Thank you Jay. Growing up, my parents bragged about my accomplishments, my looks and my general goodness to others when I wasn’t around to make other people believe that I was supported. At the time, I didn’t fully realize what was happening because I was a kid. For example, we went on a vacation to visit my dad’s family and when we got home, I happened to see that my mom had packed bunch of professionally-taken photos of me in costume from my ballet school. Later I overheard my dad mocking my mother for going overboard in her bragging about me - this was to put her down, not to protect me. I had no idea what was happening but figured it out as an adult when I learned about narcissism. Obviously, being raised by narcissistic psychopaths, I was given no support in the home, to say the least. But, without my knowing, they made other people believe that I was being loved and supported by giving them that impression. They did this on purpose to alienate me, so that no one would ever believe me if I tried asking them for help, and so that they would never assume things were as bad as they were, even if they suspected. I remember one lady from church came to my house to confront my mother about my singing talent and my reservedness, which had caught her attention - she was the mother of 3 happy, healthy daughters. My mother told me about the confrontation and laughed about how she’s told her that my good grades were the proof that nothing was wrong with me. I remember feeling very dissociative at that moment as my mom was basically divulging her own manipulation of me to me, you know?
For the many narcissistic relationships that I have had; they attempted to steal my accomplishments and tried to ruin me. I'm still here...what's left of me.
interfering with someone's self-concept is the main aim of an abuser. This can be parent, friend, therapist (yes, therapist)...any time anyone tries to tell you what you are, what you think, what you feel - that is abuse.
I've often thought I was a target for narcissists and wondered what drew their attacks. Thank you for showing me it's not some weakness on my part; Narcissists are just intimidated by me
They’re intimidated by our strength to be authentic, because it’s precisely what they aren’t able to do… so in order to remain blind to it, they, in a sense, reflect that (despised) image of theirselves onto you. We are like spotlights and they Hate it. But we must not dim our own light for anyone. ✌️💓❤️🩹😚👍
Thank you so much Jay. The Narcissist will never allow you the satisfaction of knowing you did anything good, right, or smart. Zero credit and in some cases negative credit is noted. Your accomplishments are met with stone silence and no facial response whatsoever. It’s like it never happened. This is their lifelong campaign to deny you any form of pleasure or joy in your life. It’s a horrible way to coexist and you will feel it every single day.
Or they take credit for the good you have done and accuse you of doing the harm they have done. I seriously do not know how they can wake up each day and Live with themselves. I absolutely do not understand why they can decide its good and fun to harm others.
Always look for partners/friends who recognize the good traits you possess, especially the ones that are significant for you. They will reinforce those traits in you. Being surrounded by people who don't see/don't want to see your authentic self will lead to confussion and depression. EDIT: narcissists will always downplay good traits you have to something bad. If you are confident, they will say you are arrogant. If you like something about your look, they will make it ugly. They will always find a way to degrade you. The purpose is to destroy your psychological integrity. If you feel confident about whatever thing (look, personality, skill) they will make you doubt yourself.
Yes, this is so true! They will only see the worst in you, and the good things you have some pride in will be twisted into something negative. It's impossible to feel good about yourself.
Yes, spot on. That is how you can detect a covert narcissist in particular. They will subtly degrade you and any attributes to make you doubt yourself. I notice that they never congratulate you for any achievements, never ever. Avoid at all costs! Or if you have to have minimal contact, do it back to them. Don't say anything nice to them...
It really sucks to see how much narcissism has and continues to ruin peoples lives. I can't stop watching videos like these because I am working hard to understand what I went through so I can hopefully heal from the pain and anguish that I have experienced at the hands of such toxic people in my life. It is so hard. Sometimes I feel like I won't ever get over it, but I really want to.
You will. You're already well on your way there, just by wanting healing and pushing for it. Keep working at it and you will have it. The things that you've been through will never stop being painful, but you will get to a place where they no longer harm you or hold you back. And when you get there, you will have an opportunity to help others following in your footsteps. Good luck to you friend, you deserve healing and self-compassion.
Same, we even become disgust as coping manner of being abused, i saw life as hell and won't to live this world, i become negative around people who only thing about themself, i fucking hate people thanks to Narcissist....
Good message ! I recognize a lot as a scapegoat. Everyone that was abused by a toxic narcissist for so many years , and overcome it , are the most mental strongest people. A hell to go through 💯
I survived it . I maintained my sanity at the Cost of having cptsd . The biggest price i pay that i have to be alone and dont have fun whit human connections simply because you see people as potential enemies Who ( if you Dont watch out ) can be narcs.
As sensitive, peaceful child I mostly heard negative things about myself from environment. Nobody complimented me for being considerate for others, instead I've always heard I am weird, shy etc. Since 13 - 24 I've lost awareness of who I am and I was identyfying with negative traits other gave me. Long time of depression and depersonalization. When someone expressed romantic interest in me, I didn't even know how to respond, cause I couldn't believe someone could like weird person like me. But recently I get in touch with my real personality, I find out I am not introvert, I am actually sociable person who blocked my real personality bc it was never appreciated.
My situation was similar to yours. I was a sensitive, peaceful and considerate child. I don't recall ever getting any positive feedback about that. I know now that narcs view these qualities as weak. Instead I was viewed as shy/introvert, weird and defective. I remember once when my narc mother proudly bragged to me about all the qualities in herself as if they were fine qualities... "I am domineering, overbearing, strong... etc". They don't appreciate your qualities but that doesn't stop them from using you for them. To them, 'weak' people deserve to be used. I felt like I wasn't allowed to have a personality. Unfortunately I had difficulty making friends in grade school (I was bullied) so that confirmed my parent's view of me. Although I'm still an introvert, as the decades have passed I am surprised and pleased to see that I am more outgoing than the role cast for me by my mother. I often wonder how I might have turned out if I had been born to supportive non-judgmental parents.
@@lesliegann2737 OMG! It feels like I could write the same comment. *I felt like I wasn't allowed to have a personality* - so true!!!The feeling of being *defective* . I've felt, I have to recompensate being "defective". For example by being nice and helpful. I already had those traits, but I gave too much focus on them hoping I will be accepted by classmates. I was bullied as well, in 2 schools. Kids and teachers confirmed the wrong about me I've learned at home. I never knew how to make friends cause I didn't know how to be pushy and force myself in conversations. But even with that, I could adapt myself, If the environment I was in, was more friendly and empathetic. My mum is dominating and I was always in her shadow. *They don't appreciate your qualities but that doesn't stop them from using you for them* . - Such a great point! If they don't like it, they can fuck off! I do remember who I was as small child, I was not shy at all, it just the lack of any positive feedback that turned me into such. Living in narcissistic world is tough for us sensitive people but never doubt yourself and your power!
Can relate. Instead of recognizing my virtues, I was told that I was embarrassing, weird, and a show off. My achievements were undermined, I was robbed of any validation,and completely devalued... I wasn't good at sports, was never interested, and was too "feminine" because was into the arts. Never good enough, they tried to dim my light and squash my spirit. Summary: I outshined them and made them feel bad about themselves. Jealousy/envy
@@kwaintraub2 I can relate a lot. I was always excluded from group cause they didn't like how I was playing team sports. Also, the other girls (and female teachers) hated me cause I think I was more feminine, I wasn't doing it in purpose, just a side effect of being sensitive and intuitive more than the bully type who destroys everything. Most boys liked me for it, but girls? They hated me for nothing. And since most teachers are women, they saw me as vulnerable prey they need to harass. I've felt so much agression from them, never any warmth or sympathy. So good you didn't let them dim your light. Envious people need to be avoided.
@Terry Mathews ... I often wonder this too. If I was supported, nurtured, and received some attention as a child/ teenager. Would my life be different? Don't get me wrong, I am proud of what I accomplished so far, and I am also proud that I have awakened to a state of inner peace, which is a beautiful thing. This new conscious arose from the narc and scapegoat abuse. Suffering eventually leads to awareness presence. Would I have awoken if I had better parenting?
So grateful for your content! I graduated from college with high honors, and my family did come to the ceremony, but quickly left after, and there was no medal. No party. At the reception at the college. My fellow classmates were confused why I didn’t have anyone there to celebrate with me. I was so used to the behavior. I just said they were busy. I later asked my mother why she had a big party for my sister that graduated the year before and invited all the relatives. She said she didn’t do that for me because she was embarrassed because of my age. I was 30 my sister was 28 she also didn’t seem to notice that I graduated with high honors because she let me know what high achievements my sister had accomplished. I think I’m going to throw myself a graduation party 🎉 I can finally see that it was her not me. Can you imagine she told me she was embarrassed of me. Like I should feel shame for graduating from college with high honors because I was 30.
I can relate. When my gymnastics coach said that I had what it takes to advance ( he was getting out of coaching) at about 12 years old, I was never allowed to take gymnastics again.
Finding safe friends is so important! I now have a small circle of safe friends who show me love, compassion and support. It has helped me feel secure, and it has been a huge turning point in my recovery.
@@backyardfunwithsimone9213 that happened to me too. The more I healed, I attracted more healthy people. Work on your healing. It will happen. Don’t give up. You deserve healthy relationships. ❤️
It's funny (ha ha?) that the only things I can give myself credit for are non-negatives. Like, I'm not addicted to anything, I'm not in debt. I'm not overweight. I've no convictions! I'm not unemployed. I'm half joking but I feel like that's all I can ''lay claim'' to. The clearly POSITIVE things are so much harder. I'm going to try hard here now though. I left my abusive x even though I was really scared. I finally got a secure job which gives me a lot of peace of mind. my daughter got in to Trinity College (a very good university).
There are some dreams/goals in this life which are impossible and must be given up to die. Your narcissist will never be satisfied. It's time to give up on them and put your hope in yourself, where it might do some good.
Thank you so much for capturing the most painful thing about being a scapegoat in your videos. The narcissist projections resulting in the creation of a negative outcome for the scapegoat. No one else seems to understand. They manifest a negative trait in their favorite scapegoat. The scapegoat cannot even let anyone know this because it appears like "not being accountable", so the problem is ignored. The real problem when the narcissist tells the scapegoat "What they are" , in the most vicious, insidious way, and then suddenly the scapegoat, whose natural qualities were honorable/good/of high standard has suddenly exhibited an outburst display. They became what they were told that they were by the narcissist for one second of their life. Thus. ruining self-worth. The scapegoat begins to believe the narcissist, as does all of the influenced. This becomes a battle of will for the scapegoat to undo the damage. No one else is capturing this horrific part of this insidious disease. It was like someone reached into my soul when finally hearing a person acknowledge this in this video and others. I cannot thank you enough for just recognizing this out loud.
My mother, who was completely fine with our father’s brutal, abusive, rage-filled abuse of us, said an odd thing to me about him. He’d just beaten us in a fit of capricious rage. Then he felt badly about it, so he decided to take us out for ice cream. I told my mother I did not want to go, that I was afraid of him. She replied, “Well, don’t you think he’s a little afraid of you, too?” Wtf? What the hell did that mean? I think I may understand that better, now. I’ve always been the one to say, in toxic situations, that it is, indeed, totally effed up. What? Was that supposed to be a secret? I’m left with the strong conviction that, if it can be destroyed by the truth, it deserves to be destroyed by the truth. My mother always knew I was the type to burn it all down to get at the truth.
Dr Ramani has a number of youtube videos on the 'Truth teller' role in a narcissistic family which might be useful to go through. Sorry you went through so much.
Also, the ice cream was not out of guilt but rather the intermittent reinforcement to get you the mental dissonance and the trauma bond, everything on check.
And I can almost bet that even while trying to enjoy that icecream he would easily find evil ways to destroy your "well earned" joy...I hope you are not reachable to any of those two monsters...
@@adrianaalvaradorodriguez6454 Oh, yes, thank you. I’m also glad the experience gave me such a visceral understanding of how other people suffer, as well, and deepened my empathy and compassion. Being the reject actually puts me in far better company.
It is even harder for the scapegoat when the lazy and un-achieving, often failing golden child in the family gets all recognition, while you, no matter how much you present, get a shrug of the shoulders.
You described my scapegoat child experiences exactly. Thank you for the validation!! I’m 76 and have spent the last five years discovering why I am who I am. This is so helpful. When I mention some of these things with my siblings, I get nothing in response from them.
I experience the same with my sisters. Is as if they weren´t in there with me when I was insulted, humiliated, and even beaten. Hurts me and made me take distance from them.
@@Sldindpunjab My two older sister joined my narc, insecure, emotionally dangerous mother and ganged up on me. 40 years later my younger brother joined them. Peace and love to you
@@Sldindpunjab Same with my sister. I asked her (in an email) what she felt and thought about our father beating our dog that yelped in pain and me being left behind when our parents took only her to the zoo...I asked her why she didn't stand up for me or the dog (I was too afraid of my dad to stop him but the dog's screaming still haunts me...) she never answered. Dead silence for weeks now...
I was sent off to boarding school abruptly at 12. Oddly enough I excelled in my own way. So much so that I was an officer in any club that existed and participated in nearly every activity as well as keeping an excellent GPA. By middle of 2nd year I was winning national awards academically in certain subjects and I was abruptly taken home at age 13 to care for an ill parent. And by ill I mean stay in bed, not get up, not dressed, not shower, not eat... Pills and alcohol were involved as was serious clinical depression. There was, other than school, no social life, and intermittent interaction with only the other parent. But the other parent had a career and a public persona to keep up and all older siblings were gone. I was in no way capable of caring for someone in that condition at that age. I had to go back to the school that I had attended from kindergarten through 6th grade where I had lost all of my close friends for the most part as kids are fickle. Also a member or 2 of my family was rather notorious. Let's just say my family was well known including in laws. I struggled to fit in again only to be pulled out and returned to boarding school at the beginning of the following year where of course much had changed and I had lost all of my offices and much of my motivation. Over the years a pattern emerged where that "ill" parent seemingly seemingly accidentally" on purpose" would disrupt important events for me. Additionally I had an extended cousin who was definitely definitely a clinical malignant narcissist who focused upon me and any one and anything I held dear. I've had to learn more than I've cared to about this topic. No one looks out for the children in this sort of of situations and the results are devastating. That was the end of 1972 beginning of 73 when I was taken out of school, the "ill" parent is still alive. let that sink in.
I’m sorry to hear this. There’s another channel I follow that describes this role as scapegoat and “indentured servant”. My mother has been “dying” since me and my siblings were small children. She turns 65 this spring. It was a lot of invisible deceases, fainting spells and the occasional suicide threat. She convinced me and my siblings she didn’t have long to live and kept us in constant fear we would lose her. When she turned 60 five years ago she made a remark “I can’t believe I made it to 60”. Me and my siblings just stared at the floor and did not answer her. By this stage most of us were in our 30s and didn’t believe her anymore. But we dare not say it. I’ve gone no contact with all of them. Including the enablers, who allowed all of those things to happen.
So sorry...yes..I had a check cashing card at 14... BUT to get to the supermarket to buy the groceries for the week and bring them home to process and cook and freeze to make the budget... I had to first get MRS.VALIUM up get her bathed and dressed and when I got to the store ask the pharmacist if I could let her sit there while I shopped. Often she was crwal out of bed while I was doing homework, housework, cooking...and ask me if I THOUGHT IT WAS SAFE FOR HER TO TAKE MORE VALIUM...THEN GO INTO DETAIL ON HER BOWEL HABITS... I WAS LIKE.." LOOK....I AM THE MAID, THE COOK, THE SURROGATE MOTHER FOR MY MESSED UP SISTERS, I HAVE TI DISARM YOU WHEN YOU OULL THE BUTCHER KNIFE ON DADDY.. I CAN'T BE YOUR PHARMACIST OR DOCTOR.. THERE'S THE PHONE YOU CALL THEM... Then I would pray she just would stay in her room and not talk to me at all...
This is so true! I've really struggled with this, because 'worth' (apart from the basic worth of human life) and 'achievement' can be so subjective. I think a lot about context, and things like, 'Secretariat would have been a nobody, in an environment where horses were used to plow or clear trees from farmland.' Where we really get ourselves in trouble is that we want to prove ourselves to be of value in the very environment that CANNOT value us, which prevents us from putting our energies into seeking our proper context. And then we're hampered even further by stupid sayings like, 'bloom where you're planted.' (The originator of that saying was obviously not a gardener!) We feel we must attempt to achieve in an environment that's hostile TO US, rather than seeking out and moving toward an environment in which we actually CAN flourish, achieve, demonstrate our full value, AND be valued by others.
As a child you may also be subjected to the narcissists' strong thrust to isolate you and downplay, even denigrate, any relationship outside the nuclear family that might be positive for you. And of course, in a narcissistic family there is almost no support to be found anywhere from anyone, often including siblings.
It's brutal. I was told that I was too much or too annoying, simply for being a kid that needed love. It's really hard for me to share my needs with people now. In high school I wrote an essay and got an A. I felt so happy about it and showed it to my Dad, hoping for that validation. He read it and said, you plagiarized this, you didn't write this. He went as far as going to my school and telling my teacher this. Something broke inside me that day. My teacher pulled me aside later and said he knew I wrote it, but yea, I'll never forget that humiliation. I struggle a lot with procrastination now, feeling like, what's the point? I think it's one of the most devastating impacts of the abuse I experienced at home. That and feeling like no one could possibly love a failure and a defective weirdo like me, despite my life looking good on paper. I'm thankful for resources like this video, I've learned a lot and my healing journey is rocky, but I'm getting there
It's just unbelivable! You had lot of strenght to go through all this bs. I understand the procrastination, it's the feeling that no matter what you do, your energy won't be properly reciprocated.
I’m so sorry you experienced that. It made me cry as I’ve experienced similar things in my childhood. You didn’t deserve that and I completely understand your feelings today as I have felt very much the same way. The blessing is that there is hope at the end of the tunnel. Since I’ve decided to go no contact with my Dad, I feel a huge relief. I’m sleeping well now, I feel I’m healing now and have hope for the future. I never deserved what was dished out to me but I know I can move forward now and leave his illness behind. It’s taken a lot of work, tears and compassion for myself but I’m feeling the changes. Best wishes to you!
Thank you Jay. This gives me a better understanding of why my Dad made me quit the drill team when I ran home to tell him I made the highest course out of the 83 girls who tried out. (Had never been allowed to dance as a child and all the others had danced since they were small). Why he refused to attend parents night for the National Honors society two years in a row. Why just last year he told me my degree was a complete waste of money, I graduated with honors with an accounting degree. He refuses to see who I am as a person and can’t acknowledge the sacrifices I made as the oldest child caretaker of his “other two” who he prefers. He abandoned us and was later forced to take full custody. I think he was angry that as a 12 year old I couldn’t handle raising my little sisters with a non-functional alcoholic. He decided I was defective because the social workers recommended I get therapy because I had taken on the role of mother to my younger siblings. Such a sad situation. He missed out on having a daughter that only wanted to have a healthy relationship with him.
Thank you so much for this! It values my situation and feelings so much. I experienced exactly the same. I was humiliated and shamed for speaking up for my rights and for telling my parents that they are not allowed to treat me so badly. My whole childhood and adolescence was filled with arguments over this. I always had to fight and never achieved anything like fairness from my family. Although I have always had this subtle feeling of extreme pride in the back of my subconscious. Like I could feel it was coming from my strong strong highest self who wanted to remember me of my worth. But unfortunately the shame I internalized often beats that true voice. It was too long and to intense what I experienced and I really struggle to feel like I deserve the best in life. I want to encourage everyone who is reading this: trust the smallest voice in your head, that you are worthy. It’s your birth right and nothing can take that away from you. I am proud of everyone who had to suffer like that and I am so 100% sure, that you are amazingly strong. 💪 💕
I am 57 and have never ever known until now this very minute that a narcissist could be the very person that gave birth to me, likewise with the very person I would soon learn to call Dad. I always thought that a narcissist was a person outside of family, an overly insecure girlfriend, a so called friend that gets off on giving me wrong advice, an outsider just out for their own ends. Thinking about it now, maybe that's what my narcissistic parents taught me & wanted me to believe all along, maybe it was their way of ensuring I never doubt or question the abuse they offloaded onto me and to only be on the look out for it coming from outside sources, I'm now beginning to doubt absolutely everything they ever taught me, I also have to call into question my 3 younger siblings who must feel blessed for not being chosen for the lead role of Black Sheep Scapegoat and I can honestly say that if it had to be one of us I'd of stepped up for the slaughter to save their lives & futures, trouble is I know only to well that my 3 siblings are my narcissistic mothers go to, so when I stick up for myself it's not long before I'm attacked from all sides simultaneously. I've never been a religious person but Jesus, I sure feel I need him now, So help me God.
I have experienced the exact same thing. It took me 3 decades to get the whole story and only in the last 3 years of learning about Narcissism and all the related terminology was I able to break all contact with my family of origin. It's been nearly two years and I feel massively relieved. You can do this. Keep going, believe people when they show you who they are. Take care of yourself. 💖🙏
@@dnk4559 Don't we know it Pal. I have a personal question I'd like to ask you, feel free to reply or decline, either way you have my respect. I live in the UK and know a person called Dave Nailor also in the UK. I spent some of my early teens with D. Nailor, we were both red heads, my then single father dated D. Nailor's mother a lady called June. I'm not sure whether you are the same person but if you are was it my profile picture along with my surname that gave it away? My father's surname (Harrington) was very well known in the village & associated with trouble. Basically are you the same Dave Nailor????. Kind Regards.
Thank you Jay, these explanations help to put what we experienced (and still experience) into words. I'm the son of a narcissistic father, my family has always been dysfunctional and abusive, resulting in my younger brother taking his life in 2012 at the age of 21. I haven't been the same since, nor do I expect to ever fully heal, but your videos are a help in trying to get my life back together. Much love.
This really resonates with me . My covert narc mother delighted in raging and tearing me down daily with the never-ending screaming, name calling and insults . There seemed to be this belief that the oldest girl was born to be the family servant you kicked every day . She didn't even need any time spent showing me how to do things , I was just expected to know and perform tasks in the manner SHE did. By the timeI was 10 I knew that I couldn't do ANYTHING right. - everything seemed to be a setup for a reason to rage at me . Certainly by that age I was shut down and had become 'demand resistant' as I've heard it called now . This trait has not served me well in life but probably saved my sanity when I was a kid .
Y the time I was 10 I realized my family needed to treat me badly. I, too, was subject to constant ongoing criticism, so I exhausted myself try ING to conform uncomplainingly to every demand and twist and turn of my mother's contradictory expectations. With her I experienced a tangle of double binds and reciprocal spirals -- crazy making demands. She was already asserting that I was mentally ill. After 6 months I observed she never noticed a single effort I made. My father was also grossly and violently abusive. I knew my family was messed up and I was in a Hell hole and I needed to get out. I knew if I ran away I could not survive and would be caught and returned to my family where they would retaliate even more. I longed to grow up so I could be free. It was a daily heartfelt fantasy. I badly needed to escape as did my little brother. I immersed myself in studying, not just my schoolwork, but I taught myself many things. I read our entire encyclopedia set as well as my mother's college textbooks. She had returned to college and had enrolled in a program giving her advanced standing for her RN. Thus I studied surreptiously her texts on the history of philosophy, anthropology, sociology, industrial psychology as well as literature for an English course. On my own I read books on the humanities. By the time I entered college at age 17, I had more or less the equivalent of a college degree. To this day nobody in my family ever knew I was teaching myself these things, which allowed me to live in another world. Of course, there were many more challenges after I physically left my family. It turns out lifelong recovery efforts are needed on all levels of yourself. My story sounds so bad it shocks other people and it can distort new relationships if I recount my personal narrative to anyone who is not also a survivor. Thank goodness I've been able to share with friends in that group.
I relate to this so much! Especially when you said “she didn’t even show me how to do things, I was just expected to know and perform tasks in the manner SHE did”. My mom didn’t teach me anything, not a single thing, & she took great joy in telling me I didn’t know how to do anything. It feels so good to be no contact.
Vanessa seems to me "Me from parallel universe" , We moved to another place, and i started going to new scool. the first word of motivation i ever heard was from my "Sociology" teacher in 9th grade. It was just a simple line, "Good , you did that really good," she picked my assignment and showed it to other few students in the class. It was all very strange , didn't feel anything.. but what happened .. from then on I became unstoppable, The best in her class.. and I needed to maintain this in every course because I just don't want that motherly teacher lose confidence in me and got better, started concentrating and topped 9, topped 10 .. it was insane because before that i hardly passing any of my classes, and here whole school taking me as some genius -
I know as I did much the same. Teachers thought I wasn't a prodigy. I'm not so sure of that. I studied with so much intensity I think that alone could explain my high performance. I was just a sort of regular kid getting more or less mediocre grades until the fourth grade, when I got so meaningful encouragement from my teacher, Mrs. Wins. Thank you Mrs. When from long ago!
Aside from my annual visits with my doting grandparents, I never really experienced praise for a job well done until I went to private school. That place gave rewards for successful effort, instead of only punishment for not doing as well as expected. We got incentives which really motivated me.
One of the best videos. Self-sabotage, my daily pain. Even when I am receiving external validation, I feel like I don´t deserve, they assumed something wrong or I am less than the rest of the people. I am never enough.
As a child I did not have any self worth. I was always told and showed by my mother that I was not good enough. When I scored good marks in school, she only focused on that one mistake that I made, never complimenting on how great I did. She never liked how my bare face looked. Even while at home all day long, I always had to use eyeliner for my eyes and brows because she did not like how I looked without them. Because I lived my entire childhood doing eyes and eyebrows, I did not have any confidence to show my real face to anybody, even to my husband. Finally after 9 years of marriage he saw! My mind works like nobody will like me without it. I am slowly coming out of this at 40 yrs of age but still feel a sense of shame in showing my bare face to anyone, even to my husband. At 7-9 yrs of age, I loved organizing my home. During summer vacations, when my parents go for work, i would pick a room and mop, clean floor, shelves, rearrange and make it look good. It typically took me from morning till evening to finish my task. I would be so tired by evening but I loved what I did. But my mother, when she comes back from work, will mostly focus on that one bottle that I misplaced. By age 10, I stopped arranging rooms because i really felt I was not getting enough credit for the effort I put. It used to make me feel very sad. Looking back, I am so proud of that little girl who put her heart and soul into organizing without anybody even asking her to do it.
It DOES feel like a slog... Once again a REALLY helpful video with insight and hope. I almost gave up last week... I was really discouraged... But I ran into some of my drawings from decades ago and was STUNNED at how good they are.. I thought I had lost or thrown away all of them. I am working up to taking time and space and courage to sit with some them and remember how it felt to spontaneously WANT to draw something and ignore the crazies in my life at THAT time ..long enough to just do a simple drawing.... Once again, thank you for your thoughtful, intelligent content... You are helping a lot of people who from the comments... I can see have lived in purgatory all their lives for NO OTHER REASON THAN AN ACCIDENT OF BIRTH...
I’ve been working on giving myself the “medals” for a little over a year now. It started out really small, but day by day, it has made a huge difference. I have come so far. When I look back to how I felt and operated then, it feels almost like a different person.
@Billy B Start out really small. I mean small. When I did something positive or new or fun, really anything just for me, I would reward myself with something small that I liked. And when I mean small, I mean like a cup of tea or playing a favorite song. That was the foundation. A little more than a year later, I am comfortable with giving myself praise! Baby steps to big leaps.
My step father not only downplayed all my efforts to help them , but took credit for my work and told my family I did nothing . I feel like I wasted 12 yrs of my life trying to help them with there rental properties .and I doubt I'll get a dime from them when they pass because my selfish sisters will come and take everything . Such bs . I did not know he was what he was until I did some research on someone taking credit and being fake . He would run and jump on a lawnmower anytime someone would visit like he had been working all day , then jump off it five minutes later to greet our guest . And my sisters hate me because he made me out to be a bad person while making himself look good . And it wouldn't have taken 12 yrs if he had not done one thing during that time . Pathetic , I worked part time jobs to make things work . He blamed me for being lazy . I was already getting up at 330 in the morning and working tell 8 at night for yrs . And he would tell me how lazy I was all the time as he had a fat bowl of ice cream . Self projecting punk . I hope he gets what he deserves one day . Little punk
Thank you so much for this. I can relate to most of what you said here. My narcissistic mom, especially down played my accomplishments. I can't think of one time she didn't. It is something I still struggle with to this day. This video explained a lot!
Oh yes, my narc mom told me on my college graduation day that I was getting a Bachelor of Science degree with a stupid/easy degree. Did she get her degree? Of course not. Jealousy/envy rearing its ugly head!
💔🤦🏿♀️ my childhood was exactly like this. My biological parents are messed up. This hurts me. I can't even rationalize it how people can do that to a child.
I have been starting to watch 1 or 2 of these videos a night. Coming to terms with this has not been easy or something that I was even pursuing. Thank you for making these videos and this informative available to me. I am trying to understand where I have came from and why I am here. Every situation is different, but I feel like this could be a potential road map to some positive feelings that I thought might exist, be have eluded me in these last 38 years.
Tactic #3 sounds good. Will try it. Can you make a video on narcissistic smear campaigns and how they try to damage your reputation & image among extended family and social circles?
This hits home for the thing I did on my own. It was challenging physically and mentally. Out of the norm accomplishment. I don't expect extreme accolades. But just a little "nice job" would have been nice. But hey I got zero response because I was only doing activities for me and not them. My one friend told me he's proud of me. Family thinks nothing of me.
I did get praised for good grades, etc, but much was shunted to the G.C., as far as things that i had created or earned. I felt like the old clunker car sitting in the driveway, from which they could casually steal parts for the golden child. I would come up with a project or an idea. I would work on it, make arrangements, do extra chores to earn money for needed supplies. I would launch it. Then the younger golden child would see it, want it for herself, beg, nag, and throw temper tantrums. Our mother would snatch it away from me and hand it off to golden child, (who did not have to earn any of it). Then would behave as if it had been the golden child's all along. I became, in some ways, almost averse to even trying, because i knew that much of the time, if I were to succeed, they would wrest my ball away from me, and hand it to the golden child to run with, praising her every step of the way. The fact that i had earned or created it was forgotten. Why make the effort? I learned to avoid the golden child, lest she take too much of an interest in what i was doing. That was the only way that I could figure out to protect myself and what was rightfully mine. For the past 30 years, I have had to listen to demands for an apology to the G.C., because "I did not include her." The reason for that was because i knew what that would cost me. Every. Single. Time.
As always Jay, you send multi-level clarity chains our way with this re-frame. Before watching this, I felt 'wrong / weak / needy' for wanting or seeking any rightful self-worth recognition. It became too dangerous a prospect in any case, because the likelihood of shaming was too greater risk, yet I couldn't articulate any of this before. Many other threads too, all of which are now detangling as a result of your generosity of spirit and professional knowledge. Powerful, thank you ^^
When I realise what I have really been through and the effects it has on me today. I just want to punch the hell out of a punching bag or get a real hug from someone who really understands.. Just maybe it will help
I was watching pre-Olympic interviews with parents and some were CRYING and saying things like, "He's been working SO HARD for this"! And parents just DEDICATED to the sports FOR the kids! WELL NOT MY MOM! My Mom was a wretched bully BITCH! BUT she forced me to do ALL OF IT anyways! I did WIN and I worked REALLY HARD but it HAD TO BE all about HER! YOU HAD TO focus on her! It was strange thinking back about it! She was such a strange person.
Its so weird when we see these displays of pride, affirmation isn't it? Its hard to swallow that this is what it could have / should have been for us too. And then on top you were supposed to focus on the one who is negating you?! Horrible. I feel you, sister. NOBODY can take away all that you achieved which you know in your heart ^^
My parents also encouraged me to do all kinds of sports and I was good at it. But that was all about them...as you say. The thing is I knew this even as I was participating as a teenager which made me hate that sport. Who knows if I could actually have enjoyed it were it not for my parents pushing me so hard to achieve. And oh, the disappointment when I do not achieve what they had in mind. And the pain in my heart for being such a disappointment to them. Gawd! It was all just insane.
Thank you. This is a reminder for me to slow down and really take in the successes I create everyday. I keep a journal to write things out, but I recognize I have a difficult time really feeling the success. I place many conditions onto success rather than keeping it simple and clear cut. I have to take the toxic conditional layers off, (which are mostly subconscious), and discard them, before I can really ‘see’ and feel the success before me. These conditions are the infected mandates of my parents and a sick society. On a bright note: once I unearth a layer I can remember for the most part to take it out of the mix. Each time will make it easier. It’s hard going though. May we all experience Unconditional love. 🕊🙏🕊
As a smart, strong healthy girl, I knew to silence any pride or achievement or recognition. I am paralyzed by this shame as an accomplished adult and have journeyed long and hard to understand, accept and now move past the narcissistic family dynamics that haunt me. This practical advice and clear description of my experience is, I expect, going to be the life-changing knowledge that fuels my next forward movement. Well done, Jay!
Thank you, Jay. I really appreciate your empathy and your courage to articulate how it feels to be robbed of self-worth "medals." I plan to do your exercise - finding 3 reasons to feel proud of myself each day. Think I'll practice being on the lookout through each day for the lovely three. I like that this feels like an eminently do-able baby step in a healthy direction. Also, of course, I want to practice loving myself no matter what's going on or not going on in my life, even when I mess up at times, or when I'm simply being me, breathing, perhaps walking with no particular destination, perhaps humming.
Thank you Dr Jay. I really love your series with the Scapegoat Black Sheep child. I have been in recovery for about three and a half years with a really solid resource team around me. I have some of these interjects that remain, and flow through my thinking. It's like having the voice of my mother or ex-husband in my mind. I believe it's my own thoughts, talking me out of my choices or going to try something new. And many times it can send me back to this catastrophic thinking, where I will just think so black and white until I realize, oh my gosh, let's just stop and breathe. Let's look at the facts here. Let's itemize why you're thinking or feeling this. .... It's been one of the hardest things to stop, and self-actualize. The inner critic voice we instantly think is our own when really it's that of my mother's voice or my ex-husband's voice drilling that shame or devaluation, questioning my worth. Even though neither one are in my life anymore, the damage of them consistently talking me out of my strengths, or my passions, heck,.. even my choices, truth, reality ....it does take a toll. 🙏 Thank you again for all of your wonderful education. I'm really glad I found your channel. There's a whirlwind of information out here on youtube, and it's hard to find people that really break everything down and explain the human behavior aspects along with the psychology aspects of both the codependent scapegoat, and the narcissistic abuser.
I started publishing poetry in magazines as a child. In that era, you sent out your manuscript by mail with a self-addressed stamped envelope (SASE). When I got a ms. back, my narc mother would rip it open and make fun of what I had written. Around age ten, she changed her response and started saying that I must have plagiarized. It was an inadvertent validation, because I realized she was saying that it was good and this was the only way she could find to attack me. It was bittersweet, because I also realized that attacking me was the only thing she cared about.
Inside their “False Reality Field” the Scapegoat will NEVER be good enough! Difficult to break out, because they are many against one, and do all to break your Reality down 😔
My sister used to literally say, 'What do you want, a medal?' I think she heard it from a teacher originally, but she used it every time anyone around her did something worth recognition!
Jay, I would like you to speak about the siblings. Why do they deny the reality and they don´t stand up for the scapegoat child. And how after a lot of years, seems like they suffer from amnesia when the scapegoat child is deeply traumatized. Thank you.
Thank you. Everytime I watch your channel I get emotional. You describe my youth with my narcissistic mother and enabling father so precisely! The ongoing difficulties to gain self worth, the struggle of falling back into the same trap of needless shame and self criticism, just because I never got those, rightfully deserved medals! The hardest part is to really start believing that there wasn 't much wrong with me in the first place. I was just a menace to my mothers insecurity, and therefore she made it her job to belittle and shame me, over and over again. The many, many times I got a bucket of anger and wrath over me, just because I was a soft hearted and sensitive child....as a result I draw back into a fantasyworld, started writing stories, make drawings, and read a lot. I m glad to say that my mother did not succeed in destroying me, as she did with my father, who now is in his eighties, and made to believe he is a complete failure. He has withdrawn in some sort of pseudo dementia. I can tell that this is the result of narcissistic abuse, because when I interact with him when my mother is not paying attention, he suddenly gets clear eyed and some colour returns in his face. Then I see his normal, lovely personality shining through the fogs. Though my dad is beyond saving, I will keep on working at my self worth. Thank you so much for making sense of all this miserable crap.
Thank you for this video. It has helped me to regain perspective in a community that has scapegoated me for years and made me (and possibly a few other individuals) the perpetual dumping ground for their shame, insecurities and inadequacies.
Jay, I cut my parents and brother off. It's been almost 2 years. I was indeed the scape goat. I'm extremely skilled and naturally talented at a multitude of things. And no matter how much I tried to show my father how much I honed his craft, as you said, he would NEVER EVER give me recognition. And if he did it was only if someone else mentioned it in front of him. Fast forward to now, I just couldn't get myself to move forward in life. I kept procrastinating, feeling "tired" etc. I KNOW I can be successful, but something kept telling me "why bother?" And I couldn't put my finger on where that originated from until THIS VIDEO. I've literally won awards for skilled trades, bodybuilding, athleticism etc and no one in my family ever celebrated with me. I went from a bachelor pad with roaches to a penthouse - and nothing. The mere thought of trying again mentally exhausted me until I watched this video. You helped me remember that I will be rewarded, and recognized by the right people. And the success I create is also mine to enjoy!! Thank you so much for your work, you literally changed my life and helped me get over the final sticking point in my recovery!
That resonates so much. Only I took that message at face value pretty early on and pretty much stopped trying. I mean, what's the point of trying anything if I'm going to be crap at it anyway? I'm the only child out of the 3 of us who got mid to mid-low grades in school instead of constantly being on top, didn't do any activism, and pretty much refused to attend half of the lessons in children's music school. I kind of started liking my autistic brain in recent years, but at moments like this I hate it because there's so much BS I took at face value and genuinely believed for so long, and still can't throw out of my subconscious.
I like how you discuss how the scapegoat is often the most emotionally strong member of the family. I was made to feel i was a crybaby as a child, but I think the reason I cried so much as a child was because I was the only one physically abused by my mother and i got the grunt of the emotional abuse from my mother. As an adult I rarely cry, and when my dad passed I had to be the rock for the family even temporarily becoming my mother's "golden child" since I did so much for her. Needless to say now I don't think my mom is happy with any of her 3 children as we all recognize her abuse tactics and openly communicate with each regarding our mother to avoid any more games.
Thank you for your continuing efforts to increase comprehension of the dynamics at play, beginning in early development, and how they influence our self-perception and behavior as adults, more than likely, myself included, while in some sort of connection to another narcissist. The adult life we were so properly prepped and primed for. On a side note, my mother was/is the narcissist and my father the enabler, so when I heard you using my first name (Vanessa) in your example illustration, my ears were perking up quite a bit 😊
A sensitive narcissist, a friend of mine usually gives me a negative opinion when I tell him that he overwhelms me and that I don't enjoy being with him. He thinks I'm making a big mistake because I don't want to get as close to him as he would see. He is a person with very high personal energies and I have little energy. This means that during the meeting and conversation, he naturally and strongly dominates me, overwhelms me, sets the tone of the conversation, indicates what to do and how to look at the world. Most often it is only he who speaks. Let him live with this approach, why do I need a person who dominates me and overwhelms me with his content. At the same time, He is unreflective and does not want to change (he said himself that he did not want to learn anything new, it was very memorable for me). So with such a mental set this colleague probably has no chance at all to have any self-awareness, to see himself as the one who has a lot of influence on me, and so negative and overwhelming. Fortunately, I have reflections and draw worse or better conclusions. And although my Soul is very naive and childishly clinging to him, my consciousness somehow refuses to give in to it. And again and again I communicate to him that contact with him is not the same pleasure for him that he feels when he can pour out his energies on me. But it's not my business what he thinks or how he lives the world. My Soul would like to help him, but looking soberly there is no real chance that I can show him something. Only he himself may want to recognize something. And if he doesn't want to - then he'll be the same stiff, accusing and guilty guy and let him stay that way. My life is my life and I have no other, so I have to take care of myself if I want this life to be as-is.
This is so validating and was so desperately needed, thank you. I knew this within myself but could not express it and wasn’t sure if what I felt so strongly was right.
I remember that in fifth grade, I was the school spelling champion. Not that I ever expected my mother to say, good job! But I was still taken aback when, ten years later, my younger brother was bad at spelling and she said, well, I had been that way too. I didn't expect her to remember my accomplishments, but I also didn't expect that she would transform them into their exact opposite.
My mother is narc/borderline. She would take my "medals" and boast too expressively to others about it that 1. it made me embarrassed of the medal and 2. it felt that it was all about her and had nothing to do with me. Because of this I was always uncomfortable when won awards or I would do something on purpose to not win them when I saw that I'm about to win. That shame of her unnatural boast still feels heavy and I'm over 40ty now. I felt she was jealous and she still found a way to steal it from me. I learnt to self sabotage myself as it was more bearable than feeling that shame. To add insult to injury, my father's reaction would always be "you've just got lucky". God gives us talents, but devil has tricks to lock it all and never to be seen. We need to fight this evil.
Thanks a lot for the movie !! I have a familiar narcissist who seems to be very cunning and clever. In his statements, he indicates his great modesty and tries to position himself in such a way as to confuse them, as if they were trying to dominate him. And he - so poor - but still with honor (in his imagination) endures this humiliation from other people ... Such a game. This bothers me because I have no intention of rising above him. But his artificial submission as if he were the victim of someone makes the other person automatically a torturer. And this is already distasteful. And one that is hard to translate, because he has very strong personal energies and uses them to put pressure on the other side to come into his play.
I wish to heal from good people, real people! Someone that connects to me instead of tear me down. I had to fight alone for too long. They scare me.. I sense alot of bad vibes around my family. They'll sabotage my life. Love these videos
Every video I watch of yours is spot on to my particular situation. The validation I receive is incredibly satisfying. Did you learn this information from a textbook? or was it the many hours spent with clients and then coming up with your own conclusions. I find you so helpful and very much appreciate you positing these vids.
It helps me keep perspective snd remember that these are pathological family “systems” - the narcissist and their human “drones” to drop in and dump some shame and contempt and condemnation on you should you dare to act like a normal, healthy adult around them….. absolutely astonishing that some of these family members see and comment on the cruelty one day, then advocate and participate in the abuse the next.
Brilliant, spot on! So often I've felt my good deeds/efforts got 'absorbed' and were 'invisible'. Going to start a Medal Journal....what a great idea! Thank you for your videos 🤗
I have a huge disorder because of narcism. I have a hard time motivating my self. Thanks for this video. Every one i know is under q witchcraft spell from TV. My dad has turned into the worst monster. I keep absorbing his unstable energy and i hate it. I have to keep on distancing. Wishing that he wasnt like this.
What happens when you’re still close physically and all that but stop living by their rules, content to suffer their consequences as the price to live your life?
What happens is you are sacrificing 95% of a real and equal partnership based in love and respect for a mere physical transaction that’s ultimately empty and fleeting. To be trapped into that space with so little when you see others are in good, functional relationships is a very painful setup.
THANK YOU for all the videos and information. Have you ever done a video on how a grandmother or grandfather as the matriarch or patriarch narcissist orchestrates the multigenerational roles and extended abuse through parents, aunts uncle and cousins etc?
Thank you Jay. Growing up, my parents bragged about my accomplishments, my looks and my general goodness to others when I wasn’t around to make other people believe that I was supported. At the time, I didn’t fully realize what was happening because I was a kid. For example, we went on a vacation to visit my dad’s family and when we got home, I happened to see that my mom had packed bunch of professionally-taken photos of me in costume from my ballet school. Later I overheard my dad mocking my mother for going overboard in her bragging about me - this was to put her down, not to protect me. I had no idea what was happening but figured it out as an adult when I learned about narcissism. Obviously, being raised by narcissistic psychopaths, I was given no support in the home, to say the least. But, without my knowing, they made other people believe that I was being loved and supported by giving them that impression. They did this on purpose to alienate me, so that no one would ever believe me if I tried asking them for help, and so that they would never assume things were as bad as they were, even if they suspected. I remember one lady from church came to my house to confront my mother about my singing talent and my reservedness, which had caught her attention - she was the mother of 3 happy, healthy daughters. My mother told me about the confrontation and laughed about how she’s told her that my good grades were the proof that nothing was wrong with me. I remember feeling very dissociative at that moment as my mom was basically divulging her own manipulation of me to me, you know?
For the many narcissistic relationships that I have had; they attempted to steal my accomplishments and tried to ruin me. I'm still here...what's left of me.
interfering with someone's self-concept is the main aim of an abuser. This can be parent, friend, therapist (yes, therapist)...any time anyone tries to tell you what you are, what you think, what you feel - that is abuse.
i wonder what makes them believe they even have the right?! they think they're gods or something?! it's so disturbing.
I've often thought I was a target for narcissists and wondered what drew their attacks. Thank you for showing me it's not some weakness on my part; Narcissists are just intimidated by me
They’re intimidated by our strength to be authentic, because it’s precisely what they aren’t able to do… so in order to remain blind to it, they, in a sense, reflect that (despised) image of theirselves onto you. We are like spotlights and they Hate it. But we must not dim our own light for anyone. ✌️💓❤️🩹😚👍
Thank you so much Jay. The Narcissist will never allow you the satisfaction of knowing you did anything good, right, or smart. Zero credit and in some cases negative credit is noted. Your accomplishments are met with stone silence and no facial response whatsoever. It’s like it never happened. This is their lifelong campaign to deny you any form of pleasure or joy in your life. It’s a horrible way to coexist and you will feel it every single day.
They are completely envious, poor souls.
@@adrianaalvaradorodriguez6454 yes, it was all about money, positions and power, no wonder they had any loyal friends....
Thank you 🙏bless
Or they take credit for the good you have done and accuse you of doing the harm they have done. I seriously do not know how they can wake up each day and Live with themselves. I absolutely do not understand why they can decide its good and fun to harm others.
so true.....
Always look for partners/friends who recognize the good traits you possess, especially the ones that are significant for you. They will reinforce those traits in you. Being surrounded by people who don't see/don't want to see your authentic self will lead to confussion and depression.
EDIT: narcissists will always downplay good traits you have to something bad. If you are confident, they will say you are arrogant. If you like something about your look, they will make it ugly. They will always find a way to degrade you. The purpose is to destroy your psychological integrity. If you feel confident about whatever thing (look, personality, skill) they will make you doubt yourself.
And enjoy the pain they inflict into you while doing it.
Yes, this is so true! They will only see the worst in you, and the good things you have some pride in will be twisted into something negative. It's impossible to feel good about yourself.
Yes, spot on. That is how you can detect a covert narcissist in particular. They will subtly degrade you and any attributes to make you doubt yourself. I notice that they never congratulate you for any achievements, never ever. Avoid at all costs! Or if you have to have minimal contact, do it back to them. Don't say anything nice to them...
It really sucks to see how much narcissism has and continues to ruin peoples lives. I can't stop watching videos like these because I am working hard to understand what I went through so I can hopefully heal from the pain and anguish that I have experienced at the hands of such toxic people in my life. It is so hard. Sometimes I feel like I won't ever get over it, but I really want to.
You will. You're already well on your way there, just by wanting healing and pushing for it. Keep working at it and you will have it. The things that you've been through will never stop being painful, but you will get to a place where they no longer harm you or hold you back. And when you get there, you will have an opportunity to help others following in your footsteps. Good luck to you friend, you deserve healing and self-compassion.
Same, we even become disgust as coping manner of being abused, i saw life as hell and won't to live this world, i become negative around people who only thing about themself, i fucking hate people thanks to Narcissist....
Thank you for sharing this. It helps
me feel less alone.
Radical acceptance is needed!
I think there must have been a generation of our parents who are narcissist's so we all suffer their burden as their children for our whole lives
Good message ! I recognize a lot as a scapegoat. Everyone that was abused by a toxic narcissist for so many years , and overcome it , are the most mental strongest people. A hell to go through 💯
Amen to that sister 💪
I survived it . I maintained my sanity at the Cost of having cptsd . The biggest price i pay that i have to be alone and dont have fun whit human connections simply because you see people as potential enemies Who ( if you Dont watch out ) can be narcs.
As sensitive, peaceful child I mostly heard negative things about myself from environment. Nobody complimented me for being considerate for others, instead I've always heard I am weird, shy etc. Since 13 - 24 I've lost awareness of who I am and I was identyfying with negative traits other gave me. Long time of depression and depersonalization. When someone expressed romantic interest in me, I didn't even know how to respond, cause I couldn't believe someone could like weird person like me. But recently I get in touch with my real personality, I find out I am not introvert, I am actually sociable person who blocked my real personality bc it was never appreciated.
Wow- you’re awesome and amazing and I can relate 100%
I’m proud of you and keep going,
Learning and growing 😉
❤️👌☺️✌️
My situation was similar to yours. I was a sensitive, peaceful and considerate child. I don't recall ever getting any positive feedback about that. I know now that narcs view these qualities as weak. Instead I was viewed as shy/introvert, weird and defective. I remember once when my narc mother proudly bragged to me about all the qualities in herself as if they were fine qualities... "I am domineering, overbearing, strong... etc". They don't appreciate your qualities but that doesn't stop them from using you for them. To them, 'weak' people deserve to be used. I felt like I wasn't allowed to have a personality. Unfortunately I had difficulty making friends in grade school (I was bullied) so that confirmed my parent's view of me. Although I'm still an introvert, as the decades have passed I am surprised and pleased to see that I am more outgoing than the role cast for me by my mother. I often wonder how I might have turned out if I had been born to supportive non-judgmental parents.
@@lesliegann2737 OMG! It feels like I could write the same comment. *I felt like I wasn't allowed to have a personality* - so true!!!The feeling of being *defective* . I've felt, I have to recompensate being "defective". For example by being nice and helpful. I already had those traits, but I gave too much focus on them hoping I will be accepted by classmates. I was bullied as well, in 2 schools. Kids and teachers confirmed the wrong about me I've learned at home. I never knew how to make friends cause I didn't know how to be pushy and force myself in conversations. But even with that, I could adapt myself, If the environment I was in, was more friendly and empathetic.
My mum is dominating and I was always in her shadow. *They don't appreciate your qualities but that doesn't stop them from using you for them* . - Such a great point! If they don't like it, they can fuck off! I do remember who I was as small child, I was not shy at all, it just the lack of any positive feedback that turned me into such. Living in narcissistic world is tough for us sensitive people but never doubt yourself and your power!
Can relate. Instead of recognizing my virtues, I was told that I was embarrassing, weird, and a show off. My achievements were undermined, I was robbed of any validation,and completely devalued... I wasn't good at sports, was never interested, and was too "feminine" because was into the arts. Never good enough, they tried to dim my light and squash my spirit. Summary: I outshined them and made them feel bad about themselves. Jealousy/envy
@@kwaintraub2 I can relate a lot. I was always excluded from group cause they didn't like how I was playing team sports. Also, the other girls (and female teachers) hated me cause I think I was more feminine, I wasn't doing it in purpose, just a side effect of being sensitive and intuitive more than the bully type who destroys everything. Most boys liked me for it, but girls? They hated me for nothing. And since most teachers are women, they saw me as vulnerable prey they need to harass. I've felt so much agression from them, never any warmth or sympathy. So good you didn't let them dim your light. Envious people need to be avoided.
I often wonder what I could have become if I had better parents
@Terry Mathews ... I often wonder this too. If I was supported, nurtured, and received some attention as a child/ teenager. Would my life be different? Don't get me wrong, I am proud of what I accomplished so far, and I am also proud that I have awakened to a state of inner peace, which is a beautiful thing. This new conscious arose from the narc and scapegoat abuse. Suffering eventually leads to awareness presence. Would I have awoken if I had better parenting?
So grateful for your content! I graduated from college with high honors, and my family did come to the ceremony, but quickly left after, and there was no medal. No party. At the reception at the college. My fellow classmates were confused why I didn’t have anyone there to celebrate with me. I was so used to the behavior. I just said they were busy. I later asked my mother why she had a big party for my sister that graduated the year before and invited all the relatives. She said she didn’t do that for me because she was embarrassed because of my age. I was 30 my sister was 28 she also didn’t seem to notice that I graduated with high honors because she let me know what high achievements my sister had accomplished. I think I’m going to throw myself a graduation party 🎉 I can finally see that it was her not me. Can you imagine she told me she was embarrassed of me. Like I should feel shame for graduating from college with high honors because I was 30.
This clarifies why it is so difficult to take a compliment.
I have tried to do the “reward” thing-- whatever you do, don’t tell the narc about it. They will work very hard to make that worthless for you.
Sure, it's suicide to go to a narc for anything. Stay away from the Devil.
Yeah right, after all you've done there and now you act like you were victim....
The words "Who do you think you are?" always ring in my head. I also got "What do you want, a pat on the back all the time?"
It was amazing the extent that my parents went to to downplay any external praise I received, from school, boy scouts etc.
I can relate. When my gymnastics coach said that I had what it takes to advance ( he was getting out of coaching) at about 12 years old, I was never allowed to take gymnastics again.
Stay away from them
Finding safe friends is so important! I now have a small circle of safe friends who show me love, compassion and support. It has helped me feel secure, and it has been a huge turning point in my recovery.
I'm still trying to find safe friends. I seem to attract more narcissists and toxic people... :(
@@backyardfunwithsimone9213 that happened to me too. The more I healed, I attracted more healthy people. Work on your healing. It will happen. Don’t give up. You deserve healthy relationships. ❤️
It's funny (ha ha?) that the only things I can give myself credit for are non-negatives. Like, I'm not addicted to anything, I'm not in debt. I'm not overweight. I've no convictions! I'm not unemployed. I'm half joking but I feel like that's all I can ''lay claim'' to. The clearly POSITIVE things are so much harder.
I'm going to try hard here now though. I left my abusive x even though I was really scared. I finally got a secure job which gives me a lot of peace of mind. my daughter got in to Trinity College (a very good university).
Well done.
There are some dreams/goals in this life which are impossible and must be given up to die. Your narcissist will never be satisfied. It's time to give up on them and put your hope in yourself, where it might do some good.
Thank you so much for capturing the most painful thing about being a scapegoat in your videos. The narcissist projections resulting in the creation of a negative outcome for the scapegoat. No one else seems to understand. They manifest a negative trait in their favorite scapegoat. The scapegoat cannot even let anyone know this because it appears like "not being accountable", so the problem is ignored. The real problem when the narcissist tells the scapegoat "What they are" , in the most vicious, insidious way, and then suddenly the scapegoat, whose natural qualities were honorable/good/of high standard has suddenly exhibited an outburst display. They became what they were told that they were by the narcissist for one second of their life. Thus. ruining self-worth. The scapegoat begins to believe the narcissist, as does all of the influenced. This becomes a battle of will for the scapegoat to undo the damage. No one else is capturing this horrific part of this insidious disease. It was like someone reached into my soul when finally hearing a person acknowledge this in this video and others. I cannot thank you enough for just recognizing this out loud.
My mother, who was completely fine with our father’s brutal, abusive, rage-filled abuse of us, said an odd thing to me about him. He’d just beaten us in a fit of capricious rage. Then he felt badly about it, so he decided to take us out for ice cream. I told my mother I did not want to go, that I was afraid of him. She replied, “Well, don’t you think he’s a little afraid of you, too?” Wtf? What the hell did that mean? I think I may understand that better, now. I’ve always been the one to say, in toxic situations, that it is, indeed, totally effed up. What? Was that supposed to be a secret? I’m left with the strong conviction that, if it can be destroyed by the truth, it deserves to be destroyed by the truth. My mother always knew I was the type to burn it all down to get at the truth.
Dr Ramani has a number of youtube videos on the 'Truth teller' role in a narcissistic family which might be useful to go through. Sorry you went through so much.
Also, the ice cream was not out of guilt but rather the intermittent reinforcement to get you the mental dissonance and the trauma bond, everything on check.
@@adrianaalvaradorodriguez6454 Actually, that makes perfect sense, because he did that often, and I hated it.
And I can almost bet that even while trying to enjoy that icecream he would easily find evil ways to destroy your "well earned" joy...I hope you are not reachable to any of those two monsters...
@@adrianaalvaradorodriguez6454 Oh, yes, thank you. I’m also glad the experience gave me such a visceral understanding of how other people suffer, as well, and deepened my empathy and compassion. Being the reject actually puts me in far better company.
It is even harder for the scapegoat when the lazy and un-achieving, often failing golden child in the family gets all recognition, while you, no matter how much you present, get a shrug of the shoulders.
You described my scapegoat child experiences exactly. Thank you for the validation!! I’m 76 and have spent the last five years discovering why I am who I am. This is so helpful. When I mention some of these things with my siblings, I get nothing in response from them.
Ago! Know. Neither y brother.
I’m so happy for you that you’ve figured it out. I hope you’re doing well in your recovery journey! ❤️
I experience the same with my sisters. Is as if they weren´t in there with me when I was insulted, humiliated, and even beaten. Hurts me and made me take distance from them.
@@Sldindpunjab My two older sister joined my narc, insecure, emotionally dangerous mother and ganged up on me. 40 years later my younger brother joined them. Peace and love to you
@@Sldindpunjab Same with my sister. I asked her (in an email) what she felt and thought about our father beating our dog that yelped in pain and me being left behind when our parents took only her to the zoo...I asked her why she didn't stand up for me or the dog (I was too afraid of my dad to stop him but the dog's screaming still haunts me...) she never answered. Dead silence for weeks now...
I was sent off to boarding school abruptly at 12.
Oddly enough I excelled in my own way. So much so that I was an officer in any club that existed and participated in nearly every activity as well as keeping an excellent GPA.
By middle of 2nd year I was winning national awards academically in certain subjects and I was abruptly taken home at age 13 to care for an ill parent.
And by ill I mean stay in bed, not get up, not dressed, not shower, not eat... Pills and alcohol were involved as was serious clinical depression.
There was, other than school, no social life, and intermittent interaction with only the other parent.
But the other parent had a career and a public persona to keep up and all older siblings were gone.
I was in no way capable of caring for someone in that condition at that age.
I had to go back to the school that I had attended from kindergarten through 6th grade where I had lost all of my close friends for the most part as kids are fickle.
Also a member or 2 of my family was rather notorious. Let's just say my family was well known including in laws.
I struggled to fit in again only to be pulled out and returned to boarding school at the beginning of the following year where of course much had changed and I had lost all of my offices and much of my motivation.
Over the years a pattern emerged where that "ill" parent seemingly seemingly accidentally" on purpose" would disrupt important events for me.
Additionally I had an extended cousin who was definitely definitely a clinical malignant narcissist who focused upon me and any one and anything I held dear.
I've had to learn more than I've cared to about this topic.
No one looks out for the children in this sort of of situations and the results are devastating.
That was the end of 1972 beginning of 73 when I was taken out of school, the "ill" parent is still alive.
let that sink in.
I’m sorry to hear this. There’s another channel I follow that describes this role as scapegoat and “indentured servant”.
My mother has been “dying” since me and my siblings were small children. She turns 65 this spring. It was a lot of invisible deceases, fainting spells and the occasional suicide threat. She convinced me and my siblings she didn’t have long to live and kept us in constant fear we would lose her.
When she turned 60 five years ago she made a remark “I can’t believe I made it to 60”. Me and my siblings just stared at the floor and did not answer her. By this stage most of us were in our 30s and didn’t believe her anymore. But we dare not say it.
I’ve gone no contact with all of them. Including the enablers, who allowed all of those things to happen.
I'm so sorry for all the pain and aloneness. You had a long and difficult path to trudge through. I can appreciate your story.
So sorry...yes..I had a check cashing card at 14...
BUT to get to the supermarket to buy the groceries for the week and bring them home to process and cook and freeze to make the budget...
I had to first get MRS.VALIUM up get her bathed and dressed and when I got to the store ask the pharmacist if I could let her sit there while I shopped.
Often she was crwal out of bed while I was doing homework, housework, cooking...and ask me if I THOUGHT IT WAS SAFE FOR HER TO TAKE MORE VALIUM...THEN GO INTO DETAIL ON HER BOWEL HABITS...
I
WAS LIKE.." LOOK....I AM THE MAID, THE COOK, THE SURROGATE MOTHER FOR MY MESSED UP SISTERS, I HAVE TI DISARM YOU WHEN YOU OULL THE BUTCHER KNIFE ON DADDY..
I
CAN'T BE YOUR PHARMACIST OR DOCTOR..
THERE'S THE PHONE YOU CALL THEM...
Then I would pray she just would stay in her room and not talk to me at all...
@@dotsyjmaher ❤❤
I gave up several scholarships to stay back for this parent.
They've denied it, then said you can't prove it.
This is so true! I've really struggled with this, because 'worth' (apart from the basic worth of human life) and 'achievement' can be so subjective. I think a lot about context, and things like, 'Secretariat would have been a nobody, in an environment where horses were used to plow or clear trees from farmland.' Where we really get ourselves in trouble is that we want to prove ourselves to be of value in the very environment that CANNOT value us, which prevents us from putting our energies into seeking our proper context. And then we're hampered even further by stupid sayings like, 'bloom where you're planted.' (The originator of that saying was obviously not a gardener!) We feel we must attempt to achieve in an environment that's hostile TO US, rather than seeking out and moving toward an environment in which we actually CAN flourish, achieve, demonstrate our full value, AND be valued by others.
So true ! Don't loose your energy where it's not valued and reciprocated.
Wow, this is so well worded! Exactly what I'm struggling with these days. 👍🏼👍🏼👍🏼
How are you gonna get to Narnia, when you have no knowledge that such a place exists?
As a child you may also be subjected to the narcissists' strong thrust to isolate you and downplay, even denigrate, any relationship outside the nuclear family that might be positive for you. And of course, in a narcissistic family there is almost no support to be found anywhere from anyone, often including siblings.
I never considered that phrase to be ridiculous--that shed a lot of light:)
It's brutal. I was told that I was too much or too annoying, simply for being a kid that needed love. It's really hard for me to share my needs with people now. In high school I wrote an essay and got an A. I felt so happy about it and showed it to my Dad, hoping for that validation. He read it and said, you plagiarized this, you didn't write this. He went as far as going to my school and telling my teacher this. Something broke inside me that day. My teacher pulled me aside later and said he knew I wrote it, but yea, I'll never forget that humiliation.
I struggle a lot with procrastination now, feeling like, what's the point? I think it's one of the most devastating impacts of the abuse I experienced at home. That and feeling like no one could possibly love a failure and a defective weirdo like me, despite my life looking good on paper. I'm thankful for resources like this video, I've learned a lot and my healing journey is rocky, but I'm getting there
It's just unbelivable! You had lot of strenght to go through all this bs. I understand the procrastination, it's the feeling that no matter what you do, your energy won't be properly reciprocated.
I’m so sorry you experienced that. It made me cry as I’ve experienced similar things in my childhood. You didn’t deserve that and I completely understand your feelings today as I have felt very much the same way. The blessing is that there is hope at the end of the tunnel. Since I’ve decided to go no contact with my Dad, I feel a huge relief. I’m sleeping well now, I feel I’m healing now and have hope for the future. I never deserved what was dished out to me but I know I can move forward now and leave his illness behind. It’s taken a lot of work, tears and compassion for myself but I’m feeling the changes. Best wishes to you!
Thank you Jay. This gives me a better understanding of why my Dad made me quit the drill team when I ran home to tell him I made the highest course out of the 83 girls who tried out. (Had never been allowed to dance as a child and all the others had danced since they were small). Why he refused to attend parents night for the National Honors society two years in a row. Why just last year he told me my degree was a complete waste of money, I graduated with honors with an accounting degree. He refuses to see who I am as a person and can’t acknowledge the sacrifices I made as the oldest child caretaker of his “other two” who he prefers. He abandoned us and was later forced to take full custody. I think he was angry that as a 12 year old I couldn’t handle raising my little sisters with a non-functional alcoholic. He decided I was defective because the social workers recommended I get therapy because I had taken on the role of mother to my younger siblings. Such a sad situation. He missed out on having a daughter that only wanted to have a healthy relationship with him.
This is also where therapists can wreck recovery. If you’ve never been acknowledged, you don’t necessarily have the skill.
Thank you so much for this! It values my situation and feelings so much. I experienced exactly the same. I was humiliated and shamed for speaking up for my rights and for telling my parents that they are not allowed to treat me so badly. My whole childhood and adolescence was filled with arguments over this. I always had to fight and never achieved anything like fairness from my family. Although I have always had this subtle feeling of extreme pride in the back of my subconscious. Like I could feel it was coming from my strong strong highest self who wanted to remember me of my worth. But unfortunately the shame I internalized often beats that true voice. It was too long and to intense what I experienced and I really struggle to feel like I deserve the best in life. I want to encourage everyone who is reading this: trust the smallest voice in your head, that you are worthy. It’s your birth right and nothing can take that away from you. I am proud of everyone who had to suffer like that and I am so 100% sure, that you are amazingly strong. 💪 💕
I am 57 and have never ever known until now this very minute that a narcissist could be the very person
that gave birth to me, likewise with the very person I would soon learn to call Dad. I always thought that
a narcissist was a person outside of family, an overly insecure girlfriend, a so called friend that gets off on
giving me wrong advice, an outsider just out for their own ends. Thinking about it now, maybe that's what
my narcissistic parents taught me & wanted me to believe all along, maybe it was their way of ensuring
I never doubt or question the abuse they offloaded onto me and to only be on the look out for it coming
from outside sources, I'm now beginning to doubt absolutely everything they ever taught me, I also have
to call into question my 3 younger siblings who must feel blessed for not being chosen for the lead role of
Black Sheep Scapegoat and I can honestly say that if it had to be one of us I'd of stepped up for the slaughter
to save their lives & futures, trouble is I know only to well that my 3 siblings are my narcissistic mothers
go to, so when I stick up for myself it's not long before I'm attacked from all sides simultaneously.
I've never been a religious person but Jesus, I sure feel I need him now, So help me God.
I have experienced the exact same thing. It took me 3 decades to get the whole story and only in the last 3 years of learning about Narcissism and all the related terminology was I able to break all contact with my family of origin. It's been nearly two years and I feel massively relieved. You can do this. Keep going, believe people when they show you who they are. Take care of yourself. 💖🙏
I have had the same experience. They protect the abusive person in the family and attack the scapegoat.
@@dnk4559 Don't we know it Pal. I have a personal question I'd like to ask you, feel free to reply or decline, either way you have my respect. I live in the UK and know a person called Dave Nailor also in the UK.
I spent some of my early teens with D. Nailor, we were both red heads, my then single father dated D. Nailor's mother a lady called June. I'm not sure whether you are the same person but if you are was it my profile picture along with my surname that gave it away? My father's surname (Harrington) was very well known in the village & associated with trouble. Basically are you the same Dave Nailor????.
Kind Regards.
@@jonathanharrington7950 sorry but I’m not your guy. I’m from the states born and raised. Hope you find your pal and best wishes to you!
@@dnk4559 You also Mr Nailor.
Kind Regards.
Always felt like the scapegoat especially at work people just mistreat me for no reason and try to convince me I was weak minded
Thank you Jay, these explanations help to put what we experienced (and still experience) into words.
I'm the son of a narcissistic father, my family has always been dysfunctional and abusive, resulting in my younger brother taking his life in 2012 at the age of 21.
I haven't been the same since, nor do I expect to ever fully heal, but your videos are a help in trying to get my life back together.
Much love.
This really resonates with me . My covert narc mother delighted in raging and tearing me down daily with the never-ending screaming, name calling and insults . There seemed to be this belief that the oldest girl was born to be the family servant you kicked every day . She didn't even need any time spent showing me how to do things , I was just expected to know and perform tasks in the manner SHE did. By the timeI was 10 I knew that I couldn't do ANYTHING right. - everything seemed to be a setup for a reason to rage at me . Certainly by that age I was shut down and had become 'demand resistant' as I've heard it called now . This trait has not served me well in life but probably saved my sanity when I was a kid .
That is so hurtful 😔
True that.
Y the time I was 10 I realized my family needed to treat me badly. I, too, was subject to constant ongoing criticism, so I exhausted myself try ING to conform uncomplainingly to every demand and twist and turn of my mother's contradictory expectations. With her I experienced a tangle of double binds and reciprocal spirals -- crazy making demands. She was already asserting that I was mentally ill.
After 6 months I observed she never noticed a single effort I made. My father was also grossly and violently abusive. I knew my family was messed up and I was in a Hell hole and I needed to get out. I knew if I ran away I could not survive and would be caught and returned to my family where they would retaliate even more. I longed to grow up so I could be free. It was a daily heartfelt fantasy.
I badly needed to escape as did my little brother. I immersed myself in studying, not just my schoolwork, but I taught myself many things. I read our entire encyclopedia set as well as my mother's college textbooks. She had returned to college and had enrolled in a program giving her advanced standing for her RN. Thus I studied surreptiously her texts on the history of philosophy, anthropology, sociology, industrial psychology as well as literature for an English course. On my own I read books on the humanities. By the time I entered college at age 17, I had more or less the equivalent of a college degree. To this day nobody in my family ever knew I was teaching myself these things, which allowed me to live in another world. Of course, there were many more challenges after I physically left my family. It turns out lifelong recovery efforts are needed on all levels of yourself. My story sounds so bad it shocks other people and it can distort new relationships if I recount my personal narrative to anyone who is not also a survivor. Thank goodness I've been able to share with friends in that group.
Yes, you just describe how we scapegoat living for all this time, i fucking hate every single part of raised being a scapegoat....
I relate to this so much! Especially when you said “she didn’t even show me how to do things, I was just expected to know and perform tasks in the manner SHE did”.
My mom didn’t teach me anything, not a single thing, & she took great joy in telling me I didn’t know how to do anything. It feels so good to be no contact.
This video is about my childhood, especially 12:46.
Vanessa seems to me "Me from parallel universe" , We moved to another place, and i started going to new scool. the first word of motivation i ever heard was from my "Sociology" teacher in 9th grade. It was just a simple line, "Good , you did that really good," she picked my assignment and showed it to other few students in the class. It was all very strange , didn't feel anything.. but what happened .. from then on I became unstoppable, The best in her class.. and I needed to maintain this in every course because I just don't want that motherly teacher lose confidence in me and got better, started concentrating and topped 9, topped 10 .. it was insane because before that i hardly passing any of my classes, and here whole school taking me as some genius -
I know as I did much the same. Teachers thought I wasn't a prodigy. I'm not so sure of that. I studied with so much intensity I think that alone could explain my high performance. I was just a sort of regular kid getting more or less mediocre grades until the fourth grade, when I got so meaningful encouragement from my teacher, Mrs. Wins. Thank you Mrs. When from long ago!
Holy moly I really think you ve a rare knack with symbolism. Awesome
Aside from my annual visits with my doting grandparents, I never really experienced praise for a job well done until I went to private school.
That place gave rewards for successful effort, instead of only punishment for not doing as well as expected.
We got incentives which really motivated me.
One of the best videos. Self-sabotage, my daily pain. Even when I am receiving external validation, I feel like I don´t deserve, they assumed something wrong or I am less than the rest of the people. I am never enough.
Thank you, it is so intensely painful, and your videos are most appreciated.
As a child I did not have any self worth. I was always told and showed by my mother that I was not good enough. When I scored good marks in school, she only focused on that one mistake that I made, never complimenting on how great I did. She never liked how my bare face looked. Even while at home all day long, I always had to use eyeliner for my eyes and brows because she did not like how I looked without them. Because I lived my entire childhood doing eyes and eyebrows, I did not have any confidence to show my real face to anybody, even to my husband. Finally after 9 years of marriage he saw! My mind works like nobody will like me without it. I am slowly coming out of this at 40 yrs of age but still feel a sense of shame in showing my bare face to anyone, even to my husband. At 7-9 yrs of age, I loved organizing my home. During summer vacations, when my parents go for work, i would pick a room and mop, clean floor, shelves, rearrange and make it look good. It typically took me from morning till evening to finish my task. I would be so tired by evening but I loved what I did. But my mother, when she comes back from work, will mostly focus on that one bottle that I misplaced. By age 10, I stopped arranging rooms because i really felt I was not getting enough credit for the effort I put. It used to make me feel very sad. Looking back, I am so proud of that little girl who put her heart and soul into organizing without anybody even asking her to do it.
It DOES feel like a slog...
Once again a REALLY helpful video with insight and hope.
I almost gave up last week...
I was really discouraged...
But I ran into some of my drawings from decades ago and was STUNNED at how good they are..
I thought I had lost or thrown away all of them.
I am working up to taking time and space and courage to sit with some them and remember how it felt to spontaneously WANT to draw something
and ignore the crazies in my life at THAT time ..long enough to just do a simple drawing....
Once again, thank you for your thoughtful, intelligent content...
You are helping a lot of people who from the comments...
I can see
have lived in purgatory all their lives for NO OTHER REASON THAN AN ACCIDENT OF BIRTH...
I’ve been working on giving myself the “medals” for a little over a year now. It started out really small, but day by day, it has made a huge difference. I have come so far. When I look back to how I felt and operated then, it feels almost like a different person.
That is awesome:)
@Billy B Start out really small. I mean small. When I did something positive or new or fun, really anything just for me, I would reward myself with something small that I liked. And when I mean small, I mean like a cup of tea or playing a favorite song. That was the foundation. A little more than a year later, I am comfortable with giving myself praise! Baby steps to big leaps.
My step father not only downplayed all my efforts to help them , but took credit for my work and told my family I did nothing . I feel like I wasted 12 yrs of my life trying to help them with there rental properties .and I doubt I'll get a dime from them when they pass because my selfish sisters will come and take everything . Such bs . I did not know he was what he was until I did some research on someone taking credit and being fake . He would run and jump on a lawnmower anytime someone would visit like he had been working all day , then jump off it five minutes later to greet our guest . And my sisters hate me because he made me out to be a bad person while making himself look good . And it wouldn't have taken 12 yrs if he had not done one thing during that time . Pathetic , I worked part time jobs to make things work . He blamed me for being lazy . I was already getting up at 330 in the morning and working tell 8 at night for yrs . And he would tell me how lazy I was all the time as he had a fat bowl of ice cream . Self projecting punk . I hope he gets what he deserves one day . Little punk
Thank you so much for this. I can relate to most of what you said here. My narcissistic mom, especially down played my accomplishments. I can't think of one time she didn't. It is something I still struggle with to this day. This video explained a lot!
Oh yes, my narc mom told me on my college graduation day that I was getting a Bachelor of Science degree with a stupid/easy degree. Did she get her degree? Of course not. Jealousy/envy rearing its ugly head!
@@kwaintraub2 It is jealousy...I agree. So happy you graduated from college! That is huge! Something nobody can take away from you
It feels like you know this so intimately. I am stirred to sobbing.
💔🤦🏿♀️ my childhood was exactly like this. My biological parents are messed up.
This hurts me. I can't even rationalize it how people can do that to a child.
You are a good person !
I have been starting to watch 1 or 2 of these videos a night.
Coming to terms with this has not been easy or something that I was even pursuing.
Thank you for making these videos and this informative available to me. I am trying to understand where I have came from and why I am here.
Every situation is different, but I feel like this could be a potential road map to some positive feelings that I thought might exist, be have eluded me in these last 38 years.
Tactic #3 sounds good. Will try it. Can you make a video on narcissistic smear campaigns and how they try to damage your reputation & image among extended family and social circles?
This hits home for the thing I did on my own. It was challenging physically and mentally. Out of the norm accomplishment. I don't expect extreme accolades. But just a little "nice job" would have been nice. But hey I got zero response because I was only doing activities for me and not them. My one friend told me he's proud of me. Family thinks nothing of me.
Doing great despite the war you were facing. More worth to you.
I did get praised for good grades, etc, but much was shunted to the G.C., as far as things that i had created or earned.
I felt like the old clunker car sitting in the driveway, from which they could casually steal parts for the golden child.
I would come up with a project or an idea. I would work on it, make arrangements, do extra chores to earn money for needed supplies. I would launch it. Then the younger golden child would see it, want it for herself, beg, nag, and throw temper tantrums. Our mother would snatch it away from me and hand it off to golden child, (who did not have to earn any of it). Then would behave as if it had been the golden child's all along.
I became, in some ways, almost averse to even trying, because i knew that much of the time, if I were to succeed, they would wrest my ball away from me, and hand it to the golden child to run with, praising her every step of the way. The fact that i had earned or created it was forgotten. Why make the effort?
I learned to avoid the golden child, lest she take too much of an interest in what i was doing. That was the only way that I could figure out to protect myself and what was rightfully mine. For the past 30 years, I have had to listen to demands for an apology to the G.C., because "I did not include her." The reason for that was because i knew what that would cost me. Every. Single. Time.
As always Jay, you send multi-level clarity chains our way with this re-frame. Before watching this, I felt 'wrong / weak / needy' for wanting or seeking any rightful self-worth recognition. It became too dangerous a prospect in any case, because the likelihood of shaming was too greater risk, yet I couldn't articulate any of this before. Many other threads too, all of which are now detangling as a result of your generosity of spirit and professional knowledge. Powerful, thank you ^^
This is how I became as well. I felt ashamed of having any needs or wants.
Yes!!! I take my strengths to the bank. My deposits are overflowing.
When I realise what I have really been through and the effects it has on me today.
I just want to punch the hell out of a punching bag or get a real hug from someone who really understands.. Just maybe it will help
I was watching pre-Olympic interviews with parents and some were CRYING and saying things like, "He's been working SO HARD for this"! And parents just DEDICATED to the sports FOR the kids! WELL NOT MY MOM! My Mom was a wretched bully BITCH! BUT she forced me to do ALL OF IT anyways! I did WIN and I worked REALLY HARD but it HAD TO BE all about HER! YOU HAD TO focus on her! It was strange thinking back about it! She was such a strange person.
Its so weird when we see these displays of pride, affirmation isn't it? Its hard to swallow that this is what it could have / should have been for us too. And then on top you were supposed to focus on the one who is negating you?! Horrible. I feel you, sister. NOBODY can take away all that you achieved which you know in your heart ^^
My parents also encouraged me to do all kinds of sports and I was good at it. But that was all about them...as you say. The thing is I knew this even as I was participating as a teenager which made me hate that sport. Who knows if I could actually have enjoyed it were it not for my parents pushing me so hard to achieve. And oh, the disappointment when I do not achieve what they had in mind. And the pain in my heart for being such a disappointment to them. Gawd! It was all just insane.
fair play for calling it out. forgive ourselves & them & sail free .
This hits home really hard. Thank you.
Thank you. This is a reminder for me to slow down and really take in the successes I create everyday. I keep a journal to write things out, but I recognize I have a difficult time really feeling the success. I place many conditions onto success rather than keeping it simple and clear cut. I have to take the toxic conditional layers off, (which are mostly subconscious), and discard them, before I can really ‘see’ and feel the success before me. These conditions are the infected mandates of my parents and a sick society. On a bright note: once I unearth a layer I can remember for the most part to take it out of the mix. Each time will make it easier. It’s hard going though. May we all experience Unconditional love. 🕊🙏🕊
As a smart, strong healthy girl, I knew to silence any pride or achievement or recognition. I am paralyzed by this shame as an accomplished adult and have journeyed long and hard to understand, accept and now move past the narcissistic family dynamics that haunt me. This practical advice and clear description of my experience is, I expect, going to be the life-changing knowledge that fuels my next forward movement. Well done, Jay!
This talk is nothing short of miraculous, thank you
Thank you, Jay. I really appreciate your empathy and your courage to articulate how it feels to be robbed of self-worth "medals." I plan to do your exercise - finding 3 reasons to feel proud of myself each day. Think I'll practice being on the lookout through each day for the lovely three. I like that this feels like an eminently do-able baby step in a healthy direction.
Also, of course, I want to practice loving myself no matter what's going on or not going on in my life, even when I mess up at times, or when I'm simply being me, breathing, perhaps walking with no particular destination, perhaps humming.
I think it's too late for me. It's been my whole life and even still now. Thank you for helping others though.
Never too late Mordock. I you're breathing, there's still light in you and it only takes a tiny light to dispel darkness. Sending you strength ^^
Thank you Dr Jay.
I really love your series with the Scapegoat Black Sheep child.
I have been in recovery for about three and a half years with a really solid resource team around me.
I have some of these interjects that remain, and flow through my thinking. It's like having the voice of my mother or ex-husband in my mind.
I believe it's my own thoughts, talking me out of my choices or going to try something new.
And many times it can send me back to this catastrophic thinking, where I will just think so black and white until I realize, oh my gosh, let's just stop and breathe. Let's look at the facts here. Let's itemize why you're thinking or feeling this.
....
It's been one of the hardest things to stop, and self-actualize.
The inner critic voice we instantly think is our own when really it's that of my mother's voice or my ex-husband's voice drilling that shame or devaluation, questioning my worth.
Even though neither one are in my life anymore, the damage of them consistently talking me out of my strengths, or my passions, heck,.. even my choices, truth, reality ....it does take a toll.
🙏 Thank you again for all of your wonderful education. I'm really glad I found your channel. There's a whirlwind of information out here on youtube, and it's hard to find people that really break everything down and explain the human behavior aspects along with the psychology aspects of both the codependent scapegoat, and the narcissistic abuser.
I started publishing poetry in magazines as a child. In that era, you sent out your manuscript by mail with a self-addressed stamped envelope (SASE). When I got a ms. back, my narc mother would rip it open and make fun of what I had written. Around age ten, she changed her response and started saying that I must have plagiarized. It was an inadvertent validation, because I realized she was saying that it was good and this was the only way she could find to attack me. It was bittersweet, because I also realized that attacking me was the only thing she cared about.
Inside their “False Reality Field” the Scapegoat will NEVER be good enough!
Difficult to break out, because they are many against one, and do all to break your Reality down 😔
My sister used to literally say, 'What do you want, a medal?' I think she heard it from a teacher originally, but she used it every time anyone around her did something worth recognition!
Wow. I really resonated with “Vanessa”. This was an extremely insightful video that gave me a lot to think about.
Jay, I would like you to speak about the siblings. Why do they deny the reality and they don´t stand up for the scapegoat child. And how after a lot of years, seems like they suffer from amnesia when the scapegoat child is deeply traumatized. Thank you.
Thank you. Everytime I watch your channel I get emotional. You describe my youth with my narcissistic mother and enabling father so precisely! The ongoing difficulties to gain self worth, the struggle of falling back into the same trap of needless shame and self criticism, just because I never got those, rightfully deserved medals! The hardest part is to really start believing that there wasn 't much wrong with me in the first place. I was just a menace to my mothers insecurity, and therefore she made it her job to belittle and shame me, over and over again. The many, many times I got a bucket of anger and wrath over me, just because I was a soft hearted and sensitive child....as a result I draw back into a fantasyworld, started writing stories, make drawings, and read a lot. I m glad to say that my mother did not succeed in destroying me, as she did with my father, who now is in his eighties, and made to believe he is a complete failure. He has withdrawn in some sort of pseudo dementia. I can tell that this is the result of narcissistic abuse, because when I interact with him when my mother is not paying attention, he suddenly gets clear eyed and some colour returns in his face. Then I see his normal, lovely personality shining through the fogs. Though my dad is beyond saving, I will keep on working at my self worth. Thank you so much for making sense of all this miserable crap.
No Viable Path To Success You Betcha!
Thank you for this video. It has helped me to regain perspective in a community that has scapegoated me for years and made me (and possibly a few other individuals) the perpetual dumping ground for their shame, insecurities and inadequacies.
Jay, I cut my parents and brother off. It's been almost 2 years. I was indeed the scape goat. I'm extremely skilled and naturally talented at a multitude of things. And no matter how much I tried to show my father how much I honed his craft, as you said, he would NEVER EVER give me recognition. And if he did it was only if someone else mentioned it in front of him. Fast forward to now, I just couldn't get myself to move forward in life. I kept procrastinating, feeling "tired" etc. I KNOW I can be successful, but something kept telling me "why bother?" And I couldn't put my finger on where that originated from until THIS VIDEO. I've literally won awards for skilled trades, bodybuilding, athleticism etc and no one in my family ever celebrated with me. I went from a bachelor pad with roaches to a penthouse - and nothing.
The mere thought of trying again mentally exhausted me until I watched this video. You helped me remember that I will be rewarded, and recognized by the right people. And the success I create is also mine to enjoy!!
Thank you so much for your work, you literally changed my life and helped me get over the final sticking point in my recovery!
God bless you Jay🙏this channel is such a help😭can't say thanks enough🌟✨❤️⭐
Self Worth Medals!! THANK YOU!!
That resonates so much. Only I took that message at face value pretty early on and pretty much stopped trying. I mean, what's the point of trying anything if I'm going to be crap at it anyway? I'm the only child out of the 3 of us who got mid to mid-low grades in school instead of constantly being on top, didn't do any activism, and pretty much refused to attend half of the lessons in children's music school.
I kind of started liking my autistic brain in recent years, but at moments like this I hate it because there's so much BS I took at face value and genuinely believed for so long, and still can't throw out of my subconscious.
I like how you discuss how the scapegoat is often the most emotionally strong member of the family. I was made to feel i was a crybaby as a child, but I think the reason I cried so much as a child was because I was the only one physically abused by my mother and i got the grunt of the emotional abuse from my mother. As an adult I rarely cry, and when my dad passed I had to be the rock for the family even temporarily becoming my mother's "golden child" since I did so much for her. Needless to say now I don't think my mom is happy with any of her 3 children as we all recognize her abuse tactics and openly communicate with each regarding our mother to avoid any more games.
Thank you
Thank you for your continuing efforts to increase comprehension of the dynamics at play, beginning in early development, and how they influence our self-perception and behavior as adults, more than likely, myself included, while in some sort of connection to another narcissist. The adult life we were so properly prepped and primed for. On a side note, my mother was/is the narcissist and my father the enabler, so when I heard you using my first name (Vanessa) in your example illustration, my ears were perking up quite a bit 😊
As usual excellent content from UA-cam's most handsome psychotherapists. Keep this content coming J.R.!
A sensitive narcissist, a friend of mine usually gives me a negative opinion when I tell him that he overwhelms me and that I don't enjoy being with him.
He thinks I'm making a big mistake because I don't want to get as close to him as he would see.
He is a person with very high personal energies and I have little energy. This means that during the meeting and conversation, he naturally and strongly dominates me, overwhelms me, sets the tone of the conversation, indicates what to do and how to look at the world. Most often it is only he who speaks.
Let him live with this approach, why do I need a person who dominates me and overwhelms me with his content.
At the same time, He is unreflective and does not want to change (he said himself that he did not want to learn anything new, it was very memorable for me).
So with such a mental set this colleague probably has no chance at all to have any self-awareness, to see himself as the one who has a lot of influence on me, and so negative and overwhelming.
Fortunately, I have reflections and draw worse or better conclusions. And although my Soul is very naive and childishly clinging to him, my consciousness somehow refuses to give in to it. And again and again I communicate to him that contact with him is not the same pleasure for him that he feels when he can pour out his energies on me.
But it's not my business what he thinks or how he lives the world. My Soul would like to help him, but looking soberly there is no real chance that I can show him something. Only he himself may want to recognize something. And if he doesn't want to - then he'll be the same stiff, accusing and guilty guy and let him stay that way.
My life is my life and I have no other,
so I have to take care of myself if I want this life to be as-is.
This is so validating and was so desperately needed, thank you. I knew this within myself but could not express it and wasn’t sure if what I felt so strongly was right.
BINGO!! I heard this! Understood. Thank you feel like I’m going through this right now.
Thank-you Jay 🌻
I remember that in fifth grade, I was the school spelling champion. Not that I ever expected my mother to say, good job! But I was still taken aback when, ten years later, my younger brother was bad at spelling and she said, well, I had been that way too. I didn't expect her to remember my accomplishments, but I also didn't expect that she would transform them into their exact opposite.
Jay reid is the best therapist for this topic
My mother is narc/borderline. She would take my "medals" and boast too expressively to others about it that 1. it made me embarrassed of the medal and 2. it felt that it was all about her and had nothing to do with me. Because of this I was always uncomfortable when won awards or I would do something on purpose to not win them when I saw that I'm about to win. That shame of her unnatural boast still feels heavy and I'm over 40ty now. I felt she was jealous and she still found a way to steal it from me. I learnt to self sabotage myself as it was more bearable than feeling that shame.
To add insult to injury, my father's reaction would always be "you've just got lucky".
God gives us talents, but devil has tricks to lock it all and never to be seen. We need to fight this evil.
Thank you for focusing on what we can change when giving such good advice to everyone in recovery.
Thanks a lot for the movie !!
I have a familiar narcissist who seems to be very cunning and clever. In his statements, he indicates his great modesty and tries to position himself in such a way as to confuse them, as if they were trying to dominate him.
And he - so poor - but still with honor (in his imagination) endures this humiliation from other people ...
Such a game.
This bothers me because I have no intention of rising above him. But his artificial submission as if he were the victim of someone makes the other person automatically a torturer.
And this is already distasteful. And one that is hard to translate, because he has very strong personal energies and uses them to put pressure on the other side to come into his play.
I wish to heal from good people, real people!
Someone that connects to me instead of tear me down.
I had to fight alone for too long. They scare me.. I sense alot of bad vibes around my family.
They'll sabotage my life.
Love these videos
Every video I watch of yours is spot on to my particular situation. The validation I receive is incredibly satisfying. Did you learn this information from a textbook? or was it the many hours spent with clients and then coming up with your own conclusions. I find you so helpful and very much appreciate you positing these vids.
It helps me keep perspective snd remember that these are pathological family “systems” - the narcissist and their human “drones” to drop in and dump some shame and contempt and condemnation on you should you dare to act like a normal, healthy adult around them….. absolutely astonishing that some of these family members see and comment on the cruelty one day, then advocate and participate in the abuse the next.
Brilliant, spot on! So often I've felt my good deeds/efforts got 'absorbed' and were 'invisible'. Going to start a Medal Journal....what a great idea! Thank you for your videos 🤗
Thank you for another great video for understanding what happened and how I can now champion myself.
Like a dance you used to do…
How common is this sort of thing?
It seems to me a good part of the population are narcissistic.
Thank you for your work.
Thank you Jay, for offering this content to us!
Thank you for making a video about this!
Thank you for these incisive, informative and helpful videos. You are making a big difference in the world.
I have a huge disorder because of narcism.
I have a hard time motivating my self.
Thanks for this video.
Every one i know is under q witchcraft spell from TV.
My dad has turned into the worst monster.
I keep absorbing his unstable energy and i hate it. I have to keep on distancing. Wishing that he wasnt like this.
What a great video! Thanks!!!
What happens when you’re still close physically and all that but stop living by their rules, content to suffer their consequences as the price to live your life?
What happens is you are sacrificing 95% of a real and equal partnership based in love and respect for a mere physical transaction that’s ultimately empty and fleeting. To be trapped into that space with so little when you see others are in good, functional relationships is a very painful setup.
Thank you. Thank you. THANK YOU!
This is a big one for me.
THANK YOU for all the videos and information. Have you ever done a video on how a grandmother or grandfather as the matriarch or patriarch narcissist orchestrates the multigenerational roles and extended abuse through parents, aunts uncle and cousins etc?