oh i absolutely love wargaming's logic. "what did people absolutely despise about arty in WoT, Sergey?" "they hated that it could one-shot tanks with no way to defend against it, Ivan" "ok, thanks Sergei! Gergoronov, make sure that mechanic makes it to World of Warships!!"
Joe Average so in your mind, it's "balanced" to be forced to basically cripple your ship so you can defend against one carrier, or risk being one shotted. and if you try and tell me I can rely on friendly cruisers I'm going to laugh you out of the room
Well I broke down and got my second premium ship (my son bought them both for me). I already have the USS Indianapolis (that's where I am originally from). And I just got the USS Enterprise. I will admit I will be a wallet Warrior on this one. I am not very good with carriers, but I wanted this ship. Not only is it the most decorated US ship of World War II, but I was also stationed on the USS Enterprise (CVN-65 not CV-6 😁 I'm not that old) for a few years (of my 20 served), so the namesake means a lot to me.
Yes, its the *famous BigE.* Have to admit it, *it's THE ship I wanted most since the launch of WoWS.* BUT.. T8 with T7 planes, in a T9 & T10 environment where auto 1-win button AA will wreck your planes. Not being able to switch bombs, so crewed when you loaded AP bombs vs DDs during end game situations. And dmg mostly done not by (at least a bit amount of required) skill, the TBs (say hello to shitty drop pattern), but *have to rely on the heavily RNG-based DBs to make dmg*. => *No thanks WG.* How about give USN ships a better treatment overall, especially USN CVs (like Ranger vs Hiryu, Lex vs Sho), and less biased overall, like the T10 Kebab.
The argument is that it's because you can drop up to 10 torps at once, and USN torps do more damage per hit than IJN ones, so having a tighter drop pattern would be too strong. While it's true that USN aerial torps are stronger per hit, let's compare that. Enterprise's torps have an alpha of 9,867. If you could land all 10 on a target, that's 98,670 damage (prior to TDS reductions). Yes, that would be brutal. But Kaga, a tier lower, has 8,567 alpha on her torps and can drop 12 at a time. That means a raw alpha of 102,804. Apparently Enterprise would be too strong if it could deliver a less powerful torp drop than the IJN CV premium a tier below her. Makes perfect sense./s
This is going to sound unbelievable, but he doesn't like either. iChase has actaully been a long time champion of the stupidity of carrier ability to delete stuff. Just because someone uses a game mechanic to their advantage doesn't mean they support it.
That's becouse dropping Torpedoes is (from the Carriers point of perspective) skill based for you have to calculate not only when to start the attack but also have to anticipate where the enemy ship is trying to move (to avoid these Tropedoes). If you are insanly lucky however point and click dive Bombers, even from the side can score enouth hits (and in case of HE bombs fires) to do damage that requires almost 0 input and 0 setting up.
It's more that the dive bombers become more of a one-trick-pony, being only devastatingly effective against german BBs. It's also a lot easier to aim dive bomber squads than torpedo drops, so the skill required to output ratio is a bit too low.
worst feeling in the world, for both CVs and DDs; 'aw yeah, those torps are good. On target, on target' *shells streak in from behind you or your planes somewhere, BOOM* 'bu- but my torps.. :
I know I'm a bit sardistic, but would actually prefer - cold war are like - if the BigE is specialized at *deleting premium paper stalinium putinium Russian ships*.
T8 fast firering burning awesome AA 1-win-button smoking stealth glorious stalinium ship gg WG. oh, and one of the few T8 cruiser who benefits from IFHE, coincidence? mhm... ...
Keep in mind that the bombs got slightly altered, having better retention inside ships but slightly lower pen, as well as the ship herself recieving the 3M upgrade slot which gives access to aircraft speed or strike craft HP
Mark 33, introduced in October 1942, weighing 1000 lbs (454kg) of which 150 lbs (68 kg) was high explosive. The Mark 33 could penetrate a 5" deck from 10,000' (3050m) or from 6500' (1980m) when dropped from a dive bomber in a 300 knot 60 degree dive.
i were interested in this: how does AP bombs works against cv´s ? against us t6-10 cv´s & against japanese t6-10 cv´s ect . . . can you make test´s for us?
IJN torpedo bomber rekt lots of DD with ease, like insta nuke them, especially IJN DD [insert black question mark meme]? Yet BB get nuke present a poblem?
whats that in wg armada video where they are saying that you should aproach a bb from the side with ap dive bombers.... makes no sense... can someone enlighten?
Looking forward to picking up the Big E, although the instadelete of AP divebombers against KMBBs (and possibly against Graf Zeppelin as well) doesn't sound like fun for either party. If Enterprise comes bundled with a 9/15pt captain, I'll happily take her just to try my hand with high-tier carrier play..I doubt that's the best way to play her though.
29:00 lol, Chase, it's litterally impossible to have 4 CV games after tier 8. WG changed that a while ago, so up to tier 7 there can be 4 CV matches, but starting at tier 8 it's always gonna be 1v1, and since CVs are always matched against same tier CVs, the Enterprise will only ever face Lexingtons and Shokakus (and eventually the Graf Zeppelin). Another reason why Kaga and Saipan are much more OP in general, as they simply cannot be bottom tier among CVs, since they can't face tier 8 CVs.
Having lots of fighters is a reflection of the USN realizing that the SBD could not function as a fighter at Coral Sea and at Midway and the initial fighting around Guadalcanal that one squadron was not enough.
If i remember correctly, from the movie "Pearl Harbor" Arizona got struck with a AP bombs and its a Insta Delete ( well, there's that one torpedo I guess )
Looks disgustingly OP, even by CV standards. When will WG realise that being able to choose who to delete, at leisure, from total safety on the other side of the map is a TERRIBLE gameplay choice?
hey chase I just wanted to say that I love your vids and I watch them as soon as I can. your vids are always entertain me and part of what made me play WoWs. it's a great game and I always come to you for reviews. thanks for doing these vids!
I've the same sentiment, Bill. If memory serves, I've read where there was a push in the US Navy to save her, but the higher up brass thought it was more important to use her in the bomb tests to observe the nuke's effects on a carrier. It was, and still is, a damned shame. That ship, crew and dock workers went through, and recovered from, so much she should have been saved. In my opinion, the Enterprise's service history made her THE ship of the US Navy.
I'll definitely be a buyer of Graf Zeppelin been waiting almost 2 years for that ship. Now the Luftwaffe and Germany can finally make their mark in the game as CVs.
trust me when i say, the AP bombs will be nerfed, as the BBabbies will whine and complain so much that WG will nerf the AP bombs into the ground, and this is coming from a BB main that doesnt care about the AP bombs
Are you trying to say that WG will nerf Premium ships? The ships that people pay money for? They will never nerf Premium ships because why would they want to make the customers angry am I right? And if anything is considered OP, than it would probably be removed from the Shop...
Daylight4449 Fan Yep that's probably what'll happen, it's not like us crusiers players have gotten used to being insta deleted over the last couple years... (Also why the fuck does it always seem like bb players get preferential treatment over everyone else? Did a battleship save Russia or something?
Blanket nerf bro, the AP bombs are gonna be on high tier USN CVs as well, and premiums can be affected by blanket nerfs cause if they werent, you'd have premiums becoming a P2W thing, like WoT and we dont want that in WOWS
What erks me is that people think german BBs had weak deck armor, when in reality bismarcks deck at its thickest part was only a half inch thinner than USS Iowa's
Hi iChase! I was playing the Tirpitz you nuked in the first game. [USN]jerry658 Like I said in game, my Tirpitz was at 80% health and had a 69 AA rating plus double fighters aloft and together they had zero effect on repelling your bombers. Like you said AA rating is not a good metric for comparison. BTW my Cleveland is a 78 AA rating and is an awesome killer of planes. During the game, I was in a group of 3 BBs and 1 cruiser aggressively pushing your cap and we were pretty successful up to the point you sunk me. I was feeling pretty confident since when you have a Bismarck and a Tirpitz teamed up they are pretty hard to stop. From watching your previous videos, I know you feel that the Tirpitz should be an aggressive brawler and not camp on the border like so many BBs tend to do. And you are correct in surmising that being nuked in a single air strike was not very fun gameplay for me. I remember watching your previous Enterprise video and you sounded like you were not very impressed with her. Now that you showed it as a "One trick pony" and have not recommended it to purchase makes me feel a little better, I just hope these AP bombs do not become available on all other High Tier US CVs! By the way at no time did I whine about being nuked, as was implied by other posters to this thread.
People are saying that "bbs can insta delete so why not planes?" This is a bad argument, bbs are clumsy, slow, and have bad turret rotation. Planes can easily be hovered anywhere and go super fast accross the map. Yes they can be destroyed by aa, but its way different than seeing a ship. You can angle against a ship but to avoid planes, you have to pray your aa is good enough. Since the counter is different, these ap bombs should not delete full health bbs. Torpedos are differemt, players have a chance to dodge them, its almost impossible to dodge a bomb drop in a bb.
Yeah. "against passive BBs and especially German BBs" played in my Bismarck yesterday, Spawned, Enterprise send Torpedobombers and Divebombers. 50k dmg by AP bombs and Torpedos did the rest in the first 3 min without having fired a single shell... FUN AND ENGAGING
I dont get it.... In WoT you can switch between AP and HE.... Even in WoW, you can shoot both ammo. Why do they have a dedicated load out for the bombers during the game... It would be nice if you can make a choice between the two bombs
jeffrey schreuder oh yeah of course. I forgot about that. Though I dont really play enough to remember such details. Even in Wot which I used to play A LOT, my point of reference was the turret and the gun rather than HP. I guess its too demanding for me to remember that stuff.
In real life the Enterprise was a good ship. Of the original four carriers, she was the only one that survived the war. She was in the worst of the fighting during the war and received multiple awards. It's the reason why Gene Roddenberry named his ship Enterprise and where the Renter Car service Enterprise got it's name. It is also why CVN-65 was named Enterprise.
CV's are the sole reason no one makes BB's anymore. Dive Bombers aren't OP, its the problem that the game doesn't do plunging fire correctly. I can't tell you how many times my BB dropped a max range salvo on someone, the shells came in from above dropping down thru the deck and only counted as an over pen for 1032dmg ...
when torp dropping, how about lining up your torps so that they close the gap presented by the drop pattern-basically offset the two groups by a little bit when manual dropping so that when they release the torps, the gaps from the first squadron are filled with torps from the second squadron. yeah, you kinda have to sacrifice the doubling up capability of your torps meaning possibly less torp hits, but it can present a very difficult scenario for anyone trying to dodge the torps to the point they will take at least a few torps meaning guaranteed dmg and a way to mitigate the terrible drop pattern. also aren't the AP dive bombers like easy to dodge when manual dropping? i kinda feel that's the way WG balanced them, if they aren't completely square on, the damage is reduced greatly as most of the bombs will miss but i do agree that the nuking capacity of those bombs to Germans is kinda ridiculous. also can't wait to see what the Graf Zeppelin brings to the table, I'm sure it'll be interesting but I'm still
If bomb travels through more than 70mm armor, it goes bomb from what I understand. NY has 19mm deck so that's a guaranteed pen through her deck, and into her citadel deck which is 89mm So it will be a close call in the NY. NM has 25 and 140, so unlikely to do anything. Colo is 25/89, so probably pen damage. NC has 37/43. 10m difference, so it is very likely to citadel it. Iowa is 38/16. Overpen on citadel maybe? Montana is 38 and 19 So citadel ahoy..
By making the German BBs vulnerable to a pay to win ship, it doesn't improve the USN BB line at all. It just gets WG some money. Tell me why I should play this game again?
The community has not a single opinion, so of course there is always complaint about every change. RPF, invisible fire, CV being too stronk, now too weak. You're not the community, just a player thinking he's right.
Carlos Nieto I would have told WG this was a spectacular idea. German BBs have no hard counter, fire is currently the closest thing. At T8+ they counter other Battleships with their "Turtleback" nonsense and ridiculous Secondaries, those same secondaries counter DDs, add in Sonar and DDs struggle to torp them. They insta delete Cruisers. I say good, love the idea WG. If KM BBs are less appealing to play the game will be better for it. 10/10 will buy Enterprise and I look forward to trolling the shit out of the current OP class in game.
Patrick Lol, if you think German BB are bad, wait untill you see RN BB. As far as I know, high tier RN BB will be like Missouri. Yes, they have radar, on a BB. Just think about that. Still, you are right about German BB is the strongest, with the secondaries power and armor they are perfect for brawling, making bad shell dispersion a non issue. And historically, aircraft and aircraft carrier is the reason why we have no modern day battleship. ;)
Yeah Watched the Flamu Conqueror clip on Reddits.... Mino Heal on a BB. This is how WG operates, it is their business model and has been for many years. Release content that forces a player to continually grind, or in their hopes pay to free xp, to stay on top of the "meta" It is also where 99% of the burnout from the hardcore player base comes from. Dont want to play 1ks of battles to grind out the new best line than you must pay, shit gets old and people quit. Example: You grind out the entire IJN DD line and WG nerfs the fuck out of them. You then switch to USN, WG nerfs the Gearing. Then Khaba, WG nerfs that, on to the Minotaur and incoming nerf.
I struggle in high tier German BBs compared to other BB lines. The guns just suck at range and high tier matches with tons of secondary damage is rare and everything HE spams the shit out of you. Some people love them, not me. Don't need another thing to make my grind in them worse
With that Fletcher, as low-health as he was and with his torps on cooldown, I wonder if you should've done the last thing he would ever expect a CV to do and just follow him into his smoke. And it would've been truly hilarious if he came around the island anticipating your circling the way you did, and instead you were in his smoke just far enough back not to be promimity spotted. I mean, when you're in a CV and arguably the best DD in the game at such close range, you're basically screwed either way. So might as well just YOLO and hope for the best.
So if WarGaming added a really, really expensive module to make the tier 7 planes tougher than the t8 planes, why the hell didn't they just make it so the bombers were tier 8 and the fighters were tier 7? That wouldn't cost me anything in game, and it wouldn't give Enterprise 2/3 the capacity of a normal T8 CV just in fighters that are now slightly tougher than the normal t8 fighters... am I missing something here or is that a completely brainless way to solve a really, really easy problem?
The bombs are good v Japanes BBs as well. However when you see an enemy team with noting but tier 10 bbs forget it your day is going to be ruined. I was able to shut down enemy CVs with it as well.
I don't really have trouble with German battleships. My evasive maneuvers are top notch, I've even survived encounters with Notser in an Alabama shooting at my Atago. The accuracy of the German battleships makes them just meh, if you can't kill them with normal penetration damage that's your problem. That said, I have got the odd citadel on Bismarck at long range with plunging fire. One of them went on about how I was probably hacking because he is Bismarck hes citadel is immune to all damage from all angles.
There are no multi-CV matches above tier 7. With neither Shokako nor Lex being well protected, Enterprise will never see an armored CV. At least not in the current game.
So sad that the Enterprise is a one trick pony. This is what I wished the Enterprise had: 1. Mixed AP and HE bombs per squad 2. Strike loadout 3. A special ability, maybe?? Like an airplane speed booster. idk. Enterprise is my favorite ship historically, I think I'd still get her if I could either way LOL. Though that tier 10, ouch. I think carriers need a limit of 3 tiers not 4 or 5 that they can be in, so for Enterprise, she can be in either tier 7, 8 or 9 games. Not 10. Plus, I'd also like to see infinite carrier capacity, but when you run out of reserves, there's a LONG time wait on when your reserves get filled up, so that could be 5-8 minutes, depending on the carrier and it's tier and it's reserve capacity. This would be on all carriers.
Perfect way to balance a game, comrade! Permit every ship in the game to completely nullify the largest surface combat ship. I've always been a heavy cruiser main but if they make my supposed counter completely irrelevant... It just takes all the fun out of it.
Yea ...nerf the german BBs and then sell even more premium DDs or cruisers with smoke so everybody can camp the whole time undetected. Fun and engaging gameplay.
Why go for the normal T8 CV Lexington when you can buy this thing and laugh at any Lexington player you come up against ?! Like seriously the Fighters alone can effectively harass and dwindle Lexington's fighters and bombers without so much as being at a disadvantage. Also with the Enterprises 4 squadrons of 2 torpedo and 2 dive bombers she can damage/ships more effectively than the Lexington which only has 1 torpedo squadron (which gets prioritized into oblivion) and 2 dive bombers. Like seriously isn't this what is called "Pay to win" ?
I agree that USN CV need love but the AP bombs are a bit overpowered You can see in history that they did good damage but never insta destroyed a ship Still I hope the Saipan will not get this AP bombs or would be unfair and even more OP to tier 5 ships that find themselves unhelped to fucking tier 9 planes
I really have to agree with iChase on this one, its no fun to get insta deleted (I know I play cruisers) but German battleships are still to damn strong in the current meta, and the argument that they have bad dispersion and weak AP pen, doesn't really help when I as a cruiser I can lose between 13000/15000 HP from only a signal Citadel hit just down to RNG, which can be up to 1/2 my HP ill add. So yes I very cautiously welcome the Enterprise as it could just create another wave of passive BB meta should these bombs do so much damage (I.e 60000+ DMG) or maybe ill make them move I don't know. All in all i think that a high hit of around 40000 DMG would be acceptable as it shouldn't Insta delete but will punish lone BB's.
i citadel tier 8 cruisers in my kongo in a failplatoon also only the tier 6 german BB and the tier 3 german BB are best in class the other tiers are pretty even between all the nations
don't agree with ichase, from someone who plays all ships why should dive bombers be able to do 30-50k damage to a ship where AA cover and team gameplay just isn't their, plus the lack of skill needed to drop bombs is poor if a battle ship one shots you its just very lucky rng or he waited for you to make a mistake and made a good shot at close or far range, If a dd hits you with 4 torps in a battleship you made a mistake,why not give every ship defensive aa? takes no skill to use but then the cv player would say its unbalanced, they should have ap bombs but with a max damage of 4000-5000 and be less accurate just like any dispersion shot in the game
CVS at high tier deal with enough AA as is. I play all classes. the issue with cv population at high tier is because of how much aa there already is. adding def aa would kill of the few stragglers in the cv playerbase. the game is too dull without cv changing things up and they would leave if they had to drop in def aa for panic spreads every time.
I have faced the enterprise twice in my bismarck.......I have adopted convoy sailing because sweet fkn jeebus dem ap bombs. Find a friendly bb or 2 and a ca for good measure, that way they only shave off 10-20k a strike
I am not a big BB player but I agree, this easy auto delete is not "fun" nor encouraging for BB players. That said, I had started playing the Bismark hoping to go T-10 but now, 4get it. Bad timing on my end...again .
One: German BBs can be citadeled if you know where to aim when you're in close and they most assuredly be citadeled from 15km or longer. So saying 'they cannot be citadeled' is not a correct statement iChase. All German BBs have a major Achilles' Heal, piss poor torpedo protection with the exception of tier 8, the rest have the worse protection in the remaining tiers. And now, WG decides to bring out these 1000lb armored piercing bombs with an oblong drop circle that barely clears the hull of a ship meaning nearly all of them hit? And this is balanced? This is the final reason that cemented my giving up on this game completely. GJ WG, GJ! Idiots.
Shaka kuchiki how did it become p4w to you, all i see is how underpowered it is compared to other CVs, only better than the Lexington AND NOTHING ELSE EVEN THE FUCKING SAIPAN. Sure the one hit kill is OP, how about turning your rudder a bit eh? Or stick to other ships LIKE YOU ARE SUPPOSED TO DO? The Enterprise is seriously a disappointment. Kinda hope for a cool gimmick like torp and dive bombers are taken from the same pool of air planes LIKE THEY DID IN THE WAR FOR THE YORKTOWN CLASS AIRCRAFT CARRIERS.
Cause i've played against CVs bastars all this week AND FUCKING TEAMS who DOESN''T try anything and just run all the match, and now IMAGINE THIS SHIT.. i mean this SHIP GIOING FULL ATTACK as always. and the other CV same so doesn't do his work, yeah i tried to " turn my rudder" guess what happened? i just lose the half of my HP, now imagine with this ship, motivate the active gameplay? yeah sure, you can guess what's going to happend and how balanced gonna be 1 attack 1 kill on CVs... oh wait they can do that actually, no just wait for AP bombs, which are available on this ship.
That's the problem dude, everybody (at least those weeks that i've been playing more often) at BB distance and just running, so you can't push and staying with them to survive is join to the problem, now with the potential "1 shot-kill" just imagine.
Shaka kuchiki Unfortunately you can't always help having potatoes on your team. Of course if cvs are really being problematic I would recommend playing in or platooning with AA ships and AA specialized captains.
While the Moskva armor has the potential of arming the AP bombs, no reasonable player will send T7 planes against a T10 cruiser, please iChase think about.
I got a fix for BBs. Stick together you fools. You have armor, your big, strong I get it. But you’re nothing to the aircraft carrier, stick together and your odds of surviving against them are higher.
I got hit for 19K in one drop the only time I ran into an Enterprise in my Bismarck. No sir, I didn't like it. On the other hand, it does make my NC & Iowa more competitive which I can't say I mind. What's bad for one is good for another....
oh i absolutely love wargaming's logic. "what did people absolutely despise about arty in WoT, Sergey?" "they hated that it could one-shot tanks with no way to defend against it, Ivan" "ok, thanks Sergei! Gergoronov, make sure that mechanic makes it to World of Warships!!"
Joe Average so in your mind, it's "balanced" to be forced to basically cripple your ship so you can defend against one carrier, or risk being one shotted. and if you try and tell me I can rely on friendly cruisers I'm going to laugh you out of the room
Just stay near them
Well I broke down and got my second premium ship (my son bought them both for me). I already have the USS Indianapolis (that's where I am originally from). And I just got the USS Enterprise. I will admit I will be a wallet Warrior on this one. I am not very good with carriers, but I wanted this ship. Not only is it the most decorated US ship of World War II, but I was also stationed on the USS Enterprise (CVN-65 not CV-6 😁 I'm not that old) for a few years (of my 20 served), so the namesake means a lot to me.
Yes, its the *famous BigE.*
Have to admit it, *it's THE ship I wanted most since the launch of WoWS.*
BUT..
T8 with T7 planes, in a T9 & T10 environment where auto 1-win button AA will wreck your planes.
Not being able to switch bombs, so crewed when you loaded AP bombs vs DDs during end game situations.
And dmg mostly done not by (at least a bit amount of required) skill, the TBs (say hello to shitty drop pattern), but *have to rely on the heavily RNG-based DBs to make dmg*.
=> *No thanks WG.*
How about give USN ships a better treatment overall, especially USN CVs (like Ranger vs Hiryu, Lex vs Sho), and less biased overall, like the T10 Kebab.
That is what the magic of that ship was, it damn well was not state of the art, it certainly got its ass kicked but its record? wow....just wow...
It's rather unfortunate WG decided to keep the poor drop pattern for the torpedo bombers. That's a large negative for the ship imo.
pdorn1 aerroon auto dropped a AFK bb and could only hit one torp with a broad side auto drop ON BIG AsS BATTLESHIP
The argument is that it's because you can drop up to 10 torps at once, and USN torps do more damage per hit than IJN ones, so having a tighter drop pattern would be too strong. While it's true that USN aerial torps are stronger per hit, let's compare that. Enterprise's torps have an alpha of 9,867. If you could land all 10 on a target, that's 98,670 damage (prior to TDS reductions). Yes, that would be brutal. But Kaga, a tier lower, has 8,567 alpha on her torps and can drop 12 at a time. That means a raw alpha of 102,804.
Apparently Enterprise would be too strong if it could deliver a less powerful torp drop than the IJN CV premium a tier below her. Makes perfect sense./s
RedXlV because it's American
probably to balance its stupid af db.
Hold on now. You don't like deleting ships with dive bombers but totally okay with it when you do it with torpedo bombers?
I don't get that logic.
He says BS all the time.
This is going to sound unbelievable, but he doesn't like either. iChase has actaully been a long time champion of the stupidity of carrier ability to delete stuff. Just because someone uses a game mechanic to their advantage doesn't mean they support it.
That's becouse dropping Torpedoes is (from the Carriers point of perspective) skill based for you have to calculate not only when to start the attack but also have to anticipate where the enemy ship is trying to move (to avoid these Tropedoes).
If you are insanly lucky however point and click dive Bombers, even from the side can score enouth hits (and in case of HE bombs fires) to do damage that requires almost 0 input and 0 setting up.
It's more that the dive bombers become more of a one-trick-pony, being only devastatingly effective against german BBs. It's also a lot easier to aim dive bomber squads than torpedo drops, so the skill required to output ratio is a bit too low.
Hey if that is true that I retract my statement. I watch him a lot but I can be honest and say I do not watch the entirety of every video.
worst feeling in the world, for both CVs and DDs;
'aw yeah, those torps are good. On target, on target'
*shells streak in from behind you or your planes somewhere, BOOM*
'bu- but my torps.. :
They wanted to bring in ap bombs to stop bow camping bbs, but they make them most powerful against the bbs that are least likely to bow camp...
I know I'm a bit sardistic, but would actually prefer - cold war are like - if the BigE is specialized at *deleting premium paper stalinium putinium Russian ships*.
T8 fast firering burning awesome AA 1-win-button smoking stealth glorious stalinium ship gg WG.
oh, and one of the few T8 cruiser who benefits from IFHE, coincidence? mhm... ...
Keep in mind that the bombs got slightly altered, having better retention inside ships but slightly lower pen, as well as the ship herself recieving the 3M upgrade slot which gives access to aircraft speed or strike craft HP
Mark 33, introduced in October 1942, weighing 1000 lbs (454kg) of which 150 lbs (68 kg) was high explosive. The Mark 33 could penetrate a 5" deck from 10,000' (3050m) or from 6500' (1980m) when dropped from a dive bomber in a 300 knot 60 degree dive.
i were interested in this:
how does AP bombs works against cv´s ?
against us t6-10 cv´s & against japanese t6-10 cv´s ect . . .
can you make test´s for us?
IJN torpedo bomber rekt lots of DD with ease, like insta nuke them, especially IJN DD [insert black question mark meme]? Yet BB get nuke present a poblem?
People play BBs to not get deleted. If you play a DD, play it smart so you don't get deleted.
TheTripleAce3 Players don't play BBs to avoid being deleted, they play them to delete other ships.
whats that in wg armada video where they are saying that you should aproach a bb from the side with ap dive bombers.... makes no sense... can someone enlighten?
Looking forward to picking up the Big E, although the instadelete of AP divebombers against KMBBs (and possibly against Graf Zeppelin as well) doesn't sound like fun for either party.
If Enterprise comes bundled with a 9/15pt captain, I'll happily take her just to try my hand with high-tier carrier play..I doubt that's the best way to play her though.
29:00 lol, Chase, it's litterally impossible to have 4 CV games after tier 8. WG changed that a while ago, so up to tier 7 there can be 4 CV matches, but starting at tier 8 it's always gonna be 1v1, and since CVs are always matched against same tier CVs, the Enterprise will only ever face Lexingtons and Shokakus (and eventually the Graf Zeppelin). Another reason why Kaga and Saipan are much more OP in general, as they simply cannot be bottom tier among CVs, since they can't face tier 8 CVs.
Having lots of fighters is a reflection of the USN realizing that the SBD could not function as a fighter at Coral Sea and at Midway and the initial fighting around Guadalcanal that one squadron was not enough.
Are the new controls for the CVs better than the classic one? Just wondering if I should switch.
How is the Enterprise when we use normal he bomb? Is it better to deal more damage with more target and using fire?
If i remember correctly, from the movie "Pearl Harbor" Arizona got struck with a AP bombs and its a Insta Delete ( well, there's that one torpedo I guess )
The enterprises manual drop is like a regular cv auto ... and under defensive fire is it goi to go backwards?
Love the content and intro, keep it up man!
That T9 mod upgrade is a great thought, it helps balance the planes HP pool but still gives it a handicap when it comes to speed
what percs does the camo give?
Looks disgustingly OP, even by CV standards. When will WG realise that being able to choose who to delete, at leisure, from total safety on the other side of the map is a TERRIBLE gameplay choice?
hey chase I just wanted to say that I love your vids and I watch them as soon as I can. your vids are always entertain me and part of what made me play WoWs. it's a great game and I always come to you for reviews. thanks for doing these vids!
How do you attack in "boxes" with fighters?
Hey ichase. Any idea whether or not the Saipan will get the AP bombs?
I recall a youTuber saying that all high tier USN CVs will get AP bombs, and Saipan uses Essex planes, so it unfortunately probably will.
I would hope they mean on a carrier by carrier basis, it should only really be on Tier 8+ USN carriers only.
Agreed, but Saipan is premium so "why not buff it if it makes them more money?"
And why those words, I have screwed every t5 BB player in the game.
ranger maybe ? that ship need a lot of help
Have you got a suggested captain build for this ship?
The Enterprise was impossible to kill in real life
FUCK Yeah! I just regret that they didn't keep her...
I've the same sentiment, Bill. If memory serves, I've read where there was a push in the US Navy to save her, but the higher up brass thought it was more important to use her in the bomb tests to observe the nuke's effects on a carrier. It was, and still is, a damned shame. That ship, crew and dock workers went through, and recovered from, so much she should have been saved. In my opinion, the Enterprise's service history made her THE ship of the US Navy.
Saratoga was the bomb target, Enterprise was scrapped
Thanks for correcting me. It's been awhile since I've read read about the subject.
Introducing Hardcounters. Because that NEVER is a problem!
@iChase Now that the Graf Zep si out, and kind of a bad ship, is Enterprise a could buy ship ?
There should be a system like; the further away you lock the drop the tinier the drop circle or something
Im confused, how do these bombers affect German BBs anymore then they do other BBs?
hi guys, any good tips to micro manage planes??
Seems to me the simplest fix would be to increase penetration damage, but make it so AP bombs can't citadel
Whats the outro music? :D It sounds like electro swing..and I really love that
I'll definitely be a buyer of Graf Zeppelin been waiting almost 2 years for that ship. Now the Luftwaffe and Germany can finally make their mark in the game as CVs.
Richard Ping I will also pick her up at release, I mean just look at that beauty 😍
ive been trying to get good at CVs just for the graf XD
trust me when i say, the AP bombs will be nerfed, as the BBabbies will whine and complain so much that WG will nerf the AP bombs into the ground, and this is coming from a BB main that doesnt care about the AP bombs
Daylight4449 Fan agreed.
^^^^^this, sorry force of habit from the WOWS forums, the "^^^^this" thing is common on the forums there
Are you trying to say that WG will nerf Premium ships? The ships that people pay money for? They will never nerf Premium ships because why would they want to make the customers angry am I right? And if anything is considered OP, than it would probably be removed from the Shop...
Daylight4449 Fan Yep that's probably what'll happen, it's not like us crusiers players have gotten used to being insta deleted over the last couple years... (Also why the fuck does it always seem like bb players get preferential treatment over everyone else? Did a battleship save Russia or something?
Blanket nerf bro, the AP bombs are gonna be on high tier USN CVs as well, and premiums can be affected by blanket nerfs cause if they werent, you'd have premiums becoming a P2W thing, like WoT and we dont want that in WOWS
What erks me is that people think german BBs had weak deck armor, when in reality bismarcks deck at its thickest part was only a half inch thinner than USS Iowa's
overall
is she good? I'm broken from stream sale. _.
One minor nitpick, enterprise will not see t9/t10/ CVs anymore, there are no 4 CV games from T8-T10 anymore
Hi iChase! I was playing the Tirpitz you nuked in the first game. [USN]jerry658 Like I said in game, my Tirpitz was at 80% health and had a 69 AA rating plus double fighters aloft and together they had zero effect on repelling your bombers. Like you said AA rating is not a good metric for comparison. BTW my Cleveland is a 78 AA rating and is an awesome killer of planes. During the game, I was in a group of 3 BBs and 1 cruiser aggressively pushing your cap and we were pretty successful up to the point you sunk me. I was feeling pretty confident since when you have a Bismarck and a Tirpitz teamed up they are pretty hard to stop. From watching your previous videos, I know you feel that the Tirpitz should be an aggressive brawler and not camp on the border like so many BBs tend to do. And you are correct in surmising that being nuked in a single air strike was not very fun gameplay for me. I remember watching your previous Enterprise video and you sounded like you were not very impressed with her. Now that you showed it as a "One trick pony" and have not recommended it to purchase makes me feel a little better, I just hope these AP bombs do not become available on all other High Tier US CVs! By the way at no time did I whine about being nuked, as was implied by other posters to this thread.
There's SO MANY ships coming out right now! RN BBs, Graf Zeppelin, French DD Cyclone, Premium KGV, Kidd soontm, and more... so many boats!
how is this premium ship balance when u can have 2x5 fighters on a balance setup while the lexi has 6 fighters ????
People are saying that "bbs can insta delete so why not planes?" This is a bad argument, bbs are clumsy, slow, and have bad turret rotation. Planes can easily be hovered anywhere and go super fast accross the map. Yes they can be destroyed by aa, but its way different than seeing a ship. You can angle against a ship but to avoid planes, you have to pray your aa is good enough. Since the counter is different, these ap bombs should not delete full health bbs. Torpedos are differemt, players have a chance to dodge them, its almost impossible to dodge a bomb drop in a bb.
Yeah.
"against passive BBs and especially German BBs"
played in my Bismarck yesterday, Spawned, Enterprise send Torpedobombers and Divebombers. 50k dmg by AP bombs and Torpedos did the rest in the first 3 min without having fired a single shell...
FUN AND ENGAGING
I dont get it.... In WoT you can switch between AP and HE.... Even in WoW, you can shoot both ammo. Why do they have a dedicated load out for the bombers during the game... It would be nice if you can make a choice between the two bombs
Kaga is the same in tier 7, actually worse because even vs anti air fire you still hit torps easely
Speaking of CV secondaries...they should add the USS Whiteplains...one of the few Carriers to beat a Cruiser in a gunfight.
How do you know which enemy is stock?
HP
jeffrey schreuder oh yeah of course. I forgot about that.
Though I dont really play enough to remember such details.
Even in Wot which I used to play A LOT, my point of reference was the turret and the gun rather than HP.
I guess its too demanding for me to remember that stuff.
Next balance patch, CV in general are completely incapable of doing any significant damage to German BB at all.
In real life the Enterprise was a good ship. Of the original four carriers, she was the only one that survived the war. She was in the worst of the fighting during the war and received multiple awards. It's the reason why Gene Roddenberry named his ship Enterprise and where the Renter Car service Enterprise got it's name. It is also why CVN-65 was named Enterprise.
CV's are the sole reason no one makes BB's anymore. Dive Bombers aren't OP, its the problem that the game doesn't do plunging fire correctly. I can't tell you how many times my BB dropped a max range salvo on someone, the shells came in from above dropping down thru the deck and only counted as an over pen for 1032dmg ...
when torp dropping, how about lining up your torps so that they close the gap presented by the drop pattern-basically offset the two groups by a little bit when manual dropping so that when they release the torps, the gaps from the first squadron are filled with torps from the second squadron. yeah, you kinda have to sacrifice the doubling up capability of your torps meaning possibly less torp hits, but it can present a very difficult scenario for anyone trying to dodge the torps to the point they will take at least a few torps meaning guaranteed dmg and a way to mitigate the terrible drop pattern. also aren't the AP dive bombers like easy to dodge when manual dropping? i kinda feel that's the way WG balanced them, if they aren't completely square on, the damage is reduced greatly as most of the bombs will miss but i do agree that the nuking capacity of those bombs to Germans is kinda ridiculous.
also can't wait to see what the Graf Zeppelin brings to the table, I'm sure it'll be interesting but I'm still
are they gonna release it to most t8-10 usn cv's?
Sadly yes.
And here I was thinking going BB would be fun.
TheTripleAce3 well the USN bb don't take muck damage from AP bombs
If bomb travels through more than 70mm armor, it goes bomb from what I understand.
NY has 19mm deck so that's a guaranteed pen through her deck, and into her citadel deck which is 89mm
So it will be a close call in the NY.
NM has 25 and 140, so unlikely to do anything.
Colo is 25/89, so probably pen damage.
NC has 37/43. 10m difference, so it is very likely to citadel it.
Iowa is 38/16. Overpen on citadel maybe?
Montana is 38 and 19 So citadel ahoy..
TheTripleAce3 the NC Iowa and Montana all have a mid layer of armor of 150 mm that you can't see in the armor viewer for some reason.
TheTripleAce3 so basically with most USN BBs probably won't get citadels
By making the German BBs vulnerable to a pay to win ship, it doesn't improve the USN BB line at all. It just gets WG some money. Tell me why I should play this game again?
"Hey let's not ask the community about the game and that some ideas for improvement cause raisins"- WG logic
chocolate coated
The community has not a single opinion, so of course there is always complaint about every change. RPF, invisible fire, CV being too stronk, now too weak. You're not the community, just a player thinking he's right.
Carlos Nieto I would have told WG this was a spectacular idea. German BBs have no hard counter, fire is currently the closest thing. At T8+ they counter other Battleships with their "Turtleback" nonsense and ridiculous Secondaries, those same secondaries counter DDs, add in Sonar and DDs struggle to torp them. They insta delete Cruisers.
I say good, love the idea WG. If KM BBs are less appealing to play the game will be better for it.
10/10 will buy Enterprise and I look forward to trolling the shit out of the current OP class in game.
Patrick Lol, if you think German BB are bad, wait untill you see RN BB. As far as I know, high tier RN BB will be like Missouri. Yes, they have radar, on a BB. Just think about that.
Still, you are right about German BB is the strongest, with the secondaries power and armor they are perfect for brawling, making bad shell dispersion a non issue. And historically, aircraft and aircraft carrier is the reason why we have no modern day battleship. ;)
Yeah Watched the Flamu Conqueror clip on Reddits.... Mino Heal on a BB. This is how WG operates, it is their business model and has been for many years. Release content that forces a player to continually grind, or in their hopes pay to free xp, to stay on top of the "meta" It is also where 99% of the burnout from the hardcore player base comes from. Dont want to play 1ks of battles to grind out the new best line than you must pay, shit gets old and people quit. Example: You grind out the entire IJN DD line and WG nerfs the fuck out of them. You then switch to USN, WG nerfs the Gearing. Then Khaba, WG nerfs that, on to the Minotaur and incoming nerf.
I struggle in high tier German BBs compared to other BB lines. The guns just suck at range and high tier matches with tons of secondary damage is rare and everything HE spams the shit out of you. Some people love them, not me. Don't need another thing to make my grind in them worse
any idea on price point yet?
Probably $60 like tirpitz.
With that Fletcher, as low-health as he was and with his torps on cooldown, I wonder if you should've done the last thing he would ever expect a CV to do and just follow him into his smoke. And it would've been truly hilarious if he came around the island anticipating your circling the way you did, and instead you were in his smoke just far enough back not to be promimity spotted. I mean, when you're in a CV and arguably the best DD in the game at such close range, you're basically screwed either way. So might as well just YOLO and hope for the best.
I bet that NC wasn't feeling good about losing 20,000hp especially as AP damage can't be repaired like HE can.
So if WarGaming added a really, really expensive module to make the tier 7 planes tougher than the t8 planes, why the hell didn't they just make it so the bombers were tier 8 and the fighters were tier 7? That wouldn't cost me anything in game, and it wouldn't give Enterprise 2/3 the capacity of a normal T8 CV just in fighters that are now slightly tougher than the normal t8 fighters... am I missing something here or is that a completely brainless way to solve a really, really easy problem?
when does this ship come out?
Marc P. Tmrw
The bombs are good v Japanes BBs as well. However when you see an enemy team with noting but tier 10 bbs forget it your day is going to be ruined. I was able to shut down enemy CVs with it as well.
I don't really have trouble with German battleships. My evasive maneuvers are top notch, I've even survived encounters with Notser in an Alabama shooting at my Atago. The accuracy of the German battleships makes them just meh, if you can't kill them with normal penetration damage that's your problem. That said, I have got the odd citadel on Bismarck at long range with plunging fire. One of them went on about how I was probably hacking because he is Bismarck hes citadel is immune to all damage from all angles.
There are no multi-CV matches above tier 7. With neither Shokako nor Lex being well protected, Enterprise will never see an armored CV. At least not in the current game.
Wiggum Esquilax The Graf Zeppelin has *some* armor at leasr like 50-60mm deck if im not wrong
Time to respec my Tirpitz for AA again when this one comes around
So sad that the Enterprise is a one trick pony. This is what I wished the Enterprise had:
1. Mixed AP and HE bombs per squad
2. Strike loadout
3. A special ability, maybe?? Like an airplane speed booster. idk.
Enterprise is my favorite ship historically, I think I'd still get her if I could either way LOL.
Though that tier 10, ouch. I think carriers need a limit of 3 tiers not 4 or 5 that they can be in, so for Enterprise, she can be in either tier 7, 8 or 9 games. Not 10. Plus, I'd also like to see infinite carrier capacity, but when you run out of reserves, there's a LONG time wait on when your reserves get filled up, so that could be 5-8 minutes, depending on the carrier and it's tier and it's reserve capacity. This would be on all carriers.
WTF are you talking about? Carriers have the same matchmaking as any other ship ffs ...
Perfect way to balance a game, comrade! Permit every ship in the game to completely nullify the largest surface combat ship. I've always been a heavy cruiser main but if they make my supposed counter completely irrelevant... It just takes all the fun out of it.
German MA is also going to be nerft in 0.6.8... ist that true? :-(
Speaking of nerfing German BBs, sea-group has hints that WG is going to be nerfing their secondaries' damage and fire chance
That's the main reason to play German BBs though now that BigE can one shot Bismarcks.
Yea ...nerf the german BBs and then sell even more premium DDs or cruisers with smoke so everybody can camp the whole time undetected.
Fun and engaging gameplay.
How the hell do you get this ship?
Why go for the normal T8 CV Lexington when you can buy this thing and laugh at any Lexington player you come up against ?! Like seriously the Fighters alone can effectively harass and dwindle Lexington's fighters and bombers without so much as being at a disadvantage. Also with the Enterprises 4 squadrons of 2 torpedo and 2 dive bombers she can damage/ships more effectively than the Lexington which only has 1 torpedo squadron (which gets prioritized into oblivion) and 2 dive bombers. Like seriously isn't this what is called "Pay to win" ?
Also, Moskva? Really? That thing has bad AA at best. It is not hard to take it out with any carrier
I agree that USN CV need love but the AP bombs are a bit overpowered You can see in history that they did good damage but never insta destroyed a ship Still I hope the Saipan will not get this AP bombs or would be unfair and even more OP to tier 5 ships that find themselves unhelped to fucking tier 9 planes
Can those bombs bounce?
wow that amagi at 18:54
I’m buying this thing so fast if it goes on sale again
HA! R.I.P. Hood as well!
I really have to agree with iChase on this one, its no fun to get insta deleted (I know I play cruisers) but German battleships are still to damn strong in the current meta, and the argument that they have bad dispersion and weak AP pen, doesn't really help when I as a cruiser I can lose between 13000/15000 HP from only a signal Citadel hit just down to RNG, which can be up to 1/2 my HP ill add.
So yes I very cautiously welcome the Enterprise as it could just create another wave of passive BB meta should these bombs do so much damage (I.e 60000+ DMG) or maybe ill make them move I don't know. All in all i think that a high hit of around 40000 DMG would be acceptable as it shouldn't Insta delete but will punish lone BB's.
i citadel tier 8 cruisers in my kongo in a failplatoon
also only the tier 6 german BB and the tier 3 german BB are best in class the other tiers are pretty even between all the nations
don't agree with ichase, from someone who plays all ships why should dive bombers be able to do 30-50k damage to a ship where AA cover and team gameplay just isn't their, plus the lack of skill needed to drop bombs is poor if a battle ship one shots you its just very lucky rng or he waited for you to make a mistake and made a good shot at close or far range, If a dd hits you with 4 torps in a battleship you made a mistake,why not give every ship defensive aa? takes no skill to use but then the cv player would say its unbalanced, they should have ap bombs but with a max damage of 4000-5000 and be less accurate just like any dispersion shot in the game
CVS at high tier deal with enough AA as is. I play all classes. the issue with cv population at high tier is because of how much aa there already is. adding def aa would kill of the few stragglers in the cv playerbase. the game is too dull without cv changing things up and they would leave if they had to drop in def aa for panic spreads every time.
Oh my. German BBs get a hard counter and we are supposed to worry? Nah, there is nothing to worry about.
And here I was contemplating whether to buy the Tirpitz or not,
thanks for saving me $60 wargaming!
in short:
for beginners: grab Kaga
for intermediate: grab Saipan
for advanced: grab Enterprise
agreed?
The Tirpitz just got Tallboy'd!
I have faced the enterprise twice in my bismarck.......I have adopted convoy sailing because sweet fkn jeebus dem ap bombs. Find a friendly bb or 2 and a ca for good measure, that way they only shave off 10-20k a strike
Ah yes.... The Bane of my Mainly German Ship Fleet.
The NTR-prise. Cause she always steals victory from me.....
what about british CVs????
I love it everytime it goes and boom no more OP german BB and gernerally no more BB
This puts my German BB grind off for a while......
I was in the first match you showed here when you recorded it (LethalEn4cer) My nod to you at 8:09 :P
I am not a big BB player but I agree, this easy auto delete is not "fun" nor encouraging for BB players. That said, I had started playing the Bismark hoping to go T-10 but now, 4get it. Bad timing on my end...again .
One: German BBs can be citadeled if you know where to aim when you're in close and they most assuredly be citadeled from 15km or longer. So saying 'they cannot be citadeled' is not a correct statement iChase. All German BBs have a major Achilles' Heal, piss poor torpedo protection with the exception of tier 8, the rest have the worse protection in the remaining tiers. And now, WG decides to bring out these 1000lb armored piercing bombs with an oblong drop circle that barely clears the hull of a ship meaning nearly all of them hit? And this is balanced? This is the final reason that cemented my giving up on this game completely. GJ WG, GJ! Idiots.
15:37 OOOOUCH! hahaha. Nice drop.
11:40 that tirptiz just got deleted
Sorry 15:39
A super balanced P4W as always, even if you aren't a German BB player if you ask me.
Shaka kuchiki how did it become p4w to you, all i see is how underpowered it is compared to other CVs, only better than the Lexington AND NOTHING ELSE EVEN THE FUCKING SAIPAN. Sure the one hit kill is OP, how about turning your rudder a bit eh? Or stick to other ships LIKE YOU ARE SUPPOSED TO DO? The Enterprise is seriously a disappointment. Kinda hope for a cool gimmick like torp and dive bombers are taken from the same pool of air planes LIKE THEY DID IN THE WAR FOR THE YORKTOWN CLASS AIRCRAFT CARRIERS.
Cause i've played against CVs bastars all this week AND FUCKING TEAMS who DOESN''T try anything and just run all the match, and now IMAGINE THIS SHIT.. i mean this SHIP GIOING FULL ATTACK as always. and the other CV same so doesn't do his work, yeah i tried to " turn my rudder" guess what happened? i just lose the half of my HP, now imagine with this ship, motivate the active gameplay? yeah sure, you can guess what's going to happend and how balanced gonna be 1 attack 1 kill on CVs... oh wait they can do that actually, no just wait for AP bombs, which are available on this ship.
Shaka kuchiki Stick with your teammates and you won't be a prime target for cv drops then.
That's the problem dude, everybody (at least those weeks that i've been playing more often) at BB distance and just running, so you can't push and staying with them to survive is join to the problem, now with the potential "1 shot-kill" just imagine.
Shaka kuchiki Unfortunately you can't always help having potatoes on your team. Of course if cvs are really being problematic I would recommend playing in or platooning with AA ships and AA specialized captains.
While the Moskva armor has the potential of arming the AP bombs, no reasonable player will send T7 planes against a T10 cruiser, please iChase think about.
People on the internet are not reasonable. It will happen and you will get unlucky. Wargaming wills it.
I got a fix for BBs. Stick together you fools. You have armor, your big, strong I get it. But you’re nothing to the aircraft carrier, stick together and your odds of surviving against them are higher.
I got hit for 19K in one drop the only time I ran into an Enterprise in my Bismarck. No sir, I didn't like it. On the other hand, it does make my NC & Iowa more competitive which I can't say I mind. What's bad for one is good for another....
German nerf is expected , now buff all the soviet ship