Are Miracles Possible? w/ Dr. Frank Turek || Project
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- Опубліковано 3 сер 2024
- This is a recording of Session 3 at Main Street Church's Project 3:15 Conference with Dr. Frank Turek.
Project 3:15 is the annual apologetics conference of Main Street Church that seeks to equip Christ-followers to defend and share their Christian faith with confidence and compassion. - Розваги
Faith is the power of total conviction in the mind, possessing the mind.
Faith, arising out of your need to believe in something, because such a belief will serve your purposes in some way, can be powerful and strong.
Belief is even stronger. Belief is the offspring of hearsay and logic. Because you have heard something and been convinced that what you have heard or read is true, you develop a deep belief in what you have heard. You believe it to be true. You believe in a total, complete way which defies contradiction.
Christ was constantly telling people: "Believe you will receive-and you will receive."
However, Christ knew at the time, that it will be almost impossible for most people to ever have the faith which will cause miracles to happen-since no matter how much he or others might explain Truth to them, they will still never have the intense knowing.
Up to this time, people who have faith in Christ are like precocious children. Their faith has been partially blind and accepting, yet interwoven with much doubt. Therefore, whatever they needed to be done for them, they depended on Christ for the work to be accomplished. Whereas, in fact, much of what they believed they have derived directly from Christ has been their own faith in Christ made visible in the form of things asked for.
While this child-like faith is very important to our well-being, those who are capable of moving onward on the spiritual path to perfection, must now reach a deeper level of true knowledge of the relation between mind and matter. Without this foundation-people will continue to flounder in myths, fallacies and will be locked into the misery of the human condition.
Concerning miracles. I believe they are happening often. A miracle is defined here as the supernatural affecting the natural. Is this not why we pray? We want some change to occur with God's help. When a person is born again, we have received our own personal miracle. God wants to be involved in making changes. It seems many time, we are holding him back because we are unwilling.
Atheist absolutely would not agree that without God there is no purpose. They may agree that there's no purpose handed down from on high, but the atheist has just as much purpose in their life as anyone else. Purposes that we Define for ourselves, or develop because of our relationships or place in society. For example, my purpose is, in my mind, to make myself feel as good about myself as I possibly can. There are things that I am evolutionarily inclined to believe are bad to do, like murder - because murder is by definition unjustified if I know I've committed murder I know I've done something unjustified- and that there are things which are good to do in general, like being kind to the elderly or the weak , and for reasons which are not within my choosing, doing the bad things as I perceive it causes me to feel bad about myself, which I do not like, and doing the things which I perceive to be good makes me feel good about myself. This is not the case with all people. some people's self-defined purpose is to cause as much harm as they can, and these people seek to make themselves feel good as well, though it makes them feel good to do bad instead of good. No God is necessary for any of this.
Thank you for sharing!
Genuine question - I'm not sure I understand. So because you said that we define our own purposes & that some people's self-defined purpose is to cause as much harm as they can, would they really be wrong for causing harm & doing bad to others if that is their "self-defined purpose?" You said that murder is unjustified (which is true), but then you say that some people's "self-defined purpose" is to cause harm, which may include murdering others. So would they really be wrong/evil if they are just fulfilling their "self-defined purpose?"
…. Let’s hope it’s not Stalin’s or Mao type of purpose…
I speak for myself as a non believer. Regardless if there is a god or not , I strive to live an impeccable virtuous life as best I can , given the knowledge , understanding, insight and wisdom I have at any given moment , and I lead it with kindness and love . I am responsible and accountable for my choices and actions. I create my own “heaven or hell” every moment with my thoughts words and actions. Wether or not there is a god or not has no bearing on how I conduct myself . I do it for the sake of being a good decent person in and of itself . The golden rule has been around a lot longer than Christianity .
Christianity is just a philosophy/theology . Its a version , amongst many , of the concept of God. I reject the Christian version 🤷🏼♂️. Not so put off by something like the deist version of the concept of God, one that set everything in motion billions of yrs ago and either died , can’t intervene or doesn’t care to. To me, the biblical god, yaweh , is an ethically and morally depraved monster. Hell, I have better moral standards that. Genocide infanticide discrimination , non Israelite slavery etc are just not my cup of tea . Sorry yaweh , ya don’t make the cut
So, you must be all Knowing. You must know everything that happened throughout history, and all the motives behind them to think that you can rightly judge God. It seems more reasonable that you are prideful, and self righteous, thinking more highly of yourself then you should. Do you really think that everyone should follow you, as you are the source of goodness, and Truth?
Is it actually your position that whatever you believe is good today, tomorrow you could believe the complete opposite, and not be wrong? This is meaningless.
@@scottm4042 what comes first , Scott, yaweh or morality ? This question alone will reveal your indoctrination depending on how you answer it . Tell me, Scott, if you were to lose your faith and leave religion , would you go out and start murdering, raping, pillaging, stealing, lying, harming etc ? If so , please stay religious.
In regards to being prideful and boastful , why don’t you take a closer look at your biblical god . 1 Corinthians 13:4-8 , makes yaweh look like a hypocrite. You should spend more time analyzing your Bible . But you won’t bc you’re too Indoctrinated, emotionally attached ,and of course, fearful. However , if you need assistance, I’ll be more than happy to help point out his hypocrisy.
And yes , people should follow what I said above . You can’t go wrong by being too honest , too truthful , too respectful, too fair , and treating people with decency and dignity, can you, Scott ? And if there is a “god” like yaweh ( which there’s not ) and at the pearly gates after I die he turns me away just because I did not believe in him instead of how I led my life , then that god would not have my respect nor be worthy of worship. You can have him for eternity . I’m better than that . Sorry , Scott but I can only judge by what is written in your Bible by a supposedly omnipotent Omniscient and omnibenenvolent “god”. And he doesn’t pass the test.
1) you seem to be indoctrinated
2) The threat of eternal hellfire is pointless to those who don’t believe in the Bible narrative … so 🤷🏼♂️ To a nonbeliever it’s like an adult being threatened with getting a sack of coal for Christmas if you’re on the naughty list . Altho, to you it probably makes you feel mighty and haughty . but has zero effect whatsoever
3) I don’t believe in hell or demons or devils or unicorns or leprechauns . Btw, the Bible mentions unicorn 8 times
4) I don’t live I fear not hatred nor hopelessness. Are you projecting? Is that what you think you’d feel like if you didn’t believe ? Bc I don’t
5) where’s the free choice with a 5 yr old child stricken with childhood cancer thru no fault of their own ? A child born , they no fault of their own, in a country where starvation runs rampant ? Freak accidents like being the 5 yo innocent little girl instantly killed by , of all things, a 200lb sturgeon that just happened to jump out of the water and in its path colliding with the little girls head and killing her (happened in north Florida on the Suwannee river )? Where’s the free choice with natural disasters like mudslides, earthquakes , tornadoes , hurricanes, tsunamis etc killing innocent people thru no fault of their own ? Or how about poor innocent animals caught in forest fires being burned alive bc of a lightening strike ?
6) if your version of the concept of a loving God is so insecure and jealous that you don’t believe in him and sends you to hell despite how well you conduct yourself in this life , then he is not worthy of respect nor worship . Again, what comes first , god or morality ?
7) you believe in a talking snake , a talking donkey and talking burning bush. You believe in a guy living in a whales body for 3 days . You believe in canes that turn into snakes and parting the sea by raising a cane. You believe in thousands of animals , reptiles , birds and insects being loaded onto a wooden boat . You believe in a god that flooded the earth , killing innocent children , infants and fetuses . You believe in people raising from their graves and walking into the city greeting people and the list goes on. And btw , according to the Muslim tradition, Mohammed split the moon in half and flew to heaven on a winged horse . Do you believe that too? After all , that claim is no less fantastical than those fantastical bibles stories. And if you don’t believe that Muslim claim, what criteria do you use to determine if it’s just a fantastical story or if it’s real ? 🤷🏼♂️. You believe all these Bible things. I do not.
8) I believe in the concept of God. That is to say an ideal . A virtuous ideal to strive to live up to . To strive to live an impeccable , virtuous life and to lead it with love and kindness . I do not believe nor would I ever want to believe in some jealous, wrathful deity that commands genocide , infanticide , permits slavery etc . How awful . You live in fear . It’s sad
Anyway as long as you are a good and decent person , believe in whatever you want . Be good for the sake of being good
@@bitofwizdomb7266 There is a place for people who do not want to have a relationship with God, their Creator, but it is not as fun as you think. The Bible says every good and perfect gift comes from God, if you remove those gifts, what are you left with. Fear, hatred, hopelessness. Not a fun place. But we are loved by God, and He has created us with free choice. So, love does not force someone to believe, he must come on His own free will. God loves you enough to respect your will to choose. If you choose not to live with God, there is a place for that. We all worship that which we deam most worthy. If we choose to worship something other than God, then see where that false god will take you. Think of the choice of the two thieves on crosses next to Jesus. One made a good choice, the other chose to mock Him, and went to destruction. Sin leads to destruction, and death. And I still claim that you have limited knowledge.
@@scottm4042 sounds like ugh are projecting . I don’t love in a place of fear nor hatred nor hopelessness . Is that what you’d feel like if you didn’t believe in yaweh ? Bc I sure don’t . As for the “not a fun place” , that’s of no threat to me bc I don’t believe in it . I dont believe in demons, devils , unicorns (btw, the Bible mentions unicorns 8 times), leprechauns etc . Furthermore, I don’t believe in talking snakes and donkeys and burning bushes , nor do I believe in a guy living in the belly of a whale for 3 days or people raising from their graves and walking they the city greeting people. But you do . And btw way , if you believe in such fantastical stuff , do you consider the Muslims claim that Muhammad split the moon in half and flew to heaven on a winged horse ? And if not, what criteria do you apply to determine if it’s true or not ? Sounds just as fantastical to me .
It’s obvious that you are indoctrinated. Again, I do not believe in a god that would command genocide and infanticide and sanction slavery (and beating them as needed), or one that wiped out people with a flood, including children , infants , fetuses . But you do . And you defend it tooth and claw . Sad . As I said earlier , I believe in the concept of God, not the Abrahamic versions of the concept of God. They are made up imo. What I mean by concept is an ideal. An ideal to strive to live up to . This is why I said “strive to live an impeccable virtuous life and lead it with love and kindness “. And you can do so without a belief in a personal god like yaweh . Buddhists and Jains are amongst the most compassionate, loving, peaceful people who revere life so much so that many walk on cheese cloth so as not to harm insects . Yet neither believe in a deity . People can be and ate good without a belief in god . As long as you’re a good honest truthful respectful fair and decent person , then I don’t care what you believe in.
I don’t need the threat of hellfire and /or the prize of “paradise” to be a good person and conduct a good life . But some people do. Again , I ask you , what comes first , god (yaweh in your case) or morality ? If you were to leave your faith tomorrow , would you go out killing and raping and stealing and harming and lying and manipulating and pillage etc ?
@@scottm4042
1) you seem to be indoctrinated
2) The threat of eternal hellfire is pointless to those who don’t believe in the Bible narrative … so 🤷🏼♂️ To a nonbeliever it’s like an adult being threatened with getting a sack of coal for Christmas if you’re on the naughty list . Altho, to you it probably makes you feel mighty and haughty . but has zero effect whatsoever
3) I don’t believe in hell or demons or devils or unicorns or leprechauns . Btw, the Bible mentions unicorn 8 times
4) I don’t live I fear not hatred nor hopelessness. Are you projecting? Is that what you think you’d feel like if you didn’t believe ? Bc I don’t
5) where’s the free choice with a 5 yr old child stricken with childhood cancer thru no fault of their own ? A child born , they no fault of their own, in a country where starvation runs rampant ? Freak accidents like being the 5 yo innocent little girl instantly killed by , of all things, a 200lb sturgeon that just happened to jump out of the water and in its path colliding with the little girls head and killing her (happened in north Florida on the Suwannee river )? Where’s the free choice with natural disasters like mudslides, earthquakes , tornadoes , hurricanes, tsunamis etc killing innocent people thru no fault of their own ? Or how about poor innocent animals caught in forest fires being burned alive bc of a lightening strike ?
6) if your version of the concept of a loving God is so insecure and jealous that you don’t believe in him and sends you to hell despite how well you conduct yourself in this life , then he is not worthy of respect nor worship . Again, what comes first , god or morality ?
7) you believe in a talking snake , a talking donkey and talking burning bush. You believe in a guy living in a whales body for 3 days . You believe in canes that turn into snakes and parting the sea by raising a cane. You believe in thousands of animals , reptiles , birds and insects being loaded onto a wooden boat . You believe in a god that flooded the earth , killing innocent children , infants and fetuses . You believe in people raising from their graves and walking into the city greeting people and the list goes on. And btw , according to the Muslim tradition, Mohammed split the moon in half and flew to heaven on a winged horse . Do you believe that too? After all , that claim is no less fantastical than those fantastical bibles stories. And if you don’t believe that Muslim claim, what criteria do you use to determine if it’s just a fantastical story or if it’s real ? 🤷🏼♂️. You believe all these Bible things. I do not.
8) I believe in the concept of God. That is to say an ideal . A virtuous ideal to strive to live up to . To strive to live an impeccable , virtuous life and to lead it with love and kindness . I do not believe nor would I ever want to believe in some jealous, wrathful deity that commands genocide , infanticide , permits slavery etc . How awful . You live in fear . It’s sad
Anyway as long as you are a good and decent person , believe in whatever you want . Be good for the sake of being good
Dr frank, as I'm sure you've heard many times before, though atheist don't believe in an objective morality handed down from on high, as soon as we agree on a goal, objective moral statements can be made. we simply choose to set as our goal the maximizing of human flourishing and the minimization of human misery. Now that we have a goal set, we can say things like the Holocaust was bad, as it clearly does not work towards maximizing human flourishing and caused a great deal of human suffering. Well, you might say, your decision to agree on the goal of human flourishing is totally arbitrary and therefore unjustified. This couldn't be further from the truth. I am a human being. I or any one of my progeny May unexpectedly find themselves at any place in society. If I want to maximize the chances that I flourish, and minimize the chances that I suffer, without knowing for certain where I will be in society, then the goal to maximize human flourishing in general is obvious and totally not arbitrary. It is a self-serving goal, and therefore needs no further justification