The Best Bean To Cup
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- Опубліковано 15 чер 2024
- This one has been a long time coming, and even at this run time I feel like I’ve barely scratched the surface. As I said, we didn’t touch on the apps because apps cause me emotional pain most of the time. (Also, we didn’t want to make a 2 hour video...). *We unfortunately managed to leave out the Gaggia Accademia UX/UI review from this edit so if you're interested in that, we have uploaded it separately here: • Gaggia Accademia UX/UI...
Here’s the links to the machines we tested:
Melitta Barista TS: international.melitta.de/en/P...
De'Longhi Dinamica Plus: www.delonghi.com/en-gb/dinami...
Gaggia Accademia: www.gaggia.com/automatic-mach...
Siemens EQ9: www.siemens-home.bsh-group.co...
Jura Z10: jura-z10.com/en_uk/
Miele CM7750: www.miele.co.uk/e/countertop-...
Timestamps:
0:00 Intro
2:53 Espresso testing
17:33 Milk drink testing
25:45 User interface and build testing
33:17 Concluding thoughts
Related videos:
How To Dial In a Bean To Cup (Like A Nerd): • How To Dial In A Bean ...
“Coffee Expert” Reacts to Brad Pitt’s Weird Coffee Commercial: • "Coffee Expert" Reacts...
Links:
Patreon: / jameshoffmann
Limited Edition Merch: www.tenshundredsthousands.com
My Books:
The World Atlas of Coffee: geni.us/atlasofcoffee
The World Atlas of Coffee Audiobook: bit.ly/worldatlasofcoffeeaudio
The Best of Jimseven: geni.us/bestofjimseven
Find me here:
Instagram: / jimseven
Twitter: / jimseven
Things I use and like:
My video kit: kit.co/jimseven/video-making-...
My current studio coffee kit: kit.co/jimseven/studio-coffee...
My glasses: bit.ly/boldlondon
My hair product of choice: geni.us/forthehair - Розваги
We somehow unintentionally managed to leave out the UX/UI segment for the Gaggia Accademia on this edit, so we've uploaded that section separately here instead: ua-cam.com/video/zgybPrP1YJA/v-deo.html
Oh this is awesome I'm happy you testing my machine too or very similar, I got the melitta t-smart TS is just deluxe like.
Oh and the 55ml instead of 60, the machine adjusts it if you change the grind setting. Imo this machine is great price/quality, allthough mine was already replaced under warrantee & the display can give trouble if you keep machine on for long.
You managed also not to include the price in Euros.
Looks like you have a scammer pretending to be you giving away coffee machines
@@jg-uh5xq yeah... I just received one of those... surely it’s not for real!?
The perfect cup of coffee was brewed and enjoyed exactly 28 years ago on a Tuesday afternoon in a small cafe in Spain. Everyone else missed it.
That sounds like a sentence that would find itself in the Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy
But, perfect to whom?
The best you ever had is just a memory
@@brendboer6026 as each moment passes it becomes memmory
@@keco185 first thing I thought of too. what a great book.
Now we need test for under 1k for the machines we can actually afford 🤣
This must be a scam! He wrote more comments like that and it seems like we both win the same machine.. I’d only trust a verified account
Yeah, us plebs are people too. 😉
@Flexo I second this!
Wonder if the Patreon supporters chose more expensive machines with the knowledge that they make a chance to win these machines.
I've been hard at bay finding a good machine under 1k that actually brews good coffee. Found none. I've just splurged and got the delonghi. For under 1k, just buy a Nespresso machine honestly... you'd be better off.
I’m not even slightly in the market for these machines, yet, I still watch all your videos. Love them.
I would love to see a comparison of multiple Delonghi Bean To Cup, from the lowest end to the highest end, since the price range is quite large and they seem to use the same brewing mechanism.
seconded!
Thirded
q .... quadrupled? What is the correct word, guys?
err quintuppled?
My understanding is that all units from a specific series (ECAM, ESAM, etc) the internals are the same (brew unit, boiler, pump, etc). Only the offered features and user interface differ.
The Siemens actually has a true dual grinder - not just dual hopper. So no mixture of coffee.
The milk tank can go into the fridge and you can buy an milk package adapter if you want.
seems like a rushed video.
@ 2:19 he states he's not going too much into detail on every machine. Stay Alert Stay Alive
I have a Siemens, makes way better coffee than most other brands that are 2-3x expensiver..
We use the eq9 with single grinder (s700 i think) and the McDonald's Espresso roast. We Love it. Surely not the best quality Coffee but we Love the Taste with the eq9. And what i think is the best Part on the Siemens. She is absolute easy to Handle and cleaning. All parts are ready to build Out and can be cleaned. Most parts in the dishwasher.
The Machine can Show when the next cleaning process is expected. All process is with an step by step Manuel in the Machine and in the Manuel. It has an integrated water decalcer.
I love this Machine.
Its no real Espresso Machine but for us, she is quite perfect
@@robertof.5283 We have the same with the single grinder and I concur, coffee is great, lattes and espressos too, we use very dark roasts though. But the cleaning is so simple on this compared to other machines we've had before, couldn't quite believe how easy it was to clean both the brewing unit and the inside. It's also one of the most quiet machines we had. Heaven!!
As a Jura owner, I am happy to see it got good results. I think folks who own a Jura understand that they are paying for well above average coffee that is still a notch below the traditional coffee shop machines in exchange for incredible convenience. I don't want to be a barista in my own house every morning when I'm rushing to work or having a dinner party -- it's an incredible feeling to be able to pull a great cup of coffee or cappuccino and have minimal setup / cleaning to do afterwards. I personally have found it to be worth every penny, even if it means I give up control over some of the knobs I would have to get the perfect extraction
You nailed the whole Superautomatic ownership experience and why Jura should still be considered the best at it. Only thing I'd add is that Jura are too pricey if your main focus is espresso. You can get as-good espresso with much cheaper Superautomatics. But what Jura does to simplify and automate the milk process, if that's what you want, is a thing of beauty and worth every cent. Also, I reckon these machines make better coffee than two-thirds to three-quarters of Baristas out there.
Yes those are my thoughts on Superauto machines too. Both my son and my son-in-law have more hands on types of coffee makers and although they will generally make a better espresso (it can go badly wrong some times) - its takes an absolute age to get there and then there's all the cleaning up after. By the time you've added some frothy milk though, there's not much difference in the quality of the coffee.
@@Roulandus-le-Fartere Any opinion on where Jura stands vs semi-autos?
I was a happy Jura owner buying Jura E6 when on sale at Costco. Worked great for 6 months then started to not dispense coffee. Would grind and start the brew process but few drops would come out with liquid in the puck container. I ran clean cycle even though not prompted and not helpful. Changed the filter even though not needed. This helped for half a cup then problem returned. I was going to contact Jura but since bought at Costco just cleaned up the machine and returned to Costco. Thanks for the return policy Costco refunded my purchase price. I do not abuse Costco return policy but did not want to deal with sending the machine in for repair. I think 6 months to start failure was not good and I did do all the maintenance required and still have large number of Jura cleaning pucks and few of the filters. If I get the courage I may give them another shot.
Agreed. As someone who has owned espresso machines as well as fully automatic machines.. the ability to get 80% of the experience for 10% of the effort is worth it, especially when you are time limited.
We need another video for 2024
My aunt has Jura machines for years and loves a cappuccino, she actually considers not having a container a feature as she just sticks it in the container, closes it up and back into the fridge.
Completely agree. We've been using our Z5 for years and only used the milk container once at the very beginning. There is just no argument for filling a container as it needs to be emptied and cleaned afterwards. I'd say it's the right call to sell it separately because even those people using it can just keep one for any future machine.
Agreed. We use ours mainly for espresso and when we want to make some milk drink, we just take a carton of milk out of the fridge and make it. No need to clean anything afterwards :)
My Jura the same I used a screw top jam jar and just made hole in top for silicon tube as I rarely use auto cappuccino program and I can keep jar in fridge when I do between uses 🤣
Agree too. Good not to have to wash another container. Just a little hose.
I agree as well. I’d guess James is thinking of the expense = luxury but most people in this market are busy and the fewer dishes the better.
21:00 made me laugh so hard. It delicately prepares your drink with a delicate layer of foam on top... and then just angrily sputters and steams all over it
it also kicks sand in your face and makes moves on your girlfriend
@@ianwilliams7740 Thanks to that machine I´m sleeping on my parents coach and had to take a second job at McDonald´s to pay for the alimony. For some reason I also have HIV now.
the steam causing that little bit of spill over the side of the cup just added to the comedy, haha. poor little delicate cup of coffee.
Hi James, my father made one of his first trips to Italy in the early early 70s. He brought back his first espresso machine (no clue of what the name was). Seems like he kept going back and buying more machines. He always had one at home and one at his office. I got all of his hand me downs. So I have had espresso machines since probably 1973. I had 2 Quick Mills Super Automatic machines, with the filter basket of 7 g and an upgraded one with 9 g. Look them up. I have owned an assortment of single boiler machines heat exchangers since my early 20s. To name a few I have had multiples: Electra, Pavoni, Pasquini Livietta, Quick Mill Anita, and I am currently rocking a dual boiler, what you would call a Sage (Breville in the US). Freshly roasted double shot cappuccino first thing in the morning for 45 years! The funny thing is that in those early days I had almost no clue on how to get good reputable shots until guys like you came along and explained it all. Thank you for your contribution…
I've had my Jura Z6 for over a decade now and I am very pleased with my purchase. The Jura shop in my area asked if I wanted to "upgrade" my Jura for a new one. Turned down the offer as my older model apparently has a very good boiler where as newer ones coffee/espresso does not come out as hot.
I coincidentally bought the Jura two weeks ago. So seeing your review is quite pleasing.
The machine, once you figured out all it’s ins and outs, is fantastic.
It’s summer in South Africa and the cold brew it delivers is something quite astonishing.
The flat white is proper quality that is better than a lot of average “coffee shops”
I am mechanical engineer and your descriptions of fail designed features made me laugh a lot.
My top 5 of funniest points:
1. the moving thing (why?? 😂)
2. the violent steam finish (wtf!)
3. choice-buttons too tight at each other (oops, now I have to drink cappuccino instead of espresso 🤷🏻♂️😄)
4. noisy fans
5. the upstanding cover of bean hopper
violent steam finish !🤣
I have a Delonghi worked continuously in my small restaurant, I think the model is magnifica S. It is not a coffee restaurant per se but 30+ cups of coffee per day is for sure. 10 years, it has been making coffee, and still going strong.
My advice to you is sell more coffee, margins on a cup of coffee are much higher than on anything else in restaurant/gastronomic business
Magnifica S is a legend. I have had it in most of the offices I worked in. Never disapoints, and the coffee is reasonably descent for such cheap machine.
We have a refurbished magnifica S in our house, has made 2700 coffees in 4 years and still working great
in line with french fries @@KokkiePiet
These reviews and coffee advice are awesome.
No bias (from what I can tell) & just nice clear advice on how to have nicer coffee. Thanks! 😊
James his review about "cean to cup machines", is by far the best that I have seen, the most other reviews on youtube don't tell anything about the coffee quality or with less details, James can tell in a very interesting way what to expect. James tells in a fascinating way, really took your attention, critical in pleasant way.
What a fab review James. Really enjoyed it. I have owned Juras for 10+ years and now have an E8 and it serves me well but always wondered how the other brands were. So fabulous to see the comparison and as always with your reviews I love your structured approach to it all and honesty!!
Bosch Siemens actually has other newer models with milk pipe going into the carton as well and I think it's brilliant. No need to store a separate container in the fridge or clean and the milk never remains in the container and goes bad. I love my Bosch machine.
I've had an older Jura machine (the Ena3) for about 14 years now and I've been impressed with it. Normally I hate UIs that are basically a single multi function button, but this one does it well, and seems to appreciate that its primary place in the world is to solve the first coffee problem, so just turning it on and slapping the big button will give you coffee. Accessing the other functions through The Button is handled by making it a jog dial with clear detents, and feedback on a simple single line LCD, which works well for me: no recall needed so it solves the normal problem with single button interfaces. It is also still easy to service occasionally with the local agents all these years later, and has survived being pulled off the kitchen counter onto it's face by an angry baboon with barely a scratch to show for it (I live in an interesting place). So for me, although cheaper machines have feature parity I've been happy I paid more for this one as I'd almost certainly have gone through at least two of the cheaper machines in this timeframe.
We have a slightly cheaper Delonghi, similar style and built quality. Even after 4 years of daily use several times a day it produces tasty coffee - not proper espresso, but it does not claim it would. Thank you for your test and insight James!
I've got the Delonghi that's roughly half the price of the one he's reviewing and I'm certain it's exactly the same on the inside. Same touch-screen interface and everything. I love it, and to have him say he likes the coffee means I have not wasted my money. 😄
When my in-laws bought the exact delonghi as in the video they gave me and my wife older delonghi which is at least 7, more like 8 years old (it has over 20000 or so cups of coffee under its belt) . The pucks coming from the machine are as dry as they were when it was new and I was able to dial very tasty coffee from it. I am very impressed by delonghi.
My in-laws gave it to us because it had electronic issues and when send to service they told them that to repair it it would cost like half a price of a new one. So they bought the new one.
Given it was more or less working they gave it to us and turned out no problems so far occurred and we have it like 6 months. I suspect a solar power plant on my in-laws house is in fault as that might have created instability in the outlets.
For final comparison my parents had a Bosh for like 8 years also and that was giving out wet slush instead of pucks for the last 2 years (and what was worse a tasteless brown water instead of coffee) so they (and that is total coincidance) bought the delonghi from the video as well.
Yes! as someone who restored a fair amount of delonghi's; ALL OF THEM HAVE THE SAME INTERNALS. the only main differences being having an extra heating element for automatic steaming models and different design with different recipes. The ecam 21.112b has being going strong with my parents for 5 years now. I recently refurbished it and it still works fine. Only downside to an semi-auto espresso machine is that superauto's get really dirty over time, and this is the case with all machines even if they say they are ''automatic cleaning''
Model?
I have the entry level delonghi etam 29.510.sb (what a mouthful) and the grinder knob looks identical to the delonghi machine featured. I love it, it has had daily use for 3 years and has never missed a beat. Only downside to me is it does waste a lot of water cleaning itself before and after making coffee but it's not the end of the world. Would recommend one for sure.
Thank you for your expert insight James - glad that the wait for your review wasn’t that long! Have been interested in automatic machines for daily use and a Hario or manual espresso for the weekend to cultivate my coffee experience.
I've gotten to use a Jura S9, and with my experience with that and seeing other Jura machines, I think there's a fairly good case to be made that they're meant as premium office machines rather than creating the best possible at-home espresso. They're meant to be maintained by a core set of people while being able to pump out decent espresso on demand all day - hence the 'hidden' drink settings. Jim in the end cube isn't going to muck up everyone's coffee by putting it on some random setting that only he likes.
+1 … Our Jura Impressa S9 has been a workhorse for more than a decade or more. Great strength coffee. .. PS., we luv our Miele appliances D/W, Drier, Washer, Oven etc.
Jim always mucks stuff up.
Yes, the cleaning requirements for Juras when using milk drinks really put me off the brand as a home machine.
@@robinisathakur The Meile is worst by far.
There's a reason every office uses a Jura. Everybody starts by buying a cheaper machine. Then another one when it breaks after 3 months of punishing use. Then, after the second unit also breaks, they understand that it makes more economic sense to get a heavy duty Jura machine that will be good for years.
I love coffee! i hate people telling like "this is the only good way to drink coffee"..just hate it! But you are the first person in a long while that actually talks about every aspect of the coffee and how to approach it, thanks for all the knowlegde i now start to learn from you 1 video at the time! got alot to go, but daimn is is amusing/informative! love the content!
I have the Delonghi in the comparison. I know the mobile apps were not part of the review but the app allows fine-tuning the output by ml. Very easy to adjust and save preferences. Also the container is quite easy to clean which was important to me. Thanks for the review.
I have a lower level of the Delonghi. Have to second your positive for the container with a plus that it fits in the fridge in the door. Also all the feeding of water, milk, emptying is done from the front which is a huge plus point on the usual kitchen counter where there is other stuff to the sides of the machine and cabinet above it. Have to give it high marks for ergonomics and mechanical useability.
Pppp
I have the Delonghi Dinamica Plus and I really like it. For milk drinks, I do the cappucino mix, which does coffee first then milk, which mixes the beverage a lot better. Also, with the app you can actually easily increase the dosage and volume.
what kind of? 85 or 95 please?
Yeah it is a nice machine! Technically Coffee first drinks are more traditionally that of a latte. Cappuccino's are milk first then espresso so that you can a "cap" of foam on top.
We've been using our Jura ENA9 since I got it for my husband several years ago. Big splurge but it ended up paying for itself easily - my husband stopped going to Starbucks daily. I've got to say that Jura's service center is the absolute best of any that I've ever experienced with any company, ever.
I can buy any espresso machine. Can't buy the customer service dept. Thank you for sharing the good about this company. May look into Jura.
I keep reading the exact opposite on multiple sites. 🤔 Bad customer service is a deal breaker for me.
@@catguy64 I can only speak from my experience over many years. Jura has given me the best customer service I have ever received for any product, much less for a kitchen appliance. My cleaning service broke the Jura by shoving parts back all incorrectly which jammed the machine (not a simple jam when you forget the grounds hopper which is the typical jam and solved by a sequence of buttons over the phone). Sent it to Jura and the reconditioned it (for a fee that my cleaning service paid for) and fixed it and sent it back - I swear its better than it was new. I bought this about 10 years ago and still going strong!!
2nd - we've had Jura for 15+ years and I have been consistently impressed with their customer service. I've recommended Jura to friends + family and they also have not been disappointed. Would not buy any other machine.
We had an older Jura in the office that made about 30-60 shots every day. It was beat to hell but made excellent coffee with an outstanding crema for many years and I've been enamoured with Jura's ever since.
Agreed. My partner was always buying coffees, sometimes leaving home to go through the Maccas drive through (of all things) because he hated instant, and didn't want to faff about with espresso machines.
So armed with just a couple hundred Australian dollarydoos I searched around and found a local appliance wholesaler that also did refurbs and factory seconds - where they had a used Jura ENA Micro 90, pretty banged up on the outside but they cleaned out and replaced the inner parts where necessary to freshen it up. Was previously in a small office lunch room.
We've since had it for over 3 years, multiple cups a day and never once missed a beat.
Every few weeks it goes through a self clean cycle with fancy little tablets (takes like 20 mins and is all automated), and swap out the water filter a few times a year + hand wash the removable parts.. saved us soooooo much money, I love it
@@MotoCat91 Yeah that's something that's impossible to test on a bench: how long will it keep making good coffee without breaking? That's where the price difference between the Delonghi and Jura will start to make sense, when the swiss made machine soldiers on 10 years after the other one has broken down.
I've had my jura for over 7 years. Never replaced anything. Has always worked and tasted great! I have always used the exact same coffee beans for 7 years *Lavazza* and I noticed it started to taste sour last year. So I watched a UA-cam video on how to disassemble and clean it. It's basically a space ship on the inside and after extreme care of disassembling the very small parts and deep cleaning and soaking components, it's basically brand new again. It's not hard to work on these. Just very small and important parts in there. If anything were to break, parts are expensive and honestly I would maybe just buy a new machine.
@@coryh9731I have a jura z8. So after you cleaned it the coffee tasted better again? I spoke to jura and if you send it to them they do a total refurb of all internal parts that need replacing for around 400 aud$.
We had a Jura ena 9 have had it for 14 years still going but recently up graded to Jura s8 because we got near new less than a year old been recently service. Anyway I’m in love it has so many features we didn’t have in the older model 🖤☕️
I have the Melitta, and you are right about the buttons. It"s difficult to adjust the buttons but i usually use the personal buttons, so you don't need to adjust the buttons. Pretty decent machine for the money
For those still wondering about that Breville/Sage Oracle Touch, James has reviewed it before, in December 2017. Here's the link:
ua-cam.com/video/fRBOxyu2b2Q/v-deo.html
I'd still like him to revisit this machine.
Me too
Agreed I have the Oracle myself which is nigh on the same machine minus the touchscreen and love it to bits so would be interested in seeing James compare that to other machines head to head.
A thorough and thoroughly enjoyable review. My favorite remark, "I don’t always want granularity. I often want to get to coffee as quickly as I can.”
I have owned a Jura Capressa E8 for 15 years and the cup I brewed this am is just as good as the first one I ever made with it. I use purifier water only and I use fresh beans, and not 'flavored' beans. Also, I go through the cleaning cycle with the Jura tablets when the machine prompts me to do so. I paid $1200 for it back then and it has been worth every cent!
Not as good as going to Starbucks though where the professionals make them
When mine finally died it had over 37,000 brew cycles over 17 years.
I keep a small (12 oz ) stainless milk frothing pitcher to hold the milk for my Jura machine. That way it can go in and out of the refrigerator as needed. I usually only make 3 or 4 café latte per day so that way the milk is protected from spoiling. I found that putting the milk tube directly into a bigger milk box or jug had the potential of spoiling the larger quantity of milk through cross-contamination. Also, my Jura machine ( Impressa A9) has been completely reliable for the 6 years that I've owned it. It's been serviced once but keeps chugging along.
I have owned Jura machines for about 18 years now, first one was the original E8 I sold after 4 year, second one was the F9 which i ran until i needed new burrs after 10 years, 3rd is the new E8 which i absolutely love. I have tried Delonghi and Saeco early models, but those early models were very poor builds and brews which made me switch back to Jura and stay with them. the E8 is about half the price of the Z10, but has many of the UI but with manual grinder adjustment. The only alternative i have ever considered was the Oracle Touch, so i cant wait for that comparison
Once you go to a machine like a Jura you can never go back.
@@MrFizzarale Not sure about that, my friend has jura and i purchased Delonghi it is no comparison, Delonghi pores much better espresso then jura. I think is depends on what model you get.
@@rimasl.5645 With me having no experience with Delonghi products I cannot speak to their quality. So I cannot embrace this debate as much as I would like.
And how do you cope with unremovable brew unit? From a maintenance perspective it can cost a fortune…
Idk, I tried several Juras (E8 and Z6) recently and really didn't like them. Milk wasn't hot enough and coffee shots were really small even after ajusting all the settings. I bought an Oracle Touch, and it's much, much better. It's not a super automatic though so you still have to rinse parts after.
I'm so glad someone finally reviewed the Miele! I've only seen the cheaper variants and we have this exact one! Thanks for the vid
“Why did that move!” - really got a chuckle out of that one
Thanks James. Really love
watching your videos. I'm a newbie in the world of the espresso machines. I own a Delonghi Autentica, so below this price range, but for my level of experience it works for me.
Miele, in my mind, exists mostly to sell their stuff to people that buy a whole kitchen at furniture stores. And that's why they get away with the prices they charge. My parents got all of their kitchen electronics built-in from them (bean-to-cup, fridge, microwave, ...) and they all have these weird issues that just make them incredibly frustrating to use.
And I'm pretty sure that's why they do weird things like moving the spout up and down: it looks cool and stands out the first time a furniture salesman shows it to you, and that's how they get sales
miele genuinely makes real good washing machines, drying machines and dishwashers - that's what they're known for... their other products eh.... the super expensive built in coffe machines that cost over 3000 pounds have a reputation of being unable to deliver hot coffe
@@BitmapFrogs so its mostly like 90% of german coffee. I myself have a Miele vacuum and its great, but their coffee machine is probably made for the German market. And Germans drink the worst coffee in Europe. Mind you I’m not talking about specialty/minority run cafes, but the everyday germans place. The coffee there is usually so terrible that you’d rather just drink beer/wine
Would like to say, on behalf of my wife who watched this with me, that the cups and glasses that you use in this video are all beautiful! She isn't sold on a B2C machine yet, she is very happy with what I produce from my Gaggia Classic. Very interesting and informative video.
Miele are known for having an unconventional user interface. It’s seen in many domestic devices.
This coffee machine seems from the size and controls, more like an office machine that a technician will set up and the people at the office only need to press a button for making a cup of coffee. This also explains why it has such a flexibility in the grinding as well as the cup size.
The automatic cup height adjustment tries to solve a problem that you see in many kitchen offices as the coffee area gets very dirty because people are too lazy to adjust the coffee outlet.
Last remark - Miele devices are known for their durability and ease of service. This can something come on the expensive of compactness a build design.
Yep the issue with bulk reviews, is the glossing over the target demographic and brand philosophy.
I had one of those counter mounted Mieles, and I HATED it… it broke down FIVE TIMES in the two years I owned it and the shots it made were average at best… so we just kept using our old Jura instead.
We had a Miele built in and it sucked. got rid of it in a remodel, and now using a manual setup with joy.@@ElZamo92
As a former Miele employee this kind of pains me - one of the smaller and cheaper Miele coffee machines with much smaller footprint would have been nice as a comparison (we had one until Dec23, when we upgraded our 800€ Miele from 207 for an Ascaso Duo Steel PID and a Eureka Mignon Oro).
FYI: The coffee machines are one of the few products Miele does not produce itself, but just does the engineering for to let others build it for them (same with their fridges, which are 1:1 Liebherr fridges).
Also: Miele does more and more cost cutting, which also seems to impact product longevity. I am not really sure that this is the sustainable way forward for the company
I had a Delonghi for around 900€. After around 5 Years we changed the bewing group, At the end of its life after around 13 Years it brewed around 25.000 cups of coffee, you can check that in the internal menu. So 900€ for the machine and for 100€ you could get all important replacement parts. I always recommend a Delonghi. I think they have a pretty good value.
And the same goes for all my friends and realtives that had a Delonghi. Everyone that had a Miele or Jura had quite a few problems and they were harder to repair.
We have a Delonghi Magnifica in the office. We've owned it fully 14 years and we flog it mercilessly without any thought for basic responsible maintenance.
A few years back the main motor shorted so we replaced it DIY with used eBay parts DIY.
Over the last year, rather than replacing seals or even checking them, we just kept pounding out coffees and ignoring minor leaks as they slowly escalated. Finally the boiler couldn't hold pressure and leaks abounded. We pulled a used boiler from a junk machine we found and it's back in business like new. Such a beast!
I think our Delonghi will outlive me!
@@mdgow i hate them too...mine is 10 years old, made 10k coffees. It broke down a few months ago (linkswitch blew up). I spent 4 euros and 2 hours on researching and soldering. Works like a charm again... I WANT a new one, but i cant find a reason!
I would rather take semi auto machine. Feels better to make your own better coffee
@@petervansan1054 maybe you want it, but most people don't. And that's what this video was about.
I also use a profitec 500, but for everyone who just wants coffee, DeLonghi is my recommendation.
@@mdgowmodel?
Popcorn!!! Popcorn!!! I need to relax on the couch with a bowl of popcorn and just soak this all in! I love these in depth comparison/reviews, and how James goes in depth, in ways I never imagined.
I bought a delonghi based on this review and we are very happy with it. Took a bit to dial in some custom settings, but I think that is par for the course. Thank you.
Hello, I'm interested in this machine as well and was wondering if you have had any issues over the time that you have owned it. I am being put off from purchasing it based on some reviews that said that it dies very quickly. Thank you!
This just makes me happy for my Breville Barista Express I got 5 years ago. I control it and adjust based on how stale my coffee has become and steam my own milk, saved $500 and better espresso for my work, which thanks to practice is fairly consistent and quick. I can pamper my loved ones and make them smile with some basic foam art too, which is missing here so it just depends on what you're looking for.
I’m so glad you’re viewing these options too, so awesome to get a huge variations of all machines, great 👍
Now I feel relief about owning a Jura Z10 after this review of automatics Bean To Cup coffee machines by James. I love the convenience of just pressing a button and getting a coffee without all the prep flow. One thing it wasn't mentioned is that with the Jura Z10 you can also do cold brews. I totally agree it does not beat a good grinder and Espresso machine. When I feel the urge for real espresso, I just fire up my E65s GbW grinder and VA EP1 to enjoy the best espresso shop experience.
For the most part, my folks have had De'Longhi machines and for the most part they are very good machines. We had one with the milk attachment that never made scalding milk and eventually died, but it still brewed on.
I've had 3 Juras over the years and a Melitta. The Melitta was great but the home model couldn't keep up with production and eventually quit. The Juras are workhorses for the office and home. They produce great coffee and milk drinks and are easy to use. Worth the extra money.
I own the Delonghi, there is an app with it which allows you to control the water and everything else. Thanks for the review
I own the Melitta Barista TS, and I agree that the buttons are a bit frustrating because (being touch buttons) they do not really give any haptic feedback and they also are a bit unresponsive (sometimes for example it takes a few presses to actually get into the menu). But since you can have several user profiles which save all the settings for each of the drinks for each user, it is not AS bad as it sounds. You can dial in your preferences, and from then on you just press the big "I want this drink" buttons in the top row and do not have to fiddle with the settings anymore. Also, I like that Melitta has an online shop where you can buy all the separate parts of the machine if you ever need a replacement (milk lines, brew group, lids, whatever), so if ever something goes wrong, you do not have to either throw out the whole machine or send it to an expensive "official repair shop".
I'm a Rancilio Silvia guy but I've rarely had time or energy to make lattes with it for a long time. For this reason I bought the Melitta Barista TS a few months back and I love it. Yes, the usability aspect is a bit troublesome but tbh it's not a deal breaker in any way. You get used to the quirks of the machine pretty fast, just like with any machine. The ease of use when compared to a semi-automatic like Silvia is just from another planet. Now I finally have time to get a decent cup of coffee before work. And yes, obviously with a semi-automatic you get to make the exact kind of coffee you need, and you can get your milk scorching hot (which just doesn't happen with this Melitta) but the reality is that I'm now drinking more coffee drinks than ever before and the taste hasn't bothered me even once.
The dual hopper system was one of the main reasons I wanted this Melitta and it works fantastically. I do shift work which means my working hours change weekly from day to night to evening. It's a must to be able to get decaf coffee easily and Melitta most certainly offers that. I'm sure there's still some residue coffee powder left in the grinder from the other hopper but if I really really really need to be sure I don't get any caffeine I just run one decaf espresso shot and throw it away. Yes, it's possible to use ground coffee as well and that works just fine but it's still much easier to use beans. Granted I only ever make milk drinks but I have no problems using beans that have been in the hoppers for a few days. The hopper lid is fairly well insulated which helps to keep the beans fresh enough, at least for me.
I could've gotten a Jura 8 for cheaper than this Melitta and it's very well possible it would've been better in some ways BUT after watching Jura's product videos it became clear that cleaning the milk system would be a hassle compared to Melitta. Apparently you need to use Jura's own detergent daily to clean the milk system whereas with Melitta you only need to run the automatic steam cleaning everytime you use the milk function (which basically means just attaching the milk tube to the metal grill of the machine and pressing a button a few times), and you need to run the more thorough cleaning with detergent weekly.
I also love how the Melitta looks.
My parents bought a DeLonghi Dinamica (the base model, not the Plus) about four years ago. That machine is what got me drinking coffee in the first place, and it's still going strong to this day. While I agree that the milk frothing on it isn't great and I sometimes miss my setup when I go home to visit, it makes nice coffee incredibly quickly and conveniently. We all love it!
Edit: I meant Dinamica, not Dedica
Well this came at a perfect time! I’ve been looking for a machine for months now. The Melitta it is!
James: makes a whole video on what the word 'strong' even means in coffee. Also James: 'coffee not particularly strong".
I purchased a semi automatic coffee machine 8 years ago. I went with the Deloghi magnifica S because it offered me control over the milk side and I figured that that would help me to get the best coffee from a relatively cheap machine. I like it, I get decent coffee
"milk was ... fine. Unspectacular but kind of decent" James provides some of the best and most honest descriptions you'll find.
Thank you James for doing this comparison that included the DeLonghi model that we purchased a few months ago. It was a brand new model that, at the time of purchase, had not been reviewed comparatively like this. Armed with the info I could find and what we were willing to afford, this was the model I chose. I previously had a Breville Bambino and a good grinder, and was thoroughly enjoying my espresso-making journey (learning much from you! 😊), working to perfect my milk foam, etc. The move to a bean to cup machine was fraught but, ultimately, we made the right decision for US. We go to bed looking forward to our morning coffee, and I’ve finally stopped missing the coffee-making morning ballet of grinding, tamping, pulling and frothing. No clean-up is a total bonus! One serious drawback to this machine is the bypass “chute” for a different coffee... You can only put one distinct measure of ground coffee into it for one cup at a time. Annoying. Other than that, I’m very happy with it and am glad that, from your point of view, we didn’t waste our money. Thanks again!
I have a Delonghi Eletta. It has various sizes, strengths, milk, and temperature options. It actually makes pucks, and is shockingly quite great considering it is all automatic.
£1000 plus is too much. What is best price for a reasonable bean to cup machine ? £300 or more ?
I have the same, the setting for cappuccinos is all the way to the right instead of down the middle for adjusting milk foam. I wonder if that would've made a difference in James' assessment of milk quality, or using regular milk.
@@anthony64632 1000 is actually pretty reasonable. For a good espresso machine you need about 300, for a good grinder aprox 400, that makes 700. Add 300 for making it automatic and you have 1000. When I was low on budget and still wanted tasty coffee I used not-so-bad grinder and moccha pot. In my opinon is the best way to make espresso-like drink at low cost.
@@kuba6344, if I had £1000, then I would go for it . But I don't have it. So what the rock bottom proce for a good bean to cup machine. I have had delomgi manual expresso machine worth £200 ,broke down in 2 years.
@@anthony64632 Which gives the Beko bean to cup a good write up. At £250 ..
Beko CEG5301X
Great video as always.
I'd like to see a comparison of lower end bean to cup machines. Delonghi Magnifica, Gaggia Brerra and a Melitta Cafe Solo etc.
Keep up the excellent videos James.
Happy to see Jura comes out on top because that's the one I would recommend to people that want a good bean to cup machine.
James: Reviewing expensive coffee machines that cost £1000+.
Me: Watching James reviewing machines that cost more than my monthly rent while drinking Folgers Classic Roast pre ground coffee, made in a Mr. Coffee drip brewer I got @ Walmart for $20 and drinking from 16oz Dunkin' Donuts mug. And enjoying the video regardless.
This is the way.
James: “It’s monstrous, it’s huge, it’s two and a half thousand pounds!”
Me: “It doesn’t look like it weighs that much 🤔” ……”oh!” 😄
I love my gaggia accademia. It's nice to wake up in the morning, press 1 button and the drink is made. And the ability to froth your own milk (which I'm learning) was the selling point for me. It's a great machine!
He didn’t mention the flow control. Is this a feature you use, and how important is it to its performance or capabilities?
We have a Jura E8 and love it. I maintain it and it works well. If I wasn't married, I would have a manual setup but I work from home and can't leave my desk to make my wife a flat white every time she wants one and she's unwilling to learn how to do it manually. I'm thankful for the super auto.
I actually own the Melitta for about 2yrs now and just saw this video.
As a "user", yes the buttons as you said are miserable
I mainly use the machine via the Bluetooth App, which is really good and user-friendly
Considering the price point i really like it, as a "daily driver" for when I'm too lazy for making coffee by myself.
Thanks for doing these reviews, it's been something I've thought about getting once I get my kitchen done. The only review I except is a James Hoffman review ☺️ I don't except any others!
I have the Delonghi Magnifica xs, it has been a pretty solid machine. (IMO) I've owned it for about 5 years and it has been working great.
I'm not an espresso expert by any means but I do have a machine at home. Recently they put a jura in our workplace and I was really surprised by the quality. Not that it's fantastic but I never imagined coffee coming from these "Kaffeevollautomat"s, as they are called in German, would be drinkable. Good to see you that you found it decent in comparison to others as well.
Awesome review! It's great to hear that some of the coffee machines deliver great results. It's a shame that some of the models are not yet available in some Asian countries , but hopefully, they will become available soon. 🤞
The miele cm6350 is a very good machine and much smaller, and by the looks of it, pulls a better shot than the massive Miele.
@Lily Princess worth it
Can’t speak for their coffee machines (and I wouldn’t buy a bean2cup machine) but their kitchen appliances are built like tanks and, in my experience, significantly outlast their cheaper equivalents making them far better value in the long term. Yes, I am a Miele snob 😂
I also can't speak for their coffee machines, but their vacuum cleaners are superb (and more reasonably priced than all their other product ranges). After years of Dysons I'm very glad I switched.
Love my Melitta connect. Been a couple of years since owning it now and it’s not let me down yet. As someone else has mentioned, the app is actually really good. Though I use my automated settings for daily espresso and the app for milk drinks on the weekend. I paid ~£800 so they must have gone up in price.
I was thinking about buying a machine of this type, been waiting for this video! 🤩
I had a Jura Z5 for years and was able to get excellent milk foam by playing with the mixing valve WHILE it was steaming. I poured my first latte art with that machine.
"Weird coffee people, like me." Hearing this made my day.
As the owner of a Miele vacuum, “auditory assault” is the absolute nicest way to describe their products.
i have a washing machine and its quiet as a cat...
My Miele vacuum is the quietest vacuum I've ever owned. It's not quiet by any means, but it is far quieter than the previous vacuums.
@@BitmapFrogs is it one of the ones with a cast iron bottom?
Vacuums are loud. Miele vacuums are about as loud as you'd expect for the amount of suction you get.
@@TheLevanin Vacuums are loud because they're designed to be loud. They're designed to be loud because that's what we expect. There are some vacuums out there that make practically no sound at all and they're not very popular.
Thank you for doing this. I was really hoping for it.
James, your videos are fenomenal. I'm laughing on my own while learning about coffee.🤣😂🤣
That was so helpful..
I miss going for a coffee.
I have had almost 7 years years stuck in bed after I became wheelchair dependent and need a wheelchair accessible house that accepts pets.
I use to be a nurse so can I can no longer work so purchasing machine is a really considered purchase I will need to save up a good while for but would be lovely to have in bedroom and get a good coffee and make coffee for those few friends who have stuck by me over the years... It is true when ill long term you find out who true friends are.
I have looked out a money box and will start saving for a decent coffee hit. TQ for comparison
Just dropping in a recommendation for Jura ENA 8 which I recently bought and I'm in love with.
I have a Sprada Futura that I bought new in 2004. I recently had it serviced for the first time since new. It needed a refurbished brewing unit, a new grinder and draining valve after 10412 cups of coffee. Very happy with the quality coffee it produces.
Excellent review. All of your reviews are excellent.
I have the Gaggia Accademia and also struggled quite a bit to get it dialled in. But overall I think it's a good machine, and I think the addition of a manual steam wand/hot water dispenser is a plus point over some of the others that didn't really get a mention.
New one that came out at the end of 2022 or the older one? I just got the new one and I have to say I am pleasantly surprised. Though it is a bit expensive. Took very little work to get a decent espresso, although I feel there is room for improvement in my settings.
After running a few cycles with the 2022 Accademia I am also surprised how easy it was to get a good tasting drink out of it… I really think the coffee plus or whatever it’s called system (runs two grind cycles) helps a lot with getting out an espresso that really does have the strength / texture of a real espresso. Can’t really ask for much more given the convenience of it. Also I’m just using the beans the machine came with, haven’t even tried anything fresh yet so excited to give that a go
thank you for answering questions I never knew to ask
I now have something to aspire to. The De'Longhi Dinamica Plus is now officially on my wish list.
Got myself a Jura S8 for those moments when I want a fast espresso or coffee with a push of a button. The best super automatic machine of all I used. I had a Delonghi, Melita, Philips, Saeco. None comes close to Jura. 😊
The price difference is of course also massive, so no wonder the experience matches that
I used a comparable Jura at my previous office place. The milk system was kinda nice cause the milk pack could just stay in a little fridge and the process of refilling was simple for everyone to do
I sell many Juras in my shop in it is interesting that many customers hate the click in milk carafe that so many machines use.
Did you get an opportunity to fiddle with the dose/strength/temp settings and compare it against semi-autos?
We have a Jura machine at work (a few of them) and a comment about the milk container. I believe it’s separate because it is also a fridge. It keeps the milk cold and has it’s own power supply and fan. So it’s more than just a container and probably why they don’t include it. My personal opinion is that they should just include it and bump the cost of the unit as a whole.
Its true that Jura has the Cooling Units for milk. in 0.6L and 1L sizes. but they also have a small glass alternative that you can put in the fridge, for like 1 or 2 servings. would be nice if that was included with a machine this price without upping the price. since the glass once aren't to expensive. I work in a shop where we sell Jura, and we often include one of these milk containers as a free gift on a purchase.
I really appreciated your testing of these machines! Well done! We ended up purchasing the Dinamica Plus (we own two), and so far (~400 drinks between them), they’ve done what we’ve asked of them. I really like the ability to experiment through the app on my iPad when it comes to making different drinks. In addition, once we find a drink we really like, the app makes setting the drink up on the second machine a breeze. I can see us eventually moving on to more of a manual process…but for now, we are enjoying the convenience.
I'd like to see you do more of an "office-oriented" review. I think that's a significant draw for the bean-to-cup use case.
Wow, this DeLonghi coffee machine costs around 540 GBP in Poland (converted to British pounds). A really great machine for the money, I personally own a slightly lower model and am very happy with it.
In general we have quite good prices for machines in Poland. To a degree where (although now with possible export fees may not be so clear-cut) buying one in PL and sending to UK might still end up cheaper than buying in the UK.
Thanks for the video James! I have the Melitta, it's great to hear your recommendations on dosing, grind, temperature, etc. On the user interface - 1. It has an app to help set up and save drinks, which is very easy to use - 2. You only have to set up a drink once, next time you can just press a button - 3. It has user profiles that are simple to select, in case your setup isn't the same as someone else. Hope that helps!
We have also the Melitta as new family automated Barista member. Coming from capsules it was a big step forward and we are very happy.
Target was to have two hoppers, because my wife tended to have a smoother coffee, me some stronger notes. In the meantime we use the same coffee from one hopper, daughter some other from the 2nd. We are so pleased with the quality of the brew, the taste of the (speciality) coffee, as well the recipes for the milk drinks. Maybe also to mention, that this machine uses the right (Italian) order of milk vs. coffee (Cappuccino Coffee first, caffè latte milk first). Also the milk system cleaning is a much cleaner process, then the competitors shown, which may push the foam out of the Glass with the shot of steam after the process. The Melitta drains the hot cleaning water into the drain pan. overall we wouldn’t change the machine anymore. I became a real coffee junkie with this.
Great review from James as always.
Would have loved to see the Gaggia Cadorna Prestige tested in this line up.
A Gaggia machine and Adjustments: name a more iconic duo.
I have the Melitta that you reviewed here. Agreed on the button responsiveness, it's bad. The app makes life a lot easier but the key thing is that once you set it up, the personalisation options mean that I walk up, select me and the drink I've already programmed. For my partner, I select a different user and that drink. It means that you actually hardly ever use the buttons. As a result, button responsiveness is never an issue.
I can confirm that. I use saved coffee setups and never the sliders or +- buttons. With the app it's easy to program.
I can also confirm this - straightforward machine with enough configuration to make a good coffee, and easy to clean with reasonably priced occasional maintenance' bits such as seals. Having had a number of different machines over the years I am rather fond of this unassuming small footprint machine that does the job and isn't 'needy'.
Another outstanding video from James. I bought the Delonghi DP after spending hours reviewing Breville, Gaggia, Saeco, Miele, Phillips, Jura. I reviewed maintenance, taste, # of recipes and ability to create custom recipes with milk based drinks. I did not buy based on foaming milk substitute. James really should have said that most, if not all, bean to cup auto foamers will struggle w/ milk substitutes. However, a couple of highly respected sites like ECS Coffee, Seattle Coffee Gear, Whole Latte Love, have positively commented Delonghi's ability to foam and work with alternative creamers.
I've personally tried almond, almond coconut, soy, oat and there's NO SUB for 1/2 & 1/2, Whole or Heavy cream Cow's milk. Sure those alternatives have some calorie savings, but in no way, do they offer taste that's within 80% of Cow's milk creamer. The aftertaste and blah, meh cream texture just doesn't cut it. So if he tried Cow's milk cream w/ the Delonghi he would have gotten microfoam, and various heights of cream, which their LatteCrema system offers that others don't.
Lastly, I did buy it because of Brad Pitt's commercial!!! How could you not want to buy it after watching Perfetto from Brad? LOL.
Hello, thanks for this comment. I'm actually very interested in this machine and I was wondering how long you've had it now and if you've had any issues. I've been put off from buying it due to reviews saying that it breaks very quickly. Thank you in advance for any help you can give me!
Thank you for sharing the pricing at the beginning of this video. I'll see myself out before I waste anyone's time.
Damn I been looking for these for a minute thank you
With the Gaggia you’re supposed to turn the milk thing immediately back towards the handle position and the steam is supposed to go to the handle towards the drip tray
James is a simple man. He can make a video with two simple ingredients.
✅Beans
✅Patreon
Firstly, I love your videos and have been watching them for some time now, even if they are not relevant to the coffee I make and the tools I use.
Secondly, I was in the market for a new machine a few months ago and was looking at a semi-auto Breville machine. The missus convinced me to look at the Jura Z10 as there happened to be an in store demo while we were there. After much consideration and research, which included this video, we purchased the Z10. Luckily for me there was a deal at the time where I saved AUD$1,800 by getting the retailer to price match, and I have to say I have never looked back! It is a huge step up from the very old Baby Gaggia I was previously using.
I never thought I would get an automatic machine, yet here I am. The additional milk canister/fridge was a good buy also as it is now all basically self-contained. I love that I can program my own coffee and make it how I like it with a simple push of a button, or tap on the screen in this case. Makes those 3:00am coffees much simpler to make.
Also, the cold brew function is a cool thing to have and I find it works pretty well.
My parents have a jura and swap milk types, keeping both in the fridge which works very well for them. Theyve had the same machine for a decade at least and its still going strong.
I really like my DeLonghi Magnifica - it's an older style machine that is as bare-bones as it gets by todays standards. No display, no menus, just a few LEDs and buttons, two dials to set the amount of water and the aroma setting (grind time). It self-calibrates puck size and grind time and gets surprisingly consistent if you don't vary the grinder setting or type of beans too much. Most DeLongthis re-use parts from previous generations, so it's a continuing evolution, often just the same machine in a new case with a fancy menu screen added.