Actually a writer on production team during an interview confirmed Jim can take his armor off as a troll. It's just that his intense emotional state made amulet try to protect his by keeping the armor active since it misinterpreted his frustration as him being in a life threatening environment.
Personally I think that Merlin gave Jim a choice on being half troll or remaining human, and the fact that Jim chose to make that sacrifice of turning into a half troll exemplifies his heroicness. Of course Merlin worded it in such a way that turning into a troll was the right choice but after that he did give Jim a *choice*. Being half troll Jim is faster, has better reflexes, isn't as fleshy or fragile. So that definitely allowed him to destroy Gunmar and ward off Angor Rot. About being permanently troll, Merlin can only see glimpses of the future and so he didnt know of Arthurs magic shedding off Jims troll form when he was crushed.
Merlin wasn't right, he was making sure the events of Camelot happened the way he remembered it: with a non-human Trollhunter, another Douxie, Claire with her armor, and Steve tagging along.
@@love-bg5bk it did. When they return Merlin says to Douxie that he remembers that day like it was yesterday. He also says that knowing the future comes with a responsibility. THIS was the responsibility he was talking about. Merlin knew Jim would have that shard that would kill him. He didnt see him resurrect so he again, acted responsible.
If Jim didn’t turn into a troll and killed Gunmar. What happens when the green knight attacks. Jim was badly hurt as a troll so he might have been killed as a human. Maybe Merlin saw this on the time map and prevented his death
3:31 Actually that was the Amulet responding to his emotions, the armor remained because he felt unsafe. It's basically a defense mechanism, but other than that I believe you are right about Merlin manipulating Jim. Jim becoming a human/troll hybrid was a superfluous twist in my opinion.
From my perspective Merlin was right because when Jim turned into a troll he was way stronger than him being human. And lets not forget that every single trollhunter except Jim was troll that meant even if Merlin would not be there it would still mean tradition and someone else would change Jim to being troll
I actually have a theory of why Jim was able to be chosen by the amulet when no other human was. Remember Douxie is the one who powered the amulets gem stone. Its magic is the same colour as his and he knew a specific human would defeat Gunmar. Now this does create a paradox but presuming everyone has a kind of magical signature I think Douxie somehow powered the amulet to choose and troll or this specifically coded human.
I think Merlin shouldn't have manipulated him, but I really don't believe Jim would have survived if he was still human and on top of that he was able to take down even more Gummgumms because of his troll power boost. I believe troll Jim was something that was planned and the reason for it was so the writers could get around Jim's fragile body. Let's be honest, the attacks Jim took as a troll would have ended him had he been human. Like when Gunmar threw Jim on the roof where the battle was won. If Jim was still human in that scene we would all have been questioning how was it that Jim survived. And that's not even getting on the attack from Morgana or the fact that human Jim was weaker than Gunmar in the dark lands, which by the way Gunmar got a power boost. To sum it all up he had to become a troll because otherwise without a doubt he would have been done. You're free to disagree, but just rewatch both eternal knight episodes and you tell me if human Jim would've been able to survive that.
He was right, he was ensuring that when Jim fought those stronger than himself on the future (green knight, Morgana) he was capable u saw how he got tossed around in the end of trollhunters by Morgana human Jim would have died there itself
How Jim could have defeated Gunmar and Angor Rot if he was a human?? He couldn't defeat Gunmar when he was in the darklands and the only reason Angor Rot was killed is because his friends helped him.
It is true that Jim's physical human from was week, which would increase his momentum in his fight against Gunmar. However, I think that it is Jim's knowledge that he was failing as human. Since both Trollmarket and Arcadia was both his home, he could used the geographical advantages. Additionally, just as he defeated Bular, he could used his body size as another advantages. Lastly if he was properly trained by Vendel, using all the stone in the amulet, he could definitly win against almost all adversities.
@@user-sd7xo9zz9u is not enough, jim couldn't even land a hit on a magicless old man, now imagine against two magical and powerful creatures that have centuries of battle expierence and that were the slayers of legendary heroes and villains
@@ElCantarDeGesta5255 But what if Jim was properly trained with the all the Trollhunter's gemstones and received proper training mentally and physically. He could triumph. The reason why he could not land a hit on Merlin because he was not fully prepared. His mind wasn't on the fighting, but only on his mother's rescue. But you have a solid point. Being a half troll did help him in a certain ways.
@@user-sd7xo9zz9u for what i know you can only use one gemstone in the amulet (correct me if im wrong) also i don't think that the stones survived when Gunmar attacked troll market (or at least Blinkous didn't bring them when the incident happened for what i know) also Jim was properly physically trained and we can see that in his fights escenes against possessed Drall and some of the Gumm-Gumms soldiers (wich are difficult to defeat for a human for what we can see in Wizards) mentally no, but is not like if that could have been of much help in his fight against Gunmar and Angor Rot
@@ElCantarDeGesta5255 First of all, the amulet can use up to six stones. Meaning Jim could have used three more stones besides the triumbric stones. In the eternal night part to when Blinky says they will leave once they have gathered what they need from trollmarket. He was most likely referring to the stones and other sacred items. Gunmar only concentrated on conquering the world, not really destroying the trollmarket. If he was mentally trained, he would not have to worry about his mother or his time to adjust as a half troll. This gives him two days to layout plan, and use the geographical advantages. In essence, if he was trained mentally, he did not had to become a troll to win.
I actually really liked Jim turning into a troll. I thought it added a great layer of depth to the story and sent two pretty powerful messages. The first being that sometimes, you just aren't enough. That you may have to make sacrifices that hurt you because you just can't do everything all the time, but that that doesn't mean things won't eventually be okay again. Jim became a troll, he had to, and he had a really hard time at first, but he won, he's alive, his friends and family are safe and that's what matters. But it also pushed a sense of finality and consequence in the end of Trollhunters. Things weren't all okay. Jim was hurt, the Heartstone was destroyed, and the trolls needed to leave. All of these major changes felt really mature and realistic, and gave the characters fantastic growth. (Plus, Troll Jim's design was completely badass) I'm actually quite sad that Jim turned back into a human during Wizards. Edit: I also never really saw Jim being a good Trollhunter because he was human, but rather in spite of being human. He offered a fresh perspective mentally, with new ideas that needed to be shared and brought into troll society. He had empathy, and was kind to his enemies to make them his allies, but Jim always struggled with the more physical aspects of being a Trollhunter. A lot of the time he just couldn't keep up as well. Turning him into a troll was really the best of both worlds. And yeah, Jim beat Gunmar with "only a slice" but that was a major fight with both him and Angor Rot ganging up on him and being thrown all over the place. Him being troll almost certainly saved his skin there, as Angor even remarks on it. Let's face it, his social life was always kinda doomed as the Trollhunter, but he could also probably get a job in Arcadia since they know about the trolls. There's also glamour masks and largely at home work. If he wore enough clothes he could probably be in the sun, not to mention we KNOW there was a stone that could be used in the amulet to circumvent that and I'm sure Merlin knows what it would be and could help Jim get another one. (It also helps reinforce the bittersweetness of the ending)
Just saying it wasn’t that Jim could not take his armour off. It was that he was in a identity crisis, he was not sure who he was. So the amulet locked his armour to keep him safe emotionally or physically
The only reason Merlin made Jim become troll is because Merlin needed to kill Morgana but he’s old and can’t do it alone. So to lock in his chances of winning he made Jim troll so he would get his magic back.
I have an off topic theory, what if what happened in Trollhunters was just a false flag, just like Zootopia? I mean, the Janus Order is similar to the ONA (Order of Nine Angles), and like O9A it engaged in occultism and terrorism. Also, there military didn't take over the Arcadia when people, trolls, and aliens co-existed together, which glows. I wouldn't be surprised if the Janus Order was one of those "secret sociétes" ran by the CIA, a honeypot for occultism and terrorism just like ONA. By the way, the founder of ONA, David Myatt is speculated to be associated with the CIA.
Great video, super interesting thing to think about. Here's kinda my take on all of it (sorry, this is going to be kinda long). First off, I think the whole "Destiny is a gift..." quote is super important, mainly because it plays a huge role in how we should interpret Jim's decisions. Specifically, I think it's important to look at the part that says "never forget that fear is but the precursor to valor, that to strive and triumph in the face of fear is what it means to be a hero. Don't think. Become." Obviously, this quote from Blinky was super important to Jim in the beginning of the story, and is what helped give him the final push to become the trollhunter. But I also think this quote describes and explains Jim's decision to become half-troll (and later full troll), and also why I think Jim becoming full troll and turning back to human WAS planned from the beginning. Let me explain. Near the end of the series, we find out from Merlin that the reason Jim is picked as a trollhunter is because he is a) human, and b) has a big heart and desire to help others (as Merlin says he himself once had). Humans are physically weaker than trolls, so Jim isn't picked because of his physical abilities; his human-ness is so valuable because humans are less solitary than trolls and see a lot of value in relying on each other. This is shown throughout the show, as Jim is victorious oftentimes not because of his fighting abilities, but because of his friends and his human ability to bring them together and work with them. Examples of this include the battle with Bular (which we see later that Drawl would have lost because he went in alone), Angor Rot, etc. So naturally, it, makes sense that Jim's greatest fear is losing his humanity (not his physical qualities, but the mental and emotional ones). This fear is demonstrated to us when Jim goes into the pit where you face your greatest fear that apparently no troll ever makes it out of, and it appears that he's fighting an animalistic, troll-like version of himself. This is where things get interesting, because we have this conflict where Jim really needs an extra power boost to beat Gunmar (it's clear when he goes to the Darklands that while Jim has gotten tougher, he has no chance of actually beating Gunmar, as he once again relies on teamwork to escape), but he's afraid of losing what makes him human (and therefore successful as a trollhunter) if he embraces the darker "troll" side (as we see when he starts training with Strickler). Flash forward to Merlin being a manipulative butsnack to Jim. While Merlin is definitely manipulating him, I think Jim is given a choice; he can choose to fight as a human, which means he won't have to face his greatest fear. OR, he can choose to strive and triumph in the face of his fear of no longer being human. Jim chooses to take the risk that he will no longer have his human qualities in order to have the physical strength to defeat the Gum gums, accepting that in order to have the victory, he would have to make a SACRIFICE. No victory comes without a cost, and for Jim that cost was facing his greatest fear. This completes his heroes journey. I also think the change does make sense in the context of the show; Jim is basically a bridge between the best qualities of humans and trolls (vulnerability and reliance on each other and toughness and resilience), so while the change was definitely a surprise to me, it made a lot of sense to me later. I personally think Merlin was definitely correct that Jim would need the power boost; we see Jim being able to hold off both Gunmar AND Angor Rot at the same time, while previously he was never able to do so. There were several times when Jim got smacked so hard that there's literally no way any human could have survived it, so I think the change was necessary. Here's the kicker though: we find out that while Jim does have to sacrifice his physical human characteristics, his human character still remains; he still has the propensity for sacrifice and teamwork (as we later see in the fight against Morgana and later in Wizards). Jim's character still remains the same, no matter what form he's in, and that is his strength.The risk and sacrifice paid off. *He faced his fear, and strove and triumphed in the face of it, making him a hero.* Furthermore, I personally think Merlin understood that Jim's true strength came from his character, and that that character wouldn't be stripped away by the change to being a troll. So to me, this makes Merlin doubly right, as much as I hate him. This is why I think that Jim turning full troll and back human was planned from the start; it's to show us that what makes Jim the trollhunter is his character *which never changes.* It only seems natural that Jim goes back to his original form, or the person that he is inside, so that he can figure this out for himself in Rise of the Titans and accept that he's worthy of wielding Excalibur. I'm literally so hype for the setup for this movie, it blows my mind. Sorry this is so insanely long, I just had to put these thoughts out somewhere with some fellow trollhunter fans. Great videos, I love trollhunter theories!
Oh my god u are fabulous very nice explaining and i was always in favor that Merlin was right .... It was correct for jim to face his greatest fear to be a hero and to save the world... We all just had to see Jim's all phases so now trollhunters rise of the titans willl set a perfect ending and a balanced one too for jim as he will weild excalibur
OKAY I FINISHED READING. Firstly, Toby. I'm sure you've seen Rise of the Titans. And as much as I would've agreed with you about Jim's character pre-Rise of the Titans, idk if I still can now. I mean, the idea was that what made Jim the Trollhunter was his character. Now tho, that the amulet chose toby, the theory can't stand because Toby doesn't have the same character Jim does. In the first episode, when he saw Steve bullying Eli, he was the one who told Jim that they shouldn't get involved. In the ending of rise of the titans, he did the same thing. AS MUCH AS I LOVE TOBY, I don't think he's capable of being the next Trollhunter. I'm not ac disagreeing with you lol, just wanted to add my own thoughts.
I FOUND JIMS BIGGEST FEAR! Remember what he saw in the deep? Remember how Green Knight was calling him? Remember what Jim told to Arthur when he call him 'Beast'? The Jim was in the deep.. and he is already start to begin with...and sure he will be if he get broken with all those is happening to him...because he is the young Atlas...but he have been doing adventures...adventures wich one of those is a part of him....thats why the new movie is 'Rise of the TITANS' because Atlas was....is a Titan...from the strongest actually and his is the titan...who was holding the earth in greek mythology.....and he was suffering a lot..BUT A LOT... he was the ONLY one how was suffering sooooo much!So........ I am afraid Jim's biggest fear is............ To he began a monster............... Thats why he was so angry when Arthur called him....... A Beast.........
From what I believe, Merlin did know that Jim could be back. With foreseeing not through the timeline constructor, his divinity allowed him to see much more. For example, he already foresaw Jim becoming Trollhunter millennia away. Because Merlin knew that sharing his knowledge could do too much damage to the nexus point in the time line, he chose to conceal it instead. (Only my thoughts)
I really didn’t like that Merlin turned him into a troll, because the whole point of season 1 was that being human makes him a great troll hunter. 1) he can work in the daylight instead of fighting in the shadows like his predecessors 2) he can protect both human and troll worlds, and use human technologies and troll magic. 3) his humanity stops him from using rule #2, and that helped him later on when he spared Chomsky and Chomsky later went into the dark lands and helped save enrique. So the whole point is MERLIN WAS WRONG
not watched the video yet, so Idk if you've said this, but when Merlin tells jim he can see into the future and expected him to be taller and older, this could be talking about Merlins memories from when Jim went back in time and told him about being the first human Trollhunter. Like maybe merlin assumed the size he was as a troll was the same as his human size.
Btw: when Douxie and his friends went back in time, douxie was powerful so he was able to stop morgana but in the original battles of killahead Merlin sealed morgana.
A lot of interesting information. I also think there is a possibility that Jim could have defeated Gunmar as a human. However, fighting both him and Angor rot would have made the battle more difficult for him.
Honestly Human Jim wouldve actually Beat Gunmar but it would take Hours considering how Powerful Season 3 Gunmar is. He was Amped with the Heartstone which gave him Unlimited Power and full Strength. Angor is a different story though, We can See Angor landing hits on Jim without Gunmar's Help because Gunmar was knocked out in the Rubble for a minute. And Angor easily Grazed Troll Jim with his Creeper Sun Poison blade. Angor could hold his own against Morgana (He possibly couldve defeated her) even with One Eye. Jim couldnt handle a second with Morgana, But Angor made it look so easy because of his fast Agility, Speed, and Power. As far as i can tell, Season 3 Angor is the strongest Troll we have ever seen (Troll Jim can come close) Because Angor had full access to his Body and Soul. Although it kinda seemed like he lost his magic and powerful abilities.
People wanting him back human being the driving force of them changing him back was definitely true but that’s the only part of this I can agree with. Maybe he would be able to make the killing blow as a human but you forget that as a full human he wouldn’t of got to the point of making the killing blow on Gunmar with everything that happened in that two on one fight. And as a full troll the cut from the creepers sun blade would slowly kill him after and most trolls aren’t actually shown to be small or fast enough to do what he as a half troll did. Yes Merlin knew the outcome of him turning into a half troll so that definitely influenced his words cause he knew Jim would have the physicality he ends up with. But as they say many Trollhunters died at Bular’s hand, note how Jim killed Bular in a one on one fight using his size to his advantage. We can only assume Gunmar is stronger than Bular so he needed an edge and the way that fight went before the killing blow was delt I think shows he needed that edge. Lastly, there’s a thing called hybrid vigour where a half breed of two species is superior to the parent species, for example Ligers and Mules, I think the hybrid vigour of being half human, half troll is what was needed here. People go on about him being turned into a troll as though he isn’t still half human, he’s pretty much confirmed to be half and in his physicality that shows and gives him advantages over both Trolls and humans.
I just noticed something about The helmet that Jim unlocks after putting in one of the triumbric stones, the horns on the helmet are exactly the same as the ones he has after turning into a half troll.
Simple correction.Make Jim a wizard like Claire him using both the amulets magic and his own makes him stronger probably even strong enough to beat even Morgana.
Here’s the thing that I have noticed, (yes I know this video is 3 years old) even though it only took a quick slice as you said, that was the end result. When Jim started fighting gunmar, it was a 2 on 1. He would have DIED as a human in that scenario, 100%. Also, Gunmar was weakened already from fighting with Jim earlier. So even if it wasn’t a 2 on 1 I think he still would have lost as a human because A he definitely couldn’t have done that quick and strong of a slice before, and B Gunnar wouldn’t have been weakened to the point where he would be that slow to react.
I'd like to add on that gunmar was amped by the heart stone when he and angor fought Jim and when he ad jim foght in the dark lands he was physically at his weakest
The only thing about Merlin is that he didn't know too much about shadow magic and its emotions so maybe Merlin was mistaken about being a troll and hunter forever?
This is going to be a late comment Alot of people tend to forget that Merlin had alot on his plate in both trollhunter and in wizards it doesnt help that when we see him in the situations are very important and life or death in trollhunter Morgana was going to be unsealed and bring forth the eternal night, then there's the fact his current trollhunter wouldn't/isn't be strong enough to even stop let alone beat gunmar or provide aid with Morgana then theres the fact he isnt at his strongest when facing Morgana and we see this as he was getting ragdolled by Morgana Then in wizards merlin was in a war and his timeline gets messed up and hes trying his best fix it/keep it intact to make sure things go the way there supposed to but they dont While yes in both shows merlin comes off like a jerk that because he understands the gravity of the situations we see this in his scuffle with jim when jim calls him a jerk he doesnt deny it but hes not wrong in his point of view isnt jim strong enough to and he was trying to get him to understand that in wizards from his point of view his student has been know to take the easy way and messed up before so he's going to have a hard time listening to or trusting him with anything especially if it means thag a key to winning a war is at risk
quick question: do you think that the events in wizards when they went back in time were the same as the events at the original battle of killahead or no?
In my opinion, the original timeline did not involve Douxie's time travel, but when they went back in the past they were forced to orchestrate so that everything would work correctly, they were very lucky to have a normal future again, a sense that in their trip there could have been major changes
Deya was not the first Trollhunter, but evidence of the regular timeline was Gunmar’s lost eye, which would mean that Tellad-Ur helped Gunmar challenge Orlagk and he lost his eye in the process. But the timeline is skewed because Deya struck Gunmar across the neck, not kicked him into the bridge. And, Bular got injured by AAARRRGGH, not tossed by Nimue.
I don’t know Merlin was being a jurk about it and making one side of the argument stronger than the other but I think Jim would have a better chance as a troll than as a human there was a 1% chance that Jim would of beat ganmar and angorrot at the same time
when you mentioned merlin said jim needed to be more human reminded me of in the dragon prince when viren was slowly gaining power through the three seasons through manipulating other characters or telling stories reflecting his pride and dark magic.
Jim was happy as a troll but was always in danger. ALSOOOOOOOOOOo since Jim was always in danger that's why he couldn't take his armour off. It reacts to his emotional state. I also just straight-up love half-trolljim
In my stories after Jim returns to new timeline he becomes half troll again but this time he can eat both real food and inanimate stuff and he is immune to sunlight
Jim turned human because he was in full troll state and he died in that state so only his human part was left and he became a full troll because of the green knights shard which Merlin did not know existed
3:10 the chance of this is small, but maybe Merlin didn't know that the stuff that the arcane order did to him would actually turn him into a human again. We won't ever know ofc and it is unlikely.
It was actually stated that “The eclipse blade wont be enough to defeat Gunamar”, this likely refers to Jim’s human “strength”, or AP(Attack Potency). We know Gunmar was able to tank lods of heavy attacks, so just welding the Eclipse Blade, as a human child… wont be enough to slice through Gunamr, he needed the physical force, or “power” to push through him. This is likely, because if it were Troll Jim slicing him with the Sword of Daylight, then he’d barely even scratch Gunmar. So your argument saying “Jim could’ve easily sliced through Gunmar “, doesn’t pillar, because the series exploits this os false in every way. Even Strictlor, and Numora agree that his humanity wasn’t enough. So the potion that Merlin gave to Jim was very much needed, and likelt amped his mentality a bit as well, since he didn’t have the will power to finish a fight, even when he had the “Troll Dust”within him, as a human(Episode: “Coffee”, I do believe) Merlin was very much right, the only reason everything lead up to the events of “Rise of the Titans”, was because… One, no one knew that the Arcane Order revived King Arthor. And two, when they did find out… Merin was instantly killed, so…
He could have survived his fight with Gunmar but his fight with Morgana.. I'm pretty sure he would have died as a human in many instances of that battle (and let's remember that Merlin's focus was on Morgana, he wasn't worried about Gunmar)
Dude I don't think Jim could have survived the fight in his human form, he already tried to defeat Gunmar while he was in the darklands and he failed (Gunmar almost killed him) and now that Gunmar had the power of the heartstone it could'been impossible to kill, also we have to remember that he was fighting Angor Rot too at the same time
@@ElCantarDeGesta5255Not only That but Gunmar was at his weakest aswell, No power and he barely had any strength in the Darklands while Jim had the Eclipse blade
Why would Merlin make Jim a troll, if he was powerless as a troll in wizards? I’m still confused about why Jim couldn’t summon the eclipse blade Maybe cause of the corruption?
I would’ve been fine with Jim becoming a troll if Merlin hadn’t been such a jerk about it. Like forcefully taking out the amulet and stuff like seriously. And like Jim wouldn’t have been able to go to school anymore and go out in daylight but like if Merlin was more calm about it and weighed out any other possible options with Jim instead of being so forceful about it and yelling then I would’ve been fine but no. He was a jerk. I don’t like Merlin.
you do have to think merlin does not know shadow magic’s which douxie said in wizards, but now that claire know shadow magic ,just like morgana she has healing ability’s.
Why didn't Merlin just make a potion that gave jim superhuman abilities like super strength, speed, agility, durability like a troll but he would still be human otherwise he would just be superhuman.
I personally don’t think he was right. Jim clearly regretted it after he did it and seemed almost heartbroken and helpless, you could say it was the only way but we know Jim already essentially beat gunmar once, when gunmar was controlling one of the changelings . I think he could have done it in the finale as well while still remaining a human. Blinky once told Jim after strickler gave him the grave sand that what made him such a good trollhunter was his humanity, taking it away almost seems wrong even if it’s for the better. The whole shows plot was how he was the first human trollhunter, so when they made him half troll it just kinda annoyed me. Which kinda makes the 3rd season my least favorite of the 3 seasons in the original show. I felt like he was meant to remain the human trollhunter, it was what made him the best one so far in my opinion. Jim completely lost his human life after the season 2 finale. While we know now it was reversed it’s still horrible. He missed out on highschool, being with his mom, going outside and being a teenager. Remember, he was literally only a teenager. As a teenager I don’t think I could do that. He was also manipulated into making a decision, even strickler was against it
I think Merlin is 50% wrong and 50% right because based on seasons 1 and 2 of trollhunters when Jim had to fight the bad Trolls he couldn't really defeat them all that easily he kept having to go back to fight them on a different day. But when he was turned into a troll later in season 3 he was a lot stronger and he was able to do a quick slice with his sword and defeat Gunmar. And I was thinking that in Rise of the Titans if Krel and Douxie did work together to create another amulet and give it to Jim I'm thinking that they should change it a bit to wear when Jim says "For the glory of Merlin daylight is mine to command" that it would just give him his normal armor but when Jim says "For the Doom of gunmar eclipse is mine to command" that would put him in his Eclipse armor and turn him into a troll because of the strength and his head could be protected with a helmet. And when Jim was done with his Eclipse armor and his troll form he could turn back into a human all he had to do was think of his human form and the amulet would turn him back.💙 (🤓)
I’m obviously a year late to this video, but I want to say it anyways. I think Merlin was wrong, but I don’t think it was a bad writing decision. Merlin is a asshole, we all know that much. And he also likes to be in control. He said that Jim, though chosen for being human, was never destined to remain that way- so he planned that beforehand. He probably did think that only human wasn’t enough, even that only troll wasn’t enough. I do think he believed that. However, he takes that assumption and treats it as truth. And while he did technically give Jim a choice, there was a lot of guilt tripping and manipulation, so it was almost sure that he would do it. I liked the decision to make troll Jim because it shows what lengths Merlin is willing to go to make sure his plans go his way. And expanding on the writing choice, I think they could’ve done more with that decision after besides what they did with Wizards. Because Merlin absolutely ruined Jim’s future by doing that, and there wasn’t even a payoff for it. It could have been a great chance for character interactions and tensions. Barbara was furious with Merlin after he changed him; wouldn’t it have been a great character moment to see Jim be angry about it after the act? We got a fantastic episode of how he dealt with it initially, but those feelings aren’t just going to vanish. Especially when dealing with the chance that he didn’t even have to go through it, it would just show how unfair it is. His life got ruined for nothing. I think it could’ve been a good line to follow.
Why does everybody hate Merlin. He has seen various the happen over the course of 2000 yrs of his lifetime. Tbh melon isn’t selfish at all he is just the type of person who wouldn’t risk the world for one person.
I disagree, become half troll and half human was the only way ti defeat gunmar and angor rott, Just because jim had "the best of two worlds", he was strong like a troll, and he was agile like a human
I think Merlin makes Jim half-troll so he could survive after Arthur hit him! If he was human then he could not survive that he could lose so much blood and so much pain! So is better to he be half-troll because he didn't feel so much pain then than when he was human! Also I think Merlin didn't like so much Jim and i think he had a good reason about that!
@@User_Maria_25795 i thought that you were talking when Arthur was hunting trolls and then Jim got hited by Arthur when he found him with Claire and Morgana lol, you should have said "Green knight" and yes, they are the same but im not used of that because in the legends, Arthur and the green knight are different characters
I thought jim should have been able to switch from troll to human so he can live his life but also have the strength and abilities to fight the bad guys
Dude your amazing ok I love your vids I’m a big troll hunters fan like huge and if you can keep doing these type of vids I will totally support you ok just keep on going and also I would really like to know more about Jim and Claire if that’s ok and reply to me if you can thanks dude
Turning him into a troll (or half troll) he deprived Jim of one of his greatest if not the greatest advantage he had over the trolls: Immunity to daylight.
But at the same time, that didn't matter in the context of of the Eternal Night because there was no daylight. But in any other situation, it is a huge limitation.
i am 1 of your first subcribers i saw i grow up with subs from like 10 subs to 1.73k love u and keep the good work =) ( and idk if i was the 10th subcriber or the 50th sorry idk maybe you can see if i was the 10th or 50th) love u again
Merlin was wrong. He is a toolbag. Jim should never have become a half troll ... And guess how canon proves Jim could've defeated Gunmar as a human just fine? Here: In the Janus Order headquarters, Jim fights AN IDENTICAL CLONE OF GUNMAR. AND KILLS " GUNMAR," AS A HUMAN. What's more... GUNMAR HIMSELF WAS CONTROLLING THAT CLONE with his Decimaar Blade. So, basically,that was a test run to see if Jim could slay Gunmar as a full human in his regular detachable armor ... WHICH HE DID. And , here's he thing; love Half Troll Jim all you want, but Jim himself,did not love it at all. By November,in Wizards timeline, he'd accepted it,but being " half troll Full Hunter" did not help him at all, completely the opposite. Not to mention...what sort of unfortunate offspring would he and Claire have had? Unable to live normal lives themselves?
You are wrong, first of all that wasn't a clone, Gunmar was possessing Otto and that's why he died when the normal blade hited him, Otto could die with the normal blade but Gunmar can't, since the beginning is very clear that only the eclipse blade could slay Gunmar because as Blinky said once, the daylight blade have fought many times against Gunmar but it was never able to kill him
merlin was right actually, just think about it, the ghost counselors have many experiences with gunmar, but they couldn't kill him with the eclipse sword, which means Jim might be dead due to gunmar's brutality
Merlin is right about Jim to become a half troll so he can be come stronger and faster and Jim could not fight gunmar in the dark lands. And about merlin saying to Jim that he will become a troll forever and he can't become human again but Jim did become human it is bc of Claire's dark magic and doxic said in wizards that merlin does not know dark magic.
No. He may have been right about Jim being troll to defeat Gunmar(that is the ONLY thing I agree with). However,the way he went about getting want he wanted was destructive. He was a total dick. He may have "nicer" in Wizards but he was only 10%nicer than he was in Trollhunters He doesn't care about being kind/reasonable/nice. He only cares about being right.
I think Merlin was right but his method was wrong Gunmar who was stronger then his first self who beat Jim in 1v1 Angor Rot who was one of Jim's biggest enemies and Morgana who was almost equal to Merlin ı mean Merlin wasn't at his strongest form so how the hell can we expect Jim beating both Gunmar and Angor Rot also Green Knight who Jim fought later on who hurted Half-Troll Jim pretty badly so ı think ıf Jim didn't turn into a Half-Troll they couldn't win and why he is unhappy is pretty clearfirst they were at the edge of a fight and they start to travel so what can you expect he was leaving home and when he turned into human he wasn't a HALF-Troll he was a 100% troll not only that but he was controlled by the green knight what can you expect
It doesn't make him "wrong", it makes him a coward. He's so afraid of the idea of there being a fraction of a chance to lose to Morgana that he is willing to do whatever he personally deems to be "the right thing", including removing free will from others and never listening to the words coming out of anyone's mouth except his own, in order to prevent that. He's also a massive narcissist and has an ego the size of the Taj Mahal, but that's beside the point. There's no way that it could be a "temporal loop" situation, either, because there were very clearly differences in how things were handled originally in Camelot versus the story with Jim and present Douxie that we got in Wizards, case in point Merlin. The Merlin we see for the majority of Wizards isn't the one who woke up in Trollhunters, it's the Merlin from Camelot. The Merlin that dies is the past version of Merlin, which creates a paradox if it were a temporal loop. Camelot-era Merlin can't both die in front of present-day Douxie AND go to sleep in his tomb to be found by Jim centuries later. This is why I hate that they ever paint Merlin in the "He's always right!" light or as a wise being, because he very clearly isn't. Literally in the first scene we meet him, he's wrong. He predicted Jim to be much taller, and 30 years old. Merlin does not see "the" future, he sees "a" future, and does whatever he thinks is right in order to prevent even the slightest possibility of that future from happening if he deems it unsatisfactory, throwing the regards of all others to the wayside. It's the same line of thinking as Carol Danvers in Civil War 2.
Actually a writer on production team during an interview confirmed Jim can take his armor off as a troll. It's just that his intense emotional state made amulet try to protect his by keeping the armor active since it misinterpreted his frustration as him being in a life threatening environment.
This is cool! Thanks for confirming this, I was wondering about that
"Troll Jim was the biggest debate between the community"
*Rise of Titans entering*
Personally I think that Merlin gave Jim a choice on being half troll or remaining human, and the fact that Jim chose to make that sacrifice of turning into a half troll exemplifies his heroicness. Of course Merlin worded it in such a way that turning into a troll was the right choice but after that he did give Jim a *choice*.
Being half troll Jim is faster, has better reflexes, isn't as fleshy or fragile. So that definitely allowed him to destroy Gunmar and ward off Angor Rot. About being permanently troll, Merlin can only see glimpses of the future and so he didnt know of Arthurs magic shedding off Jims troll form when he was crushed.
Merlin wasn't right, he was making sure the events of Camelot happened the way he remembered it: with a non-human Trollhunter, another Douxie, Claire with her armor, and Steve tagging along.
I agree; How would Jim and Claire react to the parlor trick in "For the Glory of Merlin" if they saw what happened in Wizards?
He would be dead the shard would have killed him before any of that happened xD
That doesn't make sense because that past did not exist
@@love-bg5bk Or did it?!?
@@love-bg5bk it did. When they return Merlin says to Douxie that he remembers that day like it was yesterday. He also says that knowing the future comes with a responsibility. THIS was the responsibility he was talking about. Merlin knew Jim would have that shard that would kill him. He didnt see him resurrect so he again, acted responsible.
Salesman: *slaps trollhunters fandom* “this bad boy can fit so much hate for Merlin in it, it’s incredible!”
Lmao
If Jim didn’t turn into a troll and killed Gunmar. What happens when the green knight attacks. Jim was badly hurt as a troll so he might have been killed as a human. Maybe Merlin saw this on the time map and prevented his death
3:31 Actually that was the Amulet responding to his emotions, the armor remained because he felt unsafe. It's basically a defense mechanism, but other than that I believe you are right about Merlin manipulating Jim. Jim becoming a human/troll hybrid was a superfluous twist in my opinion.
You are so stupid Tim with a diet against the Green Knight and Morgana
Yeah I think ur right
Agreed
Maybe The only reason merlin said he cant be changed back was because he was ☠dead when it happened
From my perspective Merlin was right because when Jim turned into a troll he was way stronger than him being human.
And lets not forget that every single trollhunter except Jim was troll that meant even if Merlin would not be there it would still mean tradition and someone else would change Jim to being troll
I actually have a theory of why Jim was able to be chosen by the amulet when no other human was.
Remember Douxie is the one who powered the amulets gem stone. Its magic is the same colour as his and he knew a specific human would defeat Gunmar. Now this does create a paradox but presuming everyone has a kind of magical signature I think Douxie somehow powered the amulet to choose and troll or this specifically coded human.
I totally agree
If Jim tried to fight Gunmar as he a human he would have been killed even if Gunnar was destroyed
@@kirstinemmanuel-sule4175 Let's not forget that jim had to battle angor rot and gunmar both together.
I agree and the fact he would have been dead if he wasn’t a troll because he was literally thrown across town
Human jim wouldve died to Morgana's final attack as his durability as a troll is what allowed him to take the final blast
I think Merlin shouldn't have manipulated him, but I really don't believe Jim would have survived if he was still human and on top of that he was able to take down even more Gummgumms because of his troll power boost. I believe troll Jim was something that was planned and the reason for it was so the writers could get around Jim's fragile body. Let's be honest, the attacks Jim took as a troll would have ended him had he been human. Like when Gunmar threw Jim on the roof where the battle was won. If Jim was still human in that scene we would all have been questioning how was it that Jim survived. And that's not even getting on the attack from Morgana or the fact that human Jim was weaker than Gunmar in the dark lands, which by the way Gunmar got a power boost. To sum it all up he had to become a troll because otherwise without a doubt he would have been done. You're free to disagree, but just rewatch both eternal knight episodes and you tell me if human Jim would've been able to survive that.
I agree with you on that. No way Jim would have survived that if he was still human.
He was right, he was ensuring that when Jim fought those stronger than himself on the future (green knight, Morgana) he was capable u saw how he got tossed around in the end of trollhunters by Morgana human Jim would have died there itself
How Jim could have defeated Gunmar and Angor Rot if he was a human?? He couldn't defeat Gunmar when he was in the darklands and the only reason Angor Rot was killed is because his friends helped him.
It is true that Jim's physical human from was week, which would increase his momentum in his fight against Gunmar. However, I think that it is Jim's knowledge that he was failing as human. Since both Trollmarket and Arcadia was both his home, he could used the geographical advantages. Additionally, just as he defeated Bular, he could used his body size as another advantages. Lastly if he was properly trained by Vendel, using all the stone in the amulet, he could definitly win against almost all adversities.
@@user-sd7xo9zz9u is not enough, jim couldn't even land a hit on a magicless old man, now imagine against two magical and powerful creatures that have centuries of battle expierence and that were the slayers of legendary heroes and villains
@@ElCantarDeGesta5255 But what if Jim was properly trained with the all the Trollhunter's gemstones and received proper training mentally and physically. He could triumph. The reason why he could not land a hit on Merlin because he was not fully prepared. His mind wasn't on the fighting, but only on his mother's rescue. But you have a solid point. Being a half troll did help him in a certain ways.
@@user-sd7xo9zz9u for what i know you can only use one gemstone in the amulet (correct me if im wrong) also i don't think that the stones survived when Gunmar attacked troll market (or at least Blinkous didn't bring them when the incident happened for what i know) also Jim was properly physically trained and we can see that in his fights escenes against possessed Drall and some of the Gumm-Gumms soldiers (wich are difficult to defeat for a human for what we can see in Wizards) mentally no, but is not like if that could have been of much help in his fight against Gunmar and Angor Rot
@@ElCantarDeGesta5255 First of all, the amulet can use up to six stones. Meaning Jim could have used three more stones besides the triumbric stones. In the eternal night part to when Blinky says they will leave once they have gathered what they need from trollmarket. He was most likely referring to the stones and other sacred items. Gunmar only concentrated on conquering the world, not really destroying the trollmarket. If he was mentally trained, he would not have to worry about his mother or his time to adjust as a half troll. This gives him two days to layout plan, and use the geographical advantages. In essence, if he was trained mentally, he did not had to become a troll to win.
I actually really liked Jim turning into a troll. I thought it added a great layer of depth to the story and sent two pretty powerful messages. The first being that sometimes, you just aren't enough. That you may have to make sacrifices that hurt you because you just can't do everything all the time, but that that doesn't mean things won't eventually be okay again. Jim became a troll, he had to, and he had a really hard time at first, but he won, he's alive, his friends and family are safe and that's what matters. But it also pushed a sense of finality and consequence in the end of Trollhunters. Things weren't all okay. Jim was hurt, the Heartstone was destroyed, and the trolls needed to leave. All of these major changes felt really mature and realistic, and gave the characters fantastic growth. (Plus, Troll Jim's design was completely badass)
I'm actually quite sad that Jim turned back into a human during Wizards.
Edit: I also never really saw Jim being a good Trollhunter because he was human, but rather in spite of being human. He offered a fresh perspective mentally, with new ideas that needed to be shared and brought into troll society. He had empathy, and was kind to his enemies to make them his allies, but Jim always struggled with the more physical aspects of being a Trollhunter. A lot of the time he just couldn't keep up as well. Turning him into a troll was really the best of both worlds.
And yeah, Jim beat Gunmar with "only a slice" but that was a major fight with both him and Angor Rot ganging up on him and being thrown all over the place. Him being troll almost certainly saved his skin there, as Angor even remarks on it.
Let's face it, his social life was always kinda doomed as the Trollhunter, but he could also probably get a job in Arcadia since they know about the trolls. There's also glamour masks and largely at home work. If he wore enough clothes he could probably be in the sun, not to mention we KNOW there was a stone that could be used in the amulet to circumvent that and I'm sure Merlin knows what it would be and could help Jim get another one. (It also helps reinforce the bittersweetness of the ending)
It ruined jims character because the whole point of trollhunters was that Jim was a human trollhunter and becoming a troll ruins that
Maybe he needed to be a troll to have the agility to land the strike on Gunmar.
Just saying it wasn’t that Jim could not take his armour off. It was that he was in a identity crisis, he was not sure who he was. So the amulet locked his armour to keep him safe emotionally or physically
The only reason Merlin made Jim become troll is because Merlin needed to kill Morgana but he’s old and can’t do it alone. So to lock in his chances of winning he made Jim troll so he would get his magic back.
I have an off topic theory, what if what happened in Trollhunters was just a false flag, just like Zootopia?
I mean, the Janus Order is similar to the ONA (Order of Nine Angles), and like O9A it engaged in occultism and terrorism.
Also, there military didn't take over the Arcadia when people, trolls, and aliens co-existed together, which glows.
I wouldn't be surprised if the Janus Order was one of those "secret sociétes" ran by the CIA, a honeypot for occultism and terrorism just like ONA.
By the way, the founder of ONA, David Myatt is speculated to be associated with the CIA.
Great video, super interesting thing to think about. Here's kinda my take on all of it (sorry, this is going to be kinda long).
First off, I think the whole "Destiny is a gift..." quote is super important, mainly because it plays a huge role in how we should interpret Jim's decisions. Specifically, I think it's important to look at the part that says "never forget that fear is but the precursor to valor, that to strive and triumph in the face of fear is what it means to be a hero. Don't think. Become." Obviously, this quote from Blinky was super important to Jim in the beginning of the story, and is what helped give him the final push to become the trollhunter. But I also think this quote describes and explains Jim's decision to become half-troll (and later full troll), and also why I think Jim becoming full troll and turning back to human WAS planned from the beginning. Let me explain.
Near the end of the series, we find out from Merlin that the reason Jim is picked as a trollhunter is because he is a) human, and b) has a big heart and desire to help others (as Merlin says he himself once had). Humans are physically weaker than trolls, so Jim isn't picked because of his physical abilities; his human-ness is so valuable because humans are less solitary than trolls and see a lot of value in relying on each other. This is shown throughout the show, as Jim is victorious oftentimes not because of his fighting abilities, but because of his friends and his human ability to bring them together and work with them. Examples of this include the battle with Bular (which we see later that Drawl would have lost because he went in alone), Angor Rot, etc. So naturally, it, makes sense that Jim's greatest fear is losing his humanity (not his physical qualities, but the mental and emotional ones). This fear is demonstrated to us when Jim goes into the pit where you face your greatest fear that apparently no troll ever makes it out of, and it appears that he's fighting an animalistic, troll-like version of himself. This is where things get interesting, because we have this conflict where Jim really needs an extra power boost to beat Gunmar (it's clear when he goes to the Darklands that while Jim has gotten tougher, he has no chance of actually beating Gunmar, as he once again relies on teamwork to escape), but he's afraid of losing what makes him human (and therefore successful as a trollhunter) if he embraces the darker "troll" side (as we see when he starts training with Strickler).
Flash forward to Merlin being a manipulative butsnack to Jim. While Merlin is definitely manipulating him, I think Jim is given a choice; he can choose to fight as a human, which means he won't have to face his greatest fear. OR, he can choose to strive and triumph in the face of his fear of no longer being human. Jim chooses to take the risk that he will no longer have his human qualities in order to have the physical strength to defeat the Gum gums, accepting that in order to have the victory, he would have to make a SACRIFICE. No victory comes without a cost, and for Jim that cost was facing his greatest fear. This completes his heroes journey. I also think the change does make sense in the context of the show; Jim is basically a bridge between the best qualities of humans and trolls (vulnerability and reliance on each other and toughness and resilience), so while the change was definitely a surprise to me, it made a lot of sense to me later.
I personally think Merlin was definitely correct that Jim would need the power boost; we see Jim being able to hold off both Gunmar AND Angor Rot at the same time, while previously he was never able to do so. There were several times when Jim got smacked so hard that there's literally no way any human could have survived it, so I think the change was necessary.
Here's the kicker though: we find out that while Jim does have to sacrifice his physical human characteristics, his human character still remains; he still has the propensity for sacrifice and teamwork (as we later see in the fight against Morgana and later in Wizards). Jim's character still remains the same, no matter what form he's in, and that is his strength.The risk and sacrifice paid off. *He faced his fear, and strove and triumphed in the face of it, making him a hero.*
Furthermore, I personally think Merlin understood that Jim's true strength came from his character, and that that character wouldn't be stripped away by the change to being a troll. So to me, this makes Merlin doubly right, as much as I hate him.
This is why I think that Jim turning full troll and back human was planned from the start; it's to show us that what makes Jim the trollhunter is his character *which never changes.* It only seems natural that Jim goes back to his original form, or the person that he is inside, so that he can figure this out for himself in Rise of the Titans and accept that he's worthy of wielding Excalibur. I'm literally so hype for the setup for this movie, it blows my mind.
Sorry this is so insanely long, I just had to put these thoughts out somewhere with some fellow trollhunter fans. Great videos, I love trollhunter theories!
Oh my god u are fabulous very nice explaining and i was always in favor that Merlin was right .... It was correct for jim to face his greatest fear to be a hero and to save the world... We all just had to see Jim's all phases so now trollhunters rise of the titans willl set a perfect ending and a balanced one too for jim as he will weild excalibur
AHAHAHHA OKAY IM GOING TO READ ALL OF THIS, EVEN IF IT REQUIRES A FEW EXTRA BRAIN CELLS 😤
OKAY I FINISHED READING. Firstly, Toby. I'm sure you've seen Rise of the Titans. And as much as I would've agreed with you about Jim's character pre-Rise of the Titans, idk if I still can now. I mean, the idea was that what made Jim the Trollhunter was his character. Now tho, that the amulet chose toby, the theory can't stand because Toby doesn't have the same character Jim does. In the first episode, when he saw Steve bullying Eli, he was the one who told Jim that they shouldn't get involved. In the ending of rise of the titans, he did the same thing. AS MUCH AS I LOVE TOBY, I don't think he's capable of being the next Trollhunter. I'm not ac disagreeing with you lol, just wanted to add my own thoughts.
@@cadencev5572 Yeah, honestly, I was not super happy with the ending, I thought it kinda messed up a lot of stuff
i ain’t reading allatw
He knew he was being a jerk, he told Jim that if he could overpower him. Then what do you think Gunnar or Angor Rot would do?
I FOUND JIMS BIGGEST FEAR!
Remember what he saw in the deep? Remember how Green Knight was calling him? Remember what Jim told to Arthur when he call him 'Beast'?
The Jim was in the deep.. and he is already start to begin with...and sure he will be if he get broken with all those is happening to him...because he is the young Atlas...but he have been doing adventures...adventures wich one of those is a part of him....thats why the new movie is 'Rise of the TITANS' because Atlas was....is a Titan...from the strongest actually and his is the titan...who was holding the earth in greek mythology.....and he was suffering a lot..BUT A LOT... he was the ONLY one how was suffering sooooo much!So........
I am afraid Jim's biggest fear is............
To he began a monster...............
Thats why he was so angry when Arthur called him.......
A Beast.........
Merlin did not know that he could be changed back
From what I believe, Merlin did know that Jim could be back. With foreseeing not through the timeline constructor, his divinity allowed him to see much more. For example, he already foresaw Jim becoming Trollhunter millennia away. Because Merlin knew that sharing his knowledge could do too much damage to the nexus point in the time line, he chose to conceal it instead. (Only my thoughts)
2:27 he just said that part of him would not be the same, not that he would be stuck as a troll forever.
I really didn’t like that Merlin turned him into a troll, because the whole point of season 1 was that being human makes him a great troll hunter.
1) he can work in the daylight instead of fighting in the shadows like his predecessors
2) he can protect both human and troll worlds, and use human technologies and troll magic.
3) his humanity stops him from using rule #2, and that helped him later on when he spared Chomsky and Chomsky later went into the dark lands and helped save enrique.
So the whole point is MERLIN WAS WRONG
not watched the video yet, so Idk if you've said this, but when Merlin tells jim he can see into the future and expected him to be taller and older, this could be talking about Merlins memories from when Jim went back in time and told him about being the first human Trollhunter. Like maybe merlin assumed the size he was as a troll was the same as his human size.
Btw: when Douxie and his friends went back in time, douxie was powerful so he was able to stop morgana but in the original battles of killahead Merlin sealed morgana.
A lot of interesting information. I also think there is a possibility that Jim could have defeated Gunmar as a human. However, fighting both him and Angor rot would have made the battle more difficult for him.
Honestly Human Jim wouldve actually Beat Gunmar but it would take Hours considering how Powerful Season 3 Gunmar is. He was Amped with the Heartstone which gave him Unlimited Power and full Strength. Angor is a different story though, We can See Angor landing hits on Jim without Gunmar's Help because Gunmar was knocked out in the Rubble for a minute. And Angor easily Grazed Troll Jim with his Creeper Sun Poison blade. Angor could hold his own against Morgana (He possibly couldve defeated her) even with One Eye. Jim couldnt handle a second with Morgana, But Angor made it look so easy because of his fast Agility, Speed, and Power. As far as i can tell, Season 3 Angor is the strongest Troll we have ever seen (Troll Jim can come close) Because Angor had full access to his Body and Soul. Although it kinda seemed like he lost his magic and powerful abilities.
People wanting him back human being the driving force of them changing him back was definitely true but that’s the only part of this I can agree with.
Maybe he would be able to make the killing blow as a human but you forget that as a full human he wouldn’t of got to the point of making the killing blow on Gunmar with everything that happened in that two on one fight.
And as a full troll the cut from the creepers sun blade would slowly kill him after and most trolls aren’t actually shown to be small or fast enough to do what he as a half troll did.
Yes Merlin knew the outcome of him turning into a half troll so that definitely influenced his words cause he knew Jim would have the physicality he ends up with. But as they say many Trollhunters died at Bular’s hand, note how Jim killed Bular in a one on one fight using his size to his advantage. We can only assume Gunmar is stronger than Bular so he needed an edge and the way that fight went before the killing blow was delt I think shows he needed that edge.
Lastly, there’s a thing called hybrid vigour where a half breed of two species is superior to the parent species, for example Ligers and Mules, I think the hybrid vigour of being half human, half troll is what was needed here. People go on about him being turned into a troll as though he isn’t still half human, he’s pretty much confirmed to be half and in his physicality that shows and gives him advantages over both Trolls and humans.
I just noticed something about The helmet that Jim unlocks after putting in one of the triumbric stones, the horns on the helmet are exactly the same as the ones he has after turning into a half troll.
Not exactly
What’s different about them?
Simple correction.Make Jim a wizard like Claire him using both the amulets magic and his own makes him stronger probably even strong enough to beat even Morgana.
this was a really good video! i hope you post more content like this, it's very entertaining hearing u talk about ur opinions and such about toa :D
Here’s the thing that I have noticed, (yes I know this video is 3 years old) even though it only took a quick slice as you said, that was the end result. When Jim started fighting gunmar, it was a 2 on 1. He would have DIED as a human in that scenario, 100%. Also, Gunmar was weakened already from fighting with Jim earlier. So even if it wasn’t a 2 on 1 I think he still would have lost as a human because A he definitely couldn’t have done that quick and strong of a slice before, and B Gunnar wouldn’t have been weakened to the point where he would be that slow to react.
I'd like to add on that gunmar was amped by the heart stone when he and angor fought Jim and when he ad jim foght in the dark lands he was physically at his weakest
Jim could take off his armor it was just his emotional state
He isn't even strong enough to fight Angie rot in his human state
In season 1 Jim did kill angie rot. And in season 1 he was a human.
The only way he was able to get to the stage of killing Gunmar was by his troll side
The only thing about Merlin is that he didn't know too much about shadow magic and its emotions so maybe Merlin was mistaken about being a troll and hunter forever?
I think that Merlin was partically right
Jim would have died if he wasn't a troll, he was trown by Morgana across the whole town
If he couldn't take off the armor that would be really uncomfortable
Next video, do “What if Orlagk won the Clash of the Gumm-Gumms”.
This is going to be a late comment
Alot of people tend to forget that Merlin had alot on his plate in both trollhunter and in wizards it doesnt help that when we see him in the situations are very important and life or death
in trollhunter Morgana was going to be unsealed and bring forth the eternal night, then there's the fact his current trollhunter wouldn't/isn't be strong enough to even stop let alone beat gunmar or provide aid with Morgana then theres the fact he isnt at his strongest when facing Morgana and we see this as he was getting ragdolled by Morgana
Then in wizards merlin was in a war and his timeline gets messed up and hes trying his best fix it/keep it intact to make sure things go the way there supposed to but they dont
While yes in both shows merlin comes off like a jerk that because he understands the gravity of the situations we see this in his scuffle with jim when jim calls him a jerk he doesnt deny it but hes not wrong in his point of view isnt jim strong enough to and he was trying to get him to understand that
in wizards from his point of view his student has been know to take the easy way and messed up before so he's going to have a hard time listening to or trusting him with anything especially if it means thag a key to winning a war is at risk
Jim had gotten cut by Angor’s creeper sun poison and didn’t die, but if he was human it most likely would’ve been game over.
But Jim was bleeding instead of having the purple Lines like Aargh had. He was still human so it wouldnt have killed him.
What would a Half troll Jim and a human baby look like?
quick question: do you think that the events in wizards when they went back in time were the same as the events at the original battle of killahead or no?
In my opinion, the original timeline did not involve Douxie's time travel, but when they went back in the past they were forced to orchestrate so that everything would work correctly, they were very lucky to have a normal future again, a sense that in their trip there could have been major changes
Deya was not the first Trollhunter, but evidence of the regular timeline was Gunmar’s lost eye, which would mean that Tellad-Ur helped Gunmar challenge Orlagk and he lost his eye in the process. But the timeline is skewed because Deya struck Gunmar across the neck, not kicked him into the bridge. And, Bular got injured by AAARRRGGH, not tossed by Nimue.
@@leewong7421 actually daya was still the first trollhunter cause the stone thingy she held had her true name
But I think the timeline got branched from them time travelling
@@Blaze20075 , that doesn’t mean anything tho
If human jim got beat up by a depowerd wizard. what chance would he have had against gunmar and angor rot? he would have been killed very very fast.
I don’t know Merlin was being a jurk about it and making one side of the argument stronger than the other but I think Jim would have a better chance as a troll than as a human there was a 1% chance that Jim would of beat ganmar and angorrot at the same time
If he was human
when you mentioned merlin said jim needed to be more human reminded me of in the dragon prince when viren was slowly gaining power through the three seasons through manipulating other characters or telling stories reflecting his pride and dark magic.
my opinion: if you can't tell right from wrong it is better that way
Jim was happy as a troll but was always in danger. ALSOOOOOOOOOOo since Jim was always in danger that's why he couldn't take his armour off. It reacts to his emotional state. I also just straight-up love half-trolljim
Jim wasnt happy as a troll
In my stories after Jim returns to new timeline he becomes half troll again but this time he can eat both real food and inanimate stuff and he is immune to sunlight
Jim turned human because he was in full troll state and he died in that state so only his human part was left and he became a full troll because of the green knights shard which Merlin did not know existed
3:10 the chance of this is small, but maybe Merlin didn't know that the stuff that the arcane order did to him would actually turn him into a human again. We won't ever know ofc and it is unlikely.
It was actually stated that “The eclipse blade wont be enough to defeat Gunamar”, this likely refers to Jim’s human “strength”, or AP(Attack Potency).
We know Gunmar was able to tank lods of heavy attacks, so just welding the Eclipse Blade, as a human child… wont be enough to slice through Gunamr, he needed the physical force, or “power” to push through him. This is likely, because if it were Troll Jim slicing him with the Sword of Daylight, then he’d barely even scratch Gunmar.
So your argument saying “Jim could’ve easily sliced through Gunmar “, doesn’t pillar, because the series exploits this os false in every way. Even Strictlor, and Numora agree that his humanity wasn’t enough. So the potion that Merlin gave to Jim was very much needed, and likelt amped his mentality a bit as well, since he didn’t have the will power to finish a fight, even when he had the “Troll Dust”within him, as a human(Episode: “Coffee”, I do believe)
Merlin was very much right, the only reason everything lead up to the events of “Rise of the Titans”, was because… One, no one knew that the Arcane Order revived King Arthor. And two, when they did find out… Merin was instantly killed, so…
W
I believe Merlin was wrong to turn gym into a troll the whole point of the show is the show that troll hunters can be humans and trolls
I THINK HE WAS GREADY AND WANTED A HIGHR CHANES AT WINNG AND DIDNT CARE ABOUT ANYONE ELSE
Maybe he knows that it's not permanent he was trying to hide the truth from others.
If he was not a troll morgana would have killed him in one shot
If Jim was not a troll how could've he got on the roof where Gunmar was slayed in the first place? Jim would've died by that throw on the roof
did you forget that merlin can glimpse the future
He can only see glimpses of the future nor glimpse into the future
He could have survived his fight with Gunmar but his fight with Morgana.. I'm pretty sure he would have died as a human in many instances of that battle (and let's remember that Merlin's focus was on Morgana, he wasn't worried about Gunmar)
Dude I don't think Jim could have survived the fight in his human form, he already tried to defeat Gunmar while he was in the darklands and he failed (Gunmar almost killed him) and now that Gunmar had the power of the heartstone it could'been impossible to kill, also we have to remember that he was fighting Angor Rot too at the same time
@@ElCantarDeGesta5255Not only That but Gunmar was at his weakest aswell, No power and he barely had any strength in the Darklands while Jim had the Eclipse blade
Why would Merlin make Jim a troll, if he was powerless as a troll in wizards? I’m still confused about why Jim couldn’t summon the eclipse blade Maybe cause of the corruption?
He couldn’t use the sword. Because the shardhit his amulet and was corrupted and meant he couldn’t summon his sword
I would’ve been fine with Jim becoming a troll if Merlin hadn’t been such a jerk about it. Like forcefully taking out the amulet and stuff like seriously. And like Jim wouldn’t have been able to go to school anymore and go out in daylight but like if Merlin was more calm about it and weighed out any other possible options with Jim instead of being so forceful about it and yelling then I would’ve been fine but no. He was a jerk. I don’t like Merlin.
you do have to think merlin does not know shadow magic’s which douxie said in wizards, but now that claire know shadow magic ,just like morgana she has healing ability’s.
Why didn't Merlin just make a potion that gave jim superhuman abilities like super strength, speed, agility, durability like a troll but he would still be human otherwise he would just be superhuman.
I don’t think there are poitions like that since why didn’t blinky give one to Jim or the Janis order to Gunmar
@@havynphung7897 yeah but if anyone could make a potion like that it's Merlin.
I personally don’t think he was right.
Jim clearly regretted it after he did it and seemed almost heartbroken and helpless, you could say it was the only way but we know Jim already essentially beat gunmar once, when gunmar was controlling one of the changelings . I think he could have done it in the finale as well while still remaining a human.
Blinky once told Jim after strickler gave him the grave sand that what made him such a good trollhunter was his humanity, taking it away almost seems wrong even if it’s for the better.
The whole shows plot was how he was the first human trollhunter, so when they made him half troll it just kinda annoyed me. Which kinda makes the 3rd season my least favorite of the 3 seasons in the original show. I felt like he was meant to remain the human trollhunter, it was what made him the best one so far in my opinion.
Jim completely lost his human life after the season 2 finale. While we know now it was reversed it’s still horrible. He missed out on highschool, being with his mom, going outside and being a teenager. Remember, he was literally only a teenager. As a teenager I don’t think I could do that. He was also manipulated into making a decision, even strickler was against it
What he did was wrong for Jim, but right for the story
i think merlin never liked jim....
I think Merlin is 50% wrong and 50% right because based on seasons 1 and 2 of trollhunters when Jim had to fight the bad Trolls he couldn't really defeat them all that easily he kept having to go back to fight them on a different day. But when he was turned into a troll later in season 3 he was a lot stronger and he was able to do a quick slice with his sword and defeat Gunmar. And I was thinking that in Rise of the Titans if Krel and Douxie did work together to create another amulet and give it to Jim I'm thinking that they should change it a bit to wear when Jim says "For the glory of Merlin daylight is mine to command" that it would just give him his normal armor but when Jim says "For the Doom of gunmar eclipse is mine to command" that would put him in his Eclipse armor and turn him into a troll because of the strength and his head could be protected with a helmet. And when Jim was done with his Eclipse armor and his troll form he could turn back into a human all he had to do was think of his human form and the amulet would turn him back.💙
(🤓)
I totally agree with you but the thing is if jim wasn't a troll I don't think he would have been able to handle angeroth and gonmar at the same time
I’m obviously a year late to this video, but I want to say it anyways. I think Merlin was wrong, but I don’t think it was a bad writing decision. Merlin is a asshole, we all know that much. And he also likes to be in control. He said that Jim, though chosen for being human, was never destined to remain that way- so he planned that beforehand. He probably did think that only human wasn’t enough, even that only troll wasn’t enough. I do think he believed that. However, he takes that assumption and treats it as truth. And while he did technically give Jim a choice, there was a lot of guilt tripping and manipulation, so it was almost sure that he would do it. I liked the decision to make troll Jim because it shows what lengths Merlin is willing to go to make sure his plans go his way. And expanding on the writing choice, I think they could’ve done more with that decision after besides what they did with Wizards. Because Merlin absolutely ruined Jim’s future by doing that, and there wasn’t even a payoff for it. It could have been a great chance for character interactions and tensions. Barbara was furious with Merlin after he changed him; wouldn’t it have been a great character moment to see Jim be angry about it after the act? We got a fantastic episode of how he dealt with it initially, but those feelings aren’t just going to vanish. Especially when dealing with the chance that he didn’t even have to go through it, it would just show how unfair it is. His life got ruined for nothing. I think it could’ve been a good line to follow.
Why does everybody hate Merlin. He has seen various the happen over the course of 2000 yrs of his lifetime. Tbh melon isn’t selfish at all he is just the type of person who wouldn’t risk the world for one person.
Agreed I would do the same leave Jim there
*melón*
Well he was kinda of a jerk but he was a jerk with good intentions
If he was a human he wouldn’t have been Jim beast in wizards and would have changed the plot
i liked troll jim and he would have been beat a lot earlier in the fight of him gunmar and angor rot
I disagree, become half troll and half human was the only way ti defeat gunmar and angor rott, Just because jim had "the best of two worlds", he was strong like a troll, and he was agile like a human
I just wanted to ask if Trollhunters the rise of titans will be like the last movie or seriala that will end Tales of Arcadia or there will be more.
took the words right out of my mouth
Jim technically did died as such the amulet would never accept him again.
Yes how did Jim that he could kill going to fight off the Godmother sword could do that to a human
I think Merlin makes Jim half-troll so he could survive after Arthur hit him! If he was human then he could not survive that he could lose so much blood and so much pain! So is better to he be half-troll because he didn't feel so much pain then than when he was human! Also I think Merlin didn't like so much Jim and i think he had a good reason about that!
Yeah but Arthur could not have hitted him if he was a human
@@User_Maria_25795 i thought that you were talking when Arthur was hunting trolls and then Jim got hited by Arthur when he found him with Claire and Morgana lol, you should have said "Green knight" and yes, they are the same but im not used of that because in the legends, Arthur and the green knight are different characters
@@ElCantarDeGesta5255 yes they are I am pretty sure the green knight protects in the legends and is not a big ass killer
@@aquador8594 eh not exactly, the green knight is a villian, is literally a cruel prank of Morgana to Sir Gawaine in most versions of the legends
@@aquador8594 but Arthur has his reasons to hate trolls if we think about it
I really liked the concept but I think it had to be changed (Jim turning human) which Luckily he did.
I thought jim should have been able to switch from troll to human so he can live his life but also have the strength and abilities to fight the bad guys
But then he would of been a changling or something
I lit cried after.. jim sorta died
Dude your amazing ok I love your vids I’m a big troll hunters fan like huge and if you can keep doing these type of vids I will totally support you ok just keep on going and also I would really like to know more about Jim and Claire if that’s ok and reply to me if you can thanks dude
Thanks for watching my videos and I will keep making more content!
@@DoctorHero your welcome and do you think rise of the Titans is going to be good or bad let em know any time
Turning him into a troll (or half troll) he deprived Jim of one of his greatest if not the greatest advantage he had over the trolls: Immunity to daylight.
But at the same time, that didn't matter in the context of of the Eternal Night because there was no daylight. But in any other situation, it is a huge limitation.
@@DoctorHero yeah, I know, I was referring to future battles or scouting for a new hearthstone
He did it to save the world. That’s a good cause
The confusing thing is that the trollhunters in the void said the amulets sword hit Gunnar a thousand times but Jim killed hi in one hit
Because only the eclipse sword can kill Gunmar.
@@t10malayalam30But Jim was still using Daylight. It had a dark red color to it due to Merlin's Elixir. He even called the sword Daylight.
i am 1 of your first subcribers i saw i grow up with subs from like 10 subs to 1.73k love u and keep the good work =) ( and idk if i was the 10th subcriber or the 50th sorry idk maybe you can see if i was the 10th or 50th) love u again
I think he would of been fine with human Jim if he was older like he thought
MERLIN DOESNT KNOW SHODOW MAGIC
Merlin was wrong. He is a toolbag. Jim should never have become a half troll ...
And guess how canon proves Jim could've defeated Gunmar as a human just fine?
Here:
In the Janus Order headquarters, Jim fights AN IDENTICAL CLONE OF GUNMAR. AND KILLS " GUNMAR," AS A HUMAN.
What's more... GUNMAR HIMSELF WAS CONTROLLING THAT CLONE with his Decimaar Blade. So, basically,that was a test run to see if Jim could slay Gunmar as a full human in his regular detachable armor ... WHICH HE DID. And , here's he thing; love Half Troll Jim all you want, but Jim himself,did not love it at all. By November,in Wizards timeline, he'd accepted it,but being " half troll Full Hunter" did not help him at all, completely the opposite. Not to mention...what sort of unfortunate offspring would he and Claire have had? Unable to live normal lives themselves?
You are wrong, first of all that wasn't a clone, Gunmar was possessing Otto and that's why he died when the normal blade hited him, Otto could die with the normal blade but Gunmar can't, since the beginning is very clear that only the eclipse blade could slay Gunmar because as Blinky said once, the daylight blade have fought many times against Gunmar but it was never able to kill him
merlin was right actually, just think about it, the ghost counselors have many experiences with gunmar, but they couldn't kill him with the eclipse sword, which means Jim might be dead due to gunmar's brutality
Jim Meeting Merlin = Jim Suffering
Dude technically Merlin saved Jim's butt from getting killed in battle
I like to pretend Merlin and everything afterwards never happened.
Doctor if it wasn’t for Merlin than it would’ve been a mess. He was right because it helped Jim in so many ways
Merlin is right about Jim to become a half troll so he can be come stronger and faster and Jim could not fight gunmar in the dark lands. And about merlin saying to Jim that he will become a troll forever and he can't become human again but Jim did become human it is bc of Claire's dark magic and doxic said in wizards that merlin does not know dark magic.
Please teach us jim lake voice impressions please🥺
Didn't kanjigar said that telling the future will doom it,im guessing thats what merlin did
No. He may have been right about Jim being troll to defeat Gunmar(that is the ONLY thing I agree with). However,the way he went about getting want he wanted was destructive. He was a total dick.
He may have "nicer" in Wizards but he was only 10%nicer than he was in Trollhunters
He doesn't care about being kind/reasonable/nice. He only cares about being right.
I swear you use to heart people’s comments and now you don’t :(
Huh "boom
I think Merlin was right but his method was wrong Gunmar who was stronger then his first self who beat Jim in 1v1 Angor Rot who was one of Jim's biggest enemies and Morgana who was almost equal to Merlin ı mean Merlin wasn't at his strongest form so how the hell can we expect Jim beating both Gunmar and Angor Rot also Green Knight who Jim fought later on who hurted Half-Troll Jim pretty badly so ı think ıf Jim didn't turn into a Half-Troll they couldn't win and why he is unhappy is pretty clearfirst they were at the edge of a fight and they start to travel so what can you expect he was leaving home and when he turned into human he wasn't a HALF-Troll he was a 100% troll not only that but he was controlled by the green knight what can you expect
It doesn't make him "wrong", it makes him a coward. He's so afraid of the idea of there being a fraction of a chance to lose to Morgana that he is willing to do whatever he personally deems to be "the right thing", including removing free will from others and never listening to the words coming out of anyone's mouth except his own, in order to prevent that. He's also a massive narcissist and has an ego the size of the Taj Mahal, but that's beside the point.
There's no way that it could be a "temporal loop" situation, either, because there were very clearly differences in how things were handled originally in Camelot versus the story with Jim and present Douxie that we got in Wizards, case in point Merlin. The Merlin we see for the majority of Wizards isn't the one who woke up in Trollhunters, it's the Merlin from Camelot. The Merlin that dies is the past version of Merlin, which creates a paradox if it were a temporal loop. Camelot-era Merlin can't both die in front of present-day Douxie AND go to sleep in his tomb to be found by Jim centuries later.
This is why I hate that they ever paint Merlin in the "He's always right!" light or as a wise being, because he very clearly isn't. Literally in the first scene we meet him, he's wrong. He predicted Jim to be much taller, and 30 years old. Merlin does not see "the" future, he sees "a" future, and does whatever he thinks is right in order to prevent even the slightest possibility of that future from happening if he deems it unsatisfactory, throwing the regards of all others to the wayside. It's the same line of thinking as Carol Danvers in Civil War 2.