Thank you for this video. I have a Fiat 169 Panda Multijet with a broken timing chain. I was hoping to just replace the rockers affected by piston contact but your video shows the need to order a full set of rockers. To be fair, it makes sense to just change the lot. I'm interested that you replaced the oil pump. But it will have driven considerable miles, so just fit a new one. Another part to order. The Fiat version of this engine has a crankshaft locking port at the front of the engine that uses an 8mm pin to lock the flywheel, so it might be possible without the crank locking tool. However access to do this work in the car is so restricted that engine removal is well worth the effort. You can also fit a new clutch while in there for almost no additional work. Last of all the chain link has failed. What a shame the designers did not use a double row (duplex) timing chain. Bean counters "saving money" I guess.
Note the chain is tensioned with Iran locked at half stroke with number 1 on the upstroke. Cam is locked with the special spring-loaded keys. Crank sprocket is loose so the tensioned chain wont pull the timing out. That left-handed bolt locks the crank sprocket to the crank. Only then can the timing locks be removed.
Any help would be appreciated. The engine had a stretched timing chain on it. Could it be the things that sit on top of the valves? Like in your video they were broken. Even tried easier start and didn’t even bark off it
Great video, really helped as I'm rebuilding an engine. However I am somewhat confused as, using the timing kit seems to time the engine almost mid rotation and not top dead center. Take it that is so valves don't clash. I've done it as you have and the engine rotates fine so hopefully it'll work.
Hi, on some engines they are timed so that the pistons are all dead level halfway down the cylinders to aid in putting the cams back in so it doesn’t slow the pistons to hit the valves.
I seem to have turned this engine counterclockwise too much, now the engine does not start, will it be enough if I put everything back in places with a new chain?
I have done this job many many times on fiat fiorino and Citroen Nemo from the first model's to the late 2018 mods never took the engine out, what transmission do you have there??
They differ between vans, it is about locking the crank and seeing as though this particular locking kit bolts behind the flywheel you need to remove the gearbox. And the other side of the engine is stripped down to access the chain so essentially there is no mounts holding the engine in.
Unfortunately to do the job on this particular model yes it does, as the crank locking tool goes on the gearbox end of the crank, so you have to remove the gearbox, which in turn removes the engine mount that side, then you have to take the other side (chain side mount off) so your left with nothing holding the engine in the bay.
Awesome job man, just a quick one for you, do you think same exact engine but with a semi-automatic transmission makes the job harder? I personally never had the opportunity to take an auto gearbox out of a Peugeot/Citroen.
I have done a timing chain on one of these today, but still doesn’t start, doesn’t seem to be much pressure going into the injectors. Changed the pump on engine to a running one and only changed the pressure slightly but still doesn’t fire. Used the timing tools but didn’t take gear box off. There’s a slot on top of gearbox for a pin to go into the fly wheel
You will have to remove the top cam carrier and pull out the rockers to make sore it hasn’t dropped a valve, but most of the ones I have done have been ok and just done the rockers
Hi, we have the same engine where the chain has snapped just like this. Do you think it may have damaged the valves or is it likely to have just broken the rockers like yours? Thanks, Chris.
Hi CDB Mechanic, i have a combo 1.3 D possible timing chain broke, my current garage is saying new engine, but im thinking a refurbishment job such asyou videoed. Just wondering where you are based. Im in essex. Would you be interested in this job ??
Hi there, yes you can rebuild like shown on the video, I am based in sheerness, so only a stones throw across the water, but realistically it’s 1 and a half hours (ish) from you!, I can carry out the inspection and job yes if the van was bought me. If you are needing any info my number is 07545 916115 give me a message/ring.
I've had numerous high mileage Honda's and Toyota's and have never heard of a cam chain actually snapping, how can it happen is it of such poor quality?
On this particular model there is no hole in the gearbox for the crank locking, you have to use the tool I show to lock into the crank behind the flywheel. Some models have the pin, others have the plate.
@@todayintheshopbanksy5904 The real madness was not fitting an adequate cam chain in the first place. A twin row (duplex) chain would have been minimal extra cost at the factory and solve the problem entirely. Retrofitting is not possible and redesigning the production line would cost £mega.
I would say that’s pretty good gauge on price, it is not a small job and it is labour intensive! However prices will vary from place to place, some might be 40 pound an hour, some may be 60.. will be garage preference
@@Chris_CDB why do you want to give us headhache ? Can't you record quietly and without going everywhere so we could see really what's happened and what you are doing ?
Thank you for this video.
I have a Fiat 169 Panda Multijet with a broken timing chain. I was hoping to just replace the rockers affected by piston contact but your video shows the need to order a full set of rockers. To be fair, it makes sense to just change the lot.
I'm interested that you replaced the oil pump. But it will have driven considerable miles, so just fit a new one. Another part to order.
The Fiat version of this engine has a crankshaft locking port at the front of the engine that uses an 8mm pin to lock the flywheel, so it might be possible without the crank locking tool. However access to do this work in the car is so restricted that engine removal is well worth the effort. You can also fit a new clutch while in there for almost no additional work.
Last of all the chain link has failed. What a shame the designers did not use a double row (duplex) timing chain. Bean counters "saving money" I guess.
Thanks for the video ! I wanted to do that on a Nemo too, but I couldn't see the hole in the gearbox, I thought I was crazy. 😆
Greatest repairs beautiful job thanks very much good explanation 👍👍👍
Note the chain is tensioned with Iran locked at half stroke with number 1 on the upstroke. Cam is locked with the special spring-loaded keys. Crank sprocket is loose so the tensioned chain wont pull the timing out. That left-handed bolt locks the crank sprocket to the crank. Only then can the timing locks be removed.
Any help would be appreciated. The engine had a stretched timing chain on it. Could it be the things that sit on top of the valves? Like in your video they were broken. Even tried easier start and didn’t even bark off it
Thanks mate
Great video, really helped as I'm rebuilding an engine. However I am somewhat confused as, using the timing kit seems to time the engine almost mid rotation and not top dead center. Take it that is so valves don't clash. I've done it as you have and the engine rotates fine so hopefully it'll work.
Hi, on some engines they are timed so that the pistons are all dead level halfway down the cylinders to aid in putting the cams back in so it doesn’t slow the pistons to hit the valves.
@@Chris_CDB That's great, certainly seems to be what I found. I'll let you know how I get on. Informative video. Many thanks.👍😎
Super video
Thanks for the comment!
I seem to have turned this engine counterclockwise too much, now the engine does not start, will it be enough if I put everything back in places with a new chain?
Great video. Anyway of knowing before you start if the engine has to come out before you atempt to replace the chain?
Chain rattling usually the give away.
Interesting.
amigo podria decirme los apriete de culata, gracias
I have done this job many many times on fiat fiorino and Citroen Nemo from the first model's to the late 2018 mods never took the engine out, what transmission do you have there??
They differ between vans, it is about locking the crank and seeing as though this particular locking kit bolts behind the flywheel you need to remove the gearbox. And the other side of the engine is stripped down to access the chain so essentially there is no mounts holding the engine in.
Great vid fella .. So does the engine have to come out to just replace a worn chain 👍👍
Unfortunately to do the job on this particular model yes it does, as the crank locking tool goes on the gearbox end of the crank, so you have to remove the gearbox, which in turn removes the engine mount that side, then you have to take the other side (chain side mount off) so your left with nothing holding the engine in the bay.
Awesome job man, just a quick one for you, do you think same exact engine but with a semi-automatic transmission makes the job harder? I personally never had the opportunity to take an auto gearbox out of a Peugeot/Citroen.
Hi mate, gearbox being semi auto will have practically no bearing on the job. as it’s basically a manual gearbox with a semi automatic selector.
@@Chris_CDB hi mate, does it uses basic clutch kit like a manual transmission? And do i need to use some sort of special tools to remove/ install ?
Yea mate, it should be a normal clutch set up just with an electronic actuator to
Activate the clutch.
@@Chris_CDB cheers brother 👍
I have done a timing chain on one of these today, but still doesn’t start, doesn’t seem to be much pressure going into the injectors. Changed the pump on engine to a running one and only changed the pressure slightly but still doesn’t fire. Used the timing tools but didn’t take gear box off. There’s a slot on top of gearbox for a pin to go into the fly wheel
Was the timing chain done due to a non start condition?
Bonjour
Je veux vous remercier pour la vidéo
So after a failure the valves are still in order? Doing some research now for a future job
You will have to remove the top cam carrier and pull out the rockers to make sore it hasn’t dropped a valve, but most of the ones I have done have been ok and just done the rockers
Thank you so much. I have used car bipper. Could you tell me, where is number of engine location on the engine?
Si se pudiera traducir el vídeo cuando esté realizando el trabajo de puesta a punto sería ideal
Hi, we have the same engine where the chain has snapped just like this. Do you think it may have damaged the valves or is it likely to have just broken the rockers like yours? Thanks, Chris.
Same me 😂 i dont know if i fit new rockers etc like on video will be fine ??
9 times out of 10 it will break the rockers, there have been occasions that have had more extensive damage but usually this repair will work.
Thank you i will try next week and let u know guys 👍
I was lucky done everything like you but with engine on car
And works perfect
Very usefull video
Thanks 👍
Hi CDB Mechanic, i have a combo 1.3 D possible timing chain broke, my current garage is saying new engine, but im thinking a refurbishment job such asyou videoed. Just wondering where you are based. Im in essex. Would you be interested in this job ??
Hi there, yes you can rebuild like shown on the video, I am based in sheerness, so only a stones throw across the water, but realistically it’s 1 and a half hours (ish) from you!, I can carry out the inspection and job yes if the van was bought me.
If you are needing any info my number is 07545 916115 give me a message/ring.
I've had numerous high mileage Honda's and Toyota's and have never heard of a cam chain actually snapping, how can it happen is it of such poor quality?
You can do it in the car, there is a hole in the bottom of the engine to insert a crankshaft pin.
On this particular model there is no hole in the gearbox for the crank locking, you have to use the tool I show to lock into the crank behind the flywheel. Some models have the pin, others have the plate.
@@Chris_CDB Blimey, that's madness.
@@todayintheshopbanksy5904 The real madness was not fitting an adequate cam chain in the first place. A twin row (duplex) chain would have been minimal extra cost at the factory and solve the problem entirely. Retrofitting is not possible and redesigning the production line would cost £mega.
Can u do mine? It hasnt snapped yet but its noisy
I can do yours if you wish yes.
On the video at 15:25, you said tighten up to 50 NM, and then you said angle another 75. Sorry, but what does angle another 75 mean.
75 degrees
How much would this cost I been quoted £1500
I would say that’s pretty good gauge on price, it is not a small job and it is labour intensive! However prices will vary from place to place, some might be 40 pound an hour, some may be 60.. will be garage preference
luckys guys ,in France one hour is about 80/100€
That's where Frank lampard ended up
Where is frank?
OMG, is the cameraman drunken ?
I suppose that you have recorded many jobs like this with a perfectly still camera… little difficult to film and show without moving…!
@@Chris_CDB why do you want to give us headhache ? Can't you record quietly and without going everywhere so we could see really what's happened and what you are doing ?
@@serge9811 odd really… seems a lot of people seemed to use the video without suffering a migraine!.. maybe it’s just you…
Yes maybe i have broken eyes too 🤣