Greth is wisdom. I agree with almost everything you said. I'm not even a vet, i've played 500h of T:A but i'm already unchasable and feel that I have learned everything.
visual route paths in actual matches sounds nice. maybe something similar to the command mode screen from t1 could be added and used to pick from and initiate or record the routes
Honestly, I understand why they have perks. It give them more knobs to turn so they can "control" the game. Lets look at the flag drag perk. They appear to ONLY want light O to cap. This sort of restriction makes some things easier to balance on the Dev side. For example, you don't have worry about a heavy finding a 250MPH route to flag and tanking his way through the defense. However, at the same time it complicates the game. I would love to try a playtest with NO perks. Just Light, Medium, Heavy classes. What are the fun parts of the game? In broad terms there are very different interactions for every player so the Devs have tried to pre-define those player roles so they can poke into those interactions. In general with have Defense and Offense. However, that is broken down into different stages. Pre-Grab and Post-Grab. During Pre-Grab the fun part for Defense is to foil the capper. Shoot them down before they get to the flag, body block the grab, mess up the route. For the Offense the fun part is to shoot the Defenders, clear the stand and get the speed or opening for the grab. During Post-Grab the fun for the Defense is the chase. To hit that fast disk to stop the capper from getting away, to run down and shoot at the capper as he blurs away into mid field, and to follow him back to his base to try to get the flag back. For the Offense the post grab fun is in getting away from the Defense, running through a hail of disks and making it back to base, and to dodge the chasers for as long as possible. The fun parts of the game are pulsed out for each player. The HoF kind of twiddles his thumbs when the flag is off stand and should he abandon his post in search of interactions he risks a quick re-grab. The chasers don't have a whole lot to do until the flag is grabbed. The base clearers switch to defenders when the flag is held, but often find themselves out of position to do much. - When I play HoF the most fun I get is putting a disk right into the cappers face as he comes in at 250MPH and spoil his run. - When I play Medium D, the most fun is getting that disk hit on the capper as he is about to hit the flag or right after the makes the clean grab then getting the return on the flag. - When I play Medium or Heavy Offense, the most fun is bombarding the defenders and getting into my own little duels and fights. There is also an adrenaline rush when the opposing capper tries to return. - When I play Medium or light offense its all about getting that rush of pure speed and swooping in on the flag and getting away. But you can't design for all this to happen all the time. I do not think these rolls should be enforced via perks. Tribes is about speed and precision aiming. All the fun parts in my experience are about moving fast and aiming well under crazy conditions. Honestly, I would rather have more ways to get to high speed faster than roll enforcing perks. Nothing in this game compares to pure adrenaline rush of trying to shoot the capper or are the capper trying to shoot the chaser while you are both going 250mph. Help us go fast and make it less punishing to make a mistake. Nothing hurts more than missing the hill incline by a few inches and having your momentum die then if you live crawling your way back up to speed. Part of the problem with the flight/ski mechanics of this game is that it is really hard to get to speed, maintain that speed and get into a fast chase. I am fine with it being hard to get a capture, but that should come with more chases. My memory may be jaded with time, but I recall in Tribes 1 there being large open sweeping hills that even let a heavy get up to a decent speed, enough to intercept a capper.
Good video. Currently the only fun thing about capping is the blink pack. As dramatic as it sounds, if they end up removing it or butchering it like some people in the Discord are suggesting, I don't know if there would be anything left in the game that could keep me playing. Maybe I'll try to learn to play medium or something. It feels like they didn't think through the implications when they changed the projectile sizes.
I appreciate the views in this video. The design of the game is leaning too much on capping and not the rest of the team that is needed for CTF. Everyone else that is not capping needs support as well. T3 is shallow right now. It is the kiss of death if Prophecy only focuses on flag capping. To make the game entertaining for 2 of the 14 players (7v7) or 2 of 40 (20v20 - come on, everyone wants the larger team Pubs), is not a winning strategy. The rest of the team is really left to deathmatch or chase a rabbiting capper. That is not innovative or fun long term. If you want casual gamers to find this game and stay, the developers need to find something fun for those players to do. Jetpack deathmatch needs something more to keep the player base.
And so does modded T:A so yeah ... Again it's not a new idea, but I think we need to make it part of the game instead of a side feature. So you can still play the game while learning.
I don't agree with 'ghost' routes. I don't agree with rewind. How old are you? I am not dissing or anything. I am a T1/T2 veteran and I can be taught new tricks, however, in my honest opinion. Spawning naked for me was absolutely the best thing about T2. That is why you coordinated with your defense team on where remote inventory were placed. I have been out of the game for about 12 years. Only because of T:A. The last part of your video was just a rant. I am watching closely and want to buy, but I really hope it is a Free to play model at first or at least a decent online free demo. Edit: The only reason I ask how old you are is because if you came up during the late 2000s or early 2010s I can understand where you are coming from after playing so many other games.
Did you miss the demo from last week's Steam Next Fest? Prophecy said they do not plan a free to play model. But they also estimated a $20 early access price. I expect they will have a few more playtest sessions so make sure you get signed up for those to try out the game. Its definitely alpha, but its also fun. What it is missing is long term depth at the moment. This coming from a Tribes 1 gamer. The DX map is so much fun and a trip down memory lane. I hope they roll out some more classic maps soon.
Extremely good idea with the recorded routes even ing ameplay. Is it a skill to memorize X routes? only for people with a lot of time ... memorizing routes is not fun... DOING them is fun!
Now this is a game that is terrified to innovate when it comes to the maps. You're telling me the best map t3 has going for it is Dangerous Crossing, a super simple map made in the late 90s? The only other visually interesting map is the copy of the Tribes Ascend lava map in theme. And they slaughtered katabatic. So they brought actually nothing to the table yet. Make maps with much bigger hills and space between the bases so the capper can have a journey back to base. Make maps with tubes like mario near the flag that let you do unconventional routes instead of side to side or back to fronts every single time. Literally just try anything new and somewhat innovative at this point. Capping in this game is an absolute snorefest because I guess people want to play the same maps they played in 1998. Dare to ask for something new guys.
I'll check it out! Also, I apologize because, re-reading my comment I didn't comment on the video directly really since I was too passionate lol. I like your idea of a rewind pack. It's something fresh for tribes and I agree the game should set up new players for success with capping. @@AlsoGreth
im not sure i agree with alot of this, i played tribes because it was alot harder and challenging, i dont think it needs to be new player friendly, alot games are not new player friendly and can still be successful, also im not sure drag should be removed either, as a proper capper with the appropriate perk nothing annoys me more than watching some medium lama grab and die when im about to take it myself, its rage inducing, the fact there is no text chat either annoys me because you cant call them out on their shittyness, i dont mind if other people wanna run the flag, but maybe dont do it on the slowest classes and instantly die, ya know? 2 or 3 idiots like this on your team can throw the match edit - ngl tho rewind pack sounds interesting
"like keeping the oven and freezer open to balance the temperature, while the building has no roof" I wish I had your analogy skills, well done sir👍
This game has no legs unless they add the rest of Tribes before release.
Just a question: if you remove the Pathfinder "Role" (gatekeeping as you called it) - what would be the purpose of Light Offense?
Greth is wisdom. I agree with almost everything you said. I'm not even a vet, i've played 500h of T:A but i'm already unchasable and feel that I have learned everything.
Greth out there spitting the truth as usual
visual route paths in actual matches sounds nice. maybe something similar to the command mode screen from t1 could be added and used to pick from and initiate or record the routes
Midair 2 what do you think about that?
Honestly, I understand why they have perks. It give them more knobs to turn so they can "control" the game. Lets look at the flag drag perk. They appear to ONLY want light O to cap. This sort of restriction makes some things easier to balance on the Dev side. For example, you don't have worry about a heavy finding a 250MPH route to flag and tanking his way through the defense.
However, at the same time it complicates the game. I would love to try a playtest with NO perks. Just Light, Medium, Heavy classes.
What are the fun parts of the game? In broad terms there are very different interactions for every player so the Devs have tried to pre-define those player roles so they can poke into those interactions. In general with have Defense and Offense. However, that is broken down into different stages. Pre-Grab and Post-Grab.
During Pre-Grab the fun part for Defense is to foil the capper. Shoot them down before they get to the flag, body block the grab, mess up the route. For the Offense the fun part is to shoot the Defenders, clear the stand and get the speed or opening for the grab.
During Post-Grab the fun for the Defense is the chase. To hit that fast disk to stop the capper from getting away, to run down and shoot at the capper as he blurs away into mid field, and to follow him back to his base to try to get the flag back. For the Offense the post grab fun is in getting away from the Defense, running through a hail of disks and making it back to base, and to dodge the chasers for as long as possible.
The fun parts of the game are pulsed out for each player. The HoF kind of twiddles his thumbs when the flag is off stand and should he abandon his post in search of interactions he risks a quick re-grab. The chasers don't have a whole lot to do until the flag is grabbed. The base clearers switch to defenders when the flag is held, but often find themselves out of position to do much.
- When I play HoF the most fun I get is putting a disk right into the cappers face as he comes in at 250MPH and spoil his run.
- When I play Medium D, the most fun is getting that disk hit on the capper as he is about to hit the flag or right after the makes the clean grab then getting the return on the flag.
- When I play Medium or Heavy Offense, the most fun is bombarding the defenders and getting into my own little duels and fights. There is also an adrenaline rush when the opposing capper tries to return.
- When I play Medium or light offense its all about getting that rush of pure speed and swooping in on the flag and getting away.
But you can't design for all this to happen all the time. I do not think these rolls should be enforced via perks. Tribes is about speed and precision aiming. All the fun parts in my experience are about moving fast and aiming well under crazy conditions. Honestly, I would rather have more ways to get to high speed faster than roll enforcing perks.
Nothing in this game compares to pure adrenaline rush of trying to shoot the capper or are the capper trying to shoot the chaser while you are both going 250mph. Help us go fast and make it less punishing to make a mistake. Nothing hurts more than missing the hill incline by a few inches and having your momentum die then if you live crawling your way back up to speed.
Part of the problem with the flight/ski mechanics of this game is that it is really hard to get to speed, maintain that speed and get into a fast chase. I am fine with it being hard to get a capture, but that should come with more chases. My memory may be jaded with time, but I recall in Tribes 1 there being large open sweeping hills that even let a heavy get up to a decent speed, enough to intercept a capper.
How about adding transports
14:18 made me chuckle xD +1
YOU KNOW WHAT YOU DID!
Good video. Currently the only fun thing about capping is the blink pack. As dramatic as it sounds, if they end up removing it or butchering it like some people in the Discord are suggesting, I don't know if there would be anything left in the game that could keep me playing. Maybe I'll try to learn to play medium or something. It feels like they didn't think through the implications when they changed the projectile sizes.
Once again, Very Well Said!
i rly like ur pack idea greth
also spitting facts as always ofc
very talented in putting thoughts into words my man
I really like the idea of a rewind pack
No 🤬
nice vid
I appreciate the views in this video. The design of the game is leaning too much on capping and not the rest of the team that is needed for CTF. Everyone else that is not capping needs support as well. T3 is shallow right now. It is the kiss of death if Prophecy only focuses on flag capping. To make the game entertaining for 2 of the 14 players (7v7) or 2 of 40 (20v20 - come on, everyone wants the larger team Pubs), is not a winning strategy. The rest of the team is really left to deathmatch or chase a rabbiting capper. That is not innovative or fun long term. If you want casual gamers to find this game and stay, the developers need to find something fun for those players to do. Jetpack deathmatch needs something more to keep the player base.
MA2 already has thé routes menu, saving, practicing. You Can even create scénario with bots.
And so does modded T:A so yeah ... Again it's not a new idea, but I think we need to make it part of the game instead of a side feature. So you can still play the game while learning.
@@AlsoGreth exactly. I've restarted TA 2 days ago but it Always empty :(
It was soooo good imo
I don't agree with 'ghost' routes. I don't agree with rewind. How old are you? I am not dissing or anything. I am a T1/T2 veteran and I can be taught new tricks, however, in my honest opinion. Spawning naked for me was absolutely the best thing about T2. That is why you coordinated with your defense team on where remote inventory were placed. I have been out of the game for about 12 years. Only because of T:A. The last part of your video was just a rant. I am watching closely and want to buy, but I really hope it is a Free to play model at first or at least a decent online free demo.
Edit: The only reason I ask how old you are is because if you came up during the late 2000s or early 2010s I can understand where you are coming from after playing so many other games.
Did you miss the demo from last week's Steam Next Fest? Prophecy said they do not plan a free to play model. But they also estimated a $20 early access price. I expect they will have a few more playtest sessions so make sure you get signed up for those to try out the game. Its definitely alpha, but its also fun. What it is missing is long term depth at the moment. This coming from a Tribes 1 gamer. The DX map is so much fun and a trip down memory lane. I hope they roll out some more classic maps soon.
@@ddade11 Thanks for the info.
As someone that only plays tribes to cap, this really hits the nail on the head. Really well put.
Just Re-skin StarSiege:Tribes and re-release it with new maps. Problem SOLVED.
Extremely good idea with the recorded routes even ing ameplay. Is it a skill to memorize X routes? only for people with a lot of time ... memorizing routes is not fun... DOING them is fun!
Now this is a game that is terrified to innovate when it comes to the maps. You're telling me the best map t3 has going for it is Dangerous Crossing, a super simple map made in the late 90s? The only other visually interesting map is the copy of the Tribes Ascend lava map in theme. And they slaughtered katabatic. So they brought actually nothing to the table yet. Make maps with much bigger hills and space between the bases so the capper can have a journey back to base. Make maps with tubes like mario near the flag that let you do unconventional routes instead of side to side or back to fronts every single time. Literally just try anything new and somewhat innovative at this point. Capping in this game is an absolute snorefest because I guess people want to play the same maps they played in 1998. Dare to ask for something new guys.
Did you see my earlier mapping video? I propose a new archetype. Mapping video from around december.
I'll check it out! Also, I apologize because, re-reading my comment I didn't comment on the video directly really since I was too passionate lol. I like your idea of a rewind pack. It's something fresh for tribes and I agree the game should set up new players for success with capping. @@AlsoGreth
im not sure i agree with alot of this, i played tribes because it was alot harder and challenging, i dont think it needs to be new player friendly, alot games are not new player friendly and can still be successful, also im not sure drag should be removed either, as a proper capper with the appropriate perk nothing annoys me more than watching some medium lama grab and die when im about to take it myself, its rage inducing, the fact there is no text chat either annoys me because you cant call them out on their shittyness, i dont mind if other people wanna run the flag, but maybe dont do it on the slowest classes and instantly die, ya know? 2 or 3 idiots like this on your team can throw the match
edit - ngl tho rewind pack sounds interesting