Georgian independence in Abkhazia - From Moscow to Magadan
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- Опубліковано 20 вер 2024
- Every year on 29 September, Abkhazia celebrates the independence of Georgia, acquired after the bloody Georgian Civil War in the early 1990s. This time, the party is even more exuberant because of its recognition as an independent state by Russia. But what is the importance of Russia in Georgian lives? In addition, Jelle visits the dacha (second home) of Joseph Stalin.
Original title: Van Moskou tot Magadan - Abchazië, de lange arm van Rusland
What's left of communism? How big are the differences between the poor and the rich? What is the influence of corruption? Is Russia a "young democracy" (as former Dutch prime minister Jan Peter Balkenende previously said)?Is it a "sovereign democracy" (according to Putin) or a "fascist regime" (as read in The Economist)? Jelle Brandt Corstius is looking for the topics that rule the life of ordinary Russians in Russia.
Presented by: Jelle Brandt Corstius
© VPRO February 2009
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English, French and Spanish subtitles by Ericsson and co-funded by the European Union.
I am Georgian and I love Abkhazians. We love you, we miss you very much. We care about you! I don't understand why you hate us so very much! You won the war, you killed thousands of Georgians, almost 300 000 Georgians became IDPs, We lost our land, our home. In my house for example, which was built by my parents, Abkhazians are living now. After all those things you still hate us? Why? I am proud of my people because after all these horrors we still love you and we will return Abkhazia and Abkhazians with our love. Love is the tool! Just open your eyes, my brothers and sisters, and finally see who''s your friend and who's an enemy.
After all those things you mentioned how can you love apsua motherfuckers? :D They are cheap slaves of Russia
რა დღეში ჩააგდეს აფხაზეთი აგური-აგურზე არ დაუდიათ 30 წელი გავიდა ამათი აფსუა აჯმაკუზა დედებს ვტენე .
ჩაჩა რა ცემი ფეხებია? მაგას ჭაჭა ქვია, ყელაფერი აბდაუბდაა როცა ფესვი არ აქვს .
Abkhazeti is part of United Georgia!
Not anymore, lol
abkhazia part of Georgia always stupid always
likesmilitaryhistory Alan Moore - Not anymore? Yes, Nauru and Nicaragua agrees you :DD But the whole civilized world considers toilet paper much valuable than abkhazian passport)))
That's why they have Russian Passports lol
when rusia will fall abxazia became Gorgian again
Abkhazia is part of Georgia, Russian won’t be always your guard and what u gonna do after these?
one day united states wont be there to protect you georgians ...and in 2008 itself russia should have occupied georgia with respect to your attitude...
@@vikramnandakumaran2434 really? They did train us and fund us but they didn't help us in the war, the russians did help the abkazians and ossetians. Since they can barely squeeze out 2 allies and will do anything to retain them
Georgia rules
Those Abkhazian are smart👍👍 they don't wanna be part of a whore nation, made of traitors and sale out bastards.
@@vikramnandakumaran2434 typical for people like you. Abzhkazia and Samochoblo are Georgia!.
Karabach is Azerbaijan!
They say that Russia saved them, but in reality Russia took control over them and now abkhazia's fate lies in the Russian hand
Do you know what is the worst feel ever? When foreigner teaches and tells you that your land is not your. Abxazia is georgia, it was georgia and will be in the future too. If anybodu knows history he would not say that abxazia is indipendent country. And now is abxazia free?
In past abkhazians were our ally
We was helping them
Doing everything for them
And now
Our old loved people and even the region
Became our enemy
Abkhazia Is parf of Georgia!
Abjasia is georgian, outside russians
Lol no it isnt'.
@@chepushila1 it is.
Привет я из России!
Those "abkhazians" of course they are georgians have our culture and same things Abkhazia is part
of Georgia .
Yeah, Even Tradition Of Pouring Water Or Spirts On Graves Are Same That Was In This Video!!!
@@kupatrap2374 and this is why so many Abkhaz have returned to Traditional Abkhaz Paganism because christianity is the same as Geogian occupation .
Yep, abkhazians have no history other than being a region of Georgia!
Cossack-Abkhaz friendship sounds so odd xD
abkhazia is chernobil now abkhazia is part of georgia !
Тупой , как сванский ишак
It's a myth saying that Abkhazia was ever independent state. "Genocide of Abkhazians" ? It's a fucking joke.
Thank you for this video. I always try to somehow find out about the other side and have a semblance of contact, but as a Georgian, unless some of them come here for a football match, videos like this are the only way.
I have a question to you though after 8 years from producing this what's your opinion abut the conflict and the region in general?
We do not express personal opinions here. We try to tell a story, as objectively as possible.
:)
Thank you very much for your hard and brave work!
Hello Beka,
Thank you so much for watching!
Abkhazia is part of Georgia
abkhazia is a part of georgia
Заза....так мою собаку зовут.
Пошёл вон , пёс!
abkhazia,this is georgia!!
Abkhazians - time is coming, when we have to stop hating each other and start thinking how to solve the problems for the future generations of Georgians and Abkhazians. Both of us are suffering, while China becomes Giant superpower, Japan is in 23'rd century and Even Africa is becoming more developed, than us. this is the result of hatred. time to start new era. our children are not less than Japaness children, our children deserve to live in not bloodshed and poverty, but in a peaceful, developed society and state. there must be many ways to each other. we just need to start from somewhere.. we need to start to nagotiate. don't think about Russia. we have to think about ourselves. because they do not think about us at all. thay don't care. we must care of ourselves. i know the past. that was Apocaliptic times, post soviet era, when even Georgians were killing each other for the political reasons. i know... but we must know the past to avoid the same mistakes in the future. Our society has raised after that times so much. Georgians now are Liberal-coservatives. we know, that nationalism in Caucasus is just suicide of culture and peace. 90% of Georgians think so.
Abkhazia was Abkhazia always and will be. no problem with that. but we are not going to go somewhere. we will always be neighbors. there was times in 16'th and 17-th Centuries, when Imeretians were killing Gurians and Gurians were killing Mingrelians and Kakhetians were killing Kartlians. this kind of things always were happening in the world and in Caucasus too. i know many people died in Abkhazia, many were injured, but i don't think that any of them would be against peace and normal relations between peoples. More, than 103 Billion people are dead already in the world. more, than 94% of Humans are suffering any desease in the world. there are so much dead and suffer in the world. What we can is to try and somehow do something to build a better world, better future. we can not live always in hatred. i don;t say anything about the independence or any status of Abkhazia. i am just saying, that nagotiation is important, possible and sooner or later we have to start just speaking to each other.
what about 300 thousand Georgian refugees? do you think, that they must have a right to come back and live in their homes? or if their homes now are destroyed, or there lives any Abkhazian family, ok let them live, but Georgian state will build a new house for Georgian families. what do you think about that process to start? would not it be fair?
and what if you get the status of Federative republic in Georgia? there will be new business projects, open borders and warmer relations. your economics will boom, you will become more developed and also will have a status of federative republic like for example Checnya has in Russia. we would give you a total independence, but it is now very dangerous. there are already many Armenians in Abkhazia. less and less Abkhazians. we can not risk, as Armenians will say that they want Abkhazia to be the part of Russia if there is referendum about this.
"time is coming, when we have to stop hating each other and start thinking how to solve the problems for the future generations"
Yes!
It's also something that is being said in our documentary about Turkey/Armenia: bit.ly/ITarmenie
it comes true if abkhazians will understand that abkhazia is part of Georgia ))
რუსებზე საზიზღარი ერი თუ არსებობს
8:41 look at that women , 100% armenian, even her accent is armenian she doesn’t have to do anything with georgians or abkhazians. 50% of the population in Abkhazia are armenians. How dare they call themselves abkhazians when they are completely different people , real abkhazians are GEORGIANS , and they were forced to leave their homes after the war and most of them live in Tbilisi now.
you are right i have seen home of abkhazian people kicked from abkhazia they are at Werovani
Armenians in Abkhazia are naturalized Abkhaz unlike the Georgian settlers who came after stalin forced Abkhazia into Georgia in the 1930s . Georgian settlers unlike the Armenians fought for Georgia while Armenians fought and died for independent Abkhazia and this explains why there still there and the Georgian settlers have been expelled .
Abkhazia is a big reason America should pay attention to what's happening in the Soviet sphere. Oh, it's not 'soviet' any longer? wanna bet? ask the Georgians if it isn't. Or Ukraine. God bless Georgia and not Russophile Abkhazis so much.
Thank you for the video,you clearly showed us the condition of the “Independent country”.I hope abkhazians will see how Russia occupies and assimilates their traditions and resident...Its not independence what they call...
Thank you for watching!
Abkhazia was and one day will be part of goregia ..same ethnicity same traditions and culture ..the dictator of kerimllin want to separate nations because it is the only gurrantee to continue rulling great russia ..
ვაი თქვე ცოდოებოო, მარა ხის თავიანების დაბოლება ხო ადვილია.
23:12 what dog thinks about abkhazians and their "independence"
Riesiges Dankeschön für das Video! Ich hoffe, irgendwann werden die Abkhazia sich dafür schämen und werden ihre Meinung über die Georgia ändern. Wobei, die ursprüngliche Abkhazia gibt es in Abkhazien fast keine mehr . Das ist die Realität!
Thank you for this video. As someone who’s not from the area, it’s hard understand what really happened in Abkhazia, because objective information is very hard to come by. However, 20-30K Georgian civilian casualties compared to 2K Abkhazian is a big indicator of what happened.
The world should know about this conflict, as well as other recent conflicts in the Caucasus, because it seems like history keeps repeating itself and we are not learning from our mistakes.
We must always do everything we can to avoid conflict. I am Macedonian and my entire family was expelled from Greek Macedonia in the 1940s. I was strongly opposed to accepting the agreement about the new name, because Greece has committed atrocities against my people over and over, and they got what they wanted once again. I was in deep sadness for weeks after it passed Parliament. But, deep inside I knew that it was the most subtle kind of capitulation and that it is the right step in terms of avoiding possible conflict and more ethnic cleansing. I think of what happened in the Caucasus and the Balkans in the 90s, and I say AVOID CONFLICT AT ALL COSTS!!
@@Alexander-vn4lq
Your country FULLY controlled by CIA. so do not speak about brain poising. Abkhazia is NOT Georgia and DEFIANTLY NOT Russia. Abkhazia is ABKHAZIA. just like we have in Kurdistan in Iraq. Abkhazia should wave their own flag along with the Georgian and Russian flags. for everyone's best interest: Abkhazia MUST remain independent unless you want Moscow to convert Tbilisi into radioactive waste land. At least Russia did NOT use depleted Uranium against: Iraq , Kosovo , Bosnia , Serbia , Albania , Vietnam , Syria , Donbass (East Ukraine) , Libya. - which resulted in MILLIONS of super ugly babies. so in short words... Russia is NOT the monster but USA & NATO.
"America and eu need to get used too." What? It don't matters what side wins that chess move. All of them dont care about the world. That sentence was really odd. But it was the only remark i could find in all of these series. Great job, thank You all for the informations. Its really hard to find good documents about the east. The climat that is painted thrue the series is world class quality, like always on vpro. Love from Poland.
Thank you Bohun for your comment.
You stupid idiot. Abkhazians and Cossacks were playing football with georgian heads in Gagra. And when Georgians surrendered in parliament building, they brought them outside and shot them with no regard for warriors honor. So stop with this bullshit lies that you heard from russian propaganda machine
What kind of broken in English is that? "Georgian independence in Abkhazia" so Georgia is part of Abkhazia now? "Every year on 29 September, Abkhazia celebrates the independence of Georgia" - Abkhazians celebrating our independence?
Seriously who even wrote this nonsense?
Gracias por los subtítulos en español
De nada, Saladino! :)
Afkhazeti is part Georgia ardzimbas Dedas ro daveci gudautashi deidas gagrsshi ) separatist bliad )
Great video as always. By the way, when was this episode filmed?
Thank you Matheus! We aired the episodes in 2009.
Thank you for the information!
matheus abkhazia is Georgia u dumbass. this is not information. this is dezinformation.
Give me the control over that territory, a couple of years and secure environment for investors and I'll make a fucking heaven in there. There are so many opportunities in there and they have been wasting them for the past 25 years.
abkhazia is georgia
Comedy-show
:D
I want to ask Apsni people, are you now majority population in Abkhazia after all these wars? If you listen to many stories of Georgians that were forced to leave Abkhazia in 90s, you will understand the pain that they have endured. In this conflict, there were two victim ethnicities: Apsua and Georgians. And very smartly, each of the ethnicities accuses another of being the agressor.
This is my favorite show
Thank you! Would you care to tell us what it is that you especially like?
Who is from abkhazia
22:55 Oh my god they predicted what would happen to Ukraine 10 years ago wow
Wie breid geheel tegen de afspraken 1991 uit naar het Oosten Jelle?, dacht de NAVO.
Jelle praat leuk alleen als een kip zonder kop.
What song do the cossacks sing??
If Georgia has to take Abjasia with tanks and soldiers then abjasia is not for Georgia, if there are cultural ties, you can try other ways to return together.
Abkhazia love💗
the Republic of Abkhazia is recognised as a state by Russia, Venezuela, Nicaragua, Nauru, and Syria.
loool
Abkhazia won it’s independence from Georgia that is all
Its region of georgia that is occupied by russia you idiot
No entiendo en Abjasia son musulmanes o ortodoxos
Молодец иностранец,правду показал!
The driver of the program is too biased, he can not hide his bias, I guess that's why there is so much I do not like.
I think those people should be given a chance to be free. Infact the Russian federation should provide them with all the resources to renovate their demolished parliament. And to my brothers in Georgia, like it or not at one moment the entire Georgian nation will one day go back into the control of the Russian federation to support my theory read the book of revelation in the Bible. So it's just a matter of time every prophecy will be fufilled.
are you fucking insane
23:18 what is the point of this scene ?
Just seeing a part of daily life there?
Here is my best impression of Georgians:
Georgia is part of Abkhazia! Always was always will be!!!
True Georgians are Abkhazians! The ones who call themselves Georgians today actually came from Armenia!
What will happen when Murica is no more with you Georgians??!?!
Mah mah mah >:D (suppose to be evil laugh)
nah
What
@@xdumoo you're probably one of those people who believe that shot rustaveli was Armenian or that half our culture has Armenian roots
people look at him, that's the result of russia right there and brainwashing. i suppose all "abkhazians" are psychopaths like him in that chernobyl
Mate what.
Shakalivi now is Ukrainien this man no work for the georgiens , now is work forthe CIA in Odessa this man is and traite for the georgiens .
pépé pépé Bla bla. Saakashvili revived Georgia in every aspect.
Abjasia is a very nice country. So beautiful and strong history for to be a great nation. Self-determination for Abjasia is the best option.
What about english subtital?
Hi Raj Shrestha, did you turn on the subs in CC?
@@vproworldstories thanks. Subtital is ok.
madre mía no sabia nada lo que ocurría con este país mucha fuerza hermanos abjasios y espero que sen reconocidos mundial mente saludos desde PERU Sudamérica
Comment section filled with Georgian nationists who have no idea of the facts and simply spread Georgian lies . Both nations shear some history but are seperate peoples with there own language , culture and religous traditions . Abkhazia and Georgia joined the USSR as equal sovergn nations , but the Georgia stalin down gradded Abkhazia to an ASSR inside Georgia in the 1930s . Abkhaz have as much rights as the Kosovo Albanians .
Georgian king is burried in Abkhazia, you know that? Back from 11th century. Also, Abkhazia SSR joined USSR but had a unity treaty with Georgian SSR. Abkhazian king was from Georgian dynasty too- Leon 2, Archabadze dynasty. Read the history, my friend.
Georgia and Abkhazia joined the USSR, you mean voluntarily? 🤣
Wasn't it like the Soviets invaded the Caucasus, Georgia, Armenia and Azerbaijan? And you say Georgians just lie in the comment section.
Let us sample them all ...hahaha ur genuis .how could u invade thse nice people very easy ....thank u very much u erease all wrong ideas about those simple people ..
Inoticed wen u get drunk ur face turn red ..that hppened exactly in ur video about engoshia when u proposed atoast with their leaders ..
Primer comentario en español soy de chile
For those who write here that Abkhazia is Georgia a little history. Abkhazia and Georgia are different countries and different peoples. The capital of Abkhazia is the city of Sukhum. The capital of Georgia is Tbilisi. Abkhazia has been known since the VI century BC, as the country of Colchis, when the Greeks (Argonauts) began to sail there for the golden fleece. The Greeks founded several settlements in Colchis and lived with the local tribes. The names of some settlements have been preserved from ancient times to our time, for example, Gumista (a settlement on the Gumista river) and Ochamchiri. The names of some settlements have changed, for example, Pitiunt (the ruins of an ancient fortress exist) are now called Pitsunda. Then these lands belonged first to the Roman Empire, then to the Byzantine Empire. At the end of the VIII century, the Abkhazian kingdom arose, in which, in addition to local tribes and Greeks, several Georgian tribes, Armenians and even Arabs lived. In the second half of the 16th century, Abkhazia was conquered by the Ottoman Empire. In Abkhazia there were many uprisings against the Turks (in 1725, 1733, 1771, 1806, etc.). In 1810, in order to get rid of Ottoman oppression, the Principality of Abkhazia became part of the Russian Empire. Georgia, for the same reason, became part of the Russian Empire in 1801. After the February Revolution of 1917, Abkhazia was conquered by Georgia, and in 1918, a peace treaty was concluded between Georgia and Abkhazia in Moscow, and Abkhazia became part of Georgia. However, in 1921, the Soviet Socialist Republic of Abkhazia was formed in Abkhazia, and in order to stop the Georgian attack in Abkhazia, Red Army troops were introduced. The USSR was formed in 1922, and Abkhazia entered it as a union republic. In 1931, Abkhazia was again annexed to Georgia. In 1990, Abkhazia became a sovereign Abkhazian Socialist Republic. Georgia attacked Abkhazia four times to conquer Abkhazia in 1918, in 1992-1993, in 1998 and in 2008. Now the Republic of Abkhazia is recognized as independent by Russia, which spoke in the conflict on its side, and five other UN member states. Protect Abkhazia from Georgia. I beg you.
Михаил Кононов Its big remake of our history and its a lie. Colchs were not only Abkhazian people. Colchis included Mengrelians and Laz people too. Abkhazia was always part of United Georgia. Ruler of Abkhazia Leon spoke Georgian language(alphabet) and kingdom of Abkhazia had capital in Kutaisi, which was always part of Georgia. Those people who live in Abkhazia today are Apsuas who came from Cherkess mountains two centuries ago. Real Abkhazian people are Georgian and when the war began you started to genocide ethnic Georgian(Abkhazian) population and forced them to leave their property. Thats why those people are rebels and have no chance to be independent.
Colchis was not Abkhaz. It was Laz (Mingrelian)!!!
It nevet was a country
Abjazija is a new country. Welcome to Abjazija.
It's not a country u scumbag
Kagda bil strana abkazia vi ni vnaite rassia vrag dlia checnya ingusia dagestan ...
Its a state occupied by russia,these brainwashed people belive they live in a country? LOOK they have old vehicles from 90s,how tf are they a country?
abjacia es de México
შენღა გვაკლდი :D
Armamento soviético viejo o
Viva Abjasia y Osetia
Eseni rjul dakarguli xalxia ubindzuresi rusetis monebi 21saukuneshi
beautiful country torn by conflict and lack of international trade and recognition. It is not independent as many other countries are not. People say it is part of Georgia, probably as Kosovo is part of Serbia. It is sad to see that countries get destroyed for some crazy ideological doctrines instead of finding common ground and stay poor and screwed just because foreign powers have some plans with them.
Are you sure it is a country? Their "president" participated in Russian elections :D
It is not a country it is a bunch of people who love Russian dick and help Russian to hurt Georgia
Абхазия- Апсны 👍
Slavik Blab .i.=apsua
Абхазы молодцы !
Салам братьям из Алании!
Хаххон Дзигло .i. ოსო ღორო არც მიკვირს ოსები ყოველთვის მოღალატეები იყავით
Abjasia🤝Russia. URRA Georgia💩
Cheap slave of Russia :D
Alexander Costa 🐐💩 this is you! From Georgia🇬🇪
Abchazia is part of Russia
People are ruined and hungry people, Russians are drunkards and turned to Abkhazia, soon Russia will be destroyed by my friend)
Kosovo es Serbia y Abjasia es Abjasia.
two options: kosovo is serbia abkhazia is georgia or kosovo is free and abkhzaia is free
Abkhazia libre