How To Install An Exterior GFCI Outlet
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- Опубліковано 31 жов 2023
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I will walk you through the complete process of installation for an exterior GFCI-rated outlet. Specifically, this example includes how to handle brick/masonry walls but we will also touch on if your home has vinyl siding. I will also include feedback on the use of conduit as compared to Romex.
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This is exactly what I'm getting ready to do tomorrow. My house has the exact same layout from what you showed. The only difference is I'm going with the non-snag weather proof rubber grommet on the back and I'll caulk the for some extra water proofing. What really helped me here is that masonry bit you showed for the hole itself. You turned to towards Wagos in the past as well! Thank you for the great content!
We do this type of install almost weekly. 2 things you are doing wrong. Drill your pilot hole from the inside for more accurate placement in the basement and number 2 we always use a service entrance connector for a water tight connection on the rear of the exterior box. We do not use Romax connectors at that point they’re not waterproof.
I appreciate the feedback 👍
Now I gotta google "service entrance connector"
Technically you’re gonna wanna use UF cable as well with those se connectors. Romex isn’t rated for exterior applications. 🤔
@@protoman247you’re right but everyone still does it
You know me
Scott, I noticed you used a TR GFCI in this installation. I own a horse boarding farm and I figured out a long time ago that TR receptacles not only protect kids, but they eliminate spiders/bugs getting inside the slots, so that's all I use around my barns.
Tamper resistant outlets are required for residential applications. On the exterior it also needs to be weather resistant. The proper device in his application is a TWR outlet.
Since I live in a location that often has ground tremors and although it is not required, I consider it a best practice to use a short piece of PVC conduit to prevent scaffing when pulling or due to vibration.
When mounting a box to an exterior wall, I also consider it a best practice to put a 180 degree loop of silicone over the top of the hole behind the box. This further insures water will not penetrate behind the box and corrode terminals or damage structure.
Experience has taught me to put a loop in the NM before stapling so that, down the road, if I need to reroute for other wiring, I have the slack to do so.
Literally posted an hour before I'm getting ready to do something similar and was just looking for ways to mount electrical on the exterior correctly. Thank you!
Are you still alive?
@@jltaco85something came up and I didn't get to finish, but I've done similar electrical work and this isn't that out of my wheelhouse. I just haven't done too much exterior mounting/waterproofing before so I was looking for that part.
@@antaholics lol i was joking.
We used Jefferson Electric for our Solar installation and were very happy with their work.
Nice Video a couple of thoughts. Measure off of the top of the window then shifted the box to accommodate centering for the brick and clearance above the sill plate. You could have also mounted the box horizontal which would have picked up that inch you are short . Also I use conduit through the wall which would have reduced the exterior whole size . Lastly always covered the rear of the box with some silicone chalking around the conduit penetration prior to assembly as added protection. JMT Keep up the good work .
Thanks for the feedback, I appreciate it 👍
I never trust anyone who spells 'hole' as 'whole.'
@@diceonamay
I bet autocorrect got him.
RE:goodtimes2654. Would you use metal or pvc conduit and would you put something on the interior end of the conduit to protect the NM?
I think you need to use WR (weather resistant) outlet outside.
This is incredible timing, I was just searching for this thing through your channel a few days ago
You mentioned needing the 2nd receptacle from the junction box due to the NEC requirement for at least two 15amp receptacles on a 20amp circuit. It's been my understanding that the GFCI having 2 receptacle outlets meets that requirement. (CAVEAT: I am not a licensed electrician but am very experienced with electrical work and much of the code.) Like the other poster mentioned, I recommend confirming the GFCI function with the test buttons on BOTH the receptacle and the tester. (I think most modern testers have the button.) Keep up the great work. You have some great videos!
Correct. As defined by Article 100 of NFPA 70 (NEC 2023), duplex receptacles are multiple receptacles. A note follows the definition of receptacle to specifically indicate that duplex receptacles are an example of multiple-receptacles. The receptacle rating for duplex receptacles can therefore be read from Table 210.21(B)(3) "Receptacle Ratings for Circuits Serving More Than One Receptacle or Receptacle Outlet", which allows 15 or 20 amp receptacles on a 20 amp branch circuit.
You are correct
It is strange that 15a graded receptacle on 20a breaker. What about wire gauge? Is it 12awg since it’s on 20amp breaker. Thanks
@@tipstricksreviews4481 Yes. 12 gauge because it's on a 20 amp breaker.
Since you had to notch the floor joist. I highly recommend you go back and drill out the corners. Make the corners rounded instead of at a 90° angle. When rounded, it minimizes the chances of the wood splinting away in the future.
good point 👍
I would use liquid-tight flex conduit from the exterior box and run it to a handy box (or your 4x4) mounted on the interior floor joist. Connect the NM cable to the interior box - strip out some wire from your NM cable and run to your exterior box - wire as usual. You could use regular flex conduit since you're sealing your exterior box. My thoughts.
There's a few recommendations I'd like to make. 1) always use the ears in wet locations like that. The screws through the back are for damp location only.
2) always seal your penetration through the wall both inside and out. This prevents water seepage, helps maintain the climate controlled space, and prevents bug entry.
3) although there's an exception for short runs through wet locations, best practice is to use a wet location rated cable like UF here. Best practice is to sleeve it through the wall as well.
4) if there's more than 3 NM and/or UF cables running through the same hole you have to derate the cable.
5) although not all holes require it, for the longevity of the floor you should always sister up a reinforcement board at all knotches and holes through a floor joist.
6) in that location the gfci outlet need to be of the TRW (TRWR) type. It should have WR marked on its face.
He also needs to seal the threads of the top plug for the electrical box, or water WILL get in. You need to apply caulk to the threads and then screw the plug in. Simply smearing caulk over the top of the plug without caulking the threads only works temporarily, as the exposed caulk will deteriorate and eventually let water in again.
@@benhartley9015 Teflon tape would do as well and deteriorates less than caulk.
@@benhartley9015 Silicone, not caulk, no thread sealant needed.
There's no exception for NM through wet locations in short runs. In this install, no part of the cable is in a wet location so it's a moot point.
More than 1 NM cable requires derating, 2 current carrying conductors per cable (assuming 14-2, 12-2, etc.), but only in lengths longer than 24" or when run through wood framing and sealed with foam, insulation, etc. Even then, because NM is already using the 60C column, derating doesn't change anything until you have 10 or more current carrying conductors.
@@pld8993 there was an exception for short runs like this. We were allowed to run Romex in conduit on the exterior for a time. Then it was declared a wet location in that exterior conduit. Then they added an exception to cover situations like this. The code can and does change throughout the years.
I always specified metal in-use covers on my projects, contractors would install the plastic ones, which they then got to change. One contractor was so bold to tell me they don't make metal ones, I then told him to go to HD and get one.
Most hand-stripping tools have a numbered index that lets you neatly cut electric machine thread screws. That allows you to make a much smaller wall hole for your clamp.......try it.
Void in a concrete block wall means downward through the middle of a standard block wall, not through holes drilled in the sides. I suspect you would need to sleeve the NM where it enters and exits.
Also, you should have stapled the cable closer to the box (within 12”). And I like to confirm the gfci function with both the test button on the receptacle and the tester.
Hey Scott, I'm a big fan of your videos. Home Depot has 1/2 and 3/4 service entrance connectors. I think keeping the hole smaller would be better in my situation so Ill probably pick the 1/2. My plan is to drill the 1/2 hole through my wall+stucco from the inside out from an inside outlet hole to draw the power from that. And then attach the box on the outside. Any tips on drilling through the wall+stucco?
Hi Scott just wanted to add per your point about the multiple 15A on a 20A circuit:
Even a single 15A duplex is fine, because it's two outlets. The only time you have to do the 20A on 20A thing is if it's a SINGLE outlet on the yoke.
There are hundreds maybe over a thousand exceptions to the NEC. You are permitted to use a single 15 amp receptacle using #14 guage copper NM cable and have it ona 20 amp circuit breaker if the starting current ( some call it locked rotor current ) is high such as in air conditioners & air compressors..Term " Romex" never was or never will be in the ( NEC ) vode book.
@@JohnThomas-lq5qp You're not allowed to do this with cord and plug connected equipment. You are thinking of the motor loads rule, which allows you to size for MCA/MOP, but it doesn't apply to receptacles - which have specific limits. Also, who mentioned Romex?
@@HarrisonFrith-cr4ie Had to install a 20 amp circuit breaker on a single receptacle that was feed by #14 copper wire. Couple of times on old window air conditioners that probably drew close to 12 amps but would occasionally trip a 15 amp breaker when compressor started up. Also had to do the same on an air compressor. Customer had pressure switch to shut off at 150# air pressure. When he started it up first time in the morning there was no air pressure and it could run until bring satisfied with 150# of air pressure but when pressure switch called for air with 135# in tank would often trip a 15 amp circuit breaker on start up.
I've never seen a micro inverter like that used to put power into house not sure how that one works.
but i have panels on roof and they required a lot of special hookups and a specific inverter that reads power from house and syncs with it on voltage and frequency as well as shutting off in a power outage, so it does not back feed to power lines in an outage while they are working on lines.
I'm really a novice, but I worked with an electrician for several months. Even as a carpenter, I remember that holes should be drilled within about 18" from the joist support point. Drilling further away from that support not only tends to weaken the joist, but I believe that it is against code.
In a cubby I have been installing a new 20a outdoor power outlet for a car 🚗 port for an electric fan
I would referenced the top of the window to measure to the midway of the joist. Then drill the hole from outside with that measurement.
Very helpful. Thank you.
From outside I would have drilled a large hole first in the first part of the brick and then with the pilot bit, at an angle go thru the back part of the brick at an angle going up to reach the center of the joist or about. I would also fill the hole from inside with expanding foam to keep insects and cold air from coming in. Lastly I would have put a bead of caulking around the big hole in the brick before screwing the box on the wall, kind of belt and suspenders with the outside caulk around the box.
Also, I would disable the hammer function on the drill since this is a kind of soft clay brick, the carbide bit beeing sharp enough to cut and prevent a breakthrough in the back even if it takes a few minutes more..
Yeah, that might have been a good move 👍. This type is very brittle especially when using a rotary hammer drill.
Nice CT camps in that box. Can you do a video on that?
Great Video. Thank you for sharing
You bet!
Scott, thanks for the video. I like the video, but have a suggestion. I would like to see you caulk the back of the box before securing it to the wall, and I think you should have caulked the inside of the box where the wire is coming in to the box. Also, you should check the instructions on the box, one of the ones I previously installed required caulking of the plugs.
Also, check with Joel but I am pretty sure a duplex receptacle is considered multiple outlets, therefore it is ok to have a 20A circuit breaker supply one outlet box with a 15A duplex receptacle installed, since there are 2 outlets to plug into.
The notch of the bottom of the joist seemed like a clever trick that should pass inspection.
You are the goat 🐐 of home repairs
It is recommended to seal using silicone or other products so water can not get in behind the box and enter the house or box but around the top will work but should be check every year.
the bugs and cold air will get in the bottom with just caulking three sides like he did.
@@ranger178 The reason you do not caulk the bottom is to allow any leakage or condensation to drain out. For the romex hole you could use a thick O-ring or a wad of silicone to prevent water/bugs from entering.
A parts / shopping list would be helpful... I think I found the kit you used: TAYMAC MKG420CS
A duplex receptacle is 2 outlet and 1 15 amp receptacle on a 20 amp circuits compliant.
where can I get those yellow covers for the main lugs on my older QO electrical panel that did not come with them
The forces put on a joist are greatest at its outer edges. The top of the joist is in compression and the bottom is in tension. As you move from the top of the joist to the center of the joist the amount it is in compression moves to zero. As you move from the bottom of the joist to the center of the joist the tension forces move from its highest value to zero. So essentially, the center of the joist is where the forces are zero, thus making it the idea location to drill holes as it does not compromise the integrity of the joist. Making cuts at the top or bottom of the joist maximally compromises its integrity. Even making holes off from the center can reduce the strength of the joist depending on where the hole is. It's possible to turn a joist from a 2x10 to a 2x8 by doing what you did there with that notch. Depending on the loads placed on that joist, you may have greatly compromised the strength of that joist and any walls or flooring that depend on it. Same rule applies to studs, rafters or trusses. This is why plumbers and electricians should always drill through the center of the wood they need to drill through. And the smaller the hole, the better. In this case I would have put the outlet one more block higher in order to get it through the middle of the joist.
Yes. You can lookup online or get a framers guide telling you where you can drill within a joist. But NEVER NEVER NEVER folks notch a joist. That severely compromises the joist. If it was new construction and an electrician notched a joist, the inspector would require it to be replaced or sistered. This fellow would have been much better looping the cable under the joist. Only cables 5 feet from the ground and less need protection. Nothing would damage the cable up there running under the joist.
With all that void in the concrete block, one could have drilled upward from the outside through the big hole to make a 'Romex' hole in the floor joist, well above the bottom.
Is there a reason the 'Romex' cable had to be level going through the wall?
Duplex outlets count as having 2 receptacles for the purposes of using 15A outlets on 20A circuits
Yep, a duplex receptacle is literally two receptacles. But a lot of people casually think of and call it just one.
My understanding of code is that a second GCI on that circuit is certainly allowed but is not required. A duplex receptacle is two receptacles, so a single 15 amp duplex is actually acceptable on a 20 amp circuit. I just tend to install 20 amp receptacles on 20 amp circuits because other than the few dollars of extra cost, I can't think of a good reason not to, and more versatility down the line with the sorts of devices I can power could prove useful one day.
Question: this is a home built pre 1950 (darkness of the joists & wooden posts), it uses 2x6’s for the floor joists, is this your residence and if it is, why would you buy with this small of a joist? Thanks!
Went to your Amazon store, saw 2 different boxes but didn't see the front cover. Was it just not listed yet?
Im in the us when i did mine i used 12-2 out door wire
Would this be any different for a hot-hot-ground 30amp 230v run?
you don't need multiple outlets to run 15-amp outlets on 20-amp circuit since it is a duplex outlet it is already 2 outlets only if you ran just a single outlet would it need to be 20 amp.
I would put caulk behind the box so water, bugs, cold air etc. does not get in at wire clamp and if you are going to run a short piece of wire out to box anyway you might want to make it outdoor cable, so the paper does not get wet. might want to put some kind of sealant on the threads of the knockout screw in covers since water can seep in on top one.
The plastic recessed box does not hold those in use outdoor covers very well to house for a seal and some covers will hit wall and not be easy to open all the way if flush to wall.
You could have mounted that box an inch higher and not have had to notch out the floor joist. (Unless you’re trying to match the height of an existing outlet) but I would have centered the outlet vertically on that block.
Also, you forgot to show the circuit breaker connections
Im confused,the bare ground of the feeder coming into the box should be run through the ground screw first whether its a branch or dedicated circuit. This is a serious pet peeve of most inspectors and an indication of experience. Why run it to a Wago then back to the ground screw with a Shepard hook? I dont see the reason behined it,or am I missing something?
Thanks!
Loomed in block is just fine in east coast Canada.
Generally we run wire below joists with staples. Just the most common method here.
Can’t do that in the US unless you run a raceway board to staple the NM to.
people go to finish basement then and put drywall over the wires everyone follows different codes but that is pretty old idea to not put wires in basement over joists but through middle instead.
I was actually taught to drill through joists, and only adopted stapling underneath once I started my own jobs.
Different areas, slightly different rules. Pretty cool to compare.
Something strange on this video is passing the wire near the mains. That is illegal in local resi builds.
It recently came to my attention that not all gfi outlets work with current flowing in either or both directions. In some cases, the test button won't work while backfeeding power, and sometimes it might even damage the receptacle. Just something to consider before trying to backfeed through a gfi receptacle...
For a test, I would have just used an extension cord to an inside outlet, or installed a power inlet on a transfer switch.
I’m very disappointed that you talk so much about code and then totally ignore it.
that whole micro inverter seems fishy i have a solar panel on roof setup and it requires a lot of special wiring in house. the inverter has to be able to read voltage and frequency to precisely match the power companies' voltage and be in sync for frequency as well as shut off in case of a power outage, so you don't energize lines back to pole when they are working on them.
That box will get water in it. If silicone is not applied to the top screw. Also my electrician instructor told me he had his guys drill a 1/8” hole at the bottom of the box for if any water will get in.
Is the cable clamp 100% necessary? Yesterday i got everything i need to install a few exterior outlets but i didn't get any cable clamps.
On any entrance from a conditioned space (inside) to and unconditioned space (outside) you would need to put on some duct seal per code also use a weatherproof cord grip other than that good job
Duct seal needed only if using a raceway, not for a cable. The connector does not need to be weatherproof because it is inside the wall.
Doesn’t a 15A duplex GFCI receptacle already satisfy multiple outlet requirement for being on a 20A circuit?
Correct. As defined by Article 100 of NFPA 70 (NEC 2023), duplex receptacles are multiple receptacles. A note follows the definition of receptacle to specifically indicate that duplex receptacles are an example of multiple-receptacles. The receptacle rating for duplex receptacles can therefore be read from Table 210.21(B)(3) "Receptacle Ratings for Circuits Serving More Than One Receptacle or Receptacle Outlet", which allows 15 or 20 amp receptacles on a 20 amp branch circuit.
What makes a waterproof seal between the box and the cement? There’s a big hole in your block going into your basement but I don’t see any seal.
All the way at the end of the video I used 100% silicone to seal things up 👍
I would still use Conduit, even though code does not not require it. Code is only for MINIMUM Protection; you do not want that NM cable to have any possibility to be nicked by that masonry.
What outlet mount did you use? I’m having a difficult time finding one such as the one you’re using without it being from some sketchy Chinese website.
NEC states “more than 1 15 amp receptacle.” A duplex, including GFCIs is 2 receptacles. Also, sealing the actual penetration (hole) is more code compliant.
Thanks for the feedback!
I would also try and thread the wire through the pipe at the panel rather then have a single wire going to the panel. This would have made a neighter job. Especially when this is inspected when selling the house.
1. I would have sealed/waterproofed the back of the box against the masonry block. As installed it looks like water would run down the exterior wall, between the exterior box and the wall, and then get inside the block penetration and wall cavity; causing problems later.
2. I also would have used conduit from the panel up into the floor joist cavity as a minimum.
3. I never would have notched the bottom of a floor joist; pretty sure that will be a structural problem later with future home inspections (if the home is ever for sale).
As far as item 1, evidently you didn't watch to the end of the video. 13:58
not a very helpful seal if bugs and air can get in at bottom and i would have sealed the screw in knockouts.@@JCWren
@@JCWrenthanks for the call out, I missed that the first time….
I like the nail plate idea, yet the "sharp edges" concerns me. Even a thin piece of wood would prevent any possible (though doubtful) cutting of the wire. Some rubber wrapped around the wire would take care of it.
Just did this recently. I used the same metal box as you did and had issues fitting the bulky GFCI in the box even though I used Wago connectors. I used gray PVC 1/2" threaded male adapter through the center hole of the box and ended up having to cut the threads sticking out into the box with a rotary tool. Those boxes are horrible and my opinion not deep enough for a standard sized GFCI Also at your service panel all the wires that come into the top of the box should be stapled within 12" maybe add a 2 x 6 under those wires.
That box is called a Bell box. They do make a deeper version, which is ideal for GFCIs.
I would have installed a short piece of conduit through the masonry. Would have taken less time than all the talk about it.
But, when installing screws through the inside of the box, would sealing washers have been required (or a good idea) to prevent moisture from entering the box? I have never seen these boxes that could be mounted from inside screws, only tabs on the outside.
Yes, if you don't do this you should use outdoor rated cable to to protect it from chafing against the masonry.
I would have put a few inches of conduit with a right-angled fitting, though I would have considered myself ridiculous for doing so. I would also use Fischer or Rawl plugs in that brick, instead of Tapcon, since it's so brittle.
I would use a conduit pipe through the brick coated with polyurethane on the outside before sliding it in to seal it, and then a waterproof service connector for Romex to the box. If you could not drill from inside out and made that drill mistake with the small hole when drilling from outside in, I would have filled the first hole with some sort of cement sealer and moved up right then and drilled a new hole in the right spot. I think I'd rather have a filled bad drill hole than notch out that floor joist like that. Not sure with spacing how you could drill from inside with that big drill though but I bet some smart guy knows here.
i just thread conduit right into box then you just use regular 3/4 masonry bit to make hole to put conduit through and have clamp on inside house.
Re: 15A outlets on a 20A breaker -- a strict reading of the code (I don't remember the section, sorry) indicates that you can install a single 15A duplex receptacle on a 20A circuit, because the two receptacles on the face count as... multiple receptacles. Of course, your local inspector may interpret that differently.
is there a reason you didn't use the 4x4 box in the basement to mount the GFCI and then use the load terminals for standard WR rated duplex receptacles? I did something along these lines when I put outdoor outlets on my house as the unfinished basement also needed some more outlets.
He probably got a kit that comes with the box, in-use cover, and a WR-rated GFCI receptacle. You save a good 20% versus buying all those components separately. Also, you really do want your GFCI receptacles outside where, if it trips, you can reset it right there-not have to go inside the house down to the basement.
yeah, our local code people want you to use gfi breakers now rather than outlets which is a real pain to reset in basement all the time@@aaron74
I would used a piece of conduit in the bricks topped with a LB. Is what I would have done. Since the whole looks wide enough for this application.
Why didn't you mount it one brick row up? That would have saved you the notch and nail plate on the very bottom of the joist, also the NM would have been more concealed vs. looking like it just got squeezed up in there.
I have to agree with TomCee53. It seems like the entry/exit of masonry **should** need sleeving- and if NEC doesn't call for it- just add it because they will a few years later.
He screwed up his measurement... and yes mechanical protection is needed when going threw a block wall
No silicone behind the box? The romex connection isn’t water proof just curious if the box will fill up over time
box will get moisture in it anyway. those flimsy gaskets that come with In use covers fail, tear etc let moisture in. we drill drain holes in our exterior boxes, silicone or R391 Weatherproof Electrical Putty on the back of the box around peneration
You only need a duplex 15a outlet to be to code on a 20a breaker. Not multiple devices. Just no single Simplex outlet.
In-use covers for exterior receptacles are actually required by code now, I think.
yeah, and a lot of places are even requiring metal in use covers over plastic ones now. depends on what code they follow.
masondry?
No seal putty, or silicone behind the box, or in the hole? The rain could just run down the wall and line, into the basement?
Yeah, I think Silicone or duct seal would be a good idea. You will see I added Silicone here ua-cam.com/video/i4HBc-LfYP8/v-deo.htmlsi=_8kJb_g5zdgVP_cM&t=839
If you ran conduit through the brick, would you still need a wire nut at the box? If so, how would you install the wire nut?
he couldve used the proper connector for an exterior box. We run 1/2 pvc with 1/2 male adapter into back of Bell boxes. or we use liquid tight strain relief connectors. romex connector installed in the Bell box backwards - the clamping side facing in the box eats up space
I have two points that lean toward your not using conduit through the drilled hole. 1. 2017 NEC 334.10 (A)(2). NM shall be permitted to be installed or fished in air voids in mason army block or tile walls. A drilled hole is not an air void in the block. It was not made with the hole you drilled. NMC uses do not apply since you did not use it. 2. 334.12 Uses not permitted. 334.12(B) 14:43 NM shall not be used under following conditions or locations. (4) In Wet or damp locations. The exterior wall outside is a wet location. If you have a large overhang, it would be a damp location. According to Article 100 Definitions Location, Wet in unprotected locations exposed to weather is a wet location. NM can not be installed in a wet location. In the handbook, the inside of a raceway in a wet location is considered a wet location.
So, no conduit is not legal through drilled holes in masonry, and putting a conduit through the hole to the box in a wet location can not have NM installed either. Must be NMC or UF.
The NM cable is entirely within the wall and basement so uf is not required a since it is not installed in a wet location.
You didn't caulk the tapcons. Don't all box intrusions have to be sealed?
Style point: keep the GFCI inside. Use a WR/TR outlet outside. Good job overall.
Can you use Wago nuts outdoors in a waterproof box? I am about to do a similar project with a GFCI before a lamp post.
That shouldn’t be a problem.
Yep, won’t be an issue 👍.
We were told at an IAEI continuing education class that is NEVER legal yo run type MM cable to any outdoor location .All outdoor locations are considered either wet or damp locations. Type NM cable ls not approved for damp locations.Told us we must use tupe UF cable .
You can run NM up to an outdoor location but you cannot run it within an outdoor location. The entire cable is in the wall and basement, uf not required here.
Probably a dumb question, but would you have to ground the metal junction box cover? I know you are supposed to bond metal junction boxes, just don't know if it would apply to a cover if the junction box is plastic.
If you used a metal cover on a plastic box, yes you'd have to ground the cover.
I’d think it good to not cut the bottom chord of the joist. Doing so weakens the joist. And I’m always concerned when NM wire is allowed to come into contact with any metal…even a nailer plate. I do enjoy your channel. This is my first time to comment.
Where is your duct seal behind the box?
I believe this would be a fail in Canada, for in "section 12 wiring methods", for Non-metallic-sheathed cable, 12-512 states: "Not to be Embedded: The cable shall not be buried in plaster, cement, or similar finish."
I would probably just do a PVC sleeve out the back of the box.
Love the channel! I’m new to electrical work, but my understanding is that NM cable is not permitted outdoors. Once you penetrated the masonry to run the NM cable outside, didn’t you go against code? Keep up the great work?
Thats all he does. is violate the code.
The entire NM cable is in the wall and basement.
@@pld8993 Correct me if this is wrong…but my understanding is that once a penetration has been made to an outside wall, it is considered a outside/wet location.
@@user-bp5wi6fl9m Inside the wall is not considered outside or a wet location. The inside of the wall ends at the outside wall surface.
Hi @@pld8993 . Thanks for your input. I’m trying to reconcile how NEC defines Wet Locations with your comments.
As I understand it, NEC defines wet locations as installations underground or in concrete slabs or masonry in direct contact with the earth; in locations subject to saturation with water or other liquids, such as vehicle washing areas; and in
Additionally,
NEC 334.12(B) USES NOT PERMITTED (TYPE NM)
Type NM cables shall not be used under the following conditions or in the following locations:
Where exposed to corrosive fumes or vapors
Where embedded in masonry, concrete, adobe, fill, or plaster
In a shallow chase in masonry, concrete, or adobe and covered with plaster, adobe, or similar finish
In wet or damp locations
So why didn't you go with 20 amp outlet if you installed a 20 amp breaker?
Since the brick is hollow, just make a hole in the joist and into the brick cavity the proper distance above the edge of the joist. It'll be a little trickier to fish the wire through the brick cavity, but then you won't have to notch the joist.
Since the joist was notched, it should be sistered with another (unnotched) 2x stock, glued and nailed to the joist above the notch. I'm not sure how far to each side of the notch is required to bear the load across the notch -- I'm not THAT much of an expert. And, rather than a notch, the cut should be tapered to distribute stress across the joist rather than focusing it in the corners of the notch.
a duplex receptacle is considered more than one
I had to listen twice where you talk about adding additional 15 amp outlets on a 20 amp circuit because you failed to mention that you still need 12 ga. wire. A little confusing but not incorrect.
In my opinion 16 inches of loose NM-B above the electrical panel is quite a bit and would be subject to damage. I'd put a threaded conduit nipple through the wall into the back of the box, in your case a 90 above the floor joist and an NM-B clamp. I usually try drilling the hole in the wall a bit higher.
In my opinion, as we allow cables to be exposed in the joists of basement ceilings then cable protection should be completely optional elsewhere in an unfinished basement. Side entry into an electrical panel offers a lot of advantages in keeping the panel interior neat and less cluttered with wires. And circuits can be more easily rearranged over the years if a house might go through an amount of remodeling. And I'd go further and say that I'd rather run cables under solid joists than drill a bunch of holes - if there is no intention to finish a basement. A well-maintained house may last a few hundred years and should be expected to have a lot of modifications in its lifetime. At times the code puts too much emphasis of safety for today and not enough on the safety of hundreds of years of change.
@@JasonEDragon sure, but people are clumsy with leaning stuff against walls. I grew up in a municipality which didn't allow any exposed NM-B in floor joists.
@@nicholassmerk On a wall of my basement I have a Generac whole house transfer switch, 2 subpanels, and an area for phone, cable, ethernet, and camera connections. There were at least 6 big upgrades that shifted things around over the past 40 years and it is tinkered with almost every year. Perhaps in the future there could be some solar inverters and a battery or two. The code should not make things less maintainable just to avoid an unlikely problem. A person could just as easily try to lean something tall up between 2 joists in the ceiling and damage some cables. In my experience, the more difficult you make something to repair the less likely a homeowner will repair it when needed.
Think of all the staples that are placed on electrical wiring. What if we had something like the UK had with their "green goo" cables - where the cables that were made for a few years turned out to degrade sooner than expected and had to be replaced. Much of their wiring could be replaced by lifting floorboards. We would have to rip out much of the drywall in a house.
i would have drilled my hole a bit higher to go through the wood rather then the concrete. Just to make a more secure job, I would use conduit connected to the outside box. Rather be safe then sorry.
There is code and above code.
With that said, I would've rather spent a couple extra dollars to put a Liquidtight fitting on the back of the exterior box, with some sealant around it.
As it stands, water can still go down the exterior wall and get between the wall and the box sitting on top of the non-exterior rated cable, clamp, and that water can freeze and thaw an end up, causing damage to the brick around it.
Just because it's not "necessitated "in code does not mean you can't take the extra step to prevent any water getting into the foundation.
I acknowledge that you put some sealant around the box for that purpose. However, overtime if that were to shrink up or tear having the liquid tight fitting is an extra level of protection, and the fitting by itself, does not count as "running NM cable quote through conduit .
Should’ve went up another course
why install outlet upside down?
WR designation on the unit?
Yep 👍
If you want it more waterproof, use a Underground Feeder (UF) Cable Connector on the back of the box.
I would have applied a half circle of silicone on the top back of the box to prevent water from coming into the box.
its going get moisture in there anyway. exterior boxes are subject to temperature changes, humidity. cant tell you how many exterior boxes Ive found at our complex where even with every possible leak point sealed up tight as a drum, moisture still got in
I think I would have started with a pilot hole through the floor joist first
The issue with that especially on this type of brick is the blow out it causes which is definitely not desired on the outside.
@@EverydayHomeRepairs FWIW, the way that I handle that personally is with 3 bits. First is a 1/8" x 16" masonry bit that I use to drill a pilot hole. You're going to get blowout with that, but it's fine, the larger holes will cover them up. Once that's drilled, step up to something like a 1/2" or 3/4" bit to drill that out, but only go half way through on each side before going all the way through to avoid blowout. Repeat that process with the final size. Takes a bit longer, but the holes are clean with no blowout.
Thanks for the feedback Dan 👍
The Excellent Labourer sent me
My understading of code (I reread) is that because you are using a duplex outlet you dont actually need a 2nd outlet. You didnt do this- but I think folks should not silicon underneath the box because thats how any trapped water drains out
I think you are correct on not needing the 2nd outlet. Thanks for the feedback!
Something I was totally confused on for a while with my existing installation. Hence the research. I dont know why the NEC allows this rather than just having 20 amp rated receptacles multiple or single , but hey it does. @@EverydayHomeRepairs
Did you drill holes in the outdoor box to mount it? I don't ever recall seeing holes in an outdoor rated box, usually they have lugs.
some will have dimples inside them meant to be drilled through. I refuse to use the wings , they just rust off anyway.
12:05 You said that you can install a 15amp receptacle onto a 20amp breaker. Technically, you already met that. By installing a duplex receptacle. So no need to install an other on the back of the house.
I know you will though. But I just wanted to make sure you’ve already met that code by installing a duplex receptacle.
Thanks for the feedback 👍
Is that outdoor rated romex?
Nope, just standard 12/2
Doesn't need to be, the cable is not outdoors
You have to build a chase above your panel. You can’t have exposed Romex like that