Mad Minute Series: Lee-Enfield No.4
Вставка
- Опубліковано 12 вер 2024
- Patreon: / blokeontherange
Finally. The first "proper" installment in the Mad Minute series! In which The Bloke geeks out with the footage and data he got! This one is the Lee-Enfield No.4 in .303 British (natch), to serve as the baseline. Target is 18-20m away, in case I forgot to say it in the vid.
Sorry for the echo in part of the video. There might be one or two more with the same problem in the pipeline, so we'll all just have to suffer just a small amount :)
Facebook: / blokeontherange
It's no wonder that troops who were facing this weapon often thought they were under machinegun fire.
10-20 lads on a mad minute would have been scary to face back then.
Actually, there is no 'evidence' to suggest any such thing.
This refers to the battle of Mons in 1914, the first major engagement between British and German troops. David Aitchison is right. There is no evidence for this, and it is a bit of a myth.
@EnglishXnXproud There isn't a single German combat report from the engagements at Mons that mentions this. Not one; unless of course, you have one? And this is because it's a story, a 'ripping yarn' if you wish, dreamed-up to sell newspapers to the gullible, which is to say; people like you. Unthinking, non-analytical individuals who haven't even stopped to consider the fact that massed rifle fire and machine gun fire don't sound alike. But hey; if you have the 'missing' German combat report from the Battle that refutes all of this; well then, let's see it Sherlock.
@EnglishXnXproud Actually I'm colonial, not American and what's more I had 3 relatives killed on the Somme. That, in large part, is why I'm not prepared to tell lies and spread bullshit about what actually happened during the War. The 'mad minute' shit is a myth. Most of the stuff you hear about the War is lies, so you grow up twat!
@@davidaitchison8875 ya because at the battle of the Somme the Brits lost 60,000 men in one day going over the top. There was no one left to say if they used the mad minute or not.
Okay, the Enfield is clearly your baby. That’s impressively fast!
Not only has he trained with it, but the Enfield bolt is already very quick and easy to operate.
and aswell you can see how he is using only his middle finger to operate the trigger as this is what many british and commonwealth soldiers did to fire off as amany rounds as possible before the enemy could
As he pulls the bolt back? His Pinky Finger is on the trigger. I own my Grandfathers gun which happens to be a Lee/Enfield .303 Mk 4. I tried to get faster and had a few "Jams". I love my Families gun and it puts food on the table. Does yours?
Love it 😍 my grandad carried a mk3 1915-1918 . He said " she saved my life many times , never let me down...I was sad when I de-kitted...I felt sort of vulnerable for a long time after the war without her ....strange " Never forget those words as they were the only thing he ever said about his time in the trenches. RIP Tommy Warren ..x
Me *eyes wide open from how impressive that was”
Bloke “Very fumbly”
I'd just like to point out that this is an absolutely amazing channel. I enjoy modern guns, but there's something about pushing old guns in a more serious capacity (not just plinking away at targets for fun), that gets me excited.
I wish .303 surplus rounds/casings was still a thing around here in Canada!
Commissar lubi I bought 200 rounds of PRVI and 60 of Sellier and Bellot in oz. it’s reasonably available in oz which is a good think. Also it’s $25 Aussie per 20. So the price in good. It comes in 150 to 180 grains. So if some piddly back water like Australia has it, then surely Canada has it.
You just don't see it here either in the uk, I just handload using ppu bullet heads which aren't too overpriced and get my brass from the range bin
Henry Parkin maybe I’ve been lucky. I could be wrong but certainly in Melbourne Australia I just bought it at the local store. I actually use by 22 more so 200 rounds would probably last me two years. Maybe I’ll buy the rest just to store as I don’t hand load.
they sometimes are ... I bought 2,000'ish from the GCSurplus auction site 2 years ago, all once or de-mil'd(zero fired) brass .. they were under scrap metal.
... sometime in or after 2019, the old ranger No.4's that are surplus & not kept by their issued rangers -- will appear on the site too for sale
EDIT: (I've also seen them for sale by the Ziploc bag in-stores)
I feed my SMLE S&B which seems like nice ammo, the rim shape varies though, sometimes square, sometimes not.
It is reasonably priced, certainly enough for me to be questioning the economics of reloading but a cheaper option would be nice.
Now do a Mad Hour :-)
That would be simply awful.
He would spare time not needing to pull the trigger.
But is it better than the Happy Minute ?
That rifle would be worth 20 bucks after that
Lol "I wasn't counting" sounded like lindy XD
Note on hard extraction, if you ever end up using ammunition specifically made for tropical conditions that has had shellac or lacquer coating added (an example here is KF - Khadki Ordinance Factory) you will find extremely sticky cases once the chamber is hot. I found washing this ammunition in methylated spirits and scrubbing with scotchbrite solved the problem. PS: I never found the projectiles in KF headstamped ammunition to be concentric to the case mouth - maybe due to it being specifically made for Vickers guns (it comes in Vickers belts). Cheers from down under.
First LE4 mad minute I've seen on the tube which actual accuracy. I've seen plenty of people compete the series in under a minute, but who knows where the rounds actually went. Good on you with the accuracy, mate! Thanks!
Unbelievably impressive that soldiers in WWI and WWII did this under fire. What skill and nerves of steel it must have required.
Maybe bolt-stops on mag followers aren't that bad, if even The Bloke gets caught out anyone can. I wonder if The Bloke's method makes any difference compared to how BritishMuzzleloaders tried it. This way, apparently:
Start with 10 in mag + 1 in chamber
Fire 6
load 5 (10 in rifle)
Fire 6
Load 5 (9 in rifle)
Fire 6
Load 5 (8 in rifle)
Fire 6
Load 5 (7 in rifle)
Fire 6 *
Load 5 (6 in rifle)
Fire the final 6 rounds.
He almost achieved 36 shots in a minute that way. This also had the same number of charger loads when Bloke ran out of time at the point where I put the (*) mark.
It's interesting to consider that moving to just a 6 round charger with only a 6 round capacity would have much the same benefit as having a 10 round mag +1 in chamber with 5-round charging. They could be used the same way, fire 6, load a clip, repeat. Only unlike a 10+1 it could be continued indefinitely without getting confused about when you need to double reload. Makes me wonder how well something like a Carcano would do in a Mad minute. The whole point of that being 6-round clips that can be also loaded quicker.
And your manky mouser is still way out of spec. The bolt just isn't engaging with most of the camming surface, it's not like the camming surface is too long/short or too shallow/steep. Damn mismatched bolts.
Treblaine p14 in 30.06?
I wish i lived in Switzerland
I wish I could afford machine guns.
I wish i could live in Germany
Muhammad, pls.
You don't say where you live but this kind of thing is legal in most countries, it can get a bit expensive though.
Same Thomas
0:32 OOF fumbled out a round
Here in the U.S., we would need an approved ATF Form 4 and NFA tax stamp for that full-auto weapon.
In order for the No. 4 to be classified as a full auto weapon it would have to fire more than one round per trigger pull, which it clearly doesn't, because it's a bolt-action rifle
@@twentyfifthdui4717 Yeah, I have
15:20 thanks for saying it. I kept thinking it lol.
OOF, that hang fire. I always get hangfires with old .303 in my enfield too. A couple years ago I got some surplus stuff with 1943 headstamps... stuff smelled like rotten eggs lol
If You ever should Need a ak 74 contact me i live in switzerland too
niemand nieman That feels a bit like cheating for the mad minute.
I bid for one in an auction yesterday - but beaten by the buzzer (and a larger bid)
Very interesting results, Bloke! Thanks for the video.
I have the sudden urge to try this with a Mosin Nagant.
Bloke on the Range Cor, that’s potentially worse than with a Lebel....
Keep a rock handy incase that laquered steel ammo sticks.
I keep wondering if the reason methods like the 'Mad Minute' were used in early 20th century training was because it simulated combat stress. Maybe some use could be found from bolt-action rapid fire, though just being able to aim and function the rifle, keep it shooting at any rate would seem much more easily learned skills for the common infantryman. It might even be that the top brass didn't really understand why Mad Minute training lead to better success on the battlefield, but by George it did.
But, of course, I am just an American... ...
And 15 rounds matched when you started getting tired.
On his fourth charger clip he only fired 4 not 5. Did he eject two at 0:33? 07:15. So he did.
Love the trackball mouse you're using there. Got introduced to this channel through Forgotten Weapons video, enjoying your content so far mate.
Not bad on the reload. Smooth as hell
Why did you have to replace the projectles?
Stephen Woods ???
Stephen Woods because no firearms have infinite ammo
*Adjudant Gilbert:* Duh. But he said he had to pull and replace the bullets for legal reasons. What was wrong with the original ones is a perfectly good question.
WJS Maybe they were steel bullets?
Hello how are you?
I have two questions, please, what is the distance at which it made the shots, and you was aiming at the center or was not targeting?
ty
Have you considered making some sort of drillpress mounted chamfering tool for commercial ammunition? Might help with costs.
Maybe you could modify a plumbing pipe reamer or a chamfering tool with the center stem cut out? Would be cheaper than fabricating one from scratch, I imagine.
I am on it....
Nice skills gives me an appreciation the skill required...one observation is your first shot after a new clip fired with the index finger was generally the most accurate.
Expensive? Cost of enjoyment!!
Being a reloader I find here (in Canada) with the high price of powder and bullets that in some cases I can purchase factory loaded ammo for less than I can reload. I can factor out casing cost because a good friend supplied me with plenty of .308.
I do find that .303 is barely worth reloading unless you use cheap bullets and from 50+ cents down to 30+ cents isn't much of a savings per round.
Where are you getting 303 for 50 cents each?
the bullets "projectiles" only at about .50 cents. "Bullets" meaning only the bullet, not a complete cartridge.
Hey Bloke, awesome vid, have a no. 4 myself and I'd love to try a mad minute. Can't wait for the rest of the comparisons.
nice to see you're uploading! I haven't been seeing your videos in my sub box.
I want literally any series of the LE. I only recently learned of the Mad Minute. The only bolt action I have owned is the Remington 700, which I had training on. I guess technically I still own a T99 but I never shoot it because it takes 7.7 and I do not have access to that expensive ammo.
There are a ton of LE’s in the states and I come across them often. I’ve never looked into ammo availability though. They’re just cool. I like WWII rifles and this one is simply legendary.
26 shots in 60 secs, damn...
The Norwegian Inge Hvitås scored 39 hits at a 40 cm target at 200 meters in 60 seconds. The guy in the video is still very fast, though.
I thought I'd ask this question at what seems like a brilliant source for answers on UA-cam, Was the statement that German Soldiers thought they were under machine gun fire when actually under fire from a platoon of Brits with Enfields correct? I would assume this came from the Old Contemptibles era of WW1.
Yes, that’s correct. It came from some of the earliest engagements in 1914 at Mons, and the British troops at the time were all professional soldiers rather than the volunteers who joined up as the war progressed. There was an extra schilling a week pay for men who were skilled marksmen - the King’s Schilling - so most of those guys were very proficient with their rifles, and the German forces said in their dispatches that they came up against terrible & very accurate machine gun fire.
I kind of suspect that charging with two clips per reload might be faster. If you're loading loose rounds instead of clips, isn't it faster to load the magazine to capacity rather than load one round after each shot? Same principle, you're breaking your hold less often.
Except the force required for that 2nd charger is quite a lot higher ;)
*Bloke on the Range:* Even so, I'm not sure the _total_ reload time, including unseating and re-seating the rifle, would be twice as long. I guess it would depend on how strong your thumbs are.
Brilliant. I have wanted to own and shoot one of thees since I lived in the US MidWest in the early 1960's. I now live in Newark NJ and have no reason or opportunity to own any long gun , let alone any hand gun
One reason I'm glad I left for Alabama.
Fantastic video and a fantastic Lee-Enfield rifleman
beautiful
Remember that old TV show, HOT SHOTS? They had three persons running a gauntlet with a Smelly-highest score won. A Brit. showed them how to correctly manipulate the bolt of an Enfield, as shown here, beforehand. Not one of the three contestants adhered to this method.
Cheers! I been trying to figure out the Mad Minute and I never even though about using the ring or pinky to fire while the upper hand operated the bolt.
Middle finger ;)
Thank you, enjoyed that geekery very much :) Just wish my school CCF Unit in the late 1980s had allowed us enough blank .303 rounds to let us try a Mad Minute with our No.4s :) (No.4 would probably still be faster than the L98A1 we got in 1989...)
I live in texas
Best place for rifle shooters
I just bought a new old srock barrel for my no1 mk3
Cant wait to install it
Good video bloke
Love the content on this channel 👌🏼keep it up lad
With geeky analysis!!!! Huzzah!!!
You made bloody Swiss cheese of that target.
Used to shoot the Mad Minute with the HBSA North a while ago. Great fun with an old SMLE.
Good video, Bloke!
Bloke something strange is happening. Two or so hours ago, I could watch that video without problems, now I only get a black box and the video doesn't play. I tried other gun channels and the same thing happens. I tried normal channels and everything seems working normally.
Edit: 20 seconds later and it works. Strange.
What about running the drill with a hasty sling? Should be easier to keep the rifle in your shoulder and maybe make loading 10 more practical.
Bloke on the Range yeah I've shot both ways before, with and without a sling. I'm referring to a hasty sling vs a loop sling.
I'm impressed. Gosh, I would live to a nice #4!
Lloyds Camera?
lindybeige
Lindybeige's first name is "Lloyd"
Two Answers, but no answer.
UA-camr Lindybeige. He was on Blokes channel 6 months ago and vice versa.
Is it Lloyds Camera though
Where is best place when using a bench rest on the rifle before sling mount or after
behind, and sometimes best with your hand between the rifle and the rest.
At 50 seconds there should have been NO dry click you should have counted.
Fantastic video sir!
I tried some rapid fire. I just gave up after 15 rounds. Was kicking into my bad shoulder too hard, old football injury...
I did mate. Still 180gr ppu kicks like a mule...
Geek warning! Do you plan to chart how and where your rounds wandered from zero as you and your rifle got tired? A complicated pretty graph but you could project from it to say at which point mad min becomes a waste of ammo / loses suppressive effect.
Accuracy isnt essential for a suppressive effect.
@@James-sk4db proximity is
That was great, man.
Very good. As I’m sure you know, the minute is supposed to be shot at 300m
Well metres were never used in the war by Britain so not sure how. Unless you mean miles? Which would be a pretty good effort…
Funny how you can deduce when a shooting video was made based on ammo prices and clothing worn.
What's the name of the timer you use trying to buy one thanks.
Mine is a CED 7000 or 9000 or something. The one in this vid is an old one belonging to the range.
Great video as always, thanks.
Even with a few hard extractions amazing grouping and it being fumbly good job keep up the good vids i love the #4
I'm wondering how an Ishapore 2A or 2A1 chambered in 7.62 NATO would improve speed over the .303 because of it's lack of rim lock potential? Interesting series you have here sir.
Yes, true enough. Sadly, in the colonies, I have little choice now that my supply of good ammo from the Empire is drying up. Still have a bit of South African left to feed my SMLEs and No. 4 and 5.
It's a fun series. looking forward to the rest.
I have a .308 Ishy and it works very well indeed on rapid fire. My .303 Ishy is a bit more accurate, and if you know what to look for rimlock is not a problem. They are my usual shooters since they are the youngest of my Enfields. Unfortunately, 100+ years of corrosive milsurp (including the infamous POF round) has rendered my 1917 Mk III* to display status.
im struggling to find any info online abot click bangs
Clickbang in my experience with Enfields is largely due to old or bad ammo
I have use of a #4 but I'm a lefty. Is it possible?
I suggest you watch some of the shooting videos from Ian at Forgotten Weapons and his co-project InRange TV. He is a "lefty" as well, and the speed he cycles the bolt when shooting any bolt-action rifle, not just Lee Enfields, is incredible! Not just static target shooting, but 2-gun matches as well.
Try this from the 2:50 - 4:10 mark - ua-cam.com/video/HtxXZcnf2sY/v-deo.html He is using a late WWI "improved" Lee Enfield Pattern 1917
Interlaken! Me and my daughter are planning a trip to Switzerland which will take us through there, tentatively next May!
Love your videos otherwise.
Cant imagine how smoothy this thing runs
I love that nerdy deal tale
Dear Sir, looking at the video I find that you moved your head and lost your sight on target during bolt action, effectively loosing the benefit of the Enfield design
I made a comment to that effect in the video. Too much K31 shooting and a short butt on the No.4 there.
Thank you sir for the reply. Missed that point in the video. Would love to see how you do with a longer butt on the Enfield. Should get a higher rate of aimed shots. Great series of videos. Really enjoyed all the videos. Any possibility of doing comparison tests against the Lee Enfield, Kar 98k against the bolt-action rifles of the Japanese army Arisaki and Russian Mosin -Nagant? Thank you for the great videos!
Guns n Graphs! I love it.
If you manage 10 rounds in 12 seconds, load 2 clips in about 4 seconds, it would then be possible to get the elusive 38 rounds in 1 minute. Is it possible?
Switch to libreoffice; it's getting way more work done to it.
Outstanding indeed! The best I did was 18 rounds at 100 yards using the once plentiful Pakistani POF .303 ammo here in the US about 10 years ago. I guess I will try it out again this time with a different rifle using my Indian L2A2 in 7.62mm NATO. I hope that is not cheating in your book?
What group size did you get at 100?
@@jason200912 6 inches center mass on a B-27 silohoutte target.
Yes with deliberate aiming with steady stream of fire in a vertical group. It takes time and rounds to achieve this with steady concentration. Vertical is only of elevation better than deflection using only battle sights. Recoil and manipulation of the bolt requires practice. Very hard indeed. Requires good concentration on a normal range. Marksmanship decreases in combat when getting shot at.
great video mate. could you remind me of the target size and distance for the mad minute? my dad and i would love to give it a go with his Parker hale .303
nah not official, screw that lol. thanks mate now to see if i can find some pistol targets
No full auto in the building
Hey, will you talk about the swiss Luger (the 7.65 parabellum), the first one to be adopted by an army ?
Also, question : I have one 06/29 without the P on the trigger guard, so it was not officially privatized. What could have happened ? Was he stolen 80 years ago ?
Hm. The guy who sold it to me told me that it belonged to a soldier, and that he only used it for the mandatory training. It's in excellent shape. Maybe he lied, and it was never used, then sold as you say.
Btw, I live in Geneva, so if you need a magnificent 06/29 for a video, you can borrow it !
what do you typically pay for ammo/ 303 brit? I'm looking to purchase No.4 mk1* LB. Possibly my first firearm.
One Swiss Franc a bang. When bought in quantities of at least 500.
There ya go. She'll do what you need if you run her right.
why do some lee-enfield's have the nose cap and some don't?
thank you
Just came here to say that, having fired this weapon (owned by my old Master's advisor), I want one for myself: it's accurate and fast!
As it was mentioned that this rims were to spec: A few years ago i read somewhere that the .303 was the cartridge with the biggest variations in specs during WW1 and WW2, is there any truth to that?
The only thing I ever heard on this count is that the British government had much looser standards than the Canadians did during World War One, resulting in some trouble for the sensitive Canadian Ross rifles using British-made ammunition. However, the Lee Magazine System itself had no extraordinary issues with British ammunition, and the Ross rifle is not a gun to really judge the quality of anything by due to its unique situation.
Bishop's finger. A rather good ale only made on Friday.
Well shit you did a lot better than me
At what point does a bolt action rifle become a chain gun?
You alternated between index and ring finger which caused you to lose precious seconds.
I did not use my ring finger once.
@@BlokeontheRange You're in denial and mixing apples and oranges. Churchill weeps. Hitler laughs. Freud is pensive.
???? I have never, ever fired a live round with my ring finger in my life. What you're seeing in this video is not my ring finger pressing the trigger. And firing the first round conventionally after re-shouldering is faster since your need to reposition the butt properly and positively in your shoulder or you'll have problems. It wastes time to shoulder and then move the hand back to the bolt handle when you can just take the shot conventionally. If you think otherwise, please post a video demonstrating how your way is faster and better.
I calculated you could have gotten 30 without the errors. If the record was something like 37 it was not that far off.
Jesus... Doesn't anyone bother to sweep up on that range?
i'm fat, can i do the mad minute standing up instead?
3:20 robit engage
try 1 charger, fire one out of it, the load the next one.
so 5-1+5
Bloke on the Range I just wonder if that would take some time off, most people I see loading 10 pull the 1st charger off. I was just thinking that might be faster then doin that. I really don’t know I’ve never used a Lee Enfield.
where are you from?
Lars S
Hes English but lives in Switzerland which is how he has such a large firearm collection. Its in his Q n A.
You should do that over LOL.
Trackball??????
I am so disapointed with my young self! These guns where all over for NOTHING! WITH surplus AMMO!
Now with the interweb clearly these are truly GREAT bolt actions!
Hey Bloke, if you want to see some fast shooting you should check out a video called Stangskyting DFS 1986
Shouldn't loading the full clips technically be better because it reduces the small bolt working times
Try keeping that sight picture with Mauser 98 or a Springfield...
Like this you mean? ua-cam.com/video/hj90zasSu0o/v-deo.html
Rest the rifle on a sand bag it will be more like combat.
Train Conductor If he wanted combat authenticity, perhaps he could get the chap to whizz a few rounds back in his direction. I suspect that isn’t what he was going for.
lazaglider he was saying the rifle was heavy, the sand bag would be for support
S&B 180gr Training .303 british NO RIM JAM at my no.4 mark1