Proof MGSV Ground Zeroes is a Simulation 😲
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- Опубліковано 25 сер 2024
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Sorry, but I think this whole “simulation” theory is cop a out.
Where's the MGSV analysis!?
"V1rtu@l H@$ C0me T0" ua-cam.com/video/SK2S1Mk7QvQ/v-deo.html
This makes no sense, unless the Big Boss in Ground Zeroes is not the real Big Boss.
But the MGSV story tells there is only one Big Boss doppleganger...😏👀
Please sube in spañish!?😅
Honestly they really should have had big boss' voice changed to David Hayter in mission 46. That would have been icing on the cake for the twist and solidify the unreliable narrator in mission 0.
Bruh Davids voice doesnt work for big boss. Sutherland is best because he fits
@@Daud-ix4tm How are you going to say the original voice actor's voice doesn't fit?
@@Daud-ix4tm Sutherland’s voice fits Venom Snake but Hayter’s voice definitely fits Big Boss
@@visassess8607 because it doesn't due to how big boss looks. I saw a video where it was David's voice and it just doesn't work. Hey I love David but I stand my ground and will die on that hill. Plus dont be dick riders very more open minded
Sorry to break it to you all, but the real Big Boss never showed up in the entirety of MGSV, even in Mission 46.
Also, OG big boss spoke russian fluently but in mgsv he suddenly needs an interpreter.
Thats because of the shrapnel
@@halloweenjack95 No, that's just the excuse they give. In reality it's because Venom isn't the real Big Boss.
@@Nezxmi very likely. But there are actually some other legit theories as well.
@@halloweenjack95 did you even play the damn game
@@Naterade1959 about 8 times. Maybe more.
Also before each side ops mission in GZ the opening credits read "A Pseudo-historical recreation"
Well that’s for us because threats what it is it takes place in Afghanistan during the Cold War and everything but it twitsts it a bit
@@kienzan5589 no that was Phantom Pain
Ground Zeroes was set in a nameless island near Latin America
@@demonking86420it’s Cuba and it’s an island in the Caribbean
Ground zeroes is set on a loose recreation of Guantanamo bay
@@reloadedspade176 which is in Cuba
"Big Boss, turn off the game console right now."
"What did you say?"
@@TheRealBlazingDiamond Operation intrude N313 has been aborted
@@TheHitReality47 Intrude* but the quote is "The mission is a failure. Cut the power right now!"
@@TheRealBlazingDiamond switch off your MSX or NES console
Fission Mailed 💀
Hearing Big Boss or even Solid snake for that matter asking anyone "What should I do" is the most out of character and impossible thing Snakes would ever say.
@@rabertoification The signs are everywhere in all kinds of potency. This small line of dialog would have flown over most people's heads. Yet it's still a sign of a fake. I love this series so much lmao
@mateocristianmendez would he? He always had intel..
@@christiangottsacker6932 Brother, Intel only gives out orders. How to proceed with those orders is always up to snake. Intel giving advice is only for the player. Not Snake.
@christiangottsacker6932 This is directed m0stly towards BB in the first place. I still stand with what I said before, but could you imagine the greatest soldier on the planet say "what should I do?". See what I mean.
@CrayZgunZ he asks what to do frequently lol I'm obviously not saying he's incapable.. but still he didn't plan out the whole virtuous mission alone at all or anything like it, and the entire end message was how much of a pawn he is, and being used made him bitter.
They played us like a damn fiddle!! 💔
Metal gear saga is so complicated to understand...
Play MGS2 and just listen to there take on future wars, drones, misinformation etc. Its mad to play it today and see how scary accurate it is.
@@randomsimpsonsquotes6033 And the patriots and the artificial intelligence and everything… Kojima l knew what he was doing
I always said it after playing MGS 3, I could see that Kojima was trying to tell us something
And ocelot being the worst of it
No facts, only interpretations
Went to the comment section for clarity. Came out with an even larger head ache.
Could you imagine being me right now? The only MGS I played was The phantom pain. Every once in a while I discover a new fragment of the saga and that leaves me questioning and trying to figure out what is what and who is who
@@caiopoggers I gave up after 4 coming off the massive headache that was MGS2
It's interesting but when we play GZ Kojima himself tells us "starring Big Boss", while when we play TPP the titles go "starring Punished Venom Snake"
Well yeah, Venom didn't do the GZ mission. This doesn't contradict this video's theory.
@@onii-chandaisuki5710 the medic that shields big boss in GZ is who you play as in PP.
@@nakedsnake4248The medic doesn't know that though
You’d think with brainwashing Venom, they would teach him the languages Big Boss could speak lmao.
How would that work though? It makes sense to brainwashing/gaslighting someone into having false memories after being in a coma but brainwashing a language into someone seems kinda farfetched considering this takes place before nanomachines, which would've made it easy to do im assuming.
Sokolov -Your Russian is superb!
Learn a 2nd language, they didnt have the nano-machines to program him like a computer.
They did but I he shrapnel in his head was affecting that part of his brain. It's explained in game when you try to interrogate an enemy for the first time.
@@thepanthionno that’s just an excuse because he isn’t big boss
Fun fact: Glaz and Pelitz will also refer to Big Boss as "A Phantom" in the mission "Eliminate The Renegade Threat"
No, they said a Phantom is coming.
@@RaidenTheRipper950 Big Boss (The Player) is asked whether he's a Phantom.
- P&S
@@PythonSelkan Oh I didnt know that, thanks.
"Videogames have shallow stories"
The videogame:
😂
No one ever said this 🧐
When did anyone ever say that?
That fits why GZ had Sutherland as Snake, because it wasn't the actual Big Boss, but Venom imagining it as himself.
No lol it’s because David Hayters voice was awful by PW and Kojima likes filling his games with movie/tv actors he likes 😂
@@donotinteract7851Yeah, it’s funny seeing people trying to give a legitimate in-game reason for the voice change when it’s simply down to Kojima being obsessed with Hollywood actors. He has been looking to replace Hayter since at least 3, where he tried to get Kurt Russel on board.
If they had made Big Boss' voice different than Snake's as early as MGS3, I would never have had an issue with it.@@throbbingfellow1136
GZ was a VR effort. The glaring light flairs are an indicator, as well as hidd8ng valuable info such as venoms real identity to avoid a paradox
And also if you look at big boss shadow, big boss hair will appear with a short hair not a long hair.
😉
which shadow,,, in which game and scene.?
@@adamhearts9195 play ground zeroes at extra ops where you need to retrieve a cassette tape and look at big boss shadow.
@@bryuhMan That is just a limitation of the Fox Engine. Hair isn't able to cast shadows. Nothing more.
I love those little details we didn't see at first.
This game has the hardest lore to understand
Bisexual vampires 😎
I still don't understand what the word "vamp" has to do with bisexuality and so far have not found the answer on the internet which is not how the internet is supposed to work@@shadowstriker84
@@shadowstriker84I'LL TAKE YOUR ENTIRE STOCK!
you've never played kingdom hearts
Dont even bro will be confused literally from the beginning 🤣@kickassgreek
It’s about spying, subterfuge, misdirects and lying.
Everything you hear is a lie, even the truth is a lie in this series, but all those twist and turns is what makes this series fun to play
This is also like MGS2 even. Raiden does the Tanker mission (a mission before the main game, just like GZ) in VR. I believe the Colonel's lines in the beginning of the Plant mission will even change depending on if you did the Tanker mission first or not.
Kojima made a very very good story that still up to this day, we still haven't finished uncovering every secret stories hidden in Metal Gear, I admire him for that
This also explains why Miller says "To hell with big boss!" and mentions something about using Venom to take down Big Boss once we learn the "truth" in mgsv TPP.
Miller and Big Boss were essentially using each other for their own ends, and Miller lying to him and essentially having a hand in ending MSF, Big Boss realizes it could've been prevented had Miller told him the truth. it's odd that miller confesses this to him though, as it really didn't stand any purpose other than letting us the players be aware of his betrayal. it really didn't serve a purpose to tell big boss this as Miller should've known it would estrange him and BB. the whole reason BB left the Patriots and Cipher was because of their lies and scheming behind his back, but Miller, despite wanting to take Big Boss down, still worked with Cipher led by Zero, which is one of the organizations Paz was working for too, hence why Miller knew her, but Zero only ever intended to help BB and rekindle their friendships despite the fact Skull face ultimately went rogue and made XOF out of Cipher forces, waging a secret war on everyone including the world.
One of skull faces first acts was to infect Zero with the disease that essentially vegetates him, and he did this because he knew Ciphers true intentions weren't to rid Big Boss. But Zero had Anderson use the Patriots AI to glorify big boss and his past, making him a hero and a legend despite the fact most thought of him as evil and infamous by then thanks to Miller and Venom making Diamond Dogs. the oddity is though that Venom did this under Big Bosses wishes, even though BB had issues with Les Infants Terribles to the point of leaving Cipher and Patriots but he somehow ends up being okay with Venoms existence and even gives him orders in secret. Though Venom / medic worshipped bb and wanted to help him, Miller was trying to use him to destroy bbs legacy and name.
All of the metal gears is basically thematically about secret organizations with even more secret civil wars, corruptions, and disparity amongst their own organizations ranks. double and triple agents, conflicting stories and actions all basically stemming from The Bosses ideals that were passed down and misconstrued into BB.
BB isn't as bad as the game makes him seem but hes still undoubtedly a selfish, arrogant, and egocentric man whom has taken countless lives with his own hands and caused countless more deaths via just being associated to him by proxy. he's vain and deluded, misguided, and an hopeless romantic. practically traits of all of the snakes.
You know, I played all the games at least once and I don't fully understand the story yet , this is quite refreshing, thank you.
excellent snake.
You've got a great understanding of the underlying story, Boss.
Nah big boss is a hero, as was the boss and solid snake
@@calebmarin I honestly probably don't understand a lot of it myself, even though Ive played all the games a few times over... Lol, this series was intentionally confusing and contradicting and I still don't understand what Miller was thinking by betraying BB as he did... Was he truly so arrogant that he thought he could lie and betray BB and still work with him? Even to the point of confessing? Because, Miller only got angry at BB once he ghosted him after he learned of his betrayal, and this simply was enough to make Miller swear vengeance on him?.. kinda odd imo.
Just for more story clarity though, Big Boss left the Patriots and Cipher because Zero did the Les Enfants Terribles project without his consent and even knowledge, making Solid, Solidus, and Liquid clones of him. This upset BB so much he left the organizations behind, (well that and the fact he had learned the truth about the boss, that she was ordered on a suicide missions by the American government to pretend to be a defector and ultimately let BB kill her, it was the lying and doing things behind people's backs, making and using soldiers as puppets that upset BB into leaving as Les Infants was just the final straw,) but he also, after losing Militaire Sans Frontiers because of Paz and Miller, basically operating as agents for Cipher and probably Xof, as at that point I'm pretty sure Zero had already been poisoned by skull face and Skullface had already made XOF, Big Boss found out about Venom being made by Zero, as that was basically the last two things Zero ever did. He and Eva had BB and Medic rescued after their heli exploded, Zero also gave the go ahead to make Venom and knowing he was dying on top of knowing Skullface was rogue and making big plans, Zero gave Cipher to Donald Anderson and had him program the Patriots AI system to glorify BB. But Solidus got ahold of the Patriot AI, pretending to be BB, to try and draw in Liquid and the other snakes but BB was okay with Venom being his double purely because this mean the Patriots AI was focusing on Venom and not himself. Which was how he went and made Zanzibar Land, making his own country so to speak.
Solidus wanted to become BB and control everyone through nano machines and the Patriots AI. Liquid just wanted to cause chaos and bring the whole world to war. Venom was a good guy tbh but he willingly and knowingly played the bad guy to keep BB safe, while Miller used Venom to try and destroy BBs image. Ocelot was always semi loyal to BB too but he did waiver a bit once Liquid was in the picture, however, he did this intentionally, kind of how Venom was brainwashed Ocelot had himself brainwashed into thinking he was Liquid purely so he could help Big Boss out. Which is why Liquid and Ocelot seemed to be working together throughout. It was more like Ocelot spying on Liquid for BB, and using himself as a lure to get Solid into the picture.
In this way the real Big Boss was literally giving orders to all the snakes nearly. Liquid through Ocelot, BB was literally the leader of Foxhound as well, and gave Solid the order to go to Shadow Moses as well as Operation Intrude, which was the mission where solid killed Venom, of which BB ordered venom to partake in as well.
The reason he didn't care who died here is because if, as it happened, Solid won and Venom died then solid and the world would think him dead and defeated but even if Venom killed snake, won, and managed to keep outer heaven alive, everyone would still think venom was the real BB and he would still be safe to do as he was with Zanzibar.
As for The Boss, she wasnt a traitor like the third game made her seem. She was ordered by the CIA to pretend to be a defector to the USSR so she could make contact with Volgin, her task was to try and locate the Philosophers legacy and bring it back to the US. The PL being an huge amount of cash and currency that was put together by heads of the US, China, and Russia, and was basically a microfilm with all the bank accounts on it. But because Volgin used the Nuclear weapon, an Davy Crockett American made, on Russian soil the Russian government and the US had to agree that both the boss and Volgin had to die to prevent world war and save face between them. Eva, who was also posing as the KGB agent Tatyana, was also tasked to find the PL for the Chinese, hence why she ended up stealing a fake microfilm from snake after they slept together at the end of 3. BB was able to bring home the real PL to US but it was only half of it and BB was pissed once he learned why The Boss died, as Eva left him an recording that explained what she truly did. How she died a true patriot and hero but will be remembered as a traitor.
Oh, also, Ocelot is actually The Bosses son. He was in MGs3 as well, acting as a triple agent between US, Russia, and some other org but ultimately he ends up finding the other half of the PL that the KGB managed to acquire and he stole it and kept it for himself. This is why BB and Ocelot got along so well though, as he finds out near the end of Snake Eater that Ocelot is the bosses real son, the one that was taken from her.
One thing that really makes me wonder about Venom Snakes true identity...
Who else knows?
Big Boss, Zero, Ocelot, Miller for sure. Volgin was able to figure it out, and it's definitely possible that Psycho Mantis knows and could have told Liquid at some point. (I doubt Ocelot would have told him)
It's not clear if the rest of the Patriots knew. Eva or Sigint could have been kept in the dark. I wouldn't be surprised if Paramedic was involved, given that she was involved with creating the Cyborg Ninja, but nothing concrete to implicate she was involved or knew.
Theres no way Paramedic was involved with Venom Snake, by the time Big Boss broke with Zero, she and Sigint stayed on Zero's side
The doctors at cypress knew
Certain Diamond Dogs soldiers also know Venom isn't the Real Big Boss.
"Boss, whoever you are, I'll still follow you."
Contradicting Ocelot in the Truth tapes, who said:
"No one around him will doubt that it's the Big Boss they know."
- PythonSelkan
I don't think Psycho Mantis knew or at least told Liquid. When Liquid talks about his experience with BB he recalls his memories on Mother Base, he never interacted with the real BB from what we know so far.
imagine if this was actually just the writer forgot their own convoluted plots and just says ''fuck it'' and start writing whatever they could remember from memory 😂
This was my first thought . It could go either way but metal gear has so many plot holes on top of translation errors that it's hard to put all the pieces together.
Jajaja and we think that is a part of an elaborated plan to make the best lore in the history of videogames 😂😂
But in MGS GZ we DO play as the real Big Boss. Venom Snake was "created" after the mother base attack...
Indeed, but the Ground Zeroes mission WE (the players) played - was the mission being experienced through Venom Snake's brainwashing, hence these clear inconsistencies... AND Kiefer Sutherland being heard as the protagonist, instead of David Hayter, even for GZ.
- P&S
@@PythonSelkan Maybe, I'm not sure. Bcause, for example, Paz dies in the "real" GZ mission, but in the brainwashing version, they told Venom she survived.
@@victorcroft8794that was Venom’s previous Medic identity feeling a hell of a lot of guilt over not saving Paz- she did die during GZ. Miller and Ocelot were never in that room with Paz on the Medical Platform, and the room itself was under construction with only a metal floor.
@@literallyvenomsnakeThat contradicts itself. If Venom remembers the events of GZ, then he'd remember that Paz, the person he was trying to rescue, had died.
@@LarryTheTugaGamer1511
He does, he just can't cope with the guilt, hence why his mind (thanks to shrapnel as well) is able to fabricate the room, Paz, the interactions with Miller, Ocelot and an alternative "ending" as to how things ended up in GZ. It isn't until he starts remembering more when the facade is lifted and he remembers what truly happened in GZ. That information is in his mind, he just couldn't cope with the guilt of being unable to save Paz.
Ok, what if in Metal Gear(1987), the REAL Big Boss did lead Solid Snake through Outer Heaven, meanwhile Venom and Miller thought that he wouldn't have anything to report back to the west because of the deceit of their operations. Then, Gray Fox, working for the real Big Boss, helps Solid Snake destroy Outer Heaven without Snake even knowing. Big Boss would get what he wanted by shutting down Miller and Venom, while making the world believe that he too was killed in Outer Heaven.
well played.
I always thought more that Big Boss and Venom Snake were allies until the end. Let’s not forget the traps BB gave by codec to snake, which is what also would’ve caused grey fox to be captured, meaning bb and venom were together in it… if that was the case, why would grey fox protect bb if he would find out that he was sent just as distraction? Well he was part all along of the ruse setup by Big Boss and Venom Snake and pretend that he was captured, hoping Snake would not succeed and die in the process (since BB was not fond of him) but since he succeeded then grey fox had no other option but to blow his cover and protect Big Boss in MG2…anyways, I think I like your theory better!
Damn sounds like exactly what the story is and if anyone thinks it’s a theory that it’s not is weird
Not to be impolite, but I seriously have to disagree with your theory because it obviously doesn’t explain the unhelpful radio chatter with Big Boss during Metal Gear, nor the overall atmosphere that Snake is obviously unprepared for his mission. If we assume that real Big Boss was on the radio while Punished Snake only appeared in the end (which makes the most sense and retcons the biggest plot hole), then it’s obvious the 2 of them are very much working together - Big Boss’s “advice” arguably hurts Snake more than the final fight. Even without that explanation, there are still no hints whatsoever that *anybody* is *secretly* helping Snake whatsoever during the first Metal Gear except for the rebels (whose help is quite limited though), since the whole thing with Miller only starts in part 2. Also, I think you’re just overanalyzing Grey Fox’s part in the first game; it’s more likely Kojima had some ideas for him but couldn’t put them in the first game in time, so we’re just to assume that this aborted subplot merely ends with Grey Fox leaving the stage after his brief appearance.
@@MultiBOZA I haven’t replayed the originals in years besides mg 2 solid snake I beat it the other day but I would say that maybe it’s a time problem like you said. But I’m going to replay the first msx game soon
Another detail: Eli is actually LIQUID SNAKE as a child. At the end of the game as Psycho Mantis is looking at Eli you can see in the reflection of the lenses in his gas mask Liquid Snake and Solid Snake as a kid.
Dude that's not a "secret" at all.
@@noex100 Never called it a secret-
@FatalShotGG Yes you did, you just edited your comment.
Nah I spelt Eli wrong so I fixed it. Make up what you want tho-
Damn! I didn't even realize that Ground Zeroes was a simulation. It makes sense. Hideo said that Peace Walker, GZ and TPP was part of the MGSV trilogy.
Ground Zeroes is big boss tho, it is never said or implied that GZ you play in Venom's "Implanted memories". Could be just an overlook
Totally agree. The Snake from GZ is the real Big Boss from Peace Walker. There’s no sense in bringing the Brain Washing of Venom Snake. So glad this ☝🏼comment is here.
It also makes sense with the switch in voice actor if we really look into it it makes sense that the real big boss is not involved in the simulation and leaves and venom is brainwashed into believing he's big boss which is why in the simulation he's got a different voice which is a cool thing we can gather from this information
Shoul have worked better if Hayter replayed his role on all the scenes where the real BB was in
@@sikbeta We don't see BB directly in any scene in both GZ and TPP. All of the events Big Boss was in were Venom's projection of the events as narrated to him by Ocelot after he woke up from coma
What about the hospital scene at the start? Is that just Venom imagining that BB is leading him away?@@dvornikovalexei
watch fight club. seriously. No hayter = no BB. easy.
Bro was like “this is what actually happened in metal gear” and my brain was like “checking out”
I can absolutely believe Ground Zeroes is a simulation, with little inconsistencies here and there to create that ‘imperfect’ feeling between it and the real world, but I personally feel like the specific evidence given may be cherry-picking. Yes, Big Boss was angry, but that was taken out of context from a longer, five-minute cutscene in which the two discuss the future of MSF. Big Boss didn’t walk away from Miller or MSF; it doesn’t feel like a genuine betrayal. I think the line spoken in GZ was made to be vague or not summarize events as they happened to the letter, not because they wanted to erase Miller’s ‘betrayal,’ but just to sell Miller’s imperfect version of events to Venom because maybe Miller didn’t feel as though Venom needed to hear the real story.
Or it's because Kojima forgot or perhaps retconned that.
Like isn't Peace Walker all about Big Boss struggling with and trying to understand why The Boss defected even tho EVA explains all of that in the tape she leaves him at the end of MGS3?
I highly doubt Kojima "forgot". He pays very close attention to detail.
As for Peace Walker, Big Boss is grappling with why The Boss agreed to be a pawn and sacrifice both her life and reputation just so the government could get some money.
EVA explained why The Boss "defected", but not why The Boss willingly went along with such a self-effacing scheme. THAT is what BB is so anguished about in Peace Walker: he's so appalled by his mentor not only being used like disposable trash by her government, but by her actually acquiescing to that mission. That's why BB mentally deteriorates, feeling betrayed not only by his country but by The Boss herself. During the PW torture at the hands of Strangelove, this cognitive dissonance is on full display: he can't bring himself to admit The Boss sacrificed her life and dignity for her country and insists she must have had other motives. He then dedicates the rest of his life to creating a world where soldiers will always have more war and more battles without being pawns of countries. Only at the end of MGS4 does BB basically admit that The Boss acted selflessly to further her own vision of a world united and at peace. To this end, he says the world would be better without "Snakes" (i.e. soldiers), abandoning his former philosophy and accepting The Boss' true will.
it was actual a translation / localization error. The original JP script is different so this means nothing in the end
So Kaz knew everything during the events of TPP because I remember the ending of the game Ocelot and Kaz talk about how Big Boss sold them out well mainly Kaz.
Kaz finds out way later so does ocelot because he brainswashed himself
He gets a call from Cypher telling him about the whole Venom Snake act, it's in the tapes
@@sikbetawhi h tape is it? Can you name it?
Metal Gear series deserves an anime AND a ground up remake for ps5
Fuck no. Western activists would destroy a remake
@@Butiguessilovememore at that point, Konami should just leave them out
@@Butiguessilovememoreno? you do know the entire game franchise is and has been anti-war? also, MGS3 remake now, so, you were wrong
western activists are anti-white not anti-war@@literallyvenomsnake
@@ButiguessilovememoreFake fan by the way
Kaz saying theyre a tripple agent and he knew the whole time. But he gets pissed when Big Boss uses his cosmetic clone Venom Snake to be his partner in battle. Kaz doesnt like being lied to despite lying himself.😊
That makes sense. I remember being annoyed by this in GZ but I just ignored it as a little mistake.
I also remember GZ had some weird... glitch like things in the opening cutscene? I can't remember exactly now. But it's kind of like when a VHS tape starts to tear. Maybe this is relevant?
I took it as Venom’s memories not clashing well with the brainwashing before Awakening.
I hear its amazing when the purple stuffed worm in flapjaw space with a tuning fork does a raw blink on hari kiri rock. I need scissors! 61!
He didnt forget it. Kaz literally says, "I was the parasite below feeding off zeros power."
that’s why the camera also feels like we’re a third person seeing everything happen
Game writers: Holy shit I forgot a character was supposed to know something. Nobody will notice.
Theorists: *5 pages of analysis*
None of it makes a lot of sense to me probably because Hideo didn't know he would make other Metal Gear games.
everytime I heard kaz say that line in a video about ground zeros I'm like " what do you mean we,asshole."
oh my god it really is a parallel of mgs2. that’s wild
Metal gear storys are always crazy and the best.
Proof that it isn't: Kojima basically retconning the entire series with every entry.
Don't believe their lies.
@@Zanziebar ol el ul il al
It'd fake news from The Patriots AI
@@mrnukes797 *!*
100s of years from now, the Sons of PythonSelkan will unveil truths of Metal Gear, secrets and revalations hidden away in the very programming of Metal Gear, Kojima's Legacy!
I allways thought that line didnt make sence but i allways let it slide but now when youre putting two and two together it makes sence now
This is genuinely a good theory. Because in the future instalments Miller had legs and arms. So something had to be altered in venom snake's memory. He could have gotten a transplant surgery but who knows.
Its explained that he got bionics added to him. He didnt get any in mgsv to keep the pain fresh in his mind
He literally has a prosthetic leg in mgsv
@@leonrussell9607it’s more like a peg leg, very basic compared to Snake’s prosthetic arm. I figure he just got himself some advanced prosthetics made after he had gotten killing Skullface out of his system.
What??? Miller is never shown to have real arms or legs in any future installment in the series.
That’s also why Big Boss has Venoms voice (Keifer Sutherland) in Ground Zeros. It’s Venom, not BigBoss, after all!
It was because everyone was on comms. Only big boss and kaz knew the truth, admitting he knew it on comms with everyone listening would have endangered him
Could you imagine if Big Boss in MGS5 was voiced by John Cygan? RIP to such an amazing actor
That was one theory I had. Another was he changed it due to not a lot of people finishing Peace Walker since drop rates for Zeke parts were ass.
Excellent point! 👍
Also, if you realise, all Mainline MGS games had VR content (Yes, even MGSV (GZ is more of a Prequell to MGSV)), However, MGS3 had No VR content, so I theorize that the whole MGS3 has been put into a VR simulation, and is Venom Snake's simulation during his 9-year coma. More proof is that the Calorie Mate was made in the 1980s, the same year TPP was set.
This theory can be backed up by MatPat (''The Game Theorists'' YT channel, also the same guy that made the FNaF story) as he has lots of proof.
So what about when V learns the truth and when He punches the Mirror the Logo on his shoulder and the door switches from the Diamond dogs to Outer Heaven?
I haven't played GZ (or Peace Walker), but find this fascinating. People can say what they want about Kojima, but I think he's such a genius storyteller. Always learning new things about the MGS universe.
I loved these games growing up. I wish I could play them again.
Nah, GZ is Big Boss, Phantom Pain is Venom Snake. It's just an oversight in the writing.
In both GZ and TPP the protagonist is Big Boss. But Ground Zeroes' events had not really happened in the way we know because it's a 'memory" from a brainwashed schizophrenic. If you remember Big Boss barely talks and he uses the same CQC moves of the sequel
@@sergioriggio1769 which aligns with the fact that Venom created his own CQC that is more aggressive. and why even in GZ its not David's voice and everyone lost their mind over that back then
@@mrmasky9783 I really love the headcanon that the Kiefer Big Boss is Venom Snake while David Big Boss is Naked Snake, but it just isn't true. First of all, Kiefer voiced the real Naked Snake during TPP. Secondly, I think everyone knows by now that Kojima just wanted a Hollywood star to voice Snake and this was the only time he got to do it.
@@notyepdranel961 Just remember that Naked Snake was his codename during the Virtuos Mission. He than earned the title of Big Boss. Which was passed to Venom. In TPP, even after the truth was revealed, he could not distinguish himself from the other Snake. And that's why he always hears his own voice
I still think the Truth Chapter in The Phantom Pain reveals that it wasn’t Big Boss that infiltrated Camp Omega to rescue Paz, but instead it was Venom Snake in his final real test to prove if he is worthy to be Big Boss’s eyes ears and mouth and all action.
Think about it. Kaz wanted to expand the MSF, and Big Boss can’t be literally everywhere at once. So they recruited worthy soldiers and they had embarked on grueling test to see which one are worthy to be Big Boss in mind and spirit but physically as well. Not as a doppelgänger, but as the one that thinks and acts like Big Boss. Venom (whose original code name was Medic due to his quick thinking and excellent expertise medic skills in combat) was the top candidate and his final test was Camp Omega.
Big Boss was in the helicopter to offer support from above and maintain reconnaissance, while Kaz was left behind to aid the Nuclear Inspection (before some wheelchair bastard betrayed everyone that welcomed open arms to him).
If the controversy of David Hayter not returning did not happened, the truth ending and during their escape at the hospital would reveal David’s voice as Big Boss in a surprising revelation that Kiefer Sutherland’s voice as “Big Boss” is in fact Venom (or rather Punished) Snake aka The Medic.
So the idea of having “two” Big Bosses is sort of in effect but in the way originally planned. Venom being Big Boss’s phantom while the real one is in hiding to rebuild a new faction.
Venom’s mind is still stuck in 1974 Peace Walker era, so instead of being mad at Big Boss using him, he as an MSF soldier still stand by him and took it as an honor to be Big Boss’s decoy.
Sadly it was short lived when a certain imperfect clone manages to destroy their hardened facility including Venom himself.
so venom snake is the one who solid snake killed that was called big boss's clone?
Damn, it makes fuckin sense!
Still a masterpiece
Just like the MGS2 tanker “mission”
In MgsV mission “The man who sold the world” we see your character as the doctor in the helicopter
oh my god I forgot snakes voice in peace walker was so weird
Venom is completely a different character that big boss
Big boss did this mission but venom snake got brainwashed to forget that paz was a triple agent
Konami really should give the license to Hideo Kojima, he made the series what it was and if he had control of it we could see so much more from this universe
Damn I didn't notice that
Said this the moment Miller started talking.
So ground zeroes as we see it is not big boss’s experience but venom’s recollection of the event after the hypnotherapy and such
It was raining when they met Paz and Zadornov lmao
So did GZ never happened, or in GZ we play through V brainwashed perspective?
The latter. The Ground Zeroes mission we played was the manipulated memory Venom experienced. What was true or not from the actual mission remains to be seen. Kojima did say we'd be replaying Camp Omega at one point in time...
- P&S
@@PythonSelkan thanks a lot for the reply, appreciate it!
@@PythonSelkan camp Omega is cut content for tpp
Why snake needs an interpreter in mgsv is because it's not the real snake
I... did not know this.
If they ever re-release MGSV, they only need to change the dialogs between ocelot and the big boss and the audio of the cassette. Having Venom its own Voice would represent a difference between the true and the fake snake, and for GZ, it’s a memory part of the brain washing of V. That’s the reason of that snake again trusting Kaz after the realizations at the end of PW.
I wonder why in the cutscene in the beginning you see dogs but when you play no dogs whatsoever
They should've kept davids voice for all the scenes the original big boss is in for mgsv. Voice is something that cannot be changed.
What if they did?
Exactly... there was no emotional weight when msf you built in peacewalker was destroyed in gz. Sutherland was so bland and dry with his lines it was like he doesn't care. like dude, the base you built was wrecked and you have no reaction?
his reaction should have been the same weight with kaz's famous delivery line "they played us like a damn fiddle!" and i felt that.
You can see snakes shadow in ground zeros, it looks exactly like the man from the hospital with face covered with bandages
The big secret is that Kojima completely forgot that revelation when writing MGSV, the writing in MGSV has plenty of nonsense points
In Ground Zeroes you can call Miller and he'll tell you that he had Chico's sister Amanda listen to Chico's tape and she relays the message "I'm prepared for the worst", and Kaz follows up to that with the statement "That sounded a little too cheery to me"
It never gets followed up on. What was he implying?
Ground Zeroes was not a simulation, you could argue that the side ops maybe were considering the "Pseudo historical reenactment" statements at the beginning of each of them but Ground Zeroes was not, that line of dialogue you're referring to is just the product of bad writing
There's a difference between "bad writing" that is not followed up on (till what we've seen so far), and an evident discrepancy though. This dialogue completely contradicts Peace Walker's main plot twist, literally the ending of the previous game in both timeline and release. If it ever was a genuine mistake, I'd argue they had plenty of time to fix it since 2014, since our channel first pointed it out.
The only way this could ever be a mistake, is if no one from Kojima Productions (not just Kojima), or the entirety of Konami ever noticed it's contradicting the main plot twist of their previous game - in over a decade now, which is extremely unlikely. Games aren't what they used to be during PS1/2 days. Things can easily be fixed with game updates nowadays.
It's also canon that Venom was brainwashed with all of Big Boss's missions by Hypnagogia. That includes Ground Zeroes.
- P&S
@@PythonSelkan I believe I watched a video by you guys years ago that also pointed out Big Boss (in GZ after you extract Chico), asks Miller if "we should neutralize Paz" or something to that effect. Big Boss would never kill a kid let alone Paz (or Chico). Miller says no, but BB wouldn't have even asked it to be begin with.
Ground zeroes was badass ( off topic)
MGSV is the toxic yaoi gaslighting military simulator
how does that even make sense when it's big boss unless you mean the extra ops
Yes i knew it , because a played Peace Walker, Ground Zeroes and The Phantom Pain
He didn't know it
yeap you just won my heart with this, subscribed :D
I love who miller sounds like the voice liquid was trying to put on in mgs1
Someone mentioned that this is Venom Snake's coma dream during hypnotherapy, and I can see it
They also mentioned that TPP was actually Venom's retelling of those events from his own perspective as he laid dying in the first game from Solid Snake's hand
But Kaz lost his trust after he learnt Venom was not the BB right? Thiw was in the end game tapes
We're referring to Big Boss losing his trust in Miller after he betrayed him 😊
- P&S
Actually that dialog takes place eith the actual snake before we get replaced with venom snake , hes not saying that to the fake snake but the real one.
Mgs3 is a training program that's why it's a virtual mission. I mean virtuous mission.
Virtual mission?
@@abelq8008 have you played mgs3?
@@judoclawplays962 yeah! Was just joking because that's what snake says.
@@judoclawplays962snaker but it still happened didn’t it
I'm not sure how, but we've somehow graduated to "none of the Metal Gear series is canon to the Metal Gear series". This fandom confuses me more than Ocelot tbh.
Actually I think it even goes deeper. I believe that the entire Ground Zeros game is the simulation. I feel like the feeling of anger and revenge the player feels are what Venom was shaped to feel by Ocelot after the simulation of Ground Zeros. Really think about it. The game makes you play a campaign that kills everyone and then gives you side ops in the same place and leaves you in agony trying to piece it together. And through the side ops you learn a piece by piece the more you get out of your way to look for secrets that your enemy is Cipher, and you’re shaped into hating them. Which makes the prisoner’s story in Destroy The Enemy Air Defences even crazier. It also explains how Skull Face was able to know one of BB’s lines in previous games “Don’t worry pain gets the better of us all”.
Ground Zeros is an amazing concept (that was too expensive on release)you can’t know what’s important to the lore and what isn’t.
Wait, in what way were The Patriots involved in The Medic becoming Venom Snake? Wasn’t it Big Boss, Miller and Ocelot who orchestrated that?
I think this was like the time where Ocelot said our fathers will has been complete, in an outside of the games perspective the writers of Ground Zeros didn’t know fully what Peace Walker was. Now for a lore perspective Kojima always like making twists and turns in terms of gameplay and storytelling. Like it’s a way to forget what happened in the passed and being told a story made up, another reference onto how the Patriots in MGS2 also wanted to control information and change or put right remove the context or history of certain things.
So they played us like a fiddle?
I don't Know If I understood You right but I don't think so. Because If that Is all Simulation Then what really happened to the Mother Base? Why did Skull Face acted like he was the one who attacked the Mother Base? Why Did Huey didnot retaliated against Ocelot and Miller when he was sent away?
Why the soldiers of the old mother base were scaterred across Africa and Afghanistan? Why didn't the Old Mother Base Soldiers Never Talked About This? Can Someone Answer Me these Questions? By Thinking Ground Zeroes As A simulation, It also makes me question that Is Chico Alive?!! If He is then where is he? And Why Venom Snake Is In Hospital? Plz Respond.
If i understand that right, It was happened already with real BB, but venom was brainwashed with editable memories/simulation.
(Im new in mgs, didn't play in all old mgs games except mgs what was ported for pc
It is. Just think about in MGS GZ Main Op says Time Paradox and the others like Side Ops didn't say that.
MGS series is legendary
So did the real Big Boss go on a mission to save Paz and Chico without Miller?
Did they put their disagreement on hold to storm the black site?
Honestly I thought it was just a retcon
one small issue I have..how come Miller doesn't know venom snake isn't the real big boss and only finds out at the end of the game.
it's in the tapes, he gets a call from Cypher
No if it is then kaz wouldn’t lost his one arm and one leg chico and paz wouldn’t be killed starting scene of episode 46 wouldn’t exist 9 year after the attack wouldn’t be mentioned msf wouldn’t be shut down and also kaz would knew about this if this was real but he didn’t knew about this ocelot tells him in the end
Appreciate the video
It would also explain why he's voices by Kiefer in Ground Zeroes. Would've been the perfect opportunity to bring back David Hayter at the end of Phantom Pain
Just want to add additional stuff here , So basically the canon of the story doesn’t actually happen in the phantom pain, we seeing an alternate reality of a dream hence the characters slightly off and all the parallel snakes and big bosses, the only canon part is one of the side ops in ground zeroes, everything else is an alternative version to the reality that actually happened. That’s basically the phantom pain we feel, I must say it’s brilliantly done, like for example whenever I have a new playthrough when you rescue code talker you will see there is a coexisting cassette tape where skullface talks to code talker, seeing as skull face and venom are one and the same person also while in the ride only one of them talks. the real canon lies between these blurred lines but god damn it’s such a phantom pain. The timeline secret lies with ground zero, the camp omega thing is after metal gear 2, watch the original launch trailer of Kojima
Which side op are you referring to?
Most of ground zeroes story tapes etc is brainwashing but the mission where you rescue the prisoner in the same location where Paz originally was ,paz was never there but that prisoner was, he will give you also canon dialogue, basically explaining that there was this guy who interrogated him and the humint network that they using etc but he mentions a quote that the guy who interrogated him gives which is “nothing to be ashamed of pain gets the better of us all, let the words comfort you, now did your boss tell you” this quote is the exact quote big boss uses in peace walker (previous game) it’s brilliantly done, with that being said, the real story we will never know it was never there it’s in between skull face and venom snake actions where secrets lie but the chronological order of events is difficult to tell , the whole V series is pseudo historical recreation of events, that’s the smoking gun.
Phantom Pain is a prequel to MGS1 and direct sequel to Peace Walker. GZ takes place literal months after PW, same with the attack on MB.