I'm a sx 5w4 and I feel very much the same. I only studied in college, and that was just to feel/look competent and not embarrass myself by failing. I didn't care about accumulating academic knowledge at all. Of course, I'll study stuff like enneagram or other topics I'm actually interested in for years on end for the sake of knowledge itself and how I can use it for self growth or writing. I also relate very strongly to 8 and can sometimes look like one, but not as often as a true 8. It's also nice to FINALLY hear a 5 who isn't like "ugh social events? I absolutely NEVER go to those, I want you to invite me but I'll never go, I just want to stay alone in my room all the time and never speak to anyone because I'm just that reclusive." Like....no? It's so rare that anyone invites me anywhere that I almost always have to say yes. I want to connect with people and not miss out on new, fun experiences (going to 7). I just might get overwhelmed when I'm actually there and decide it's not for me after all, or I'll go full 7 for a couple of hours before crashing. Anyway, thanks for this, glad to find a 5 who isn't a total stereotype :)
I can relate to your experience almost to a t... I've believed that I'm a 4 for the longest time, recently I saw how I could be a sx 5w4 I usually look like an 8 too, but it's usually in arguments... (Which is why I can spend several hours arguing in the comment sections lol) And I do kinda like social events but if I know I'll crash down, I'd rather not accept it... I don't like that sensation lol...
It is nice to see an example of a 5 that is more similar to me. I think I am a sx 5w4 (or social?) and I love going to parties and social events. If I am in the right mood I can be friendly and extroverted for hours at a time, but if I am not in the right 'party mood' I end up doing weird 5 shit like trying to explain the precession of the equinoxes to people, or asking people insane questions like "What is time?" or challenging everyone to play speed chess with me. And if I socialize a lot, I need a lot of alone time to decompress afterwards. I am actually pretty extroverted and chatty a lot of the time, I just need to balance that by sometimes spending an entire day by myself playing some type of strategic war game or wandering in a field listening to Vangelis. (That guy really wrote some great field-wandering music.)
I am an older type 5 SX. I just wanted to say that I'm willing to bet that you do love to study but only about the things that you are fascinated with. I think you'll notice that as you get older but I can tell already because you're already so interested in your own personality. The type of studying they force you to do in school is not compatible with our type at all in my opinion. Anyway, I enjoyed watching your video and you have a good day
5s are awesome! I attended London enneagram panels, and the 5 panel were the most dynamic/animated, vocal and confident/commanding. You really wanted to listen to them. If you want to see boring, mousy people, attend an enneagram 6 panel. You really see how cautious, bland and conformist they are.
Um ok wow. Especially the part about never really consciously thinking about energy. And the studying thing, lol. I did well in school until college and realized I actually had to try. I had zero studying habits. Yikes. Anyway, yes, info on this subtype would be amazing.
Definitely relate to the energy thing! I’m always up to socialize but I drain quickly and it leads to me feeling guilty for wanting to leave before others.
As a FIVE I’m happy how “non-avarice” we’re being with our ideas! Thanks for the video Bethany and for seeding this space for discourse. Hopefully we’ll all keep watering it till some flowers of growth bloom :)
I'm a 5w6 sexual subtype. I usually mistype as a 1w9 sexual subtype but I'm definitely a 5. I'm super conscious of my energy though because I have had a terrible habit in the past of over expending myself to the point of total burnout. I also don't like traditional studying but I've always enjoyed learning new things especially when they peak my interest. I relate highly to the 5 stereotypes. I figured the reason for relating to 8 a lot was because of the way 5 moves to 8 in growth.
When they say that we are conscious and conservative with our energy I think it means that we don't bother to waste our time with stuff that we find disinteresting, and that we deem unnecessary
I am also a 5 sx. One thing that I don't totally fit into is the stereotype of not being social or friendly with people. Of course, I have my moments when I am overwhelmed and want to leave, or feeling the need to isolate to regain energy. But I love people, and I especially love helping people, as it brings me happiness and joy. It makes me happy when others are happy. And I am, whether I want it or not, an emotional sponge, unless I mentally prepare myself first. Of course, I do not enjoy it when I help people and they don't appreciate it. Then it's just been a waste of my energy and time, AND makes me feel bad. I try my best to avoid those people.
FINALLY someone speaks the truth. I'm a sexual 5 and everyone always says it's like a 4 and I'm like, no it isn't. The 5sx takes on many of the attributes of it's arrow 8 in my opinion.
Not all 5’s study academia. One 5 I know is a stay at home moms that immerses herself in hobbies and really enjoys having time to herself to use as she pleases. However it is absolutely a facet of the type to be extremely proficient at something or several things, which you cannot do without study, practice, and considerable energy spent toward that thing. If you don’t feel the need to apply yourself with the hope of obtaining deep understanding you are 100% not a 5.
I SKIM EVERYTHING!!! 😂😂😂. 5 sx/sp. Unless I find it particularly interesting or useful. I look forward to more of your video's. It's rare I find exactly what I'm looking for.
5w6 sx/sp here, I relate a lot to what you said! E5 integrates into E8, so you are not far off, you are just healthy integration levels. It sometimes makes me wonder if sx = healthy 5. I have yet to see or meet another sx 5 that didn't also relate to an 8.
I'm a 5w4 who thought I was a primary SP, but I'm likely an sx/sp and the secondary instinct is amplified by having ADHD. I am sensitive and want nothing to drain or hurt me; at heart, however, I love carefully situating people to bare their souls before me; if not, however, I like observing them long enough to notice a quirk or apparent struggle. This is why I get easily attached to fictional characters.
I feel like there's definitely a lot more to be said, too. There's a richness and drive and spontaneity to us Fives which makes it especially sad when people write type Five off as dry and boring. Thanks Sandy!
Fellow 5 sx. I agree w/ everything you say in this video. So sample of 2 now, hah! Particularly re: studying, I've learned to do it pretty well and have pretty good study habits these days, but only because a) I hate looking like an idiot, and b) I'm a programmer, and it's part of the job.
: I'm-new in the Enneagram-Studies. As a ~5W6-Sx in a Good-Balance with my ~4-Side, I feel and think-much as the same-way-mentioned in your video, but-I-love-to-study, care-less bout the academics AND be in some deep/profound-relationships with a couple-wonderful-friends. : Thanks for the Video-Share.
I'm an sx 5w6 - I do tend to overcommit to things because I don't think about conserving my energy until after I've already spent it or promised it. I'm always up for an adventure whether in things to do, places to go, or conversations to be had. I am not a super social person, and I stay away from large crowds, but I am very invested in building my "village" of people, to whom I am very committed (w6 showing up there). I have difficulty investing myself in study or research unless it's something that is fueling my personal interest.
i feel the same, but after quite researches i think all sx5s are actually sx6s, same as me. a person once told me that if any person doesnt fit the core but only some subtypes then they cant be that ennea type, and honestly they got some good point
Yes, please post follow-up! Your experience needs to be heard... such an encouragement! Thank you! I've been mis-typed by others as an 8, and I believe this is why
I guess every enneagram subtypes are different not only depending on their initial types, but also with their instictual variants. Like wether you're sx/sp or sx/so means a lot to how you relate to these overall 5s descriptions. Also, to complete that, you can also back it up with your MBTI type, meaning that based on this, people with same enneagram subtypes, types and insticual sequences can also look totaly different when we add that component. For example I have the Infj preference in the myers briggs, but I'm also an enneagram 5w4 sx/sp. And if a person, say an Istp for example would have share the same enneagram type and sequence as me, we would look rather similar on the outside but totally different on the inside, because our mind is focused on different things. So it adds another layer of complexity to the whole thing which I find fascinating. Aight sorry for the long comment, and for the eventual mispelling I'm french. Have a great day !
I'm 5w6 with a mostly counterphobic wing...I've been studying The Enneagram for almost 13 years or so, as a hobby...and still, the instincts are annoying to me, because I find them inconsistently understood (and very much subjective; depending on the source). Anyway, I'm definitely not sx-last. From what I gather, most 5 descriptions are geared towards a 5w6 with sx-last, and a mostly phobic wing. I first typed as 4, and then 6. Realizing I could be 5 was a big revelation for me, but I still went on to question my type a lot over the years (I considered every type on some level but at various times really locked onto 3, 1, and 8, in addition to the 4, 6, and 5 I originally explored). Never seriously thought I was a 7, 2, or 9. Nevertheless, at the end of the day, I'm sure I'm 5. I'm a lot more romantic, artistic, aggressive, passionate, and volatile than classic 5s (but this isn't something that's always on the surface, usually I'm pretty grounded). Sometimes I seem more like CP6 or 8. However, I do put up very strong boundaries a lot of the time. I can relate a lot to Type 8 as well and have wondered if I'm 8. I think the instincts in general are just rather confusing and misunderstood, which makes the types harder to understand in a uniform way. It has been suggested by some that I'm clearly sp/sx, others suggested sx...it's hard for me to really decide, because I see so many contradictions in the instincts and how they're explained...so people are working with different ideas of the instincts when they type themselves and others...nice video, thanks for sharing.
The instincts are, as named, instinctual, so they are felt in the "gut" center. So this is one case where overthinking it and trying to reach an objective definition can be unhelpful. Actually, I found it quite easy to determine my instinctual stack. I've always been preoccupied with dreaming up the perfect partner and relationship, noticing when people were interested in me, focusing on what attracted or disgusted me, etc. etc. Personally, it was much clearer to learn the instincts separately from the enneagram subtypes. Descriptions like Beatrice Chestnut's are helpful, but a little vague and vulnerable to confirmation bias. And when people do have different ideas of what the instincts are, sometimes they are wrong, but sometimes they are perceiving different facets of the same phenomena. They are biological drives, as well as personality fixations, as well as foci of attention, as well as directions of energy and exertion. In the case of Fives, the dominant instinct will be the area that causes the most "fear" and in which we display the most "avarice." So as a sexual five, simply going up to an attractive person and talking to them is a terrifying experience, whereas I experience no anxiety at all about my social status and social expectations, or my material safety and well-being. Similarly, I can be "stingy" by withholding my attention and affection, and pretending that those are things I have no need for. But money or credentials or accolades aren't on my radar in the same way.
@@personalitea-333 Yeah that makes sense. I can still probably make sp/sx work for myself (which I've had as my stacking theory for a good length of time). I can't say I've ever been able to convince myself I can be without a relationship. When single I have always wanted to be in one (and often had trouble finding someone), and when in relationship I've had high standards for it, sometimes needing more space, sometimes needing more connection. Probably the times I've suffered most were when I wasn't in a committed relationship/had just left one, or the one I was in was not healthy. The single time I was most depressed was when I was dumped after a five year relationship. Also I haven't felt many fear or hoarding issues with approaching people I found attractive. To the contrary, I tended to always put my feelers out, and try to see if there was a possible connection there even if it seemed like a bit of a long shot. Even while in relationships I've needed to have my space and boundaries. I remember a friend noted many years ago that I seem to always need a “personal space bubble” except maybe with “[a girlfriend]”. I've noticed that even then, I tend to often pull back when not really in “sx mode”. Sometimes yes very romantic, intimate, and touchy-feely etc., especially during dating romance initial phase, other times a bit more distant and I guess “domestic”, just hanging out, relaxing, enjoying separate things in the same space with another, etc. That being said, I've always had some issues with SP, whether it be obsessing or neglecting. Some things I'm really picky about, like needing peace and quiet or being able to withdraw into solitude and comfort when I get overwhelmed or exhausted. With a 5 though I've tended to minimize conventional needs quite often, like learning to get by on little, not caring how much money I make, not really having a great career path or plan etc., I think this is classic SP5, but then whatever the “basic” things I do come to feel that I need become very important, like a stable home environment (albeit often a simple/stark one), safety net for when things go wrong, some family and friends to rely on, etc. With strong SX variant this also extends to my intimate relationships, which makes it really hard for me to be without romance in my life. I just feel incomplete and somewhat lost but I still have an independence about me, because that being said, I've also enjoyed the freedom of being outside a relationship, but often fell into unhealthy SP-patterns of substance abuse and addiction to stimulation in order to medicate loneliness, boredom, etc. to fill what was missing in my life. Anyway, I agree with you that too much analysis can make it hard to really get in touch with those underlying energies, since they're more intuitive...but there are some good intellectual/logical formulations that also work for understanding them, they just tend to be a bit tricky for some cases because of the dynamics of the different instincts.
@@personalitea-333 "In the case of Fives, the dominant instinct will be the area that causes the most 'fear' and in which we display the most 'avarice.'" This was a very useful comment; thank you. I've studied MBTI/cognitive functions for 9+ years, and just got into enneagram ~6 months ago. I haven't seen many useful descriptions of the 5's instincts, and the only test I've seen so far was for instincts only, regardless of type (and the social/sexual answers used way more expressive language than would probably be relatable for most 5's, so I scored very highly as sp, even though that's definitely my lowest instinct). Based on the few descriptions I'd seen/heard, I had figured I was so/sx (because I do keep tabs on social totems/thought patterns in society, but I had also done some of the exact things mentioned in the sx5 portion of Tom LaHue's video). But I definitely have more anxiety about romantic relationships than I do about social impact (though so is definitely the runner-up), so I'm probably sx/so. Anyway -- thanks again for the clarification. I'm curious what your MBTI type is? Seems like that could have a big impact on how we manifest our enneagram types/wings/instincts.
As a social 8 and trying to learn about subtypes of type 5, I’ve never heard about this connection to 8! I am very curious - What it is about the eight that you identify with?
5w6 sx/so here. I agree with her on the matter and for me its the intensity thrill that I can relate with type 8 and also the assertiveness, aggression, leaderskills. When I was younger the crew I was in were about 20 guys, and I was the one leading the group.
@Fire tears Thanks for this description! That makes sense… When the sx 5 is comfortable and confident I’ve seen this, and love it! It’s rare though and one of my favorite types.. thanks for explaining
You don't like studying as in you don't like structured learning, or as in you don't like learning in general. Because like, isn't the love of knowledge what makes a five a five? If information is more just a defense mechanism than a source of genuine pleasure, could it be that you're a 6w5?
I think I'm a sx/sp 5w4. I will go to a social event if there is a remote possibility of getting laid. I experience emotions deeply and I can tolerate roommates, within reason, definitely need a private room. I do have an insatiable thirst for knowledge, but I am a male, and I think testosterone might be the culprit. I remember a while back, a now trans man, talking about the transition and saying after the testosterone treatments he began to become really into science. Before as female he had no interest whatsoever. Yes, I know there are women that are into science, and that there have been great women scientist. But, I would bet those women had high testosterone levels relative to the rest of their sex or even the average male.
I'm a sx 5w4 and I feel very much the same. I only studied in college, and that was just to feel/look competent and not embarrass myself by failing. I didn't care about accumulating academic knowledge at all. Of course, I'll study stuff like enneagram or other topics I'm actually interested in for years on end for the sake of knowledge itself and how I can use it for self growth or writing. I also relate very strongly to 8 and can sometimes look like one, but not as often as a true 8.
It's also nice to FINALLY hear a 5 who isn't like "ugh social events? I absolutely NEVER go to those, I want you to invite me but I'll never go, I just want to stay alone in my room all the time and never speak to anyone because I'm just that reclusive." Like....no? It's so rare that anyone invites me anywhere that I almost always have to say yes. I want to connect with people and not miss out on new, fun experiences (going to 7). I just might get overwhelmed when I'm actually there and decide it's not for me after all, or I'll go full 7 for a couple of hours before crashing.
Anyway, thanks for this, glad to find a 5 who isn't a total stereotype :)
I can relate to your experience almost to a t...
I've believed that I'm a 4 for the longest time, recently I saw how I could be a sx 5w4
I usually look like an 8 too, but it's usually in arguments... (Which is why I can spend several hours arguing in the comment sections lol)
And I do kinda like social events but if I know I'll crash down, I'd rather not accept it... I don't like that sensation lol...
😍😍
It is nice to see an example of a 5 that is more similar to me. I think I am a sx 5w4 (or social?) and I love going to parties and social events. If I am in the right mood I can be friendly and extroverted for hours at a time, but if I am not in the right 'party mood' I end up doing weird 5 shit like trying to explain the precession of the equinoxes to people, or asking people insane questions like "What is time?" or challenging everyone to play speed chess with me. And if I socialize a lot, I need a lot of alone time to decompress afterwards. I am actually pretty extroverted and chatty a lot of the time, I just need to balance that by sometimes spending an entire day by myself playing some type of strategic war game or wandering in a field listening to Vangelis. (That guy really wrote some great field-wandering music.)
I agree as a sx 5, we need more content
I am an older type 5 SX. I just wanted to say that I'm willing to bet that you do love to study but only about the things that you are fascinated with. I think you'll notice that as you get older but I can tell already because you're already so interested in your own personality. The type of studying they force you to do in school is not compatible with our type at all in my opinion. Anyway, I enjoyed watching your video and you have a good day
5s are awesome! I attended London enneagram panels, and the 5 panel were the most dynamic/animated, vocal and confident/commanding. You really wanted to listen to them. If you want to see boring, mousy people, attend an enneagram 6 panel. You really see how cautious, bland and conformist they are.
Um ok wow. Especially the part about never really consciously thinking about energy. And the studying thing, lol. I did well in school until college and realized I actually had to try. I had zero studying habits. Yikes. Anyway, yes, info on this subtype would be amazing.
Definitely relate to the energy thing! I’m always up to socialize but I drain quickly and it leads to me feeling guilty for wanting to leave before others.
As a FIVE I’m happy how “non-avarice” we’re being with our ideas! Thanks for the video Bethany and for seeding this space for discourse. Hopefully we’ll all keep watering it till some flowers of growth bloom :)
I'm a 5w6 sexual subtype. I usually mistype as a 1w9 sexual subtype but I'm definitely a 5. I'm super conscious of my energy though because I have had a terrible habit in the past of over expending myself to the point of total burnout. I also don't like traditional studying but I've always enjoyed learning new things especially when they peak my interest. I relate highly to the 5 stereotypes. I figured the reason for relating to 8 a lot was because of the way 5 moves to 8 in growth.
Same, about being mistyped as 1w9. The w6 and Sexual subtype make me far more social which tend to not reveal the 5 so much.
As 5s we study and learn out of fear. Sounds accurate :)
When they say that we are conscious and conservative with our energy I think it means that we don't bother to waste our time with stuff that we find disinteresting, and that we deem unnecessary
I am also a 5 sx. One thing that I don't totally fit into is the stereotype of not being social or friendly with people. Of course, I have my moments when I am overwhelmed and want to leave, or feeling the need to isolate to regain energy. But I love people, and I especially love helping people, as it brings me happiness and joy. It makes me happy when others are happy. And I am, whether I want it or not, an emotional sponge, unless I mentally prepare myself first. Of course, I do not enjoy it when I help people and they don't appreciate it. Then it's just been a waste of my energy and time, AND makes me feel bad. I try my best to avoid those people.
3:40 "But then I can't do it as well as I thought..." YES. I identify with this sooo much. You're not alone.
Aaaamazing! I love how you described the need for flowing with energy. I just discovering the meaning enneagrams and your video has now got me hook.
FINALLY someone speaks the truth. I'm a sexual 5 and everyone always says it's like a 4 and I'm like, no it isn't. The 5sx takes on many of the attributes of it's arrow 8 in my opinion.
I am a sexual five and the five description does fit me. I preserve my energy and I do love knowledge and gathering information.
Fair. I realized recently that my version of conserving energy is: "uff, that sounds like a hassle"
Lol kinda same i don’t premeditate saving energy put i post-pone chore trips like store returns for a looong time
Not all 5’s study academia. One 5 I know is a stay at home moms that immerses herself in hobbies and really enjoys having time to herself to use as she pleases. However it is absolutely a facet of the type to be extremely proficient at something or several things, which you cannot do without study, practice, and considerable energy spent toward that thing. If you don’t feel the need to apply yourself with the hope of obtaining deep understanding you are 100% not a 5.
I SKIM EVERYTHING!!! 😂😂😂. 5 sx/sp. Unless I find it particularly interesting or useful. I look forward to more of your video's. It's rare I find exactly what I'm looking for.
5w6 sx/sp here, I relate a lot to what you said! E5 integrates into E8, so you are not far off, you are just healthy integration levels. It sometimes makes me wonder if sx = healthy 5. I have yet to see or meet another sx 5 that didn't also relate to an 8.
I'm a 5w4 who thought I was a primary SP, but I'm likely an sx/sp and the secondary instinct is amplified by having ADHD.
I am sensitive and want nothing to drain or hurt me; at heart, however, I love carefully situating people to bare their souls before me; if not, however, I like observing them long enough to notice a quirk or apparent struggle. This is why I get easily attached to fictional characters.
Fives are awesome! :) Subtypes definitely make 5's look different from each other. I enjoying hearing your perspective on the Sx variant. Sandy
I feel like there's definitely a lot more to be said, too. There's a richness and drive and spontaneity to us Fives which makes it especially sad when people write type Five off as dry and boring. Thanks Sandy!
@@personalitea-333 👏 Yes! Some of the memes and associated stereotypes drive me nuts!!!
It was great hearing your perspective! Thanks for sharing that and would love to hear more!
Fellow 5 sx. I agree w/ everything you say in this video. So sample of 2 now, hah! Particularly re: studying, I've learned to do it pretty well and have pretty good study habits these days, but only because a) I hate looking like an idiot, and b) I'm a programmer, and it's part of the job.
fellow 5, but a 5w6. Most likely sp. You have a nice smile.
I'm a five and I totally conserve my energy.
5w4 sx/so and I completely relate to everything you've mentioned here!
: I'm-new in the Enneagram-Studies. As a ~5W6-Sx in a Good-Balance with my ~4-Side, I feel and think-much as the same-way-mentioned in your video, but-I-love-to-study, care-less bout the academics AND be in some deep/profound-relationships with a couple-wonderful-friends.
: Thanks for the Video-Share.
I'm an sx 5w6 - I do tend to overcommit to things because I don't think about conserving my energy until after I've already spent it or promised it. I'm always up for an adventure whether in things to do, places to go, or conversations to be had. I am not a super social person, and I stay away from large crowds, but I am very invested in building my "village" of people, to whom I am very committed (w6 showing up there). I have difficulty investing myself in study or research unless it's something that is fueling my personal interest.
i feel the same, but after quite researches i think all sx5s are actually sx6s, same as me.
a person once told me that if any person doesnt fit the core but only some subtypes then they cant be that ennea type, and honestly they got some good point
When are you going to post your follow-up video?
Yes, please post follow-up! Your experience needs to be heard... such an encouragement! Thank you!
I've been mis-typed by others as an 8, and I believe this is why
@@katieandtannerhartman3430 me too!
I guess every enneagram subtypes are different not only depending on their initial types, but also with their instictual variants. Like wether you're sx/sp or sx/so means a lot to how you relate to these overall 5s descriptions. Also, to complete that, you can also back it up with your MBTI type, meaning that based on this, people with same enneagram subtypes, types and insticual sequences can also look totaly different when we add that component.
For example I have the Infj preference in the myers briggs, but I'm also an enneagram 5w4 sx/sp.
And if a person, say an Istp for example would have share the same enneagram type and sequence as me, we would look rather similar on the outside but totally different on the inside, because our mind is focused on different things. So it adds another layer of complexity to the whole thing which I find fascinating.
Aight sorry for the long comment, and for the eventual mispelling I'm french. Have a great day !
I just found out I’m a sx5 not sure what my secondary instinct is or wing but I relate to what you said about studying.
THANK U FOR EXISTING AND FOR MAKING THIS VID
What is your Tritype and your MBTI type?
relating to 8 yes yes. 5w4 sx
2:24 hello not-a-statistic
sx is the counter type for 5!
I'm 5w6 with a mostly counterphobic wing...I've been studying The Enneagram for almost 13 years or so, as a hobby...and still, the instincts are annoying to me, because I find them inconsistently understood (and very much subjective; depending on the source). Anyway, I'm definitely not sx-last. From what I gather, most 5 descriptions are geared towards a 5w6 with sx-last, and a mostly phobic wing. I first typed as 4, and then 6. Realizing I could be 5 was a big revelation for me, but I still went on to question my type a lot over the years (I considered every type on some level but at various times really locked onto 3, 1, and 8, in addition to the 4, 6, and 5 I originally explored). Never seriously thought I was a 7, 2, or 9. Nevertheless, at the end of the day, I'm sure I'm 5. I'm a lot more romantic, artistic, aggressive, passionate, and volatile than classic 5s (but this isn't something that's always on the surface, usually I'm pretty grounded). Sometimes I seem more like CP6 or 8. However, I do put up very strong boundaries a lot of the time. I can relate a lot to Type 8 as well and have wondered if I'm 8. I think the instincts in general are just rather confusing and misunderstood, which makes the types harder to understand in a uniform way. It has been suggested by some that I'm clearly sp/sx, others suggested sx...it's hard for me to really decide, because I see so many contradictions in the instincts and how they're explained...so people are working with different ideas of the instincts when they type themselves and others...nice video, thanks for sharing.
The instincts are, as named, instinctual, so they are felt in the "gut" center. So this is one case where overthinking it and trying to reach an objective definition can be unhelpful.
Actually, I found it quite easy to determine my instinctual stack.
I've always been preoccupied with dreaming up the perfect partner and relationship, noticing when people were interested in me, focusing on what attracted or disgusted me, etc. etc.
Personally, it was much clearer to learn the instincts separately from the enneagram subtypes. Descriptions like Beatrice Chestnut's are helpful, but a little vague and vulnerable to confirmation bias.
And when people do have different ideas of what the instincts are, sometimes they are wrong, but sometimes they are perceiving different facets of the same phenomena. They are biological drives, as well as personality fixations, as well as foci of attention, as well as directions of energy and exertion.
In the case of Fives, the dominant instinct will be the area that causes the most "fear" and in which we display the most "avarice."
So as a sexual five, simply going up to an attractive person and talking to them is a terrifying experience, whereas I experience no anxiety at all about my social status and social expectations, or my material safety and well-being.
Similarly, I can be "stingy" by withholding my attention and affection, and pretending that those are things I have no need for. But money or credentials or accolades aren't on my radar in the same way.
@@personalitea-333 Yeah that makes sense. I can still probably make sp/sx work for myself (which I've had as my stacking theory for a good length of time). I can't say I've ever been able to convince myself I can be without a relationship. When single I have always wanted to be in one (and often had trouble finding someone), and when in relationship I've had high standards for it, sometimes needing more space, sometimes needing more connection. Probably the times I've suffered most were when I wasn't in a committed relationship/had just left one, or the one I was in was not healthy. The single time I was most depressed was when I was dumped after a five year relationship. Also I haven't felt many fear or hoarding issues with approaching people I found attractive. To the contrary, I tended to always put my feelers out, and try to see if there was a possible connection there even if it seemed like a bit of a long shot. Even while in relationships I've needed to have my space and boundaries. I remember a friend noted many years ago that I seem to always need a “personal space bubble” except maybe with “[a girlfriend]”. I've noticed that even then, I tend to often pull back when not really in “sx mode”. Sometimes yes very romantic, intimate, and touchy-feely etc., especially during dating romance initial phase, other times a bit more distant and I guess “domestic”, just hanging out, relaxing, enjoying separate things in the same space with another, etc. That being said, I've always had some issues with SP, whether it be obsessing or neglecting. Some things I'm really picky about, like needing peace and quiet or being able to withdraw into solitude and comfort when I get overwhelmed or exhausted. With a 5 though I've tended to minimize conventional needs quite often, like learning to get by on little, not caring how much money I make, not really having a great career path or plan etc., I think this is classic SP5, but then whatever the “basic” things I do come to feel that I need become very important, like a stable home environment (albeit often a simple/stark one), safety net for when things go wrong, some family and friends to rely on, etc. With strong SX variant this also extends to my intimate relationships, which makes it really hard for me to be without romance in my life. I just feel incomplete and somewhat lost but I still have an independence about me, because that being said, I've also enjoyed the freedom of being outside a relationship, but often fell into unhealthy SP-patterns of substance abuse and addiction to stimulation in order to medicate loneliness, boredom, etc. to fill what was missing in my life. Anyway, I agree with you that too much analysis can make it hard to really get in touch with those underlying energies, since they're more intuitive...but there are some good intellectual/logical formulations that also work for understanding them, they just tend to be a bit tricky for some cases because of the dynamics of the different instincts.
@@personalitea-333 "In the case of Fives, the dominant instinct will be the area that causes the most 'fear' and in which we display the most 'avarice.'"
This was a very useful comment; thank you.
I've studied MBTI/cognitive functions for 9+ years, and just got into enneagram ~6 months ago. I haven't seen many useful descriptions of the 5's instincts, and the only test I've seen so far was for instincts only, regardless of type (and the social/sexual answers used way more expressive language than would probably be relatable for most 5's, so I scored very highly as sp, even though that's definitely my lowest instinct). Based on the few descriptions I'd seen/heard, I had figured I was so/sx (because I do keep tabs on social totems/thought patterns in society, but I had also done some of the exact things mentioned in the sx5 portion of Tom LaHue's video). But I definitely have more anxiety about romantic relationships than I do about social impact (though so is definitely the runner-up), so I'm probably sx/so.
Anyway -- thanks again for the clarification.
I'm curious what your MBTI type is? Seems like that could have a big impact on how we manifest our enneagram types/wings/instincts.
Same. 5w4 sx/sp. I have more to say but I’ll wait until I get to a proper computer….
Sexual 5 have dominant arrow to 8. I am also this subtype and I feel the same.
intp?
You seems like lady Elon Musk...
As a 5 this is a very high complement 😂
Yep
What’s your secondary instinct?
Self-pres
@@personalitea-333 Lightning in a bottle!
archetype
Same, I am also a 5 SX
Where are you from?
@@angelzuniga2920 Michigan, currently. You?
How's life for a fellow Sx 5?
5s integrate to 8s as you prob know
more
As a social 8 and trying to learn about subtypes of type 5, I’ve never heard about this connection to 8! I am very curious - What it is about the eight that you identify with?
5w6 sx/so here. I agree with her on the matter and for me its the intensity thrill that I can relate with type 8 and also the assertiveness, aggression, leaderskills. When I was younger the crew I was in were about 20 guys, and I was the one leading the group.
@Fire tears Thanks for this description! That makes sense… When the sx 5 is comfortable and confident I’ve seen this, and love it! It’s rare though and one of my favorite types.. thanks for explaining
You don't like studying as in you don't like structured learning, or as in you don't like learning in general. Because like, isn't the love of knowledge what makes a five a five? If information is more just a defense mechanism than a source of genuine pleasure, could it be that you're a 6w5?
I think I'm a sx/sp 5w4. I will go to a social event if there is a remote possibility of getting laid. I experience emotions deeply and I can tolerate roommates, within reason, definitely need a private room.
I do have an insatiable thirst for knowledge, but I am a male, and I think testosterone might be the culprit. I remember a while back, a now trans man, talking about the transition and saying after the testosterone treatments he began to become really into science. Before as female he had no interest whatsoever.
Yes, I know there are women that are into science, and that there have been great women scientist. But, I would bet those women had high testosterone levels relative to the rest of their sex or even the average male.