I discovered your channel last week and have been binge watching everything up till now. I wish I could do a project like this, I'm a fairly smart guy, but no where near how knowledgeable you are with all this stuff. Nor do I have the space or tools todo all this. For now, I will live vicariously through you.
You made the right choice on installing the lithium battery on the inside. This helps insure charging the battery within the correct temperature limits. Lithium batteries do not like extreme temperatures.
I've watched this at least 3 times. It's 1 of the most informative resources for this engine. Am seriously considering the NA Apex to replace the Jabiru 2200 on my Skystar Pulsar III. Thanks again.
Your build is really coming along well. The work you have done and have had done (engine mount) is beautiful. Thanks for the clarity of your videos and the sound that I can hear.
Wow Bryan, your kit fox is looking extraordinary. Such amazing attention to detail. I love the classic yellow highlight color. so much to take with this video.
That's a really clean looking engine install. Even the new engine mount looks cleaner than the prototype. I would like to point out that mandrel bent doesn't mean a single piece of tube, it means the tube was bent using an insert (mandrel) that keeps the inside radius of the bend from kinking during the bending process.
Great engine choice. I ride a 2004 Yamaha FZ1 which has a similar version of that engine. Such smooth, linear power with decent mileage. Never though about using it in a plane or snow sled, but why not. I can’t wait to her this fly on a future video.
I'm late to the Apex venture but trying to catch up. I'm currently building an Europa XS and one of my biggest holdups in considering the Apex is the engine mount. If there was one that interfaced like the Rotax 912 ring mount I'd be rocking! Exciting to see these engines, that cost a lot less, make there way into the aviation world. - Found you from GRT's website and now I'm on a subscriber.
Kick ass engine.. I had 2003 R1 and I put it on a dino and it put out 158 HPs to the ground not crank.. Totally stock... Minus the letter of oil I dumped out for the stock Dino compation I entered and won that year hehe.. Total monster of a engine for its time.
You mentioned on the battery putting the screws in from the bottom so they can’t hit your feet. Traditionally aircraft have tried to make sure that the screw can’t fall out of the hole even if the nut falls off. So they would’ve put the screw in from the top. Other than that, a nice looking project.
Such a cool video. I have an FJR1300 which has a YZF-R1 type engine. Runs like a dream. Valve lifters are a bit noisy. Other than that, absolutely zero complaints!
Love the build. Hey just a quick thought. If you have a false lean condition at idle or a certain rpm range, the wide band O2 sensor might be too close to the exhaust outlet.
Looks awesome, I would like to see how many can go 1,000 plus hours of dependable service in an aircraft application. The power demands of an airplane are a lot more constant and heavy. Lets see how well a snow machine/ motorcycle engine holds up under the demanding HP output conditions of aviation use.
Yamaha is always been first and that goes with watercraft, they were first with the 4 stroke waverunner 2002 FX 140 that was the MR1 motorcycle engine and with the 1800 which I guess is the same in aircraft as in their FX SVHO and GP 1800 Waverunners. Its a proven engine that you can trust your life with. I have yet to see under normal and extreme use ever have a failure and even abused engines I have never seen failures.
Looking good! Been nice to get insights into some of the intricacies of building. Just curios though, wouldn't it be better to have the battery rotated 180 degrees for easy access to the terminals from the inside? Maybe you have plans for an access panel? ***NOTE*** My question does come from ignorance. I have not built a plane and have little hours in one. :) Keep the great videos coming! Thanks for the time invested in making them! CHEERS!
The engine looks great after you cleaned it up and painted the valve cover! Did you paint the block too, or just polish the aluminum? If its just polished aluminum, what did you do to get it cleaned up?
I would look at how Lithium iron batteries fail, some folks put them in the cabin but they have a box that vents to the outside in case the battery goes TU. I'm for sure putting mine FWF, but it'll be a Shorai.
9:40 How do you access battery terminals after you put skin on the plane? Why not orient the battery so terminals face toward center of plane? In attempt to keep starter cables shortest possible, could battery be placed on right side of aircraft interior? Above passengers feet?
The cowling can be removed to access the battery or 4 screws from underneath removed and the battery slides out. I could flip it around, but there is a charging lead off it as well.
Epic episode! Thanks for the insight on airplane engines for a Kitfox. I did thought that this came originamlly from a motorcycle. Will the rpm be also in the range of an R1? Thanks for sharing your epic journy.
I can see this mill being used in a small hot rod, like a Ford Pop, Austin 7, Fiat Topolino, Fiat 500, or something similar. Who’s thinking of something like this?
Few thoughts, I assume that at any time you could add a second earth battery on the right side if you wanted redundancy power. Also not sure of the elevation in your local High Sierra's if you run that amex engine without a turbo in remote Idaho with the altitude and mountainous terrain will you have climbing power? Also was you fusalage as I recall is a FF4 or 5 and I'm wondering if your wing is an STi?
It is a Kitfox 7 airframe. Redundant power can be added latter, but with the iPad as the back up screen it already has an internal battery. Since the Kitfox is designed for 100hp at sea level, tThe APEX with 160hp at sea level will do great at altitude. A turbo can always be added to maintain that 160hp at altitude at the expense of weight and complexity and of course the cost. I expect a solid 135hp at 9-10,000 feet
Is it possible to achieve the same result by using a road engine in place of the snowmobile engine ?. if so where can i find information. thanks and congratulations for the work you do
@@BowenAero thanks for the explanation, but unfortunately in Italy the sun gives so that there are not many snowmobiles and many low-priced motorcycles
No need for that. The CG will be right on. This firewall forward will weigh about the same as a Rotax 914 install. My model 5 with the Lycoming was 80 lbs heavier on the nose and I had the battery in the tail to help along with the forward wing sweep.
Why not use the Twin1160 cc turbo 4 stroke 160 hp by Suzuki witch I believe is Yamaha apex 2012 to 2016. Just wondering you can get them brand new for around $ 3400.00
I chose the Yamaha because of the proven history of its conversion to aviation. It has been used in gyrocopters for more then 10 years. A lot of the developments came from the gyro guys and the gearbox is made by SkyTrax, which is Teal Jenkins, a gyro guy. I’m sure there are other engines that could make a good conversion, but you would be starting over from scratch. The APEX already has a good track record and vendor support.
@@BowenAero I knew most of that I am looking for alternitive engine's that you can buy in a crate option since from what I understand you cannot buy an apex like the one you are using brand new or am I wrong
@@woodyahh2110 I think that is why the sidewinder may end up being the future engine of choice. Teal has designed a gearbox and Bryan Dacus is working on a tune using the AEM ECU.
There is no reason why a snowmobile engine shouldn't work well in a aircraft. They are both designed to be run max rpm for long periods of time. If the sled engine is only has half as good as the motorcycle engine engine it should last forever. Nice conversion.
Here is the video of the removal of the engine from the sled ua-cam.com/video/M3HVOuaJP58/v-deo.html and here is the gear box install ua-cam.com/video/W-8isSUiLnQ/v-deo.html
What's the power consumption of those contactors, how many amps will be flowing through them on a normal basis? (Will the parasitic losses be excessive?)
Looking so good! I am just enjoying the last of my time when I can say I can takeoff shorter than you 😜
When I build my kitfox I plan on using a similar engine....
I discovered your channel last week and have been binge watching everything up till now. I wish I could do a project like this, I'm a fairly smart guy, but no where near how knowledgeable you are with all this stuff. Nor do I have the space or tools todo all this. For now, I will live vicariously through you.
Wow, really like the Yamaha install. That is a proper power unit, can’t wait to hear it fire up.
I’ve only see the first 30 seconds so far and already love it!!
You are doing a fantastic job! Thanks for sharing your insights. Can’t wait to see how it all turns out.
You made the right choice on installing the lithium battery on the inside. This helps insure charging the battery within the correct temperature limits. Lithium batteries do not like extreme temperatures.
I've watched this at least 3 times. It's 1 of the most informative resources for this engine. Am seriously considering the NA Apex to replace the Jabiru 2200 on my Skystar Pulsar III. Thanks again.
Your build is really coming along well. The work you have done and have had done (engine mount) is beautiful. Thanks for the clarity of your videos and the sound that I can hear.
Really excellent work. Always fun to peek into the garage of an expert at work.
Wow Bryan, your kit fox is looking extraordinary. Such amazing attention to detail. I love the classic yellow highlight color. so much to take with this video.
yellow and silver/gray. great combo.
Its been great following this build. Thanks for taking the time to put these videos together.
Loving this build! Beautiful work, Im so excited to see this thing start up.
Looking good
Need to put smoke in exhaust
That plane will be a head turner for sure !
That's a really clean looking engine install. Even the new engine mount looks cleaner than the prototype.
I would like to point out that mandrel bent doesn't mean a single piece of tube, it means the tube was bent using an insert (mandrel) that keeps the inside radius of the bend from kinking during the bending process.
Sigh, black & yellow are some of my fave colours too! That aircraft is beginning to look really good! Well done Bryan :)
Great engine choice. I ride a 2004 Yamaha FZ1 which has a similar version of that engine. Such smooth, linear power with decent mileage. Never though about using it in a plane or snow sled, but why not. I can’t wait to her this fly on a future video.
Very exciting, so looking forward to the next episode. Thank you very much Bryan
I'm late to the Apex venture but trying to catch up. I'm currently building an Europa XS and one of my biggest holdups in considering the Apex is the engine mount. If there was one that interfaced like the Rotax 912 ring mount I'd be rocking! Exciting to see these engines, that cost a lot less, make there way into the aviation world.
- Found you from GRT's website and now I'm on a subscriber.
Oh, I needed this, I needed this, I so, so needed this! No point in saying why.... 😉
Kick ass engine.. I had 2003 R1 and I put it on a dino and it put out 158 HPs to the ground not crank.. Totally stock... Minus the letter of oil I dumped out for the stock Dino compation I entered and won that year hehe.. Total monster of a engine for its time.
You mentioned on the battery putting the screws in from the bottom so they can’t hit your feet. Traditionally aircraft have tried to make sure that the screw can’t fall out of the hole even if the nut falls off. So they would’ve put the screw in from the top.
Other than that, a nice looking project.
Well, if they fall out I will see them this way, so win win. 🙂
Such a cool video. I have an FJR1300 which has a YZF-R1 type engine. Runs like a dream. Valve lifters are a bit noisy. Other than that, absolutely zero complaints!
Gonna be a pretty clean set up sir. Lookin good
Nice dance moves Bryan. Chippendale dancer may be in your future... lol Graet job. Kitfox is beautifel!!!
Man I really love your videos. Thanks for all the great content. My solo flight is in a couple days wish me luck.
Awesome and good luck.
Looking Great!
Wow nice job, Super clean install👍👍👍
Beautiful work brother...
Great job. Can you talk about the cost of the total parts and engine only. Thanks Tom
wow your very fortunate to be able to have a motor like this it looks delicious lol!!!!!!
Love the build. Hey just a quick thought. If you have a false lean condition at idle or a certain rpm range, the wide band O2 sensor might be too close to the exhaust outlet.
Looks awesome, I would like to see how many can go 1,000 plus hours of dependable service in an aircraft application. The power demands of an airplane are a lot more constant and heavy. Lets see how well a snow machine/ motorcycle engine holds up under the demanding HP output conditions of aviation use.
Dang this is getting real.... I'd be doing a dance too.... LoL 🤣😂🤣😂😜👍
Yamaha is always been first and that goes with watercraft, they were first with the 4 stroke waverunner 2002 FX 140 that was the MR1 motorcycle engine and with the 1800 which I guess is the same in aircraft as in their FX SVHO and GP 1800 Waverunners. Its a proven engine that you can trust your life with. I have yet to see under normal and extreme use ever have a failure and even abused engines I have never seen failures.
you need a fuse right at the positive battery terminal
looking great Thanks for the Videos
Looking good! Been nice to get insights into some of the intricacies of building. Just curios though, wouldn't it be better to have the battery rotated 180 degrees for easy access to the terminals from the inside? Maybe you have plans for an access panel?
***NOTE*** My question does come from ignorance. I have not built a plane and have little hours in one. :)
Keep the great videos coming! Thanks for the time invested in making them!
CHEERS!
Good question, I am making the boot cowling removable so I’ll have access
@@BowenAero Cool deal. I wondered if that was the other option.
The engine looks great after you cleaned it up and painted the valve cover! Did you paint the block too, or just polish the aluminum? If its just polished aluminum, what did you do to get it cleaned up?
I would look at how Lithium iron batteries fail, some folks put them in the cabin but they have a box that vents to the outside in case the battery goes TU. I'm for sure putting mine FWF, but it'll be a Shorai.
Real quick just want to know you already know what type of wings are going to put on that thing I like Mike Petty who is still confused
Please, do you have a class for teaching students on aircraft making?
Awesome channel, great videos. I loved your cowl videos!
What kind of fuel consumption are you planning on running this engine?
About 5gph
9:40 How do you access battery terminals after you put skin on the plane? Why not orient the battery so terminals face toward center of plane? In attempt to keep starter cables shortest possible, could battery be placed on right side of aircraft interior? Above passengers feet?
The cowling can be removed to access the battery or 4 screws from underneath removed and the battery slides out. I could flip it around, but there is a charging lead off it as well.
Epic episode!
Thanks for the insight on airplane engines for a Kitfox. I did thought that this came originamlly from a motorcycle. Will the rpm be also in the range of an R1?
Thanks for sharing your epic journy.
Yes RPM will be in the 8-10,000 range
@@BowenAero maybe you don't know about this thing, R1 engine actually came from yamaha YZR-M1 from moto gp, and can reff up to 20.000 rpm
I can see this mill being used in a small hot rod, like a Ford Pop, Austin 7, Fiat Topolino, Fiat 500, or something similar. Who’s thinking of something like this?
Few thoughts, I assume that at any time you could add a second earth battery on the right side if you wanted redundancy power. Also not sure of the elevation in your local High Sierra's if you run that amex engine without a turbo in remote Idaho with the altitude and mountainous terrain will you have climbing power?
Also was you fusalage as I recall is a FF4 or 5 and I'm wondering if your wing is an STi?
It is a Kitfox 7 airframe. Redundant power can be added latter, but with the iPad as the back up screen it already has an internal battery. Since the Kitfox is designed for 100hp at sea level, tThe APEX with 160hp at sea level will do great at altitude. A turbo can always be added to maintain that 160hp at altitude at the expense of weight and complexity and of course the cost. I expect a solid 135hp at 9-10,000 feet
Is this lighter than the rotax 915 and such? Any major pros/cons over just picking a dedicated aircraft engine
It is lighter than a 915 with more hp at sea level and the option to turbo it up to 300hp
@@BowenAero Or 750 HP if you're Mike Patey...LOL
@@toddr2265
LoL 🤣😂
i am loving your build. did you ever get a before and after weight on the wings with paint and coverings?
I have not yet, thanks for reminding me to do the after
Thanks for the great series. Where did you get the motor from? This has really inspired me to want to build a kitfox.
great video! can/does yamaha supply brand new engines or short/long blocks?
Unfortunately no
Doesn't this engine make max HP at like 12000 rpm. At what RPM are you going to be operating at? with the reduction gearbox.
Peak of 10,500RPM, normal operation will be 7,500-10,500rpm on the engine
Is it possible to achieve the same result by using a road engine in place of the snowmobile engine ?. if so where can i find information. thanks and congratulations for the work you do
Do you mean a motorcycle engine? The problem there is the integrated gearbox. The snowmobiled is preferred because of the direct drive output.
@@BowenAero thanks for the explanation, but unfortunately in Italy the sun gives so that there are not many snowmobiles and many low-priced motorcycles
What none of the engine people mentioned so far, what provision you made for cabin heater?? Oil or coolant?
It runs off the coolant and is a small radiator with a fan on it. It works ok.
You said that Ken Brown in Reno built the mount and the header, does he have a website?
He doesn’t at this time.
Did you consider putting the battery in the tail area to help your CG?
No need for that. The CG will be right on. This firewall forward will weigh about the same as a Rotax 914 install. My model 5 with the Lycoming was 80 lbs heavier on the nose and I had the battery in the tail to help along with the forward wing sweep.
Sick Moves
You are first on the list for a ride.
Very nice
Why not use the Twin1160 cc turbo 4 stroke 160 hp by Suzuki witch I believe is Yamaha apex 2012 to 2016. Just wondering you can get them brand new for around $ 3400.00
Because there isn’t a gear box design for this application.
@@BowenAero
So it's not about 2 cyl versus 4 cyl thing .
Just a reduction drive that fits the motor ?
I chose the Yamaha because of the proven history of its conversion to aviation. It has been used in gyrocopters for more then 10 years. A lot of the developments came from the gyro guys and the gearbox is made by SkyTrax, which is Teal Jenkins, a gyro guy. I’m sure there are other engines that could make a good conversion, but you would be starting over from scratch. The APEX already has a good track record and vendor support.
@@BowenAero
I knew most of that
I am looking for alternitive engine's that you can buy in a crate option since from what I understand you cannot buy an apex like the one you are using brand new or am I wrong
@@woodyahh2110 I think that is why the sidewinder may end up being the future engine of choice. Teal has designed a gearbox and Bryan Dacus is working on a tune using the AEM ECU.
There is no reason why a snowmobile engine shouldn't work well in a aircraft. They are both designed to be run max rpm for long periods of time. If the sled engine is only has half as good as the motorcycle engine engine it should last forever. Nice conversion.
So what year and miles did the sled have?
2007 with 1200 miles
@@BowenAero
Didn't you say you've gone through the engine though, so it's basically new ?
I did not tear it down because it is such low time. I did pull the valve cover to take a look at the top end and its spotless.
Any videos of the engine build and clean up?
Here is the video of the removal of the engine from the sled ua-cam.com/video/M3HVOuaJP58/v-deo.html and here is the gear box install ua-cam.com/video/W-8isSUiLnQ/v-deo.html
been waiting for this! Btw I moved back to RDG. Do you belong to any forums where you can be DM.
Was it Ken Brown the racecar guy helped with the Apex engine?
Ken Brown from Reno made the engine mount and the header. Brian Dacus from BD Turn Key Engines did the AEM engine electronics.
As I got further into the video I realized it's probably not the same guy.
@@BowenAero Do you have contact info for the header?
@@tonybraun5118 n
This thing’s gonna kick ass. That engine looks light. What does it weigh?
About the same as a Rotax +- 7-8 lbs
I can’t wait to see it fly and find out what kind of numbers you see.
Got me again! I dont think i have hit like faster
any kits coming using the 3 cylinder turbo yamaha?
Teal at SkyTrax has developed a gear box for the 3 cylinder
@@BowenAero looking forward to seeing one in action!
Does anyone know aproximate concumption per hour for this conversion?
What's the power consumption of those contactors, how many amps will be flowing through them on a normal basis? (Will the parasitic losses be excessive?)
Compared to a mechanical switch like this www.amazon.com/dp/B07L2JRHRQ/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_apa_fab_S8rGFbBVP4AFZ
Use the prototype for a camera tripod
How many kg is Kitfox
The empty weight will be around 800lbs or about 358 Kg
@@BowenAero I make kitfoxs, with slightly larger tubes hopefully fit on this channel kitfox ramze chilindrishvili.
Please mention engine weight??
Engine weight is 131 lbs, the entire firewall forward was 181 lbs
OK Google. What is a collector?
Looking good!