are a lot of trophies and ribbons on the Wall that can attest to the '06, ......"Dam! what was that?"
Definitely an all around caliber.
Same
Don’t forget that even the 30-06 has changed over the last 100 years , the powder quality and manufacturing precision has improved significantly .
It might be old but it’s still up there with the best .
I'm 65 years old. Both shoulders were broken as well as right scapula totally seperated. Both wrists fused. Neck and back broke. Not to mention a severe and substantial amount of NeuroMuskuloskeletal damage. And 36 surgeries to put me back together, and that's not even all of it, all from an Aircraft accident while with the Air Force. And yet I will still shoot my 30-06 or my 270 Winchester over anything else. Furthermore, with over 50+ years of Handloading and Load development on many different cartridges, The 270 Winchester is by far the most substantial in terms of load development and surprizing Ballistics I have ever seen. I can and have beaten the 6.5 creedmore hands over fist in accuracy, velocity and more. I have loaded my 270 Winchester's with the 145 grain ELDX to 3,167fps. And that was not a hot load. Sub Moa accuracy and retains 1804fps at 950 yards. If there is one thing I have learned over that time it's that the 270 Winchester needs a longer barrel and a 1-9 twist. I'll stick with the Old Timers.
Thank you for your service those are some impressive loads!
270 is excellent to Jack O'Connor that was Mr 270
In my short 60 years of hunting and owning hundreds of rifles, I know I have addiction and am trying to get help🤔😳😂 the 30-06 just works and it’s going to take the 6.5 another hundred years to catch up to the legend! 6.5 is great for deer but not a true big game rifle! When hunting elk we call it the 6.5 needmore😂
True
Indeed!
The 6.5(55) has been taking game a lot longer than the 30-06.
Swedes have been taking elk, caribou, and moose with 6.5 x55 for longer than the 06.
@@chadbalonick1784 and don't forget proper bullet choice.
Apples and oranges. I wouldn’t go hunt bear or moose with a 6.5 a Creedmoor but I have with the 30-06. Different tools for different jobs
Imma try 6.5 on moose this year.
Ya well apples are better than oranges and 30-06 is the apple.
I have shot several moose with at least four different calibres the biggest one was with the 243 and he didn’t know i
was not using a magmun
@@ronbyer7483 it’s all about shot placement. But I think a larger calibre helps a little with poor shot placement.
@@ronbyer7483 I never said you COULDN’T do it but bigger cartridges make more sense for larger animals. I love my 7mm-08 but I wouldn’t pick it for bigger critters
People tend to dog the 30-06 as a hundred year old round, but with modern bullets powder and primers and newer rifles the 30-06 keeps coming back as a modern cartridge, and if you look at most of the newer cartridges, they are all based on the 100 year old 30-06.
My grandad used a pre64 model 70 featherweight in 30-06 shooting 165 partitions to kill everything from inland grizzlies to moose to pronghorn. I think it’s still among the top three cartridges.
Right, As we grow older and tweak just a bit our old reloads, groups get smaller, my 1917 Enfield 1MOA group of 1984 got down to 3/4 recently
If a 30.06 won't kill it, I don't want to meet it.
I think the 30-06 was a reaction to the 98 Mauser in 8mm Mauser. I think they are very very similar cases......
Yup. New powder and bullet tech took the already unbelievably versatile 3006 to another level, it may be 100 years old but it's still kicking the new kid on the block at every turn.
As an old guy myself, I love the white New Balance reference. I just told the wife I’m getting rid of all my white New Balance sneakers. I got into long range shooting about 8 years ago and started with a Savage LRR in 6.5 Creedmoor. Started hand loading about a year later. What a blast. Shooting tight groups out to 700 yards with my hand loads was very satisfying.
LOL my Dad proudly shot a "free" Husqvarna 30-06 he picked up for hunting for 40+ years, and no joke he even has some crusty old "originally" white New Balance shoes out on his back porch! But about 8 years ago my trusty old Model 88 in .308 developed a cracked stock which would've cost nearly the same as a new budget rifle to replace. After a ton of research I went with a Ruger predator in 6.5 and was quite impressed with its .3 MOA accuracy with factory Hornady ammo and light recoil. Naturally, I let Dad and another buddy (a 300WSM guy) shoot it and they too were amazed. After watching me over the next few seasons practicing out to 1k yards and "effortlessly" drop at least 25 or so Antelope plus several nice Mule deer no problem even on some really LONG pokes, guess who both went out and got new Rugers in 6.5? Love your screen name too BTW!😅
Good on ya! Never stop learning. I’m an LR Shooter. Won many gold medals with the .308. Now shooting a 6.5 CM out to 1000m to keep learning the new wind patterns with a 147 gr ELDM. Still hunting bear and deer with 308 and .30-06 as a back up camp gun. Peace Be The Journey!
Man, the smoke coming out of that ballistic gel was incredible to watch. I think us "older generation" like the 30-06 for a good reason!!!!! Yes, if I had only one round/rifle to have for hunting, this would be my choice hands down. Not to take anything away from the 6.5 cm because I own one as well and I love it as well.
I would love to see all the accuracy tricks employed by the 6.5 Creedmoor applied to a 30-06. I’d love to see what rifle Gavin could build. Seems like the cool thing right now is to bag on the 30-06. All I know is it kills like lightning whenever I take it into the field.
But ,the 30-06 can be just as accurate as any new Cartridge, if you do what it takes, I made my 1917 Enfield shoot under 1 MOA with the right combo of components, Without tweaking cases, neck etc, Powder, Primer ,and the right Bullet, Didn't know about case trimming, neck turning, neck tension and you name it, Basic Lee Pres, Dies, Imr 4350, CCi 200 Primers, The main dif was the bullet, And hard to get today Speer 165 Grand Slams, Factory Rem,Fed, Win 150's paper plat groups, Factory 165 Sams makes the same paper plate accuracy, Ok reload, Manuals Imr 4350 best powder, Bullet what was available, Hornady, Sierra, etc. Got a box of 168 Target bullets and they were tackdrivers (and thet was in 1984) 40 yrs later the same rifle shoots 3/4 " with just a bit of more knowledge
Just had the opportunity to go work on adak island in Alaska and brought my first hunting rifle, a savage 30-06. took a caribou just fine. I’m eating some now lol
probably gonna end up at the 300 PRC
I have a custom built 30-06. as low as .22" 5 shot groups at 100 using off the shelf Federal GMM ammo.
@@xANDRExFLC who’s barrel did you use?
I am close in age to Guy, so raised on 30-06. The 6.5x55 has been around since roughly 1894 and our NATO friends have shown us how they take everything from pigs to moose. The efficiency of other low recoil cartridges like the 7-08 shine when it comes to silhouette where the Ram plate must be hit hard enough to knock it over rather than just rung. So nothing against 6.5 CM but efficient lower recoil cartridges are nothing new. When you are my age, you can have any cartridge/rifle you want, but keep in mind recoil is only part of the trade-off balance. Accuracy is always important, and so are terminal ballistics when it comes to killing. Whatever you choose, you must be proficient with your placement and also bring enough gun for the job. Know your limits. YMMV.
I also helps if you aren't a trophy hunter. I exclusively go for head shots. The most humane kill, and it NEVER fails.
In comparison to some others, 6.5mm (.264-cal.) projectiles are marvelously efficient and are both slippery aerodynamically (good B.C. numbers) and have excellent sectional density, too, which is one measure hunters use when choosing the correct cartridge for a given hunt. The venerable 6.5x55 or "Swedish Mauser" has been around since the 1890s and the Swedes, Norwegians, etc. have been using it to hunt everything from caribou to reindeer. It has also been a favorite African plains game cartridge for many years, chiefly using 160-grain round-nose solids.
As a precision/tactical choice, 6.5mm projectiles are extremely efficient and the best bullet designs can remain supersonic out to distances of 1500 yards in some cases. They are great competition rounds, since they offer low recoil but excellent efficiency and accuracy. Or as the tacti-cool guys say, "300 Win-Mag performance with less recoil than .308 Winchester." Well, yes, but not quite, since 140-grain slug does not hit as harder as a 220-grain slug that far down range, but for applications where weight and retained KE are not big factors, then they work fine.
The area where something like 30-06 really shines in terms of hunting is that the cartridge case can handle an astonishingly wide range of weights and styles of bullets, ranging from 80 to 220-grains. Everything from varmints to giant bear. It isn't as flat-shooting as 6.5x55 or 6.5 CM, but it is by no means a slouch either, especially inside 400 yards, which is where the vast majority of shots are taken. And whereas the 6.5 CM tops out around 145-grains or so, the big '06 can handle bullets of 220-grains - slightly more if needed - with ease. In hunting large and ill-tempered game, bullet weight, cross-section and retained momentum matter a great deal.
A fun comparison to make, but what I'd really like to see is 6.5 CM or 6.5x55 versus 270 Winchester, since the latter is really more comparable to those 6.5mm choices.
Wbat I do know is what the gun manufacturers figured out a lo-o-o-ng time ago, they arent going to sell you "another" rifle/caliber exactly like the one you already have; they need to continually coming up with new cartridges and rifle models to stay in the bla k ink !
It's in their best interest to come up with new obbh's & abhh's to get your green backs.
The old y.6.5xt55 really was about all that the average whitetail hunter ever needed.
The century old -06 loaded with 168 gr. BTSP and modern powders should keep up with the best of those new creations .
If you don’t miss maybe but if you do and wound it sounds pretty dumb to me usually you shoot the shoulder or the vital v and it drops instantly way more ethical than headshots because it is way harder to miss!
@@kalebmcdaniel9147 I've seen plenty of deer run after getting shot in the vitals, and I've NEVER missed on a head shot. I can consistently maintain a 6" group @ 1,000 meters.
The only thing that 6.5 Creedmoor haters actually hate about the cartridge is the hype 6.5 Creedmoor had for years. But the hype is real here and it's a great cartridge.
It is a great cartridge. Accurate. Easy on the shoulder. Plenty powerful enough for most hunting.
I started hunting on 30-06 and 300win short mag, that being said I wanted to hate the Creedmoor because of the hype, then got a deal on one and soon realized it is definitely great and has a lot of potential in the hands of an accurate shooter.
my first new rifle was a .30-06. And it was the first firearm I started reloading for.
Sold that rifle and I did without an .-06 for many years, until this year I found an excellent rifle made by Tikka in .30-06. Think I'm going to love it after many years of simply missing that first rifle.
Great video guys, I praise the honesty in this video. Both cartridges are very capable, thanks Gavin!
I'm 68 and grew up shooting a single shot .22 and a WWII 30.06 that my grandfather bought from an add in the back of a magazine for a few dollars, shipped to the house, still packed in cosmoline. Boy, were those the day's! My grandfather was a competition shooter and a great teacher and so from the time I was 8 he started me shooting the .22 on bench and a 4x scope. Later at the age of 12 he taught me on the 30.06 with adjustable open sights and I became proficient shooting both with five shot groups in less than 1 MOA at 100 yards. Many of his hunting and shooting buddies were amazed at what the "boy" could do and often commented that my grandfather had re-worked the guns but my grandfather would simply say, "It's the nut behind the butt that counts". Anyway, his guidance and teaching came in very handy when I got into the military during Viet Nam. After shooting many different firearms and calibers over the years I still prefer the 30.06, the .270 and the 25.06. If I had to pick just one, it would be the 30.06 every time because of its versatility. In my opinion, if you're hunting beyond 300 yards you're not hunting, you're a wannabe sniper and most likely causing a lot of unnecessary pain to animals. They don't deserve that! When you come right down to it, it really is the NUT behind the butt!
@ Richard Stone - "Nut behind the butt!" That's absolutely classic! Thanks for the laughs.... your dad sounds like he was quite a man. My late father was a WWII veteran (USN) also, and I treasure what I learned from the men of that generation when I was a boy just learning about responsible FA use, hunting, camping and the outdoors. Just about every dad or uncle on our street when I was a kid was either a veteran of WWII or Korea, and there were even a few three-war men, who had done WWII, Korea and Vietnam. Grandfather was in WWI, army. But yeah, those were the guys who taught us kids to shoot, camp, make a camp fire, etc. - in Scouts, 4H or whatever. Good times, and man alive do they seem a long ways in the past now....
@@GeorgiaBoy1961 Thank you for those kind words and for your family's service and yes the REAL MEN of our country are dying off. Hopefully men like you and others as few as you may be will continue to carry the torch!!!
Choices are great, I've got no complaints with either. You won't find me hunting with anything but a .22LR, .30-30 or .30-06, not because I'm a caliber snob but simply because I'm not interested in spending more money on another hunting rifle. I would be interested in hunting elk with a spear and an atlatl if it were legal, but until then the .30-06 will have to do.
Agreed. There are just WAY too many calibers.
I run 22 mag, 30-30 and 270
I hunt with .22lr, 30-30, and .30.06 myself... I carry a sidearm of either .22lr (ruger mkii) or ruger Blackhawk in .44mag depending on the season and what I'm hunting... have never needed or desired anything different honestly 🤷
As an old guy, my trust of and familiarity with the 30-06 is challenged by my increasingly apparent physical limitations. I currently do not own rifles in either caliber, but I remember coming home with a sore shoulder from marathon target shooting sessions with old military 30-06 rifles. Where I live, I must hunt whitetail with slug guns or rifles with straightwall cartridges. For the aforementioned reasons, I transitioned to the .450 Bushmaster and my shoulder does not regret the change. I suspect I might make a similar choice if I needed to pick between my "old buddy" the 30-06 or the 6.5. Great presentation and comparison.
My 30-06 is a German Blaser R-93, w/Zeiss 50mm scope. Bought in Germany after a year in Iraq. My German gunsmith, matched it with Norma oryx 180 grain. He Said one of the most popular rounds, even in Europe. A tack driver. Love the Blaser, especially on 30-06.
Since I have owned an ‘06 for 30 plus years it’s what I choose. I could load plenty of ammo for the price of a new 6.5 Creedmoor. If I didn’t already own the ‘06 I might be tempted by the Creedmoor if only for the lighter recoil.
Best comparison video I've seen. Thanks for the balance between technical data and practical examples.
Great comparison thanks for the work you did and the information you gave on this.
Grew up shooting 30-06 from 9 years old, now have a 6.5cm and still enjoy the canon. Old trusty has always been accurate with factory ammo (PMP 180gr). Head shots down to 250-300m no problem. 6.5 is fun though, reloading now with some South African made Balistix Monolithic copper bullets 120gr.
All the rage over the creedmoor is that it is built with LR performance in mind. But not so often mentioned is the fact that grandpas old 30-06 with a standard 10 twist and chambering can achieve the same-same stabilizing some exceptionally high BC bullets, worn out bluing and dinged up walnut and all. Now lets see the apples to apples comparison with a 30-06 built for long range precision performance!
BRABO!!!!THEY DONT MAKE FACTORY LR RIFLES FOR THE 30-06!!!!A PITY,FOR .308 THERE ARE BUNCH OF THEM.THEN THEY SAY THE 308 IS MORE ACCURATE THAN THE OLD MAN.
GREAD IS SERBIA......ZASTAVA,MAKE PPU AMMUNITION IS FROM SERBIA.I LOVE AMERICAN PEOPLE!!!
Took my first buck of the season with the new Precision Hunter 178 grain ELD-X in my .30-06 and I was amazed at the knockdown power it has over the 165 grain Superformance I was using prior. i still like the Superformance but this is the first deer I have ever shot at 75 yards broadside that knocked him off his feet sideways! I was blown away and the entrance hole was almost as big if not bigger than the exit! I am now a new fan of this load for sure! Way to go Hornady!
We picked up a Creed to celebrate this year's Moose tag....sorry Guy, lightning has struck me twice, my dad twice, and my son once. This will be the backup gun this trip. The Creed is getting 127 grain Barnes LRX. .My bull (850 lbs) folded to a 12O grain Barnes TSX with a 4895 light recoil load. (7mm-08). I am convinced that shot placement and a hand loaded quality projectile are part of the thrill. I need no convincing of the effectiveness.
Sold my 6.5 with fusion factory 140 zero pass through. Lost three out ten deer including my largest buck. Was recovered on neighboring property. You guys have great and entertaining content keep it up. Rotate the wrap- ups. Thank you again
What bullet were you using, distance and where did you hit? Surprised by your experience having used and reed about hunting with the 6.5x55
Great video! Would love to see a head to head comparison on the Old guy (6.5x55 Swede) vs. New Kid on the block (6.5 Creedmoor). Of course using all the same reloading components with an added comparison of the Premium factory ammunition available for both cartridges.
That would be a good comparison. We don't happen to have a 6.5x55 around the UR shop right now, but perhaps in the future. The ol' 6.5x55 has a wonderful reputation. I've only shot one a few times. Pleasant to shoot and excellent accuracy.
6.5x55 is a long-action cartridge, whereas 6.5 CM is a short-action one, so the older larger case has greater case volume, hence can be pushed somewhat higher in MV than the 6.5 CM. Proponents of the 6.5 CM state that its shorter fatter case and longer neck lend themselves better to modern bullet designs, but if an extra 50-150 fps matter to you, the 6.5x55 might be worth a look. Where the newer kid on the block may have an edge is with newer bullet designs, not just because of the case, but because most rifles chambered for 6.5 CM have at least a 1:8 twist, whereas some 6.5x55s do not run quite that fast in their twist rates.
Honestly, a skilled reloader or even someone willing to shop around for the right factory load, can probably get nearly equivalent performance out of the 6.5 CM to the 6.5x55. The difference is pretty modest. Personally, I'd choose 6.5 CM for precision LR or target use, but Swedish Mauser for hunting use. The old Swede also has a very distinguished record as a military cartridge, back when Sweden still used it instead of 7.62x51 NATO.
Thanks to the both of you for the Intel. You have my like. I've always been a huge Creedmoor fan.
I’m a 30-06 guy but have always loved the 6.5 Swede and 260 Remington. The 6.5 CM (Man Bun) is a great cartridge as well. I would love one in a Ruger No 1. Great video.
The thing I love about 30-06 is the giant versatility in bullet weights you can use. I have loaded as light as 110 grain speer hollow points and as heavy as the 225 grain Hornady bullets and still got good accuracy with both. 180ish grain bullets are probably the best overall but it's pretty rare to be able to load such different loads.
Used 130 grain Speer hollow points for varmint shooting in the 1970's with the 30-06, lots of fun! I've used 110 - 220 grain bullets in that fine old cartridge.
Don’t forget the old accelerator rounds, 55gr .223ish cal in a sabot, pushing 4000+ fps….
And from 1000fps to well above 3000fps. And that's just with a 150gn projectile
if you want the best out of the 06 then 190 to 210 grn bullets are where it's at providing you have the twist
I’ve used both 30.06 and my 6.5 creedmoor and both will get the job done for white tail. With my 6.5 I’ve noticed less blood which is a disadvantage for tracking and bleeding out if you don’t hit a vital organ. But it is more accurate and let’s me reach farther out than my 30.06. I think I’d go for the 30.06 if I had to pick but if all I had was a 6.5 I wouldn’t be upset.
Accuracy is the key to taking any game. A bad shot is a bad shot, I don't care what you're shooting.
Great info guys.
I've killed 4 kudu including 2 big bulls with the 178 eldx in 30.06 and its a killer they didn't make it very far. Meat damage is a little high at close range but not too bad. I also love the 180 gr sierra gamekings they work very well and the actual bc is higher than advertised they keep up with the eldx with both shooting 4.2 moa at 300 meters
As a poor broke college student, I bought a Tradewinds Husky around 1970 in 3006 for about $100. It’s had a couple of makeovers since then but has always shot tight groups with factory & handloads alike. Can’t even begin to count the Big Game Animals it has taken over the years hunting CO,NM, & TX. Also own a Howa in 6.5 CM, that is a delight to shoot @ the range & groups under 1 MOA. It would likely do the job on the CO Mule Deer that I have a tag for this November, but I can’t leave my old Friend the “Trusty Husky” behind. Thanks for putting this video comparison together. The viewer can now decide which cartridge meets their needs, or if another is better suited for their situation. At least for now we are free to choose in America! Let’s pray that our Children & Grandchildren will have the same freedoms in the future.
Great honest review. I will be hunting this season with a Howa 1500 in 3006.My backup will be Howa 1500 in 7mmMag. I have several Anterless Tags for the Thompson center Compass in 6.5 CM.
I was 1 of 6 in a long range shooting class yesterday. 5 people shooting 6.5 creedmoor and then me shooting my wood stock rem 700 30-06. I was hitting plates at 1000 yards just like the others in the class…I just paid a bit more in shoulder tax. Elk size game and up I’m taking 06. Deer sized game I’m taking 6.5
I think I know who's class you were in. :) Congrats on doing so well.
My son bought a 6.5 Creedmore in a Ruger American and he is continually impressed by it. I picked up a used Remington 7600 dirt cheap in 30-06 about ten years ago and am impressed by it. He has been shooting factory ammo and everything seems to go through it very nice. I got some dies for the 30-06 and reloaded some rounds and I have had some great beginner's luck. All in all, we've had a lot of fun with these rifles and I guess that's the point of all of this.
I love my 6.5 the people that are losing deer with it are probably using eld match ammo which is not a hunting bullet. Haven’t touched my 30-06 in 5 years. 16 deer and a black bear taken and she’s never let me down yet. Both are good but let’s be honest here there’s tons of cartridges out there that would stomp on both the 30-06 and 6.5 my 257 weatherby giggles at both
The Creedmoor is used to defeat the wind in the military
Great video! Thanks 😁
Great video. I am firmly in the .30-06 camp; for the kind of hunting I do it is perfect. That being said I own and use other cartridges as well.
Interesting comparison. Frankly, I wasn't ready for this context. But very interesting with great consideration and data. Good conclusion. Both are excellent cartridges in a variety of applications. Thanks gents.
AWESOME video idea guys!!!
I have owned and shot the 6.5 Swede for decades. The 6.5 Creed was a also ran for me.
The 30/06 is one others strive to become as popular.
Yeah ! Hard to get out of the shadow of a cartridge with so much history. And a hell of a track record in the field.
I know the popularity of the 6.5 Swede in Europe has a long linage as well.
Give me a choice of only one caliber? The 30-06 would be hard to pass up as a great all around cartridge.
@@mot0rhe4d40 I remember a story in the "last page" of a gun magazine about the 30/06. The author went back and fourth at the kitchen table with his wife about caliber aTributes and she would say "like the 30-06" he would say yae. Then thins caliber does that and she would say cant the 30/06 shoot heavy bullets... yea. Then he. Would talk about long range small critter shootin... She would say the 30/06 dosent have light bullets? Well yea...
It the end he said THATS WHY I HATE THE 30/06. Darn thing is like a know it all do it all friend....
Hahahahaha
I hesitate ta say, but its all many would ever really need. 😳😜🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸
@@cw2a 😆😆😆😆 too true.
@@cw2a - I made the mistake of letting my wife hear that I could do ALL of my big game hunting with just my 30-06... She said I really ought to sell all the other rifles and take her on a nice vacation.... Yikes!
i prefer my 6.5 over my 30.06 mainly due to recoil(6.5 is 6.25lbs 06 is 7) and the 30.06 cult gets annoying lol
Dam Gavin I love your page , always so interesting!
I too found the sweet spot at 41.0 grains of 4350. That gave me average .75 inch groups, which I considered adequate out of an inexpensive Ruger American Predator. I am not a hunter, but if I ever needed to hunt, that 6.5 Creedmore Ruger would be my choice of gun.
Curious, what was your overall length? Or to ojib
Craig Boddington did a write up decades ago that summed it all up: A .27 caliber can do everything a .30 caliber can do, but do it flatter with less recoil.
I never had a dead pig, deer, or elk complain that I should have used a 180 grain over a 130 grain.
The 270 is another time-honored hunting cartridge!
The first rifle I owned was a Remington Model 740 semi-auto in 30-06. I had been using an old Model 95 Winchester lever action in 30-40 Krag, that I eventually inherited from my grandfather and had taken my first elk and Mulie with. I was always interested in building a rifle so I sold the '06 after taking my deer and elk the first year I had it and wasn't impressed how it shot. I managed to pick up a Remington Model 700BDL that had been in a fire in a '06, pulled off the barrel and stock, cleaned everything up inside, including new parts and springs in the bolt and a custom made trigger with a 25cal HART barrel and built a 25-06 Ackley Improved that shot sub half minute 5 shot groups at 100 yards. This rifle just got its 7th barrel 2 weeks ago.
Great video! A comparison between the eld-x and the cx bullet would also be very interesting for hunting.
Although, the new broom may sweep the best the 30-06 can handle reduced charge weights. Inevitably, I will always grab my 1903 a3 depending on my terrain and hunting conditions. Respectfully, I will not have a muzzle break on my 1903a3. Thanks, for the outstanding content.
In Montana most of the game I hunt tends towards the bigger side - elk, mule deer, etc. Because of that I've always been partial to 30 cal. Most of the time I'll grab an -06 over a 6.5CM. When hunting deer or antelope, I've generally gone with a .270 or 7mm-08. The Creed is an interesting cartridge for many reasons, but everyone has their preferences. For my part, I just would rather not send a bullet that small at something the size of an elk, but I know people do it every year successfully. So like Gavin said, place your shot well.
Lucky you that have more than 1 rifle, Still hunt with my 1917 Enfield, and had a very liked Blr in 7-08(had to let it go), My 30-06 doesn't kick much and is still under 1 MOA with Speer 165 Grand Slams, Bit on the hard side to expand but learned between the eyes, behind the ear, and back bone to compensate for expansion, and if I miss by a bit it will expand on tough muscle, looking fo a 🤣well priced 7 Rem Mag to pass on to grandson, Only 8Yrs , my old Enfield a bit heavy for him
I would never have thought of 6.5 Creedmoor as a hunting cartridge. I'm confused now.
I had believed;
- 6.5 CM for long distance paper
- 7mm RM for long distance meat.
- 308/30-06 for big critters close-in.
- 375 HH for fangs and claws.
With me here is how they stack up 30-06 in the front 6.5 in the back thanks for posting really enjoy your video
The .30-06 is my go to cartridge. My load is a 208grn Hornady ELD @ 2,800 fps from a 24" Rock Creek barrel. The rifle was built for shooting out to 1,000 meters. I've never hunted with it, but I'm sure it will take anything on the planet.
Would be curious to know what your load is.
Me too. 2,800 fps is booking it for a 30-06 with a 208 grn bullet.
@@fedup3582 I'm using Superformance powder. Look at the load data in the latest Hornady Reloaders Manuel. Always remember, published data is conservative for liability reasons. I may be able to get over 2,800, that is just where I'm at right now.
@@michaelbyrd499 I push 165gr at a bit over 3,200. Your 2,800 with over 200gr is pretty hot.
@@EdBert yes it is. I call it the "Sledgehammer".
People tend to focus on tiny advantages/disadvantages differences between cartridges and blow them way out of proportion. This phenomenon takes place in many different situations regarding human perception. If you correctly purpose-load your ammo and place the shot where it needs to go then it's practically all the same shit.
Shot placement... :)
Pretty much. If you hunt out west, you'll be taking longer shots at game, in the east, you deal with brush. Something hand-loaders should consider is also finding a factory load that works well, just in case you forgot your loads at home and have to source locally. That's when having a common caliber; 30.06, .308, .270 comes in handy.
I've hunted for six decades, mostly in open country, and I own both calibers. The Creedmore is fine up to six hundred yards and for whitetails or smaller game. However, the ought six is simply more power. It kills everything in the States with ease and at twice the range.
Nothing has ever walked away from my ought six, thus it's always my go to choice.
The best gun, assuming adequate power, is the gun you shoot best.
I've been hunting for 50+ years.
The 06 is the all time classic! The 6.5 is nothing to laugh at. Less recoil and plenty of take down.
I own both and love them both.
Great video Gavin! Started reloading .30-06 when i was a teen ager. That was over 40 years ago. And I shot .30-06 today when I was out. That said, I really enjoy the creedmoor round as well. The only "big" game I hunt anymore is whitetail deer. I am sure the creedmoor will easily do what I need it to do on deer. But, I am hung up on .308 Winchester. 30-06 is flat rough on deer. Bloodshot ribcages and shoulders. For me and deer hunting it's .308 Winchester and 165gr Hornday spire point bullets.
Been taking white tails with a 30-06 since I was 14, yeah over 50 years ago.
You are correct about chest damage though. I avoid shoulder shots whenever possible. I clean butcher and process my own, so avoiding not only the loss of meat but also the grossness of bloodshot membranes.
At ranges out to 125 or maybe 150 (with a rest) I will take neck shots. Close in top of the neck, longer range base. It drops them faster than chest shots, cannot run with a severed spinal cord.
@@EdBert indeed. Right behind the ear
25-06 works great too especially for deer !🙂
This was a great comparison between two awesome cartridges.
It's refreshing to see a fair comparison using similar bullets. Most of the comparisons you see with older cartridges versus newer cartridges compare the older cartridges using off the shelf older bullets versus the newer cartridges with the new more ballistic efficient bullets.
Good point. “This old cartridge loaded with core lokts out of a $400 used gun full of carbon and copper vs. my $1400 rifle that I sank another $400 in upgrades and topped with a $800 scope and am running $53/box ammo through”
Thanks for the comparison. I thought the 30.06 was not going to perform as well. It does use a lot more powder and brass to get similar performance, but it carries plenty of energy downrange if you can hit the target.
Every shooter is different and has different abilities so I am for whatever rifle you can shoot accurately and safely.
I was shooting horady light magnum 180 gr in my 30 06 rem pump action for wood bison and at 140 yards the bullet went right trough, 2 years ago I shot an elk at 460 yards with 180 gr federal and landed a perfect heart shot, I am hunting with my 3006 since 1982 and always did really good
Outstanding! Ya, I've been using the 30-06 for a long time as well. It always comes through. Please ignore the spam comment, someone is trying to imitate UR. We're working on that.
I hunt Whitetail and with all the hype, I was beginning to think the 6.5 was a better round. After watching a few vids comparing old trusty to the new kid on the block. I'm happy old trusty won't let me down. Great Video guys!
Great discussion guys very informative. I really get sick of the silly comments around calibres. Right tool for right job and what you like is my motto, and that includes so many factors that have nothing to do with the number on the cartridge. There may have been an argument years ago that x cartridge is better for whatever but with modern incredibly diverse ammo for nearly every cartridge that's just a stupid argument now. I have a .308 that is set up as a 50-300 yard hunter sort of thing and I also have a Rem Mag that boggies on out confidently to 600+. But I could easily swap that around with just changing the scope, barrel and do some work on them right? It seems to me the actual calibre is rapidly becoming the least important factor in the whole thing.
Both good cartridges but the creedmoor tends to be overhyped.
Two of my 4 boys hunt with 6.5 and they are great for deer size game but me and one of my other sons use 30-06’s and always have less wounded and tracking especially on elk!
@@edwardabrams4972 i have 30-06's with which I have had great luck with. When the creedmoor came out, I was intrigued and as hype grew, I got one and hunted with it. It turned out to be exactly what I expected, a tweaked 260 Remington. It was accurate, comfortable to shoot, and good for deer/antelope sized game, but it was underwhelming for me. I know you can take elk with it with proper bullet, good placement and reasonable ranges, but I would not personally use it for such uses unless I didn't have a choice. I can fully understand your comment.
3006!!!! Why? Because it just works good and gets the job done!! Gonna be hanging whitetail with my Remington 700 long range and 168gr Berger VLD's!! Can't wait!
I have both and use the 30-06 more often than not. This is especially true if I'm hunting mule deer or something larger. Yes, the recoil is somewhat greater, but in a hunting situation, I rarely even feel the recoil anyway. The 30-06 dumps energy faster and still has ample penetration for most situations. Yes, it does come down to shot placement. But when the velocity falls below hydrostatic shock speed, then it becomes the frontal area and weight of the bullet. Think 45-70 at 700+ yards. I shoot a 165gr pill at 3005 fps. At 400 yards I'm 17.7" low when zeroed at 220 and 2" high at 100. At 500yds I'm still over 2000fpe. That's about the same as the Creedmoor at 100 yds.
Personally, I think the 6.5 Creedmore is a fix to nothing and over rated. I prefer the 6.5x55mm. The .30-06 is a great cartridge, I own 4 rifles in the .30-06 chambering, and two Mauser's in the 6.5x55mm, one of those is an M-94 Carbine. One of my rifles in .30-06 is the M-1 Garand. NOTHING is for sale. If you handload, you can get the 6.5x55mm to outperform the 6.5 Creedmore. I love both calibers and they are great for deer and other similar sized game. Our Scandinavian friends kill moose with the 6.5x55mm. Hogs and other nasty animals have been killed with the 6.5x55mm. So, in other words, not a fan of the Creedmore. JUST my opinions here and another great video.
Here's my take from a retailer, hunter and a guy that just shoots a lot. 6.5 all day for the range. I bought a new hunting rifle two years ago, ended up with a 3006 again. That's saying something because I'm surrounded by all the new stuff, prc's, 6.8 western, 6.5 rpm's etc. I chose it because it just can't be beat inside 300 yards which is plenty where I live. The one thing missed in this video, is near the end when you mentioned shot placement. If you have a bit of wind and you happen to nip the scapula or part of the shoulder, that's where the 6.5crd will let you down on big game. The 3006 will have a better chance at busting that shoulder and getting better penetration. Let's be honest, hunting doesn't always go as planned, and you don't always make the perfect shot. You're not shooting off a bench with bipods and rear bags. Forgiveness in a cartridge is important. As a footnote, I bought my wife a rifle this year for elk. I chose 7mm-08, and it shoots the precision hunter very well. That's a better comparison for the 6.5crd in my opinion.
I own and enjoy both. Thanks for the video!
In my most recent rifle purchase, I studied a lot of ballistic charts before I decided what to get. I went with the 30-06 in a Bergara Timber. 55 to 220 gr, you can do everything from ground hogs to moose with a 30-06.
To my knowledge, the 1-10 twist for 30 cal bullets will support up to 220gr eldx bullets. Am I wrong?
Haven't ran the ELD-X 220s. Have a lot of experience with the 220 gr Hornady loaded in the '06. It was good to go 👍
I've shot 220 grain Nosler Partitions from my 30-06 with great results, but I haven't tried the longer 220 grain ELD-X bullets. Yet. Hornady claims that the 220 gr ELD-X will work in a 1:10 barrel. I suspect that they're correct.
30/06 is as good as you need and nothing you do not. Just right. With a 220 grain flat nose copper solid or brass solid one can drop the thick skinned Big Five of Africa. With a 180 grain Nosler Partition for the soft skinned across the globe. And a bonded bullet ELD 178 grain is a great understudy. Suppressor and muzzle brake can mitigate recoil impulse.
The 178 ELD is a lead core bullet not a solid copper bullet
@@BcFuTw9jt I stand corrected. Edited the post. Thanks for the heads up.
A year late - but those two are the ones I own.
Started with the 30-06 and now use it for driven hunts, because I don't want to spend the money for a new barrel yet.
On my game size and ranges I don't see a difference.
Love both.
In 6,5 I would have taken a 6,5 Swede, 6,5x57 or 260 as well. But the creed was easiest to find for a south paw....
It's funny that Guy mentioned that he has a fixed 6x scope on his -06. My "bubba-ed" Swedish Mauser (before I got it) has a Burris 6x40mm scope on. My father in law said "You can have it if you put a scope and rings on it.". The Burris was what I had without a home, so that's where it went. My father in law uses .243 Win for deer and .30-06 for elk (Eastern Oregon) With proper loads and bullet construction, I don't see why the 6.5mm Creedmoor couldn't do both.
I've been shooting the 30-06 for 30+ years, eastern NC whitetails. Love it, but just got a 6.5 Creedmoor sub MOA groups and took my first deer at 400 yards, I believe I have a new love ❤️
I have 30-06, 308, 303, and 6.5 Creedmore. I always used the 308 as my go to. This year I bought the 6.5 for deer hunting and used it for moose hunting and was successful. Very impressed. I will still use my other rifles because I love shooting.
What distance did you shoot the moose at?
@@christiantorres6118 It was approximately 250 meters through the neck. Well placed shot.
Hey, Guy! What sling is that on the R700? Thanks for the video!
Excellent comparison
Most reloading manuals recommend loading the 30.06 to lower pressure because of all the old 30.06 rifles that are still out there. One of my best shooting 30.06's is completely stock Browning A-bolt stalker with the plastic stock. It consistently shoots .375" groups at 100 yds. with a load that is 1/2 grain over the maximum recommended load of H-4350.
@ Victor O'Neill - As your experience demonstrates, a skilled reloader using modern components and high-efficiency bullets, can attain rather impressive performance from the old 30-06. You can get near to 300 Win-Mag performance if you go about it properly, which is no small thing. And using high-BC 200-grain or heavier bullets, it can rival the 6.5 CM and 300 Win-Mag in terms of supersonic range. There's really not many things the venerable 30-06 cartridge can't do well.
Old weak 30-06 were never made, 1903 Springfields and my still in use 1917 Enfield where te base for many custom Magnums, Name a weak 30-06, reload to almost full and watch for pressure, and the most accurate is usualy a bit below max
@@WillyK51 - Maybe he means those early production low-serial number Springfield M1903s that were improperly heat-treated and there were some receivers which cracked under normal use. The problematic serial number range rifles, however, were sent back in to be re-heat-treated properly - which according to General Julian Hatcher's records, solved the problem.... but old tales persist anyway.
The legal departments for reloading components manufacturers play it safe, anyway. No one wants to get sued for a "too-hot" load in an old rifle which failed at the wrong time. The Swedes have been known for a very long time as makers of high-grade steels, but you'd never know it for the recommendations for "Swedish Mauser" bolt-actions, which are down-graded 25-30% from their potential due to the rifles all being at least eighty years old and some as much as one-hundred twenty five years old.
Same deal with the M1903, I bet.... now, far as those M1917 Enfield 30-06 rifles, they became popular sporterized rifles because of their strong and quite long receiver design, which accommodates magnum-length cartridges easily. So people had their gunsmiths rechamber them in whatever favorite magnum hunting cartridge they liked.
I have two hunting rifles, one is a Tikka in 6.5 creedmoor, the other is a Sako in 270 Winchester. The creedmoor is laser accurate and kills deer and pigs very easily. I like it.
I bought the same Tikka rifle and just need a FFP scope for it. Can’t wait to start shooting it.
Nice video, men! I will have to look for these up-dated bullets for the 30-06. I purchased a Savage 110 Storm this year in the 30-06 caliber. Liked and Subscribed
I have shot and hand loaded 30-06, 308 Win., 7mm REM Mag, and 6.5 CM. My favorite big game is 7mm REM Mag. My preferred target and varmint caliber is 6.5. CM in a AR-10 pattern rifle. A semi-auto, low recoil, flat shooting rifle has such an advantage for varmint shooting, there’s really nothing better for me. FYI, my current 308 Win rifle is also an AR-10 pattern rifle. It’s a whole lot of fun to shoot.
Hands down 30.06 far superior.
How about the superior .260 Rem? :-). 6.5 Creedmoor is an also ran of 50 fps less at any similar load for a 70 year old wildcat (Waters .263 Express) with similar throat and twist.
Love this video. Thats my two calibres i hunt with in south africa. I also have a 22lr brno mod 2 and a 303 brit.
Kind of an apples to oranges comparison. A better comparison would be a 6.5 PRC to the 30-06.
I love the 6.5 Creedmore. The recoil is very tolerant for a 70 year old hunter with 2 shoulder replacement surgeries. Shot placement is key to hunting success. Knowing the physical anatomy of the game animals you are hunting is a must. Hunting deer, elk, & moose is different than a wild hog.
I love the Hornady 6.5mm Creedmore 129gr American Whitetail.
As a huge fan of the 6.5 creed, I'm still sitting here like well yeah a 30/06 will eat the 6.5's lunch. I mean its an 06.... its damn near legendary. It was actually closer than I thought it would be to be honest.. lol But as always love the videos keep up the good work.
The 30-06 IS Legendary!!!
Great content fellas! I currently run a Remington 700LR in 30-06 with a Deadair Nomad LT. I had the muzzle cut down to 24” and threaded for a suppressor. The combination is great, 30-06 does kick a lot but my rifle is heavy enough that it seems it tame down the recoil especially with the suppressor. Maybe a 11 pound rifle with the whole setup. It’s not the model image of a hunting rifle because it’s heavy but just remember that you have the capability if you want to take that shot. I have carried it while hunting and walking long distance and it does suck but there is some good merit into having a pack that is able to carry the rifle. It is ideal to carry it in arm if you’re hunting but if you’re just scouting you might as well strap it into your pack. I also run ELDX hornady that developed for hand loading and they shoot so well. On a regular day 1 MOA, most of the time .75-50. On a good day I got a .33” four shot group.
Put a good muzzle brake on there and it will reduce it even more. My .308 hardly moves.
@@camonly849 no need to. The suppressor does it’s job very well. A 30-06 is a very capable round with modern powders and bullets.
@@NaterTaterOutdoors suppressor only offers a slight reduction in recoil from my experience the brake offered way more. 30-06 is extremely capable
Spot on with your assessment IMHO. have at least one of each caliber in your cabinet, preferably two, is a great option too.
Hi Gavin. How about a ballistic gel block test at 100 yards. I wonder how the bullets will perform at about hunting range.
Thanks for a great channel.
I agree.
Still the 30-06 will have more ft/lb and expansion, all the way to 600 yd.
I have used both on many critters and have stopped using the 6.5 Creedmoor on game. I hunt out to 300 yards max and 30 cal of pretty much any weight and bc is a sure thing at the ranges I choose to hunt. In my experience, it provides a faster and more ethical death for mid and large sized game. I have done more game tracking with the 6.5 than any other gun. Sorry, but this is my experience. I am aware that many people swear by 6.5 CM and have killed game at impressive ranges and am not saying that it cannot get the job done. I am only saying that I prefer 30 cal after seeing the effects of each bullet.
Too many people get hung-up on paper ballistics, it's field performance that counts when hunting.
And what bullet are you using with the 6.5 that your tracking
@@corybeesley6666I have used the following factory ammunition on whitetail and hogs. Hornady Precision Hunter 143 grain, Remington core lokt 140 grain, Hornady Whitetail Hunter 120 grain and Federal Non-Typical Whitetail 140 grain. All have performed poorly in my opinion. I have some Sierra Game Changer 130 grain and 140 grain to try, but haven’t felt motivated to use it. I have gone back to 30 caliber and have no reason to look back. 30-06 and 308 have worked very well for me this Texas Whitetail season. I fired 3 shots with a 100% success rate of the animal not taking 1 additional step.
Thank you , for a wonderful video. You are a winning team.
By your charts, the 6.5 energy at 200 is below 2000 ft lbs. which is what everyone acknowledges is minimal for elk. 3006 meets that at 400.
I've never been impressed with the creedmoor, it just doesn't do anything I can't do with my -06, 6.5x55 or even my 7x57.
funny you mention 7x57. Seems that has been falling off the radar for no apparent reason. Fantastic round.
@@nebelwerfer199 Because it's German round not American :D
We won’t be around in 100 years to see if the Creedmore can truly be compared to the legendary 30 06. I was surprised to see how close it comes. I’ll stick with my 06 for hunting. I’ll take the Creed to the range. The recoil difference is the creeds selling point. Even compared to the .308. Great informative video guys.
horseshoes & hand grenades
I have both of these and like them both.
I’ve taken caribou and muskox with my 30-06’s, but lately have been using my .243 for caribou.