@@joshuabier6772 I do? Thats why Im here...but Im also educated in this field so its more like refresher lessons for me. He hasnt said anything I dont already know...g
@@AliAbrahem As I said in a comment that youtube deleted, Im an exercise science undergrad so he says everything I already know. Its a good refresher tho
Feel is only a part of the process. If you’re getting the same movement and range of motion but more reps with a stronger grip (ie, thumbs used) then that is almost inarguably going to be better stimulus.
@@Masterscotts1 using my thumbs caused me to do less reps since it would put a strain on my forearms and they would give out before my back because I don’t use straps since they broke. So thumbless grip is the go to for me
I've heard "forearms taking over" from a lot of different directions but I don't get what it means. Thumbless grip to me feels like I'm simply handicapping my grip and nothing else. You're still moving the weight with the same back muscles, so apart from a mental placebo, what does it actually add?
@@paoloh885 when you are gripping something you engage your forearms therefore when pulling the weight all of the muscle in your foreman’s begin to start firing away. If you’re moving heavy weight it’s possible that your forearms may give out causing you to not be able to grip the bar anymore even though your back could squeeze out maybe another 1 or 2 reps
@@Mcgurkyyy101 sorry for the late reply: if thumbs out of the equation works best for you then no reason to change! Typically however, grip is overall stronger with thumbs used as opposed to just fingers, and also decreases the risk of tendinitis somewhat. Hook grip could be another solution if you weren’t looking to replace your straps or prioritise some forearm specificity. All the best!
The funny part about a lot of the advice you provide is that I’ve found myself doing some of it unintentionally or automatically because it just feels to right. For example this video: I haven’t been to the gym in quite sometime and was never an expert, but I intuitively did all of this advice including letting the last rep go back up real nice and slow for a good stretch. The science behind it only reinforced the habit lol
I'm proud of myself hearing this, I figured out the final negative thing going push ups a long long time ago I remember thinking if you can push up then you can always resist down, I always end my push ups on a negative
That grip suggestions is actually great. I used to feel my forearms also work during lat pulldowns and wondered what could be done so that they aren't used as much.
Thank you Jeff this has kept me from injuries and my eccentrics are looking so much better 26 going 27 and ego lifting and going crazy was fun but definitely not viable as you get older thanks man love your content! ❤❤❤
Not using your thumb for grip just makes your grip a bigger limiting factor. Less forearm engagement doesn’t necessarily transfer to more lats engagement
Well, this content is way better then introducing weird exercises to a mostly clueless crowd. Explaining the details of well established exercises is so much better.
For me with my arms fully stretched at the top the plates on the machine are basically resting in each other, at least with pull ups if you’re tall you can bend your knees.
Did lat pulldowns earlier, glad to hear I do every one of these tips 🔥 the thumbless grip is a game changer too, kept it for years and will never go back!
I’ve been teaching these to my gf as she’s new to weight lifting and I’m glad I’ve been giving her good advice! I’ll be using your channel for other workouts, much love
My man Jeff. The forearms aren’t going to take over no matter what grip you use. Using a thumbless grip doesn’t have anything to do with that. You are not going to use more of your back if you use less of your forearms. The reason people feel their lats more going thumbless is because of the position it puts your wrists/hands in. You even said to use straps to combat this which I agree with but it is not because of your forearms “taking over” if you were to use a normal grip
@@anon8633I’m the opposite. I’m able to do 15+ full range of motion pull ups and I feel the difference going thumbless. Reason I say pull ups instead of pull downs is because not everyone can do full range pull ups even if you do super heavy pull downs. I’ve always did thumbless just because that was more comfortable for me. OP is also wrong in stating his reason why people feel lats more for thumbless. The real reason is that when you use your thumb, you naturally just end up squeezing the bar more. That simply makes you use your forearms more.
@@justeatingchipsandwatchingsuicide grip is only dangerous in push exercises like bench press, where you could get buried under the bar. going thumbless for pull downs is not “suicide grip”.
@@path9938a gym rat once told me that straps prevents you from building strength in your forearms and growing them, if you use straps for all pull exercises every time you’ll get bigger but your forearms will look funnily small
Spot on video with one personal correction because it’s individualistic perhaps to me only, but I actually feel better connection with my back with regular grip.
@@Scion15 so basically the thumb has it's own muscle on the hand wich is not a forearm. If you were doing it without the thumb, technically it's harder to grip because it's just four fingers holding on. My best bet is that placebo was the thing making them feel more lat. But a looser grip making you feel more back is just nonsense in my opinion.
Your forearm and back perform two different functions, they cannot "take over" during a pulling exercise because the forearm is responsible for Wrist flexion/extension.
It depends on the grip you use. With the one shown in the video (pronated grip), it shouldn't happen. However, with a supinated grip, your forearms and biceps are much more involved.
You're right, it feels different when after last rep I slowly put it back. I tend to do it sometimes to reduce noise (shy new gym girl here) but I will do it only this way from now on!
@julienwelllife lats are engaged when the shoulder stays engaged. Leaning forward and seeing the shoulder expand removes the lats tension. Your elbows have to remain in front of the body, and no less then roughly 30 degrees away from the body, meaning a fully extended arm typically relocated tension to teres and rhomboids naturally. Single arm pull downs are the best lat grower, because it allows you to keep the weight in front of you, and allows you to shift to either side, making the lat stretch outward, not simply up and down. Hope that helps
I get massive forearm pain with lat pulldowns, so I'll definitely try this. I've used open grips on many other exercises; I guess I haven't tried it here yet because you need so much control for pulldowns. Might actually consider straps.
I just started working out seriously a few weeks ago and I feel uncomfortable dropping the weight fast and I wanna do the motion correctly so I always release the weight slow and extra careful. I’m glad I know this is also important for muscle growth
As Dr. Mike says: "As if another one."
Slow, as if another. RACK.
I read that with his voice 😂
AS IF ANOTHER. SLOW. SLOW. SLOW. WAIT. WAIT. rack.
First time I watched one of his videos I started applying that mantra 👌🏼💯
“another one”
Just about to do lat pulldowns.
Did u do what he said
I think we did lat pull downs at the exact same time. Crazy
@@sairajd1670no he just ignored it
@@ChapatiMan 🙁
Tbh I was watching this during my rest between sets just now and applied the thumbless grip and had to drop the weight slightly but felt my lats more
UA-cam shorts are quickly becoming a powerhouse of yours. Great job combining the pertinent information into “snack sizes”!
Pretty much ideal for the gym too. You can keep holding your phone ergonomically, it's short form so you don't waste time and hog the equipment.
Just like him!
Absolutely stellar tips and flawless way to execute a lat pulldown. This is why Jeff is one of the best for y'all to listen to
why do you sound so condescending😭 you should listen to him too g
@@joshuabier6772 I do? Thats why Im here...but Im also educated in this field so its more like refresher lessons for me. He hasnt said anything I dont already know...g
@@joshuabier6772because he’s Mr. Bruise Lee Roy, the boy with an anime profile picture shiver me timbers🥶🥶🥶
When you want advice on how to gain muscle, always listen to someone who needed drugs to gain muscle…clown world
@@AliAbrahem As I said in a comment that youtube deleted, Im an exercise science undergrad so he says everything I already know. Its a good refresher tho
The second tip is great. I started doing that awhile ago, basically treating my hands as hooks and I feel it WAY more now than before
Feel is only a part of the process. If you’re getting the same movement and range of motion but more reps with a stronger grip (ie, thumbs used) then that is almost inarguably going to be better stimulus.
@@Masterscotts1 using my thumbs caused me to do less reps since it would put a strain on my forearms and they would give out before my back because I don’t use straps since they broke. So thumbless grip is the go to for me
I've heard "forearms taking over" from a lot of different directions but I don't get what it means. Thumbless grip to me feels like I'm simply handicapping my grip and nothing else. You're still moving the weight with the same back muscles, so apart from a mental placebo, what does it actually add?
@@paoloh885 when you are gripping something you engage your forearms therefore when pulling the weight all of the muscle in your foreman’s begin to start firing away. If you’re moving heavy weight it’s possible that your forearms may give out causing you to not be able to grip the bar anymore even though your back could squeeze out maybe another 1 or 2 reps
@@Mcgurkyyy101 sorry for the late reply: if thumbs out of the equation works best for you then no reason to change! Typically however, grip is overall stronger with thumbs used as opposed to just fingers, and also decreases the risk of tendinitis somewhat. Hook grip could be another solution if you weren’t looking to replace your straps or prioritise some forearm specificity. All the best!
The first one of Jeff’s vids where I’m already doing everything correctly already!
Same! I love lat pulldowns
Same, and im still smalll
It is so nice to see a fitness influencer who just calmly and doesn't yell while using all these crazy editing techniques/effects. (William Li)
I thought he left?
Greg Doucette has left the chat.
😂@@967mviews2
Leave William alone
Keep bringing back bro Jeff please, he's hilarious. Really makes teaching the noobs interesting I find.😅
Yess, I really want to see bro jeff again
More of these shorts, PLEASE! They’re really helpful
That thumbless grip tip probably just saved my pull up game. Thank you
God i love this channel so much and it just exploded out of nowhere
Am liking this individual explanation of exercise and showing everything. Quick and fast summary
Editor needs a raise
Need lqlawi
The funny part about a lot of the advice you provide is that I’ve found myself doing some of it unintentionally or automatically because it just feels to right.
For example this video: I haven’t been to the gym in quite sometime and was never an expert, but I intuitively did all of this advice including letting the last rep go back up real nice and slow for a good stretch. The science behind it only reinforced the habit lol
I'm proud of myself hearing this, I figured out the final negative thing going push ups a long long time ago I remember thinking if you can push up then you can always resist down, I always end my push ups on a negative
Always wondered about the grip. Thumbless is far more comfortable! Thanks for confirming!
Removing the thumb is a solid piece of advice because my forearms kept taking over as I got near the end of the set.
that's the best 'xray' effect I've ever seen in a fitness video.
I didn’t think of straps bro! Thanks been watching you for over 5 years now
Showing off v. effective gains and form. Thanks for sharing
Love the bro jeff examples of what not to do, the comparison between the correct way and completely wrong way is always helpful to see
That grip suggestions is actually great. I used to feel my forearms also work during lat pulldowns and wondered what could be done so that they aren't used as much.
Thank you Jeff this has kept me from injuries and my eccentrics are looking so much better 26 going 27 and ego lifting and going crazy was fun but definitely not viable as you get older thanks man love your content! ❤❤❤
I’m glad I found your channel got me learning
one of the most useful channel;s ive found for workouts
Damn. Knew all of this intuitively just from lifting for 17 years. So its definitely good advice.
The editing of this video is so good top notch quality and info!
I've always wondered if my form for lat pull downs were correct. Thanks for the info
Not using your thumb for grip just makes your grip a bigger limiting factor. Less forearm engagement doesn’t necessarily transfer to more lats engagement
Best tip ever I am tired of seeing others ego lifting in this exercise just to show off their garbage reps.
A wise man once said: “The rep you don’t wanna do is the rep that makes the gains”
Well, this content is way better then introducing weird exercises to a mostly clueless crowd.
Explaining the details of well established exercises is so much better.
Best method standing up and walking to the pullup bar imo
Yep, nothing beats pull ups
For me with my arms fully stretched at the top the plates on the machine are basically resting in each other, at least with pull ups if you’re tall you can bend your knees.
I think both have a place. The movements have overlap but they're not interchangeable. But if I could only do one it'd be pull ups.
Did lat pulldowns earlier, glad to hear I do every one of these tips 🔥 the thumbless grip is a game changer too, kept it for years and will never go back!
The final negative applies to the majority of all exercises.
Mainly for cable excersizes
I’ve been teaching these to my gf as she’s new to weight lifting and I’m glad I’ve been giving her good advice! I’ll be using your channel for other workouts, much love
Great tips. Thanks!
never stop making these educational vids bro
Jeff: Don't lean back this much
FatJoe: Okay, now lean back!
He said not that much!
love the overlaid muscle drawing, great way to illustrate things!
My man Jeff. The forearms aren’t going to take over no matter what grip you use. Using a thumbless grip doesn’t have anything to do with that. You are not going to use more of your back if you use less of your forearms. The reason people feel their lats more going thumbless is because of the position it puts your wrists/hands in. You even said to use straps to combat this which I agree with but it is not because of your forearms “taking over” if you were to use a normal grip
I often switch between the two and it never makes a difference. Been doing pulldowns for 12 ish yrs so I'd imagine I'd feel a difference by now.
@@anon8633I’m the opposite. I’m able to do 15+ full range of motion pull ups and I feel the difference going thumbless. Reason I say pull ups instead of pull downs is because not everyone can do full range pull ups even if you do super heavy pull downs. I’ve always did thumbless just because that was more comfortable for me.
OP is also wrong in stating his reason why people feel lats more for thumbless. The real reason is that when you use your thumb, you naturally just end up squeezing the bar more. That simply makes you use your forearms more.
I've seen videos advising not to use the suicide grip. I'm at the point where I'm just going to do what feels good.
They can still be a limiting factor though
@@justeatingchipsandwatchingsuicide grip is only dangerous in push exercises like bench press, where you could get buried under the bar. going thumbless for pull downs is not “suicide grip”.
the bro lifter characterization is top notch
Straps on the lat pulldown is crazy man
how so?
@@path9938a gym rat once told me that straps prevents you from building strength in your forearms and growing them, if you use straps for all pull exercises every time you’ll get bigger but your forearms will look funnily small
Spot on video with one personal correction because it’s individualistic perhaps to me only, but I actually feel better connection with my back with regular grip.
Hood Jeff kinda reminds me of prison Mike from the office. 😂
This man has helped me so much
I try to put my thumb up on the index finger as much as i can, feels phenomenal
i might try this
Leaning back keeping bro jeff big as hell!!
I just do pull-ups and chin-ups. 🤷♂️
Same.
Go for it,he ain't forcing anyone for doing any particular exercise.
I just love the muscles added into editing it really helps to visualize how to do the workouts
I'd love to know how you make these edits, Jeff
The GOAT!!! Keep it up please! Your Shorts are amazing!!
Jeff, please tell me you were joking about the thumbless grip 😭
Ikr it doesn't make any sense
Yeah makes no sense
Any of you care to elaborate? Made perfect sense to me.
@@Scion15 so basically the thumb has it's own muscle on the hand wich is not a forearm. If you were doing it without the thumb, technically it's harder to grip because it's just four fingers holding on. My best bet is that placebo was the thing making them feel more lat. But a looser grip making you feel more back is just nonsense in my opinion.
Your forearm and back perform two different functions, they cannot "take over" during a pulling exercise because the forearm is responsible for Wrist flexion/extension.
gyms need little tvs on the equipment (or a qr code link) showing this type of video. A+
Forearms taking over? That doesn't make sense
Exactly
Yeah, I can see forearms getting tired from the grip but how can they take over? Maybe he meant to say biceps?
Wouldn't they get tired faster with a thumb less grip anyway
It depends on the grip you use.
With the one shown in the video (pronated grip), it shouldn't happen.
However, with a supinated grip, your forearms and biceps are much more involved.
@@disc06 there’s a big difference between a muscle being more involved vs a muscle taking over. IMO at least.
that no thumb thing is brilliant. cheers
Bro Jeff ^^
please keep doing these shorts, this is insanely useful and quick
arnold schwarzenegger did them like this so i dont gotta say more
You are not Arnold bro
🤡
The difference in my gains after finding this channel is comically huge
"that final negative on that final rep" on every move you can
Def guilty of your last point. I always let the bar 'fly back up' thus losing that last, hard rep. Great info
Thanks for guiding us for so long. Can't believe so much time has passed away and we've come so far 🎉
Also I’m glad I’m not the only one doing the thumbs over thing, I actually do it for lots of random workouts, it feels more natural a lot of time
The cosplays for bad examples are on point😂
Whatever you do just feel your back. Straight forward.
apart form quality content, brilliant edit and effects. Much appreciated!
Grip on the bur is the most important purt. 😂
Youre a great coach. Thank you for your work😊
Love that ur evidence based and have a bc degree . What a rare combo on social media !!
honestly science based lifting is super fun for me idk why people hate it cuz like i laugh in joy everytime i finish a workout with excellent forn.
ikr, it feels sooo much better
I started doing reverse grip lat pulldowns, I’ve seen some amazing results and I can get a real pump that way.
These videos are killer. Such slick editing with great animation. Oh yes, nice gym advice too.
Wow I love the last point, letting the last rep be slow seems like a key thing.
Those back animations are crazy good
Holy shit a real human that works out and doesn’t pump himself with chemicals to fake it till he makes it
Good tips. minus the gym straps
You're right, it feels different when after last rep I slowly put it back. I tend to do it sometimes to reduce noise (shy new gym girl here) but I will do it only this way from now on!
Crazy how high quality his shorts are.
Leaning forward and letting the shoulders loose at the top removes lats completely. Yall still glaze this dude.
explain
@julienwelllife lats are engaged when the shoulder stays engaged. Leaning forward and seeing the shoulder expand removes the lats tension. Your elbows have to remain in front of the body, and no less then roughly 30 degrees away from the body, meaning a fully extended arm typically relocated tension to teres and rhomboids naturally. Single arm pull downs are the best lat grower, because it allows you to keep the weight in front of you, and allows you to shift to either side, making the lat stretch outward, not simply up and down. Hope that helps
You absolutely made a banger short! Well done 👏
I just love this format, keep em coming Jeff
Thank you. I will implement these on my next leg day.
love this. The thumb tip is priceless
Vital information allthough I didn't learn anything new here, that is how I do my pulldowns💪🏼
I like the visual effects. Good job man
I like that he added it (maybe) the most important.
The animations are amazing
I control every negative on the way up, takes away from some of the reps and the weight but the stretch is worth it to me
Was planning on doing lat pulldowns today, thanks Jeff!
Loving the new shorts and style of content J.Nipp!! Yes I’m a fan boy 😅
I love these shorts. all going into a gym playlist.
I did my reps today very slowly... god damnit was this hard. I love it! Thanks for the advise from you and dr. mike
This guy is awesome, actual good information
I like letting the last rep go as it helps me back up again 🆙
At the end of the day you know if you did a good set, doesn't matter if you're swinging your back. If you're pumped up in the back, it's working.
The last tip is just good gym etiquette in general. So many lay machines break because people let the weight fly on the last rep
I get massive forearm pain with lat pulldowns, so I'll definitely try this. I've used open grips on many other exercises; I guess I haven't tried it here yet because you need so much control for pulldowns. Might actually consider straps.
I would also always recommend a hook grip. IF you do it right, it's virtually as relaxed as with straps. And so much more convenient.
Needed this, about to get back into gym after two years of sloppiness
I try doing aloe negatives on my last reps and man that hits different. Thank you for the advice 😤
I just started working out seriously a few weeks ago and I feel uncomfortable dropping the weight fast and I wanna do the motion correctly so I always release the weight slow and extra careful. I’m glad I know this is also important for muscle growth