UPDATE: there's apparently a notion that suiren's art is ai? which it most definitely is not! suiren has posted videos as well of their art process to prove it isnt AI, which you can see here: x.com/xastherielle/status/1831058023093301725
@@LukenYo an app, and twitter is now called X bc it got bought from someone else but everyone is still gonna call it twitter especially gen z and gen x
Why do people feel so entitled to tell artists how to price their work. If you can't afford it? It's a luxury, you don't need it and the artist knows their worth. If you think it's too cheap? Why do you care, it's the artists choice and it doesn't effect you.
I see both sides to this argument and I had to beg for an artist friend of mine to up commissions because they where drowning in so much work that they didn't have much if any personal time for themself and they also complained about not having enough money so they had to take more comms . They finally agreed to it and asked if a 10% increase was enough we went back and forth and finally settled on a 25% increase just so they can have more self care time.
@@brandonhowell5096 I definitely get it when it's a situation like this, where it's a friend suggesting it for various reasons and the artist does have the following to up the prices and still get frequent enough comms. It's just when random people do it without considering why the artist chose that price to begin with, that's what bugs me lol.
@@brandonhowell5096 Heres the issue, many economies are shit, so artists raise prices but people have also less to spend so art is less affordable You simply cannot tell artist just to raise prices You could of told your friend to raise their price and they could end up receiving not enough commissions to make up for the loss of customers that came with a price increase
I think for beginners they definitely often need someone to tell them that they can up their prices but definitely never tell someone it's too expensive. If it's really too expensive they won't get customers and will lower their prices but if they still get customers it's for a reason and the reason is that other people think their prices are fair.
Another thing I do as an artist: People that commissioned me 3 times get a client card that tracks their comms. If they commission 5 more, they get discounts :)
I was honestly expecting them to cost like $200 with how expensive art related/hand made things are. I didn't know much about logos but honestly it is good for people
Logos are the most expensive thing in graphic design. I feel like the anime aesthetics industry is very much a bubble, even 200 would be very low on the standard market. 2000 bucks actually would be more of a standard price and since with logo design you also buy the rights to it, likely even more expensive.
i'm working with Suiren since more than 1 year for custom overlays, panels, logo, etc. and even work with her with the suprise me icon logo, she's the most sweet, hardworker & human artist i've ever worked with. She's absolute amazing. It mades me so sad that she the drama happens and got accused of bad things cause she decided to make surprise-me affordable icon for people and train herself on those. I'm happy at the end that it helps her getting recognized as a good artist and that she did rise the price for those logo for her own goods cause she deserves the best.
yes!! i hate how the internet just cant see the good in some things :/ like why did they spin suiren trying to make affordable logos into such a negative 😭
This especially! I got into an argument regarding the Spotify price going higher. The commentor reasoned that highschooler could afford it, why bother lowering it. I argued that there's people out there living outside of America, and they responded "That's a YOU problem, not U.S." Like okay damn- For context: I don't pay premium in Spotify, but extremely bothered that they're putting what was once free behind a paywall.
I keep my prices very low compared to my current skill level because: 1. Charging more for my art stresses me out and makes me want to work on it less because of expectation. 2. I am, and was, a person who couldn't afford good quality art of my comfort characters when I could have really used the emotional boost. Also, yes, art is a luxury not a necessity. However, happiness is a necessity. Plus, I learned a lot of skills for free from people online. I want to give back too! 3. People who flock to low budget artists aren't the ones who are going to pay for the high budget artists anyways. The same way that "more profit is good for business" you also have "target demographics." Someone that shops for good quality clothes at Target isn't going to go to Anthropology and drop $150 for a dress. Same thing here. People looking for cheaper artists aren't going to be commissioning the more expensive artists. People just need to mind their own business 🤷🏽♀️ I've seen artists that sell their work for $500+ with wait lists that are years long. I promise they'll be fine.
@@maggie3060 exactly! I've always been a "cheap but good" artist customer until this summer when I finally splurged and got two $100+ commissions. While I would love to drop $500 on a beautiful piece of my characters, it's not something I'm willing to spend unless it's a special occasion. Same thing goes for customers like you who would rather save up/drop a bunch of money on specific artists regardless of high prices. Both approaches are ok 🥰 Like of I want to be a charitable/hobby artist I shouldn't have for-profit/industry artists in my DMs demanding I raise prices. That's like going to Walmart and demand they charge $100 for a shirt so that Aeropsotale can sell the same quality polyester shirt for $200 🤧
Don't raise prices just because someone tells you to... don't lower your prices just because someone tell you to. As an artist, I charge what I think my art is worth at the moment. Am I undercutting someone? Absolutely. Is it my problem? Absolutely not. It's a competitive market, and someone not being able to compete is not your issue. As long as YOU can pull it off and live off of it, it's all good. You do you.
10:13 in my country the hourly rate is $1.3 an hour. Moral of the story is that forcing 1 artist to raise prices is not gonna do anything, because other countries don't have such high hourly rates, and these people are ALSO on the market.
A lot of south east asian artists charge very low prices and it seems like they "hurt the market" but in reality they can do that since the cost of living is lower so they dont need 50-60$ from everything ,but i understand why some would think its harmful.
The cynical part of my mind hears this and says “sounds like someone is trying to undermine their competition” but I do think with their skill level, they should charge a bit more even if it is a newer service
Yeah , there's always been this weird subsection of artists who think that other artists lower prices , hurts them. Though this is somewhat true technically , The artists who demand other artists change their prices are often hyper competitive and will never share another artists work. And the way I see it , if you cant be selfless enough to elevate other artists around you - you shouldn't be dictating other people prices. Like being an artist doesn't automatically enroll you in the Graphic Artists Guild (GAG) or some collective, its a free market .
I've worked with her before for a side Vtuber project, I gave her the model png, colour codes/palette and a description of the character's personality and would like to see in the logo. She sent back a perfect icon AND gave me 5 different outline variants too. I am sad that people started drama over this, but I agree that she should raise her prices!! She works so so hard and deserves the extra money.
I wonder how twitter reacts to someone not from usa setting "low" prices. You can work for an english speaking part of the internet but live somewhere, where 30-50 bucks is well A LOT. I live in a country where 15 dollars is a big amount of money. I don`t talk about this exact artist, but why did twitter decided that everyone who sells in usd is american. I don`t care about the market as an artist, i care about getting as much commisions and as much money as i can. Sometimes it is easier to draw a few low priced pics. Thats rude to come into someones dm and say "hello you ruin my work please ruin yours", imagine mcdonalds making they prices lower and kfc coming and saying hey umm actually you cant do that!!!
Spmeone told me a few days ago that they pay max 2$ to their friend that would do similar art to mine. My Prices are ranging from 15$-60$. They also called me a beginner artist....Itbwas in an open forum when discussing how an artwork that was merely scribbles of crayons had sold for thousands of dollars and I had simply said ' Man I wish I could get a highly priced comission or a sale like that....' You know, how you sometime air your wishfull thoughts....and that was the response I got from this random person....I decided not to engage with them and just simply block them.
That’s what’s happening with this artist in another comment lol. People are arguing with her and her husband and trying to say that because art is a luxury, people don’t NEED to have it cheap. Like, so is chocolate. Does that mean that all chocolate should be priced at the same price as expensive handmade chocolatier chocolate?
A lot of the people who go to artists and tell them to raise prices usually aren't looking to buy from that artist in the first place. If you have the funds and you think the artist you're commissioning deserves more money, then provide them a tip to make up for the funds you think they deserve and that could potentially make the artist raise their prices more naturally, but if they like their own prices where they're at, it's their choice. Some artists, unfortunately no matter what they price their art at, will sometimes never get commissions despite the talent and the work they put in, but the second they have a low price, this happens without fail and it's kind of interesting how people feel entitled in telling artists how to price themselves and blame them for "market value" when we have literal AI users that are attempting to saturate the same marketplace with low prices and lower quality "art"
See kat explains it very well. So the answer to your question would be: a lot of people care, especially other artists. You can`t force indiviuals but it still is a market issue that affects many.
as a graphic design student who pays over 10k a semester: the second i saw those prices i thought they were a STEAL!!! I would've bought their surprise me commission and tipped 185 because I would have not accept less than 200. More if its a step by step commission, but cus its a sort of skeb-like commission and you get what you get, i'd totes pay 200. You are paying for time, skill, and experience, art is a luxury! The only gripe I have about vtuber logos is sometimes their logos aren't vectors(but thats not too important unless you plan to blow up the logo to massive scales or really tiny and not want it to be fuzzy) ALSO Important!!! Vtuber logos are commercial and artists should also consider that when pricing.
@@HereComesCats literally why I went to Canada! cus why am I paying more to go out of state when I can move in with my fiancé in Canada and have cheaper tuition T^T I think if I was a permanent resident the tuition would be 4k cad a semester instead of 10k cad
I’m so tired of other artist’s attacking artists just cause of jealousy that they are getting business. Like focus on your work and what you’re making, sabotaging another artist’s rep and work just to gain attraction is so so low.
that whole convo thing. i had a friend message me on tumblr to tell me to tag something, since people had a trigger to it. (It was a skeleton with pink roses around it. It looked very aesthetically pleasing to me. Said friend didn't have the trigger, but I assumed someone who was my followers was, and contacted my friend over it. And in turn tell me about it) So I replied and said, "Sorry I didn't know. I will tag it right now for any followers with said trigger." for everyone to see, due to replying shows up on post, then in mail boxes at the time. Not only that, but a lot of people did that, cause no one had anything to hide, and my friend just responded with a message yelling at me for showing that off, and to delete the message. LIKE? Bro? What? I still do not get it to this day why they where so angry over it, and we are not friends anymore, but that's a wild as heck story that is not the main point. Just glad they are out of my life, cause people like that are wild.
Came to say that my logo is shown in the video and Suiren is an amazing artist. I've commissioned them twice and it was lovely working with them both times. They are seriously one of the sweetest people on this earth!!
Yeah, that really rubbed me the wrong way. The DM telling her she is harming the market, that is. She can charge what she wants. She is a really talented artist and every single artist should sell their OWN damn art for whatever the F they want. The fact that she made affordable options for people that literally CANNOT afford anything more whether the economy is booming or in a recession is a really kind and amazing thing. It's not harming the market. Because artists and people who love and collect art understand that the value of art is subjective, just like art itself. Something super dumb and ugly to me is worth millions to someone else. And vice versa. And let's not forget that she had OPTIONS!!! She isn't selling all her logos for $15! She has OPTIONS for people who can't afford more! I'm ranting. I'm sorry, but I can't stand it when people pull that shit.
Wasn't the whole idea that people who makes art can choose what they wanted to price their art. since its their art. Like how people will sell a tiny canvas with two abstract circles for 100's it was their choice. Its up to the consumer to choose if they want to by it or not. SINCE ART IS AN LUXARY. Like people be getting mad that art is expensive but than when its cheaper people complain theres no winning 😭
The only argument I'd make here is that you gotta remember - worth =/= how much someone will pay. It's pretty common knowledge in the collector market, but a figure being worth $5k does not necessarily mean people will go and pay $5k for it. The same applies here - it's why interests checks are also a super good idea, asking your followers if they'd be interested in hiring you for art & what their budgets are helps to drum up interest and shows the price range you're working with. "In this economy" goes both ways, so dynamic pricing is important. I don't agree with your takes on art most of the time, but your takes on social media and business are very good.
I’m just sat here like "Imma charge what price I want to, and if you think my lil ol' self affects you badly. It’s a you problem bud. More business for me." > w
Agri Stats is a company that is currently getting sued for trying to fix and increase rates of many of the foods like chicken, and were able to start price gouging because everyone kept the same price. Diversity in prices is important for a non monopoly economy
Watching this video now has me scared that other artists might be trying to cancel me behind the scenes because my prices are low as well and I'm constantly shadow banned when ever I advertise. They're not as low as Surien's as far as Logos go, but they're still lower than everyone else's and I can't get any commissions going except from one dedicated client every other month. I'm not even a beginner artist as I've been drawing digitally for over a decade now and while my style isn't as high quality as some popular VTuber model artists out there, it's still really good and almost professional grade I think. I literally don't know what else I could be doing to improve the situation and my mental is in the gutter because of the stress and panic. I always have to choose between buying food, underwear, or gifts for my friends/family every month because I only make so much. I've been wearing the same few mismatched pairs of socks for months and they are getting holes. I only eat one or two meals every day, and my family is massive and my boyfriend is across the border so I have to pay more to ship to another country. November and December are absolutely going to be a financial nightmare for me. This is just... What the fuck is wrong with people? Just let people charge what they want. If anything we need more competition in the art space because smaller creators need chances at good art just as much as the big fish do. At some of the rates these artists charge, it would take a affiliate streamer getting 15 ccv and two subs a month about 8 months just to get their $50 pay out to spend on a single emote! This is insane!
The thing with low prices is, that it attracts a different kind of people. It also often has the effect that it will be regarded as lower than it is, it will be met with less respect. from what you write, you should just up your prices and try a different demographic. It could be an experiment. As someone who has pretty high prices, i can tell you that it feels good to be hired by people who make you feel appreciated. The worst experiences that i had were when i was cheaper.
As an artist who does comms, I definitely think people are like: but you spend a day on art? Why so low? For me, it's because I'm only doing art for fun. The money is a bonus because my friends are like: I feel bad getting art without you getting paid. When honestly, I do it because seeing people happy about my art makes me happy. So I charge about 20 cad (around 15 usd), so my friends won't be anxious about me not getting something in return. I draw for fun and free most of the time.
I appreciate the business class in this video. I currently only charge 15 usd for fully rendered ship art and ik it's low but idk how to market my commissions properly and need the money bad. Maybe that would be a good video idea for all us baby artists
7:33 i feel torn! lower comm prices are good for a worldwide audience (especially if your audience is more non-american), but i always feel like artists should take advantage of and charge "western prices" bc art is a luxury and having that extra profit in a place where the average wage is lower can be so helpful. I've had experiences with clients that say they could get it better + cheaper elsewhere when i'm already charging casual hobby prices, so i sympathize with the DM too. I believe the DM had their heart in the right place but the proper grammar/punctuation gave it a colder tone than intended. i dont think anyone auto-deserves to have a conversation publicized just for having it in written form. It wasn't a public tweet and really couldve just been ignored after the 2nd message, or after adding that their market includes clients with low-income or in places where the exchange rate is especially cruel. I think there were other ways to address this.
You people don’t understand that 15$ is already a lot, especially for people who are working at minimum wage. My wife, Suiren, wants to give a chance to people who can’t afford a high price tag for their logos and also the fact that 15 USD in our country is also already a lot. (For instance, you can buy 4 Big Macs for 15 USD with our currency.)
@@kimdaehyuniee LMAO yeah no that argument doesn't work here. I'm an artist and a buyer, I'm on both sides and have seen a lot. Art isn't something you need in order to survive. That's wonderful that YOUR wife does that. Guess what, not everyone is your wife. If you literally have to decide between buying FOOD and art you literally don't need, then you might have some issues that need to be checked out.
Yall need to pick a hill to die on. 😂 As a community(for the most part), we agree that artists have the right to choose their prices. This goes BOTH ways. If you feel her prices are too low, that's fine. But saying she's "hurting the market" and she should change her prices feels weird to me.
I am an artist, a bit of an oldie now compared to most. For myself per commission, ex) full body - full render + back ground, will be up around 200+ dollary doos USD. For most people, yes that is a massive amount of money but I won't go around and shame other artists for charging less. I often when commissioning others will do my best to tip a decent amount. If I think someone is undercharging, I'll tip them often much more or even the price of the commission it's self. I think this artist's work is very lovely, and she should charge a bit more when she feels confident about it. For me, a piece depending on what it is can take over well over 10 hours, even longer depending on the complexity. It's the time investment which is often the killer for most artists, I used to take very cheap portrait commissions, about 15-20 dollars each while I was in college that became oddly popular and I'd often find myself drowning in the time put in vs what I was getting in return.
They are amazing but it's sad that they raise their prices, as person from 2nd world country I earn like 700$ a month. If I were to get into vtubing (as I'm considering) having such affordable option would be great
it's actually better that they raise their prices for the reason that other artists who aren't as good can also earn money. vtubing is not a life or death situation, it's a luxury. if you can't afford good looking logos, just do the free option and learn how to draw yourself. ms paint is a free program on windows. artists under pricing is unfair to themselves and every other artists. if artists keep doing this to themselves, you're going to be getting great art for like dirt cheap and people demanding for those kinds of prices to stay at such a low rate. it's awful how people don't actually appreciate the work others put in, and it's sad that people view themselves as such. i've actually messaged a vtuber model artist that their prices for models are so ridiculously cheap it feels like a crime and they really should raise their prices for their own benefit. they are so good at drawing, but their models are like half than the average cheaper end of model art. they said ty but they keep it cheap so people could have good looking models for cheap. i didn't pursue anything further as that's what they want, but it's honestly sad. like even if they wanted it to be affordable, why not just the cheaper end of prices, why did it have to be even lower than that? it would already be an amazing deal if it was priced at the average lower end. i didn't message them to make them feel bad and i don't gain anything from them raising their prices (i don't even do commissions). i messaged them because i just felt like they deserved more for their time and effort not saying people who aren't good should price at ridiculous rates, just price art reasonably.
I wonder if that person is really a pro graphic designer because $50 would also be way too low lol. Typically, a designer doesn't just do a logo, they come up with all the branding stuff. It's these big gig type sites profiting off artists that are harmful imo, not individuals like this. This artist can only serve so many people.
This happened to my friend, but my friend sells crochet plushies. She once was selling bunny plushies at 7 usd, and another woman (who also sold crochet plushies and had the same bunny pattern (the pattern was from Etsy)) started to attack her because she was selling the bunny plushie at 30 usd, and people didn’t want to buy it from her because of the price. In my opinion, I’m an artist as well, your art and work shouldn’t just be price high because you want money, that’s not morally correct or ethical. If you just spent 5 minutes doing a logo, then price accordingly, if not, then don’t go crying and attacking competitors for a problem that is clearly yours. We live in a society where, things that where usually common from our day to day life, are now luxuries, not everyone can pull $100 dollars from their wallet. Also, I think that this also lies as a internet problem, where artists were putting out “bad art” to a really high price so all the “good art” had to be higher.
Well its not exactly fair if an artist who just sells stuff for fun charges so low that the artists who do it as their livelihood can't make money anymore. Crochet takes time and labor to make and unless your friend is cranking the bunnies out in 15-20 minutes and including the price of the yarn, etc, they're making well below minimum wage. Hobbiests can sell their work but if its not your livelihood then please consider the artists who DO live off their work. I don't blame the other woman for being mad, sounds like your friend is intentionally screwing with the market because she likes giving away her work. Your mindset as an "artist" is incredibly toxic. So artists aren't allowed to make a living because you think it's morally and ethically wrong? Animators, graphic designers, seamstresses, editors....none of them deserve to make money for these things? Most art takes time and labor, if you don't take time making your art thats YOUR problem. Most of us work extremely hard.
@@mimilapin so are people now allowed to charge $100 for something that, 1) took them 20 minutes and 2) didn't take any materials? Cause I don't know if you knew, but not EVERYONE has the luxury of buying stuff, and when people who just like to capitalize of demand come and make a fuss about the situation, the other person is always in the wrong, even if they just want to give people who are less fortunate the chance of having cute stuff. I live in a place where the minimum wage is 7 dollars, just because in the US things go for a certain price, doesn't mean in all parts of the world is like that. Stop looking at this from a place of privilege and start understanding that not everyone can sell at that rate.
As a previous Vtuber customer that commissioned Suiren to do my logo, she did an absolute wonderful job with the quality of work that she provided and offered lots of variations to the logo i wanted. I was extremely suprised that she offered her services at $15, so i kept her info bookmarked for a month before deciding to go and talk with her if she can do my simple logo commission. It really helped people like me that are on a budget to get artwork and showcase it for our vtuber journey. Also its okay for Suiren to set a price for her services in which she is comfortable with, will love to see her thrive even more as an artist and showcase more artwork to everyone no matter what the price. Setting lots of love to her.❤
15:14 - if you have too many commissions (and you are overworking/overwhelmed), double price, youll prob lose half of the people, but youll have the same pay and you wont be worried about getting them done. ty i rly liked this part, this was very informative :DDDDDD 16:28 giveaways and urgencies
I also price my art way lower then it's "worth" bc I don't take comms often and also I think every one deserves to have the luxury of custom art. You don't need it to live but it's something that makes life better/more fun. My prices are super low but honestly they can go as low as 5$. It won't be a full render, or even just lines. But it's still art.
It's their art so it's their choice of price. I hate this "you hurt the market" bs because how are you supposed to charge the right prices if everyone has different opinions on what your art is worth and how good you are at art.
I feel like just thinking about prices in terms of minimum wage is a bit too simple. Sure, this would happen in a perfect world, but the truth is that commissions are competitive. The minimum wage point only starts when you have a large enough following, everyone else usually needs to undercut to draw any attention.
Probably a side note, but I have to bring it up. Feedback on prices being too low has been a staple in the art world for forever, right? It's nice to let someone know "hey, you could definitely charge more!" The art world is full of competition and that makes 99% of us undervalue our work, especially because we can only see what our art looks like to us - full of mistakes, repetitive, etc - and not what it looks like to those who love it so much they want to buy it... so, point being: what the hell is happening online nowadays that everything has to be guilt tripping and making people feel bad? We've survived for decades on "Hey, you're worth more! :)" so we HAVE scripts for discussions like this that are, you know, normal. We have a million and one ways to let someone know theyre under pricing without making them feel like shit to the point they have to publicly apologise for whats ultimately a tiny matter. It's so gross nowadays that we can't even do something like naturally undersell ourselves without strangers coming at us about how we're harming everyone around us and being selfish and so on. I swear people learned fear is a weapon that makes others listen to you and selfishly haven't put it down since.
I feel like the time x minimum wage, isn’t really reliable, some people can make amazing work but faster than others may be able to, that doesn’t mean they’re gonna constantly get commissions so they may end up underpricing themselves and you can ABSOLUTELY steal customers, thats literally how competitive marketing works. You are also not guaranteed to even maintain half of your current flow.
A business class of mine told me to set my worth and stand behind it if I believe in myself and the product. Too low prices will mean your clientell will be people who are looking to buy things as cheap as possible and it will sometimes reflect as your whole base going missing when you're eventually forced set the prices higher to be able to make a living. This is very situational in the artist + hobbyist world, but in business you have to know your worth, advertise yourself and keep paying customers(not swindlers) happy. I've learned every job will have at least one person(let's be real theres way more) begging for free or cheaper stuff. The logos are so beautiful. I'm so out of the loop with pricing so I thought 15USD is decent for logos. But from another point of view it does seem low too, kind of depends on how fast they're made I guess? Time to finish listening to the video.
I was going to ask how to price youself fairly if you never had a commission before and have a brand new account and...you answered! Instantly subscribed, lovely content
I can understand in a guild situation how 'undercutting' others could be kind of scabby, but this just.. isn't that situation. I also understand and commend the desire to be affordable... But also as a commissioner when someone's prices are suspiciously low...it turns me away because I assume that they're either using AI, that they're inexperienced and may not be responsible or take the work seriously, or that under pricing may lead to stress which could lead to unfinished work and a bad and/or unhealthy situation for the artist. I don't want to be taking advantage of someone :/
This reminds me of when I was asked to draw designs for friends/family who wanted them tattooed, when I told some artist friends I was gonna charge like £15 or £25 at most they were losing their minds. Some of the pieces were extremely huge and hours to days of work 💀💀 I'm grateful to them for looking out for me but god asking people for anything more than £25 was mortifying! I did end up charging more and thankfully friends/family were more than happy to pay more for the work ❤️
In this case we already know the artist was doing a super sale and there's no problem about it, especially if they were testing the skill with this kind of piece and needed quick feedback/clients. But except for this situation, I believe Art should be priced following the artist situation: 1: How much time you need to make a piece and how difficult is for you. (if you want to do a lot of them in short time etc) 2: The level of your art skills (based on your preferences) 3 and super important: Demand and Offer situation in your job. I have medium/low prices because my brain can't focus a lot and my art skills are simple in terms of shading, plus I have very low demand so I need to be cheap and get more clients (example: I have a ych headshot portrait for 15$ because it's a special kind of piece and I got like 3 requests in 5 months or such) Market value anyway is not the same everywhere in the world. Which kind of market were they talking about, currency have different value depending on where you are from. (plus, have they ever checked Skeb???)
Im an artist and have commissioned that artist so many times and theyre legitimatly so sweet and genuinely talented. They dont deserve a finger pointed at them like that imo
Don't forget as clients we have a lot of power to encourage artists to value their time more and make them feel more confident in their work! If you can, always tip the artists you commission. That way you're not pressuring the artist but are still supporting their work monetarily. When artists charge for art a lot of times they don't take into account for the time they take to promote themselves, the time they take to talk to you, go over references, deliver files, etc. If you want artists to value themselves first, show it by valuing them and their time!
tbh i felt the same way when i saw the message that the artist sent to reach out to them.. it came across like they were jealous and saw them as competition or something
A lot of artist are outside of US, and for us to get customers even look at us it's the only way - to make low prices, because outside of US there no even chance to get high payment for digital art.
i had a few people tell me my art isnt worth 15/ 20/10$ but others say it is im not a good artist but people telling me this made me upset like sometimes it takes a few days or a week
art is one of those things that can never have a 100% exact universal price standard. i think that artists can price their stuff however they want, cheap or expensive! the thing about "damaging the market" is that the effect isn't quite as horrible as some people might think, at least in my opinion. with these online commissions, theres an OVERWHELMING chance that you'll find a unique art style and ability/boundary for each individual you see, and because art is literally all about these details, they are all in a way offering different products rather than selling the same thing and competing. if anything, the competition is for popularity rather than for customers specifically, and that has very little to do with commission prices. if a buyer likes your art enough, they will be willing to pay for it even if it's more expensive than someone else's. this other person pricing their own commissions cheaper isn't going to steal a ton of customers from you just like that. also, buyers who do just go for the cheap choices would probably not have bought your more expensive work even if the other person priced their work the exact same or more expensive. those who decide they can't or simply don't want to fork over a certain amount of money for your art won't suddenly decide they can/want to pay more just because everyone costs more. they'll just decide not to buy art at all, because those people (no hate to them i understand the situation) simply don't want to spend more than a certain amount on this luxury product.
one time i commissioned an artist and they didn't tell me it was a 'surprise me' also the end result was garbage and when i tried asking for changes they said no.
I saw stuff like this on Pinterest recently but the other way around, someone was selling plain colored + little detail (blush on the knees and basic shading and stuff) unrigged bases for 50 bucks, everyone was saying that was too much and they were just going to screenshot it, and no one thought that was wrong to say. I ended up leaving a comment about how rude it was to imply someone’s time and talent on art wasn’t worth 50 dollars. “50 for an unrigged base?” Yeah rigging takes time and would cost way more, 50 is reasonable for a blank unrigged base, someone even said “I can make this myself” do it then????😭😭
As a vtuber on a major budget due to a mix of factors, I will forever be grateful to the artists that raffled and/or gifted their work, even those I paid for in XIV gil. Why? Because, as much as I would love to toss hundreds of dollars on gorgeous art to make my time on this space rock beautiful, I would rather eat and have lights on. I've paid for work, plenty of it, but prices have gotten out of hand. Much like groceries and housing, Idgaf about the "market" but how much I can afford. Bless Suiren for thinking of people like that, because they could easily make triple that but wanted to look out for the small folks; worth isn't always about money but strength in morals, of which she is plentiful.
Check prices for the market then charge what you think YOU can handle. What I mean by this is. Labor costs and if applicable material costs should be factored into your price. You should also realize that if your price is too cheap then you might get overrun with requests. Eventually, you will hit a break limit. Either you will realize you can't do the work for that price/time or you can't pick up all the work that comes your way. Then the overflow will either have to go elsewhere or they won't be paying anyone anyway. It kind of solves itself for self employed artists/crafters. Obviously this doesn't apply to large companies but for small artists this doesn't seem like something someone else should need to call out. Don't underestimate your value but you don't need to follow others either. Price for yourself and your market.
Logo making is very time consuming charging $15 for the amount of work and time is crazy! Especially if all the logos are different it’s not one concept with different tweaks or format it’s different logos a hat a teddy bear infinity sign that’s a lot of work that’s crazy!
Minimum wage in my state is 16.35… I could never compete with their prices. :/ I would rather work at Home Depot and get full benefits + paid time off.
I had to change my rates for commissions because it was waaaaay below the going rate... I'm going to have to do it again because of Eh-Aye *and* the current going rate still being higher.
My biggest mistake of my life was to listen to "these" people saying I make my prices too low and it is below minimum wage and I should raise it higher. Since then I got from like 30 commissions a year to 1 or 0 . Even if you are good artist having full colored art for 15 dollars you will earn more than zero customers. Though with the first thing there are japanese pages that do it like this. some anonyme person sends commission request, you have 0 conversation. they drop a prompt what they want to have , that's it. and the rest is to artists interpretation and it will be delivered without refunds. means no conversations at all and I really love t his. Had so much trouble with clients in the past which I sent sketches and all and they were always fine. and then randomly when the piece is almost done they want a major change
I get both sides. As a consumer, $15 for a logo is a great and affordable price. As someone who learned and was licensed in graphic design, $15 for a logo (ESPECIALLY if it’s for commercial use) is WAY too low.
18:03 I love hearing your strategy tips! As a crochet artist, I want to sell my products, but I struggle on how to do my pricing and things like that. Thank you for your help! 😁💚
Imagine feeling so entitled that you’re harassing another artist for prices THEY chose to set for themselves… not everything is about you 😭 this is why we can’t have good things
the thing is, if a person can only afford the affordable, they will only do that. its not like she is "stealing" clients, she is simply giving an opportunity to those who can regularly afford it. I know artists that have low prices due to they want others to have the opportunity and get sufficient enough founding on patreon etc. and i appreciate those artist so much, id never be able to have some custom stuff before if not for them. and that makes me eternally grateful that being said, that's not standard, not everyone should or can do that and that's okey. but to try and guilt trip people to up their prices when they just did that to be kind ? idk that don't sit right with me. If they had simply been "damn ur art is just so good u definitely should up it" that would have been different. but man, don't dm people to make them feel bad for just wanting to be nice to their community.
I understand the "hurting the market". Sometimes it hurt people from other countries. In my country, some people wanted to hire you for below livable wages just because some are willing to be exploited. Of course, don't let people tell you what your prices should be.
People in the art community need to understand each artist prices things for their own reasons, I price my stuff cheaper cause I want people to be able to get art even if they cant afford a large price. I offer pricing to help out the people like myself who might only have $15 to spare on themselves. As Adults, you have bills, and other things to pay we dont always have the funds to buy everything to treat ourselves but still deserve to treat ourselves once in a while without going into the hole. Also....minimum wage is different in all places. In the USA, one state is 5.15, another is 8.00, and another is 15.00.... if we venture out of USA it is so large a range... people need to stop and think about things and see everywhere isnt same and everyone isnt the same.
The problem of her low prices literally came to fruition. After that post blew up she got 112 commission requests. It will take them forever to get all of them done and the 112th person will have to wait quite a while. If they just upped the price they would be doing themselves a favour. Its nice that they want it to be accessible but at the same time they are a business not a charity + not everyone is serious enough in their endeavours to need a logo.
My stance is, art might be a luxury - for clients. But as the artist, especially if you make a living from it, it really depends on where you live and on your living situation. For an artist who has kids, living in europe, i could NEVER EVER EVER ask for this little amount of money. Just think about it - for a logo like this, even if you are fast, it takes several hours of work, BUT also the communication with the client, social media content prep and service, invoicing. So the time alone that goes into this is probably around 6 hours minimum. Where I live minimum wage is nothing you could life off as a family so hourly rate must be at least 25+ USD. There we would be at 150 USD and then we would only have the pure time that went into it, not the skill, the experience and not the rights that you sell typically with a logo. With that on top you can easily triple the amount, and still then we would be at apprentice pricing. If I charged 15 bucks, I would have an hourly rate of 2,50 USD. If I work my ass of, on top of that being limited in when I work because I have a toddler, I could earn 350 USD a month. I feel like, even for a cheaper area in the world that is not enough. That doesn`t even remotely cover food OR daycare, not to mention rent. I am under the impression that charging that low also is some kind of privilge, because then you aren’t financially dependent on it. Not even if you double the price. My colleagues charge easily several thousands for a logo. Logo design is the most expensive craft within the graphic design world. I am more expensive and with my prices I reach a different target audience than someone with cheaper prices. I don`t feel threatened by artists with lower prices though. I just couldn`t feed my kids going this low. But i also think, there`s enough for everybody. I have my own opinion on how artists ideally should price their art but I would never tell another artist what to do like this.
(not necessarily what is happening here but) selling something small and cheap is a long term strategy... Stores call it the "basic white tshirt" This concept is you offer a small low cost item at almost no profit inorder to make your store more accessible. People come in. Buy the white-t to try your brand out. If they like it they will likely come in to buy more or start to recommend you to other. So the profit from the white-t is a delayed profit vs immediately. Or just need a quick cash flow for some bills so they do a sale/deal to get a income boom. (Without attaching too much personal story to it)
This is similar to when photographers do mini shoots. Where they just spend a whole day doing 30-60 min sessions with people at a reduced price. It's enough to cover expenses (maybe) but then when people need a bigger photoshoot they already know the photographer and are likely to pay for a more fuller priced shoot bc they know the quality first hand. Or they share the quick shoots on socials and someone they know books a full session.
I mean there are aspects where both suiren and the messager are in the wrong? depending on speculations. For suiren, it is great to provide cheap affordable art and she most definitely deserves more than just $15USD for the commissions. But also, she most definitely could've showed the dms and then mention in a seperate post of thread that she is specifically pricing below for the community and mention the market price cause since she has a lot of fans and followers, there are bound to be over thousands of aspiring artists or artists in the market that price lower due to this. With the commenter, they could be a fellow graphic design artist that views suiren as a competitor that attempted to manipulate suiren into making her prices market prices to ensure proper competition or for more potential commissioners but there is also the case that they have goodwill. They might have wanted a fellow artist to get paid what they deserve and didnt word it correctly or maybe they tell that to all artists that lower their prices significantly as a warning "your art is worth more and it is important to acknowledge that". I would also argue against the breach of privacy part since the commenters in her comment section were extremely rude to the messenger and said nasty things about them to bring suiren up which should not be acceptable nor supported. Suiren responding to those comments also allowed more of those comments to flow in that may deal mental health damages to the messenger which I know how it feels from random people online who know nothing. We know nothing about the intentions of both the people in the conflict so I dont see how its right to think of the best for one and think of the worst for the other.
people who arent artist also need to understand its ok to price your art a bit expensive. I have friends who think $15-$30 per emote is expensive and it always made me annoyed since emotes take time as much as normal art. Art is a privilege and being an artist myself I know I can't always get art since some artists can be expensive.
I feel like art has been getting ridiculously expensive and exclusive because it's mostly become comms for vtubers (technically for commercial use) these days. I'm saying this as an artist myself. I used to open sketches for $12 a pop on Deviantart or tumblr because I draw really fast and just wanted to get some pocket change for fun. I didn't want to do serious hardcore commissions and the higher you price your art the more people expect as well. In this world of comms, if I charged $15 for some doodles, I'd probably get messages like those Suiren has gotten. This isn't a comment on Suiren; I don't know them, but some artists draw/make graphics really fast and actually it might take Suiren just 15-20mins to whip a logo up if they have a very good workflow/foundation. Usually people who aren't strong in their foundation take a lot longer to produce a piece of artwork and hence they make a loss because they charge $15 but take 4hrs to make a logo. They feel like they're working less than minimum wage. You need to figure out a good price point for yourself and your skill level, and stop worrying about other people "spoiling the market" LOL
Gotta love people telling other people what to do and expecting them to do as one says lmao.. I used to undercharge even for a simple fact that I needed money SUPER damn FAST, ASAP, right now, and it's an easy way to do it. My friend used to undercharge for her insane art until she built an audience and then started to slowly raise and raise. She still does cheaper work for people that can't spend money on digital pixels, but still want to buy something as treat for themselves. While Surien's work def worth more, let them do whatever the fuck they wanna do. Not to mention that they or their client audience might be mainly from other countries where dollar is valued, so even a twenty bill is a lot. Holy--
UPDATE: there's apparently a notion that suiren's art is ai? which it most definitely is not! suiren has posted videos as well of their art process to prove it isnt AI, which you can see here: x.com/xastherielle/status/1831058023093301725
Ppr just got jealous
Don't let people in twitter tell you what you need to do, rule # 1
do do do do do do do do do do do do doooooooooo do do do do do da do da do daa do do do do do da da da da do do do
what twitter?
great rule 😂
@@LukenYo an app, and twitter is now called X bc it got bought from someone else but everyone is still gonna call it twitter especially gen z and gen x
Life wisdom
Why do people feel so entitled to tell artists how to price their work. If you can't afford it? It's a luxury, you don't need it and the artist knows their worth. If you think it's too cheap? Why do you care, it's the artists choice and it doesn't effect you.
I see both sides to this argument and I had to beg for an artist friend of mine to up commissions because they where drowning in so much work that they didn't have much if any personal time for themself and they also complained about not having enough money so they had to take more comms . They finally agreed to it and asked if a 10% increase was enough we went back and forth and finally settled on a 25% increase just so they can have more self care time.
@@brandonhowell5096 I definitely get it when it's a situation like this, where it's a friend suggesting it for various reasons and the artist does have the following to up the prices and still get frequent enough comms. It's just when random people do it without considering why the artist chose that price to begin with, that's what bugs me lol.
@@brandonhowell5096 Heres the issue, many economies are shit, so artists raise prices but people have also less to spend so art is less affordable
You simply cannot tell artist just to raise prices
You could of told your friend to raise their price and they could end up receiving not enough commissions to make up for the loss of customers that came with a price increase
I think for beginners they definitely often need someone to tell them that they can up their prices but definitely never tell someone it's too expensive.
If it's really too expensive they won't get customers and will lower their prices but if they still get customers it's for a reason and the reason is that other people think their prices are fair.
its affects peoples though???
Blaming the artist was so unnecessary, just tell her you love their work and should price it higher
Another thing I do as an artist: People that commissioned me 3 times get a client card that tracks their comms. If they commission 5 more, they get discounts :)
client card that tracks their comms? Could you explain what is this?
Is it per five commissions that they get a temporary discount? Or once they got five commissions, they permanently have the discount?
@@ihaventgrownaspine9994i think after 3 commissions they get the client card, and after 5 more commissions there is a discount
@@jayceenova9860 I translated it to english (since I am french): A fidelity card! every 5 comms has a 25 percent discount on it
@@ihaventgrownaspine9994 Every fifth comm is discounted! and on top of that, they get a free piece once in a while :)
I was honestly expecting them to cost like $200 with how expensive art related/hand made things are.
I didn't know much about logos but honestly it is good for people
no fr!! $15 is such a steal, especially for that quality!
Logos are the most expensive thing in graphic design. I feel like the anime aesthetics industry is very much a bubble, even 200 would be very low on the standard market. 2000 bucks actually would be more of a standard price and since with logo design you also buy the rights to it, likely even more expensive.
We getting drama for every category known to man😭🤣
Fr
REAL 😭
Twitter moment
logo drama is CRAZY ngl
I've no idea what's going on but I love listening to these drama videos like a podcast at work
Literally I listen while I’m cleaning 🤣
Same, but for drawing!
I do it while I study LOL
I watch these when I’m grinding on games 😅
REAL!!! I listen to these while doing homework or drawing. Nice background noise that isn't annoying or i have to constantly look at the screen for
i'm working with Suiren since more than 1 year for custom overlays, panels, logo, etc. and even work with her with the suprise me icon logo, she's the most sweet, hardworker & human artist i've ever worked with. She's absolute amazing.
It mades me so sad that she the drama happens and got accused of bad things cause she decided to make surprise-me affordable icon for people and train herself on those.
I'm happy at the end that it helps her getting recognized as a good artist and that she did rise the price for those logo for her own goods cause she deserves the best.
yes!! i hate how the internet just cant see the good in some things :/ like why did they spin suiren trying to make affordable logos into such a negative 😭
Some of you have to remember we aren't all American. Sometime our livable is not your livable and our work is gonna be cheaper.
And this is why I don’t hire outside of the USA. I would rather my money go back into my economy.
This especially! I got into an argument regarding the Spotify price going higher. The commentor reasoned that highschooler could afford it, why bother lowering it. I argued that there's people out there living outside of America, and they responded "That's a YOU problem, not U.S." Like okay damn-
For context: I don't pay premium in Spotify, but extremely bothered that they're putting what was once free behind a paywall.
And our livable is BARELY livable (however again, art is luxury, not a necessity.)
@@ericaallisonc good for you....
but where’s the common ground in regards to having prices made affordable to those internationally? (this is genuine question as a hobby artist)
The logos Suiren made are actually all so cute 🥹🌸
THEY AREEE the designs and color combos are ADORABLE and I love the logos sm, im so glad they're getting the support they deserve
I keep my prices very low compared to my current skill level because:
1. Charging more for my art stresses me out and makes me want to work on it less because of expectation.
2. I am, and was, a person who couldn't afford good quality art of my comfort characters when I could have really used the emotional boost. Also, yes, art is a luxury not a necessity. However, happiness is a necessity. Plus, I learned a lot of skills for free from people online. I want to give back too!
3. People who flock to low budget artists aren't the ones who are going to pay for the high budget artists anyways.
The same way that "more profit is good for business" you also have "target demographics." Someone that shops for good quality clothes at Target isn't going to go to Anthropology and drop $150 for a dress. Same thing here. People looking for cheaper artists aren't going to be commissioning the more expensive artists. People just need to mind their own business 🤷🏽♀️ I've seen artists that sell their work for $500+ with wait lists that are years long. I promise they'll be fine.
Yeah if i had 1000 bucks id probably go to artists i really admire for art first, not seek out the lowest prices.
@@maggie3060 exactly! I've always been a "cheap but good" artist customer until this summer when I finally splurged and got two $100+ commissions. While I would love to drop $500 on a beautiful piece of my characters, it's not something I'm willing to spend unless it's a special occasion. Same thing goes for customers like you who would rather save up/drop a bunch of money on specific artists regardless of high prices. Both approaches are ok 🥰
Like of I want to be a charitable/hobby artist I shouldn't have for-profit/industry artists in my DMs demanding I raise prices. That's like going to Walmart and demand they charge $100 for a shirt so that Aeropsotale can sell the same quality polyester shirt for $200 🤧
Don't raise prices just because someone tells you to... don't lower your prices just because someone tell you to. As an artist, I charge what I think my art is worth at the moment. Am I undercutting someone? Absolutely. Is it my problem? Absolutely not. It's a competitive market, and someone not being able to compete is not your issue.
As long as YOU can pull it off and live off of it, it's all good. You do you.
Exactly. If someone wants affordable commissions then they can do so.
10:13 in my country the hourly rate is $1.3 an hour. Moral of the story is that forcing 1 artist to raise prices is not gonna do anything, because other countries don't have such high hourly rates, and these people are ALSO on the market.
A lot of south east asian artists charge very low prices and it seems like they "hurt the market" but in reality they can do that since the cost of living is lower so they dont need 50-60$ from everything ,but i understand why some would think its harmful.
The cynical part of my mind hears this and says “sounds like someone is trying to undermine their competition” but I do think with their skill level, they should charge a bit more even if it is a newer service
They have more expensive comms that are more in line with standard pricing, but yeah they definitely deserve more "market rate" aside.
Yeah , there's always been this weird subsection of artists who think that other artists lower prices , hurts them.
Though this is somewhat true technically , The artists who demand other artists change their prices are often hyper competitive and will never share another artists work.
And the way I see it , if you cant be selfless enough to elevate other artists around you - you shouldn't be dictating other people prices.
Like being an artist doesn't automatically enroll you in the Graphic Artists Guild (GAG) or some collective, its a free market .
I've worked with her before for a side Vtuber project, I gave her the model png, colour codes/palette and a description of the character's personality and would like to see in the logo. She sent back a perfect icon AND gave me 5 different outline variants too. I am sad that people started drama over this, but I agree that she should raise her prices!! She works so so hard and deserves the extra money.
I wonder how twitter reacts to someone not from usa setting "low" prices. You can work for an english speaking part of the internet but live somewhere, where 30-50 bucks is well A LOT. I live in a country where 15 dollars is a big amount of money. I don`t talk about this exact artist, but why did twitter decided that everyone who sells in usd is american. I don`t care about the market as an artist, i care about getting as much commisions and as much money as i can. Sometimes it is easier to draw a few low priced pics. Thats rude to come into someones dm and say "hello you ruin my work please ruin yours", imagine mcdonalds making they prices lower and kfc coming and saying hey umm actually you cant do that!!!
I mean to be fair companies like mcdonalds and kfc do exactly that
Spmeone told me a few days ago that they pay max 2$ to their friend that would do similar art to mine. My Prices are ranging from 15$-60$. They also called me a beginner artist....Itbwas in an open forum when discussing how an artwork that was merely scribbles of crayons had sold for thousands of dollars and I had simply said ' Man I wish I could get a highly priced comission or a sale like that....' You know, how you sometime air your wishfull thoughts....and that was the response I got from this random person....I decided not to engage with them and just simply block them.
That’s what’s happening with this artist in another comment lol. People are arguing with her and her husband and trying to say that because art is a luxury, people don’t NEED to have it cheap.
Like, so is chocolate. Does that mean that all chocolate should be priced at the same price as expensive handmade chocolatier chocolate?
Art is still a luxury. You do NOT need it.
@@lil_doggo_of_doom again, so is chocolate, and there’s still $1 bars of candy.
Imagine getting upset at someone just trying to hook other people up
A lot of the people who go to artists and tell them to raise prices usually aren't looking to buy from that artist in the first place.
If you have the funds and you think the artist you're commissioning deserves more money, then provide them a tip to make up for the funds you think they deserve and that could potentially make the artist raise their prices more naturally, but if they like their own prices where they're at, it's their choice.
Some artists, unfortunately no matter what they price their art at, will sometimes never get commissions despite the talent and the work they put in, but the second they have a low price, this happens without fail and it's kind of interesting how people feel entitled in telling artists how to price themselves and blame them for "market value" when we have literal AI users that are attempting to saturate the same marketplace with low prices and lower quality "art"
see my thing is ITS HER ARTWORK who cares what she prices HER artwork
See kat explains it very well. So the answer to your question would be: a lot of people care, especially other artists. You can`t force indiviuals but it still is a market issue that affects many.
as a graphic design student who pays over 10k a semester: the second i saw those prices i thought they were a STEAL!!! I would've bought their surprise me commission and tipped 185 because I would have not accept less than 200. More if its a step by step commission, but cus its a sort of skeb-like commission and you get what you get, i'd totes pay 200. You are paying for time, skill, and experience, art is a luxury! The only gripe I have about vtuber logos is sometimes their logos aren't vectors(but thats not too important unless you plan to blow up the logo to massive scales or really tiny and not want it to be fuzzy)
ALSO Important!!! Vtuber logos are commercial and artists should also consider that when pricing.
...where does one only have 10K-ish per semester for college damn 😭
@@HereComesCats Canada, International student
@@semecchi damnnnn mine was 25k/semester with partial scholarship, states needs some of what Canada got 😭😭😭
@@HereComesCats literally why I went to Canada! cus why am I paying more to go out of state when I can move in with my fiancé in Canada and have cheaper tuition T^T I think if I was a permanent resident the tuition would be 4k cad a semester instead of 10k cad
@@semecchi that is so nice 😭😭 actually affordable for most 😭
Thats nowhere near 50 dollars specially because its an icon. 15-30 seems fair. if it was an extremely detailed icon ok 50 would be understable
You are spot on with your business commentary!!! Too many people undercharge and are overworked.
I’m so tired of other artist’s attacking artists just cause of jealousy that they are getting business. Like focus on your work and what you’re making, sabotaging another artist’s rep and work just to gain attraction is so so low.
that whole convo thing.
i had a friend message me on tumblr to tell me to tag something, since people had a trigger to it. (It was a skeleton with pink roses around it. It looked very aesthetically pleasing to me. Said friend didn't have the trigger, but I assumed someone who was my followers was, and contacted my friend over it. And in turn tell me about it) So I replied and said, "Sorry I didn't know. I will tag it right now for any followers with said trigger." for everyone to see, due to replying shows up on post, then in mail boxes at the time. Not only that, but a lot of people did that, cause no one had anything to hide, and my friend just responded with a message yelling at me for showing that off, and to delete the message. LIKE? Bro? What?
I still do not get it to this day why they where so angry over it, and we are not friends anymore, but that's a wild as heck story that is not the main point. Just glad they are out of my life, cause people like that are wild.
Came to say that my logo is shown in the video and Suiren is an amazing artist. I've commissioned them twice and it was lovely working with them both times. They are seriously one of the sweetest people on this earth!!
Yeah, that really rubbed me the wrong way. The DM telling her she is harming the market, that is. She can charge what she wants. She is a really talented artist and every single artist should sell their OWN damn art for whatever the F they want. The fact that she made affordable options for people that literally CANNOT afford anything more whether the economy is booming or in a recession is a really kind and amazing thing. It's not harming the market. Because artists and people who love and collect art understand that the value of art is subjective, just like art itself. Something super dumb and ugly to me is worth millions to someone else. And vice versa. And let's not forget that she had OPTIONS!!! She isn't selling all her logos for $15! She has OPTIONS for people who can't afford more! I'm ranting. I'm sorry, but I can't stand it when people pull that shit.
I LOVEEE YOUR STRATEGIZING, as an artist who wants to open up commissions in the future, your tips on these things are immensely appreciated!!
Wasn't the whole idea that people who makes art can choose what they wanted to price their art. since its their art. Like how people will sell a tiny canvas with two abstract circles for 100's it was their choice. Its up to the consumer to choose if they want to by it or not. SINCE ART IS AN LUXARY. Like people be getting mad that art is expensive but than when its cheaper people complain theres no winning 😭
The only argument I'd make here is that you gotta remember - worth =/= how much someone will pay. It's pretty common knowledge in the collector market, but a figure being worth $5k does not necessarily mean people will go and pay $5k for it. The same applies here - it's why interests checks are also a super good idea, asking your followers if they'd be interested in hiring you for art & what their budgets are helps to drum up interest and shows the price range you're working with. "In this economy" goes both ways, so dynamic pricing is important.
I don't agree with your takes on art most of the time, but your takes on social media and business are very good.
I’m just sat here like "Imma charge what price I want to, and if you think my lil ol' self affects you badly. It’s a you problem bud. More business for me." > w
Agri Stats is a company that is currently getting sued for trying to fix and increase rates of many of the foods like chicken, and were able to start price gouging because everyone kept the same price. Diversity in prices is important for a non monopoly economy
Watching this video now has me scared that other artists might be trying to cancel me behind the scenes because my prices are low as well and I'm constantly shadow banned when ever I advertise. They're not as low as Surien's as far as Logos go, but they're still lower than everyone else's and I can't get any commissions going except from one dedicated client every other month. I'm not even a beginner artist as I've been drawing digitally for over a decade now and while my style isn't as high quality as some popular VTuber model artists out there, it's still really good and almost professional grade I think.
I literally don't know what else I could be doing to improve the situation and my mental is in the gutter because of the stress and panic. I always have to choose between buying food, underwear, or gifts for my friends/family every month because I only make so much. I've been wearing the same few mismatched pairs of socks for months and they are getting holes. I only eat one or two meals every day, and my family is massive and my boyfriend is across the border so I have to pay more to ship to another country. November and December are absolutely going to be a financial nightmare for me.
This is just... What the fuck is wrong with people? Just let people charge what they want. If anything we need more competition in the art space because smaller creators need chances at good art just as much as the big fish do. At some of the rates these artists charge, it would take a affiliate streamer getting 15 ccv and two subs a month about 8 months just to get their $50 pay out to spend on a single emote! This is insane!
The thing with low prices is, that it attracts a different kind of people. It also often has the effect that it will be regarded as lower than it is, it will be met with less respect.
from what you write, you should just up your prices and try a different demographic. It could be an experiment. As someone who has pretty high prices, i can tell you that it feels good to be hired by people who make you feel appreciated. The worst experiences that i had were when i was cheaper.
As an artist who does comms, I definitely think people are like: but you spend a day on art? Why so low?
For me, it's because I'm only doing art for fun. The money is a bonus because my friends are like: I feel bad getting art without you getting paid. When honestly, I do it because seeing people happy about my art makes me happy. So I charge about 20 cad (around 15 usd), so my friends won't be anxious about me not getting something in return. I draw for fun and free most of the time.
But then I get countless dms from people getting upset at me for charging for my art, because they expect me to do it for fun 😂
I appreciate the business class in this video. I currently only charge 15 usd for fully rendered ship art and ik it's low but idk how to market my commissions properly and need the money bad. Maybe that would be a good video idea for all us baby artists
7:33 i feel torn! lower comm prices are good for a worldwide audience (especially if your audience is more non-american), but i always feel like artists should take advantage of and charge "western prices" bc art is a luxury and having that extra profit in a place where the average wage is lower can be so helpful. I've had experiences with clients that say they could get it better + cheaper elsewhere when i'm already charging casual hobby prices, so i sympathize with the DM too.
I believe the DM had their heart in the right place but the proper grammar/punctuation gave it a colder tone than intended. i dont think anyone auto-deserves to have a conversation publicized just for having it in written form. It wasn't a public tweet and really couldve just been ignored after the 2nd message, or after adding that their market includes clients with low-income or in places where the exchange rate is especially cruel. I think there were other ways to address this.
I’m a full time artist myself. They’re under charging themselves my line work by itself costs more than that. I hope everything works out well
The rest of their work is priced at market standard, this was a special deal and not their normal rate.
@@LilyLovecraftyes I understand that even with a deals that’s still too low
You people don’t understand that 15$ is already a lot, especially for people who are working at minimum wage. My wife, Suiren, wants to give a chance to people who can’t afford a high price tag for their logos and also the fact that 15 USD in our country is also already a lot. (For instance, you can buy 4 Big Macs for 15 USD with our currency.)
@@kimdaehyunieeArt is a luxury.
@@kimdaehyuniee LMAO yeah no that argument doesn't work here.
I'm an artist and a buyer, I'm on both sides and have seen a lot. Art isn't something you need in order to survive. That's wonderful that YOUR wife does that. Guess what, not everyone is your wife.
If you literally have to decide between buying FOOD and art you literally don't need, then you might have some issues that need to be checked out.
Yall need to pick a hill to die on. 😂 As a community(for the most part), we agree that artists have the right to choose their prices. This goes BOTH ways. If you feel her prices are too low, that's fine. But saying she's "hurting the market" and she should change her prices feels weird to me.
My prices are low because my arts meh and I want people to be able to get art cheap,bc I know the struggle of commissions being way too outta reach
I am an artist, a bit of an oldie now compared to most. For myself per commission, ex) full body - full render + back ground, will be up around 200+ dollary doos USD. For most people, yes that is a massive amount of money but I won't go around and shame other artists for charging less. I often when commissioning others will do my best to tip a decent amount. If I think someone is undercharging, I'll tip them often much more or even the price of the commission it's self. I think this artist's work is very lovely, and she should charge a bit more when she feels confident about it.
For me, a piece depending on what it is can take over well over 10 hours, even longer depending on the complexity. It's the time investment which is often the killer for most artists, I used to take very cheap portrait commissions, about 15-20 dollars each while I was in college that became oddly popular and I'd often find myself drowning in the time put in vs what I was getting in return.
genuinely expected this to be a drama about one logo being $600 or something, but it's just complaining for no reason 😂😂
They are amazing but it's sad that they raise their prices, as person from 2nd world country I earn like 700$ a month. If I were to get into vtubing (as I'm considering) having such affordable option would be great
never hurts ina asking if artists take payment plans
it's actually better that they raise their prices for the reason that other artists who aren't as good can also earn money. vtubing is not a life or death situation, it's a luxury. if you can't afford good looking logos, just do the free option and learn how to draw yourself. ms paint is a free program on windows. artists under pricing is unfair to themselves and every other artists. if artists keep doing this to themselves, you're going to be getting great art for like dirt cheap and people demanding for those kinds of prices to stay at such a low rate. it's awful how people don't actually appreciate the work others put in, and it's sad that people view themselves as such.
i've actually messaged a vtuber model artist that their prices for models are so ridiculously cheap it feels like a crime and they really should raise their prices for their own benefit. they are so good at drawing, but their models are like half than the average cheaper end of model art. they said ty but they keep it cheap so people could have good looking models for cheap. i didn't pursue anything further as that's what they want, but it's honestly sad. like even if they wanted it to be affordable, why not just the cheaper end of prices, why did it have to be even lower than that? it would already be an amazing deal if it was priced at the average lower end. i didn't message them to make them feel bad and i don't gain anything from them raising their prices (i don't even do commissions). i messaged them because i just felt like they deserved more for their time and effort
not saying people who aren't good should price at ridiculous rates, just price art reasonably.
I wonder if that person is really a pro graphic designer because $50 would also be way too low lol. Typically, a designer doesn't just do a logo, they come up with all the branding stuff. It's these big gig type sites profiting off artists that are harmful imo, not individuals like this. This artist can only serve so many people.
This happened to my friend, but my friend sells crochet plushies. She once was selling bunny plushies at 7 usd, and another woman (who also sold crochet plushies and had the same bunny pattern (the pattern was from Etsy)) started to attack her because she was selling the bunny plushie at 30 usd, and people didn’t want to buy it from her because of the price. In my opinion, I’m an artist as well, your art and work shouldn’t just be price high because you want money, that’s not morally correct or ethical. If you just spent 5 minutes doing a logo, then price accordingly, if not, then don’t go crying and attacking competitors for a problem that is clearly yours. We live in a society where, things that where usually common from our day to day life, are now luxuries, not everyone can pull $100 dollars from their wallet. Also, I think that this also lies as a internet problem, where artists were putting out “bad art” to a really high price so all the “good art” had to be higher.
Well its not exactly fair if an artist who just sells stuff for fun charges so low that the artists who do it as their livelihood can't make money anymore. Crochet takes time and labor to make and unless your friend is cranking the bunnies out in 15-20 minutes and including the price of the yarn, etc, they're making well below minimum wage. Hobbiests can sell their work but if its not your livelihood then please consider the artists who DO live off their work. I don't blame the other woman for being mad, sounds like your friend is intentionally screwing with the market because she likes giving away her work. Your mindset as an "artist" is incredibly toxic. So artists aren't allowed to make a living because you think it's morally and ethically wrong? Animators, graphic designers, seamstresses, editors....none of them deserve to make money for these things? Most art takes time and labor, if you don't take time making your art thats YOUR problem. Most of us work extremely hard.
@@mimilapin so are people now allowed to charge $100 for something that, 1) took them 20 minutes and 2) didn't take any materials? Cause I don't know if you knew, but not EVERYONE has the luxury of buying stuff, and when people who just like to capitalize of demand come and make a fuss about the situation, the other person is always in the wrong, even if they just want to give people who are less fortunate the chance of having cute stuff. I live in a place where the minimum wage is 7 dollars, just because in the US things go for a certain price, doesn't mean in all parts of the world is like that. Stop looking at this from a place of privilege and start understanding that not everyone can sell at that rate.
“Harms the market” is what a lot of art schools directly teach their students. It’s really driven into different curriculums
As a previous Vtuber customer that commissioned Suiren to do my logo, she did an absolute wonderful job with the quality of work that she provided and offered lots of variations to the logo i wanted. I was extremely suprised that she offered her services at $15, so i kept her info bookmarked for a month before deciding to go and talk with her if she can do my simple logo commission. It really helped people like me that are on a budget to get artwork and showcase it for our vtuber journey. Also its okay for Suiren to set a price for her services in which she is comfortable with, will love to see her thrive even more as an artist and showcase more artwork to everyone no matter what the price.
Setting lots of love to her.❤
15:14 - if you have too many commissions (and you are overworking/overwhelmed), double price, youll prob lose half of the people, but youll have the same pay and you wont be worried about getting them done.
ty i rly liked this part, this was very informative :DDDDDD
16:28 giveaways and urgencies
the rest of the video especially the end strategy about the 50% off! thank you!!
I also price my art way lower then it's "worth" bc I don't take comms often and also I think every one deserves to have the luxury of custom art. You don't need it to live but it's something that makes life better/more fun. My prices are super low but honestly they can go as low as 5$. It won't be a full render, or even just lines. But it's still art.
as a person who get distracted easily, those random sound effects help me snap back to the video haha
It's their art so it's their choice of price. I hate this "you hurt the market" bs because how are you supposed to charge the right prices if everyone has different opinions on what your art is worth and how good you are at art.
I feel like just thinking about prices in terms of minimum wage is a bit too simple. Sure, this would happen in a perfect world, but the truth is that commissions are competitive. The minimum wage point only starts when you have a large enough following, everyone else usually needs to undercut to draw any attention.
Probably a side note, but I have to bring it up. Feedback on prices being too low has been a staple in the art world for forever, right? It's nice to let someone know "hey, you could definitely charge more!" The art world is full of competition and that makes 99% of us undervalue our work, especially because we can only see what our art looks like to us - full of mistakes, repetitive, etc - and not what it looks like to those who love it so much they want to buy it... so, point being: what the hell is happening online nowadays that everything has to be guilt tripping and making people feel bad? We've survived for decades on "Hey, you're worth more! :)" so we HAVE scripts for discussions like this that are, you know, normal. We have a million and one ways to let someone know theyre under pricing without making them feel like shit to the point they have to publicly apologise for whats ultimately a tiny matter. It's so gross nowadays that we can't even do something like naturally undersell ourselves without strangers coming at us about how we're harming everyone around us and being selfish and so on. I swear people learned fear is a weapon that makes others listen to you and selfishly haven't put it down since.
I feel like the time x minimum wage, isn’t really reliable, some people can make amazing work but faster than others may be able to, that doesn’t mean they’re gonna constantly get commissions so they may end up underpricing themselves and you can ABSOLUTELY steal customers, thats literally how competitive marketing works. You are also not guaranteed to even maintain half of your current flow.
Just checking in, I hope you're doing good.
I usually listen to you while getting ready for work in the morning.
Have a great week!🌟
A business class of mine told me to set my worth and stand behind it if I believe in myself and the product.
Too low prices will mean your clientell will be people who are looking to buy things as cheap as possible and it will sometimes reflect as your whole base going missing when you're eventually forced set the prices higher to be able to make a living.
This is very situational in the artist + hobbyist world, but in business you have to know your worth, advertise yourself and keep paying customers(not swindlers) happy. I've learned every job will have at least one person(let's be real theres way more) begging for free or cheaper stuff.
The logos are so beautiful. I'm so out of the loop with pricing so I thought 15USD is decent for logos. But from another point of view it does seem low too, kind of depends on how fast they're made I guess? Time to finish listening to the video.
I was going to ask how to price youself fairly if you never had a commission before and have a brand new account and...you answered! Instantly subscribed, lovely content
I can understand in a guild situation how 'undercutting' others could be kind of scabby, but this just.. isn't that situation.
I also understand and commend the desire to be affordable...
But also as a commissioner when someone's prices are suspiciously low...it turns me away because I assume that they're either using AI, that they're inexperienced and may not be responsible or take the work seriously, or that under pricing may lead to stress which could lead to unfinished work and a bad and/or unhealthy situation for the artist. I don't want to be taking advantage of someone :/
This reminds me of when I was asked to draw designs for friends/family who wanted them tattooed, when I told some artist friends I was gonna charge like £15 or £25 at most they were losing their minds. Some of the pieces were extremely huge and hours to days of work 💀💀
I'm grateful to them for looking out for me but god asking people for anything more than £25 was mortifying!
I did end up charging more and thankfully friends/family were more than happy to pay more for the work ❤️
In this case we already know the artist was doing a super sale and there's no problem about it, especially if they were testing the skill with this kind of piece and needed quick feedback/clients. But except for this situation, I believe Art should be priced following the artist situation:
1: How much time you need to make a piece and how difficult is for you. (if you want to do a lot of them in short time etc)
2: The level of your art skills (based on your preferences)
3 and super important: Demand and Offer situation in your job.
I have medium/low prices because my brain can't focus a lot and my art skills are simple in terms of shading, plus I have very low demand so I need to be cheap and get more clients (example: I have a ych headshot portrait for 15$ because it's a special kind of piece and I got like 3 requests in 5 months or such)
Market value anyway is not the same everywhere in the world. Which kind of market were they talking about, currency have different value depending on where you are from.
(plus, have they ever checked Skeb???)
Im an artist and have commissioned that artist so many times and theyre legitimatly so sweet and genuinely talented. They dont deserve a finger pointed at them like that imo
Don't forget as clients we have a lot of power to encourage artists to value their time more and make them feel more confident in their work! If you can, always tip the artists you commission. That way you're not pressuring the artist but are still supporting their work monetarily. When artists charge for art a lot of times they don't take into account for the time they take to promote themselves, the time they take to talk to you, go over references, deliver files, etc. If you want artists to value themselves first, show it by valuing them and their time!
tbh i felt the same way when i saw the message that the artist sent to reach out to them.. it came across like they were jealous and saw them as competition or something
Am surprised that she can post so much that says how much drama it is
A lot of artist are outside of US, and for us to get customers even look at us it's the only way - to make low prices, because outside of US there no even chance to get high payment for digital art.
That would be really cool if you could make a video about more social media market strategies like the one you said in the video !
yaaay I’m glad u like it :3
i'm not even an artist but i love watching these videos
i had a few people tell me my art isnt worth 15/ 20/10$ but others say it is im not a good artist but people telling me this made me upset like sometimes it takes a few days or a week
11:59 RAAAAAH MY FRIEND BUNNIE MENTIONED LETS GOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!
🎉🎉🎉
art is one of those things that can never have a 100% exact universal price standard. i think that artists can price their stuff however they want, cheap or expensive! the thing about "damaging the market" is that the effect isn't quite as horrible as some people might think, at least in my opinion. with these online commissions, theres an OVERWHELMING chance that you'll find a unique art style and ability/boundary for each individual you see, and because art is literally all about these details, they are all in a way offering different products rather than selling the same thing and competing. if anything, the competition is for popularity rather than for customers specifically, and that has very little to do with commission prices. if a buyer likes your art enough, they will be willing to pay for it even if it's more expensive than someone else's. this other person pricing their own commissions cheaper isn't going to steal a ton of customers from you just like that. also, buyers who do just go for the cheap choices would probably not have bought your more expensive work even if the other person priced their work the exact same or more expensive. those who decide they can't or simply don't want to fork over a certain amount of money for your art won't suddenly decide they can/want to pay more just because everyone costs more. they'll just decide not to buy art at all, because those people (no hate to them i understand the situation) simply don't want to spend more than a certain amount on this luxury product.
one time i commissioned an artist and they didn't tell me it was a 'surprise me'
also the end result was garbage and when i tried asking for changes they said no.
I saw stuff like this on Pinterest recently but the other way around, someone was selling plain colored + little detail (blush on the knees and basic shading and stuff) unrigged bases for 50 bucks, everyone was saying that was too much and they were just going to screenshot it, and no one thought that was wrong to say. I ended up leaving a comment about how rude it was to imply someone’s time and talent on art wasn’t worth 50 dollars. “50 for an unrigged base?” Yeah rigging takes time and would cost way more, 50 is reasonable for a blank unrigged base, someone even said “I can make this myself” do it then????😭😭
As a vtuber on a major budget due to a mix of factors, I will forever be grateful to the artists that raffled and/or gifted their work, even those I paid for in XIV gil. Why? Because, as much as I would love to toss hundreds of dollars on gorgeous art to make my time on this space rock beautiful, I would rather eat and have lights on. I've paid for work, plenty of it, but prices have gotten out of hand. Much like groceries and housing, Idgaf about the "market" but how much I can afford. Bless Suiren for thinking of people like that, because they could easily make triple that but wanted to look out for the small folks; worth isn't always about money but strength in morals, of which she is plentiful.
Check prices for the market then charge what you think YOU can handle.
What I mean by this is. Labor costs and if applicable material costs should be factored into your price.
You should also realize that if your price is too cheap then you might get overrun with requests. Eventually, you will hit a break limit. Either you will realize you can't do the work for that price/time or you can't pick up all the work that comes your way. Then the overflow will either have to go elsewhere or they won't be paying anyone anyway.
It kind of solves itself for self employed artists/crafters.
Obviously this doesn't apply to large companies but for small artists this doesn't seem like something someone else should need to call out.
Don't underestimate your value but you don't need to follow others either. Price for yourself and your market.
Logo making is very time consuming charging $15 for the amount of work and time is crazy! Especially if all the logos are different it’s not one concept with different tweaks or format it’s different logos a hat a teddy bear infinity sign that’s a lot of work that’s crazy!
Minimum wage in my state is 16.35… I could never compete with their prices. :/ I would rather work at Home Depot and get full benefits + paid time off.
I had to change my rates for commissions because it was waaaaay below the going rate... I'm going to have to do it again because of Eh-Aye *and* the current going rate still being higher.
My biggest mistake of my life was to listen to "these" people saying I make my prices too low and it is below minimum wage and I should raise it higher. Since then I got from like 30 commissions a year to 1 or 0 . Even if you are good artist having full colored art for 15 dollars you will earn more than zero customers.
Though with the first thing there are japanese pages that do it like this. some anonyme person sends commission request, you have 0 conversation. they drop a prompt what they want to have , that's it. and the rest is to artists interpretation and it will be delivered without refunds.
means no conversations at all and I really love t his. Had so much trouble with clients in the past which I sent sketches and all and they were always fine. and then randomly when the piece is almost done they want a major change
I get both sides. As a consumer, $15 for a logo is a great and affordable price. As someone who learned and was licensed in graphic design, $15 for a logo (ESPECIALLY if it’s for commercial use) is WAY too low.
18:03 I love hearing your strategy tips! As a crochet artist, I want to sell my products, but I struggle on how to do my pricing and things like that. Thank you for your help! 😁💚
Imagine feeling so entitled that you’re harassing another artist for prices THEY chose to set for themselves… not everything is about you 😭 this is why we can’t have good things
We're causing hyperinflation II with this one!
the thing is, if a person can only afford the affordable, they will only do that. its not like she is "stealing" clients, she is simply giving an opportunity to those who can regularly afford it. I know artists that have low prices due to they want others to have the opportunity and get sufficient enough founding on patreon etc.
and i appreciate those artist so much, id never be able to have some custom stuff before if not for them. and that makes me eternally grateful
that being said, that's not standard, not everyone should or can do that and that's okey. but to try and guilt trip people to up their prices when they just did that to be kind ? idk that don't sit right with me. If they had simply been "damn ur art is just so good u definitely should up it" that would have been different. but man, don't dm people to make them feel bad for just wanting to be nice to their community.
I understand the "hurting the market". Sometimes it hurt people from other countries. In my country, some people wanted to hire you for below livable wages just because some are willing to be exploited. Of course, don't let people tell you what your prices should be.
with that quality and detail, she really should charge more
People in the art community need to understand each artist prices things for their own reasons, I price my stuff cheaper cause I want people to be able to get art even if they cant afford a large price. I offer pricing to help out the people like myself who might only have $15 to spare on themselves. As Adults, you have bills, and other things to pay we dont always have the funds to buy everything to treat ourselves but still deserve to treat ourselves once in a while without going into the hole. Also....minimum wage is different in all places. In the USA, one state is 5.15, another is 8.00, and another is 15.00.... if we venture out of USA it is so large a range... people need to stop and think about things and see everywhere isnt same and everyone isnt the same.
i really liked this kind of content!! it's cool
I love ur strategies! Thanks ❤
This is literally the moist critical of art
The problem of her low prices literally came to fruition. After that post blew up she got 112 commission requests. It will take them forever to get all of them done and the 112th person will have to wait quite a while. If they just upped the price they would be doing themselves a favour. Its nice that they want it to be accessible but at the same time they are a business not a charity + not everyone is serious enough in their endeavours to need a logo.
My stance is, art might be a luxury - for clients. But as the artist, especially if you make a living from it, it really depends on where you live and on your living situation. For an artist who has kids, living in europe, i could NEVER EVER EVER ask for this little amount of money. Just think about it - for a logo like this, even if you are fast, it takes several hours of work, BUT also the communication with the client, social media content prep and service, invoicing. So the time alone that goes into this is probably around 6 hours minimum. Where I live minimum wage is nothing you could life off as a family so hourly rate must be at least 25+ USD. There we would be at 150 USD and then we would only have the pure time that went into it, not the skill, the experience and not the rights that you sell typically with a logo. With that on top you can easily triple the amount, and still then we would be at apprentice pricing.
If I charged 15 bucks, I would have an hourly rate of 2,50 USD. If I work my ass of, on top of that being limited in when I work because I have a toddler, I could earn 350 USD a month. I feel like, even for a cheaper area in the world that is not enough. That doesn`t even remotely cover food OR daycare, not to mention rent. I am under the impression that charging that low also is some kind of privilge, because then you aren’t financially dependent on it. Not even if you double the price.
My colleagues charge easily several thousands for a logo. Logo design is the most expensive craft within the graphic design world.
I am more expensive and with my prices I reach a different target audience than someone with cheaper prices. I don`t feel threatened by artists with lower prices though. I just couldn`t feed my kids going this low. But i also think, there`s enough for everybody. I have my own opinion on how artists ideally should price their art but I would never tell another artist what to do like this.
(not necessarily what is happening here but) selling something small and cheap is a long term strategy... Stores call it the "basic white tshirt"
This concept is you offer a small low cost item at almost no profit inorder to make your store more accessible. People come in. Buy the white-t to try your brand out. If they like it they will likely come in to buy more or start to recommend you to other. So the profit from the white-t is a delayed profit vs immediately.
Or just need a quick cash flow for some bills so they do a sale/deal to get a income boom. (Without attaching too much personal story to it)
This is similar to when photographers do mini shoots. Where they just spend a whole day doing 30-60 min sessions with people at a reduced price. It's enough to cover expenses (maybe) but then when people need a bigger photoshoot they already know the photographer and are likely to pay for a more fuller priced shoot bc they know the quality first hand.
Or they share the quick shoots on socials and someone they know books a full session.
Or tattoo parlors doing small flash tattoos for like $20!
It's a strategy that is effective when used in moderation.
I mean there are aspects where both suiren and the messager are in the wrong? depending on speculations.
For suiren, it is great to provide cheap affordable art and she most definitely deserves more than just $15USD for the commissions. But also, she most definitely could've showed the dms and then mention in a seperate post of thread that she is specifically pricing below for the community and mention the market price cause since she has a lot of fans and followers, there are bound to be over thousands of aspiring artists or artists in the market that price lower due to this.
With the commenter, they could be a fellow graphic design artist that views suiren as a competitor that attempted to manipulate suiren into making her prices market prices to ensure proper competition or for more potential commissioners but there is also the case that they have goodwill. They might have wanted a fellow artist to get paid what they deserve and didnt word it correctly or maybe they tell that to all artists that lower their prices significantly as a warning "your art is worth more and it is important to acknowledge that". I would also argue against the breach of privacy part since the commenters in her comment section were extremely rude to the messenger and said nasty things about them to bring suiren up which should not be acceptable nor supported. Suiren responding to those comments also allowed more of those comments to flow in that may deal mental health damages to the messenger which I know how it feels from random people online who know nothing.
We know nothing about the intentions of both the people in the conflict so I dont see how its right to think of the best for one and think of the worst for the other.
Not me reading ''logo'' as ''lego'' 💀💀
people who arent artist also need to understand its ok to price your art a bit expensive. I have friends who think $15-$30 per emote is expensive and it always made me annoyed since emotes take time as much as normal art. Art is a privilege and being an artist myself I know I can't always get art since some artists can be expensive.
I feel like art has been getting ridiculously expensive and exclusive because it's mostly become comms for vtubers (technically for commercial use) these days. I'm saying this as an artist myself. I used to open sketches for $12 a pop on Deviantart or tumblr because I draw really fast and just wanted to get some pocket change for fun. I didn't want to do serious hardcore commissions and the higher you price your art the more people expect as well. In this world of comms, if I charged $15 for some doodles, I'd probably get messages like those Suiren has gotten. This isn't a comment on Suiren; I don't know them, but some artists draw/make graphics really fast and actually it might take Suiren just 15-20mins to whip a logo up if they have a very good workflow/foundation. Usually people who aren't strong in their foundation take a lot longer to produce a piece of artwork and hence they make a loss because they charge $15 but take 4hrs to make a logo. They feel like they're working less than minimum wage. You need to figure out a good price point for yourself and your skill level, and stop worrying about other people "spoiling the market" LOL
Just price your art however you want, other artists can just suck it up and deal with it
Gotta love people telling other people what to do and expecting them to do as one says lmao.. I used to undercharge even for a simple fact that I needed money SUPER damn FAST, ASAP, right now, and it's an easy way to do it. My friend used to undercharge for her insane art until she built an audience and then started to slowly raise and raise. She still does cheaper work for people that can't spend money on digital pixels, but still want to buy something as treat for themselves. While Surien's work def worth more, let them do whatever the fuck they wanna do. Not to mention that they or their client audience might be mainly from other countries where dollar is valued, so even a twenty bill is a lot. Holy--
I saw their logos on my timeline but the waitlist was already 80 persons