I’ve done that a few times in the past, but subscribers account for such a small percentage of views these days that it would just confuse all the newcomers lol.
@@MattMaranMotoring Yooooo Matt. I agree with the comment. Times have changed. I don't think confusing newcomers is something you should think about honestly. I think you should use the WRX name when you do Subaru videos.
been in both this and the 25 GR corolla. The GR blows this shit out of the water im not gonna lie. Both in power and how it handles. The WRX weighs over 200lbs heavier and you FEEL that.
@@steve8803 I know, I was joking. At this point an STi wouldn’t really make sense. If it came back in today’s market it’d be $55k and severely underpowered compared to the competition. A few people would buy them for the badge prestige but it would not be successful.
@@steve8803 I respect that, but I disagree. Subaru has changed a lot over the years. The performance stays the same but the prices are climbing rapidly. Add the limited slip diffs, the transmission, “engine tuning”, suspension upgrades, and current day Subaru would charge $5k-$8k above the TS. There’s no way in hell Subaru would simply do a transmission swap and charge the same or less than the TS, not the Subaru of today.
this! I like the WRX for what it is, but the WRX owner friends I have only brag about how much HP their new FA24 engine makes. But some of us car about handling and that open front diff and open rear diff with brakepad torque vectoring straight from the Forester SUV. We need a good handling STI that always came standard with front limited-slip diff, center DCCD diff, rear limited-slip diff.
I traded my 22 WRX Premium in on my GR Corolla Circuit. The GRC is superior in every way except back seat space and the WRX is also cheaper to add hp. At the cost of the tS it's a no brainer to go with any other competitor.
That back seat space must be really tight. I was looking at GRC as well but it only has 30” of rear leg room. My 06 STi has 33” and it is tight already for my two kids. Although I like GRC I wont be able to get it because of that.. #dadlife
@@taelee347 You should go find one at a dealership and see what you think. Mine fit just fine in the back seat, but have been out of car seats for years. Most kid hauling duties go to our other cars though.
Shoutout to the Elantra N. I came out of a Golf R and have enjoyed the N so very much. It feels German and my 2024 manual is one of the best gearboxes I've rowed. Absolute dagger-like front end. Total hoot to drive.
I haven't driven EN manual yet, but I'd say I think it may feel close to my 2020 kia forte gt manual. I test drove the current miata. I like the clutch feel, clutch biting point and shift feel better in kia forte gt than the Miata. People shouldn't complaint about hyundai/kia's manual. I am sure there are better ones out there, but hyundai/kia's manual transmissions are not that bad.
Just test drove a 23' in ceramic white with the 8 speed DCT. I never thought another vehicle would dethrone the likes of an RX-7 or Miata for budget performance fun but.. The Elantra N is the new king. It is so good for the money and surprisingly the rear seats actually have leg room for taller people.
How is the WRX a letdown? The tS, maybe for the price. But the WRX is a solid sports sedan. Have you driven one? And Matt’s assessment of the tS is fair enough, but he was also over-critical of the WRX as a car - overly-critical and almost angry, not typical for Matt Marran.
@@tomrakusan1179 I mean my comment was in regards to the tS more so than WRX as a whole, but given the fact that its clear you watched the video from your reply, Im confused by your question. Why is the WRX a letdown? Matt explains for 30 min in this video why.. After tax, title etc youre paying FIFTY THOUSAND dollars for a car thats just "fine". Cheap outdated interior, uncomfortable seats, harsh ride, inexcusably laggy infotainment, no heated wheel, no wireless charging, zero upgrade on performance, a lackluster 6k redline and on and on.. Again, its not an awful car but when you ask nearly $50k it better bring something to the table that isn't offered by ALL its competitors at a lower or equal price. Its outdated, overpriced, under powered and under equipped in top trims. Simple as that.
@@daltonnko9901 I'd like it if youtube car reviewers introduced themselves as the guy who knows everything and complains about anything. It'd be more realistic (this is universal on youtube).
$47K USD for WRX with Brembos and suspension... no thanks. And for those who say STI back in 2004 inflation adjusted would now cost 50K+...yes but back then STI was very competitive performance-wise, so the price was justified.
Another thing people forget is that most people had more DISPOSABLE income in 2004 than today. Basic housing, food, medical didn't eat up nearly as much of the budget. I was able to buy a brand-new Acura RSX S Type back in 2003. But today, even though I earn a lot more on paper, I can't really afford a brand-new S Type today.
@@norwegianblue2017 RSX S to Integra Type S doesn't seem like a fair comparison though. The ITS is a CTR with extra luxury on top. Maybe 2003 Civic SI to 2025 Civic SI would be a fairer comparison. Given how many $50-70k SUVs and pickup trucks now litter the roads, driveways, and big-box store parking lots now, it sure seems like people have more disposable income to drop on "family vehicles" far bigger and costlier than necessary.
@@thatoneotherotherguy Maybe not a fair comparison. But all I know is that at least I was able to afford a Type S on a regular young person's income. That's who these cars should be aimed at.
@@thatoneotherotherguy I wouldn't say they have more disposable income. Most are happy to take out long loans (84+ months) on those vehicles to keep the payments low. Sadly too people seem okay to have car payment over 600 dollars and make their car payments sometimes as much as their mortgage. Its crazy, but people are living in debt and credit now a days. If something really goes wrong they might have zero saving to pay for something. Thats why some car channels you see dealers or mechanics saying people have 2 choices now when it comes to cars. They either have the money to fix what they have or make a car payment. Not both.
@@peteraugustinos9226 so you're saying people don't have more disposable income, they're just being really irresponsible choosing to buy really expensive discretionary vehicles they can't afford on very long loans? I do agree that loans over 60 months are incredibly stupid, but I also don't see repossessions happened left and right on this new normalized oddity of a "$60k family pickup truck"
Review: All the reasons not to buy a 2025 Subaru WRX tS 😂 I own a 2022 WRX Limited (which at the time had an MSRP of $35,995 and only $995 for destination and delivery) and I totally agree on how I’d also pick any of the competitors at this price for a tS. Currently daydreaming of owning a Type R or Golf R
@@taelee347 yeah at those prices, a WRX was a no-brainer. The Limited were nice vs the competitors. Not the fastest or fanciest, but they had “enough” of everything. At more than $45k for a tS they better be at AT LEAST 320hp and more bells and whistles! Insane
Needed to see this review! Here I am with a paid off 21 base VA with 36k miles thinking I would love the new TS… every other review I see on UA-cam raves about this car, but Matt has always been an honest automotive channel! Appreciate you, brother! I’m going to pass on this TS and hang on to my VA.
it’s subjective bro. I have 22 Limited paid 40k with taxes and fees. I would have loved to have waited and gotten the TS. The Brembos, Recaros and drive modes are worth it for me.
While the FA24 certainly has very high tuning potential.. I am not sure I would trade VA STi given at high power levels you will need that TY85 STI 6 speed. If you are going to leave it stock then its moot. Other than the engine everything else is on par (Brakes) or a downgrade hardware wise (trans, actual front and rear diffs, and hydraulic steering feel although this one is subjective) and you would most likely pay more on top of trading your car in considering this costs 47K.. I am not sure if you can get 40K for your 2021 but you will still be in debt.
Happy to help! And yeah with interest rates still not being the best for car loans, I’d hang onto a paid off car and invest the spare cash if you have it.
@@cptnbananas88 Likewise here. 2021 Base WRX with 26k miles purchased 9/21, one of the last VA's, for $28.5k. Nothing I see here is worth trading it in for, especially as I keep my WRX's stock.
Part of the challenge of the WRX is it's getting quite expensive. A base model is $36k, and this is $10k over that. $10k might be cool...if it was a full on STI with the full drivetrain. That used to be an $8k adder over a standard WRX. They're asking more than that for a standard WRX with a few upgrades. If this was a $3k to $4k adder, yeah, makes sense. $10k? How is that justified? Worse, a standard Impreza, is a $25k car. So just going to the WRX at all is already an $11k bump up. So you're up $21k from an Impreza to this, nearly double the price of nearly the whole car you're already getting, just for an engine change, suspension, brakes, and seats. Is the manual even different between the cars? (maybe, haven't checked). Now premium cars at premium prices is not uncommon. You can buy a Wrangler Rubicon for astronomical pricing, and on a relative scale, you kind of have to determine if the price is wild. The problem with Subaru is they've never been a premium brand. They've always played in the budget realm. It doesn't help you can buy a low mile, nearly new STI for $35k to $40k today. It's not competing with just other new cars. It's still competing with used ones, used WRXs, and even used STIs.
Sad to see what Subaru keeps doing with the WRX line. No STi, excessively priced for what you get, lacking in options, etc. For a long time was my favorite car and still love the bugeye I have. But doesn't seem like a great option for new anymore.
Glad you addressed the cold start drone. I sold my 2022 because it was so annoying. Screamingly loud, and then when it’s warmed up you can’t even hear it when you drive. Also the infotainment really is THAT bad vs any other new car in its price range. Aside from those two things it is a pretty great car
Great review. Subaru is crazy asking this price for so little. I own a 2015 WRX and was looking to upgrade. Looks like I won't be getting another Subaru. I also think the black exterior cladding makes the latest gen car's basically look cheap, terrible design choice.
Oooof, Matt. You were done with this review barely 20 secs in. It's hard to watch an icon fall so far and soooo hard, ain't it? As a seven-time Subaru owner, I continue to watch the VB out of nothing more than morbid curiosity. Subaru is the little kid that doesn't want to go to the barber, cuts his own bangs, ruins his hair, and proudly exclaims, "See, mommy! I did it myself!" Subaru Corp and SOA, you suck. Your CVTs are garbage, your U.S. dealerships are full of clowns, and you've massacred a once great champion of automotive enthusiasm. You're Mitsu 2.0, only taking 15 years longer to get there.
Always enjoy your reviews. I remember when your channel was named Subaru WRX fan. As someone who supports their products, maybe Subaru should listen too to you. There are some great elements to this vehicle, but the negatives really hold it back. With some tweaks, the wrx could be a special vehicle.
@MattMaranMotoring I have a 22 wrx on e85 with an intake and it makes around 370whp. That is way more worth the money than this since it only requires the intake and e tune
I got the premium last year for 35K otd with the HK speakers and moonroof. For that price it was a good value proposition. I needed AWD as i live in the Midwest. I needed space as I have 2 kids. The car has its flaws but at 35K i wouldn't be complaining, knowing that with 3K I could get it to 350whp reliably compared to a GRC which is an already stressed 3 cylinder engine.
Thanks for the honest review. I was considering this with the type R and the Type S. I knew it was going to be a stretch with this car but your video confirmed my concerns. Greatly appreciate the insight!!
So, basically the complaint is about price. The drone on start up and how much fuss you made about it is silly. The STIs etc were just as bad. It settles down quickly. Everything else is fine. I still don't think it needed eyesight, but I will take the adaptive cruise control for sure. Priced at 42, it would be a good option. 46 is wild.
Price is everything in a competitive market. Imagine this car cost half as much; it would be an amazing car at $23K such that no competitor even merits consideration. Imagine this car cost twice as much; it would be utter crap at $92K unworthy of even reviewing, much less buying.
These cars are still selling. Everyone is critical of the unpainted fenders, overpricing, no STI etc. but … in the end this generation of WRX is selling more then ever before Facts 💯💯💯
~48k with price, taxes and fees... think about that for a sec. It's not an STI, it has horrible equipment, no power bump, and subaru basically expects you to mod it yourself with aftermarket parts or their in-store cosmetics. I was so ready to buy a 2025 because I enjoyed driving the 2024 but wanted to see what the next model had to offer but honestly this is just too much for a "tuned by sti" top trim.
I would get a pre eyesight WRX if I were to buy one of this generation. One thing I do like about the 2025 is that purple color. Devils Advocate: They don't worry about the exhaust because they know most people will put an aftermarket one anyway.
It is amazing my back in 2006 when I bought my new 2006 Subaru Legacy special edition, I got as a option the center armrest pop up extender to make it higher and still in 2025 they are using it. Amazing. LOL I will say it does work well just funny after all these years. Also, Subaru did do a software update for the touchscreen to help it, but clearly in your tester it was slow. I will say back in April I tested a WRX at the dealership and the screen did not lag like that, and it was about 38 degrees outside when I tested it. I don't think you can say every Subaru screen lags as bad as this one did, but they have had issues with them.
The screen does work better when warmed up, so if it wasn’t immediately being used after a cold start it might have been better. But my experience here is pretty consistent with every other Subaru I’ve used in the past 4 years with this system sadly. Maybe I’m just unlucky lol.
I'm glad I bought my 2022 Limited new in 2023 for 3K under MSRP. Don't need Brembo's, i do wish it had an STI trans. It's super easy to add power to the FA24. It's been a great daily for me for 2 years and plan to keep it for many years. It's certainly not worth close to 47K which you'd probably get it for around 44K. Still not worth that much over a Limited. I love analog gauges and my moonroof.
You're spot on, all points.. I've always been a huge Subaru WRX / STI fan, since I was young and always wanted to own one but never did because, well life.. I'm now at the stage where I can buy one, but I'm not.. Probably going to pick up the Golf R instead.
@MattMaranMotoring Very very bad. The WRX tS is set to be an intentional disaster to avoid bringing back the STI. Let's be real here. We all know the tS really isn't/wasn't "tuned by STI." SOJ (Subaru of Japan) and SOA (Subaru of America) disbanded the entire STI Division team when they told the entire world back in 2022 that the STI for the VB gen platform was cancelled and wasn't happening. Yet, Subaru has the car. They may not have the engine since they retired the EJ20 in Japan and EJ25 in North America. If Subaru was concerned about not having an engine for a VB WRX STI, they should've pulled a move like Toyota did with BMW. Subaru should've gone (and still should go) to Porsche and get their 2.5T Flat Four Boxer engine that makes 350hp and 309lb-ft. Granted the fuel economy would either be the same as the standard WRX or better than the WRX with 20 MPG City, 25 MPG Highway, and 21+ Combined (20/25/21+) as in 1 MPG better in each EPA metric, the fact that Porsche's 2.5T is far more potent in its performance would give the engine an advantage to be the car that the enthusiasts are asking and desperately pleading for.
The Premium trim is the one to get on pretty much any Subaru that offers it, including this WRX. You really don't need extras on top of it. And in the WRX's case, most trims have been selling $3k below MSRP for years. A 2025 Premium for $3k off is not a bad deal for how much all-weather family performance car you get. And if I recall correctly, you get pretty strong resale value. But yes, steer clear of this tS trim.
@@MattMaranMotoring I mean it got, what, a 4% price increase from last year for the same trim? Not awesome considering virtually no new standard equipment on Premium, but could be worse, I guess. They're moving 20k units a year here, so I guess they feel ok with that many at these prices. Would be nice if they'd put a manual in the 2.5rs Impreza, but Subaru's sales don't seem able to support a third manual at this point.
I just bought an RS 2 weeks ago. Even that was stretching value. This Ts is pointless. I have no idea where it fits in. They need three models, Base, Sport, STI. Then there's no confusion. I think they are just trying to get rid of excess parts at this point and re-spinning it as a new model when everything is the same, excluding the digital cluster, which makes me believe that the new cluster will fit in the previous 22-24 models without problems. It's likely plug and play so they didn't have to redesign the wiring harness.
I bought the TR (at a discount) because I did not want that digital dash in the TS. I love the car and is so underrated. I'm glad it's hated on, so I can get a discount. But in all seriousness, test drive WRX and yall will change your mind. I could give a crap about the center screen...i just turn it off and enjoy the drive...6 speed, made in Japan, awd...
Back when Subaru offered the WRX and STI, the STI stood out as a significant upgrade, justifying the price increase. The tS, however, doesn't offer enough hardware or experience to warrant the extra cost.
The only positive thing I heard him say were short gearing in the transmission, no auto rev matching junk, and no moon roof. Too many other complaints about the car to make me interested. I bought my STI because of him, at least partly.
I agree with this review. It makes sense. However I still think the VB is better than past generations specially if you get it for the right price. I got a 2022 limited for under 30k with under 20k miles. Put about $1k in mods and it’s looking amazing. Better engine and platform just don’t spend too much on it
That slow infotainment system is maddening to me. The styling has grown on me somewhat but watching this video I see how bland the nose is. The blue interior is too much and not a fan of the giant portrait screen. Pricing is ridiculous. Thanks Matt for the helping me cross this off my list.
I just put $500 deposit on a new 2024 wrx base. Getting a pretty solid deal on it about 30,500 before taxes title fees. Definitely a great deal. Although the other trims including TS are not worth it imo.
I wonder if they have improved lane keep assist since 2020? The version on my Outback is TERRIBLE. They should call it "white line pogo assist" for how much it swings you back and forth. Every Hyundai/Kia rental I've ever driven has been A LOT better. Also speaking of 45 grand? I'm pretty sure you can get a top of the line Touring XT Outback that has a nice leather interior for that kind of money. They are pretty nice inside and has the 260 hp engine. I get 29-32 mpg on the highway. Finally, I should say that the one thing I think Subaru does better safety feature wise is the size and placement of the blind spot warning lights. Nice big amber lights on the inside of the mirror unit are very easy to see and they light up when you still have time to make a better decision. Unlike others that give you a little triangle of light when it's too late.
With destination it’s 47k. If it was 40-42k I think it would be solid buy. Like you said it’s asking the same for 300 plus hp cars like the golf R n Type R. If this costs 47k what would an STI version cost? 55k??
Love the honesty from Matt good deal at less than $35k then another that that too many options. It’s almost like some manufacturers are tying to kill off their sport cars and only make basic transportation.
Give us a base, virgin edition with build capability based on solid internal components and let the buyer play with the peripherals. You gave us brakes 3/2 pucks, tech and comfort. Be thin seat factor, be cool and nibble add tune to your identities and live FREE. You got brakes.
I can see your frustration with Subaru when it comes to the TS model. Subaru did all the hard work of bigger performance brakes, chassis tuning etc but forgot to turn up the wick to give this thing more boost. 12 psi is not exactly stressing out the engine. If it had 300+ horsepower then it would make sense, but if I was upgrading my 22 Premium, I would be looking at a Type R over the TS.
I have a feeling...maybe false hope...that they are saving the sti version for a midcycle refresh in a year or 2 that will have big changes like ditching a lot of the unpainted plastic.
The WRX and STi were fast (quick) for the 2002-2008 span but cars have evolved and left Subaru behind. My 2017 STi is a fun car but a lot of vehicles now can keep up with it with ease or beat it stoplight to stoplight and that is a metric for a Daily driver to be held to.
The thumbnail says "too expensive" but a quick search puts the 2024 WRX Premium at 35000 with no other options. Brembo 6 piston front/2 Pistion rear are $4-6000 (without install.) And you get recaro seats plus a few suspension options which according to other reviewers are an awesome upgrade. Id say $45700 (not $47000) price tag is pretty decent all things considered. Do we expect them to lose money on a car?
Been saying this for about the last 10 years. After the generation of WRX that ended in 2014, Subaru started their journey of completely abandoning their fan base and staying way behind the development curve.
Sad to see prices gone up. I bought a 23 WRX because of the price, and it has a little bit of everything between GRCorolla and Civic Type R. Now price is as high as the other competitors 😢
One thing to note, GR Corolla would not make a good daily or family car, while WRX is a perfect in that sense that is still fun to drive with AWD and close to 300 hp. Rear seats room in Corolla is very bad, while you can put 2 car seats in the back of WRX. Corolla also wants to be trashed to be fun, but WRX has good low end torque which comes handy in daily driving, which is 99% of the driving. With simple bolt ons and a tune you easily squeeze 50+ HP from fa24
I love my 22 base wrx but because it was only 30k and i can add my performance stuff. We honestly dont need the dampers because we will eventually put coilovers on them. 47k is crazy because a type r or corolla at that price point will obviously be the better car to spend all that money. If that was all subaru was offering i would definitely choose a corolla or type r over that 47k wrx with a weak transmission and power
Nearly 47 grand for that is nuts. The Outback and WRX days of glory are over. I loved the Crocodile Dundee campaign but that was 30 years ago...cmon Subaru
Matt Overall right review of the benefits v. Cost of the tS. Overall, agree. I sensed that your displeasure of the tS extrapolated onto aspect of the WRX which are common to all the trims. The screen is not as bad as you stated, etc. it is a great car as you assessed two years ago, while the tS is just overpriced and only good for track use. Let us not the tS piece cloud our judgement of the overall excellent WRX package Thank you
my 86s infotainment screen isnt as bad but it still is laggy, occasional infotainment software updates come out so I hope they are able to make it smoother through this
It feels like you really wanted to like this car - and maybe you do - but I appreciate your objectivity. This car is too expensive for what you’re getting. It’s like Subaru is telling potential buyers, “Take it or leave it, we don’t care.” There are folks who will buy this because it’s the best performing new WRX you can get, and it’s as close to an STI as we’re likely get anytime soon. And I think Subaru is counting on those folks to just buy the car and not question the company like you are. Personally, I’m still baffled by Subaru’s absolute refusal to make a WRX hatchback again. They would sell much better than the sedan versions have the last several years.
Would love to get a GR but that back room is so tiny, i can't do it. Thinking on this but once you mentioned the other ones its tough competiton. I would rather get a golf R for about the same price. Type R idk if I would like a fwd car again, but it is a beast of a car.
You should introduce yourself as Subaruwrxfan in your WRX reviews as a little easter egg
I’ve done that a few times in the past, but subscribers account for such a small percentage of views these days that it would just confuse all the newcomers lol.
Subaruwrxnottafan
This car doesn’t deserve a subaruwrxfan intro
@@MattMaranMotoring Yooooo Matt. I agree with the comment. Times have changed. I don't think confusing newcomers is something you should think about honestly. I think you should use the WRX name when you do Subaru videos.
@@MattMaranMotoringwe are the few the proud 😅
Thank you for being so honest and telling us straight up that this trim is just not punching as hard as it should for the price
been in both this and the 25 GR corolla. The GR blows this shit out of the water im not gonna lie. Both in power and how it handles. The WRX weighs over 200lbs heavier and you FEEL that.
We want the STi back!
Subaru: Best we can do is give you a red WRX badge.
I have that red front badge on my 2019. They copied me.
@@steve8803 I know, I was joking. At this point an STi wouldn’t really make sense. If it came back in today’s market it’d be $55k and severely underpowered compared to the competition. A few people would buy them for the badge prestige but it would not be successful.
@@steve8803 The new WRX TS MSRPs a hair under $47k. There’s no way you believe Subaru would price a new STi the same.
@@steve8803 I respect that, but I disagree. Subaru has changed a lot over the years. The performance stays the same but the prices are climbing rapidly.
Add the limited slip diffs, the transmission, “engine tuning”, suspension upgrades, and current day Subaru would charge $5k-$8k above the TS.
There’s no way in hell Subaru would simply do a transmission swap and charge the same or less than the TS, not the Subaru of today.
this! I like the WRX for what it is, but the WRX owner friends I have only brag about how much HP their new FA24 engine makes. But some of us car about handling and that open front diff and open rear diff with brakepad torque vectoring straight from the Forester SUV. We need a good handling STI that always came standard with front limited-slip diff, center DCCD diff, rear limited-slip diff.
Matt is always the most honest and precise when providing his critiques. Really refreshing vs others that seem more like adverts than reviews
That center console reminds me of a android phone from 2011
I've never seen Matt this angry before lmaooo. But it's completely justified, especially given his former UA-cam channel name 😂
That infotainment lag is brutal
I paid $33k for my 2024 Premium a few months ago. Glad I didn't wait for the 2025s now
I traded my 22 WRX Premium in on my GR Corolla Circuit. The GRC is superior in every way except back seat space and the WRX is also cheaper to add hp. At the cost of the tS it's a no brainer to go with any other competitor.
Just make sure you don't go over 70 mph. Toyota will deny your claim if your car goes up in flames
@EvolutionIX219 I think you mean 85, lol. And it's too late for that.
@@EvolutionIX219better yet, get the previous gen WRX because this one is fucking ugly
That back seat space must be really tight. I was looking at GRC as well but it only has 30” of rear leg room. My 06 STi has 33” and it is tight already for my two kids.
Although I like GRC I wont be able to get it because of that.. #dadlife
@@taelee347 You should go find one at a dealership and see what you think. Mine fit just fine in the back seat, but have been out of car seats for years. Most kid hauling duties go to our other cars though.
Shoutout to the Elantra N. I came out of a Golf R and have enjoyed the N so very much. It feels German and my 2024 manual is one of the best gearboxes I've rowed. Absolute dagger-like front end. Total hoot to drive.
Thanks for sharing your ownership experience!
I haven't driven EN manual yet, but I'd say I think it may feel close to my 2020 kia forte gt manual. I test drove the current miata. I like the clutch feel, clutch biting point and shift feel better in kia forte gt than the Miata. People shouldn't complaint about hyundai/kia's manual. I am sure there are better ones out there, but hyundai/kia's manual transmissions are not that bad.
Just test drove a 23' in ceramic white with the 8 speed DCT.
I never thought another vehicle would dethrone the likes of an RX-7 or Miata for budget performance fun but..
The Elantra N is the new king.
It is so good for the money and surprisingly the rear seats actually have leg room for taller people.
What a letdown.. I wouldn't even pay 30k for this. Solid and honest review as always though!
Thanks!
How is the WRX a letdown? The tS, maybe for the price. But the WRX is a solid sports sedan. Have you driven one? And Matt’s assessment of the tS is fair enough, but he was also over-critical of the WRX as a car - overly-critical and almost angry, not typical for Matt Marran.
@@tomrakusan1179 I mean my comment was in regards to the tS more so than WRX as a whole, but given the fact that its clear you watched the video from your reply, Im confused by your question. Why is the WRX a letdown? Matt explains for 30 min in this video why.. After tax, title etc youre paying FIFTY THOUSAND dollars for a car thats just "fine". Cheap outdated interior, uncomfortable seats, harsh ride, inexcusably laggy infotainment, no heated wheel, no wireless charging, zero upgrade on performance, a lackluster 6k redline and on and on..
Again, its not an awful car but when you ask nearly $50k it better bring something to the table that isn't offered by ALL its competitors at a lower or equal price. Its outdated, overpriced, under powered and under equipped in top trims. Simple as that.
I trust subaruwrxfan's op on subarus
@@daltonnko9901 I'd like it if youtube car reviewers introduced themselves as the guy who knows everything and complains about anything. It'd be more realistic (this is universal on youtube).
Appreciate your clear and detailed honesty in this review Matt
Thanks for watching Jack and I’m glad you liked the video!
Nice to have you bag on cars that deserve it. Thanks for thoughtful and informative reviews of attainable cars.
These have been out for awhile now and I think they have aged like milk. The older WRXs looked so much better I think.
They turned into an average car. Very boring
$47K USD for WRX with Brembos and suspension... no thanks.
And for those who say STI back in 2004 inflation adjusted would now cost 50K+...yes but back then STI was very competitive performance-wise, so the price was justified.
Another thing people forget is that most people had more DISPOSABLE income in 2004 than today. Basic housing, food, medical didn't eat up nearly as much of the budget. I was able to buy a brand-new Acura RSX S Type back in 2003. But today, even though I earn a lot more on paper, I can't really afford a brand-new S Type today.
@@norwegianblue2017 RSX S to Integra Type S doesn't seem like a fair comparison though. The ITS is a CTR with extra luxury on top. Maybe 2003 Civic SI to 2025 Civic SI would be a fairer comparison. Given how many $50-70k SUVs and pickup trucks now litter the roads, driveways, and big-box store parking lots now, it sure seems like people have more disposable income to drop on "family vehicles" far bigger and costlier than necessary.
@@thatoneotherotherguy Maybe not a fair comparison. But all I know is that at least I was able to afford a Type S on a regular young person's income. That's who these cars should be aimed at.
@@thatoneotherotherguy I wouldn't say they have more disposable income. Most are happy to take out long loans (84+ months) on those vehicles to keep the payments low. Sadly too people seem okay to have car payment over 600 dollars and make their car payments sometimes as much as their mortgage. Its crazy, but people are living in debt and credit now a days. If something really goes wrong they might have zero saving to pay for something. Thats why some car channels you see dealers or mechanics saying people have 2 choices now when it comes to cars. They either have the money to fix what they have or make a car payment. Not both.
@@peteraugustinos9226 so you're saying people don't have more disposable income, they're just being really irresponsible choosing to buy really expensive discretionary vehicles they can't afford on very long loans? I do agree that loans over 60 months are incredibly stupid, but I also don't see repossessions happened left and right on this new normalized oddity of a "$60k family pickup truck"
I am beyond grateful for my 2017 sti lol
@@jrmz7843 so no problems with clutch or persistent problems? I’ll be in the market soon and contemplated a 2024 base or 2017 sti
@ nope my sti has been running strong and healthy
Review: All the reasons not to buy a 2025 Subaru WRX tS 😂
I own a 2022 WRX Limited (which at the time had an MSRP of $35,995 and only $995 for destination and delivery) and I totally agree on how I’d also pick any of the competitors at this price for a tS. Currently daydreaming of owning a Type R or Golf R
30k base and 35k loaded for WRX is certainly good deal given today’s market - plastic cladding or not.
@@taelee347 yeah at those prices, a WRX was a no-brainer. The Limited were nice vs the competitors. Not the fastest or fanciest, but they had “enough” of everything. At more than $45k for a tS they better be at AT LEAST 320hp and more bells and whistles! Insane
Another (happy) 22 Limited owner that agrees - 45K is just too much. Unfortunately, sounds like the lower end WRXs are getting pricier too.
5:26 The infotainment system has worse lag than the turbo😭
Why does the screen matter? Just turn it off and enjoy the AWD made in Japan turbo as you row the gears
@Adam-t4y because you're paying for it
@@JoeyJoe-JoeJrShabadoo i get enough value from the drive :-)
Subaruwrxfan not sugar coating it…the new pricing is just ridiculous, agree with FF and AWD alternatives 👍
Needed to see this review! Here I am with a paid off 21 base VA with 36k miles thinking I would love the new TS… every other review I see on UA-cam raves about this car, but Matt has always been an honest automotive channel! Appreciate you, brother! I’m going to pass on this TS and hang on to my VA.
it’s subjective bro. I have 22 Limited paid 40k with taxes and fees. I would have loved to have waited and gotten the TS. The Brembos, Recaros and drive modes are worth it for me.
While the FA24 certainly has very high tuning potential.. I am not sure I would trade VA STi given at high power levels you will need that TY85 STI 6 speed. If you are going to leave it stock then its moot.
Other than the engine everything else is on par (Brakes) or a downgrade hardware wise (trans, actual front and rear diffs, and hydraulic steering feel although this one is subjective) and you would most likely pay more on top of trading your car in considering this costs 47K.. I am not sure if you can get 40K for your 2021 but you will still be in debt.
Happy to help! And yeah with interest rates still not being the best for car loans, I’d hang onto a paid off car and invest the spare cash if you have it.
@@cptnbananas88 Likewise here. 2021 Base WRX with 26k miles purchased 9/21, one of the last VA's, for $28.5k. Nothing I see here is worth trading it in for, especially as I keep my WRX's stock.
@@Teromi stop using "bro," it's cringe.
Agree completely, at 46k+ if you dont deal with snow then anyone in their right mind gets a base mustang gt
Remember 10 years ago the Sti was 35k at most
The prices these days for an inferior car are insane
Part of the challenge of the WRX is it's getting quite expensive. A base model is $36k, and this is $10k over that. $10k might be cool...if it was a full on STI with the full drivetrain. That used to be an $8k adder over a standard WRX. They're asking more than that for a standard WRX with a few upgrades. If this was a $3k to $4k adder, yeah, makes sense. $10k? How is that justified? Worse, a standard Impreza, is a $25k car. So just going to the WRX at all is already an $11k bump up. So you're up $21k from an Impreza to this, nearly double the price of nearly the whole car you're already getting, just for an engine change, suspension, brakes, and seats. Is the manual even different between the cars? (maybe, haven't checked).
Now premium cars at premium prices is not uncommon. You can buy a Wrangler Rubicon for astronomical pricing, and on a relative scale, you kind of have to determine if the price is wild. The problem with Subaru is they've never been a premium brand. They've always played in the budget realm. It doesn't help you can buy a low mile, nearly new STI for $35k to $40k today. It's not competing with just other new cars. It's still competing with used ones, used WRXs, and even used STIs.
Sad to see what Subaru keeps doing with the WRX line. No STi, excessively priced for what you get, lacking in options, etc. For a long time was my favorite car and still love the bugeye I have. But doesn't seem like a great option for new anymore.
Glad you addressed the cold start drone. I sold my 2022 because it was so annoying. Screamingly loud, and then when it’s warmed up you can’t even hear it when you drive. Also the infotainment really is THAT bad vs any other new car in its price range. Aside from those two things it is a pretty great car
Hope you're having a good holiday season, Matt! Merry Christmas!
Great review. Subaru is crazy asking this price for so little. I own a 2015 WRX and was looking to upgrade. Looks like I won't be getting another Subaru. I also think the black exterior cladding makes the latest gen car's basically look cheap, terrible design choice.
Oooof, Matt. You were done with this review barely 20 secs in. It's hard to watch an icon fall so far and soooo hard, ain't it? As a seven-time Subaru owner, I continue to watch the VB out of nothing more than morbid curiosity.
Subaru is the little kid that doesn't want to go to the barber, cuts his own bangs, ruins his hair, and proudly exclaims, "See, mommy! I did it myself!"
Subaru Corp and SOA, you suck. Your CVTs are garbage, your U.S. dealerships are full of clowns, and you've massacred a once great champion of automotive enthusiasm. You're Mitsu 2.0, only taking 15 years longer to get there.
“Subaru WRX not-a-fan here….” Thanks for your candor, Matt!
Thanks for watching! I’m glad you appreciate the honesty!
It was great to see you in a WRX again! Thanks for sharing your objective insight--it really makes a difference.
Thanks for watching!
I love Matt in Karen mode 😂
Very passionate we all expect more from Subaru
Always enjoy your reviews. I remember when your channel was named Subaru WRX fan. As someone who supports their products, maybe Subaru should listen too to you. There are some great elements to this vehicle, but the negatives really hold it back. With some tweaks, the wrx could be a special vehicle.
The 300zx was almost more interesting than the WRX lol
Haha yeah it was really clean!
Is there a review of a Nissan 300zx in this channel?
Unfortunately I’ve never reviewed one.
@MattMaranMotoring I have a 22 wrx on e85 with an intake and it makes around 370whp. That is way more worth the money than this since it only requires the intake and e tune
It WAS more interesting
Awesome review, Matt! Thank you for being so honest. You are easily my favorite car reviewer on UA-cam
Thank you, I’m honored to be your favorite!
I got the premium last year for 35K otd with the HK speakers and moonroof. For that price it was a good value proposition. I needed AWD as i live in the Midwest. I needed space as I have 2 kids. The car has its flaws but at 35K i wouldn't be complaining, knowing that with 3K I could get it to 350whp reliably compared to a GRC which is an already stressed 3 cylinder engine.
This WRX hasn't grown on me at all. All the cheap looking plastic cladding is hideous.
@@vr6gls the rear looks terrible and the front looks like a beaver
I actually got over the looks after driving it.
@@bmanboogie I can care less about how it drives, if I don’t like looking at it. It’s a horrible design.
@vr6gls That's understandable. It depends on the person. I drive 50miles to work one way so I am more focused on how it drives ✌️
@@bmanboogie I guess so, its like you wearing an ugly shirt. You don't really see it but it's still ugly. I want to like it but I can't.
Please keep calling out automakers on their insane pricing. This is getting out of control.
I definitely will!
Thanks for the honest review. I was considering this with the type R and the Type S. I knew it was going to be a stretch with this car but your video confirmed my concerns. Greatly appreciate the insight!!
Happy to help!
Subaru selling a WRX for STI prices is like McDs canceling their Big Mac, then selling their cheeseburgers for BigMac prices
So, basically the complaint is about price.
The drone on start up and how much fuss you made about it is silly. The STIs etc were just as bad. It settles down quickly.
Everything else is fine. I still don't think it needed eyesight, but I will take the adaptive cruise control for sure.
Priced at 42, it would be a good option. 46 is wild.
Price is everything in a competitive market. Imagine this car cost half as much; it would be an amazing car at $23K such that no competitor even merits consideration. Imagine this car cost twice as much; it would be utter crap at $92K unworthy of even reviewing, much less buying.
20:02 HE SAID THE THING!!!
These cars are still selling. Everyone is critical of the unpainted fenders, overpricing, no STI etc. but … in the end this generation of WRX is selling more then ever before Facts 💯💯💯
~48k with price, taxes and fees... think about that for a sec.
It's not an STI, it has horrible equipment, no power bump, and subaru basically expects you to mod it yourself with aftermarket parts or their in-store cosmetics. I was so ready to buy a 2025 because I enjoyed driving the 2024 but wanted to see what the next model had to offer but honestly this is just too much for a "tuned by sti" top trim.
I would get a pre eyesight WRX if I were to buy one of this generation. One thing I do like about the 2025 is that purple color.
Devils Advocate: They don't worry about the exhaust because they know most people will put an aftermarket one anyway.
That bumper on the rear (especially in white) looks like someone just plucked something off of a Wilderness model and connected it to this car.
It is amazing my back in 2006 when I bought my new 2006 Subaru Legacy special edition, I got as a option the center armrest pop up extender to make it higher and still in 2025 they are using it. Amazing. LOL I will say it does work well just funny after all these years. Also, Subaru did do a software update for the touchscreen to help it, but clearly in your tester it was slow. I will say back in April I tested a WRX at the dealership and the screen did not lag like that, and it was about 38 degrees outside when I tested it. I don't think you can say every Subaru screen lags as bad as this one did, but they have had issues with them.
The screen does work better when warmed up, so if it wasn’t immediately being used after a cold start it might have been better. But my experience here is pretty consistent with every other Subaru I’ve used in the past 4 years with this system sadly. Maybe I’m just unlucky lol.
Matt was not feeling this car, at all. I think we need more honest reviews across UA-cam car reviewers!
I love this car! If I didn't already have a Golf R, this 25 WRX tS would be the car for me. VB already a great car but this takes it up a notch.
I just picked up my 2024 RS for $40,300 CAD(~$29,000 USD). Besides active dampers and a couple red badges, what justifies $18k mark up.
Good review but the Type R is in no way like a magic carpet ride in comfort mode. The Elantra N on the other hand is decent in comfort mode
I'm glad I bought my 2022 Limited new in 2023 for 3K under MSRP. Don't need Brembo's, i do wish it had an STI trans. It's super easy to add power to the FA24. It's been a great daily for me for 2 years and plan to keep it for many years. It's certainly not worth close to 47K which you'd probably get it for around 44K. Still not worth that much over a Limited. I love analog gauges and my moonroof.
TS for Team Subaru.
Is that gear lever really that loud??? When you were at a stop, you put it into 1st and it sounded like something snapped.
Yeah it’s a little noisy.
You're spot on, all points.. I've always been a huge Subaru WRX / STI fan, since I was young and always wanted to own one but never did because, well life.. I'm now at the stage where I can buy one, but I'm not.. Probably going to pick up the Golf R instead.
At this point we have to ask this, is Subaru planning to pinch off the WRX with all these lackluster features compared to the competition?_?
Yeah not doing an STI seems to be a bad sign about their commitment to the WRX.
@MattMaranMotoring Very very bad. The WRX tS is set to be an intentional disaster to avoid bringing back the STI.
Let's be real here. We all know the tS really isn't/wasn't "tuned by STI." SOJ (Subaru of Japan) and SOA (Subaru of America) disbanded the entire STI Division team when they told the entire world back in 2022 that the STI for the VB gen platform was cancelled and wasn't happening.
Yet, Subaru has the car. They may not have the engine since they retired the EJ20 in Japan and EJ25 in North America. If Subaru was concerned about not having an engine for a VB WRX STI, they should've pulled a move like Toyota did with BMW. Subaru should've gone (and still should go) to Porsche and get their 2.5T Flat Four Boxer engine that makes 350hp and 309lb-ft. Granted the fuel economy would either be the same as the standard WRX or better than the WRX with 20 MPG City, 25 MPG Highway, and 21+ Combined (20/25/21+) as in 1 MPG better in each EPA metric, the fact that Porsche's 2.5T is far more potent in its performance would give the engine an advantage to be the car that the enthusiasts are asking and desperately pleading for.
Disappointment! It's what makes a Subaru, a Subaru!
Great honest review Matt! Just one minor correction, the Golf R also does not have rev matching.
Really? I could have sworn the Mk8 press car I had a couple years ago had it.
The Premium trim is the one to get on pretty much any Subaru that offers it, including this WRX. You really don't need extras on top of it. And in the WRX's case, most trims have been selling $3k below MSRP for years. A 2025 Premium for $3k off is not a bad deal for how much all-weather family performance car you get. And if I recall correctly, you get pretty strong resale value. But yes, steer clear of this tS trim.
Yeah the 2025 Premium is less of a value than 2024 but I agree, still a decent value if you need AWD and can get some good discounts.
@@MattMaranMotoring I mean it got, what, a 4% price increase from last year for the same trim? Not awesome considering virtually no new standard equipment on Premium, but could be worse, I guess. They're moving 20k units a year here, so I guess they feel ok with that many at these prices. Would be nice if they'd put a manual in the 2.5rs Impreza, but Subaru's sales don't seem able to support a third manual at this point.
I just bought an RS 2 weeks ago. Even that was stretching value. This Ts is pointless. I have no idea where it fits in. They need three models, Base, Sport, STI. Then there's no confusion. I think they are just trying to get rid of excess parts at this point and re-spinning it as a new model when everything is the same, excluding the digital cluster, which makes me believe that the new cluster will fit in the previous 22-24 models without problems. It's likely plug and play so they didn't have to redesign the wiring harness.
I bought the TR (at a discount) because I did not want that digital dash in the TS. I love the car and is so underrated. I'm glad it's hated on, so I can get a discount. But in all seriousness, test drive WRX and yall will change your mind. I could give a crap about the center screen...i just turn it off and enjoy the drive...6 speed, made in Japan, awd...
Back when Subaru offered the WRX and STI, the STI stood out as a significant upgrade, justifying the price increase. The tS, however, doesn't offer enough hardware or experience to warrant the extra cost.
The only positive thing I heard him say were short gearing in the transmission, no auto rev matching junk, and no moon roof.
Too many other complaints about the car to make me interested.
I bought my STI because of him, at least partly.
I think the WRX Premium is still a good value, but unless an STI comes out, these upper level trims just aren't a good value.
I agree with this review. It makes sense. However I still think the VB is better than past generations specially if you get it for the right price. I got a 2022 limited for under 30k with under 20k miles. Put about $1k in mods and it’s looking amazing. Better engine and platform just don’t spend too much on it
That slow infotainment system is maddening to me. The styling has grown on me somewhat but watching this video I see how bland the nose is. The blue interior is too much and not a fan of the giant portrait screen. Pricing is ridiculous. Thanks Matt for the helping me cross this off my list.
Happy to help!
Great Review! This car just begs for help in so many ways. I wanted to like it but I’d take a chance and buy and old one 😂
I just put $500 deposit on a new 2024 wrx base. Getting a pretty solid deal on it about 30,500 before taxes title fees. Definitely a great deal. Although the other trims including TS are not worth it imo.
I wonder if they have improved lane keep assist since 2020? The version on my Outback is TERRIBLE. They should call it "white line pogo assist" for how much it swings you back and forth. Every Hyundai/Kia rental I've ever driven has been A LOT better. Also speaking of 45 grand? I'm pretty sure you can get a top of the line Touring XT Outback that has a nice leather interior for that kind of money. They are pretty nice inside and has the 260 hp engine. I get 29-32 mpg on the highway. Finally, I should say that the one thing I think Subaru does better safety feature wise is the size and placement of the blind spot warning lights. Nice big amber lights on the inside of the mirror unit are very easy to see and they light up when you still have time to make a better decision. Unlike others that give you a little triangle of light when it's too late.
Yeah thankfully the lane keep assist has improved in the past few years.
With destination it’s 47k. If it was 40-42k I think it would be solid buy. Like you said it’s asking the same for 300 plus hp cars like the golf R n Type R. If this costs 47k what would an STI version cost? 55k??
Makes the infotainment in the MK 8 GTI look like genius in comparison lol.
Love the honesty from Matt good deal at less than $35k then another that that too many options. It’s almost like some manufacturers are tying to kill off their sport cars and only make basic transportation.
Give us a base, virgin edition with build capability based on solid internal components and let the buyer play with the peripherals. You gave us brakes 3/2 pucks, tech and comfort. Be thin seat factor, be cool and nibble add tune to your identities and live FREE. You got brakes.
I can see your frustration with Subaru when it comes to the TS model. Subaru did all the hard work of bigger performance brakes, chassis tuning etc but forgot to turn up the wick to give this thing more boost. 12 psi is not exactly stressing out the engine. If it had 300+ horsepower then it would make sense, but if I was upgrading my 22 Premium, I would be looking at a Type R over the TS.
I have a feeling...maybe false hope...that they are saving the sti version for a midcycle refresh in a year or 2 that will have big changes like ditching a lot of the unpainted plastic.
The WRX and STi were fast (quick) for the 2002-2008 span but cars have evolved and left Subaru behind. My 2017 STi is a fun car but a lot of vehicles now can keep up with it with ease or beat it stoplight to stoplight and that is a metric for a Daily driver to be held to.
The thumbnail says "too expensive" but a quick search puts the 2024 WRX Premium at 35000 with no other options. Brembo 6 piston front/2 Pistion rear are $4-6000 (without install.) And you get recaro seats plus a few suspension options which according to other reviewers are an awesome upgrade. Id say $45700 (not $47000) price tag is pretty decent all things considered. Do we expect them to lose money on a car?
I couldn’t live with that interior colour on a daily basis and why go from red brembos to that colour? I’m happy with my TR
All these different badges and upgrades yet NO POWER!! the entry level for cars now is minimum 300 HP or at least 300 torque.
I will keep my Fiat 500 turbo manual. Huge aftermarket and cheap as far as tuning cars go. Can’t beat it size and weight benefits for ice racing.
Good thing you changed your name 😂😂
Subaru should badge engineer a M340i with x-drive and sell it as a WRX.
No LSD with that much money is just lame.
Been saying this for about the last 10 years. After the generation of WRX that ended in 2014, Subaru started their journey of completely abandoning their fan base and staying way behind the development curve.
Sad to see prices gone up. I bought a 23 WRX because of the price, and it has a little bit of everything between GRCorolla and Civic Type R.
Now price is as high as the other competitors 😢
You forgot to mention that with e85, exhaust and intake tune these are putting down 400 horsepower on the dyno.
One thing to note, GR Corolla would not make a good daily or family car, while WRX is a perfect in that sense that is still fun to drive with AWD and close to 300 hp. Rear seats room in Corolla is very bad, while you can put 2 car seats in the back of WRX. Corolla also wants to be trashed to be fun, but WRX has good low end torque which comes handy in daily driving, which is 99% of the driving. With simple bolt ons and a tune you easily squeeze 50+ HP from fa24
Matt, you’re 100% right
I love my 22 base wrx but because it was only 30k and i can add my performance stuff. We honestly dont need the dampers because we will eventually put coilovers on them. 47k is crazy because a type r or corolla at that price point will obviously be the better car to spend all that money. If that was all subaru was offering i would definitely choose a corolla or type r over that 47k wrx with a weak transmission and power
Nearly 47 grand for that is nuts.
The Outback and WRX days of glory are over. I loved the Crocodile Dundee campaign but that was 30 years ago...cmon Subaru
Why the hell can’t they just make ONE version without the black wheel arches. Just ONE version. Call it WRX “street” or WRX “not hideous”.
It almost looks like it cut power right after going into second on that pull.
Keep up the great work Matt. Love me some turbo Subaru. But they have lost their way.
Matt
Overall right review of the benefits v. Cost of the tS. Overall, agree.
I sensed that your displeasure of the tS extrapolated onto aspect of the WRX which are common to all the trims. The screen is not as bad as you stated, etc. it is a great car as you assessed two years ago, while the tS is just overpriced and only good for track use.
Let us not the tS piece cloud our judgement of the overall excellent WRX package
Thank you
That rear bumper needs to be redesigned. It's the only thing keeping me from buying one.
Yea not a fan of this at all, bassicallly all downsides compared to competition. Great review as always!
my 86s infotainment screen isnt as bad but it still is laggy, occasional infotainment software updates come out so I hope they are able to make it smoother through this
There’s a new update for the GR86’s radio if you have a second gen.
@ yup going to be installing it sometime soon
It feels like you really wanted to like this car - and maybe you do - but I appreciate your objectivity. This car is too expensive for what you’re getting. It’s like Subaru is telling potential buyers, “Take it or leave it, we don’t care.” There are folks who will buy this because it’s the best performing new WRX you can get, and it’s as close to an STI as we’re likely get anytime soon. And I think Subaru is counting on those folks to just buy the car and not question the company like you are.
Personally, I’m still baffled by Subaru’s absolute refusal to make a WRX hatchback again. They would sell much better than the sedan versions have the last several years.
Would love to get a GR but that back room is so tiny, i can't do it. Thinking on this but once you mentioned the other ones its tough competiton. I would rather get a golf R for about the same price. Type R idk if I would like a fwd car again, but it is a beast of a car.
Very apparent that he is no longer Subaruwrxfan… Subaru is a lost company. ✌️