All I gotta say is this, years ago I was deep into bandage into sin. Pornography was a daily part of my life I would literally watch it every single time I got a chance, but when I was brought awareness of my sins the thing I loved the most, was like the worst possible forms of torture I would literally beg and try to bargain with God. " I will never do it again don't send me to hell. I battled with it for 10 years for all those years of me trying to stop myself it felt with each time I did it I would feel like I was inching closer and closer to hell. You know what caused me to stop? Asking him to do it something that took me years to do he did in exactly 1 day. One day I woke up and the craving and urge to watch it is gone. Now that I am free you can literally not pay me to watch that stuff. And I hope it stays this way by his grace because I couldn't free myself and I wouldn't want to be a slave to it ever again
According to this video, it was God’s will, and predetermination for you to get into pornography like that for some reason. That’s what this man’s teaching.
When I tell people God chooses His people like Jesus chose the disciples they think i'm being arrogant as if i'm "special". On the contrary, knowing full well God chose me, it woke up a reverence in me that makes me fearfully humble and grateful to Him for the rest of my life. WHO am i? i'm nothing!! Without divine intervention I could still be out there among the spiritually living dead. I have nothing to offer Jesus but a broken heart as a result of my sin. That's why we pray non-stop for the lost (2 Timothy 2:25)
Well even though you're right I think you're arrogant. But that's the difference between what you're saying and seeing that they are chosen. That doesn't mean you're wrong it just comes off as arrogant.
I was once blind but now I see Amen, we have no righteousness of our own, Christ is our righteousness. Forever grateful but it’s not a licence to sin.👍🙏❤️🙌
Michael Rey that’s what I’m thinking. God has the power to save like he did us but why preach the gospel to them if they won’t hear? All will be answered eventually
@@dirkdookies6418 I think He uses us as an instrument to accomplish His will and plant the seed. He waters while we just plant seed. I'm struggling to understand this too. I read Romans 9 and a lot changed for me
U thank God for giving u life & u also thank God for giving animals life for u to take their lives away & eat them. U thank God for choosing u to recover from illness & ignoring many dead patients. Are u unable to realize how religion uses an imaginary God to fool u into feeling special by exploiting your hypocrisy narcissism gullibility arrogance, ignorance, & intellectual dishonesty? No offense.
John Piper is a blessed man. His 'words for each context' are so precious and I believe they are driven by the 'Voice of Holy Spirit'. Thank you for the broadcast.
"I was once blind but now I see" - I'm right there with you. That part of an old gospel song I thought was about someone who didn't know Jesus at all. But, the line applies to me in a different way. I've always known Jesus, but thought it was I who did what was necessary to grow spiritually. Then, my eyes were opened to see that it was and is God through His Holy Spirit who is growing me. I am merely a recipient of His good graces in His working in my life.
I have been studying the Bible for a long time now and have been listening to the late RC Sproul, John MacArthur, Steve Lawson, the late Dave Pawson, Skip Heizig and to this podcast of John Piper and I must say there is unanimity in what they teach and in the major doctrines of sin, salvation,God’s sovereignty and this 7 points exegetically sourced from the Bible is an excellent and inspired summary of the seemingly difficult and irreconcilable teachings in the Bible🤔😊 Thank you Pastor John for neatly collating them all for us all😊 I studied Hermeneutics myself and I must confirm you are spot on😊Glory to God🙏😇😍
A Spirit born child of God LOVES to make decisions based on God's Word. It gives me great JOY. "It is GOD that works IN you both to WILL and to DO of His good pleasure". Thank you Lord for your grace and letting me be a part of this mystery of the kingdom of God.
I don't fully agree with John's interpretation of God's sovereignty but I appreciate it. I know that sounds contradictory but every once in a while I listen to him for encouragement; i.e. God reminds me of just how much He is in control of my life when I listen to John. And I can see it as I reflect on 41 years of being a believer.
If l, as a parent, don't interfere with my child's decision making process when l see it's leading to disaster, not only would l be a terrible parent, It would prove l don't love him or her. Do unto others as you would have them do unto you! Light the way to those in the dark so they won't trip and fall! God, as a leader, provider, lover and protector of our souls should ALWAYS be a mayor and ACCESIBLE factor in influencing our decision making. "In all your ways acknowledge Him and He shall direct your paths". Every thought under the obedience of Christ. "and the LIGHT OF LIFE will flood your path" So, the strongholds of the god of this world must be broken over us so we can be open to receive the NEW nature given by GOD in order to be able to respond to HIM adequately!
The Holy Spirit transforms us...and by seeing the goodness and beauty of our Lord Jesus Christ, we can experience that compelling, savory sovereignty of God that leads our will to the will and heart of God. Correct?
Forced love, is not love! We must go to him freely, with no assumptions of our rewards. Our Father is Flawless!❤❤❤🙏🙏 Complete in his Holiness!❤❤ UNMEASURABLE IS HIS LOVE!😊😊😊😊
Yes! Forced love is not love! Every true Christian should love god by their own willingness. The question is, if the holy spirit does not work within someone, how could they be awaken to truly love god? If you said "forced" , well i said it is a grace that god love us so much, thus god "WORK" all things so we could loves and obey him by our own willingness!!
@@BELA_NUS through tribulation and prayer we see that he wants the best for us, and after our attempts to fill the void left from our separation from him, through sin and materialistic lifestyles, the lucky one's come back to his understanding, and want to obey him. God bless, your journey!❤🙏
"mystery" or "can't fully understand until heaven" are euphemisms to dodge a blatant logical contradiction. Piper's embrace of compatibilism/determinism has led me to describe him as a pyper-calvinist (play on words with hyper-calvinist).
John Piper is a blessed man, no doubts about it. But let me sum up in a couple of lines his 11 minutes: We are responsible for the desires and decisions which God decides to come into our hearts and minds.
@@chessic4 Don't care about it, you don't have to. The unpleasant side of calvinistic view (calvinists never talk about) is: God foresees the fall into sin for all mankind in his plan (so it is inevitable). God foresees NO decision for Christ for the majority of people. God condemnes this majority to eternal death for THEIR sin, as consequence of THEIR unbelief in Christ. The good news: God reveals himself in the Bible in quite another way.
Points in the biblical view of the relationship between the human will and God's sovereignty. 1. Until they are born again by the power of God's Spirit, all human beings ever since Adam are spiritually blind, darkened in their understanding, hardened in their hearts, unable to grasp spiritual truth, rebellious against God, spiritually dead in trespasses, enslaved to sin, unable to please God. 2. All people are still responsible in that condition - accountable to God, liable to judgment, because this darkness that they are in; this slavery that holds them, has its power over them. Not against their will or against their desires, but precisely because of their will and because of their desires, they love sin so much. This is not a bondage against their will, it is a bondage because of their will. 3. This does not limit the complete sovereignty of God over everything. God is in control of the fallen will of man. 4. By the work of the Holy Spirit, God replaces blindness with reality. He sets people free. The slavery to God is not the same as the slavery to sin. 5. This new slavery to God is true freedom for 3 reasons: first, like slavery to sin, it is completely willing. Second, the new desires - unlike the desires to sin - accord with what is true and beautiful and lasting; God's righteousness, God's way. Third, this new slavery to God is true freedom because our former, so-called freedom ended in everlasting death, and our new slavery to God ends in eternal joy. 6. This new freedom does not limit the complete sovereignty of God, including the redeemed human will. God is working in us through Jesus Christ. This doesn't mean we can't grieve the Spirit, but it does mean that God lets Himself be grieved for His purpose, which will always come to pass. God is still sovereign over our wills. 7. Nevertheless, God's way of ruling the redeemed will not compromise our responsibility or nullify the true freedom. How can this be? There is a glimpse of how it might be in 2 Corinthians 3:17-18. Where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is freedom. When the Spirit of God transforms us to God's will, to love it and conform to it, and thus reflect the glory of God, this is true freedom because it is happening through beholding the glory of the Lord.
He understands the narratives and paradigms of each soul to a complete Perfect Degree perfectly. Which means he knows exactly what people will do and why they will do what they do according to the perspectives that people have. He allows it like a Game of Dominos for his Purpose, The Calvinist actually have kept a lot of Facts concerning his Philosophy.
There are two ways to look at God's salvation. From the responsible man after Adam's side by reading Romans in the New Testament. The other is God's side which is reading Ephesians. To understand one without the other will lead to a lot of false teaching and misunderstanding of salvation. To answer the question, there is a saying, 'You can lead a horse to the water, but you cannot make it drink'. The horse is responsible for the final act. It is the same with salvation, the final act is man's responsibility. But without God's side it will never happen.
The calling of God (our spirit rebirth/born again/justified) is not our choice but His IAW Romans 8.29/30. What we do with it afterward is our choice whether to grow in the given faith towards sanctification or be carnal. The choice is entrance into the Kingdom of God or not, not heaven itself.
@@johnhoffman8203, Piper actually discusses this in his video about Arminianism vs Calvinism, you should check it out. But I'm persuaded, that yes God never forces us to accept him, but he has made himself so irresistible when he shines the light of the glory of Jesus (2 Cor. 4:4) to us, that we can't but bend our knees to him. I believe it is God who saves us all the way, and even in a divine sense keeps us from stumbling (Jude 24-25).
@@lincolnf.4383 We are not saying the same thing. God's calling/justification/rebirth is His alone IAW Romans 9 and is without repentance and we can not resist His calling by design. Receive it because it frees you to believe that you are truly saved by his grace without works and cant loose it because His word is true per Is 55.10/11. This is not about our sanctimonious guilt because the real choice lies in sanctification to complete the salvation process and this is OUR choice, to be Spirit lead or a carnal christian. The result is loss of the inheritance/eternal (age lasting) life/hope/KOG/millennial reign for those carnal believers.
Seeing this question blew my mind. This is a problem with humans and the humanist today. They feel as if our rights and our powers and our choices can override God how does he not violate us? Wow wow wow wow that’s all I can say wow maybe it’s just the wording thatI can’t fathom and maybe the question could’ve been thought of differently and maybe I’m taking it wrong. Wow. We’re not even worthy to speak of his name , Praise God, for his great prominent mercy for his grace that exceeds everything, for he first loved his children and looked after us guided us he saw to the very day of salvation for us the day he saved us. We live now to serve the great Almighty Lord, for my will, for my will, is your real. I will do what you will give me, the ability Lord to do as you ask oh Lord, give me the grace I need to walk with you. Oh Lord, praise your holy name ALL GLORY TO GOD!!!
After listening to the show , I see I was wrong and took the question incorrectly by just the reading and initially hearing it , this fella was genuinely asking a question while being drawn by God and seeking GODS TRUTH PRAISE GOD!
Seven key points presented to explain the relationship between human will and God's sovereignty: 1. Unregenerate humanity is spiritually blind, rebellious, and enslaved to sin. 2. Humans are accountable despite their fallen condition; they love darkness. 3. God's complete sovereignty is not limited by human fallenness; He directs even pagan kings' hearts. 4. God's regenerating work through the Holy Spirit replaces spiritual blindness with light, freeing individuals from sin's bondage. 5. New slavery to God is true freedom because of willing alignment with God's righteousness and eternal joy. 6. This new freedom doesn't diminish God's sovereignty; He continues to work in redeemed individuals. 7. The transformation of the redeemed will by the Holy Spirit doesn't nullify human responsibility or freedom, seen in the concept of beholding the glory of the Lord. The discussion delves into the interaction between God's sovereignty and human free will, highlighting the concepts of regeneration, spiritual transformation, and the role of the Holy Spirit in shaping human desires and decisions.
5:35 ive been thinking about this myself and ive come to the conclusion that we as humans have the power to choose because god gave us free will but we DO NOT HAVE THE POWER TO CONTROL THE CONSEQUENCES OF THOSE ACTIONS so we have control over the choices BUT only god has control over the consequences that follow those choices and those consequences will either be death or eternal life.
This question can be answered by the "God-Eternity-Time diagram". God knows everything past, present, and future, but we do not. Since we do not know what He has predestined, we are fully responsible for all our decisions. When we make decisions, we do so freely in time, while God predestines it in eternity. As an illustration: we cannot blame God for making us choose Option A when there are Options A, B, and C, etc available, and we do not know what God has predestined about our final decision. When we choose Option A, we do so freely in time, while God predestines it in eternity.
Did God create me spiritually blind and hardened in my heart, unable to grasp spiritual truth, rebellious against God, spiritually dead in tresspasses, enslaved to sin, and unable to please God? Where does my desire to love sin so much come from? According to your teaching, I was born with original sin because of choices Adam made. I had no hope from the very beginning. I was born with a sin nature. There was nothing I could do to save myself from it. I was stamped at birth. And the only way out is for God to reach down, take out my heart of stone and give me a heart of flesh - He makes that decision - yet I am responsible if He chooses not to change my heart. How is this just? He causes all of this to happen - the fall of man all the way down to salvation through Christ - it all had to happen in order for HIs will to be accomplished. If God's will is always accomplished, He'd have to control man to carry out His will - and some He uses for good, and some He uses for bad. I just don't understand what hope man has then. He is stamped at birth - unto Heaven or eternal damnation. So I ask then, what must I do to be saved? If there is nothing I can do, then there is no hope for me. I am at the mercy of God to decide if He wants to save me or not. And let me preface this to say, I was raised Catholic and in my early twenties attended a Baptist Church and believe I was born again - I saw myself clearly as a sinner and understood I could never save myself. I have fallen on my face before God many times in the thirty years since - knowing my dapravity before Him. I am now 57 and have for many years begun to question the things I read in the Bible and what I experience in life - especially witnessing the intense suffering of people I love. I want to understand and find the answers. I want to trust God and love Him with complete abandonement, but when I listen to answers such as this and sermones on predestination and devine election, I no longer see a loving God. I'm beginning to wonder if perhaps I am not one of His elect and my life of faith was just wishful thinking.
You will say to me then, “Why does he still find fault? For who can resist his will?” But who are you, O man, to answer back to God? Will what is molded say to its molder, “Why have you made me like this?” Has the potter no right over the clay, to make out of the same lump one vessel for honorable use and another for dishonorable use? What if God, desiring to show his wrath and to make known his power, has endured with much patience vessels of wrath prepared for destruction, in order to make known the riches of his glory for vessels of mercy, which he has prepared beforehand for glory Romans 9 :19-23
None is righteous, no, not one; no one understands; no one seeks for God. All have turned aside; together they have become worthless; no one does good, not even one.” Romans 3:10 Therefore, just as sin came into the world through one man, and death through sin, and so death spread to all men because all sinned- Roman's 5:12 but God shows his love for us in that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us. Since, therefore, we have now been justified by his blood, much more shall we be saved by him from the wrath of God. For if while we were enemies we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, now that we are reconciled, shall we be saved by his life. Romans 5: 8 So then it depends not on human will or exertion, but on God, who has mercy. For the Scripture says to Pharaoh, “For this very purpose I have raised you up, that I might show my power in you, and that my name might be proclaimed in all the earth.” So then he has mercy on whomever he wills, and he hardens whomever he wills. Romans 9: 16-18 The understanding of the Lord is infinite. Psalms147:5
Such a complicated topic. The last 2 years really raised some questions. On the one hand, Christian's went along with and were silent, on what their rulers were doing because ultimately God was still in control. On the other hand they were also silent in allowing the rulers to violate other's consciences. You can really see now how the mark of the beast system will work and how even the elect will accept it if God doesn't first remove them because "love your neighbour" has been perverted now, just like the covenant of marriage was.
While the author authored the whole story, the characters in the story can't blame the author for their action. The same way we in His story, can't blame God for our action.
@shikyokira3065 in your analogy, God is the author, right? As the author, he knows the beginning and the end, and he controls how everything turns out. But why does he blame man for sinning?
The Holy Spirit inspires, guides, gives mercy ect but doesn’t force you. It’s just giving you a push towards a direction not forcing you to it step by step.
@AVB2 Human to human interaction can’t be compared to a God to human interaction. Nature takes it course. In your scenario while tragic it would be part of Gods plan. Read the book of Job.
@AVB2 I didn’t mean literally. I meant the nature of humans. But yes technically he controls actual nature and anything he wants including us, but then we would just be like robots and he gave us free will to choose a path he lays out, or not. Like Adam and Eve or Lucifer, they chose their own path.
@AVB2 That’s not at all what I said. You yourself just said God gave Jesus a task to do. Jesus followed it. Giving you a task implies the choice to not follow it, forcing you to do something would make giving a task pointless. God didn’t control Jesus, Jesus followed his Father’s task as a perfect son. Has God ever controlled someone would be a better question. That answer would be yes, like the king of the Egyptians, he told Moses to tell the king to let his people go, but he decided to make the King stubborn so he would refuse in order to show his might to the Egyptians.
So basically God knows exactly what to do or NOT to do in order to motivate us in a way that we “back the decision’s” but they end up being the ones that God knew/knows we need to make to complete our best journey possible?
You either make a decision in the flesh which is usually base or sinful. You can make a decision in your soul which can be passionate either for good or evil depending on the presence of the Spirit. A decision in the Spirit is always divine or in line with the perfection and Divine. The difference that His Spirit makes in Our life is that He gives us the freedom to do right. Are you free from the consequences of stealing food because you are hungry. Don’t you know if you fast the hunger leaves. He does provide. I will say that deciding to fast and lacking food are two completely different things.
✟ Give not that which is holy unto the dogs, neither cast ye your pearls before swine, lest they trample them under their feet, and turn again and rend you. Matthew 7:6 (KJV) No His sovereignty doesn't violate our decision making.
My soul griefs from my falling and my will and mind are weak I what to be with the lord again but the worldly desires of my life are like chains I from the bottom of earth And up above I see Heaven in all of its glory mind sways me and I cant do anything about it, I am scared that I may not be chosen I and weak And will most likely go to hell But I just wish I knew what to do
I’m in the same boat. I’m broken over all my sins and grieve over them. I’ve been praying fasting reading the word etc to seek after Him and it’s breaking me more
Like everything else there's a ditch on both sides of the narrow path. GOD is sovereign over HIS sovereignty. We shouldn't assign things beyond what we understand. If the bible says there are free will offerings then there's free will. How HE dispenses or allows oir free will is a mystery. The closest I go to explain it is HE is almighty, not only everywhere but HE is also everywhen. HE is alpha and omega, alef and tav, the beginning and the end. Trying ro define HIS devine nature is a fools errand. My son, beware of anything beyond these. Of making many books there is no end, and much study is a weariness of the flesh. The end of the matter; all has been heard. Fear God and keep his commandments, for this is the whole duty of man. Ecclesiastes 12:12-13 ESV
To me it’s rather simple….God is fully sovereign but when he made man, He (God) chose to limit His sovereignty when He gave man the first spoken and written promises to distinguish Himself from all other god’s who man create who are “capricious”. Therefore God sovereignly created man with freewill to choose in receiving or rejecting His promises because it declares that “whatsoever a man soweth he shall also reap” good or bad. In this God does not violate His main attribute of Love over a fallen creation who is given the opportunity to redeem themselves to their creator.
The old philosophical question of " free " will versus determinism. Only small and uninformed minds see a contradiction in that dichotomy. The world we inhabit has a dual nature. It's not only possible that God's sovereignty doesn't violate our decision making. It's an absolute fact the two must exist side by side. Our decision making freedom is not total. It's partial and very limited. That isn't a newsflash. All who consider the problem must realize it.
Excuse me but this should be titled "how does our decision making not violate Gods Sovereignty" because the last time i checked God doesnt do anything outta violation.
When you raise a child you are constantly “violating their decision making”, because they are immature, naive and ill prepared for the challenges of the world that face them. Children of God need guidance from God in the same way so as to walk in the maturity He intends for them to walk in. Colossians 3:14 KJVS [14] And above all these things put on charity, which is the bond of perfectness. Hebrews 5:13-14 KJVS [13] For every one that useth milk is unskilful in the word of righteousness: for he is a babe. [14] But strong meat belongeth to them that are of full age, even those who by reason of use have their senses exercised to discern both good and evil. God exercises (violates) sons of God in their decision making to bring them to maturity, bring them to righteousness. Hebrews 12:6-11 KJVS [6] For whom the Lord loveth he chasteneth, and scourgeth every son whom he receiveth. [7] If ye endure chastening, God dealeth with you as with sons; for what son is he whom the father chasteneth not? [8] But if ye be without chastisement, whereof all are partakers, then are ye bastards, and not sons. [9] Furthermore we have had fathers of our flesh which corrected us , and we gave them reverence: shall we not much rather be in subjection unto the Father of spirits, and live? [10] For they verily for a few days chastened us after their own pleasure; but he for our profit, that we might be partakers of his holiness. [11] Now no chastening for the present seemeth to be joyous, but grievous: nevertheless afterward it yieldeth the peaceable fruit of righteousness unto them which are exercised thereby. And if God doing so offends you in some fashion? If you think he has not the right to do so? You completely fail to understand the power God has over His creation. Romans 9:19-24 KJVS [19] Thou wilt say then unto me, Why doth he yet find fault? For who hath resisted his will? [20] Nay but, O man, who art thou that repliest against God? Shall the thing formed say to him that formed it , Why hast thou made me thus? [21] Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishonour? [22] What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction: [23] And that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy, which he had afore prepared unto glory, [24] Even us, whom he hath called, not of the Jews only, but also of the Gentiles? www.justifiedfreely.com
Luke Wagner parents don’t effectually change their kids’ wills as God is claimed to by Calvinism. They incentivize with positive and negative incentives in response to their freely-willed actions. Regarding the potter, I refer you to a small book called The Potter’s Promise.
Galatians 4:7 (No longer slave(s) but son(s)...) New King James Version Therefore you are no longer a slave but a son, and if a son, then an heir of God through Christ.
I guess in hindsight, we look back and see that whatever took place must’ve been GOD‘s will. Is that correct? So when I made a decision that ended in loss of my finances and falling into depression and drug abuse, I want to know why God would will that for my life? I am very angry with myself for not staying where I was, but that loss of income made me get so depressed let down a very dark path. I just wanna know why.
At first he says that we were willfull slaves to sin and we desired it.. but then a little later he stated that when we are slaves to God we are truly free because we truly desire God contrary to when we were unwillfull slaves to sin. He contradicts himself by saying that we are willfull slaves to sin and we desire it in the first statement and then by saying the contrary in the second one..
Not at all! We ARE slaves to sin! But when we "walk in the Spirit" we ARE, by GOD'S strength, freed from the bondage (slavery) of sin. But "Apart from HIM, we can do nothing" (John 15:5) and we remain in sin (slavery, bondage)
I pondered this for a while and tried to think simply about life and death. We can willfully choose to live and be in control of our lives, yet God still has ultimate control because we can get struck by lighting. Does me getting struck by lighting take away my free will? No, because I could’ve chosen not to go outside, yet then God could choose to send a meteor or tornado. I guess another analogy could be this. I chose to stand up or sit down, those are my choices, I’m free to chose either, but God is ultimately in control because without Him those wouldn’t be choices in the first place. Let me know what you guys think?
Free will, from a practical standpoint, is an illusion. If God is real, you really have no choice but to follow unless you see choosing eternal damnation as a legitimate option. God doesn't want us to serve out of fear or "mandate." God wants us to do so because we want a relationship with Him. To that end, God deprives us of absolute proof of His existence. This allows us to doubt and disbelieve because we don't choose Him. When nonbelievers and skeptics want to argue, "If God is real, why does ______ happen?", they ignore the whole point of free will. For God to actively intervene on every act of evil or sorrow, He would be taking away our free will. God's actions would prove He exists, making disobedience a non-viable option. You can't have God protecting the world from ALL evil AND have free will.
There is plenty of sin in Hell, yet people still practice sin in Hell... What did Jeremiah say about the heart of the spiritually dead??? He said that it is desperately wicked, who can fathom it?
I absolutely love that God is sovereign over everything.....but does that mean He determines everything...I've heard the "not one rogue molecule" and "dust particle" illustrations that Dr. Piper and RC have used, but if I make a typing mistake in this comment and have to correct it ...was that really ordained of God ? How far does we carry this ?
I have no doubt Mr. Piper is sincere in the expression of his passion. I also have no doubt he's sincerely blind to the truth of the gospel. What he's saying is preposterous at best violating all notions of common sense.
No to both questions. They were in innocence but were subject to obedience. They then were deceived by Satan who made them doubt God's motives and this led them to disobedience. Foreknowledge is not predestination.
@@smeatonlighthouse4384 When God created Satan, He knew that satan would eventually deceive Eve. So through divine foreknowledge and actively creating Satan, Eve was forced to be deceived and could not have chosen to not eat of the fruit. There is no way for God's foreknowledge to be wrong. Predestination must be true.
Piper doesn’t know it that every time he speaks he’s just like us he can sound just as arrogant and has a problem with his ego. Because people are trying to be perfect like god god doesn’t have to worry about getting any ailments.
God determined the end from the beginning and is all powerful. If He didn't want us to desire sin He would have made us so otherwise you're saying He's not all powerful.
Can a god of all knowledge not figure out how to bring about everything and not force our will and minds is anything impossible for god so how does he do it exactly who fully knows god's mind
For a Christian, the Judgment Seat of Christ and the Great White Throne Judgment would be farces if "free will to choose" was not true. Think on these things:. how could souls be judged and held responsible if they were predestined without free will? Is that just?.
There are many free will theories. This thread could use a lot more clarity around what specific theory of free will people are saying we do or do not have. For example, below is a classic Reformed treatment of free will. You'll see that it affirms free will, but it excludes some particular theories like libertarian free will, and instead affirms a form of theistic compatibilism. Westminster Confession of Faith Chapter 9 - Of Free Will I. God has endued the will of man with that natural liberty, that is neither forced, nor, by any absolute necessity of nature, determined good, or evil. Chapter 3 - Of God's Eternal Decree I. God from all eternity, did, by the most wise and holy counsel of His own will, freely, and unchangeably ordain whatsoever comes to pass; yet so, as thereby neither is God the author of sin, _nor is violence offered to the will of the creatures;_ nor is the _liberty_ or contingency of second causes taken away, but rather established.
God does not refuse anyone who sincerely repents and turns to him. If we look at Judas, he had many opportunities to repent to Jesus for stealing from the poor or betraying the Lord. Judas chose on his own free will to let his own interests be at the centre of his life instead of submitting to God. At the end of Judas' life he does not blame God for his discussions, rather he says "I have betrayed an innocent man". If Judas had been forced by God against his will he would have been bitter with God, instead he was ashamed and grieved by his own choices.
Yeah I understand you but the thing is when unfair and suffering things happen you still hold your head up high and wear those wounds scars and cross with pride and grace
If God works all things after the council of his own will from ancient times to everything not yet done he controls your decision making, he controlled what Judas did!
God is sovereign but he’s made it so we still have free will. I don’t know how he does it but it works. Not everything is understood but we have to trust in God
That's funny because I have been being a superposition of being born again or not. And that isn't something that anyone can check. (E.g. Schrodinger's cat) But I definitely see things that are spiritual. And I definitely know that the Father loves me. But the problem I have is that being born again the Holy Spirit would have to have sinned (blasphemy) and not then it would not be save(I'm still working on how the holy spirit in the form like a man is supposed to be Christian and be under the word since you all seem to think.) As far as free will? It's a tough subject. I have willed that people kill themselves because I dislike them and they have.
First of all I have to say nobody loves the darkness if you stop and look at it how would anyone of us in this whole entire world or even universe for that matter grow if all we did was never send second of all there's no sin God has sent us here to make these mistakes and to learn and to grow and to become better people if we do not make mistakes and do wrong we will never become better people and we will continue to stay the same every day you're only bondage in this world is hearing and listening to what you are saying right now these are the kinds of things that keep us as a human being down it makes us feel bad for anything that we do that everybody else considers wrong there is no right and there is no rum and when you find out right and wrong you have got to find it out for yourself within yourself otherwise who is to say who's right and who's wrong what kind of God would give us nothing but choice in our lives that is our biggest gift other than love that we have why on Earth are we given a rulebook to go by if we're giving choice God would prefer for us to find out the answers to everything on our own instead of following the next the next part of the person before us life is about making good or bad choices this is what he asks of us it is not to stay grounded and to stay in this bondage as you speak I am so passionate about this I used to believe everything that you were saying I believed in it from a a child however as I've gotten older and have become more spiritual I have learned that God walks with us not above us God wants nothing but for us to be happy and to learn love there is no way to learn love living the way you speak because all we will ever do in life is regret everything we've ever done all we will ever do is keep ourselves in this bondage as you call it now we all know that God speaks to everybody so if you do not believe me and what I say right now what I ask of you all of you all of you is to ask the big guy girl himself all I ask I do not under any circumstances believe that my loving God would ever contradict himself in the Bible by saying Val shalt not kill in the Ten Commandments and then say unless I tell you to Dad is not a loving God God in the Bible is ridiculous my God does nothing but love me no matter what I do it doesn't give me permission to go out and do stupid stuff that doesn't give me permission to go out and hurt people but what it does do is give me permission to make mistakes and be able to grow instead of be stuck in this crazy bondage that you speak of
You know absolutely nothing of Gods word. You are walking in darkness. I do not say this to hurt you but to warn you. You must be born again. You cannot disagree with God and be His child. Repent and seek Him and His righteousness.
Becky- maybe you love your sin more than you love God. Please pick up your Bible and read. Jesus calls you to repent and trust in Him. And in the future, please use punctuation as your opinion was very difficult to understand without it. :)
Dream 2017 I had a dream a few years ago about this water coming across the United States..... It was crazy. No more Florida. Most of Georgia, Alabama, the east coast..... Gone..... The water came up to the Foothills of the mountains In North Alabama. It is coming by attack.... I keep getting China and Russia doing the attacking nuclear and conventional.......I also saw an asteroid hitting the Atlantic ocean off the northwest coast of Africa. It will be a dreadful thing. Both of these things brings wave after wave across the Atlantic to our coast here in America. It's over.... We have been judged. Amen If you don't know Jesus, you better repent and get to know Him. It's now or never. Amen
People have free will. God doesn't even know your name or that the earth exists. God provides personality to all beings but it is not a two way street. Nothing you do gets back to God because that is not what God wants. He does not want to experience a confused, ignorant, primitive life. He wants to experience love. That's what it's all about. God also wants His children to gain a personality. That is why you exist. The OT passages that you quoted mean this: People have no value to the universe until your soul chooses to keep you. Then the doors open and you can ascend and other ascended beings will teach you the truth.
No one loves darkness, they love themselves. The universe rejects selfishness.
If God is sovereign over people's free will, then why is there sin in the world?.... Couldn't He spared us all this trouble by having all people be born in Eden in perfection?
True freedom is not feeling good doing good, nor or doing sin, because both of those imply you didn't choose what you like doing. You're still a slave to something, either sin or righteousness. True freedom is being a slave to nothing, being able to choose for real and having free will, not having your free will determined by someone else, that's programming.
@Ben Jones You're right, but it's even possible to fall away once you have tasted the spiritual gifts like speaking in tongues and have the full presence of the Holy Spirit. Which means true freedom goes beyond anything, like Christ gives you freedom, but you have a higher freedom that lets you reject freedom itself, even when you had a glimpse of the full experience of it. And it's possible to go against your desires, and even to act irrationally, and do the most evil thing for absolutely no reason or the best thing for no reason, we can choose to make no sense in what we do and have a backwards logic, or make sense. But Christ and the Holy Spirit help us choose the right thing and make us more spiritually aware of what we are doing with love. But it also says the Lord puts things into people's herats and so does the devil so freedom isn't 100% of the time, unless it's possible to reject thoughts put into your heart.
Well I don't think God's sovereignty violates I do think that a nation's does that satan does.. and that the Lord is prepared to judge people who listen to satan and decide to accuse His people and violate His people into sin. Indeed they even listen to satan in the scripture and try to use it to pull people away from the Lord away from following Him and to lead lives of sin. In listening to Satan they call on to do that even the Lord's Name.
GOD'S WILL TO TURN MAN'S SINFUL WILL AROUND MAY ONLY BE DONE BY GOD'S HOLY SPIRIT BY CHRIST ALONE !! TILL THE HOLY SPIRIT ENTER MAN'S HEART BY FAITH IN CHRIST---YOUR HUMAN WILL TENDS ONLY TO MORE SIN AND PRIDE TOWARDS A RIGHTEOUS CREATOR !!
All I gotta say is this, years ago I was deep into bandage into sin. Pornography was a daily part of my life I would literally watch it every single time I got a chance, but when I was brought awareness of my sins the thing I loved the most, was like the worst possible forms of torture I would literally beg and try to bargain with God. " I will never do it again don't send me to hell. I battled with it for 10 years for all those years of me trying to stop myself it felt with each time I did it I would feel like I was inching closer and closer to hell. You know what caused me to stop? Asking him to do it something that took me years to do he did in exactly 1 day. One day I woke up and the craving and urge to watch it is gone. Now that I am free you can literally not pay me to watch that stuff. And I hope it stays this way by his grace because I couldn't free myself and I wouldn't want to be a slave to it ever again
Thanks for your sharing bro. Really appreciate your experience fighting that sin. I could only said, our god mercy is deeper than our transgression.
According to this video, it was God’s will, and predetermination for you to get into pornography like that for some reason. That’s what this man’s teaching.
When I tell people God chooses His people like Jesus chose the disciples they think i'm being arrogant as if i'm "special". On the contrary, knowing full well God chose me, it woke up a reverence in me that makes me fearfully humble and grateful to Him for the rest of my life. WHO am i? i'm nothing!! Without divine intervention I could still be out there among the spiritually living dead. I have nothing to offer Jesus but a broken heart as a result of my sin. That's why we pray non-stop for the lost (2 Timothy 2:25)
Well even though you're right I think you're arrogant. But that's the difference between what you're saying and seeing that they are chosen. That doesn't mean you're wrong it just comes off as arrogant.
I was once blind but now I see
Amen, we have no righteousness of our own, Christ is our righteousness.
Forever grateful but it’s not a licence to sin.👍🙏❤️🙌
Michael Rey that’s what I’m thinking. God has the power to save like he did us but why preach the gospel to them if they won’t hear? All will be answered eventually
@@dirkdookies6418 I think He uses us as an instrument to accomplish His will and plant the seed. He waters while we just plant seed. I'm struggling to understand this too. I read Romans 9 and a lot changed for me
U thank God for giving u life & u also thank God for giving animals life for u to take their lives away & eat them. U thank God for choosing u to recover from illness & ignoring many dead patients. Are u unable to realize how religion uses an imaginary God to fool u into feeling special by exploiting your hypocrisy narcissism gullibility arrogance, ignorance, & intellectual dishonesty? No offense.
This reminds me of how unworthy I truly am, and how merciful God in Christ truly is! Again I declare freely; “I’m not Worthy.”
Me too.
You are the righteousness of God in Christ. No longer unworthy.
I believe in Jesus Christ as my Lord and Savior! He saved a wretch like me! I am eternally grateful!!!
You’re no longer a wretch. You are the righteousness of God in Christ.
John Piper is a blessed man. His 'words for each context' are so precious and I believe they are driven by the 'Voice of Holy Spirit'.
Thank you for the broadcast.
"I was once blind but now I see" - I'm right there with you. That part of an old gospel song I thought was about someone who didn't know Jesus at all. But, the line applies to me in a different way. I've always known Jesus, but thought it was I who did what was necessary to grow spiritually. Then, my eyes were opened to see that it was and is God through His Holy Spirit who is growing me. I am merely a recipient of His good graces in His working in my life.
Well said
I have been studying the Bible for a long time now and have been listening to the late RC Sproul, John MacArthur, Steve Lawson, the late Dave Pawson, Skip Heizig and to this podcast of John Piper and I must say there is unanimity in what they teach and in the major doctrines of sin, salvation,God’s sovereignty and this 7 points exegetically sourced from the Bible is an excellent and inspired summary of the seemingly difficult and irreconcilable teachings in the Bible🤔😊
Thank you Pastor John for neatly collating them all for us all😊 I studied Hermeneutics myself and I must confirm you are spot on😊Glory to God🙏😇😍
A Spirit born child of God LOVES to make decisions based on God's Word. It gives me great JOY. "It is GOD that works IN you both to WILL and to DO of His good pleasure". Thank you Lord for your grace and letting me be a part of this mystery of the kingdom of God.
Thanking God! All glory to God in Christ Jesus! Thank you and God bless you Pastor John Piper.
I don't fully agree with John's interpretation of God's sovereignty but I appreciate it. I know that sounds contradictory but every once in a while I listen to him for encouragement; i.e. God reminds me of just how much He is in control of my life when I listen to John. And I can see it as I reflect on 41 years of being a believer.
"In Me you live and move and have your Being" Acts 17:28. ❤
Thank you Pastor John for this truth spoken.
Pastor John is always so enlightening
Such wisdom and clarity on this matter. Thank you.
Thank you. May God bless you.
How beautifully You quote scripture ❤️❤️❤️❤️🥺
Because every free will decisions come from our INTENTIONS ( silently from our heart ♥️) God can read our hearts at anytime
But if He doesn’t give you the Holy Spirit then automatically the heart won’t be pure. This is so frustrating.
If l, as a parent, don't interfere with my child's decision making process when l see it's leading to disaster, not only would l be a terrible parent, It would prove l don't love him or her. Do unto others as you would have them do unto you! Light the way to those in the dark so they won't trip and fall!
God, as a leader, provider, lover and protector of our souls should ALWAYS be a mayor and ACCESIBLE factor in influencing our decision making.
"In all your ways acknowledge Him and He shall direct your paths". Every thought under the obedience of Christ.
"and the LIGHT OF LIFE will flood your path"
So, the strongholds of the god of this world must be broken over us so we can be open to receive the NEW nature given by GOD in order to be able to respond to HIM adequately!
The Holy Spirit transforms us...and by seeing the goodness and beauty of our Lord Jesus Christ, we can experience that compelling, savory sovereignty of God that leads our will to the will and heart of God. Correct?
2 Corinthians 4:4, ephesians 4:18, 1 Corinthians 2:14, Roman's 8:7, ephesians 2:5, Roman's 8:6, romans 8:8, john 3:19, proverbs 21:1, ezra 6:22, genesis 20:6, proverbs 16:1, acts 4:27, 2 Corinthians 4:6, Roman's 6:20, john 28:32, Hebrews 13:21, ephesians 4:30, ephesians 1:11, 2 Corinthians 3:17-18
Thank You!
Thank you
Thank you
You're the real mvp
Forced love, is not love!
We must go to him freely, with no assumptions of our rewards.
Our Father is Flawless!❤❤❤🙏🙏
Complete in his Holiness!❤❤
UNMEASURABLE IS HIS LOVE!😊😊😊😊
Yes! Forced love is not love! Every true Christian should love god by their own willingness. The question is, if the holy spirit does not work within someone, how could they be awaken to truly love god?
If you said "forced" , well i said it is a grace that god love us so much, thus god "WORK" all things so we could loves and obey him by our own willingness!!
@@BELA_NUS through tribulation and prayer we see that he wants the best for us, and after our attempts to fill the void left from our separation from him, through sin and materialistic lifestyles, the lucky one's come back to his understanding, and want to obey him.
God bless, your journey!❤🙏
Thanks for sharing 🙏
My personal notes
2:00
4:00
5:30
6:20 *
9:00
Praise God!!
"mystery" or "can't fully understand until heaven" are euphemisms to dodge a blatant logical contradiction. Piper's embrace of compatibilism/determinism has led me to describe him as a pyper-calvinist (play on words with hyper-calvinist).
lol. Well put.
John Piper is a blessed man, no doubts about it. But let me sum up in a couple of lines his 11 minutes: We are responsible for the desires and decisions which God decides to come into our hearts and minds.
We are responsible for someone else’s decisions? I’m so confused. I’ve been trying to understand Calvinism, but I’m struggling.
@@chessic4 Don't care about it, you don't have to.
The unpleasant side of calvinistic view (calvinists never talk about) is: God foresees the fall into sin for all mankind in his plan (so it is inevitable). God foresees NO decision for Christ for the majority of people. God condemnes this majority to eternal death for THEIR sin, as consequence of THEIR unbelief in Christ.
The good news: God reveals himself in the Bible in quite another way.
Ahh yeah
This makes no sense 🤦🏻♀️
God’s loving kindness leads to repentance, not our decision. Gods opens blind eyes and unblocks deaf ears. The Holy Spirit convicts of sin.
Points in the biblical view of the relationship between the human will and God's sovereignty.
1. Until they are born again by the power of God's Spirit, all human beings ever since Adam are spiritually blind, darkened in their understanding, hardened in their hearts, unable to grasp spiritual truth, rebellious against God, spiritually dead in trespasses, enslaved to sin, unable to please God.
2. All people are still responsible in that condition - accountable to God, liable to judgment, because this darkness that they are in; this slavery that holds them, has its power over them. Not against their will or against their desires, but precisely because of their will and because of their desires, they love sin so much. This is not a bondage against their will, it is a bondage because of their will.
3. This does not limit the complete sovereignty of God over everything. God is in control of the fallen will of man.
4. By the work of the Holy Spirit, God replaces blindness with reality. He sets people free. The slavery to God is not the same as the slavery to sin.
5. This new slavery to God is true freedom for 3 reasons: first, like slavery to sin, it is completely willing. Second, the new desires - unlike the desires to sin - accord with what is true and beautiful and lasting; God's righteousness, God's way. Third, this new slavery to God is true freedom because our former, so-called freedom ended in everlasting death, and our new slavery to God ends in eternal joy.
6. This new freedom does not limit the complete sovereignty of God, including the redeemed human will. God is working in us through Jesus Christ. This doesn't mean we can't grieve the Spirit, but it does mean that God lets Himself be grieved for His purpose, which will always come to pass. God is still sovereign over our wills.
7. Nevertheless, God's way of ruling the redeemed will not compromise our responsibility or nullify the true freedom. How can this be? There is a glimpse of how it might be in 2 Corinthians 3:17-18. Where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is freedom.
When the Spirit of God transforms us to God's will, to love it and conform to it, and thus reflect the glory of God, this is true freedom because it is happening through beholding the glory of the Lord.
He understands the narratives and paradigms of each soul to a complete Perfect Degree perfectly. Which means he knows exactly what people will do and why they will do what they do according to the perspectives that people have. He allows it like a Game of Dominos for his Purpose, The Calvinist actually have kept a lot of Facts concerning his Philosophy.
There are two ways to look at God's salvation. From the responsible man after Adam's side by reading Romans in the New Testament. The other is God's side which is reading Ephesians. To understand one without the other will lead to a lot of false teaching and misunderstanding of salvation.
To answer the question, there is a saying, 'You can lead a horse to the water, but you cannot make it drink'. The horse is responsible for the final act. It is the same with salvation, the final act is man's responsibility. But without God's side it will never happen.
The calling of God (our spirit rebirth/born again/justified) is not our choice but His IAW Romans 8.29/30. What we do with it afterward is our choice whether to grow in the given faith towards sanctification or be carnal. The choice is entrance into the Kingdom of God or not, not heaven itself.
@@johnhoffman8203, Piper actually discusses this in his video about Arminianism vs Calvinism, you should check it out. But I'm persuaded, that yes God never forces us to accept him, but he has made himself so irresistible when he shines the light of the glory of Jesus (2 Cor. 4:4) to us, that we can't but bend our knees to him. I believe it is God who saves us all the way, and even in a divine sense keeps us from stumbling (Jude 24-25).
@@lincolnf.4383 We are not saying the same thing. God's calling/justification/rebirth is His alone IAW Romans 9 and is without repentance and we can not resist His calling by design. Receive it because it frees you to believe that you are truly saved by his grace without works and cant loose it because His word is true per Is 55.10/11. This is not about our sanctimonious guilt because the real choice lies in sanctification to complete the salvation process and this is OUR choice, to be Spirit lead or a carnal christian. The result is loss of the inheritance/eternal (age lasting) life/hope/KOG/millennial reign for those carnal believers.
God + man < God
God came in to this world to save which was lost and He did it without man's help!!!
God does NOT "violate" US, but WE VIOLATE GOD and His WORD.
Seeing this question blew my mind. This is a problem with humans and the humanist today. They feel as if our rights and our powers and our choices can override God how does he not violate us? Wow wow wow wow that’s all I can say wow maybe it’s just the wording thatI can’t fathom and maybe the question could’ve been thought of differently and maybe I’m taking it wrong. Wow.
We’re not even worthy to speak of his name , Praise God, for his great prominent mercy for his grace that exceeds everything, for he first loved his children and looked after us guided us he saw to the very day of salvation for us the day he saved us. We live now to serve the great Almighty Lord, for my will, for my will, is your real. I will do what you will give me, the ability Lord to do as you ask oh Lord, give me the grace I need to walk with you. Oh Lord, praise your holy name ALL GLORY TO GOD!!!
After listening to the show , I see I was wrong and took the question incorrectly by just the reading and initially hearing it , this fella was genuinely asking a question while being drawn by God and seeking GODS TRUTH PRAISE GOD!
Anyone that believes in Jesus Christ now until they die , God has chosen them and changes them .
Humans think it's more important to have their free will than submit to God. I rather be totally taken by God than have my own evil free will
Seven key points presented to explain the relationship between human will and God's sovereignty:
1. Unregenerate humanity is spiritually blind, rebellious, and enslaved to sin.
2. Humans are accountable despite their fallen condition; they love darkness.
3. God's complete sovereignty is not limited by human fallenness; He directs even pagan kings' hearts.
4. God's regenerating work through the Holy Spirit replaces spiritual blindness with light, freeing individuals from sin's bondage.
5. New slavery to God is true freedom because of willing alignment with God's righteousness and eternal joy.
6. This new freedom doesn't diminish God's sovereignty; He continues to work in redeemed individuals.
7. The transformation of the redeemed will by the Holy Spirit doesn't nullify human responsibility or freedom, seen in the concept of beholding the glory of the Lord.
The discussion delves into the interaction between God's sovereignty and human free will, highlighting the concepts of regeneration, spiritual transformation, and the role of the Holy Spirit in shaping human desires and decisions.
That's literally AI and still doesn't resolve the glaringly obvious unsolvable problem between Free Will and God's Sovereignty.
God gave us the ability and option to choose... Some call us free moral agents.... The Holy Spirit is a gentleman...
I needed this.
Just awesome‼️‼️
5:35 ive been thinking about this myself and ive come to the conclusion that we as humans have the power to choose because god gave us free will but we DO NOT HAVE THE POWER TO CONTROL THE CONSEQUENCES OF THOSE ACTIONS so we have control over the choices BUT only god has control over the consequences that follow those choices and those consequences will either be death or eternal life.
This question can be answered by the "God-Eternity-Time diagram". God knows everything past, present, and future, but we do not. Since we do not know what He has predestined, we are fully responsible for all our decisions. When we make decisions, we do so freely in time, while God predestines it in eternity.
As an illustration: we cannot blame God for making us choose Option A when there are Options A, B, and C, etc available, and we do not know what God has predestined about our final decision. When we choose Option A, we do so freely in time, while God predestines it in eternity.
Amen!!!
Did God create me spiritually blind and hardened in my heart, unable to grasp spiritual truth, rebellious against God, spiritually dead in tresspasses, enslaved to sin, and unable to please God? Where does my desire to love sin so much come from? According to your teaching, I was born with original sin because of choices Adam made. I had no hope from the very beginning. I was born with a sin nature. There was nothing I could do to save myself from it. I was stamped at birth. And the only way out is for God to reach down, take out my heart of stone and give me a heart of flesh - He makes that decision - yet I am responsible if He chooses not to change my heart. How is this just? He causes all of this to happen - the fall of man all the way down to salvation through Christ - it all had to happen in order for HIs will to be accomplished. If God's will is always accomplished, He'd have to control man to carry out His will - and some He uses for good, and some He uses for bad. I just don't understand what hope man has then. He is stamped at birth - unto Heaven or eternal damnation. So I ask then, what must I do to be saved? If there is nothing I can do, then there is no hope for me. I am at the mercy of God to decide if He wants to save me or not. And let me preface this to say, I was raised Catholic and in my early twenties attended a Baptist Church and believe I was born again - I saw myself clearly as a sinner and understood I could never save myself. I have fallen on my face before God many times in the thirty years since - knowing my dapravity before Him. I am now 57 and have for many years begun to question the things I read in the Bible and what I experience in life - especially witnessing the intense suffering of people I love. I want to understand and find the answers. I want to trust God and love Him with complete abandonement, but when I listen to answers such as this and sermones on predestination and devine election, I no longer see a loving God. I'm beginning to wonder if perhaps I am not one of His elect and my life of faith was just wishful thinking.
You will say to me then, “Why does he still find fault? For who can resist his will?” But who are you, O man, to answer back to God? Will what is molded say to its molder, “Why have you made me like this?” Has the potter no right over the clay, to make out of the same lump one vessel for honorable use and another for dishonorable use? What if God, desiring to show his wrath and to make known his power, has endured with much patience vessels of wrath prepared for destruction, in order to make known the riches of his glory for vessels of mercy, which he has prepared beforehand for glory
Romans 9 :19-23
None is righteous, no, not one; no one understands; no one seeks for God. All have turned aside; together they have become worthless; no one does good, not even one.”
Romans 3:10
Therefore, just as sin came into the world through one man, and death through sin, and so death spread to all men because all sinned-
Roman's 5:12
but God shows his love for us in that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us. Since, therefore, we have now been justified by his blood, much more shall we be saved by him from the wrath of God. For if while we were enemies we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, now that we are reconciled, shall we be saved by his life.
Romans 5: 8
So then it depends not on human will or exertion, but on God, who has mercy. For the Scripture says to Pharaoh, “For this very purpose I have raised you up, that I might show my power in you, and that my name might be proclaimed in all the earth.” So then he has mercy on whomever he wills, and he hardens whomever he wills.
Romans 9: 16-18
The understanding of the Lord is infinite.
Psalms147:5
Or maybe the Bible doesn’t teach this.
Such a complicated topic.
The last 2 years really raised some questions. On the one hand, Christian's went along with and were silent, on what their rulers were doing because ultimately God was still in control. On the other hand they were also silent in allowing the rulers to violate other's consciences.
You can really see now how the mark of the beast system will work and how even the elect will accept it if God doesn't first remove them because "love your neighbour" has been perverted now, just like the covenant of marriage was.
While the author authored the whole story, the characters in the story can't blame the author for their action. The same way we in His story, can't blame God for our action.
But can the author blame the characters he created?
@@exaucemayunga22 Why would the author need to blame the characters? Have you seen any author of a story blame the characters they've created?
@shikyokira3065 in your analogy, God is the author, right? As the author, he knows the beginning and the end, and he controls how everything turns out. But why does he blame man for sinning?
@@exaucemayunga22 Let's put this in this perspective. Does it make sense for Tolkien to blame Sauron for his evil actions?
@@shikyokira3065 No
The Holy Spirit inspires, guides, gives mercy ect but doesn’t force you. It’s just giving you a push towards a direction not forcing you to it step by step.
@AVB2 Human to human interaction can’t be compared to a God to human interaction. Nature takes it course. In your scenario while tragic it would be part of Gods plan. Read the book of Job.
@AVB2 I didn’t mean literally. I meant the nature of humans. But yes technically he controls actual nature and anything he wants including us, but then we would just be like robots and he gave us free will to choose a path he lays out, or not. Like Adam and Eve or Lucifer, they chose their own path.
@AVB2 That’s not at all what I said. You yourself just said God gave Jesus a task to do. Jesus followed it. Giving you a task implies the choice to not follow it, forcing you to do something would make giving a task pointless. God didn’t control Jesus, Jesus followed his Father’s task as a perfect son. Has God ever controlled someone would be a better question. That answer would be yes, like the king of the Egyptians, he told Moses to tell the king to let his people go, but he decided to make the King stubborn so he would refuse in order to show his might to the Egyptians.
So basically God knows exactly what to do or NOT to do in order to motivate us in a way that we “back the decision’s” but they end up being the ones that God knew/knows we need to make to complete our best journey possible?
I think so
It always seems like The reform tradition keeps saying God hates sin, God chooses sin for us, then God Blames us for our sin.
Though it wasn't God's fault that we became lost in those things Christ died to set us free from it was our fault.
You either make a decision in the flesh which is usually base or sinful. You can make a decision in your soul which can be passionate either for good or evil depending on the presence of the Spirit. A decision in the Spirit is always divine or in line with the perfection and Divine. The difference that His Spirit makes in Our life is that He gives us the freedom to do right. Are you free from the consequences of stealing food because you are hungry. Don’t you know if you fast the hunger leaves. He does provide. I will say that deciding to fast and lacking food are two completely different things.
✟
Give not that which is holy unto the dogs, neither cast ye your pearls before swine, lest they trample them under their feet, and turn again and rend you.
Matthew 7:6 (KJV)
No His sovereignty doesn't violate our decision making.
Well consider this God created first so we are always reacting to what God makes or the multitude of decisions that were created by God first acting
Our Lord called Peter and other apostles thick headed so I believe Max is in good company!😣🙏
God's sovereignity turned jonah around and sent him
To ninevah!
My soul griefs from my falling and my will and mind are weak I what to be with the lord again but the worldly desires of my life are like chains I from the bottom of earth And up above I see Heaven in all of its glory mind sways me and I cant do anything about it, I am scared that I may not be chosen I and weak And will most likely go to hell But I just wish I knew what to do
I’m in the same boat. I’m broken over all my sins and grieve over them. I’ve been praying fasting reading the word etc to seek after Him and it’s breaking me more
Me too. This is freaking hard.
Like everything else there's a ditch on both sides of the narrow path.
GOD is sovereign over HIS sovereignty.
We shouldn't assign things beyond what we understand.
If the bible says there are free will offerings then there's free will. How HE dispenses or allows oir free will is a mystery.
The closest I go to explain it is HE is almighty, not only everywhere but HE is also everywhen. HE is alpha and omega, alef and tav, the beginning and the end.
Trying ro define HIS devine nature is a fools errand.
My son, beware of anything beyond these. Of making many books there is no end, and much study is a weariness of the flesh. The end of the matter; all has been heard. Fear God and keep his commandments, for this is the whole duty of man.
Ecclesiastes 12:12-13 ESV
To me it’s rather simple….God is fully sovereign but when he made man, He (God) chose to limit His sovereignty when He gave man the first spoken and written promises to distinguish Himself from all other god’s who man create who are “capricious”. Therefore God sovereignly created man with freewill to choose in receiving or rejecting His promises because it declares that “whatsoever a man soweth he shall also reap” good or bad. In this God does not violate His main attribute of Love over a fallen creation who is given the opportunity to redeem themselves to their creator.
he does not tell us what to think, he foreknows what we think.
exactly
why do we think what we think? because of our hearts or our souls that he created with exact precision?
@@tommytwo-times9053 you either follow God or self.
@@donhaddix3770 God made my ‘self’ with exact precision, so if i choose not to follow him, he is the one who directed me to do so.
@@tommytwo-times9053 he allows you to choose your own path.
What makes you think your own decisions would be better or less robotic than a sovereign living God?
Because maaaaybe God’s sovereignty does NOT mean “divine meticulous control”. ❤️
The old philosophical question of " free " will versus determinism. Only small and uninformed minds see a contradiction in that dichotomy. The world we inhabit has a dual nature. It's not only possible that God's sovereignty doesn't violate our decision making. It's an absolute fact the two must exist side by side. Our decision making freedom is not total. It's partial and very limited. That isn't a newsflash. All who consider the problem must realize it.
Excuse me but this should be titled "how does our decision making not violate Gods Sovereignty" because the last time i checked God doesnt do anything outta violation.
When you raise a child you are constantly “violating their decision making”, because they are immature, naive and ill prepared for the challenges of the world that face them. Children of God need guidance from God in the same way so as to walk in the maturity He intends for them to walk in.
Colossians 3:14 KJVS
[14] And above all these things put on charity, which is the bond of perfectness.
Hebrews 5:13-14 KJVS
[13] For every one that useth milk is unskilful in the word of righteousness: for he is a babe. [14] But strong meat belongeth to them that are of full age, even those who by reason of use have their senses exercised to discern both good and evil.
God exercises (violates) sons of God in their decision making to bring them to maturity, bring them to righteousness.
Hebrews 12:6-11 KJVS
[6] For whom the Lord loveth he chasteneth, and scourgeth every son whom he receiveth. [7] If ye endure chastening, God dealeth with you as with sons; for what son is he whom the father chasteneth not? [8] But if ye be without chastisement, whereof all are partakers, then are ye bastards, and not sons. [9] Furthermore we have had fathers of our flesh which corrected us , and we gave them reverence: shall we not much rather be in subjection unto the Father of spirits, and live? [10] For they verily for a few days chastened us after their own pleasure; but he for our profit, that we might be partakers of his holiness. [11] Now no chastening for the present seemeth to be joyous, but grievous: nevertheless afterward it yieldeth the peaceable fruit of righteousness unto them which are exercised thereby.
And if God doing so offends you in some fashion? If you think he has not the right to do so? You completely fail to understand the power God has over His creation.
Romans 9:19-24 KJVS
[19] Thou wilt say then unto me, Why doth he yet find fault? For who hath resisted his will? [20] Nay but, O man, who art thou that repliest against God? Shall the thing formed say to him that formed it , Why hast thou made me thus? [21] Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishonour? [22] What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction: [23] And that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy, which he had afore prepared unto glory, [24] Even us, whom he hath called, not of the Jews only, but also of the Gentiles?
www.justifiedfreely.com
Luke Wagner parents don’t effectually change their kids’ wills as God is claimed to by Calvinism. They incentivize with positive and negative incentives in response to their freely-willed actions.
Regarding the potter, I refer you to a small book called The Potter’s Promise.
With all due respect to John Piper, the question was not really answered in this one.
Galatians 4:7
(No longer slave(s) but son(s)...)
New King James Version
Therefore you are no longer a slave but a son, and if a son, then an heir of God through Christ.
I guess in hindsight, we look back and see that whatever took place must’ve been GOD‘s will. Is that correct? So when I made a decision that ended in loss of my finances and falling into depression and drug abuse, I want to know why God would will that for my life? I am very angry with myself for not staying where I was, but that loss of income made me get so depressed let down a very dark path. I just wanna know why.
At first he says that we were willfull slaves to sin and we desired it.. but then a little later he stated that when we are slaves to God we are truly free because we truly desire God contrary to when we were unwillfull slaves to sin. He contradicts himself by saying that we are willfull slaves to sin and we desire it in the first statement and then by saying the contrary in the second one..
Not at all! We ARE slaves to sin! But when we "walk in the Spirit" we ARE, by GOD'S strength, freed from the bondage (slavery) of sin. But "Apart from HIM, we can do nothing" (John 15:5) and we remain in sin (slavery, bondage)
Amen
If there is prophecy that does away with free will.period
I pondered this for a while and tried to think simply about life and death. We can willfully choose to live and be in control of our lives, yet God still has ultimate control because we can get struck by lighting. Does me getting struck by lighting take away my free will? No, because I could’ve chosen not to go outside, yet then God could choose to send a meteor or tornado. I guess another analogy could be this. I chose to stand up or sit down, those are my choices, I’m free to chose either, but God is ultimately in control because without Him those wouldn’t be choices in the first place. Let me know what you guys think?
Free will, from a practical standpoint, is an illusion.
If God is real, you really have no choice but to follow unless you see choosing eternal damnation as a legitimate option.
God doesn't want us to serve out of fear or "mandate." God wants us to do so because we want a relationship with Him.
To that end, God deprives us of absolute proof of His existence. This allows us to doubt and disbelieve because we don't choose Him.
When nonbelievers and skeptics want to argue, "If God is real, why does ______ happen?", they ignore the whole point of free will. For God to actively intervene on every act of evil or sorrow, He would be taking away our free will. God's actions would prove He exists, making disobedience a non-viable option.
You can't have God protecting the world from ALL evil AND have free will.
I'm a little confussed by your comment. Are you a Christian or no?
Yes.
There is plenty of sin in Hell, yet people still practice sin in Hell...
What did Jeremiah say about the heart of the spiritually dead???
He said that it is desperately wicked, who can fathom it?
Because "sovereignty" does not mean that God meticulously controls everything. Calvinists love redefining words to make them fit with their theology.
Listening to Piper one gets even more confused.
I absolutely love that God is sovereign over everything.....but does that mean He determines everything...I've heard the "not one rogue molecule" and "dust particle" illustrations that Dr. Piper and RC have used, but if I make a typing mistake in this comment and have to correct it ...was that really ordained of God ? How far does we carry this ?
GOD knows Better Than Your Decision Making, because Eternal Life For You is Better Than Temporal Lifes of the World.
I have no doubt Mr. Piper is sincere in the expression of his passion. I also have no doubt he's sincerely blind to the truth of the gospel. What he's saying is preposterous at best violating all notions of common sense.
Why did Adam and Eve sin? Was it predetermined? Did they have a sin nature prior to their fall?
No to both questions. They were in innocence but were subject to obedience. They then were deceived by Satan who made them doubt God's motives and this led them to disobedience. Foreknowledge is not predestination.
@@smeatonlighthouse4384 When God created Satan, He knew that satan would eventually deceive Eve. So through divine foreknowledge and actively creating Satan, Eve was forced to be deceived and could not have chosen to not eat of the fruit. There is no way for God's foreknowledge to be wrong. Predestination must be true.
@@smeatonlighthouse4384
So then was it God’s WILL for Adam and Eve to disobey God and thus cause sin to enter the world?
God often operates in passive sovereignty.
I am not sure how Piper has answered this question. I’m gonna go back to RC Sproul’s explanation instead.
Can you share a link for that?
Piper doesn’t know it that every time he speaks he’s just like us he can sound just as arrogant and has a problem with his ego. Because people are trying to be perfect like god god doesn’t have to worry about getting any ailments.
God determined the end from the beginning and is all powerful. If He didn't want us to desire sin He would have made us so otherwise you're saying He's not all powerful.
Can a god of all knowledge not figure out how to bring about everything and not force our will and minds is anything impossible for god so how does he do it exactly who fully knows god's mind
Do you mean: God has no business interfering in my decisions? Like Bette Midler's song, God remains at a "safe" distance."
I do not know what the future is
Wow......
For a Christian, the Judgment Seat of Christ and the Great White Throne Judgment would be farces if "free will to choose" was not true. Think on these things:. how could souls be judged and held responsible if they were predestined without free will? Is that just?.
He is a Gentleman...We have freewill.
Emelia Bailey not at all, Emelia
Tell that to king Nebuchadnezzar.
Emelia Bailey what is your will free from?
Can the free - willers provide scripture to prove we have free will.
There are many free will theories. This thread could use a lot more clarity around what specific theory of free will people are saying we do or do not have.
For example, below is a classic Reformed treatment of free will. You'll see that it affirms free will, but it excludes some particular theories like libertarian free will, and instead affirms a form of theistic compatibilism.
Westminster Confession of Faith
Chapter 9 - Of Free Will
I. God has endued the will of man with that natural liberty, that is neither forced, nor, by any absolute necessity of nature, determined good, or evil.
Chapter 3 - Of God's Eternal Decree
I. God from all eternity, did, by the most wise and holy counsel of His own will, freely, and unchangeably ordain whatsoever comes to pass; yet so, as thereby neither is God the author of sin, _nor is violence offered to the will of the creatures;_ nor is the _liberty_ or contingency of second causes taken away, but rather established.
Is a failed relationship (breakup) Gods Will or our fault?
What if god sets you up
in what sense?
LEON CORAZON God is a gentleman. He shows up always when you call on him.
God does not refuse anyone who sincerely repents and turns to him.
If we look at Judas, he had many opportunities to repent to Jesus for stealing from the poor or betraying the Lord. Judas chose on his own free will to let his own interests be at the centre of his life instead of submitting to God.
At the end of Judas' life he does not blame God for his discussions, rather he says "I have betrayed an innocent man". If Judas had been forced by God against his will he would have been bitter with God, instead he was ashamed and grieved by his own choices.
God never sets us up
Yeah I understand you but the thing is when unfair and suffering things happen you still hold your head up high and wear those wounds scars and cross with pride and grace
If God works all things after the council of his own will from ancient times to everything not yet done he controls your decision making, he controlled what Judas did!
I still don’t understand lol.
God is sovereign but he’s made it so we still have free will. I don’t know how he does it but it works. Not everything is understood but we have to trust in God
Right !! It's still something I still can't still quite grasp lol 🤔
Lol
@@dirkdookies6418 - what do you mean by "God is sovereign?"
That's funny because I have been being a superposition of being born again or not. And that isn't something that anyone can check. (E.g. Schrodinger's cat) But I definitely see things that are spiritual. And I definitely know that the Father loves me. But the problem I have is that being born again the Holy Spirit would have to have sinned (blasphemy) and not then it would not be save(I'm still working on how the holy spirit in the form like a man is supposed to be Christian and be under the word since you all seem to think.) As far as free will? It's a tough subject. I have willed that people kill themselves because I dislike them and they have.
God bless you Kevin Owen Burress
First of all I have to say nobody loves the darkness if you stop and look at it how would anyone of us in this whole entire world or even universe for that matter grow if all we did was never send second of all there's no sin God has sent us here to make these mistakes and to learn and to grow and to become better people if we do not make mistakes and do wrong we will never become better people and we will continue to stay the same every day you're only bondage in this world is hearing and listening to what you are saying right now these are the kinds of things that keep us as a human being down it makes us feel bad for anything that we do that everybody else considers wrong there is no right and there is no rum and when you find out right and wrong you have got to find it out for yourself within yourself otherwise who is to say who's right and who's wrong what kind of God would give us nothing but choice in our lives that is our biggest gift other than love that we have why on Earth are we given a rulebook to go by if we're giving choice God would prefer for us to find out the answers to everything on our own instead of following the next the next part of the person before us life is about making good or bad choices this is what he asks of us it is not to stay grounded and to stay in this bondage as you speak I am so passionate about this I used to believe everything that you were saying I believed in it from a a child however as I've gotten older and have become more spiritual I have learned that God walks with us not above us God wants nothing but for us to be happy and to learn love there is no way to learn love living the way you speak because all we will ever do in life is regret everything we've ever done all we will ever do is keep ourselves in this bondage as you call it now we all know that God speaks to everybody so if you do not believe me and what I say right now what I ask of you all of you all of you is to ask the big guy girl himself all I ask I do not under any circumstances believe that my loving God would ever contradict himself in the Bible by saying Val shalt not kill in the Ten Commandments and then say unless I tell you to Dad is not a loving God God in the Bible is ridiculous my God does nothing but love me no matter what I do it doesn't give me permission to go out and do stupid stuff that doesn't give me permission to go out and hurt people but what it does do is give me permission to make mistakes and be able to grow instead of be stuck in this crazy bondage that you speak of
You know absolutely nothing of Gods word. You are walking in darkness. I do not say this to hurt you but to warn you. You must be born again. You cannot disagree with God and be His child. Repent and seek Him and His righteousness.
Sounds like a standard man-made theology.
But Pastor John is a Christian, so he teaches the truth.
Becky- maybe you love your sin more than you love God. Please pick up your Bible and read. Jesus calls you to repent and trust in Him.
And in the future, please use punctuation as your opinion was very difficult to understand without it.
:)
God's sovereignty and free will are not incompatible
This left me even more confused
Dream 2017
I had a dream a few years ago about this water coming across the United States..... It was crazy. No more Florida. Most of Georgia, Alabama, the east coast..... Gone..... The water came up to the Foothills of the mountains In North Alabama. It is coming by attack.... I keep getting China and Russia doing the attacking nuclear and conventional.......I also saw an asteroid hitting the Atlantic ocean off the northwest coast of Africa. It will be a dreadful thing. Both of these things brings wave after wave across the Atlantic to our coast here in America. It's over.... We have been judged. Amen
If you don't know Jesus, you better repent and get to know Him. It's now or never. Amen
People have free will. God doesn't even know your name or that the earth exists. God provides personality to all beings but it is not a two way street. Nothing you do gets back to God because that is not what God wants. He does not want to experience a confused, ignorant, primitive life. He wants to experience love. That's what it's all about. God also wants His children to gain a personality. That is why you exist.
The OT passages that you quoted mean this: People have no value to the universe until your soul chooses to keep you. Then the doors open and you can ascend and other ascended beings will teach you the truth.
No one loves darkness, they love themselves. The universe rejects selfishness.
If God is sovereign over people's free will, then why is there sin in the world?.... Couldn't He spared us all this trouble by having all people be born in Eden in perfection?
To add to your question, was it God’s will for Adam and Eve to disobey God this causing sin to enter the world?
True freedom is not feeling good doing good, nor or doing sin, because both of those imply you didn't choose what you like doing. You're still a slave to something, either sin or righteousness. True freedom is being a slave to nothing, being able to choose for real and having free will, not having your free will determined by someone else, that's programming.
@Ben Jones You're right, but it's even possible to fall away once you have tasted the spiritual gifts like speaking in tongues and have the full presence of the Holy Spirit. Which means true freedom goes beyond anything, like Christ gives you freedom, but you have a higher freedom that lets you reject freedom itself, even when you had a glimpse of the full experience of it. And it's possible to go against your desires, and even to act irrationally, and do the most evil thing for absolutely no reason or the best thing for no reason, we can choose to make no sense in what we do and have a backwards logic, or make sense. But Christ and the Holy Spirit help us choose the right thing and make us more spiritually aware of what we are doing with love. But it also says the Lord puts things into people's herats and so does the devil so freedom isn't 100% of the time, unless it's possible to reject thoughts put into your heart.
Do we even have a free will if not how does God hold us responsible for our decisions does God save some and condemn others and we have no choice
Well I don't think God's sovereignty violates I do think that a nation's does that satan does.. and that the Lord is prepared to judge people who listen to satan and decide to accuse His people and violate His people into sin. Indeed they even listen to satan in the scripture and try to use it to pull people away from the Lord away from following Him and to lead lives of sin. In listening to Satan they call on to do that even the Lord's Name.
GOD'S WILL TO TURN MAN'S SINFUL WILL AROUND MAY ONLY BE DONE BY GOD'S HOLY SPIRIT BY CHRIST ALONE !! TILL THE HOLY SPIRIT ENTER MAN'S HEART BY FAITH IN CHRIST---YOUR HUMAN WILL TENDS ONLY TO MORE SIN AND PRIDE TOWARDS A RIGHTEOUS CREATOR !!
Sorry , do we carry this ....😅