The illusion doesn't really work in this case, you need to use a lower fov/tighter zoom to "close the distance" between the foreground and background. The fov is way too high and clearly shows distance between the wizard and the midget, and as a result the illusion not only fails but it looks like they're both staring into space. While the wizard DOES look a little bit bigger, it still looks like they're in totally different areas in the table and not looking at eachother, because the camera has a higher fov and is up close to the table, causing more distortion to affect the wizard than the girl. I think pulling the table rig back from the wall, using a big ol' telefocal lens, something like an 80-100mm or even a 200mm (and of course pulling the camera back to compensate), and appropriately adjusting the table rig would fix the illusion. Basically the goal is to flatten out the scene (or at least the subjects) so everything looks like it's roughly on the same plane.
They're hobbits! They don't like to be called "midgets"! There for thousands of years has been an ongoing war between the two over identity and height! Both are very sensitive about their appearance! LOL J/K Yeah, midget will do! The presentation was well, executed but the demo in the end DID kinda fal! Their points of view for each other were way off!
+Dr. Face Doctor The Hobbit should also have been seated on a lower chair. She should look the way children sitting in 'adult'chairs can often barely reach the table - that's a simple but important detail they missed here. Instead, we see her fitting high at the table, and it throws things off. And I totally agree with you about sorting the camera issue, closing down the distance.
What also throws me off is the lighting. She seems to have a hard backlight, seemingly coming from outside the door, while the wizard-guy doesn't catch any of this light, he even looks like he's in a totally different lighting environment. A good example of this can be seen in the tea drinking scene, between Frodo and Gandalf. They both got a very strong backlight, and have the same lighting environment. This makes them seem much closer to each other
Here's a visualization of how I understood his comment: ibb.co/z6DPNdJ The red arrows were where they seemed to be looking. (People normally look at the direction of the other person's eyes so that they meet in a straight line, i.e. the blue line.) The green colors denote the apparent differences in their positions in the table. Most people would pick this out intuitively just by looking at it, however this might help point out what's really going on in the scene that's not making the illusion work.
if you moved to hobbit forward a bit, and the wizard backward a bit, the illusion would look better. it is kinda easy to see that the actor is looking into blank space, because if you look at the table, the hobbit is at a different point than the wizard. another option is to have the two actors look slightly to the right, so it makes up for their different positions.
Nice tutorial! For future reference you should of set the wizard higher at the table. They are at the same height in relation to the table which is throwing the illusion off.
the only failure I see is that the actor screw the shot not looking at the propper down point in the wall (he looks like watching over the hobbit), instead the hobbit. Amazing tuto, thanks for sharing it.
Pan the camera to the right a bit so you have the same amount of space on each side of the characters. The man on the right looks closer but by putting some space on the right of the character equal to the woman then this will help. OR adjust the camera position so no space on either side of the characters,
To make the illusion work the split in the table should run away from the camera NOT at right angles to it. To see it done properly, see ua-cam.com/video/0wVaTpKRBc8/v-deo.html
A few mistakes were made but they were correct in the direction of the split ua-cam.com/video/QWMFpxkGO_s/v-deo.htmlsi=GDa185kMfA6HufIA&t=83. The video you linked to only works as a static shot.
Yeah, the concept sounds right but wasn’t executed properly. It looks like every forced perspective picture I’ve tried to take, or everyone one I’ve seen online. Just someone up close and someone far away looking like someone up close and someone far away.
Well that didn't work did it?! The wizard was much closer than the hobbit and that's exactly what we saw in camera. They didn't appear to be looking at each other either. Is there a tutorial on checking shots to see if they work? 😂😂
The illusion doesn't really work in this case, you need to use a lower fov/tighter zoom to "close the distance" between the foreground and background. The fov is way too high and clearly shows distance between the wizard and the midget, and as a result the illusion not only fails but it looks like they're both staring into space.
While the wizard DOES look a little bit bigger, it still looks like they're in totally different areas in the table and not looking at eachother, because the camera has a higher fov and is up close to the table, causing more distortion to affect the wizard than the girl. I think pulling the table rig back from the wall, using a big ol' telefocal lens, something like an 80-100mm or even a 200mm (and of course pulling the camera back to compensate), and appropriately adjusting the table rig would fix the illusion.
Basically the goal is to flatten out the scene (or at least the subjects) so everything looks like it's roughly on the same plane.
They're hobbits! They don't like to be called "midgets"! There for thousands of years has been an ongoing war between the two over identity and height! Both are very sensitive about their appearance! LOL J/K Yeah, midget will do! The presentation was well, executed but the demo in the end DID kinda fal! Their points of view for each other were way off!
+Dr. Face Doctor The Hobbit should also have been seated on a lower chair. She should look the way children sitting in 'adult'chairs can often barely reach the table - that's a simple but important detail they missed here. Instead, we see her fitting high at the table, and it throws things off. And I totally agree with you about sorting the camera issue, closing down the distance.
Agreed. The example could have used a little tweaking. However, this is a GOOD explanation of the technique.
What also throws me off is the lighting.
She seems to have a hard backlight, seemingly coming from outside the door, while the wizard-guy doesn't catch any of this light, he even looks like he's in a totally different lighting environment. A good example of this can be seen in the tea drinking scene, between Frodo and Gandalf. They both got a very strong backlight, and have the same lighting environment. This makes them seem much closer to each other
Here's a visualization of how I understood his comment: ibb.co/z6DPNdJ
The red arrows were where they seemed to be looking. (People normally look at the direction of the other person's eyes so that they meet in a straight line, i.e. the blue line.) The green colors denote the apparent differences in their positions in the table. Most people would pick this out intuitively just by looking at it, however this might help point out what's really going on in the scene that's not making the illusion work.
if you moved to hobbit forward a bit, and the wizard backward a bit, the illusion would look better. it is kinda easy to see that the actor is looking into blank space, because if you look at the table, the hobbit is at a different point than the wizard. another option is to have the two actors look slightly to the right, so it makes up for their different positions.
Nice tutorial! For future reference you should of set the wizard higher at the table. They are at the same height in relation to the table which is throwing the illusion off.
the illusion didn't work but your method is helpful
I agree. Good tutorial, but the results needed a second take.
the only failure I see is that the actor screw the shot not looking at the propper down point in the wall (he looks like watching over the hobbit), instead the hobbit.
Amazing tuto, thanks for sharing it.
Isn’t the small “expresso” cup the regular sized one?
Nice explanation of how to create forced perspective and how it was used in the movie. Thanks.
Completely FAKE. You can tell he used a real hobbit to make it look like he was using forced perspective. FAIL!
This is damn funny.
Pan the camera to the right a bit so you have the same amount of space on each side of the characters. The man on the right looks closer but by putting some space on the right of the character equal to the woman then this will help. OR adjust the camera position so no space on either side of the characters,
Its close but not quite there
sitting position still can make the illusion.
To make the illusion work the split in the table should run away from the camera NOT at right angles to it. To see it done properly, see ua-cam.com/video/0wVaTpKRBc8/v-deo.html
A few mistakes were made but they were correct in the direction of the split ua-cam.com/video/QWMFpxkGO_s/v-deo.htmlsi=GDa185kMfA6HufIA&t=83. The video you linked to only works as a static shot.
You had me until you said expresso cup
Yeah, the concept sounds right but wasn’t executed properly. It looks like every forced perspective picture I’ve tried to take, or everyone one I’ve seen online. Just someone up close and someone far away looking like someone up close and someone far away.
Wow, it's nice
Wizard is slightly stiff
do we really need the 10x1.3 explanation? :)
Nice Tuto! :)
Genius simply genius
You lost me at “expresso cup”.
Everything is ok but, the wizard most be in a higher seat. Just it!
Hey there fellow STEM/film students
lol
Well that didn't work did it?!
The wizard was much closer than the hobbit and that's exactly what we saw in camera. They didn't appear to be looking at each other either.
Is there a tutorial on checking shots to see if they work? 😂😂
5:49 of literal repeating himself.
Not that good though
looks terrible
bad
This was horrible...