@@dtrain9911 buddy... we coulda got Chychrun for an extra 2nd rounder... if this team wants to retool, they are doing it wrong. If this team wants to rebuild, they are ALSO DOING IT WRONG. Your the only clueless one here. Hronek will do nothing except bring this team back to mediocrity .
@cosbonnolly5513 Chychun and hornek are only a year apart in age, hornek stays healthy and is a right shot dman, this was a good pick up, and I think they're not done, more picks or young players coming in
@Dtrain99- the old regime set the idea of building around Petey & Quinn too far back. Signing Miller & Boeser to large contacts also set that concept back. If Quinn & Petey don't want to be patient any longer (and fair enough, that's their prerogative), then send them out too and get some nice packages and try again, because beyond just the Canucks not being anywhere close to making the playoffs (let alone actually be competitive), the prospect pool is super weak with nobody ready to make a full-time leap yet (if ever). They'll just continue to pay through the nose for FAs, and get middling results. They've insisted this road for a decade now, and they're not any closer than when it all fell apart in 2014. Insanity is doing the same things, over and over, and expecting different results.
You guys are donkeys keep stirring the pot trying to create a ruckus. Yzerman sold high but overall this is a pretty fair deal. Horvat and 2nd for Beauvillier, Raty, Hronek and a 4th. We weren’t going to be able to sign him at the dollars he wanted so tell me how you could have done better. Young player progressing and is a viable right shot D-man with term who is restricted and gives you what you need now not three years from now. Qualifying offer fits with the overall D Corp and gives you a very solid top 4 next year.
I applaud how smart Rutherford and Allvin 8 months ago for getting Hronek. Look where they are now today with their best players Huges, Miller, Petterson, Boeser, and Hronek himself playing to their full potential with our franchise goaltender Demko at his best again. It tells you the fans and media know dick about hockey club roster building. But bowing to the fans is not what the new management is brought here to do or tearing it down as suggested by many people including Drancer. It is so easily to criticize in this freaking crazy world. Great job Allvin for picking Tocchet and his coaching staff who are doing a great job steering the ship in the right direction. Dhaliwal is damn right. This is a retool to facilitate the great players Canucks already have! Respect to Rick.
Gents, good clip. (I usually see you on CHEK TV but I caught this here instead.) We all have missed the train here. As a former long term Canucks Season Ticket Holder, I spent practically my whole adult life waiting / hoping for them to win the Cup. But Ownership has always had a different idea. For them it's about being profitable as ~80% of their income (as I remember) comes from putting bums in seats. I figure their financial analytics tell them that they won't do that if they go through a complete rebuild (say unlike what Toronto did a few years back) and are losing 50 or 60 games a year. That would be a financial bloodbath, and crowds would die off to the 4-5,000 level or so. Ownership wants to make $ all the time, so they continue building mediocre teams that fill the building even if they just scrape into the playoffs => never mind win the Cup. Unfortunately, it's not about winning the Cup. It's about making money. Like 14 years of consecutive sell outs. An definitely not about getting the first overall pick, for the first time in their over 50 years of existence. Sorry for the rant.
Right, the scorched earth policy means going to Elias and Quinn, telling them that management has decided that they will be playing on a really crappy team for the next three years, thirty minutes a night going nowhere, wasting three years of their lives because we're in this wonderful rebuild now and later things will be really great. Drance likes to say "good luck with that". Well, good luck with that.
To think that Hronek will change this team from a bottom dweller to a contender is a terrible take. Hronek has a -87 plus/minus in his five years in the NHL. He is +8 this year, granted, and I know d-man's development is generally slower than forwards so he may just be hitting his stride, but to expect this trade to change everything is just wrong. If I were Petey or Hughes, I actually would prefer a proper rebuild that would ensure I have a chance to compete for the Stanley Cup in a few years, rather than being semi-competitive every year to be a wild card team. Trevor Linden came to the Canucks when this team was the perennial laughing stock in the league, and it took a few years for the team to become respectable. Petey and Hughes are only in their early 20s, so if there is a clear plan a path to long-term success, I think they would be on board with that.
You haven't mitigated that risk by trading for Hronik, you've just made it harder to become a contender because you've commited cap space you don't have and you've weakened the prospects pool coming up as the next wave that could make a difference.
They said they were going to do this. Retool. If Hronek turns out to be a top pair, right side defenseman it's going to look like a good trade. He is already a solid top 4 D.
yeah, its going to look like an awesome trade when he wants 7 million a year and we can't afford to pay petterson or hughes enough to stay. High draft picks that turn into ELC are the most important thing for us
Thats not the point, itll be nice if he turns out to be as good as hughes but will that win us the cup?. No, you dont win cups by giving away draft picks.
I'm 74 yo also, have been a fan since we got into the league in 1970, and was hoping for a cup before I die. Ain't gonna happen! Sure, we were in the final against the Rangers, but the one that rankles me is losing to the Bruins in that cup final. I don't understand why Luongo is so enamored by Canuck fans when it was his shoddy goal tending in all three games in Boston in that series, as well as Game 7. That was our chance to win the cup in that series particularly, but he was BRUTAL!
I’m with Donnie. It’s the same reason Muchmusic is outskies. They lost touch with their audience. Technology is a great thing when used correctly. When it’s just replacing human connection, it’s useless. Having a phone in show keeps you grounded and connected to the people you work for - the audience. Sure, maybe you’ll get some drunk who wants to behave inappropriately, but that’s part of the fun. It’s not entirely safe. It’s real.
I remember the Pauser calling Dan Russell's show... was he at time inappropriate? Absolutely, but that was what made those calls memorable and fun. I think having a telephone segment where audience can call in, rant and even argue with the hosts on issues would be a great thing for the show.
Like most people on here, I was a taken aback by this deal. It definitely was a gut punch to give up a first and a second this year. However, this move needs some sober second thought. Firstly, consider that our pick from the Islanders was not that high, unlike our own pick which we still have. Secondly, though this is a deep draft crop this year, that isn't the case for defensemen, and our need for a RHD is substantial. Hronek has the quality to be our second best defenseman, and that's all we were really hoping for from that first round pick anyway. Ergo the real price of this deal is actually the second rounder. Also, we are generally overrating the value of draft picks in this conversation. Though we have hit on some good players here and there, the Canucks record at the draft table has been abysmal and ranks near the bottom of the league. Hronek is a confirmed good player. A draft pick is a lottery ticket.
Im not surprised. Jim Rutherford said they're doing a retool, not a rebuild, so using the picks for trades to turn the team around in a short amount of time is exactly what he already said he would do. He said he thought he could turn the team around in about 2 years, which means he isnt going to be doing it with the draft.
Were over the cap now his and Peteys contracts due the same time this team is in big trouble .Ive got no problem trading the 1st but it should have been done at the draft no need for the second being thrown in
Ricky is correct, a retool not a rebuild. You don't rebuild with 50 year talents of Hughes (who has already proved it) and Petey who hasn't proved it yet but will soon. They also have Demko and Kuzy who are going to be major players in this retool. Now that management, coaches and the players are on the same page maybe they can start their assent to greatness. Hronek makes them way better on the back end and the forwards just don't have any problem putting the puck in the net. You win Stanley cups by having a group of good players that play for each other and no other way. What Stevey Y is doing is forgoing another year of playoffs and building up draft capital so that Detroit can have a sustained runs of playoff chances year after year. It is a long term plan that works because if you draft well like they do and develop those players well you can move the older players out and you can bring in to take their place year after year. This is a long term plan that not many teams do but it works. Most likely they will not miss a beat next year because the have such a strong pipeline, and they will most likely make the playoffs. I think the biggest reason Stevey though in the towel in was the Sens beat the crap out of them in two back to back games, a team that were right behind them in the standing. After that his mind was made up to sell sell sell, consistent with stocking up the draft capital. Yes the ownership makes a difference. How deep are their pockets? The ones with the deepest pockets can afford to lose money year after year and build the future like Stevey Y has been doing. Vancouver ownership doesn't have that luxury, but if they play their cards right next year they should be able to take a long view and start to acquire more picks. For them they have to surround Petey, Hughes, Demko, and Kuzy with players that can help them get into the playoffs, before this current group gets too long in the tooth. They have done that the last two years except they have been trying to hit home runs by bringing in a ton of new players that have taken a long time to incorporate into a cohesive unit, totally ignoring the fact that these players lack the ability to play without the puck and someone that can block shots. They are beginning to play a lot better without the puck and the results will come, (kudos to the new coaches) but they got to get someone that can block a shot (penalty kill is still real bad) for crying out loud. They are rare but they come cheap (Motte). Pray for Bedard cuz that is the only way this cycle is going to change, Canucks need some luck in the lottery, lol.
Hronek wasnt available until the Canucks offered them something they couldnt refuse. A package no one else in this league would offer, so Stevie Y had to take it.
the 1st round pick may or may not end up being in this year’s draft (we’ll see if it’s 2023 or 2024)...& it’s not over yet - they can still potentially trade more guys for picks: boeser, garland, myers
@@wuhaninstituteofvirology then at least wait until the draft. NHL is about timing but forget that, in what world does this team become a buyer this season? Stock the cupboards from a slew of picks in a notably notable draft pool then add pieces. Highly doubt teams are calling on Myers or Garland and if so they ain't gonna get you a 1st or 2nd. The only likely is Boeser and don't expect a huge return.
The ownership isn’t trying to build a cup contender they want a competitive regular season team that gets a couple playoff dates so they make money. They don’t want to go through poor regular season attendance
Yup, Yzerman knows sneaking into the playoffs will give you an extra 7-10 days of this season, but getting more picks will give you good young players when your team is a contender. Vancouver has aquillini yes men who will not commit to a rebuild because they know they'll get fired cause all aquillinis goals are is to get that extra week or two added to the profit margin.
Canuck management was under intense scrutiny. They made several moves that made sense and restored some goodwill to the jaded fanbase. It seemed as though they had accepted their fate and displayed a willingness to commit to a rebuild. Then they did this.. inexplicably stupid and unforgivable incompetence.
The difference between Detroit and Ottawa is that Stevie Y has the Stanley Cup, not the playoffs, in his mind, while Ottawa probably has a fan base or management that is just dying for even one round of playoff hockey. Hronek is a -87 player in his five years in the NHL, has some injuries, and will be asking for the moon when his contract expires in one year being a RHD who has some offensive skills. Yzerman knows Hronek is not going to be a centerpiece for a cup run, so fleeced the Canucks who are desperate to acquire a RHD to partner with Quinn Hughes. Allvin was doing all the right things in loading up on prospects, picks, while shredding salaries up until this trade. But against Steve Yzerman, the difference in their abilities become painfully clear.
A management group with a winning track record winning 2 Stanley cups in Pittsburgh I think they have a plan and know what they are doing the question is patient will the causal fans before it
He was available because they are 5 points out of a playoff spot and Yzerman is not aiming for a playoff spot, he's aiming for the cup. So he focuses on the future.
Canucks paid THAT MUCH for damaged goods? This is a Jim "Real Gud" Benning move if ever there was one. Actually, it kind of reeks of Fransucko Tortellini or whatever the hell his name is.
Get over it. The trade is market value and addresses a need. Management have been clear, this is a retool, not a rebuild. Why you and your colleagues think you know more than a Hall of fame and life hockey man I will never know. Just because his strategy is similar to bennings means nothing, benning executed his strategy poorly, let’s give the HOF guy a chance to execute his way. So far he is doing well. Additionally, this trade is market value and addresses a need!!!
All I've wanted for years is hope. When they brought in a new regime, started trading away players and getting draft picks, my hope was being restored. This one move took away all of my hope. The one thing I strongly disagree with from this show is at 4:09. Tanev needed to go. He was so slow and becoming a liability. I remember the talk shows and reading The Athletic about his declining performance, injuries accumulating, etc. We made the right move there. Calgary had a better structure in place for Tanev - he could not have done that here.
What has been going on since 2014 Donnie? The search for a top 4 RHD is what. Now people complain when they've got a shot at a real one and take it. Canuck fans wouldn't recognize a significant step forward if it bit them on the a**
Has an NHL team in the position that Vancouver is in ever traded as many 1st and 2nd round picks as the Canucks have over the past few years? It's unreal. The actual contenders in this league don't even give away as many picks as the Canucks do. It's unbelievable how this organization continues to piss away draft capital.
I don't mind this trade at all if someone was like you're going to get a Top 6 winger a top-line RHD and a decently high-end prospect for a 60 point center on a career year I would take that in a heartbeat. Plus if Beauvillier plays like he has with the Canucks so far he might fetch a 1st or 2nd next TDL.
The trade isn't an overpay for what the player is. I just can't see how the canucks can catch up to the level actual contenders are at within this 2-3 year window and most of those teams have better prospects than the canucks do right now.
Management is doing exactly what they said they were going to do, quite a few weeks ago. Not sure why the outrage is NOW, when they are executing on what they said.
100% Donnie. We were finally starting to head in the right direction, then they went essentially all in on Hronek, trading away a first and a second in a strong draft. Our opportunity to build through the draft, thrown away. Why? Do you honestly think Hronek makes a difference for this team and propels them to be a competitive playoff team? The fact that the management team thinks that this was the right move goes to show you how inept this team is. Horribly flawed philosophy and reckless use of assets that could have been used to build the team properly. Not to mention incredibly bad pro scouting ability.
100%, this is a deal you make when you're on the cusp of competing. Not when you're in the basement. Not only that, but you're buying high on a guy having a career year, who has a QO of 6+ million next summer. We have enough offensive defenseman, we don't need another. Totally asinine move. JR and Alvin need to fuck right off. I would kill to know where we'd be if Linden was in charge, we'd be looking so much better right now if we rebuilded when he pushed for it.
Canucks are moving into the realm of the Nashville Predators. Just competitive enough to be satisfied making the playoffs every so often but no hope of winning a Cup.
Donnie, he's available cause Yzerman isn't going to mortgage the future to just barley make the playoffs and get swept in the first round. This is what competent teams and competent management groups do. Instead of keeping Hronek Yzerman nets basically 2 1sts for him and can continue to amass assets and talent for when their team is ready to compete for a CUP not the 8th seed.
I’m not very familiar with Hronek, but he seems like a stud. His numbers have improved every single year he’s been in the league. Legit top-four, two-way dman, only 25, RHD, 38 pts, averages 21:30 TOI, and plus-8 on a mediocre team, $4.4M for one more season, RFA only $5M or something to qualify. They got this guy at a good price. As somebody else pointed out, the chances of any of those picks yielding another Hronek is slim to nil. They still have their own 1st which will be a high one, and five picks between rounds #3 and #4. If the plan is to pair this guy with Quinn, that could actually be a damn solid duo to build around. I like this deal for Van.
The NHL rules on this stuff are ridiculous. That was avoidable head contact, and that should be the determining factor. The refs may not catch it, but the league should....and suspend. But because he had his head down, he's fair game for a head hit. WTF?
A team in their current position has no business trading away high draft picks. You just don't do it. Hronek is a mid-20's, solid, right-shot, Dman. However, a team that is on the verge of missing the playoffs for the 8th time in 9 yrs should be trying to acquire as many picks/prospects, as possible. This franchise/ownership has traded away 3-1st round picks in the last 4-years. They obviously put little to ZERO value on drafting & developing players. Stanley Cup champions like CHI, PGH, BOS & COL were all constructed through the draft. I would LOVE to hear the logic from our management/ownership?
As a person who is 66, We, the Canucks have been drafting for over 50 years and have never reached the promised land, i can not understand how going down this same road could lead us to success,, in this teams case, maybe a different approach, might work, it is certainly worth trying after over 50 years of draft failures Like JJ Daigneault on crutches, or taking Petr Nedved over Jaramar Jagr,, I could go on and on and on!!!
@@jeromepartington1873 EVERY team has had some draft dud's and passed on players that turned into hall of famers. The Canucks are no exception but they have drafted some great talent that includes Bure, Linden, The Sedins, Pettersson, Hughes & Demko. My point was that teams that have recently won the cup have drafted their core players and taken the time to develop them. TB is another example.
@@nicholaschabros actually lot just retooled dipped for maybe 2 years got lucky in the draft and are good again over the last decade teams who have retooled have been more successful then the ones who have rebuilt
@@dtrain9911 Teams that are "retooling" have already won a championship or consistently competing in the playoffs every year. It's easier to acquire superstar players through the draft because they cost too much if you were to get them in free agency or thru trade. Building a proper foundation to your team starts with the draft. If you want to be good for the long-term, you need to have a deep prospect pool and develop the players.
I'm choosing to look at this trade in combination with the Horvat trade. Essentially Horvat for Beauvillier, Hronek & Raty. The 2nd is expendable, could become something, could become nothing. Consider the 2nd a sweetener because RHD are so hard to acquire. We addressed two of our glaring needs in RHD, and a centre prospect. Beauvillier is playing great so far.
The 2nd is not expandable in this deep draft. The 2nd is basically a 1st in most years. This is not your usual draft. Giving up the 1st was already an overpayment, but giving up the 2nd in this year's draft is just bonkers. Go back to 2015 where late firsts turned out to be great NHLers and this year's draft is seen as even deeper than that one.
It's not Benning, Allvin, or Rutherford making these decisions. It's all ownership, all they care about is selling a few tickets and merchandise. #selltheteam!
No single move, on its own, wins you a Stanley cup. Hronek is a good defenseman. He could be great in Vancouver. He's fits the right age for the core group. I agree with the majority of people saying this move doesn't make sense right now for the canucks.
As a wings fan, I'm not sure how I feel about this trade, either. We were finally starting to look better on the back end and then we get rid of someone that's playing very well, whose in the prime of his playing years. SY is smarter than me, so we'll see what he has planned.
aquilini is in the middle of a messy expensive divorce and he is more concerned with filling the arena than building a contender and without a doubt the worst thing to happen to the canucks.
When I got the trade alert text yesterday my heart broke a little. I completely understand the need for RHD but you cannot overpay like that on a guy like Filip.
You guys need to get over Tanev not being retained by the Canucks. The guy was always on the shelf just like Andrew Cassels back in the day. He has only played 82 games once in three seasons with the Flames.
Canucks always trying to be the mid tier, make the playoffs team. He does fit the 25 and under description they said they would be targeting. Not a good trade, but a good player and just what they said they would do.
I'm not saying it's a good trade but what no 1 is talking about is Quinn huges need a serviceable rd 🤔 I think management think this will be a good d pairing maybe meyers is on his way out?
Hronek is not the guy you get to partner with Hughes. Now we have two dedicated OFD and no adequate DFD to cover them while they freewheel It's the right move at the wrong time
Serious Q - do you expect EP (&QH) to stick around if we hoard draft picks and bring back a worse team next year vs this year’s crappy team? I mean i’m all for a proper rebuild - but that means selling EP and QH, TD too. You cant expect to keep those guys and go all draft capital; its having your cake and eating it too. Hronek is not OEL2.0.
You guys should definitely take phone calls!!! Pat Mcafee has done phone calls for his entire show pretty sure he’s the exact opposite of old school. Wake up producers listen to Donnie
I’ve been a fan for a long time logical fans get the trade casuals don’t it’s that simple I would phone to tell Donnie to stop working and retiring his takes are getting worse
Rutherford helped 2 teams win Stanley cups Donnie is reaching and the redwings in year 6 of a rebuild spinning the tires lol so another example of many of the rebuilds not really sucking
Canucks hockey media, for most part, are equivalent to Steve Simmons in TO. Tabloid media is more like it. I feel for Drance’s co-host most days. Thomas likes to hear himself talk. It has got gross. If Thomas knew hockey like he likes to believe he does, he’d still be employed by the NHL. 31 other teams and no takers . . . Canucks fans screaming for RHD . . . Never satisfied. Period. Bandwagon fans at the finest (exclude the good majority who stay quiet). They’re as disgusted with Canucks media as much as I am, I’m sure of it. They’re just too nice of Canadians to say so!
I usually agree with Donnie, but not this time. We have been craving for a bonified top 4 D-man and when we finally get it, we aren't happy? These kind of players don't come cheap. Instead, we want to take our chances with drafting a kid in the 13-16 spot who may or may not pan out sometime 2-3 years later or longer? I wonder whether Petersson, Hughes, Demko and Kuzmenko are willing to wait that long. I think this is a good move. Bo Horvat and 2nd round pick for Hronek, Beauvilier, Raty and 4th round pick is a fair return. This is called retooling.
Retooling the retool of the retool. This is what the Canucks have been doing for ten years. It has made them a bottom team in the NHL that whole time just a bit above Arizona and Maybe Ottawa for the worst team in the league the last decade.
I think I'm alone here but I like the deal. The 1st rounder wasn't OURS, it was yhe Islanders. Just look at the Canucks d pairings after the last game. 2 of the 6 defenceman were NHL regulars
The best way to put it, is that the wings are currently the better team and are the team that should make the playoffs before the canucks. And Yzerman and ownership seen that they dropped two games back to back they decided to sell and gather drafts picks. Canucks ownership no we are close. get rid of the draft picks that we got. Absolutely the worst trade you can do. Hronek is a good player but not worth a 1st and 2nd
Why was Hronek available? For the same reason why you are complaining about the trade from Vancouver's point of view. Those two picks are a great return. Besides, what Steve saw in the back-to-back Ottawa games reinforced his belief that Detroit is not ready. They are looking at a window around the young core rather than the 25 year olds. Also, Yzerman is selling high. It is not obvious that Hronek will have more seasons like 22-23. This is his first really good season.
what i'ld like to see is when you have ALLVIN on your program, you tell him he has no clue what he's doing? tell him your concerns that you tell us, but kiss his butt when you have him on air.
As long as Aquilini owns the Canucks, you know what to expect.
No, mgmt has autonomy
100% right!
Thank you Donnie for saying how it is. This criticism of the Canucks is well deserved. The trade is an overpayment and the wrong direction right now.
Then you’re clueless as he is it’s a steep price for what the teams needs to build around Pettersson and Hughes
@@dtrain9911 buddy... we coulda got Chychrun for an extra 2nd rounder... if this team wants to retool, they are doing it wrong. If this team wants to rebuild, they are ALSO DOING IT WRONG. Your the only clueless one here. Hronek will do nothing except bring this team back to mediocrity .
@cosbonnolly5513
Chychun and hornek are only a year apart in age, hornek stays healthy and is a right shot dman, this was a good pick up, and I think they're not done, more picks or young players coming in
@Dtrain99- the old regime set the idea of building around Petey & Quinn too far back.
Signing Miller & Boeser to large contacts also set that concept back.
If Quinn & Petey don't want to be patient any longer (and fair enough, that's their prerogative), then send them out too and get some nice packages and try again, because beyond just the Canucks not being anywhere close to making the playoffs (let alone actually be competitive), the prospect pool is super weak with nobody ready to make a full-time leap yet (if ever).
They'll just continue to pay through the nose for FAs, and get middling results.
They've insisted this road for a decade now, and they're not any closer than when it all fell apart in 2014.
Insanity is doing the same things, over and over, and expecting different results.
@@dtrain9911 be honest, you liked the OEL trade at the time
Only if ownership listened to TL16 we’d be so much ahead of the curve then we are now…
Not necessarily
oh man I really love this show from Donnie and Dhali today. Great. Couldn't agree more with their take on the Hronek trade.
good trade. not too old. solid, mature right hand D are invaluable and this team was in desperate need.
1. Bring back the call in. 2. Donnie's ire is my mojo. 3. Rick's hand gestures are criminally underrated.
You guys are donkeys keep stirring the pot trying to create a ruckus. Yzerman sold high but overall this is a pretty fair deal. Horvat and 2nd for Beauvillier, Raty, Hronek and a 4th. We weren’t going to be able to sign him at the dollars he wanted so tell me how you could have done better. Young player progressing and is a viable right shot D-man with term who is restricted and gives you what you need now not three years from now. Qualifying offer fits with the overall D Corp and gives you a very solid top 4 next year.
I applaud how smart Rutherford and Allvin 8 months ago for getting Hronek. Look where they are now today with their best players Huges, Miller, Petterson, Boeser, and Hronek himself playing to their full potential with our franchise goaltender Demko at his best again. It tells you the fans and media know dick about hockey club roster building. But bowing to the fans is not what the new management is brought here to do or tearing it down as suggested by many people including Drancer. It is so easily to criticize in this freaking crazy world. Great job Allvin for picking Tocchet and his coaching staff who are doing a great job steering the ship in the right direction. Dhaliwal is damn right. This is a retool to facilitate the great players Canucks already have! Respect to Rick.
Gents, good clip. (I usually see you on CHEK TV but I caught this here instead.) We all have missed the train here. As a former long term Canucks Season Ticket Holder, I spent practically my whole adult life waiting / hoping for them to win the Cup. But Ownership has always had a different idea.
For them it's about being profitable as ~80% of their income (as I remember) comes from putting bums in seats. I figure their financial analytics tell them that they won't do that if they go through a complete rebuild (say unlike what Toronto did a few years back) and are losing 50 or 60 games a year. That would be a financial bloodbath, and crowds would die off to the 4-5,000 level or so. Ownership wants to make $ all the time, so they continue building mediocre teams that fill the building even if they just scrape into the playoffs => never mind win the Cup.
Unfortunately, it's not about winning the Cup. It's about making money. Like 14 years of consecutive sell outs. An definitely not about getting the first overall pick, for the first time in their over 50 years of existence.
Sorry for the rant.
This comment should have more upvotes. Well said friend.
Right, the scorched earth policy means going to Elias and Quinn, telling them that management has decided that they will be playing on a really crappy team for the next three years, thirty minutes a night going nowhere, wasting three years of their lives because we're in this wonderful rebuild now and later things will be really great. Drance likes to say "good luck with that". Well, good luck with that.
It's still going to be a crappy team... they just also won't have prospects or picks
@@rometimed1382 no it won’t
To think that Hronek will change this team from a bottom dweller to a contender is a terrible take. Hronek has a -87 plus/minus in his five years in the NHL. He is +8 this year, granted, and I know d-man's development is generally slower than forwards so he may just be hitting his stride, but to expect this trade to change everything is just wrong.
If I were Petey or Hughes, I actually would prefer a proper rebuild that would ensure I have a chance to compete for the Stanley Cup in a few years, rather than being semi-competitive every year to be a wild card team. Trevor Linden came to the Canucks when this team was the perennial laughing stock in the league, and it took a few years for the team to become respectable. Petey and Hughes are only in their early 20s, so if there is a clear plan a path to long-term success, I think they would be on board with that.
You haven't mitigated that risk by trading for Hronik, you've just made it harder to become a contender because you've commited cap space you don't have and you've weakened the prospects pool coming up as the next wave that could make a difference.
@@rometimed1382 No it won't
They said they were going to do this. Retool. If Hronek turns out to be a top pair, right side defenseman it's going to look like a good trade. He is already a solid top 4 D.
yeah, its going to look like an awesome trade when he wants 7 million a year and we can't afford to pay petterson or hughes enough to stay. High draft picks that turn into ELC are the most important thing for us
Thats not the point, itll be nice if he turns out to be as good as hughes but will that win us the cup?. No, you dont win cups by giving away draft picks.
Two offensive minded d men on the top pairing? Everyone in detroit is saying hronek needs a stay at home pairing..
I'm 74 years old, I will never live long enough to SEE a Stanley Cup.
I am with you brother. I am 67 and have the same concern.
Well im 39 and i have the same concern.....
The league , the ownership, jinxed this club ,,, in a bad way...
Quinn was the only hockey man willing to lay it down...
My grandpa is 78 and feels the same way :(
I'm 74 yo also, have been a fan since we got into the league in 1970, and was hoping for a cup before I die. Ain't gonna happen! Sure, we were in the final against the Rangers, but the one that rankles me is losing to the Bruins in that cup final. I don't understand why Luongo is so enamored by Canuck fans when it was his shoddy goal tending in all three games in Boston in that series, as well as Game 7. That was our chance to win the cup in that series particularly, but he was BRUTAL!
Hronek will turn out just fine
I’m with Donnie. It’s the same reason Muchmusic is outskies. They lost touch with their audience. Technology is a great thing when used correctly. When it’s just replacing human connection, it’s useless. Having a phone in show keeps you grounded and connected to the people you work for - the audience. Sure, maybe you’ll get some drunk who wants to behave inappropriately, but that’s part of the fun. It’s not entirely safe. It’s real.
I remember the Pauser calling Dan Russell's show... was he at time inappropriate? Absolutely, but that was what made those calls memorable and fun. I think having a telephone segment where audience can call in, rant and even argue with the hosts on issues would be a great thing for the show.
Like most people on here, I was a taken aback by this deal. It definitely was a gut punch to give up a first and a second this year. However, this move needs some sober second thought. Firstly, consider that our pick from the Islanders was not that high, unlike our own pick which we still have. Secondly, though this is a deep draft crop this year, that isn't the case for defensemen, and our need for a RHD is substantial. Hronek has the quality to be our second best defenseman, and that's all we were really hoping for from that first round pick anyway. Ergo the real price of this deal is actually the second rounder. Also, we are generally overrating the value of draft picks in this conversation. Though we have hit on some good players here and there, the Canucks record at the draft table has been abysmal and ranks near the bottom of the league. Hronek is a confirmed good player. A draft pick is a lottery ticket.
A player of Hronek's caliber would take 5-6 years to reach this level through draft. That is IF your draft actually pans out.
Im not surprised. Jim Rutherford said they're doing a retool, not a rebuild, so using the picks for trades to turn the team around in a short amount of time is exactly what he already said he would do. He said he thought he could turn the team around in about 2 years, which means he isnt going to be doing it with the draft.
So kiss the future goodbye. Forever chasing their tails.
Time for fire Alvin and the Chipmunks chants!
Were over the cap now his and Peteys contracts due the same time this team is in big trouble .Ive got no problem trading the 1st but it should have been done at the draft no need for the second being thrown in
Ricky is correct, a retool not a rebuild. You don't rebuild with 50 year talents of Hughes (who has already proved it) and Petey who hasn't proved it yet but will soon. They also have Demko and Kuzy who are going to be major players in this retool. Now that management, coaches and the players are on the same page maybe they can start their assent to greatness. Hronek makes them way better on the back end and the forwards just don't have any problem putting the puck in the net. You win Stanley cups by having a group of good players that play for each other and no other way. What Stevey Y is doing is forgoing another year of playoffs and building up draft capital so that Detroit can have a sustained runs of playoff chances year after year. It is a long term plan that works because if you draft well like they do and develop those players well you can move the older players out and you can bring in to take their place year after year. This is a long term plan that not many teams do but it works. Most likely they will not miss a beat next year because the have such a strong pipeline, and they will most likely make the playoffs. I think the biggest reason Stevey though in the towel in was the Sens beat the crap out of them in two back to back games, a team that were right behind them in the standing. After that his mind was made up to sell sell sell, consistent with stocking up the draft capital. Yes the ownership makes a difference. How deep are their pockets? The ones with the deepest pockets can afford to lose money year after year and build the future like Stevey Y has been doing. Vancouver ownership doesn't have that luxury, but if they play their cards right next year they should be able to take a long view and start to acquire more picks. For them they have to surround Petey, Hughes, Demko, and Kuzy with players that can help them get into the playoffs, before this current group gets too long in the tooth. They have done that the last two years except they have been trying to hit home runs by bringing in a ton of new players that have taken a long time to incorporate into a cohesive unit, totally ignoring the fact that these players lack the ability to play without the puck and someone that can block shots. They are beginning to play a lot better without the puck and the results will come, (kudos to the new coaches) but they got to get someone that can block a shot (penalty kill is still real bad) for crying out loud. They are rare but they come cheap (Motte). Pray for Bedard cuz that is the only way this cycle is going to change, Canucks need some luck in the lottery, lol.
Hronek wasnt available until the Canucks offered them something they couldnt refuse. A package no one else in this league would offer, so Stevie Y had to take it.
I don't mind this deal in principle but you can't give up a first and 2nd in this draft. This is July business.
the 1st round pick may or may not end up being in this year’s draft (we’ll see if it’s 2023 or 2024)...& it’s not over yet - they can still potentially trade more guys for picks: boeser, garland, myers
@@wuhaninstituteofvirology then at least wait until the draft. NHL is about timing but forget that, in what world does this team become a buyer this season? Stock the cupboards from a slew of picks in a notably notable draft pool then add pieces. Highly doubt teams are calling on Myers or Garland and if so they ain't gonna get you a 1st or 2nd. The only likely is Boeser and don't expect a huge return.
The ownership isn’t trying to build a cup contender they want a competitive regular season team that gets a couple playoff dates so they make money.
They don’t want to go through poor regular season attendance
We don't know that
Oof
You can draft right shot defensemen but then fans would bitch that they didn't pick the best player available.
Yup, Yzerman knows sneaking into the playoffs will give you an extra 7-10 days of this season, but getting more picks will give you good young players when your team is a contender. Vancouver has aquillini yes men who will not commit to a rebuild because they know they'll get fired cause all aquillinis goals are is to get that extra week or two added to the profit margin.
Canuck management was under intense scrutiny. They made several moves that made sense and restored some goodwill to the jaded fanbase. It seemed as though they had accepted their fate and displayed a willingness to commit to a rebuild. Then they did this.. inexplicably stupid and unforgivable incompetence.
yup
Only incompetence here is you
Valuable input. Thanks, Mr. Allvin.
@@JohnnySportsfan You can't even admit your own shortcomings
I’m so glad your not the GM. You couldn’t have been more wrong if you tried
The difference between Detroit and Ottawa is that Stevie Y has the Stanley Cup, not the playoffs, in his mind, while Ottawa probably has a fan base or management that is just dying for even one round of playoff hockey. Hronek is a -87 player in his five years in the NHL, has some injuries, and will be asking for the moon when his contract expires in one year being a RHD who has some offensive skills. Yzerman knows Hronek is not going to be a centerpiece for a cup run, so fleeced the Canucks who are desperate to acquire a RHD to partner with Quinn Hughes.
Allvin was doing all the right things in loading up on prospects, picks, while shredding salaries up until this trade. But against Steve Yzerman, the difference in their abilities become painfully clear.
Stevie Y has his eyes on the prize.
A management group with a winning track record winning 2 Stanley cups in Pittsburgh I think they have a plan and know what they are doing the question is patient will the causal fans before it
this team is going NOWHERE until aquaman is GONE!!
Lol
He was available because they are 5 points out of a playoff spot and Yzerman is not aiming for a playoff spot, he's aiming for the cup. So he focuses on the future.
Canucks paid THAT MUCH for damaged goods? This is a Jim "Real Gud" Benning move if ever there was one. Actually, it kind of reeks of Fransucko Tortellini or whatever the hell his name is.
Bad analysis
Not the first time I've been wrong...
🤷♂
Get over it. The trade is market value and addresses a need. Management have been clear, this is a retool, not a rebuild.
Why you and your colleagues think you know more than a Hall of fame and life hockey man I will never know.
Just because his strategy is similar to bennings means nothing, benning executed his strategy poorly, let’s give the HOF guy a chance to execute his way. So far he is doing well. Additionally, this trade is market value and addresses a need!!!
All I've wanted for years is hope. When they brought in a new regime, started trading away players and getting draft picks, my hope was being restored. This one move took away all of my hope.
The one thing I strongly disagree with from this show is at 4:09. Tanev needed to go. He was so slow and becoming a liability. I remember the talk shows and reading The Athletic about his declining performance, injuries accumulating, etc. We made the right move there. Calgary had a better structure in place for Tanev - he could not have done that here.
Look at Calgary now?
What has been going on since 2014 Donnie? The search for a top 4 RHD is what. Now people complain when they've got a shot at a real one and take it. Canuck fans wouldn't recognize a significant step forward if it bit them on the a**
I thought that was Tyler Myers? Hronek was a 2nd pairing guy on the Red Wings this year.
Has an NHL team in the position that Vancouver is in ever traded as many 1st and 2nd round picks as the Canucks have over the past few years? It's unreal. The actual contenders in this league don't even give away as many picks as the Canucks do. It's unbelievable how this organization continues to piss away draft capital.
Different regimes, at least we still have our 2023 1st
I don't mind this trade at all if someone was like you're going to get a Top 6 winger a top-line RHD and a decently high-end prospect for a 60 point center on a career year I would take that in a heartbeat. Plus if Beauvillier plays like he has with the Canucks so far he might fetch a 1st or 2nd next TDL.
The trade isn't an overpay for what the player is. I just can't see how the canucks can catch up to the level actual contenders are at within this 2-3 year window and most of those teams have better prospects than the canucks do right now.
Phone calls would be amazing!
Honestly if this D is a stud for us the next 5-7 years this is a steal for us. Draft picks don’t equal automatic great players
Donnie you are losing it. We had to get someone on defense. You think you know it all. You don't.
hronek getting flipped before trade deadline is only way this makes sense
False
Management is doing exactly what they said they were going to do, quite a few weeks ago. Not sure why the outrage is NOW, when they are executing on what they said.
100% Donnie. We were finally starting to head in the right direction, then they went essentially all in on Hronek, trading away a first and a second in a strong draft. Our opportunity to build through the draft, thrown away. Why? Do you honestly think Hronek makes a difference for this team and propels them to be a competitive playoff team? The fact that the management team thinks that this was the right move goes to show you how inept this team is. Horribly flawed philosophy and reckless use of assets that could have been used to build the team properly. Not to mention incredibly bad pro scouting ability.
This trade lines up with all the other trade they have made young players that fit the same time line
this aged well
How can you commit to a rebuild with 2 of the best young players in the league with petterson and Hughes... good trade good player
Literally bought at the most premium and expensive time. Canucks are a friggin’ laughingstock. What a joke.
You're a joke
Clever. About as smart as the idiots running the Canucks.
@@michaeldodd9260 It all started with you, not them
100%, this is a deal you make when you're on the cusp of competing. Not when you're in the basement.
Not only that, but you're buying high on a guy having a career year, who has a QO of 6+ million next summer.
We have enough offensive defenseman, we don't need another.
Totally asinine move. JR and Alvin need to fuck right off.
I would kill to know where we'd be if Linden was in charge, we'd be looking so much better right now if we rebuilded when he pushed for it.
Terrible analysis
Ill say it again. You guys want the rebuild, then complain when ep40 qh want out
Since when do hughes and petey want out?
What majes you think this trade jeeps him with his and now Hroneks conteacts up at the same time and were over the cap
@@lannon4prez They don't, yet
Enjoy Hronek, Vancouver. The guy is a young stud. Tough to see him leave Detroit.
Not since that Reaves hit :(
Why did detroit let him go ?
Canucks are moving into the realm of the Nashville Predators. Just competitive enough to be satisfied making the playoffs every so often but no hope of winning a Cup.
disagree donny, I'm happy with this deal
Donnie, he's available cause Yzerman isn't going to mortgage the future to just barley make the playoffs and get swept in the first round. This is what competent teams and competent management groups do. Instead of keeping Hronek Yzerman nets basically 2 1sts for him and can continue to amass assets and talent for when their team is ready to compete for a CUP not the 8th seed.
I’m not very familiar with Hronek, but he seems like a stud. His numbers have improved every single year he’s been in the league. Legit top-four, two-way dman, only 25, RHD, 38 pts, averages 21:30 TOI, and plus-8 on a mediocre team, $4.4M for one more season, RFA only $5M or something to qualify. They got this guy at a good price. As somebody else pointed out, the chances of any of those picks yielding another Hronek is slim to nil. They still have their own 1st which will be a high one, and five picks between rounds #3 and #4. If the plan is to pair this guy with Quinn, that could actually be a damn solid duo to build around. I like this deal for Van.
Horrible trade
Only if he doesn't work out
Jack Rathbone: FUCK!!!
I can't believe Reaves didn't get suspended for that head hit.
The NHL rules on this stuff are ridiculous. That was avoidable head contact, and that should be the determining factor. The refs may not catch it, but the league should....and suspend. But because he had his head down, he's fair game for a head hit. WTF?
Whose ready for another first round pick or 3 to be traded for middling players and another 10 years of bottom 10 finishes? Let's go!
Lol
Donnie Horonik is our 2nd line RD, very good player. Vitali is also good trade with Rangers. Both young both good game pace and smarts players.
Content of the video aside. Don throwing shade at “the funny station” always cracks me up.
A team in their current position has no business trading away high draft picks. You just don't do it. Hronek is a mid-20's, solid, right-shot, Dman. However, a team that is on the verge of missing the playoffs for the 8th time in 9 yrs should be trying to acquire as many picks/prospects, as possible. This franchise/ownership has traded away 3-1st round picks in the last 4-years. They obviously put little to ZERO value on drafting & developing players. Stanley Cup champions like CHI, PGH, BOS & COL were all constructed through the draft. I would LOVE to hear the logic from our management/ownership?
As a person who is 66, We, the Canucks have been drafting for over 50 years and have never reached the promised land, i can not understand how going down this same road could lead us to success,, in this teams case, maybe a different approach, might work, it is certainly worth trying after over 50 years of draft failures Like JJ Daigneault on crutches, or taking Petr Nedved over Jaramar Jagr,, I could go on and on and on!!!
Sorry Canuck fans i forgot to mention JAKE VIRTANEN over taking David Pastrnak,, but lets build through a draft???
@@jeromepartington1873 EVERY team has had some draft dud's and passed on players that turned into hall of famers. The Canucks are no exception but they have drafted some great talent that includes Bure, Linden, The Sedins, Pettersson, Hughes & Demko. My point was that teams that have recently won the cup have drafted their core players and taken the time to develop them. TB is another example.
@@nicholaschabros actually lot just retooled dipped for maybe 2 years got lucky in the draft and are good again over the last decade teams who have retooled have been more successful then the ones who have rebuilt
@@dtrain9911 Teams that are "retooling" have already won a championship or consistently competing in the playoffs every year. It's easier to acquire superstar players through the draft because they cost too much if you were to get them in free agency or thru trade. Building a proper foundation to your team starts with the draft. If you want to be good for the long-term, you need to have a deep prospect pool and develop the players.
I'm choosing to look at this trade in combination with the Horvat trade. Essentially Horvat for Beauvillier, Hronek & Raty. The 2nd is expendable, could become something, could become nothing. Consider the 2nd a sweetener because RHD are so hard to acquire. We addressed two of our glaring needs in RHD, and a centre prospect. Beauvillier is playing great so far.
That's not the trade though. The trade was a 1st and a 2nd for Filip Hronek.
@@vancitycanucks the 1st that was acquired in the Horvat deal
@@mitchread5156 obv I know that. I'm saying you can't combine the two. One good deal doesn't negate the crappy one.
The 2nd is not expandable in this deep draft. The 2nd is basically a 1st in most years. This is not your usual draft. Giving up the 1st was already an overpayment, but giving up the 2nd in this year's draft is just bonkers. Go back to 2015 where late firsts turned out to be great NHLers and this year's draft is seen as even deeper than that one.
Welcome to the Aquilini show folks. This will be the shit forever.
It wasn't Benning. It was and is Aquilini.
No it was benning he set us back decades
@@dogsbreakfast4952 Benning was the puppet, and Aquiini the puppet master.
@@dogsbreakfast4952 He didn't set them back that long
YES! Phone calls would be amazing.
It's not Benning, Allvin, or Rutherford making these decisions. It's all ownership, all they care about is selling a few tickets and merchandise. #selltheteam!
No single move, on its own, wins you a Stanley cup. Hronek is a good defenseman. He could be great in Vancouver. He's fits the right age for the core group.
I agree with the majority of people saying this move doesn't make sense right now for the canucks.
If not now, then when?
As a wings fan, I'm not sure how I feel about this trade, either. We were finally starting to look better on the back end and then we get rid of someone that's playing very well, whose in the prime of his playing years.
SY is smarter than me, so we'll see what he has planned.
Detroit doesn't just want to squeek in to the play offs like Vancouver. Detroit wants a Tampa dynasty! That is why Detroit is selling right now.
There selling because they hit a wall in year 6 of a rebuild yet another team who has rebuilt spinning the tires
aquilini is in the middle of a messy expensive divorce and he is more concerned with filling the arena than building a contender and without a doubt the worst thing to happen to the canucks.
Donnie is a legend….😇
Both of you are 100% right on this
Kept waiting for Donnie to start the waterworks in this clip
When I got the trade alert text yesterday my heart broke a little. I completely understand the need for RHD but you cannot overpay like that on a guy like Filip.
You guys need to get over Tanev not being retained by the Canucks. The guy was always on the shelf just like Andrew Cassels back in the day. He has only played 82 games once in three seasons with the Flames.
dan russell days lol and the pauser
Canucks always trying to be the mid tier, make the playoffs team.
He does fit the 25 and under description they said they would be targeting. Not a good trade, but a good player and just what they said they would do.
I'm not saying it's a good trade but what no 1 is talking about is Quinn huges need a serviceable rd 🤔 I think management think this will be a good d pairing maybe meyers is on his way out?
Hronek is not the guy you get to partner with Hughes. Now we have two dedicated OFD and no adequate DFD to cover them while they freewheel
It's the right move at the wrong time
Still think Hronek was a bad trade? Quinn Hughes' most stable partner this season.
I don't think it's nearly as bad as many people think. Once you get over your shock.
It’s pretty bad, Detroit fans love this trade
@@Starrynova No they don't
Hronek will be signed to a big contract when he's due. EP40 may very well walk when he's a UFA.
Serious Q - do you expect EP (&QH) to stick around if we hoard draft picks and bring back a worse team next year vs this year’s crappy team? I mean i’m all for a proper rebuild - but that means selling EP and QH, TD too. You cant expect to keep those guys and go all draft capital; its having your cake and eating it too. Hronek is not OEL2.0.
Except hronek and oel have the same amount of 5 on 5 points this season.
You guys should definitely take phone calls!!! Pat Mcafee has done phone calls for his entire show pretty sure he’s the exact opposite of old school. Wake up producers listen to Donnie
I’ve been a fan for a long time logical fans get the trade casuals don’t it’s that simple I would phone to tell Donnie to stop working and retiring his takes are getting worse
Rutherford helped 2 teams win Stanley cups Donnie is reaching and the redwings in year 6 of a rebuild spinning the tires lol so another example of many of the rebuilds not really sucking
100% agree - these casual Canucks fans give us all a bad rep
It was a weird and untimely trade. People are happy now but we won’t know the repercussions of this trade til many years from now.
PREACH IT BROTHERS
I don't believe the Red Wings are fighting for a playoff spot THIS year. They weren't going to re sign Hronek
Canucks hockey media, for most part, are equivalent to Steve Simmons in TO. Tabloid media is more like it.
I feel for Drance’s co-host most days. Thomas likes to hear himself talk. It has got gross.
If Thomas knew hockey like he likes to believe he does, he’d still be employed by the NHL. 31 other teams and no takers . . .
Canucks fans screaming for RHD . . . Never satisfied. Period.
Bandwagon fans at the finest (exclude the good majority who stay quiet). They’re as disgusted with Canucks media as much as I am, I’m sure of it. They’re just too nice of Canadians to say so!
I understand the add, however the timing for the Canucks seems a bit odd. Especially when the Canucks need to get their own 1st Round Pick higher.
You gotta give to get
I usually agree with Donnie, but not this time. We have been craving for a bonified top 4 D-man and when we finally get it, we aren't happy? These kind of players don't come cheap. Instead, we want to take our chances with drafting a kid in the 13-16 spot who may or may not pan out sometime 2-3 years later or longer? I wonder whether Petersson, Hughes, Demko and Kuzmenko are willing to wait that long. I think this is a good move. Bo Horvat and 2nd round pick for Hronek, Beauvilier, Raty and 4th round pick is a fair return. This is called retooling.
Retooling the retool of the retool. This is what the Canucks have been doing for ten years. It has made them a bottom team in the NHL that whole time just a bit above Arizona and Maybe Ottawa for the worst team in the league the last decade.
lol - Is Loui Eriksson available, I wanna know! (had me laughing)
I think I'm alone here but I like the deal. The 1st rounder wasn't OURS, it was yhe Islanders. Just look at the Canucks d pairings after the last game. 2 of the 6 defenceman were NHL regulars
You're not alone
I feel for You and I feel wIth You. To 1000 percent.
Louis Ericsson, that was cold, Arctic cold
Does someone need the tax write off as in the team success or ?
This trade epitomizes the difference between a winner franchise and a franchise that will be forever losers.
No
The best way to put it, is that the wings are currently the better team and are the team that should make the playoffs before the canucks. And Yzerman and ownership seen that they dropped two games back to back they decided to sell and gather drafts picks.
Canucks ownership no we are close. get rid of the draft picks that we got.
Absolutely the worst trade you can do. Hronek is a good player but not worth a 1st and 2nd
He's absolutely worth that, timing of trade? Different question
idk, Craig button likes it, he's usually right. he was right about Tyler Myers.
Why was Hronek available? For the same reason why you are complaining about the trade from Vancouver's point of view. Those two picks are a great return. Besides, what Steve saw in the back-to-back Ottawa games reinforced his belief that Detroit is not ready. They are looking at a window around the young core rather than the 25 year olds.
Also, Yzerman is selling high. It is not obvious that Hronek will have more seasons like 22-23. This is his first really good season.
🎶and they do it all over again. There shall be no change. Canucks are the wiping mat of the west
what i'ld like to see is when you have ALLVIN on your program, you tell him he has no clue what he's doing? tell him your concerns that you tell us, but kiss his butt when you have him on air.
This doesn't bode well for free agency. I feel like that's when the retool will really take off.