NO FLANGE? How does a 4-6-0 with a BLIND set interact with the track?

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  • Опубліковано 2 жов 2024
  • In this video, we take a look at how Rio Grande Southern #20 at the ‪@crrm‬ interacts with the track, one wheelset at a time. 20 is a neat comparison to our previous video, because she's got a blind #2 wheelset! Let's check it out.
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КОМЕНТАРІ • 646

  • @gordonwerner
    @gordonwerner Рік тому +33

    Steam engines made with Lego use blind drivers for the same reason as standard Lego curved track has a very tight radius. So it’s neat to see this in the real world.

    • @cjstrader8171
      @cjstrader8171 4 місяці тому +1

      I made Baldwin Disc Drivers on a 3D printer and looked to this for some inspiration. I should start offering them around next week or so

  • @Reziac
    @Reziac Рік тому +86

    It's really astonishing how much _movement_ there is in all that tonnage... quite a fine balance.

  • @patpetersen7645
    @patpetersen7645 Рік тому +151

    this just goes to show you how smart the people who designed and built these wonderful machines were.

    • @VidsPhone
      @VidsPhone Рік тому +5

      Think of what they could do today with autocad and cnc machining. This is awesome videography. I love the section with the stephanson valve gear in motion.

    • @MRworldEtIkA
      @MRworldEtIkA Рік тому

      im not trying to be sexist but are they sure that don't need men? ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)

    • @muguly4591
      @muguly4591 Рік тому +4

      Or how smart people are in general.

    • @TheBlackFoxMaster
      @TheBlackFoxMaster Рік тому +1

      was

    • @Et91640
      @Et91640 Рік тому

      This was some of the most hackiest engineering I have ever seen, I would not call it smart

  • @BigGoucho
    @BigGoucho Рік тому +5

    That underframe crank action is hypnotic. 🍺🍻

  • @kevinmorgan2968
    @kevinmorgan2968 Рік тому +39

    Genuinely it’s amazing how these big things slide along the rails, without the flange (which I always assumed was a part of it) you see how the pressure and force are used. It’s like watching a printing press drive through the mountains, only it’s a deck of cards they are printing. Applause.

    • @w9x7cv3vg6
      @w9x7cv3vg6 Рік тому +3

      the flange on the other wheels help to maintain the position of that wheel with no flanges..

    • @kevinmorgan2968
      @kevinmorgan2968 Рік тому

      @@w9x7cv3vg6 lol and as someone who only knows trains in the way that be described as ‘choo choo! I love it!’ , I can’t believe how simple a tech can work. Must be a reason it was so popular 🧐

  • @xenowreborn
    @xenowreborn Рік тому +127

    I really like these Graphics you used in this video, it added a neat touch to this video
    Watching these locomotives run around the Museums is really fun, particularly seeing all the contributing parts work to make these mechanical steam powered beasts do the thing they were built to do so long ago is really cool!

  • @stansmith4931
    @stansmith4931 Рік тому +367

    Hello my fellow hairy men

    • @TheRealSoviet_Onion
      @TheRealSoviet_Onion Рік тому +21

      And Boys

    • @Mr_guy006
      @Mr_guy006 Рік тому +19

      Hello good sir

    • @stansmith4931
      @stansmith4931 Рік тому +69

      @@TheRealSoviet_Onion I see no boys here just a band of men drinking strawberry milk

    • @Hyce777
      @Hyce777  Рік тому +100

      Can confirm am hairy

    • @stansmith4931
      @stansmith4931 Рік тому +37

      I'm sorry but I need to say this about my own comment imagine a big group of guys covered in hair standing around 491 drinking strawberry milk out of whiskey bottles labeled xxx strawberry milk it's killing me.

  • @machinerygaming40
    @machinerygaming40 Рік тому +82

    Wow this channel has come along way Mark. I remember the first video of yours I ever watched was the original ES&D ep. 2 at premiere. Thank you for the hours of entertainment.

    • @Hyce777
      @Hyce777  Рік тому +14

      You've been here since the early days! Cheers mate.

  • @polarvortex6496
    @polarvortex6496 Рік тому +105

    The graphics upgrade with your channel is super super cool. I hope you keep the MSPaint for the 101s, but for more cleaned-up videos like this, it is awesome.
    Edit: That said, I haven't seen you do a 101 with the new editing. Maybe I don't know I want it.

    • @Hyce777
      @Hyce777  Рік тому +30

      I edited the video with the MS paint basically and Nick came back over top with the real graphics. It was awesome. Lol

    • @Javious_Rex
      @Javious_Rex Рік тому +6

      @@Hyce777 I have noticed Nick's credit coinciding with a polished graphics, it took me a minute to recognize the name. The first time I heard you was on his podcast talking about Railroads Online. Appreciate the content over the last year plus, I've enjoyed watching you grow from a musician who loves and plays with trains to ..... well, a musician who loves and plays with cooler trains. I think you love and appreciation for the things you do are the secret sauce that makes you content so enjoyable.

    • @Hyce777
      @Hyce777  Рік тому +8

      @@Javious_Rex cheers Jay! I am very fortunate that Nick has wanted to partner up for these videos. We'll be doing a more formal intro pretty soon, but it's honestly wonderful getting to work with him. Thanks for the kind words.

  • @AtkataffTheAlpha
    @AtkataffTheAlpha Рік тому +6

    I could watch steam locomotive driving mechanics spinning all day while learning about the locomotives in deep detail. Something satisfying and something educational. Loving these videos where we go into the wheels

  • @17Beastmode17
    @17Beastmode17 Рік тому +38

    This is awesome to see! I bet the men who engineered these trains could only dream of seeing them work this clearly

    • @user-hx1cz8lm2s
      @user-hx1cz8lm2s Рік тому +3

      I'm sure they have, usually those guys are supposed to validate it and what not

  • @guardiansofdisciples2918
    @guardiansofdisciples2918 Рік тому +36

    I love getting to see these locomotives from angles that were not previously filmed on other channels as far as I know. It's what makes your channel stand out from the rest. You also can't replace all the shenanigans with the other guys from the museum.

  • @TylerCMilligan
    @TylerCMilligan Рік тому +6

    Loving how your content is evolving! Graphics are crisp and narration is way smoother. Gotta say my favorite part of this was getting to see that valve gear in motion!

  • @TrainsAreReallyCool
    @TrainsAreReallyCool Рік тому +24

    You should do a camera angle on 42 and 346 that focuses just on the Stephenson valve gear. Watching the eccentrics in action is the coolest part of this video imo.

    • @Hyce777
      @Hyce777  Рік тому +16

      I need to do more valve gear stuff. Glad you enjoyed.

    • @jordonfreeman166
      @jordonfreeman166 Рік тому +2

      @@Hyce777 I’ve got some pictures of Southern 630’s Southern Valve Gear if you’re interested. The valve gear is my favorite part of a steam locomotive’s running gear.

  • @trainliker100
    @trainliker100 Рік тому +12

    The physics is the same as that of a common belt sander. The sanders have rollers at each end that are crowned (larger diameter towards the center). It may be counterintuitive to some, but this is what causes the belt to stay centered. If the belt gets off center, the nature of the roller shape causes the belt to self-center. The same occurs with crowned pulleys and flat belts used in older machinery. For the regular flanged railroad wheels, the treads are tapered so that the two wheels work in tandem to produce a somewhat similar result. If the wheel set gets too off center, a larger diameter of one wheel will contact and a smaller diameter of the other wheel and this causes the wheel set to center. Theoretically, with good enough track, you wouldn't need flanges at all. And the taper of the wheel treads also helps provide a sort of "differential" effect on curves where the wheel set will shift so a larger diameter on the outer wheel and a smaller diameter on the inner wheel make contact to prevent either wheel from skidding on the rail.

    • @Bassotronics
      @Bassotronics Рік тому +1

      The tapered design will only go so far in terms of its design on curves. On tighter curves (especially Subway train curves) the flange is a must! When you hear flange squeal, it’s because it’s doing it’s job.

    • @trainliker100
      @trainliker100 Рік тому +1

      @@BassotronicsTrue, of course. This is why it is commonplace on railroads to use rail lubricators on curves to minimize wear to the flanges and especially the rail. Don't no if they do it those very tight curves for you mentioned as well as things like the Chicago L (which I rode all the time and heard plenty of squealing) or for streetcar running.

    • @Bassotronics
      @Bassotronics Рік тому

      @@trainliker100
      Rail lubricators should be used everywhere there are tight curves but they are not that common to see. One way around that is to have a tank car as part of the train consist innovatively designed to spray lubricant every time it senses a tight curve.
      Or could be just an extra tank under the locomotive to make things easier controlled by the engineer.

    • @trainliker100
      @trainliker100 Рік тому +1

      @@Bassotronics First, it isn't just tight curves. It can also be rather broad mainline curves. And there are determinants other than just the tightness of the curve such as train speed, train weight, whether or not it is on a grade, and even wind forces. There has been quite a bit of science over the years for devices that automatically deliver grease so as to help with the flange and rail wear yet avoid getting grease on top of the rail. I doubt very much that railroads would want to haul an extra car for the purpose since it adds non-revenue weight to the train. And they would need a lot of them and it adds another handling issue to keep them filled and switched into trains. I suppose your idea of having something on board the locomotive would be possible, but it would be another maintenance headache and probably ALL locomotives would require them. Of course, the existing flange lubricators require maintenance and refilling but I suspect the railroads long ago determined it was the cheapest approach.

    • @Bassotronics
      @Bassotronics Рік тому

      @@trainliker100
      Yup!
      And I meant just one locomotive on the mainline with the device; not equip all of them. The grease supplied that one locomotive should be enough for other trains for the rest of the day depending on the type of rules, regulations or necessity.

  • @evosolutionsllc.910
    @evosolutionsllc.910 Рік тому +1

    I know nothing about trains and this is the most insane thing I learned about trains ever. Those blind sets freak me out..... Good video

  • @The_Canadian_Railfan
    @The_Canadian_Railfan Рік тому +22

    I do know that the flangless wheels help locomotives go around the corner
    But it's always nice hearing you talking about it

  • @Dallen9
    @Dallen9 Рік тому +2

    I love these kinds of videos. These kinds of videos are the real money makers for the industry cause you're literally showing how things behave in motion. And when you know what happens in motion you can make better or Maintain things better when you know what happens on the rails.

  • @theironthai8508
    @theironthai8508 Рік тому +2

    I absolutely love the shots with the valve gear. Excellent video!

  • @jean-huguesbouchard1045
    @jean-huguesbouchard1045 Рік тому +1

    My hat to those who figured all that out back in the days without gopros. They must have had countless failures and arguments with a few eurêka moment. Great video and content Hyce!!!

  • @robertgaudry2826
    @robertgaudry2826 Рік тому

    Thank you for this technical approach. This is a rare imaged explanation, or a visualised real investigation, allowed for ordinary people such as me. Thanks

  • @stuarthart3370
    @stuarthart3370 Рік тому

    That was terrific shooting of the flanged and unflanged wheels. Many thanks for showing it.

  • @Its_Trainz_Time
    @Its_Trainz_Time Рік тому +27

    I think a lot of people who don’t pay attention to railway architecture and design don’t realize that there is more than what visible to outside, especially when it comes to value gear and wheel alignments. Thanks for showing us more in depth 🙏
    Edit: I was confused about blind drivers when I first heard about them on the BR 9Fs 2-10-0s

    • @VidsPhone
      @VidsPhone Рік тому

      I worked on a riding scale railroad and we built our own switches. You really learn the physics when you run wheelsets through switches and frogs as you are building.
      .

  • @dwightprzybilla6477
    @dwightprzybilla6477 Рік тому +9

    Love the graphics that you added, it really helps clarify what is actually happening. Watching the eccentrics and the blind drivers is hypnotic. What a cool shot. Please keep the wonderful content coming!

  • @alitlweird
    @alitlweird Рік тому +1

    It’s freaking me out to see those wheels not leave the track!! 😲😲

  • @vaudevillian7
    @vaudevillian7 Рік тому

    Fantastic, these fascinate me. So beautifully shot too Hyce

  • @mccabecompositions
    @mccabecompositions Рік тому

    I wanna go to the rail museum just to listen to Hyce talk about trains irl. I love steam locomotives

  • @goofballskouf5494
    @goofballskouf5494 Рік тому +5

    Is there somewhere I can read about the patchjobs that RGS did to keep the 20 running before its restoration?

    • @Hyce777
      @Hyce777  Рік тому +1

      There's a few books the museum has about the restoration of the 20, that I believe goes into a lot of that. I am unsure if there's much out there floating around on the internet.

  • @VidsPhone
    @VidsPhone Рік тому

    when I had a model railroad I loved to take a wheelset and let it coast down a grade for 30 or 40 feet and see how gracefully it would track and stay centered between the rails. When you consider that the contact point of a trainwheel is about the area of a dime, they really do glide over the track.

  • @emj1989
    @emj1989 Рік тому +1

    sprr pacific locomotive 1913 ran at the Oakland zoo for about 3 or 4 ish years. MacDermot the builder ran the 1913 with no front pilot truck because it couldn't manage the curves. in the short time it ran there it sharpened the #1 drive axle flange into a razor blade. during its restoration we swapped tires with the # 2 axle .

  • @Bassotronics
    @Bassotronics Рік тому +1

    Thanks! There is almost no information on UA-cam regarding blind drivers.

  • @paulwilliams5208
    @paulwilliams5208 Рік тому +1

    I like to see funiculars passing loops as some have fangs on both sides on one side but on the other side would be like this flat wheel

  • @dergrinsch1
    @dergrinsch1 Рік тому

    Ej holy moly...bling.. Really, I am 38years mate, and a bright light comes to my brain. I never really looked for this, ofcorse I love trains. But I live in northern germany, and normaly the trains have two pairs of wheels in the front and back. But some old steamlocs amd the old person cars have 3 wheels in a line. I really never realised how this works... thats so cool, thanks, have a nice cristmas and a happy new year. Stay healthy!

  • @TheKurtsPlaceChannel
    @TheKurtsPlaceChannel Рік тому

    Very nicely put together video and very entertaining as well. Thanks for posting this.

  • @Shipwright1918
    @Shipwright1918 Рік тому +6

    It's a common design feature on model locomotives as well, whether or not the actual prototype had them. The idea being to get through the tighter radius curves typically found in train sets and smaller layouts.
    A lot of newer models don't do this in effort to be more prototypical, but the tradeoff is in practicality, as they need wider curves and long smooth switches to operate properly.

  • @Interesting_Banana
    @Interesting_Banana Рік тому +3

    Love watching the valve gear run, considering it's near impossible to see in normal viewing!

  • @CrAzYJk87
    @CrAzYJk87 Рік тому +7

    I know loco's have metal tyres on their wheels but when your running at the museum do you get more wear on one side of the train than the other because you run in a loop? and do you change running direction to negate the wear? I
    love the channel and from 1 train geek to another keep up the hard work and the educational videos!

    • @Hyce777
      @Hyce777  Рік тому +2

      We do change direction to negate the wear unevenness. But yes, we do see that.

  • @kristenburnout1
    @kristenburnout1 Рік тому +6

    Awesome video, the graphics (and fewer wheels perhaps?) made this much easier to follow for me than the earlier videos on the 491. And BTW if you ever visit Norway (for some reason lol) you could visit the Urskog-Høland line, it's a 750mm narrow gauge railway which has a really neat collection of Hartmann-built 2-6-2 locomotives, one of which was donated to my uni (It still works and us mechanical engineering students drive it regularly!).

  • @pianoboylaker6560
    @pianoboylaker6560 Рік тому +7

    Absolutely bloody fascinating. I once thought that there was something wrong with me for being interested in how the slippy dippy iron wheels ran on raised iron tracks, but seeing these videos I now know that I'm not the only one who has wondered how the wheels stayed on the tracks.
    Many thanks for your time in filming these beautiful beasts so that people like me can be like little boys once more.

  • @stevenormandin2059
    @stevenormandin2059 Рік тому

    I am LOVING IT :) AWESOME FOOTAGE !

  • @spagelsmegal
    @spagelsmegal Рік тому

    Loving the new editing style I’m glad the footage turned out amazing

  • @Tristan_S346
    @Tristan_S346 Рік тому

    Wow these animations just kicked the entire video up a few notches to compliment the usual information dump :)

  • @williamscoggin1509
    @williamscoggin1509 Рік тому

    This bottom of the wheel film footage kind of freak me out first time seeing it. Those wheels are moving all over the place as far as never knowing about that much left right motion especially in a curve. Never thought about all the travel happening that way to that degree, and also the people laying out the track on straightaways curves and merges, which I understand now has a whole lot of math going on as far as incremental rail separation, probably not the right terminology but it's all I know. LOL open up a whole new world of thinking as far as exactness to this level of laying rails for this to happen successfully. Excellent video! 👍🏻👍🏻🇺🇲

  • @silentwatch2260
    @silentwatch2260 Рік тому

    Definitely a great topic for people that like trains!

  • @ChaosAgent1218
    @ChaosAgent1218 Рік тому +2

    Watching what the engine did when it slipped was very interesting

  • @SternLX
    @SternLX Рік тому +3

    I was playing with the camera angles in RO! while running the Glenbrook through a 30m right hand curve and noted the center Blind Set drivers were completely floating OFF the rails with them to the left of the wheel set. 30m radius is stupid sharp for a 2-6-0 like the Glenbrook but doable. For the record that was a test piece of track. I try to keep all my tight curves >36-37m radius otherwise rolling stock I noticed like to "Wallow" around in the grade. The Realistic physics settings in RO! are pretty close to real but need a lot more work. Especially if you have a perfectly strait, flat, and long stretch of tangent track, too much speed and rolling stock wants bounce out of it. Makes no sense.

  • @josephadda3492
    @josephadda3492 Рік тому

    Very interesting video. Good idea using the snow for filling in light to illuminate the gear. Make a suggestion. You need TWO cameras. On on each side of the same axle. That way you can see the interaction and how the engine is flexing all over. Thanks Jeff.

    • @Hyce777
      @Hyce777  Рік тому

      I've got four cameras now, but at the time of filming this I only had two, and only had just enough time to capture each axle. Gotta fit in with operational needs too, it's an odd balance to make.

  • @poowg2657
    @poowg2657 Рік тому +5

    Great view of the Stephenson valve gear in action. A real push rod engine!

  • @amazingdecks1
    @amazingdecks1 Рік тому +4

    A lot of work to put this together; fascinating to see it in practice. Theoretically, in this example, there must be wheel slippage because the driving wheels are mechanically connected and must rotate at exactly the same rotational velocity. Rounding a curve, the leading and trailing axles would naturally shift to the outside to maintain equal surface velocity of the inside and outside wheels - the contact circumferences remain equal. Any wheels between the leading and trailing wheels would have a different surface speed from the leading and trailing because their contact circumference has not changed. A difficult engineering problem to solve.

  • @JohnDavies-cn3ro
    @JohnDavies-cn3ro Рік тому

    That's an interesting film. Seeing how the wheels behave is quite fascinating. Our 9F class 2-10-0's (The 'Evening Star' type) had blind centre drivers to ease them on curves due to their length. At various times they were used on a number of British locomotives, the most notorious being a Dean 4-2-4 tank engine on the Great Western. The trouble was than not only did it have blind driving wheels but the designer's patent 'centreless' bogies either end. No centering pin, but with sideways movement controlled by swing links. It worked beautifully on coaches...... but made it impossible for the engine to stay on the track. After one disastrous trip up and down the yards at Swindon it was quietly hidden away, then 'reduced to stores' and the company's official photographer instructed to have a 'little accident' with the plate glass negative he'd just taken........

    • @Hyce777
      @Hyce777  Рік тому

      Lordy, yeah, that sounds like one for history

  • @bpark10001
    @bpark10001 Рік тому

    I have an 1/8th scale 10 wheeler (7.5" gauge). My layout has 14' radius turns (that would scale to 112' radius turns in your layout). To get my engine to manage such tight turns, I had to blind the center driver. I left the original 3 degree taper, but without the flange, on the center driver. I needed to make it a lot wider.
    I also needed to make extensive modifications to the pilot truck. First, the sideways swing needed to be increased to 1.375" from 0.375" (that would be 11" versus 3" in full scale). I also needed to add a mechanism to adjust the axles out-of-parallel (so each axle remains perpendicular to the rails). Without this, the leading outside wheel climbs over the rail. Because of the wide swing, the levers connecting the pilot to the engine needed to be elongated by factor of 16. The tops of the levers just clear the boiler. The engine works great on my layout, except for backing up.

  • @altacat9702
    @altacat9702 Рік тому

    Thank you ...really fun to see the self.centering action of the tapered wheels. ....my father.and I learned about this embarrassing late in life !!! Hahaha!!! : )

  • @yann5427
    @yann5427 Рік тому

    This 11 minutes video felt like 2 minutes. Keep up the good work!

  • @williamscoggin1509
    @williamscoggin1509 Рік тому

    I wonder if the train companies have any films in this depth that engineers that are going to be driving the trains get to watch as a visual aid for learning? I know this is on types of trains that aren't used these days but it would be part of learning why engines are like they are now, and where in the past designers tried to take the engines and actually made it work but as you say not feasible in the long run. I'm 65 and just fascinated about this video, thank you.

    • @Hyce777
      @Hyce777  Рік тому

      Glad you enjoyed, I don't believe there's video like this out there in industry - wasn't when I was a part of it in 2017-2020 at least.

  • @baronjutter
    @baronjutter Рік тому

    Thanks for explaining blind drivers, Parrot man!

  • @leokimvideo
    @leokimvideo Рік тому +1

    Flanges are very overrated, a good modern well engineered railway system should never have the wheel flange touch the rails

    • @Hyce777
      @Hyce777  Рік тому

      Modern yes, in these eras, and for narrow gauge - you *absolutely* need the flanges.

  • @ImmortalAbsol
    @ImmortalAbsol Рік тому

    The snow shows you the collective travel of the wheels in some places.
    Collective probably isn't the right term but hopefully it makes sense.

  • @wellingtonnorthjunction3911

    Our 9F 2-10-0 has a flangeless wheel in the Center so it can go around corners

  • @mackjsm7105
    @mackjsm7105 Рік тому

    wow.. dude.. this was so interesting!! TY!

  • @feeldennis
    @feeldennis Рік тому

    How did the youtube algorithm get me onto this video? But I could not stop watching. you get a like for this video.

    • @Hyce777
      @Hyce777  Рік тому

      I am not sure, but I'm glad you enjoyed! The algorithm is a strange beast.

  • @heiderichvladimir7341
    @heiderichvladimir7341 Рік тому

    Weight is a crucial factor due to string forces. If the train is heavy and it's in a right curve, the wheels at the right end of the locomotive will have the flanges scraping the track while the front left ones will do the same thing. Left front and right back will be lose/the flange will be distant from the track.
    My hypothetic guess about the bogie straightening when the wheels slipped because of the oscillation that reduced friction for all wheels which "freed" the bogie and made it swing to the center due to said oscillation and reduce friction to the track. Surely the left and right motion of the oscillation causes a bit of up and down motion as well but these are very minimal events that last not even a second but combined they give us the results we see.

  • @CaptainSloose
    @CaptainSloose Рік тому +4

    Hyce....i gotta say bud. Every single video you get amaze me with how well you descibe, animate, and film the context and content. This is really fantastic stuff for train nerds. I love literally everything you do. Please never stop!

  • @johnm9263
    @johnm9263 Рік тому +2

    i initially thought the graphic of the wheel indicator was some sort of artefact, or covering up some sort of metadata imposed on the video itself......
    then i realized they were changing color along with each shot, along with you saying which wheel it was, and now it feels very clever

  • @paulfronczak1817
    @paulfronczak1817 Рік тому

    Nicely done...kind cool to see that.

  • @cameronmccreary4758
    @cameronmccreary4758 Рік тому +2

    THAT was very interesting, Hyce. It would be nice to compare the diesel locomotives with these steam locomotives.

  • @The.Conqueeftador
    @The.Conqueeftador Рік тому

    The British 9f has a similar wheel set. The 9f is a 2-10-0 with the centre driving axel (3rd) having no flange.

  • @Rylee_G
    @Rylee_G Рік тому

    this made me anxious

  • @OzzmanStudios
    @OzzmanStudios Рік тому +3

    Another noteworthy locomotive that has a blind driver is Little River Railroad #110. And I believe this is a similar set up, the middle driver is blind as 110 was a logging engine in Tennessee! Awesome video!

  • @edwarddillon6016
    @edwarddillon6016 Рік тому

    Awesome video!. I have never seen a steam locomotive in real time. Hopefully that will change soon.

  • @greekpapi
    @greekpapi Рік тому

    This is good info!!!! I have to admit, I never paid attention to this!!!!

  • @CoryAY82383
    @CoryAY82383 Рік тому +3

    Really loving these "how it works" videos! Please keep them coming and maybe even equipment tours showing off some museum rolling stock.

  • @abrahamyehoshuafrias3390
    @abrahamyehoshuafrias3390 Рік тому

    The anxiety in this is over 100%

  • @draketherailfanSPSF
    @draketherailfanSPSF Рік тому

    Its so cool that a driver can be blind and still have traction

  • @YurtFerguson
    @YurtFerguson Рік тому +1

    Hey Hyce! Been loving the content, all the fun train facts and the Railroads Online series with Kahn. But I just happened to have a thought about the game. You had talked about how the sound of the engines in the game weren't accurate under load to how they would be and it had me thinking. There is another UA-camr named Ange the Great who has been working on a real time fluid physics engine that can simulate fairly accurate internal combustion engine sounds with load and strain. It may be an interesting idea to reach out and talk to him about it as he's working on making the simulation even better and it may even be an asset that could be used in RRO to make it even more realistic sounding !

    • @YurtFerguson
      @YurtFerguson Рік тому

      It may even be able to simulate accurate whistle noises as well.

    • @Hyce777
      @Hyce777  Рік тому

      That would be cool, I'll check it out but I don't work for the game anymore so...

    • @YurtFerguson
      @YurtFerguson Рік тому

      @@Hyce777 Ohh sorry about that, but still loving your content, been watching all your vids on the museum and it's made it a definite road trip destination for me in the future.

  • @Lucius_Chiaraviglio
    @Lucius_Chiaraviglio Рік тому +1

    At the B&O Railroad Museum in the late 1980s, I saw a small standard gauge 4-6-0 (not all that much bigger than a 4-4-0) from the late 1800s that had both the 1st and 2nd drivers flangeless (presumably the lead bogie had no sideways freedom of movement, unlike here), but instead of the slight dual taper shown here, I could have sworn the profiles of both of these drivers were just plain flat.

  • @wernerdanler2742
    @wernerdanler2742 Рік тому

    I believe it was when you were showing the 2nd drive wheel that there was some kind of mechanical action going on under the body of the locomotive. It looked like piston rods moving on a crank shaft.
    The drive mechanism is other outside of the wheels, so what are those things on the inside?

    • @ThunderClawShocktrix
      @ThunderClawShocktrix Рік тому +1

      that controls the vales that let the steam in and out of the cylinder

  • @Midland1072Productions
    @Midland1072Productions Рік тому +4

    I'd never thought 20 would have a blind driver being a smaller locomotive so it's neat to see how it works. Also love the evolution of the graphics and editing :)

    • @Hyce777
      @Hyce777  Рік тому +7

      Yeah dude I was honestly surprised while I was piling around 20 the other week. "Wait the middle driver is blind??? Why?!?!"

    • @Midland1072Productions
      @Midland1072Productions Рік тому

      @@Hyce777 Seriously!!! Makes you wonder, though as your video shows, it does seem to help at least a little bit.

  • @Peasmouldia
    @Peasmouldia Рік тому

    Last steam locomotive built for British Railways, class 9f 2-10-0 and the others of the class had flangeless middle driving wheels. The 9fs could negotiate quite tight radius curves. Unfortunately the current UK rail authorities don't allow them to run on the mainline these days. The thinking is that modern point work can't handle that middle axles flangeless wheels.
    Ta.

  • @lordsherifftakari4127
    @lordsherifftakari4127 Рік тому +2

    getting a chance to film some big steam on Standard gauge would be awesome!
    my guess is that a standard gauge Consolidation 2-8-0 would behave nearly the same as 491 does on narrow gauge.
    but looking underneath a Pacific or Northern that have trailing trucks might be an eye opener!

  • @eriklindgren1980
    @eriklindgren1980 Рік тому

    Good stuff boss! 👏

  • @stevemellin5806
    @stevemellin5806 Рік тому

    Great information Thank you

  • @crystalrock18
    @crystalrock18 Рік тому

    Regarding going to see other preserved heritage railways in the US, do you think you will make it to the EBTRR? If so, that would be awesome! I got to visit out there once and it is a really really neat piece of American History. But, I’m also a nut for anything historical which is another we love what you do Hyce!

    • @Hyce777
      @Hyce777  Рік тому

      I really want to get out to the EBT for sure! I've heard it's incredible.

    • @crystalrock18
      @crystalrock18 Рік тому

      @@Hyce777 the east coast state of America are very beautiful…….and also filled with road rage drivers. I wish I was joking on that one but I’m not. Avoid MD at all costs. But you will love the EBTRR and the folks there; top notch individuals just like at Strasbourg RR.

  • @myrlstone8904
    @myrlstone8904 Рік тому

    I was anticipating you mounting the GoPro to one of the wheel spokes aimed at an adjacent wheel/rail contact area. 😂
    I wonder how much the load being pulled by the locomotive in a curve affects this picture? If one did a vector analysis of the force being applied on the locomotive coupler in a curve, one could compute the force vector towards the inside of the curve being applied to the locomotive coupler. Heavy consist, steep grade, moderately sharp curve: this force could be considerable. Is it enough to change wheel tracking ? Possibly the flangeless wheel advantage would be more apparent.

    • @Hyce777
      @Hyce777  Рік тому

      I bet it is, based on what I saw at the end when she slips.

  • @Der_Yoloist
    @Der_Yoloist Рік тому +3

    If you have events at your museum there should be a screen inside where your videos are playing. You are describing it sooo good. Thank you

    • @Hyce777
      @Hyce777  Рік тому +2

      That would be most excellent! I'll see what we can get figured out.

  • @TheCyberSalvager
    @TheCyberSalvager Рік тому +1

    This reminds me of the British Railways "9F" 2-10-0. I believe that the driving wheels either side of the blind drivers on these have smaller flanges as well.

  • @walterfarley9230
    @walterfarley9230 Рік тому +2

    Blind wheels were common in the mountain logging railroads. Number 110 with the little river lumber company in tn was built like that . Number 110 still runs today with the little river railroad in cold water Michigan.

  • @lanedexter6303
    @lanedexter6303 Рік тому +1

    In Newhalem, WA on the upper Skagit River, you can see “Old Number 6,” a 1928 Baldwin 2-6-2 that was used there until 1956 (later had a brief career on an excursion railroad which went bust). The center 30” drivers are “blind drivers” because they found the engine was binding on the sharp “Shovel Spur” turn, six miles below Newhalem, and they machined the flanges off so the sharp curve could be easily negotiated.

  • @GoingtoHecq
    @GoingtoHecq Рік тому

    Great railroading

  • @Froobyone
    @Froobyone Рік тому

    Very informative.

  • @PikaPetey
    @PikaPetey Рік тому

    I can imagine back in the day trying to check how the wheels are doing on the track while the train is running would involve either some idiot holding another idiot by the ankles or a mirror on a stick.

    • @Hyce777
      @Hyce777  Рік тому

      That's about all I can figure too. This is my favorite part of doing this stuff - has anyone ever gotten to see stuff like this before? It's hard to say.

  • @3ftsteamrwy12
    @3ftsteamrwy12 Рік тому +1

    I remeber reading a memoir by possibly Robert Richardson, founder of the CRRM that when #20 was running towards the end of the RGS, her suspention and springing was so worn out for all intents, she was a 4-4-0, not a 4-6-0, as her blind drivers were very seldom in contact with the track. Kelly Anderson at Strasburg, that helped oversee her 10+ year overhaul stated that #20 was the most comprehesively worn-out locomotive that he ever saw.

  • @neumoi3324
    @neumoi3324 Рік тому +1

    The flanges of the right or left wheels grind against the right or left rails because of centrifugal forces on left or right curves. On tight turns we sometimes hear the screeches and scrapes.

  • @kevinpepperell1941
    @kevinpepperell1941 Рік тому

    It is very interesting to see in practice what the Baldwin locomotive Works standards set out in volume two of their steam locomotive standards manual issue 1949.
    A steam locomotive entering a curve tends to want to travel in a straight line meaning the fixed wheel base will have the leading driving wheel set up against the outside rail and the rear driving wheel set up against the inside rail. this is known as angle of attack or Yaw.
    The front truck through the use of swing links provides a guiding effort to be applied to the locomotive frame to reduce the effect of the Yaw.
    By increasing the load on the drawbar (increased tonnage) will increase the lateral forces being applied to the leading driving wheel set.
    Depending on the radius of the curve, the speed of the locomotive and the load on the drawbar will determine how effective the swing links are in reducing the lateral forces being applied to the front wheel set. Therefore the design of the front truck will suit the optimum size curves and speed the locomotive has been designed to operate through. Kevin Pepperell.

    • @Hyce777
      @Hyce777  Рік тому

      Didn't realize Baldwin had that detail out! That's amazing. Cheers.

    • @JESUSCHRYSLER5512
      @JESUSCHRYSLER5512 Рік тому

      MY BRAIN JUST GOT DARZHNARZHDICATED

    • @JESUSCHRYSLER5512
      @JESUSCHRYSLER5512 Рік тому

      @@Hyce777 YOUR BRAIN JUST GOT DARZHNARZHDICATED

  • @Evergreen1400
    @Evergreen1400 Рік тому

    How much do the wheels wear ? Obviously that question is vague.
    I’d think the fact that the one flange rubs on the inside of the rail during a turn it would not only keep you on the rail but help scrub speed going into the turn to some extent.

    • @Hyce777
      @Hyce777  Рік тому +1

      Surprisingly not that much. We go a long time without needing to re-profile wheels.

  • @m0ther_bra1ned12
    @m0ther_bra1ned12 Рік тому

    I have an HO scale GS4 Daylight I can't use on my track because the curves I have are too tight. Makes me wish the center drive wheels were blind like this real locomotive so it could navigate sharper curves.

    • @maremonte157
      @maremonte157 Рік тому

      Look at the Märklin SK800, they built it like that.

  • @norfolksouthernrailworks1543

    I almost want you to call someone who works with J-611, and ask them to send you clips of it doing a similar set of tracking. A 4-8-4 would be an interesting comparison to how these much smaller much lighter locomotives behave. What do you think?

  • @napalmholocaust9093
    @napalmholocaust9093 Рік тому

    Cool camera set-up. Run some pennies over 😃

  • @TheBlackFoxMaster
    @TheBlackFoxMaster Рік тому +1

    Сейчас этот принцип использую в вело тренажёрах. По сути это самоцентровка.

  • @Ti_Daley
    @Ti_Daley Рік тому

    So, you've done the long wheelbase locomotives, how about short wheelbase locos, or rolling stock wheels (fixed axle and bogie style)

    • @Hyce777
      @Hyce777  Рік тому

      20 is about as short a wheelbase I'm going to find, I think. In the 491 video we did bogie style trucks as well, but fixed axles would be neat as well.

  • @BrooksMoses
    @BrooksMoses Рік тому

    That's fascinating, indeed! What does the reverse taper on the inside of the blind driver do for it? It seems like even on these curves the driver wasn't on that section much, so maybe it doesn't do a lot at all, but I would assume there's some reason for it.

    • @Hyce777
      @Hyce777  Рік тому +1

      I am not 100% certain, but my guess would be to try and keep the axle level side to side if it did ride that far over (it would be on the normal taper on one wheel, and the reverse on the other). Without it, it would try and kick the frame out of alignment.

    • @BrooksMoses
      @BrooksMoses Рік тому

      @@Hyce777 : Oh, that makes sense. Thanks!