I know how talented these guys are, and that the leg attacks are classic, submitting your opponent while protecting yourself. I also know that the leg lock specialists are some of the most boring fights. As a fan, I would much rather see some creative work. Just sayin.
leg lock attacks are not classic theyre mostly all newly innovated and have evolved more in the past 5 years than it has since its birth. it may be boring when you dont understand whats going on and the only way you can truly know whats happening is to be just as good if not better than the ones you watch otherwise its impossible to keep up with what happens. and what would you say has the most potential for being creative, utilizing 1/2 of the body or all of the body. going from upper body to lower body attacks and visa versa opens up a whole new game of tactics, skills, creativity, possibilities and so on. im not sure i understand you position here.
@@timtaylor9590 I've been doing jits for 4 years now and I still think that matches between leg lock specialists are boring. It is what it is. I also think a lot of high level black belt Gi matches are boring because the margin of error is so low and no one wants to make a mistake.
On the street your jaw and teeth would be smashed as soon as he sits on his ass Striking is much less forgiving when grappling and it's less sport driven with all those rules that limit a person from becoming effective at self defense. To dismiss something as important as basic striking is just ignorance. Don't give the kids a false sense of how effective grappling is without learning effective striking. Concrete changes everything as does weapons and multiple attackers.
Concrete, weapons and multiple attackers all doom striking as well. Concrete kills when knockout blows occur. Not a good thing in a self defense situation for either party, especially where lethal force is not warranted. Grappling would actually be safer in that context. I agree that grappling is not smart against a knife or gun wielding opponent.... but striking in that situation is far dumber still. I wouldn’t want to grapple someone with a knife or a gun, but I’d be even less inclined still to try and get in a punching match with them! With grappling skills there is as least some remote chance of intelligent defense. The one self defense situation where striking potentially has an edge is against multiple untrained opponents, where managing the distance and creating multiple knockout is extremely unlikely, but at least plausible. But even this is debatable. The best thing against multiple attackers is either a gun, or getting away. However, as soon as one of those attackers grabs hold of you, knowledge of grappling will be far more effective in the department of getting you away-or getting a weapon in play-than striking is. So even on that front, grappling arguably has the edge. That said, are there sport-specific grappling techniques that make absolutely no sense in a self defense situation? Absolutely yes. Do we see some of them here? Absolutely yes. But let’s not assume Garry Tonon wouldn’t simply switch styles in that context. He certainly does change styles for MMA.
@@JustinColletti concrete kills when you're on your back and your attacker starts banging your head off it. Avoid the ground in a real fight. In self defense walking or running away is not always possible and you can't be sure if they have a weapon or not so effective striking like low kicks strikes to eyes throat groin keep your attacker from ever getting close. If it's one man on his own you can grapple and it's effective up to a point but with the soft mats gone a simple take down can end badly plus a passing bloke can easily get involved as you've chosen to grapple. BJJ is a sport designed to grind down your opponent, you don't have that luxury on the street, your defense and particularly your attacks have to fast and relentless to cause enough damage to get away safe. Japanese martial arts use strikes grappling and weapons. Even though you can't carry a Katana with you the ability to disarm an attacker is far easier if you get to know the typical weapons you are likely to come across. The most common are bats/sticks/steel bars and blades. If you have the experience with using weapons when you do disarm your attacker you know how to use the weapon. The amount of students I've taught that truly believed that they'd take anyone out with a baseball bat. You have to learn how to hold your weapon so it's no taken back from you and it's never as simple as just aim and swing. I have shown them countless times how easy it is to disarm someone with a bat using only the belt from my jeans. Grappling in a competition setting is definitely not preparing you for a real life attack. Don't get me wrong I enjoy grappling and I will use submissions as they present themselves. The most useful part of grappling on the street is arm locks to set up a choke or to set up a knockout strike. Again in an attack situation not just some drunk bloke being an idiot. Control is a huge part of self defense. I will never understand the thinking behind ignoring more tools to use to defend yourself. Why only grapple when you can strike and grapple they compliment each other nicely. Unfortunately Ju Jitsu well Judo that was taught to the Gracie's then they turned it into GJJ now it's migrated to the states and wrestling is mixed in with it now as the Gracie's saw fit to ignore the importance of throws so wrestling is mixed in to secure takedowns which just demonstrates that it is an incomplete form of self defense. The submissions are amazing and compliment my Judo training nicely but I always kept training with striking full contact competition is great but even that is not like a real attack. A real attack starts and ends really fast and it's not like picture perfect roll on the mats. You must use every tool available to ignore an area as important as striking is simply ignorant. If you just want to train and compete go for it but defending yourself requires preparing for every eventuality.
To who are you talking exactly? They are training Jiu Jitsu from a sports point of view, who cares what happens on the street. Most people are smart enough to deescalate altercations on the street so physical violence can be avoided altogether. To add to that, Garry Tonon is also doing MMA so I'm sure he would do just fine over there too in case it did ever occur. I'm getting so bored of people like you who keep comparing it to streetfighting. It simply isn't a streetfight. Do you also go over to boxing channels and whine about how they wouldn't stand a chance vs kicks?
Love how Gary Tonon starts to celebrate then turns around to Rafael, almost apologizing. So much humility and respect. Great ambassador of this sport
double leg takedown to heel hook, this is great !
Thanks for stopping by Ming!
yep, slick
Lol Tonon holding back from celebrating
andres viveros pretty dope of him to do to show respect.
Masters at work!
Indeed!
amazing athletes
Yup. I appreciate you stopping by Adrian.
actually they look like extremely average athletes. great ju juitsu players though
I wish they would not end the video so soon.
Tonon looked razor sharp
His opponent is no joke too. Thanks for stopping by Brian!
gary got great jiujitsu manner
Thank you or stopping by.
Rafael is no slouch..good action.
Thanks for stopping by BCT!
soooo gooood
Absolutely. Thanks or stopping by.
Good one!
Francisco Feest thank you for watching!
its like watching two snakes fight
0:54 how to breakfall
Thanks for checking out the vid.
Garry celebrating like it's his first submission ever
I know how talented these guys are, and that the leg attacks are classic, submitting your opponent while protecting yourself. I also know that the leg lock specialists are some of the most boring fights. As a fan, I would much rather see some creative work. Just sayin.
leg lock attacks are not classic theyre mostly all newly innovated and have evolved more in the past 5 years than it has since its birth. it may be boring when you dont understand whats going on and the only way you can truly know whats happening is to be just as good if not better than the ones you watch otherwise its impossible to keep up with what happens. and what would you say has the most potential for being creative, utilizing 1/2 of the body or all of the body. going from upper body to lower body attacks and visa versa opens up a whole new game of tactics, skills, creativity, possibilities and so on. im not sure i understand you position here.
@@timtaylor9590 I've been doing jits for 4 years now and I still think that matches between leg lock specialists are boring. It is what it is. I also think a lot of high level black belt Gi matches are boring because the margin of error is so low and no one wants to make a mistake.
On the street your jaw and teeth would be smashed as soon as he sits on his ass
Striking is much less forgiving when grappling and it's less sport driven with all those rules that limit a person from becoming effective at self defense. To dismiss something as important as basic striking is just ignorance. Don't give the kids a false sense of how effective grappling is without learning effective striking. Concrete changes everything as does weapons and multiple attackers.
Concrete, weapons and multiple attackers all doom striking as well.
Concrete kills when knockout blows occur. Not a good thing in a self defense situation for either party, especially where lethal force is not warranted. Grappling would actually be safer in that context.
I agree that grappling is not smart against a knife or gun wielding opponent.... but striking in that situation is far dumber still. I wouldn’t want to grapple someone with a knife or a gun, but I’d be even less inclined still to try and get in a punching match with them! With grappling skills there is as least some remote chance of intelligent defense.
The one self defense situation where striking potentially has an edge is against multiple untrained opponents, where managing the distance and creating multiple knockout is extremely unlikely, but at least plausible. But even this is debatable.
The best thing against multiple attackers is either a gun, or getting away. However, as soon as one of those attackers grabs hold of you, knowledge of grappling will be far more effective in the department of getting you away-or getting a weapon in play-than striking is. So even on that front, grappling arguably has the edge.
That said, are there sport-specific grappling techniques that make absolutely no sense in a self defense situation? Absolutely yes. Do we see some of them here? Absolutely yes.
But let’s not assume Garry Tonon wouldn’t simply switch styles in that context. He certainly does change styles for MMA.
@@JustinColletti Well put 🙏🏻
@@JustinColletti concrete kills when you're on your back and your attacker starts banging your head off it. Avoid the ground in a real fight. In self defense walking or running away is not always possible and you can't be sure if they have a weapon or not so effective striking like low kicks strikes to eyes throat groin keep your attacker from ever getting close. If it's one man on his own you can grapple and it's effective up to a point but with the soft mats gone a simple take down can end badly plus a passing bloke can easily get involved as you've chosen to grapple. BJJ is a sport designed to grind down your opponent, you don't have that luxury on the street, your defense and particularly your attacks have to fast and relentless to cause enough damage to get away safe. Japanese martial arts use strikes grappling and weapons. Even though you can't carry a Katana with you the ability to disarm an attacker is far easier if you get to know the typical weapons you are likely to come across. The most common are bats/sticks/steel bars and blades. If you have the experience with using weapons when you do disarm your attacker you know how to use the weapon. The amount of students I've taught that truly believed that they'd take anyone out with a baseball bat. You have to learn how to hold your weapon so it's no taken back from you and it's never as simple as just aim and swing. I have shown them countless times how easy it is to disarm someone with a bat using only the belt from my jeans. Grappling in a competition setting is definitely not preparing you for a real life attack. Don't get me wrong I enjoy grappling and I will use submissions as they present themselves. The most useful part of grappling on the street is arm locks to set up a choke or to set up a knockout strike. Again in an attack situation not just some drunk bloke being an idiot. Control is a huge part of self defense. I will never understand the thinking behind ignoring more tools to use to defend yourself. Why only grapple when you can strike and grapple they compliment each other nicely.
Unfortunately Ju Jitsu well Judo that was taught to the Gracie's then they turned it into GJJ now it's migrated to the states and wrestling is mixed in with it now as the Gracie's saw fit to ignore the importance of throws so wrestling is mixed in to secure takedowns which just demonstrates that it is an incomplete form of self defense. The submissions are amazing and compliment my Judo training nicely but I always kept training with striking full contact competition is great but even that is not like a real attack. A real attack starts and ends really fast and it's not like picture perfect roll on the mats. You must use every tool available to ignore an area as important as striking is simply ignorant. If you just want to train and compete go for it but defending yourself requires preparing for every eventuality.
To who are you talking exactly? They are training Jiu Jitsu from a sports point of view, who cares what happens on the street. Most people are smart enough to deescalate altercations on the street so physical violence can be avoided altogether. To add to that, Garry Tonon is also doing MMA so I'm sure he would do just fine over there too in case it did ever occur. I'm getting so bored of people like you who keep comparing it to streetfighting. It simply isn't a streetfight. Do you also go over to boxing channels and whine about how they wouldn't stand a chance vs kicks?