Danny Padilla is the most underrated of that time. He is the closest to a 5'4" version of Arnold that ever was or ever will be. Move ahead to Lee Priest.....who is the most underrated of all time. He got a raw deal.
Cutler is underrated. Sorry, can't agree with you about him being overrated. Cutler is also the best spokesman for bodybuilding ever. He's always good to his fans and willing to take time to pose with them for photos, signing autographs, etc..
I appreciate Frank Zane. His influence helped make many bodybuilders more aesthetic instead of just pregnant cows like you see mostly nowadays. It's very Greek Godlike. Then again, his body is more for the female gaze, not so much mass steroid male gaze. No wonder those guys get hated.
@wildmike951 so was Cormeir..jay was 1 inch shorter and 10 pounds heavier with most of that size difference in his midsection which made him blocky looking..Cormier was huge also with much better lines and asthetics..go Google the 2 of them together and Cormier looks so much better
Larry Scott was incredible. 20-inch, perfectly balanced arms 60 years ago! Can you imagine what someone with his genetics would have looked like in the 90's? How can you judge someone as being overrated at the time when you likely were not even born yet?
Larry Scott legendary 1960s bodybuilder, unbeatable & invincible, dream matchup, 1960s mid 1960s larry Scott invincible & unbeatable against invincible & unbeatable Sergio Oliva late 1960s
Thank you saying Frank Zane is overrated! I’ve always thought the same thing. And you’re dead on that Lou would have won all those Olympias had he not retired. Not Zane.
Lou retired too early in bodybuilding terms, but it was the right choice for his career and fame. Way more people know him as the Incredible Hulk than as a bodybuilding competitor.
Zane brought something different. That how it always was in the competition of bodybuilding. When Dorian Yates brought in the era of Mass muscle. That was the standard. Now people are tired of that shit to the point that people want to see a more aesthetic look than big ass freaks.
Jay seems like a true gentleman, and I'd love to meet him. I just met Victor Martinez at the NY Pro last weekend. Super nice guy. Sat down next to me and we talked for a few minutes.
@@bobjohnson1633 his competition was weak. Some mr Olympias have to be perfect to beat the competition. And some just didn’t have much elite competition. Dickerson won during a time when the competition was at its weakest. He was the best of the worst. And everyone knows it already.
@@RonDaSantis that’s a stretch . Arnold was winning during the weakest era of all time . He beat the same couple guys over and over . He won one Olympia uncontested . If anyone should be number one on this list should be Arnold . Easily
@@josephohrablo4866 ok that’s a good point too. But my points still stand as well. But a large part of Arnold’s value is everything from bodybuilding plus everything else he’s done.
Hi Marx, good vid, I followed the sport when MM and RG were active. I can understand your view. For those who followed the sport monthly through the competitions and articles which were published monthly in Muscular Development and Muscle and Fitness we likely have different opinions of these two competitors. RG was a very respected pro who did multiple shows yearly and showed up in great shape continously. He was not blessed with the greatest structure but was a bodybuilders bodybuilder. Incredibly hard working, did a lot of shows and trained intensely. Very well respected and popular as a pro bodybuilder. MM, one of the most esthetic physiques and best posers of all time. Calves and forearms huge, great arms, delts, pecs and back in harmony. In league with Zane, Paris and Benfatto for symmetry. Not a mass monster but a great ambassador of the sport. In the 80's he toured Sears stores for Weider products and would do a short posing routine and then have a q and a with the spectators in the middle if the department store. I skipped a day of school in my senior year of high school to see him in Edmonton Alberta Canada in 1984. He was pealed, skin like shrink wrap. Gracious, patient, answered all of our questions. Probably have an autographed pic of him from that somewhere. The challenge of comparing different eras is the changes of development due to improvements in PEDs. What if Arnold, Lee, and the rest of the Mr. O's all weighed 280lbs, that would be a great comparison. It was a great time to follow bodybuilding, if they all used the same grear, the greats from any Era would be great. Oh that would be an interesting competition. Fortunately this is also a very competitive and interesting time to follow the sport. I think this year's Olympia and the next few could be classics. Thanks for the entertaining vids.
You need your eyes tested if you think Frank Zane is overrated. The king of aesthetics and well deserved winner of the 77,78 and 79 Mr Olympia's. You can argue that he was in better condition than Franco Columbo in the 76 Mr Olympia and should have won that too. And don't forget Frank is 1 of only 3 people to beat Arnold in competition!
😂😂😂 this one is going to cause a bang 💥 But you right politics place a huge role in Bodybuilding placings. And if you remove yourself from the Hype and just look at the Physiques then yes, these guys are over rated. Not meaning they not great guys with great personalities and an asset the the IFBB and NABA but it is awesome that you can actually see through all the Smoke, Laser Lights and Hype. I support you on this one 100% would add Ian and Hunter to the list for sure😂😂
Reg Park and Bill Pearl were invited to compete both years Larry Scott competed in the Olympia, they decided NOT to compete. So, if he competed against them and unfairly won, I'd agree. However, history is what it is, simply due to attendance.
There’s more context to the earlier Mr. Olympia story; it was a brand, new competition. At that time, the Weiders and the IFBB didn’t have the power that they would eventually garner. Park and Pearl were already established in the sport as Mr Universe winners and I’m guessing neither really cared about the Mr Olympia title
@@richfeather true, yet they were invited, none the less! Larry Scott said himself in the book, Loaded Guns, he was saddened that Park, Grimek, Pearl and other heroes of his wouldn't be competing against him!
I have to disagree that Larry Scott is definitely not a overrated bodybuilder. I have seen many photos of him in his prime and even some videos on him. His arm & shoulder development was unmatched in his prime. His physique was Herculean with no weak body parts. Due to political rules in the IFBB at that time discouraged the best bodybuilders from competing against Larry Scott.
@@martinloo9543 I believe you want to reedit your first sentence. I know what you're trying to say, but I'm sure you want to make a clear message. As far as being overrated, plenty of great competitors that I consider overrated. I admire Jay Cutler, but I don't like his overall physique. That's alright, bodybuilding is one thing for sure, Subjective. One thing I love about Scott, he had weaknesses, yet knew how to present himself as a much larger man, with a larger frame than he actually possessed. And it was probably a good thing he didn't compete against Park and Scott, because they were heroes of his.
I met John Grimek in 1980 when I was competing in the 1980 Collegiate National powerlifting championships at Kutztown University. I spoke to him for over an hour and was surprised at how thick he was. I met him again in 1981' at a National Powerlifting meet, he came up to me, called me by my name and shook my hand. I've been a fan ever since.
You have to understand that seeing these people in the flesh when they were conditioned is a whole different story. I saw Chris Dickerson the day he won the Olympia. He was in Golds Venice doing a Weider shoot at the back of the gym. He looked alien, let me tell you. His conditioning was nuts for any era.
Do older folks such as yourself ever reflect how you may possibly be succumbing to the timeless trope of "back in my day"? I'm not trying to tarnish your memories or anything, more just ask if you ever stop to examine how your own subjectivity might shape your personal evaluation of things that happened "back in my day" versus now? Or do you just think you're right - period, end of story - and that while others may succumb to the back-in-my-day trope when evaluating their past lived experience, you're simply an exception to the rule? You have you be able to at least see how what you've said comes across like that, at the least. Anyway, just something I'm curious about and that makes me wonder if I'll be like that too.
@tootoomcgoo9674 Sure, I understand human nature and often succumb to it. My Dad thought the Rolling Stones sucked out loud and were just terrible compared to his beloved jazz artists. He was likely right on a certain level, but I still loved my Stones records and will tell any youngster that the crap they listen to just sucks out loud compared to my beloved Stones. So, I became my Dad.😏
@@tootoomcgoo9674I think there's a biological basis to it. Reduced neuroplasticity in the brain results in a reduced ability to appreciate newer things as your brain simply cannot make those new connections. If it can be countered through a conscious attempt towards enjoying newer experiences, idk.
I agree. Physique-wise, he was arguably the best for his era. It was close between him, Mentzer and Padilla. Mentzer and Robbie were far more consistent, however
Jay Cutler definitely overrated. Did you ever see striations in his pectorals? I was never impressed with him. I even think Ronnie Coleman was overrated.
Cutler himself said that he didn't beat Ronnie at his best. Dorian Yates overrated? easily is top 3 physique of all time. I don't care whether you like him or his physique, him at his best slaps 99% of bodybuilders and he is widely recognized as one of the GOATS along with Heath and Coleman. Even this channel made such a video like a few weeks back
Ken Waller is a fascinating case study. Because of him, Mike Katz got cast in Pumping Iron. How so you ask. Here's what happened, Charles Gains and George Butler were the co-creators of Pumping Iron the book. The first insightful literary view into the niche activity of Bodybuilding, which became a Best Seller. They got funding to produce a movie from the success of the book. They ended up creating a new type of movie genre called a Docu-Drama. A combination of Fact and Fiction that had the appearance of being a Documentary, very clever! The IFBB ran a contest in the states that would determine the eventual winner of that years 1975 Mr. Universe. The contest was divided into three Height Classes, Tall, Medium and Short. Ken Waller won the Tall, Robby Robinson the medium and Danny Padilla won the short. Then a strange thing happened, Mike Katz who placed second to Ken Waller was also flown to South Africa with the three American class winners too. Why you may ask? Because secretly, Gains and Butler had written in a Fiction sub-plot between Waller and Katz. The Weiders were in on it and pulled a NASTY TRICK on Dany Padilla. Since a country was only allowed three competitors to enter the Mr. Universe contest. Danny, who had WON the short class got kicked off the American Team and Mike Katz got the nod to create the Fiction Sub-Plot. And of course, Waller became the Heavy and also won the Mr. Universe too. Ever wonder why Bodybuilding is NOT considered a legit sport?
@@daveedesanta6318 Ken Waller was the Tom Platz of his day. Next to Sergio Oliva, he had the best legs in bodybuilding. F.Y.I., Before Photoshop, Weider would retouch photos by superimposing images. A picture of Arnold's Calf Implants were actually Ken Wallers Calves! A picture of Sergio's calves that resembled Full Grown Cows were superimposed with Bill Grant calves to show Sergio's regression after leaving the IFBB. The Weider Mis-Information train knew NO bounds! As good as Ken Wallers legs were, his upper body never could match their development. Weak Back/Chest, Narrow Shoulder structure, Thick Waist line, Small Biceps and Triceps too. Like Platz, he over trained his Arms till he Tore Off the Biceps/Triceps connective tissues! JOHN HANSEN has a UA-cam channel where he interviews plenty of Old School Bodybuilders from the 1950's-1990's. Jerry Brainum is a guest on his channel and is a living encyclopedia of the Bodybuilding Culture and he's FUNNY too. A two-part interview with Danny Padilla will reveal to you the Pumping Iron Shenanigans that took place. There is even a Portugal component to the story, but I won't spoil it for you. All straight from the horses mouth so to speak. So Marx Max Muscle is correct to have Ken Waller on his OVER-RATED list. To be fair to the Weiders, their were only a few IFBB straps to hand out each year (Mr. Olympia, Mr. Universe, Mr. International, Mr. America, Mr. USA). So a lot of Bodybuilding competitors were left missing the boat.
How is Arnold not on this list??? Zero legs, a huge waist and poor conditioning. And half the years he won, he was either given preference over a better body builder or no one was competing against him.
@@kurtvonfricken6829yea the guy commenting is braindead, every guy in the 70s had legs smaller than todays era, id argue arnold had one of the greatest legs in his era before 75, the deep cuts were insane
Here's my take on these choices: 1- Charles Atlas (Angelo Siciliano) was a very handsome Italian man who was a Marketing Genius. Having won a Bernarr MacFadden Contest (The first Bodybuilding Publisher). Angelo changed his name to Charles Atlas then created a Dynamic Tension Course Booklet. Then seeing the Comic Book Craze among the early teenage boy crowd placed a comic book style Ad for his course into said comic books. The result, a Jackpot Goldmine that made his American Dream Fortune!!! Years later other bodybuilders would sell course booklets in the Weider magazines. Arnold, Mentzer and the like all did. But Charles was the first and most successful of them all. 2- John C. Grimek of Slav Stock was the marketing brainchild of Bob Hoffman. Bob was the first Bodybuilding/Weightlifting Publisher to realize the marketing potential of using a genetic freak to sell product. And with Grimek, he struck GOLD!!! There were only a few Bodybuilding Shows in the Post WWII Era, but Grimek cleaned up on them. The A.A.U. even created a one time only victory rule for their Mr. America Show because of Grimek. Steve Reeves liked to tell the story of the 1950 NABBA Mr. Universe where he and Grimek were tied after the initial judging. Then Grimek gave a gymnastic/balancing show and won the show! 3- Larry Scott of the freaky Arms and Delts was always a favorite of mine. He was actually the Co-Creator of the Mr. Olympia Contest!!! Here's what happened: After winning the IFBB America and Universe shows, Larry and Joe Weider were drinking beers when Larry announced his retirement because there was nothing else to compete for. Right there and then, both men began creating a show that would determine the BEST Mr. Universe for that year. That's right, the Mr. Olympia was created to pick out the best Mr. Universe and it did NOT matter from what organization it was won from. So invitations were sent to Steve Reeves, John Grimek and Bill Pearl. Only after Weider signed Arnold to be his Marketing Tool in 1971 was the Olympia Show closed off to outside Non-IFBB competitors. 4- Frank Zane Fan Boys have to realized that compared to Sergio, Arnold, Coe, Mentzer or Robby Robinson. Frank Zane resembled a slightly more muscular MALE UNDERWEAR MODEL, nothing more. He was just too Ectomorphic to compete with the Grown Men in the room!!! However, he was still able to become a very valuable Weider Marketing tool. Especially, after 1975, when Arnold retired. I remember well the Ad showing Zane using a Rubber Band that cost less than a dollar to mass produce. It sold MILLIONS for the Weiders at $20 bucks a pop! The Weiders had paid off numerous U.S. Postal Fines for Mail Fraud over the years because of False Advertising. So using the Ectomorph Zane was a stroke of marketing genius. The 1977-1979 Olympia Zane victory years were a reward for being a successful Marketing Weider tool. Zane was never in his wettest dreams better than Mike Mentzer, Robby Robinson, Casey Viator or Boyer Coe!!! 5&6- Chris Dickerson along with Franco Columbu were the two WEAKEST Olympia winners. Both were very flawed and required a lot of FIXED Judging help to win. Arnold was the promoter of Franco's two Olympia wins. And Bill Peal who did NOT recuse himself as the head judge oversaw Chris Dickerson's only Olympia win. Pearl had been Chris's personal trainer and friend since he was a teenager. 7- Mohamed Makkawy was one of those bodybuilders who looked like a GOD when viewed from the front. But then disappeared when viewed from the rear. Just like Gary Strydom. 8- Rich Gaspari took conditioning to another level in his prime. Too short and small compared to the extreme Mesomorphic Lee Haney. Rich, like 8- Jay Cutler and Tom Platz were Flawed Bodybuilders who you rooted for because they gave it their ALL! 9- Dorian Yates is a special case of someone who was the right person at the right time for the Weider's. The Weider's had been paying Bribes for years to the corrupt IOC President in order to make Bodybuilding an Olympic Sport. It NEVER happened because Bodybuilding is NOT a sport, its only a BEAUTY CONTEST!!! But that did not the deter the CORRUPT IOC President from pointing out to the Weider's that ONLY Americans had won the Mr. Olympia. Even Sergio and Arnold were naturalized citizens. So along came Dorian Yates, a subject of the Queen. So guess who became the Weider's next Olympia Marketing Tool? At first it was all good. However, after numerous torn connective tissue injuries due to very SLOPPY training. Yates was NO longer Mr. Olympia material. But the Weider's continued the Charade for two more years in the hopes of landing Bodybuilding as an Olympic Sport. It did not end well for both Yates or the Weider's. Yates became an Orthopedic Wreck and the Weider's never got to the Olympics. Overall, a justified collection of over rated bodybuilders brought to you mostly by the Weider Marketing Machine.
That other commenter stole my thunder.I was going to say WOW as well.I do feel like Zane was possibly the worst, however, and early Franco looked impressive
"Dorian Yates is a special case of someone who was the right person at the right time for the Weider's. The Weider's had been paying Bribes for years to the corrupt IOC President in order to make Bodybuilding an Olympic Sport. It NEVER happened because Bodybuilding is NOT a sport, its only a BEAUTY CONTEST!!! But that did not the deter the CORRUPT IOC President from pointing out to the Weider's that ONLY Americans had won the Mr. Olympia. Even Sergio and Arnold were naturalized citizens. So along came Dorian Yates, a subject of the Queen. So guess who became the Weider's next Olympia Marketing Tool? At first it was all good. However, after numerous torn connective tissue injuries due to very SLOPPY training. Yates was NO longer Mr. Olympia material. But the Weider's continued the Charade for two more years in the hopes of landing Bodybuilding as an Olympic Sport. It did not end well for both Yates or the Weider's. Yates became an Orthopedic Wreck and the Weider's never got to the Olympics. Overall, a justified collection of over rated bodybuilders brought to you mostly by the Weider Marketing Machine." Sloppy training? More like not backing off the intensity while depleted and at risk. All of his tears happened mere weeks before competition, even he himself says he should've backed off and not trained the same as in off season when the body is revitalized and can take a harder beating. "So guess who became the Weider's next Olympia Marketing Tool" said by someone who doesn't even know who Yates is and was. The man was barely known in his own city of Birmingham let alone UK, let alone Europe. If Weiders really wanted to make money they'd go for Shawn Ray, Flex, Levrone. You talk about corruption and fixing the contests but you think the Weiders gave a damn whether all the winners were American or not? Dorian Yates was the complete opposite of a marketable champion that a company would make money off of. As I said, if they wanted to make money they'd go for people like Ray, Flex or Levrone who all had bigger ego, were constantly competing and doing guest shows, constantly attending conventions, constantly appearing in public and overall were EXTROVERTS.
and I'm not going to argue whether '97 Yates was Mr. Olympia material, all I am going to say is that Nasser wasn't either. If you go and watch the getbig's HD video of the thing, you'd quickly realize how soft and oily he was with 0 back whatsoever. Sorry not sorry but I don't live in a fantasy land where I personally make up the rules of the 'sport'. One single torn muscle that plays no part in the majority of the poses should not AND DOES NOT hurt the athlete in those poses. Lat spreads, back double = total annihilation of Nasser "L" Sonbaty.
Mike Mentzer !! I have been sick and tired of hearing about that guy for decades. Loses a contest, then loses his mind !! Definitely agree on the Jay Cutler choice, always looked like his diet was doughnuts.
I've seen Gaspari , Yates and Cutler live at the Olympia , and although one might argue about their photogenic qualities , live they were tremendous. Period.
Let me be clear by saying I'm not trying to hate on Zane. It's not his fault if others overrate him. Moreover, I've seen channels refer to Zane as the "King of Aesthetics." However, it's far less impressive to have a small waist when you weigh far less than your competition. For example, Sergio Oliva is more impressive and aesthetic than Zane because he had a similar waist measurement, but was about 30-45 lbs bigger. It's like comparing the aesthetics of a Mr. Olympia Men's Physique competitor to Shawn Rhoden or Lee Haney. Rhoden & Haney's aesthetics will always be more impressive because Men's Physique competitors are the size of Frank Zane (many are even bigger), but Rhoden & Haney maintained their tiny waist while being about 50 lbs bigger than a Men's Physique competitor. Please don't misunderstand me. Zane had a great body in comparison to the best physique you'd see at your local gym. However, a Mr. Olympia physique is a body that's unattainable by most of the world's population, even if they too are on gear. Moreover, I'm completely aware that Zane's body is unattainable by many people, even on gear, but it's not impossible. You can find guys who look like him, but rarely find guys who look like a Haney, Ferrigno, Arnold, etc. So to me the real underrated person is Marx Max Muscle. This channel has the humor of Greg Doucette, the knowlege of Nick's Strength & Power and the cleanness of a G rated movie. Seriously, has anyone ever heard Marx Max Muscle use profanity or speak condescedingly about anyone? This is the most underrated bodybuilding channel on UA-cam. You're awesome and we appreciate the work you do. Keep it up!
Partly agree with this but I would use Serge Nubret as the example rather than Sergio Oliva, because Serge was bigger, as aesthetic AND as conditioned as Zane, whereas Sergio Oliva didnt have the same level of conditioning.
Your right about Lou. Lou also was the first mass monster. From the sledgemaster 3 times making professional powerlifting history in 2022 and on August 6th and 7th in Hamilton, Ohio under the legend and uspa meet director Eric freeman.
"Overrated" must mean something different in Canada 😂 Examples of "overrated" include Gary Strydom, Branch Warren, and believe it or not, Flex Wheeler after 1999. YES, Flex's physique was insane & people say he's an "uncrowned Olympia" but he never dialed in his lower body from behind and abused Synthol (Shawn Ray is an uncrowned 1994 Mr. Olympia). Let's also write in Ronnie Coleman after 2004. He super-sized, gut blew up, and y'all wanted to ignore it. He did the only thing he knew - train heavier and use more gear - and now the dude can't walk.
If you will dig up photos of Atlas in his prime. You will see he looked as good and better in some cases . Than anyone in his day. I point this out because most of the popular photos we see of Atlas are of him in his 50s after he became famous. Late 40s and early 50s is when he gained his popularity and became famous. I could go on & on . But look up his whole life history and you'll see
you are right about Mohamed Makkawy! A great bodybuilder yes, but the 2nd place finish in 1983 Mr Olympia was way too high a place, maybe 4th or 5th. Bertil Fox or Lee Haney should have been 2nd in 83. If Frank Zane is over-rated, then Franco Columbo is even more over-rated. Both won only because Arnold, Serge Nubret, Sergio Oliva, and Lou were no longer around (retired or banished from IFBB). Franco was very muscular and strong, but horrible aesthetics. Franco was never even among the top 5 bodybuilders in the world. Arnold, Lou, Serge Nubret, Sergio Oliva, Robby Robinson were all better than Franco from 1976 on. They either retired or were competing in rival bb federation (the ultimate no-no in the Weider empire!!). Also I disagree with Rich Gaspari being over-rated, he looked pretty good despite his terrible genetics, and he actually WAS the 2nd best bb in the world for 3 years. No one other than Lee Haney was better than Rich from 86 to 88, certainly not Mike Christian (weak legs) or Berry DeMay (20 pounds too light). Branch Warren should be on your list though, that 2nd in 2009 was bogus!
I’d actually put Gaspari in the same camp as Cutler. They both worked extremely hard, were pretty consistent, and overcame subpar genetics, as far as Mr. Olympia competitors go (if you’re in the O, you have great genetics).
@@richfeather Neither guy is over-rated though, since both were at least the 2nd best bodybuilder in the world for multiple years. By contrast Columbo, Zane, Makawwy and Dickerson were NEVER even among the top 5 in the world. Just that the 6 or so bodybuilders who were the best in the world from 1976 to 1982 either chose to retire (Arnold and Lou) or were ousted from the IFBB (Serge Nubret and Sergio Oliva), or were shafted by bad judging (Robinson, Mentzer, Coe).
@@curtharakaly4620 yea that makes sense- and he definitely didn't deserve to win in 2007 and was a little soft a couple other years. Even so, winning aside, he was still better than guys who were in better condition and out of all the mass monsters of that era he was one of the few that never once let his mid section go.
Jays look at the 01 Olympia as well as 02 and 03 Arnold is a top 5 physique of all time. Not overrated, just older and worn down by the time he started winning the O.
Jay had, in my opinion, one of the greatest physiques of all time. Probably had my favorite physique ever when he was at his best. His physique is what you would imagine when prompted to think about freaky swole cartoon superman-esque bodybuilders, no way in my mind is he overrated. Plus, if Ronnie wasn't around he'd likely be in the GOAT conversation with phil heath and yates
Jay Cutler probably didn't look like a Mr Olympia in the gym like Ronnie or Phil, but on stage he for sure has one of the greatest physiques of all time. His legs are probably the best ever, there is no way he is overrated. The great white hope
One of the Greatest Physiques...??? Never ever. A mid section wider than the widest itself is a recipe for not being a Mr. Olympia I'd say. Never had the back conditioning, more so apparent when stood next to Ronnie.
@@jaredmuller171 See I always thought the opposite. I was always blown away by him in the gym and during photo shoots. It was when he got on stage that his flaws became most visible, like his wide waist which caused a lack of v taper and the back which was average at best. He also always had the soggy donk, possibly the soggiest of all time.
@@pinetreeflag1517 - totally agree. I have nothing against Jay, but he just didn’t have the aesthetics of many of his top competitors. How he beat Victor Martinez is beyond me. I didn’t see one pose in which Jay was better than Victor in 2007. In fact, I wouldn’t have place Jay higher than 4th yet he took home the big hardware.
This is one of your more controversial but very entertaining videos I've seen yet. IMO, you were "spot on" with all of your choices and I applaud you for taking a jab at the many "sacred cows"(i.e. Frank Zane) of the bodybuilding community. I knew this subject would stir up the hornet's nest but I read with glee all of the posted comments.
You know what's really overrated? The word "overrated." Aside from being an undefined word that exists simply to make one guy's opinion seem better than another's, how do you put a value on inspiring millions of people to become more fit? Atlas and Grimek did a hell of a lot more to build an audience for this kind of video than "Marx Max Muscle" ever will.
Imagine for a moment or two if Lou Ferrigno had Lee Haney overseeing EVERY ASPECT of his training and conditioning and actually got serious about things in terms of getting fully optimized in ALL departments. I think he would have become the untouchable body builder that looked like some of alien God.
The only thing I’d say about Ferigno is his shoulder width wasn’t great even with those massive delts , it’s just a weak point that you could never change .
Well, when Arnold was at his best - in the mid 70s - he could hold his own against any of the top competitors so while I agree and wrote above that he could be considered overrated by MMM’s standards, you can’t argue that he did far more for BB than any other athlete in the sport has.
@Dimonturbo channel that's debatable. There's plenty of bodybuilders over the years with just as good biceps or better (not to mention overall better arms). While less, I would still say the same with his chest. It looked bigger proportionally due to him having weak shoulders (by today's standards)
That’s in the eye of the beholder. I think Jay is blocky with no real shape. Love and respect the guy, but not a pleasing, aesthetic physique. Shawn Ray = bodybuilding
Charles Atlas course did not talk about way to talk to buy calisthenics there's a big difference. He pushed physical fitness staying athletic. How many old men did you know in their seventies that could do a handstand push-up he could do it. Charles Atlas did not compete in bodybuilding. It was about calisthenics.
Mostly agree esp with DeMey who was better than Gaspsri. Please baby please can we have Berry DeMey vs Gary Strydom vs Bob Paris? All tall athletic guys unfortunately in shadow of the great Lee Haney - thanks MMM.
Phil Heath is pound for pound the most overrated bodybuilder of all time!!! He is so overrated that he won several Olympia title with a narrow shoulder and preggy each year he competed 😂🤣
Ken Waller was the Tom Platz of his day. Next to Sergio Oliva, he had the best legs in bodybuilding. F.Y.I., Before Photoshop, Weider would retouch photos by superimposing images. A picture of Arnold's Calf Implants were actually Ken Wallers Calves! A picture of Sergio's calves that resembled Full Grown Cows were superimposed with Bill Grant calves to show Sergio's regression after leaving the IFBB. The Weider Mis-Information train knew NO bounds! As good as Ken Wallers legs were, his upper body never could match their development. Weak Back/Chest, Narrow Shoulder structure, Thick Waist line, Small Biceps and Triceps too. Like Platz, he over trained his Arms till he Tore Off the Biceps/Triceps connective tissues! JOHN HANSEN has a UA-cam channel where he interviews plenty of Old School Bodybuilders from the 1950's-1990's. Jerry Brainum is a guest on his channel and is a living encyclopedia of the Bodybuilding Culture and he's FUNNY too. A two-part interview with Danny Padilla will reveal to you the Pumping Iron Shenanigans that took place. There is even a Portugal component to the story, but I won't spoil it for you. All straight from the horses mouth so to speak. So Marx Max Muscle is correct to have Ken Waller on his OVER-RATED list. To be fair to the Weiders, there were only a few straps to hand out each year (Mr. Olympia, Mr. Universe, Mr. International, Mr. America, Mr. USA). So a lot of Bodybuilding competitors were left missing the boat.
Mark, back in Zane's day Joe Weider used to pick the winners of the Mr Olympia and it was up to the editors of the magazines he owned to try and rationalise how Zane could possibly win out against Robby, Boyer, etc, who were clearly far better developed than Frank was. Although Weider never actually came out and said it in so many words, for fear that it could be construed that he DID pick the winners himself, it was a generally accepted viewpoint that Joe was deeply concerned over the rampant use of anabolic steroids in bodybuilding, and so he put forward a physique, Frank Zane's physique, that could be duplicated naturally, or perhaps with no more that judicious use of Dianabol, and not the much more potent and dangerous gear that was around by the mid-1970s. No doubt Joe was hoping that young bodybuilders would try to get as good as Zane and not push the envelope any further. Frank became the natural successor to Steve Reeves.
@@daveedesanta6318 . . Yeah, he was. Or at least that's what his magazines said at the time. I was active as a bodybuilder back then and I bought the Weider mags, as well as Iron Man Magazine and the York mags. Frank Zane did a posing and promo tour of Australia in 1975 and I went along to see him. On the bill that night was young Ed Casey, the current Jr Mr Australia, a guy with a bulky yet trim physique, actually bigger than Zane's physique as it turned out. But, although it was definitely NOT a competition, Zane clearly out-classed Casey in all areas except for size. I came away from that evening with a new respect for Frank, and an appreciation for what Joe Weider was all about. I believe he was trying to influence young impressionable bodybuilders into setting goals for themselves that didn't involve them risking their lives with dangerous steroids.
@@arthurblackhistoric wow that's great history there.. u are a lucky old man, bet you are healthy as a horse these days too... how old are u? and do u still work out? that's true, risking your life with steroids to achieve an appearance that is not sustainable is really stupid. the more i look at this modern body building, the more i dislike it and see it's long term dangers.
@@kurtvonfricken6829 Joe Weider, just liek the rest of his type, was nothing but a fraud... I've come to this realization. Even arnold was a fraud and a boot licker... nothing else...
And this is how you lose subscribers🤦 Jay Cutler overrated?🤔 ( 4x Mr.Olympia) The only person who dethroned Ronnie Coleman! Frank Zane overrated? Frank Zane is considered one of the most aesthetic bodybuilders if not the most of all time!
Not that many people can take credit for adding *a whole new body part* to a sport that judges body parts. Rich Gaspari goes down in history for shredded glutes.
There's a few I would have included if I'd made this list. Branch Warren comes to mind, and Dennis Wolf. Serious respect to both of them, but Branch just always had a not-very-pleasing physique, and Dennis had too many weaknesses to have such a strong CV. Just 2 that comento my mind from recent years.
Frank Zane - I’m glad someone said it. Hugely overrated. Sure he’s aesthetic, but not to any special degree, and he’s undersized even for the golden era.
@@afonso1816 lol easy to say until your up on stage in the tiny posing trunks. Have you seen a natty bodybuilding show??? NONE of these guys looked as good as Zane. But I'm sure your different 😂😂😂😂
Interesting opinions. I can’t say as I agree with all. Using MMM’s criteria, I could say Arnold was overrated. Were there better bodybuilders than Arnold during his Mr. O title run? Oliva, Pearl, Nubret - arguably better than Arnold. So, was Arnold overrated? No. He had an enormous impact on BB. How about Zane? He brought conditioning and shape in a package that was unique during his reign. Zane’s still held as the prototypical aesthetic BB and I’d suggest Zane’s physique was a significant contributor to the creation of the Classic division and the shift from the mass monsters - a necessity now as BB’s bubble-gut era of mass-at-all-costs nearly destroyed BB.
I beg to differ.The classic division was created as an attempt to go back to the pre 90's look where they balanced mass with aesthetics.Can't say Frank Zane had anything to do with that.Most bbers pre 90's were aesthetic.
Yes, there were better-built men than Charles Atlas back in the 1920s and 1930s, but they never entered the contests he did. Plus the magic of clever advertising made his fortune (and legend). I knew his son Charles Atlas Jr. (1918-2008). He told me some wonderful stories about his Dad!
I wouldn't really say Chris Dickerson is overrated. He might've won the 1982 Mr. Olympia. But in turn he's widely considered the weakest Mr. Olympia winner of all time But I'm assuming this list is based more off of accomplishments rather than community perception
@@davidanderson3684 Tbh, I don't consider any of the sham Olympias since they won by robbery: Arnold 80, Cutler 07, Dorian 97, and esp Franco in 81 etc
@@HawkHogan_ 2001 is shady af losing on the scorecards in the prejudging and a bunch of hush hush in regards to IFBB president and the promoter talking to Weider about what was to be done. Also what doesn't help the case is that Cutler stopped being a Weider athlete the year before in 2000 and Coleman was still under contract with the Weiders :)
This is a question that cannot be answered without looking at some pics. If it was Arnold No, but Dorian nvr had the best biceps to begin with so it differs
that makes absolutely 0 sense. The show is based on rounds and individual poses that are all accounted for individually. Does a torn bicep hurt the athlete in the bicep involved poses? yes, obviously. Yet why would a torn bicep that is not flexed or is straight out not even being seen in the poses like the side tricep, lat spreads, abs and thighs, side chest (to a degree) hurt the athlete? Makes 0 sense why that would be the case.
@Dj_M1 I'm getting on stage soon and have a torn meniscus in my left knee. My left leg is noticeably smaller than the right leg. Should I win over someone who has 2 good symmetrical legs? Have you ever competed before? It makes a world of difference...balance and symmetry are part of the judging. You see biceps in almost every pose. Front double, rear double, side chest, most muscular.
@@jancoexp biceps are some of the smallest muscle groups if not the smallest that actually matters on the bodybuilding stage. "you see biceps in almost every pose" is the bicep contracted therefore the injury on display in almost every pose? no. Are the biceps important enough to sway the opinion of the judges in the side chest or front lat spread, or side tricep? nope. Biceps play such an insignificant role in those poses that it's not even funny. Sure, they're visible, but no attention is paid to them. And yes, you should win against someone who has 2 good symmetrical legs if the rest of you is better than his physique, you're 30-40 pounds bigger while more conditioned.
Sigmund Klein did not enter any contests run by Bernarr MacFadden. Physical Culture magazine ran a "Perfectly Developed" contest for many years. Atlas (real name: Angelo Siciliano) won "America's Most Handsome Man Contest," in 1921 (a photo contest), then "America's Most Perfectly Developed Man" contest at Madison Square Garden in 1921. He was running neck and neck with movie stuntman, Joe Bonomo, until Joe broke his leg and Atlas went on to win. Photos of Atlas in his twenties and thirties showed a much better physique, unlike the later photos you have here. He never was "The World's Most Perfectly Developed Man," as this was a title invented by his long-time business partner and publicist, Charles P. Roman.
The funniest shit I ever heard about him was that he was a good poser. He just danced like an out of shape idiot and barely would hit a shot for longer than a second.
@@rstov9442 He was terrible to be honest. I know he got to a point where very few people will ever get, but he sucked when he got there and just danced like an out of shape idiot never hitting a pose properly. I've seen him in interviews and he seems like a Cool guy, but holy shit he was bad as a bodybuilder!
Oh WOW I wasn't aware you were present at the 1980 MR. O and had a inside scup on the round table who were making the decisions on who wins. I was and I WON.......
how convenient that you included Yates on the premise of 2 bad years ('94 & '97) but didn't include Ronnie with his 3 year run before he redeemed himself. 2000: terrible gut terrible physique, if no leg Levrone actually had legs, he'd win. 2001: losing to Cutler in the prejudging, shady deals and a whole judging panel being coerced to change their opinion as Coleman was a Weider athlete and Cutler severed the tie the year before. 2002: By far the worst Ronnie Coleman during his 8 year run. The equivalent of 1997 Yates except that Yates actually controlled his midsection and wasn't 248 pounds.
8:23 it was 1982 not 83
I was in England and went to the contest.
On that Day, Waller was the clear winner.
Danny Padilla is the most underrated of that time. He is the closest to a 5'4" version of Arnold that ever was or ever will be.
Move ahead to Lee Priest.....who is the most underrated of all time. He got a raw deal.
Dorian's broken bicep makes him overrated.
Cutler is underrated. Sorry, can't agree with you about him being overrated. Cutler is also the best spokesman for bodybuilding ever. He's always good to his fans and willing to take time to pose with them for photos, signing autographs, etc..
I appreciate Frank Zane. His influence helped make many bodybuilders more aesthetic instead of just pregnant cows like you see mostly nowadays. It's very Greek Godlike. Then again, his body is more for the female gaze, not so much mass steroid male gaze. No wonder those guys get hated.
yes except frank zane was still massive, its just that if you put him together with other bodybuilder she is dwarfed
@@jmgonzales7701indeed, Frank Zane was pure aesthetics on steroids
MMM is just a delusional fanboy. Frank Zane had a surreal physique.
Jay Cutler had a few off years but definitely one of the best. Jay definitely not over rated.
Agree
Thick blocky waist..bad asthetics..never should have beaten Cormier ever
@collin355 Cormier very good physique, but size was a big factor during that time and Jay was huge
Built like a fridge.
@wildmike951 so was Cormeir..jay was 1 inch shorter and 10 pounds heavier with most of that size difference in his midsection which made him blocky looking..Cormier was huge also with much better lines and asthetics..go Google the 2 of them together and Cormier looks so much better
Larry Scott was incredible. 20-inch, perfectly balanced arms 60 years ago! Can you imagine what someone with his genetics would have looked like in the 90's? How can you judge someone as being overrated at the time when you likely were not even born yet?
Larry Scott was the first Mr Olympia 5’7” , 200 pounds . Some bloated clowns are 270/80/90 pounds with a near pregnant belly
Larry Scott legendary 1960s bodybuilder, unbeatable & invincible, dream matchup, 1960s mid 1960s larry Scott invincible & unbeatable against invincible & unbeatable Sergio Oliva late 1960s
I skimmed this. It's click bait.
❤️ larry Scott legendary biscep& chest, calfs etc etc he beat very young Sergio oliva
❤️ legendary bodybuilder larry Scott unbeatable in his prime , however never compete against reg park & bill peal
Thank you saying Frank Zane is overrated!
I’ve always thought the same thing.
And you’re dead on that Lou would have won all those Olympias had he not retired. Not Zane.
Lou retired too early in bodybuilding terms, but it was the right choice for his career and fame. Way more people know him as the Incredible Hulk than as a bodybuilding competitor.
Zane brought something different. That how it always was in the competition of bodybuilding. When Dorian Yates brought in the era of Mass muscle. That was the standard. Now people are tired of that shit to the point that people want to see a more aesthetic look than big ass freaks.
@@vagabond4576 yea but Zane isn’t even aesthetic to me either. The new aesthetic guys are at least jacked still too.
@@guillaumebillette4078 yea maybe. But he could have had 3 Olympias first and then went and did movies still.
@@RonDaSantis For sure, he was way too big for Zane to beat.
Larry Scott had some of the best arms ever. His insertions are exceptional.
I'm doing Scott curl on a weekly.
Jay seems like a true gentleman, and I'd love to meet him. I just met Victor Martinez at the NY Pro last weekend. Super nice guy. Sat down next to me and we talked for a few minutes.
Chris Dickerson can’t be overrated because no one thinks highly of him.
Everyone thinks he was subpar already.
overrated by the judges I suppose
Lol was was good all around, and he took the O, because nobody else could keep up with him. Consistency is king.
@@bobjohnson1633 his competition was weak. Some mr Olympias have to be perfect to beat the competition. And some just didn’t have much elite competition. Dickerson won during a time when the competition was at its weakest. He was the best of the worst.
And everyone knows it already.
@@RonDaSantis that’s a stretch . Arnold was winning during the weakest era of all time . He beat the same couple guys over and over . He won one Olympia uncontested . If anyone should be number one on this list should be Arnold . Easily
@@josephohrablo4866 ok that’s a good point too. But my points still stand as well.
But a large part of Arnold’s value is everything from bodybuilding plus everything else he’s done.
Hi Marx, good vid, I followed the sport when MM and RG were active. I can understand your view. For those who followed the sport monthly through the competitions and articles which were published monthly in Muscular Development and Muscle and Fitness we likely have different opinions of these two competitors. RG was a very respected pro who did multiple shows yearly and showed up in great shape continously. He was not blessed with the greatest structure but was a bodybuilders bodybuilder. Incredibly hard working, did a lot of shows and trained intensely. Very well respected and popular as a pro bodybuilder. MM, one of the most esthetic physiques and best posers of all time. Calves and forearms huge, great arms, delts, pecs and back in harmony. In league with Zane, Paris and Benfatto for symmetry. Not a mass monster but a great ambassador of the sport. In the 80's he toured Sears stores for Weider products and would do a short posing routine and then have a q and a with the spectators in the middle if the department store. I skipped a day of school in my senior year of high school to see him in Edmonton Alberta Canada in 1984. He was pealed, skin like shrink wrap. Gracious, patient, answered all of our questions. Probably have an autographed pic of him from that somewhere. The challenge of comparing different eras is the changes of development due to improvements in PEDs. What if Arnold, Lee, and the rest of the Mr. O's all weighed 280lbs, that would be a great comparison.
It was a great time to follow bodybuilding, if they all used the same grear, the greats from any Era would be great. Oh that would be an interesting competition. Fortunately this is also a very competitive and interesting time to follow the sport. I think this year's Olympia and the next few could be classics.
Thanks for the entertaining vids.
Chris Dickerson won the Olympia in 1982
Well, that's debatable. Lol
Bannout in 83
I was at that Olympia in 82 , as an 17 year old kid .
First openly gay bodybuilder
Chris Dickerson should never have been Mr Olympia. Shows how corrupt it all is.
1980
1981
1982
DISGRACEFUL Mr Olympia results.
You need your eyes tested if you think Frank Zane is overrated. The king of aesthetics and well deserved winner of the 77,78 and 79 Mr Olympia's. You can argue that he was in better condition than Franco Columbo in the 76 Mr Olympia and should have won that too. And don't forget Frank is 1 of only 3 people to beat Arnold in competition!
I agreed with basically all of these except Larry Scott and Jay Cutler. Don't disrespect my boy Larry >:(
And Dorian
😂😂😂 this one is going to cause a bang 💥 But you right politics place a huge role in Bodybuilding placings. And if you remove yourself from the Hype and just look at the Physiques then yes, these guys are over rated. Not meaning they not great guys with great personalities and an asset the the IFBB and NABA but it is awesome that you can actually see through all the Smoke, Laser Lights and Hype. I support you on this one 100% would add Ian and Hunter to the list for sure😂😂
Reg Park and Bill Pearl were invited to compete both years Larry Scott competed in the Olympia, they decided NOT to compete. So, if he competed against them and unfairly won, I'd agree. However, history is what it is, simply due to attendance.
There’s more context to the earlier Mr. Olympia story; it was a brand, new competition. At that time, the Weiders and the IFBB didn’t have the power that they would eventually garner. Park and Pearl were already established in the sport as Mr Universe winners and I’m guessing neither really cared about the Mr Olympia title
@@richfeather true, yet they were invited, none the less! Larry Scott said himself in the book, Loaded Guns, he was saddened that Park, Grimek, Pearl and other heroes of his wouldn't be competing against him!
I have to disagree that Larry Scott is definitely not a overrated bodybuilder. I have seen many photos of him in his prime and even some videos on him. His arm & shoulder development was unmatched in his prime. His physique was Herculean with no weak body parts.
Due to political rules in the IFBB at that time discouraged the best bodybuilders from competing against Larry Scott.
@@martinloo9543 I believe you want to reedit your first sentence. I know what you're trying to say, but I'm sure you want to make a clear message. As far as being overrated, plenty of great competitors that I consider overrated. I admire Jay Cutler, but I don't like his overall physique. That's alright, bodybuilding is one thing for sure, Subjective. One thing I love about Scott, he had weaknesses, yet knew how to present himself as a much larger man, with a larger frame than he actually possessed. And it was probably a good thing he didn't compete against Park and Scott, because they were heroes of his.
How dare you disparage Frank Zane. Blasphemy!
I met John Grimek in 1980 when I was competing in the 1980 Collegiate National powerlifting championships at Kutztown University. I spoke to him for over an hour and was surprised at how thick he was. I met him again in 1981' at a National Powerlifting meet, he came up to me, called me by my name and shook my hand. I've been a fan ever since.
When you say "thick" you mean his physique or his intelligence level?
@@mitchbarredo3990 His physique.
Joe Weider is not the symbol of the IFBB, Joe Weider’s head on Robby Robinson’s body is….
I always wondered about Weider's "body". Thanks!
You have to understand that seeing these people in the flesh when they were conditioned is a whole different story. I saw Chris Dickerson the day he won the Olympia. He was in Golds Venice doing a Weider shoot at the back of the gym. He looked alien, let me tell you. His conditioning was nuts for any era.
I witnessed Frank Zane's Olympia wins. He deserved all of them, and I'm glad I was there. I wouldn't bother to see another contest the way things are.
Do older folks such as yourself ever reflect how you may possibly be succumbing to the timeless trope of "back in my day"? I'm not trying to tarnish your memories or anything, more just ask if you ever stop to examine how your own subjectivity might shape your personal evaluation of things that happened "back in my day" versus now?
Or do you just think you're right - period, end of story - and that while others may succumb to the back-in-my-day trope when evaluating their past lived experience, you're simply an exception to the rule? You have you be able to at least see how what you've said comes across like that, at the least. Anyway, just something I'm curious about and that makes me wonder if I'll be like that too.
@tootoomcgoo9674 Sure, I understand human nature and often succumb to it. My Dad thought the Rolling Stones sucked out loud and were just terrible compared to his beloved jazz artists. He was likely right on a certain level, but I still loved my Stones records and will tell any youngster that the crap they listen to just sucks out loud compared to my beloved Stones. So, I became my Dad.😏
@@tootoomcgoo9674 We all have our ideals and preferences. i.e. You WILL be like that too. Nothing wrong with it, just you being you, which is perfect.
@@tootoomcgoo9674I think there's a biological basis to it. Reduced neuroplasticity in the brain results in a reduced ability to appreciate newer things as your brain simply cannot make those new connections. If it can be countered through a conscious attempt towards enjoying newer experiences, idk.
Not in 1978
Robbie got screwed big time. I'm sad for this guy.
I agree. Physique-wise, he was arguably the best for his era. It was close between him, Mentzer and Padilla. Mentzer and Robbie were far more consistent, however
You are on UA-cam, look up Mohammed Makkaway. He's STILL in phenomenal shape.
2009 Cutler was legendary though.
Jay Cutler definitely overrated. Did you ever see striations in his pectorals? I was never impressed with him. I even think Ronnie Coleman was overrated.
Completely agree about Bill Pearl , one of the most genetically gifted Bodybuilders ever .
Robby should have won the Olympia over Frank Zane!
Always found Coleman to be unaesthetic (post 'natty' era) so see him as slightly overrated
Jay Cutler defeats the best Body Builder of all time
Mark: lol mid
Jay: 😦
And yes Dorian Yates is Overrated
He did not defeat Ronnie at his best
Ronnie lost to time.
That's bullshit. Ronnie lost to never taking care of his fucking bones. Lmao
Ronnie was by far the most overrated
Cutler himself said that he didn't beat Ronnie at his best.
Dorian Yates overrated? easily is top 3 physique of all time. I don't care whether you like him or his physique, him at his best slaps 99% of bodybuilders and he is widely recognized as one of the GOATS along with Heath and Coleman.
Even this channel made such a video like a few weeks back
Chris was underrated, if you go looking for the footage he was incredible the year he won.
Even better two years before. But Arnold showed up for that one.
Love your channel especially the side by side of the different side by side don't know why your channel doesn't have more subs. Thanks again max
Ken Waller is a fascinating case study. Because of him, Mike Katz got cast in Pumping Iron. How so you ask. Here's what happened, Charles Gains and George Butler were the co-creators of Pumping Iron the book. The first insightful literary view into the niche activity of Bodybuilding, which became a Best Seller. They got funding to produce a movie from the success of the book. They ended up creating a new type of movie genre called a Docu-Drama. A combination of Fact and Fiction that had the appearance of being a Documentary, very clever! The IFBB ran a contest in the states that would determine the eventual winner of that years 1975 Mr. Universe. The contest was divided into three Height Classes, Tall, Medium and Short. Ken Waller won the Tall, Robby Robinson the medium and Danny Padilla won the short. Then a strange thing happened, Mike Katz who placed second to Ken Waller was also flown to South Africa with the three American class winners too. Why you may ask? Because secretly, Gains and Butler had written in a Fiction sub-plot between Waller and Katz. The Weiders were in on it and pulled a NASTY TRICK on Dany Padilla. Since a country was only allowed three competitors to enter the Mr. Universe contest. Danny, who had WON the short class got kicked off the American Team and Mike Katz got the nod to create the Fiction Sub-Plot. And of course, Waller became the Heavy and also won the Mr. Universe too. Ever wonder why Bodybuilding is NOT considered a legit sport?
So knowledgeable.I go way back myself,but had no idea about these backstories.
interesting.... how did u know this? where can i read about it
@@daveedesanta6318 Ken Waller was the Tom Platz of his day. Next to Sergio Oliva, he had the best legs in bodybuilding. F.Y.I., Before Photoshop, Weider would retouch photos by superimposing images. A picture of Arnold's Calf Implants were actually Ken Wallers Calves! A picture of Sergio's calves that resembled Full Grown Cows were superimposed with Bill Grant calves to show Sergio's regression after leaving the IFBB. The Weider Mis-Information train knew NO bounds! As good as Ken Wallers legs were, his upper body never could match their development. Weak Back/Chest, Narrow Shoulder structure, Thick Waist line, Small Biceps and Triceps too. Like Platz, he over trained his Arms till he Tore Off the Biceps/Triceps connective tissues! JOHN HANSEN has a UA-cam channel where he interviews plenty of Old School Bodybuilders from the 1950's-1990's. Jerry Brainum is a guest on his channel and is a living encyclopedia of the Bodybuilding Culture and he's FUNNY too. A two-part interview with Danny Padilla will reveal to you the Pumping Iron Shenanigans that took place. There is even a Portugal component to the story, but I won't spoil it for you. All straight from the horses mouth so to speak. So Marx Max Muscle is correct to have Ken Waller on his OVER-RATED list. To be fair to the Weiders, their were only a few IFBB straps to hand out each year (Mr. Olympia, Mr. Universe, Mr. International, Mr. America, Mr. USA). So a lot of Bodybuilding competitors were left missing the boat.
@@daveedesanta6318
Watch any recent interview of Danny Padilla. He got screwed in 1975 and 1981, royally.
Danny got on the Portuguese team briefly but someone complained and he was kicked off that team too.
I dont understand how dickerson ever won the olympia
I have some muscle mags from 1982, and Dickerson looked *great*
Hey Marx can you do a comparison between Quinten Eriya vs Michael Lockett (same size)? I think you might find it an interesting one
Also, when Larry won, the Mr. Olympia was such a small contest compared to the Mr. America or Mr. Universe, so Larry only had to face like one guy.
How is Arnold not on this list??? Zero legs, a huge waist and poor conditioning. And half the years he won, he was either given preference over a better body builder or no one was competing against him.
Can’t say Arnold had zero legs. His calf’s were the best of his era. His thighs a little thin in 1975 and basically gone in 1980.
His upper body was wide as f*** lean yes but still damn and he called Mike mentzer fat well Mike had abs
ur really not smart are tou dwane burgess 💀💀
@@kurtvonfricken6829yea the guy commenting is braindead, every guy in the 70s had legs smaller than todays era, id argue arnold had one of the greatest legs in his era before 75, the deep cuts were insane
Mentzer should have beaten Arnold in 80. But the contest was fixed.
Bob Paris looked a lot better than Rich Gaspari IMHO
If you watch Larry Scott compete in 1965, the crowd was going crazy, like he was the Beatles with those arms.
Here's my take on these choices: 1- Charles Atlas (Angelo Siciliano) was a very handsome Italian man who was a Marketing Genius. Having won a Bernarr MacFadden Contest (The first Bodybuilding Publisher). Angelo changed his name to Charles Atlas then created a Dynamic Tension Course Booklet. Then seeing the Comic Book Craze among the early teenage boy crowd placed a comic book style Ad for his course into said comic books. The result, a Jackpot Goldmine that made his American Dream Fortune!!! Years later other bodybuilders would sell course booklets in the Weider magazines. Arnold, Mentzer and the like all did. But Charles was the first and most successful of them all. 2- John C. Grimek of Slav Stock was the marketing brainchild of Bob Hoffman. Bob was the first Bodybuilding/Weightlifting Publisher to realize the marketing potential of using a genetic freak to sell product. And with Grimek, he struck GOLD!!! There were only a few Bodybuilding Shows in the Post WWII Era, but Grimek cleaned up on them. The A.A.U. even created a one time only victory rule for their Mr. America Show because of Grimek. Steve Reeves liked to tell the story of the 1950 NABBA Mr. Universe where he and Grimek were tied after the initial judging. Then Grimek gave a gymnastic/balancing show and won the show! 3- Larry Scott of the freaky Arms and Delts was always a favorite of mine. He was actually the Co-Creator of the Mr. Olympia Contest!!! Here's what happened: After winning the IFBB America and Universe shows, Larry and Joe Weider were drinking beers when Larry announced his retirement because there was nothing else to compete for. Right there and then, both men began creating a show that would determine the BEST Mr. Universe for that year. That's right, the Mr. Olympia was created to pick out the best Mr. Universe and it did NOT matter from what organization it was won from. So invitations were sent to Steve Reeves, John Grimek and Bill Pearl. Only after Weider signed Arnold to be his Marketing Tool in 1971 was the Olympia Show closed off to outside Non-IFBB competitors. 4- Frank Zane Fan Boys have to realized that compared to Sergio, Arnold, Coe, Mentzer or Robby Robinson. Frank Zane resembled a slightly more muscular MALE UNDERWEAR MODEL, nothing more. He was just too Ectomorphic to compete with the Grown Men in the room!!! However, he was still able to become a very valuable Weider Marketing tool. Especially, after 1975, when Arnold retired. I remember well the Ad showing Zane using a Rubber Band that cost less than a dollar to mass produce. It sold MILLIONS for the Weiders at $20 bucks a pop! The Weiders had paid off numerous U.S. Postal Fines for Mail Fraud over the years because of False Advertising. So using the Ectomorph Zane was a stroke of marketing genius. The 1977-1979 Olympia Zane victory years were a reward for being a successful Marketing Weider tool. Zane was never in his wettest dreams better than Mike Mentzer, Robby Robinson, Casey Viator or Boyer Coe!!! 5&6- Chris Dickerson along with Franco Columbu were the two WEAKEST Olympia winners. Both were very flawed and required a lot of FIXED Judging help to win. Arnold was the promoter of Franco's two Olympia wins. And Bill Peal who did NOT recuse himself as the head judge oversaw Chris Dickerson's only Olympia win. Pearl had been Chris's personal trainer and friend since he was a teenager. 7- Mohamed Makkawy was one of those bodybuilders who looked like a GOD when viewed from the front. But then disappeared when viewed from the rear. Just like Gary Strydom. 8- Rich Gaspari took conditioning to another level in his prime. Too short and small compared to the extreme Mesomorphic Lee Haney. Rich, like 8- Jay Cutler and Tom Platz were Flawed Bodybuilders who you rooted for because they gave it their ALL! 9- Dorian Yates is a special case of someone who was the right person at the right time for the Weider's. The Weider's had been paying Bribes for years to the corrupt IOC President in order to make Bodybuilding an Olympic Sport. It NEVER happened because Bodybuilding is NOT a sport, its only a BEAUTY CONTEST!!! But that did not the deter the CORRUPT IOC President from pointing out to the Weider's that ONLY Americans had won the Mr. Olympia. Even Sergio and Arnold were naturalized citizens. So along came Dorian Yates, a subject of the Queen. So guess who became the Weider's next Olympia Marketing Tool? At first it was all good. However, after numerous torn connective tissue injuries due to very SLOPPY training. Yates was NO longer Mr. Olympia material. But the Weider's continued the Charade for two more years in the hopes of landing Bodybuilding as an Olympic Sport. It did not end well for both Yates or the Weider's. Yates became an Orthopedic Wreck and the Weider's never got to the Olympics. Overall, a justified collection of over rated bodybuilders brought to you mostly by the Weider Marketing Machine.
Wow! That’s an impressive post! You certainly put a lot of effort in to this.
That other commenter stole my thunder.I was going to say WOW as well.I do feel like Zane was possibly the worst, however, and early Franco looked impressive
"Dorian Yates is a special case of someone who was the right person at the right time for the Weider's. The Weider's had been paying Bribes for years to the corrupt IOC President in order to make Bodybuilding an Olympic Sport. It NEVER happened because Bodybuilding is NOT a sport, its only a BEAUTY CONTEST!!! But that did not the deter the CORRUPT IOC President from pointing out to the Weider's that ONLY Americans had won the Mr. Olympia. Even Sergio and Arnold were naturalized citizens. So along came Dorian Yates, a subject of the Queen. So guess who became the Weider's next Olympia Marketing Tool? At first it was all good. However, after numerous torn connective tissue injuries due to very SLOPPY training. Yates was NO longer Mr. Olympia material. But the Weider's continued the Charade for two more years in the hopes of landing Bodybuilding as an Olympic Sport. It did not end well for both Yates or the Weider's. Yates became an Orthopedic Wreck and the Weider's never got to the Olympics. Overall, a justified collection of over rated bodybuilders brought to you mostly by the Weider Marketing Machine."
Sloppy training? More like not backing off the intensity while depleted and at risk. All of his tears happened mere weeks before competition, even he himself says he should've backed off and not trained the same as in off season when the body is revitalized and can take a harder beating.
"So guess who became the Weider's next Olympia Marketing Tool" said by someone who doesn't even know who Yates is and was. The man was barely known in his own city of Birmingham let alone UK, let alone Europe.
If Weiders really wanted to make money they'd go for Shawn Ray, Flex, Levrone. You talk about corruption and fixing the contests but you think the Weiders gave a damn whether all the winners were American or not? Dorian Yates was the complete opposite of a marketable champion that a company would make money off of. As I said, if they wanted to make money they'd go for people like Ray, Flex or Levrone who all had bigger ego, were constantly competing and doing guest shows, constantly attending conventions, constantly appearing in public and overall were EXTROVERTS.
and I'm not going to argue whether '97 Yates was Mr. Olympia material, all I am going to say is that Nasser wasn't either.
If you go and watch the getbig's HD video of the thing, you'd quickly realize how soft and oily he was with 0 back whatsoever. Sorry not sorry but I don't live in a fantasy land where I personally make up the rules of the 'sport'. One single torn muscle that plays no part in the majority of the poses should not AND DOES NOT hurt the athlete in those poses.
Lat spreads, back double = total annihilation of Nasser "L" Sonbaty.
Thank you for taking your time to write this all out, you clearly know lots about bodybuilding.
Thanks for the reminder. Must go to the beach and kick sand in someone's face.
Mike Mentzer !! I have been sick and tired of hearing about that guy for decades. Loses a contest, then loses his mind !!
Definitely agree on the Jay Cutler choice, always looked like his diet was doughnuts.
I've seen Gaspari , Yates and Cutler live at the Olympia , and although one might argue about their photogenic qualities , live they were tremendous. Period.
Let me be clear by saying I'm not trying to hate on Zane. It's not his fault if others overrate him. Moreover, I've seen channels refer to Zane as the "King of Aesthetics." However, it's far less impressive to have a small waist when you weigh far less than your competition. For example, Sergio Oliva is more impressive and aesthetic than Zane because he had a similar waist measurement, but was about 30-45 lbs bigger. It's like comparing the aesthetics of a Mr. Olympia Men's Physique competitor to Shawn Rhoden or Lee Haney. Rhoden & Haney's aesthetics will always be more impressive because Men's Physique competitors are the size of Frank Zane (many are even bigger), but Rhoden & Haney maintained their tiny waist while being about 50 lbs bigger than a Men's Physique competitor.
Please don't misunderstand me. Zane had a great body in comparison to the best physique you'd see at your local gym. However, a Mr. Olympia physique is a body that's unattainable by most of the world's population, even if they too are on gear. Moreover, I'm completely aware that Zane's body is unattainable by many people, even on gear, but it's not impossible. You can find guys who look like him, but rarely find guys who look like a Haney, Ferrigno, Arnold, etc. So to me the real underrated person is Marx Max Muscle. This channel has the humor of Greg Doucette, the knowlege of Nick's Strength & Power and the cleanness of a G rated movie. Seriously, has anyone ever heard Marx Max Muscle use profanity or speak condescedingly about anyone? This is the most underrated bodybuilding channel on UA-cam. You're awesome and we appreciate the work you do. Keep it up!
Partly agree with this but I would use Serge Nubret as the example rather than Sergio Oliva, because Serge was bigger, as aesthetic AND as conditioned as Zane, whereas Sergio Oliva didnt have the same level of conditioning.
@@asprinklingofclouds I completely agree and Serge Nubret is a great example.
If I woke up tomorrow morning with Jay Cutler's hair, I'd be running flat out to the barber shop with the order for him to shave my head!
Charles Atlas won 2 most perfectly developed man contest and this was before he came out with his program, also Charles Atlas was not a bodybuilder.
Your right about Lou. Lou also was the first mass monster. From the sledgemaster 3 times making professional powerlifting history in 2022 and on August 6th and 7th in Hamilton, Ohio under the legend and uspa meet director Eric freeman.
"Overrated" must mean something different in Canada 😂 Examples of "overrated" include Gary Strydom, Branch Warren, and believe it or not, Flex Wheeler after 1999. YES, Flex's physique was insane & people say he's an "uncrowned Olympia" but he never dialed in his lower body from behind and abused Synthol (Shawn Ray is an uncrowned 1994 Mr. Olympia). Let's also write in Ronnie Coleman after 2004. He super-sized, gut blew up, and y'all wanted to ignore it. He did the only thing he knew - train heavier and use more gear - and now the dude can't walk.
If you will dig up photos of Atlas in his prime. You will see he looked as good and better in some cases . Than anyone in his day. I point this out because most of the popular photos we see of Atlas are of him in his 50s after he became famous. Late 40s and early 50s is when he gained his popularity and became famous. I could go on & on . But look up his whole life history and you'll see
Lou Ferrigno 90’s vs. Gunther Schlierkamp 2002
C‘mon Mark do it .. do it now 🫵😜
you are right about Mohamed Makkawy! A great bodybuilder yes, but the 2nd place finish in 1983 Mr Olympia was way too high a place, maybe 4th or 5th. Bertil Fox or Lee Haney should have been 2nd in 83. If Frank Zane is over-rated, then Franco Columbo is even more over-rated. Both won only because Arnold, Serge Nubret, Sergio Oliva, and Lou were no longer around (retired or banished from IFBB). Franco was very muscular and strong, but horrible aesthetics. Franco was never even among the top 5 bodybuilders in the world. Arnold, Lou, Serge Nubret, Sergio Oliva, Robby Robinson were all better than Franco from 1976 on. They either retired or were competing in rival bb federation (the ultimate no-no in the Weider empire!!). Also I disagree with Rich Gaspari being over-rated, he looked pretty good despite his terrible genetics, and he actually WAS the 2nd best bb in the world for 3 years. No one other than Lee Haney was better than Rich from 86 to 88, certainly not Mike Christian (weak legs) or Berry DeMay (20 pounds too light). Branch Warren should be on your list though, that 2nd in 2009 was bogus!
I’d actually put Gaspari in the same camp as Cutler. They both worked extremely hard, were pretty consistent, and overcame subpar genetics, as far as Mr. Olympia competitors go (if you’re in the O, you have great genetics).
@@richfeather Neither guy is over-rated though, since both were at least the 2nd best bodybuilder in the world for multiple years. By contrast Columbo, Zane, Makawwy and Dickerson were NEVER even among the top 5 in the world. Just that the 6 or so bodybuilders who were the best in the world from 1976 to 1982 either chose to retire (Arnold and Lou) or were ousted from the IFBB (Serge Nubret and Sergio Oliva), or were shafted by bad judging (Robinson, Mentzer, Coe).
@@lakeeriesailor2852 Let’s not forget Padilla, the original Giant Killer
@@richfeather yes he was robbed in 81
@@lakeeriesailor2852
And in 1975😉
Implying jay cutler was overrated is insane lol even when he was off he was still beating dudes that we're at their best
Technically he beat them...but a few times he shouldn't have. Thats what he means.
@@curtharakaly4620 yea that makes sense- and he definitely didn't deserve to win in 2007 and was a little soft a couple other years. Even so, winning aside, he was still better than guys who were in better condition and out of all the mass monsters of that era he was one of the few that never once let his mid section go.
2007 was a politic win
Jays look at the 01 Olympia as well as 02 and 03 Arnold is a top 5 physique of all time. Not overrated, just older and worn down by the time he started winning the O.
@@leoerus yea I agree
Jay had, in my opinion, one of the greatest physiques of all time. Probably had my favorite physique ever when he was at his best. His physique is what you would imagine when prompted to think about freaky swole cartoon superman-esque bodybuilders, no way in my mind is he overrated. Plus, if Ronnie wasn't around he'd likely be in the GOAT conversation with phil heath and yates
Jay Cutler probably didn't look like a Mr Olympia in the gym like Ronnie or Phil, but on stage he for sure has one of the greatest physiques of all time. His legs are probably the best ever, there is no way he is overrated. The great white hope
One of the Greatest Physiques...???
Never ever. A mid section wider than the widest itself is a recipe for not being a Mr. Olympia I'd say.
Never had the back conditioning, more so apparent when stood next to Ronnie.
@@jaredmuller171 See I always thought the opposite. I was always blown away by him in the gym and during photo shoots. It was when he got on stage that his flaws became most visible, like his wide waist which caused a lack of v taper and the back which was average at best. He also always had the soggy donk, possibly the soggiest of all time.
Jay's waistline looked about 40 inches despite being cut. Blocky, mis matched body parts.
@@pinetreeflag1517 - totally agree. I have nothing against Jay, but he just didn’t have the aesthetics of many of his top competitors. How he beat Victor Martinez is beyond me. I didn’t see one pose in which Jay was better than Victor in 2007. In fact, I wouldn’t have place Jay higher than 4th yet he took home the big hardware.
Paul Dillett was the most underaterd bodybuilder of all time. Jay, Ronnie and Dorian looked like bloated asymmetrical gummy bears compared to him.
Nah Markus Rühl is. Markus Rühl made Paul Dillett look like a little baby
That pic of Dickerson and Columbo I have Dickerson winning.
I feel that Jay Cutler was very overrated,don’t think he should have won any of the Olympia titles
Should’ve won in 2001 and 2009 that’s it
This is one of your more controversial but very entertaining videos I've seen yet. IMO, you were "spot on" with all of your choices and I applaud you for taking a jab at the many "sacred cows"(i.e. Frank Zane) of the bodybuilding community. I knew this subject would stir up the hornet's nest but I read with glee all of the posted comments.
Mohamed Makkawy overrated ? come on dude, he is one of the best poser of all time. His rountine in 1984 MrO is perfect
You know what's really overrated? The word "overrated." Aside from being an undefined word that exists simply to make one guy's opinion seem better than another's, how do you put a value on inspiring millions of people to become more fit? Atlas and Grimek did a hell of a lot more to build an audience for this kind of video than "Marx Max Muscle" ever will.
Jay Cutler has legs like Nick Walker they dont sweep that well high on the outer thigh where it attaches to the hip it looks like they indent
Imagine for a moment or two if Lou Ferrigno had Lee Haney overseeing EVERY ASPECT of his training and conditioning and actually got serious about things in terms of getting fully optimized in ALL departments. I think he would have become the untouchable body builder that looked like some of alien God.
The only thing I’d say about Ferigno is his shoulder width wasn’t great even with those massive delts , it’s just a weak point that you could never change .
Only problem is that Lou was competing before Haney was in the game...maybe for Lou's comeback he could have helped a little.
Arnold is overrated. People look at what he did for the sport and his fame rather than looking at his physique objectively.
His physique was amazing. In 1980, he was still the biggest most ripped overall. In 74? Jesus Christ.
Best chest and biceps of all time while competing in the 70s, i think thata enough
Well, when Arnold was at his best - in the mid 70s - he could hold his own against any of the top competitors so while I agree and wrote above that he could be considered overrated by MMM’s standards, you can’t argue that he did far more for BB than any other athlete in the sport has.
@Dimonturbo channel that's debatable. There's plenty of bodybuilders over the years with just as good biceps or better (not to mention overall better arms). While less, I would still say the same with his chest. It looked bigger proportionally due to him having weak shoulders (by today's standards)
Arnold had the perfect physique for the time
saying cutler is overrated, well, you lost me there....
2001 is one of the best physiques of ALL TIME on a bb'ing stage
That’s in the eye of the beholder. I think Jay is blocky with no real shape. Love and respect the guy, but not a pleasing, aesthetic physique. Shawn Ray = bodybuilding
Charles Atlas course did not talk about way to talk to buy calisthenics there's a big difference. He pushed physical fitness staying athletic. How many old men did you know in their seventies that could do a handstand push-up he could do it. Charles Atlas did not compete in bodybuilding. It was about calisthenics.
Larry Scott had beautiful arms though.
Dickerson didn´t win 1983 (that´s the year of Sammir Banout), but 1982.
Mostly agree esp with DeMey who was better than Gaspsri. Please baby please can we have Berry DeMey vs Gary Strydom vs Bob Paris? All tall athletic guys unfortunately in shadow of the great Lee Haney - thanks MMM.
Matt Mendenhall as well .
No way Jat Cutler or Larry Scott were overrated
Coleman was overrated to me. Yeah, he was big and ripped, but he looked terrible. He had bad shape, no aesthetics.
0:11 The subtitles say Kenny Waller is the guy who stole “my cat’s” t-shirt 😾
Franco is the most overrated olympia champ ever. Never had the best physique on stage the years he won.
Have to disagree. He looked great at his peak.. massive, sliced and densely muscular.
Phil Heath is pound for pound the most overrated bodybuilder of all time!!! He is so overrated that he won several Olympia title with a narrow shoulder and preggy each year he competed 😂🤣
Who wants to look like ronnie coleman you can't move
Ken Waller was the Tom Platz of his day. Next to Sergio Oliva, he had the best legs in bodybuilding. F.Y.I., Before Photoshop, Weider would retouch photos by superimposing images. A picture of Arnold's Calf Implants were actually Ken Wallers Calves! A picture of Sergio's calves that resembled Full Grown Cows were superimposed with Bill Grant calves to show Sergio's regression after leaving the IFBB. The Weider Mis-Information train knew NO bounds! As good as Ken Wallers legs were, his upper body never could match their development. Weak Back/Chest, Narrow Shoulder structure, Thick Waist line, Small Biceps and Triceps too. Like Platz, he over trained his Arms till he Tore Off the Biceps/Triceps connective tissues! JOHN HANSEN has a UA-cam channel where he interviews plenty of Old School Bodybuilders from the 1950's-1990's. Jerry Brainum is a guest on his channel and is a living encyclopedia of the Bodybuilding Culture and he's FUNNY too. A two-part interview with Danny Padilla will reveal to you the Pumping Iron Shenanigans that took place. There is even a Portugal component to the story, but I won't spoil it for you. All straight from the horses mouth so to speak. So Marx Max Muscle is correct to have Ken Waller on his OVER-RATED list. To be fair to the Weiders, there were only a few straps to hand out each year (Mr. Olympia, Mr. Universe, Mr. International, Mr. America, Mr. USA). So a lot of Bodybuilding competitors were left missing the boat.
Arnold did not have calf implants. Lou Ferrigno did, when he returned to the stage in the 90s.
Mark, back in Zane's day Joe Weider used to pick the winners of the Mr Olympia and it was up to the editors of the magazines he owned to try and rationalise how Zane could possibly win out against Robby, Boyer, etc, who were clearly far better developed than Frank was. Although Weider never actually came out and said it in so many words, for fear that it could be construed that he DID pick the winners himself, it was a generally accepted viewpoint that Joe was deeply concerned over the rampant use of anabolic steroids in bodybuilding, and so he put forward a physique, Frank Zane's physique, that could be duplicated naturally, or perhaps with no more that judicious use of Dianabol, and not the much more potent and dangerous gear that was around by the mid-1970s. No doubt Joe was hoping that young bodybuilders would try to get as good as Zane and not push the envelope any further. Frank became the natural successor to Steve Reeves.
Joe was concerned about the rampant steroid usage? really?
@@daveedesanta6318 . . Yeah, he was. Or at least that's what his magazines said at the time. I was active as a bodybuilder back then and I bought the Weider mags, as well as Iron Man Magazine and the York mags.
Frank Zane did a posing and promo tour of Australia in 1975 and I went along to see him. On the bill that night was young Ed Casey, the current Jr Mr Australia, a guy with a bulky yet trim physique, actually bigger than Zane's physique as it turned out. But, although it was definitely NOT a competition, Zane clearly out-classed Casey in all areas except for size. I came away from that evening with a new respect for Frank, and an appreciation for what Joe Weider was all about. I believe he was trying to influence young impressionable bodybuilders into setting goals for themselves that didn't involve them risking their lives with dangerous steroids.
@@arthurblackhistoric wow that's great history there.. u are a lucky old man, bet you are healthy as a horse these days too... how old are u? and do u still work out?
that's true, risking your life with steroids to achieve an appearance that is not sustainable is really stupid. the more i look at this modern body building, the more i dislike it and see it's long term dangers.
@@daveedesanta6318
I think Joe was concerned about how many magazines he could sell and not much else.
@@kurtvonfricken6829 Joe Weider, just liek the rest of his type, was nothing but a fraud... I've come to this realization. Even arnold was a fraud and a boot licker... nothing else...
And this is how you lose subscribers🤦
Jay Cutler overrated?🤔 ( 4x Mr.Olympia)
The only person who dethroned Ronnie Coleman!
Frank Zane overrated?
Frank Zane is considered one of the most aesthetic bodybuilders if not the most of all time!
Victor Martinez wiped the floor with Jay Cutler.
Ronnie Coleman. Just wanted to make a comment with his name.
I think Ronnie Coleman is overall overrated but his 1998, 1999, 2000 and 2003 Forms were insane
@@gooommiii Ronnie is the most underrated. Not to mention a natty who ate lots of chicken, rice and water.
@@gooommiii 98 he had gyno.
Not that many people can take credit for adding *a whole new body part* to a sport that judges body parts. Rich Gaspari goes down in history for shredded glutes.
There's a few I would have included if I'd made this list. Branch Warren comes to mind, and Dennis Wolf. Serious respect to both of them, but Branch just always had a not-very-pleasing physique, and Dennis had too many weaknesses to have such a strong CV. Just 2 that comento my mind from recent years.
Frank Zane is overrated ⁉️
Yup
Dorian Yates the one that changed the whole world of bodybuilding my favorite.
show us some of your own body building work man - curious to see how you have developed yourself over the years
Frank Zane - I’m glad someone said it. Hugely overrated. Sure he’s aesthetic, but not to any special degree, and he’s undersized even for the golden era.
George hackenschimdt from the bronze era was bigger than him 💀💀💀
I could go either way. Undersized for sure but come on. Most guys including myself would love to have that physique!
@@timothyvonvictory7105 i would literally have to downsize my quads to have his physique. And im a natty two years in
@@afonso1816 lol easy to say until your up on stage in the tiny posing trunks. Have you seen a natty bodybuilding show??? NONE of these guys looked as good as Zane. But I'm sure your different 😂😂😂😂
@@afonso1816 as Ronnie would say, "Afonso 18 is smoking crack"
Interesting opinions. I can’t say as I agree with all. Using MMM’s criteria, I could say Arnold was overrated. Were there better bodybuilders than Arnold during his Mr. O title run? Oliva, Pearl, Nubret - arguably better than Arnold. So, was Arnold overrated? No. He had an enormous impact on BB. How about Zane? He brought conditioning and shape in a package that was unique during his reign. Zane’s still held as the prototypical aesthetic BB and I’d suggest Zane’s physique was a significant contributor to the creation of the Classic division and the shift from the mass monsters - a necessity now as BB’s bubble-gut era of mass-at-all-costs nearly destroyed BB.
I beg to differ.The classic division was created as an attempt to go back to the pre 90's look where they balanced mass with aesthetics.Can't say Frank Zane had anything to do with that.Most bbers pre 90's were aesthetic.
Yes, there were better-built men than Charles Atlas back in the 1920s and 1930s, but they never entered the contests he did. Plus the magic of clever advertising made his fortune (and legend). I knew his son Charles Atlas Jr. (1918-2008). He told me some wonderful stories about his Dad!
Frank zane is awesome
Great shape
I wouldn't really say Chris Dickerson is overrated. He might've won the 1982 Mr. Olympia. But in turn he's widely considered the weakest Mr. Olympia winner of all time
But I'm assuming this list is based more off of accomplishments rather than community perception
Nope Franco with those bow legs no leg separation and gyno wins that overrated title!
@@davidanderson3684 Tbh, I don't consider any of the sham Olympias since they won by robbery: Arnold 80, Cutler 07, Dorian 97, and esp Franco in 81 etc
@@HawkHogan_ Ronnie 2001,2002
@@proudmen1220 I said and etc lol.
2001 could be argued for Ronnie though 2002 was obviously BS
@@HawkHogan_ 2001 is shady af
losing on the scorecards in the prejudging and a bunch of hush hush in regards to IFBB president and the promoter talking to Weider about what was to be done.
Also what doesn't help the case is that Cutler stopped being a Weider athlete the year before in 2000 and Coleman was still under contract with the Weiders :)
Day 465 of saying hi to Marx!
8:23 Chris Dickerson became Mister Olympia 1982th in London and 1983th in München, M. O. became Samir Bannout !
If you go into the Olympia with a torn Bicep you should not win over someone with all their bodyparts!!
This is a question that cannot be answered without looking at some pics. If it was Arnold No, but Dorian nvr had the best biceps to begin with so it differs
Or with the gyno,gut,melted body parts, split 4-pack etc
that makes absolutely 0 sense. The show is based on rounds and individual poses that are all accounted for individually.
Does a torn bicep hurt the athlete in the bicep involved poses? yes, obviously.
Yet why would a torn bicep that is not flexed or is straight out not even being seen in the poses like the side tricep, lat spreads, abs and thighs, side chest (to a degree) hurt the athlete? Makes 0 sense why that would be the case.
@Dj_M1 I'm getting on stage soon and have a torn meniscus in my left knee. My left leg is noticeably smaller than the right leg. Should I win over someone who has 2 good symmetrical legs? Have you ever competed before? It makes a world of difference...balance and symmetry are part of the judging. You see biceps in almost every pose. Front double, rear double, side chest, most muscular.
@@jancoexp biceps are some of the smallest muscle groups if not the smallest that actually matters on the bodybuilding stage. "you see biceps in almost every pose" is the bicep contracted therefore the injury on display in almost every pose? no. Are the biceps important enough to sway the opinion of the judges in the side chest or front lat spread, or side tricep? nope. Biceps play such an insignificant role in those poses that it's not even funny. Sure, they're visible, but no attention is paid to them.
And yes, you should win against someone who has 2 good symmetrical legs if the rest of you is better than his physique, you're 30-40 pounds bigger while more conditioned.
Sigmund Klein did not enter any contests run by Bernarr MacFadden. Physical Culture magazine ran a "Perfectly Developed" contest for many years. Atlas (real name: Angelo Siciliano) won "America's Most Handsome Man Contest," in 1921 (a photo contest), then "America's Most Perfectly Developed Man" contest at Madison Square Garden in 1921. He was running neck and neck with movie stuntman, Joe Bonomo, until Joe broke his leg and Atlas went on to win. Photos of Atlas in his twenties and thirties showed a much better physique, unlike the later photos you have here. He never was "The World's Most Perfectly Developed Man," as this was a title invented by his long-time business partner and publicist, Charles P. Roman.
King Kamali.
The funniest shit I ever heard about him was that he was a good poser. He just danced like an out of shape idiot and barely would hit a shot for longer than a second.
Well, at least overweight
@@rstov9442 He was terrible to be honest. I know he got to a point where very few people will ever get, but he sucked when he got there and just danced like an out of shape idiot never hitting a pose properly. I've seen him in interviews and he seems like a Cool guy, but holy shit he was bad as a bodybuilder!
Charles atlas could tear phone boohs and playing cards he was strong noone no one said he was a bodybuilder
When JAy was on he was one if the best ever. To me 2nd to only ROnnie at his best.
😂
Surprised Dan Cilley (or Johnny Deven Young) didn't make this list.
I was in the front row at the 2001 Mr Olympia and Jay Cutler was unbelievable and should have won that year.
Well somebody please help me. I never knew Arnold Schwarzenegger was overrated because he sure did not beat Dickerson.
Zane was not over rated in fact he had detail that most did not have in his day!!
I'd have to agree here. There are so many great ones who never won a contest. But the same guys win it over and over? Favoritism.
Franco in 81.
Oh WOW I wasn't aware you were present at the 1980 MR. O and had a inside scup on the round table who were making the decisions on who wins. I was and I WON.......
Iain Valliere is the epitome of overrated.
how convenient that you included Yates on the premise of 2 bad years ('94 & '97) but didn't include Ronnie with his 3 year run before he redeemed himself.
2000: terrible gut terrible physique, if no leg Levrone actually had legs, he'd win.
2001: losing to Cutler in the prejudging, shady deals and a whole judging panel being coerced to change their opinion as Coleman was a Weider athlete and Cutler severed the tie the year before.
2002: By far the worst Ronnie Coleman during his 8 year run. The equivalent of 1997 Yates except that Yates actually controlled his midsection and wasn't 248 pounds.