I have an idea, and it aligns with Metzen's story tropes in the past. In confining Azeroth, they did keep the Void from reaching her, but they also kept the Light from reaching her, and as she's matured, the only sources she could grow from, were those of the mortals on her surface. So she is not a nascent Void Lord, or a baby Titan. She's instead what a World Soul becomes when it comes from the center of Cosmic energies. Something new and distinct from both of them.
You're on the right track, there is a huge theory that Azeroth is more.. omnipotent in the sense that it's not only Light and Shadow, but the entire cosmos tree that she drew from on the surface. So Light, and Shadow, Life and Death, Order and Disorder, I would argue the most prominent theory now for Azeroth is - she is a product of what happens when a Worldsoul is exposed to all the cosmos energies. Because she infact, has, throughout Warcraft's history, been exposed to a metric-fuckton of each in their own unique way that has influenced the planet, and us, greatly. So this is mostly likely - and would make sense as to why some of the Titan lines even echoed that Azeroth was stronger than Sargeras, is because by the time the titans have encountered her, her Worldsoul more than likely encountered Void, and Death - then the titans meddling mixed in Order, and Life etc etc.
@@ShadowKallig At this point it feels less and less likely that most of the cosmic forces even existed as this extreme of a state and that they were just cut out from something that existed before it, what also led to this giant conflict what is driven by the need to regain this natural, undived form and at the same time being dominated by the PoV of the extremes, that they should be the one in control. Especially the whole Light/Void duality points in that direction. Life/Death are clearly seperated while seeming to be artificial and mainly for mortals which also came a long time after that creation and in many cases just from one cosmic force (in case of Azeroth mortals for example mainly from Titans then 'corrupted/altered' further). The only real cosmic force coupla in utter despite of each other seems to be Order and Fel and while people seem to see chaos as naturally evil, they shouldn't forget that the extreme of Order is plain fascism and the Titans show over and over again that they ARE that extreme. As long as you follow their order, you are fine, sure. You are absolutely not when you dare to take one step outside of it...
@@miriamweller812 I feel like different factions push worldsouls to become different thing, something like a stemcell. However they can also develop on their own, Azeroth being kind of special and experiencing tons of chaos just grew on its own outside designs of other factions. This could play nicely on considerations of free will, personhood etc. and could be used for exciting and intellectually interesting story.
@@Hauntedhighheel even Azshara has a cult around her Sylvanas's cult is more of a rookie thing compare to that. and umm... The Dark Lady is merciful, may she forgave your insolence.
Ohh, this REALLY recontextualizes when Magni released Azeroth's energy into the newly awakened earthen. I just clicked a random teleporter and found myself in what I assume is the new Earthen starting area, the Awakening Machine, and there was a book there. The earthen was musing on the nature of the souls and their free will. Even just today I bumped into a random earthen in Boralus which lead me to another one sightseeing in Vash'jir. *They're not like the other earthen.* What Magni did changed them.
She was probably about to awaken at some point but the titans forcefully put her to sleep, that’s why there’s like the dream and nightmare theme all over and I think the old gods always mention that the song that is sang is also "theirs"
I am not surprised if Azeroth would ever lash out. Like would you be happy existing inside a cage constantly being pocked and prodded by all the other cosmic forces
Xal'atath is working in favour of Xal'atath. But I would love if Azeroth is manipulating it (nudging in the right direction) to free herself. After millennia of watching us Azeroth pick up few this.
this bit of lore has me thinking that everyone is bad now, titans just wanted azeroth for her power, sargeras did, and void lords all the same but now here we are to mess all 3 of them up to get her free on her own from everyone's influence
I feel like your right, except I wouldn't be surprised if we find out Sargeras went mad in his struggle to free Azeroth. He was once the champion of the Pantheon, maybe he went crazy being the only being in the universe struggling to free her.
It doesn't mean that they're "bad". Simply that interests do not align. The Titan pantheon still have protected Azeroth many times and done good many times. It's simply in their nature to want to order things. That doesn't mean they're evil.
It's in the nature of every conscious being that arose from a particular cosmic force to seek out the expansion of it's own realm above all others. These beings are not good nor bad per se. Most azerothians are by-products of the order pantheon's works (or have been deeply influenced by this) so it's natural for it's denizens to desire aligning themselves with order, light and life magic above all others. If something good came out of the Shadowlands lore-wise is that it showed us a realm shaped by death, necromantic and shadow magic that is not only completely functional but also a vital cogwheel in the machinery of the universe.
@@zasshulad2619 I mean they are actively, and have in the past, fucked with the nature of Azeroth and her children. I mean, the whole point of dragon flight was the incarnates were actually right, and that the titans manipulated the dragons and forced them into changing their nature in order to serve their will. Sure, the caressed our cheeks and "helped" secure their interests when things were beginning to get bad. But it still doesn't change the fact it was done out of a selfish nature of persevering their order. Everything they did was taking our influence for granted. I'm sure with the legion gone and the void being handled, when the titans return to Azeroth, they will end up being just as bad as the void, legion, or even Zovaal.
18:40 I think the most straightforward impression is he was aiming at the prison, if not Azeroth herself. So his initial goal by encompassing the world was to corrupt her directly into another Dark Titan, then as we yanked him off he went "screw this, if I can't have her, nobody can!" and stabbed as hard as he could, hoping to weaken or break the prison enough that Azeroth is loosed from the grasp of the other titans. As far as "this world is a prison" interpreting I still like that conspiracy video by Xaxxas that essentially implies that "The Shadowlands" is itself another construct by the titans trying to order the realm of death. A bit of a convoluted interpretation, but it does make more sense out of the Jailer and Sylvanas's motivations. The notion basically being that Zereth Mortis and all that is also titan infrastructure using Azeroth's "prime worldsoul" essence to order the other cosmic domains.
This could be it or maybe it was such a surprise that he just flung the sword in the general direction to cause maximum damage. Because he is a spiteful oaf like that :P
If Azeroth is the centre of everything it stands to reason that she needs ALL the cosmic energies (light, void, life, death, order, disorder) in order to become this special beeing. Maybe Azeroth's supposed to bring ballance to all these forces in the end. But I guess if that happens there will be no more war in Warcraft.
@@TrueStiven LMAO do you still believe she had any right, knowledge or control? The Death system worked well. The only change that was needed was in Bastion. She was angry that families were being separated, but as we can see, there was no ban on traveling between dimensions. She was the Jailer puppet all this time. He used her, lied to her, and threw her away when she was no longer useful. Just like Sylvanas did with the Horde. Poetic justice
Sylvanas talked about mortals being condemned by the system to have no control over their life nor death nor life in death. This is absolutely clear and only clickbaiter or idiots would make anything different out of it after Sylvanas CONSTANTLY talked about what she meant in SL.
@@marcinbiay1074 Player was nothing else as the other Death Gods' puppet and without Sylvanas nothing would have changed at all. She didn't reach her final goal thanks to the betrayel but she reached a lot and it was ONLY because of her. The player character and their NPC masters only focussed on her the whole time, what was stupid anyway, since killing her would have changed nothing at all, in contrary. The main reason she was needed for had been "opening the veil", everything after that was at best a bonus and she wasns't crucial for that when it came to Zovaal's plan to use Zereth Mortis for his own goal. There isn't one time when the other Death Gods are questioned, especially the one who actually created Domination Magic. And Bastion the problem? The fake Arbiter machine isn't? Maldraxxus is sheer hell, an eternity on a warfield in endless struggle, only a brainwashed gamer would find that acceptable as long as they are not actually sent there and get what endless condamnation this fate would be. Revendreth is purgatory, so yeah... also not really something you would like at all. Ardenweald? That's just for VERY few beings. Pretty much no mortal will go there - and it's likely heavily corrupted by the Titans, who - don't forget - created the Emerald Dream Ardenwald is somehow heavily linked to... (and interesting backdoor into the Realm of Death for the Titans, no?).
Honestly the way they should’ve played it is having two halves of her soul meet like different personas (akin to Uther) and have the “good” one with memories merely up to her death by Arthas, but have their own unique damages; but then later work with Tyrande through the guidance of Elune to have the good half absorb the other darker half and become “whole” At least that way you’d manage to get both the redemption AND the vengeance carried out via “kill” in one Fel-swoop.
at 17:12 the word you're looking for is "benevolent" - personally, I hate it when I'm thinking of a word and it just doesn't come, so I'm just trying to help with that : )
I'm getting a Star Wars prequel vibe from all this. Xalatath is like count dooku making an army which forces us to make an earthen army... just for it to turn on us...
I think it would be interesting to see Azeroth not as this benevolent holy and sacred soul of the world, but to see her more angry and resentful the way we saw Argus. Maybe we can help her before all hope is lost, so she doesn't quite become so tortured that she only knows pain and rage, but still have a focus on being a victim of the titans and every other cosmological force.
I've had a similar hope as well. Not a nurturing, motherly character but more like an angry older sister. Who's sick of everyone's shit. I'm also hoping Azeroth's somewhat mentally immature in a way. She doesn't pop out with loads of exposition knowing every darn thing but instead is still also making sense of the universe and her place in it.
there is a multiple theroys out there that say argus was part of Azeroth. Cause why does some scenes show blue in her soul and later not anymore :) Argus will be a really important thing later on im sure of it.
She has already endured eons of elemental lord wars, the old god's corruption, the troll empires mining her kazarite, several burning legion invasions, US mining her Azerite and being stabbed with a blade by planet sized satan. I'm not sure what we mortals can do to win her over after all that.
@@Boxkar24 Be careful with that, though, nothing is more annoying than a powerful, utterly alien being that just acts like a random human teenage girl (or boy). We got this often enough, becasue it's simply lazy writing.
@@miriamweller812 True, and I assume a being of her stature learns at seriously high geometric rate, what human can learn in a centaury she learns in a few picoseconds.
they got realy good in tiyng the story together. As they intruduced the earthen at first I wasn't really impressed but with the story of the expansion they grew much more on me than dracthyr for example They represent the story shift from titan-focused to azeroth-focused in such a beautiful way. they are like the players(gameplaywise) compelled by rather strict rules . They take the role of magni as connection to azeroth but by making it a whole playable race. and the story really fills in a lot of plotholes right at the start of the worldsoul saga, wich is great. seems like they're finally finding out of the mess that was created since wod.
Sargeras' motives for stabbing Azeroth to me remain the same as when Legion ended. A last ditch effort to destroy Azeroth and ensure that the void lords would never get the chance to twist Azeroth's world soul into a void corrupted titan. Though i do recall somewhere in 7.3 that Sargeras intended to harness Azeroth's power in a similar way that he harnessed Argus' world soul to regenerate his demonic forces more quickly.
Off-topic, I saw the whisper of Furyw and it made me realise how much I miss the leveling series of Furyw and you. Was always a joy to see them pandas.
Amazing work as always. “Benevolent” force is what you were looking for, Benign is like “non-threatening” or “inert” so still close. Random question but do you think the world soul saga will touch on the themes we left off in shadowlands? Or is it more likely that Metzen’s vision and the original story don’t have room for the First Ones?
Unless I’m missing something, this seemingly implies that the Earthen stumbled upon something 5,000 years before TWW that caused someone to wipe their memory. Probably too many of them exposed to the world soul. Between memory wiping machines and life resetting machines, the Titans are sounding like bad guys
There still isn't a single shred of proof for that though....... literally all we have is unreliable narrator interpretations by Dagran, who I don't trust for objective knowledge.... who hears something from Archaedas, who I don't trust for objective knowledge.... who heard something from Khaz'goroth, who doesn't have objective knowledge either. I don't even think any of the Titans are bad guys except Sargeras, and maybe Eonar.
We know that the Earthen are scheduled to regularly go on an wipe their memories in the Archives. Could be a safety measure by the Titans to make sure they don't break free. EDIT: I also wouldn't say the Titans are "bad guys". Just like every other force, they have their own agenda. A lot of the time our goals aligned, that's why they and their forces were allies in the past, but we have butted heads with Titan machines since Vanilla, so it's not new.
The most obvious reason for the mind wipe is the Titans "repairing" them. There is this theater event where the Earthen tell the story about this tyrannic Keeper servant they got rid of with the help of the Keeper (if that is actually truth or just brainswashed into them who knows). At the end of it, when his body is dragged away, he threatens the earthen with the wrath of his sister Galan. Under water you can find "Galan's Edikt": ""I, Watcher Galan, erect this monument to forever be a warning. The earthen shall know the wrath of the titans if they defy their will again. From this day forward, they will be bound more tightly to my will and that of our titan overlords. If they again defy us or the titans no longer require their aid, they will be forcefully deactivated with extreme prejudice. Such is my will. Such is the will of the titans."" So it's pretty clear that the Eartens WERE force into line after that and even tighter than before.
@@laertesindeed Uh, they have shown that their order is a fascist extreme often enough. Sure, just like the human fascists, you are fine as long as you are accepting their laws. But good luck if you go against any single part of it. For some reason peopel see "order" as naturally good, but order can stand for absolute everything. 2.WW germany was an extrem rule of order... Just like "freedom", "state", "law" and many other terms, order can stand for many different things, from good to absolute evil. Slavery is a form of order. Genocide is a form of order. Again: "Order" by itself means nothing.
I don't see this from the disc quest at all. It was Dagran making an interpretation, after hearing Archaedas make an interpretation, who heard something from Khaz'goroth that is an interpretation. We don't have any objective information that the core chamber is anything other than good. Further...... if the Azeroth World Soul was speaking to Magni back in Legion, then it "WANTED" him to save the Titans in their legion captivity. That voice which he calls a "she" wanted him to help the Titans. Objectively. Irrefutably. Undeniably. That voice also "WANTED" Magni to repair the Heart Chamber. And that voice "WANTED" Magni to save and repair the Awakening Machine in ringing deeps. Now, either that voice was the Azeroth World Soul and all of the above means she likes the Titans..... or.......... that voice is not Azeroth and never was. If that voice is from the Light instead of the world soul....then that voice could be the same as how the Naaru spoke into our minds during Burning Crusade on Outland. And if indeed that voice is from the Light, then it could have been speaking through the crystal Thraegar just like it sometimes speaks through crystalline naaru. This could genuinely mean that the Light was using the thraegar back then to break through the core chamber so they could force the Light upon the Azeroth World Soul. Or...... what is also possible, is that since the Light is an equal and opposite of the Void, that various Void voices and whispers were corrupting the Thraegar and making them attack the core chamber, again so the void could get into the core and force Void upon the world soul.
Or maybe the voice always was Azeroth, and she wanted to save the Titans in Legion cause only with their help did we stand a chance against Sargeras. She wanted to fix the Chamber of Heart maybe because it is a tool capable of healing, communicating and infusing anything regardless of order alignment into her. Finally she did herself through Magni repurpose the Awakening Machine to make/wake earthen with free will, ones that would easily align with her.
@@Nullermanden If your head canon is true, that means the azeroth world soul is Dominating earthen, and enslaving them to do only what she wants. She is more dangerous than Zovaal........ "if" your head canon is true. Which it does not have to be.
@@laertesindeed It seems my reply came off as rude and dismissive of your hypothesis while that was not at all my intention. Sorry. I only wanted to present another explanation of these events that I think is more plausible. Also saying that Azeroth is giving Earthen free will is not to me comparable to saying she is dominating them, while yes, the result seems to be that they will ally with her. Of course the prime world soul is more dangerous than Zoval. I don't think anyone would deny that. PS: While your hypothesis seems to me like it makes unfair assumptions about Azeroth's feelings, I do quite like it. :)
@@Nullermanden In reverse order.... I didn't make any assumptions about the feelings of any world soul inside Azeroth....I simply listed what a voice told Magni to do in past expansions which is "not" consistent with having any negative intentions toward the Titans. It is still undecided whether that voice Magni was hearing was from the azeroth world soul or from the Light; which is why I had to list out two If-Then statements. Next....we have absolutely no evidence that Azeroth was giving free will to new Earthen in the awakening machine recently; all the lore in game says that Earthen had been made and then tested to see if there was any void corruption and if there was, they'd be redownloaded into a new body and tested again. Moreover, that Earthen made from the awakening machine in ancient Khaz Algar were also occassionally showing a free will that made them question their jobs.....and it was this ancient free will that allowed them to rebel against the bad choices of Dornic and Galan......something which they were congratulated on, by the way, when the Keeper who was higher in the hierarchy than Dornic and Galan were showed up and said what Dornic and Galan did was not acceptable. That Keeper told the Earthen they would never have to be ruled by any watchers like those....so again, demonstrating the Titans were not enemies of free will. The Titans and titankeepers "have" free will.....according to the journal writings of an Earthen who left his job and joined the freysworn; because the free will he already had long in the past was reiminiscent in what he believed the titankeepers and Titans to have already. Lastly, nope.....I didn't see any rudeness in your reply. And while I think that people with headcanon making videos as content creators are increasingly a problem for fans of the "real" lore......... that doesn't mean that every time I identify someone as having head canon, that somehow I am demeaning them. I am not. Because it is possible for you to have a head canon and you're not claiming that is what the game showed. Whereas those problematic content creators "do" use their channels to make false claims about what the game actually shows or logically supports.
@@laertesindeed But then again you did seem to assume that the voice wouldn't have helped the Titans if it despised them, which would not be true if the survival of the voice or something of comparable importance depended on helping the Titans. Enemies of enemies aren't necessarily friends, but I would, like you, not assume that the voice regards the Titans as enemies either, only that the voice, if being Azeroth, would have told Magni these things regardless so as to survive. About free will; we have no evidence that Azeroth gave free will, but wether it be by time alone or exposure to the Coreway ancient earthen on Khaz Algar gain the ability to have feelings and to rebel, and those newly activated have feelings and wills unbound by edicts from the get go. As is written in the Reconstructed Ledger earthen don't usually have these qualities, which I read to mean that they weren't part of their original design and that the Titan edicts have no control over the new ones. This is not something the Titans are known to be against, but it is inconvenient to not have them follow edicts which is why the colossi are walking in land after they all renounce the edicts. I would read them but can't find these journal writings of an Earthen who left his job and joined the freysworn. Can you site them, please? A little silliness from my side: The reason I call these things hypotheses are that to me headcanon was what someone believe unwavering without it being canon potentially ever, while hypotheses are ideas one can discuss as openly as we here do.
In my head I see Azeroth as a proud adoptive mother of a bunch of kids with gremlin energy. The things things that make them weak ultimately make them strong. The Curse of Flesh taught the Titanforged how to fight for survival. The Orcs were an invading force and now are among the greatest champions. "I don't care if you're a god. If you put 20 of my kids in one room, and they don't stand in the glowing circles, they will kill you."
Obviously, but social media clowns love to parrot the shit they make up for some reason. Sylvansa explained over and over again what she meants, anyone with half a brain cell should have gotten it.
Hmmm kind of. She wasn't talking specifically about the world soul being trapped in a titan machine, but it's still in the ballpark. She was talking about the structures of creation itself being a prison. The Jailer was going to use the world soul, too. This story is about souls and free will, which is Sylvanas' playground.
I stick to the idea that Azeroth represents "free will". If Domination magic is a thing, then "Freedom" magic might be its own. It makes sense that it's a Prime Worldsoul, because it has the freedom to become whatever it wants to be. So if it wants to support the Titans, then that shifts the balance and makes them win. Same for the Void. The Dragon Aspects can wield Titan-like magic and remain unchanged, because its the same magic but not beholden to the titans.
I think the same and I think this could lead to a interesting and mature story if they wanted to explore the ideas of free will and destiny. WoW audience is now in their 30s mostly probably so why not.
"This place is a prison And these people aren't your friends Inhaling thrills through $20 bills And the tumblers are drained and then flooded again And again Ther're guards at the on ramps armed to the teeth And you may case the grounds from the cascades to puget sound, But you are not permitted to leave I know there's a big world out there like the one i saw on the screen In my living room late last night, It was almost too bright to see And i know that it's not a party if it happens every night Pretending there's glamour and candelabra When you're drinking by candlelight What does it take to get a drink in this place? What does it take, how long must i wait? what does it take to get a drink in this place? what does it take, how long must i wait? How long must i wait?" -"This Place Is A Prison" by The Postal Service Sorry I got distracted and sang this entire song, instrumental parts included. What were we talking about?
Xalatath wants to take azeroth's power for herself. she's aligning with the void as it's the most powerful way for her to get what she wants. if she were working for the void lords, it'd be more like a business arrangement. The War Within = the war within mortal beings, as well as the war within azeroth herself. she is fighting with the void's corruption, good vs bad. i believe she wants to be free because she stands a better chance at defending herself that way. i mean look at it this way, she's trapped in a room and someone stabbed her and she had no way of defending herself. not to mention, she's been aware this entire time about all the horrible ways entities have tried to kill her. imagine you're trapped in a room and outside that room things are constantly trying to kill you. she is traumatised. she has ptsd. she wants to leave that room to be free to make her own choices. the titans are trying to force her to be good, entities want her to be bad. maybe she can exist as both? what if the war within is just making peace with the good parts of yourself as well as the bad? it's about making peace with the choices you've made, and moving on past the trauma. i believe anduin's story directly reflects azeroths struggles. she could exist as a light and void being, like calia menethil.
I like your idea you said a while ago, where Xal'atath is the part of Azeroth that is corrupted by the void. Kinda like a split personality type of thing. Both see differently but want the same thing.
hey man, thanks for the vid. Sylvanas 🦐will be happy now. The writing of this game has become so bad though, I genuinely don't understand how people enjoy the modern writing in retail WoW... i find most if not all of the characters to be insufferable
I think the World Soul is some sort of cosmic entity of immense potential that has yet to mature into its full power, whatever that may be, and as it grows it can be influenced by the Cosmic forces around it. All of the cosmos seems to be at war with each other (the ultimate War in Warcraft’s universe). Life, Death, Chaos, Void, Light, and Order are all against each other in some sort of eternal stalemate and Azeroth’s worldsoul is the one thing that can tip the scales in one side’s favor enough for them to overpower the rest.
As far as I know, unless they're trying to retcon some things, Sargeras just wanted to destroy all world souls so they couldn't be corrupted and become ultra powerful beings that even the titans wouldn't be able to stop. I do like the retcon this time though, the fact that he might've wanted to do it because he learned of the titans schemes works okay too.
It's ABSOLUTE clear that they planed their whole story since years and only change details. It's prettys insane how Blizzard holds together such a massive story over so many years without creating gaping plot holes. Something most movies are unable to in a ~2 hour plot line.
@@miriamweller812 You must think the MCU is high tier and relevant to reality. And also say that about New Star Wars and Benedict Cumberbatch's Sherlock/other quirky Brit show and anything else praised by reddit/tumblr/other like approved weeb stuff.
In the staff of sargeras lore in the Warlock orderhall it's explained that sargeras glimpsed azeroths soul and becamr infatuated with her. I think from that point on his motivations may have skewed from commit mass delete to smth else
I mean, we knew Azeroth was a prison for the old gods since ulduar, at least. They changed the meaning of said prison, but what she said was right before shadowlands was even an idea.
I think that Sargaras was aiming for the world core, that if Sargaras wanted too, he could have cut the world in two. He was aiming at something, the world core. I’m willing to bet you, if we make it through the coreway to the world core, we will find the pointy end of Sargaras’s sword poking through.
Nah. The Horde will just remain a council, and that will somehow work because the writers say so. This is a fantasy game with alien planets and battle robots, and THAT to me is the most unrealistic thing in the whole franchise.
@@donjezza10 Why shouldn't it work? The Horde is made for that more than anything else, since it's a clusterf*ck of outsiders. Actually you either need sheer tyranny to rule that or something like at least a coucil, where the different parts of this clusterf*ck at least FEEL represented.
@@slime8177 Thats what I call a low bar sir. I loved the questing and the lore of TWW but I have no strong reason to continue subbing after reaching end game and achieving some things.
@mast3734 ha you sound like me talking to the screaming democrats😹🧂🇺🇸 I did, but in love and memory as an Ali turned Horde pre BC and ever since a passionate PvPer. But the quality slipped to far when the game went unity/woke World of the Woke-Cra…🤦♂️
So how I'm seeing this: The Titans wanted only Titan Influence, Azaroth knows that only one influence is bad, so got the Thraegar to sabotage the worldcore(tm) to insure a balance of influences.
Maybe Sargaras looked at the eye of Azeroth and fell in love. And she said that she is imprisoned and so he rallied the burning legion to go free her (is it overkill? No. As you see, the forces against him was able to stop him even with that). You can see that before he stabbed her, he was doing that weird creepy cuddle thing with the planet until the clouds were lifted. Maybe he was working on lockpicking until he was pulled away by the titans, and so he was like, “Uh, no time. I hope this can help you break free!” It was after that point that Azeroth had enough voice to reach those on the surface so even though she bled her prison was damaged so she could work out her freedom?
I don’t think they’ll retcon Sargeras’ motivations behind the Burning Crusade. It seems reasonable that his Plan A could still be the destruction of Azeroth to keep it from the void’s hands. Once it’s obvious he won’t get that chance, he plunges the sword into the planet to fracture the the prison the Titans had built around her, giving her a fighting chance to resist the Void with her own means. And then follows BFA in which she immediately begins setting pieces in play to defend her. Magni, Heart of Azeroth wielding champions, empowering denizens of the planet with her very blood, (slight detour to the afterlife), reclaiming the Dragons, and now the radiant song.
I got a theory here me out. The Old Gods where and are Azeroth's defense mechanism - it's here fears and her nightmares, a reflection of her inner psyche attempting to defend the beautiful light within - aka the world soul. That is my wild theory but a more plausible question is do we think this is why Yogg was able to introduce the Curse of Flesh to the Titanic keepers? It was actually a gift from Azeroth through a curse of an Old God? Like using the enemies magic to the betterment of ourselves? Like how we have accepted Warlocks, Demon Hunters, and Death Knights into our alliances and hordes? Idk shits getting wild.
Perhaps Azeroth is predestined to be touched by each node on the axes of cosmic power. So far, Light, Fel, Chaos, Life, Death, primordial elements. Infused by all powers, she becomes master of all domains. Could she be becoming the free-willed omnibeing for which Zereth Mortis was the protype, the analog of fleshly to the prototype’s mechanism? All these attacks must occur, and all fail, in order to complete her “education” and ascendance?
She's his wife. That's why he tried to free her. The forbidden marriage. (or at least, they hooked up) But, she also told him "I can't be without you, i cannot lose you twice! If they brake us apart, kill me instead." But he failed... They also porked, and now she's pregnant, about to give birth to the ultimate mutant who'll be able to rule the universe.
They did say that we can't always be the good guys . What if those who didn't side with Sylvanas are the bad guys. I think Azeroth called for Sylvanas to be Warchief.
Found a few books and 1 book that you only see you can interact with if you mouse over. In the Erathy light hippies in the midle lower ground between the stone dwarfs and spiders. Havent searches EVERY house but there are some books there that iv found.
I don't know if politics consumed my UA-cam or what but every other video I see is yours a ton I've never seen...I love it! I got some catching up to do
Love your Videos great listen with the lore and story. How it had evolve of the years and history changing though out Warcraft. What I think is Azeroth a neutral entity and all sides in the war are trying to get the world on there side. We have seem some aspect of what each side but not fully with Order, Chaos, Death, Void and Light. Life is something we have no fully explored yet and would like what their goal with Azeroth.
I still stand by the lore that azeroth is the soul of order everything we do is just hold balance on all of the extremes we come across and whoever would get control of said soul who turn the tides of the cosmic war.
With Azeroth being influenced by all cosmic powers, I think she will awaken with all those powers becoming the being that will bring balance to the cosmos. Also, if Azeroth influenced the earthen, whats not to say she also influenced the old gods?
Well then, I knew this is going this way :D Titans are bunch of business corporate rats that just want to overtake everything. I knew that Zovaal's story will come somewhere
Should have it where some being come to azeroth, with a giant army taking over everything, the person in charge goes from planet to planet absorbing the power of each worldsoul, and everything we've done in the game has drawn attention to azeroth, the big bad wins and takes over the world soul (essentially the players are the actual villains). All the big players in the story line essentially die in the final fight and portals are opened up to a new world where we and others escape to, essentially resetting the game, where we are no longer the "hero".
My theory is that Azeroth Is the origin of all the universe forces light, dark, life, death, ect; the Titans, even though they descended from her, they imprisoned it because they saw it as chaos that went against their ordering.
So once Sargaeras shattered Worldcore with his sword, Xalatath gained access to Worldsoul, starting influencing it with darknsess, and becasue fo this, Hallowfall crystall started shifting?
i mean yeah it is a prison but like what are us azerothians suppose to do, break every single force keeping the universe together? insert tony stark "im sorry but azeroth is closed today."
I would bet that Sargeras wanted to simply remove the Titan's toy from the equation, as his last revenge. I don't think he should be considered a "hero". He would of, if he hadn't been recalled back to the Seat of the Pantheon, used Azeroth like he did Argus but because he was running out of time, and knew it, he did the one last thing he could do and that is, if he can't have Azeroth, nobody else can or should, including the Titans. If you had knowledge of your enemies, insider knowledge, would you not want to sabotage the thing that they consider most important? However, what confuses me is, if Azeroth *is* so important to the Titans and they witnessed him stab Azeroth, why have they not returned to check the damage and commence repairs? What knowledge do they hold of Azeroth? Do they still believe that because they ordered the planet that their safety guards are in working shape? Wild theory here but, I don't think the Titans are coming back. I don't think they CAN come back. I think we're going to have to go to them and we're going to find out their fate, because its weird to me that they have this worldcore, this big whole matrix they are needing and not once do they check in on it, to ensure it is working or not corrupted, and I think there is a good reason for that.
The Earthen are not the chosen people. Azeroth just cried out and do to what ever properties the titans gave the Earthen, they were the most receptive to the call.
I think azeroth as the "prime" world soul is responsible for the universe existing, and if any one power is able to infuse azeroth with enough of their flavour of magic will then effect EVERYTHING when she wakes up how ever she wakes up, be is a suden wound from a fell infused sword or when she is "suposed" to awaken, to all the powers she is like a weapon a big old reset button, and the final move of sargeras was to either destroy/wake azeroth with a suden jolt of fell magic that she would wake up and BOOM universe reset and due to the vast amount of fell he would "win" this goes for all the powers some are playing the long game like the old gods, titan, and light, and zoval and sargeras were going to do it in one big instant blast, and the enemy zoval was "warning" us about at the end instead of trying to all work together was a power outside the ones we know succeeding in infusing the world soul with all flavours for a multi colour reset.
I mean, the (extremely shady) Primus is seen as the Death God of this hell of war that is Maldraxxus, so by that alone he should be somehow good at tactic. Tactic without strategy is a certain way to an awful defeat, though. Strategy is WAY more important.
Light and Order were always thought of as "good", but we've seen time and time again how impositive they can be. Meanwhile, the Jailer - someone wronged by the Titans** (edit: Pantheon of Death) - wanted to set Azeroth free (and use her good stuff for something, maybe push the Titans away or fight the Void Lords), and the Old Gods just want her good stuff to do bad stuff (setting themselves free, spread chaos, yadda yadda). What if the master Il'gynoth mentions is not N'zoth, but whoever Azeroth turns into (supposedly something greater than a Void Lord) when influenced by the Old Gods - and we follow her? Remember they don't experience time linearly.
The Jailer never meet the Titans he was wronged by the Pantheon of Death. Argus didn't ruin the Mechanism of Death until after the Jailer was sent into the Maw. Personally I think Azeroth is one of the 1st Ones.
@@Hellfire918this is the line of thinking I subscribe to. Like the precursors from Jak and Daxter, the progenitors are (possibly) not gone but rather in stasis. In this case taking the form of a (prime) world soul. This doesn’t address the 7th force, which is an idea that intrigued me and I hope will not go unexplained. The rogue hero spec ‘Fatebound’ keeps me hopeful that we will learn the canon relationship between Fate and Free Will, and whether or not Azeroth represents this concept.
Hi Nobble¡ great video as always. Do you think dragons will be included in the "azeroth army", given that azeroth reascended them to aspectral power? Regarding the feelings from azeroth, are they feelings or SENSATIONS? feeling pain, sorrow or conscience doesnt mean decision making. I think its really curious to consider.
I think so. Think that a lot of things we see at the end of dragonflight were menat for the future (aspects/tyr return, maybe elisande timeline bit) + this flows nicely with velen's prophecy from his short story.
She's building her Empire in the Maw right now (I mean, really, what do peopel think to put something like her there, she will just raise another Forsaken army, bigger than ever before).
Sylvanus wasn't talking about Azeroth, the being, she was talking about the cosmic cycle of mortality and being reborn in the shadowlands. She wasn't right, it's a coincidence of wording.
It's not unlikely that Xalatath is somehow a part of Azeroth that was cut off mabye in the process of the Titans' first tries to corrupt Azeroth. It's also not unlikely that the "upstart goddess" Elune was created that way...
i'm looking really far here, but with everything the titans did, with their need to absolutely control everything, i'm looking forward to fighting them one by one in azeroths behalf as the final final boss of wow itself. on the way we're probably fighting both light and void, but that's where it's at for me. and hell, you can give each titan their own patch. we killed a titan already - argus. so why not step up to the pantheon with azeroths powers of freedom in our back. for supereeaaaaaaaaaaarth.. uh.. azeroooooth!
What is the timeline on sargeras becoming a fell god? Like he was a good titan before the legion. Did he go all demon lord before the other titans did stuff on azeroth or before?
![The Story of Garrosh Hellscream - Full Version [Lore]](/img/n.gif)
I have an idea, and it aligns with Metzen's story tropes in the past.
In confining Azeroth, they did keep the Void from reaching her, but they also kept the Light from reaching her, and as she's matured, the only sources she could grow from, were those of the mortals on her surface.
So she is not a nascent Void Lord, or a baby Titan. She's instead what a World Soul becomes when it comes from the center of Cosmic energies. Something new and distinct from both of them.
You're on the right track, there is a huge theory that Azeroth is more.. omnipotent in the sense that it's not only Light and Shadow, but the entire cosmos tree that she drew from on the surface. So Light, and Shadow, Life and Death, Order and Disorder, I would argue the most prominent theory now for Azeroth is - she is a product of what happens when a Worldsoul is exposed to all the cosmos energies. Because she infact, has, throughout Warcraft's history, been exposed to a metric-fuckton of each in their own unique way that has influenced the planet, and us, greatly.
So this is mostly likely - and would make sense as to why some of the Titan lines even echoed that Azeroth was stronger than Sargeras, is because by the time the titans have encountered her, her Worldsoul more than likely encountered Void, and Death - then the titans meddling mixed in Order, and Life etc etc.
@@ShadowKallig At this point it feels less and less likely that most of the cosmic forces even existed as this extreme of a state and that they were just cut out from something that existed before it, what also led to this giant conflict what is driven by the need to regain this natural, undived form and at the same time being dominated by the PoV of the extremes, that they should be the one in control.
Especially the whole Light/Void duality points in that direction. Life/Death are clearly seperated while seeming to be artificial and mainly for mortals which also came a long time after that creation and in many cases just from one cosmic force (in case of Azeroth mortals for example mainly from Titans then 'corrupted/altered' further).
The only real cosmic force coupla in utter despite of each other seems to be Order and Fel and while people seem to see chaos as naturally evil, they shouldn't forget that the extreme of Order is plain fascism and the Titans show over and over again that they ARE that extreme. As long as you follow their order, you are fine, sure. You are absolutely not when you dare to take one step outside of it...
@@miriamweller812 I feel like different factions push worldsouls to become different thing, something like a stemcell. However they can also develop on their own, Azeroth being kind of special and experiencing tons of chaos just grew on its own outside designs of other factions. This could play nicely on considerations of free will, personhood etc. and could be used for exciting and intellectually interesting story.
but the Titans arent creatures of light, but order
id vager shes gonna awaken in all the colours of the cosmic rainbow
@LiveErrors but order is born of light.
The Alliance? Toy soldiers in tin plate ✅️
The Horde? Beasts braying for honor ✅️
This world? A prison ✅️
Queen is 3 for 3
she still has simps, oh dear lol
@@Hauntedhighheel just him have this he’s on a roll…
@@Hauntedhighheel even Azshara has a cult around her Sylvanas's cult is more of a rookie thing compare to that. and umm... The Dark Lady is merciful, may she forgave your insolence.
Victory, for Sylvanas!
Being right dosen't change that she was raging ahole & hypocrite about it.
Taurens - Earthmother: Azeroth, Skyfather: Titans, totally nailed it 😆
i watch all your vids, love the lore of warcraft
Ohh, this REALLY recontextualizes when Magni released Azeroth's energy into the newly awakened earthen. I just clicked a random teleporter and found myself in what I assume is the new Earthen starting area, the Awakening Machine, and there was a book there. The earthen was musing on the nature of the souls and their free will. Even just today I bumped into a random earthen in Boralus which lead me to another one sightseeing in Vash'jir. *They're not like the other earthen.* What Magni did changed them.
The curse of soul?
She was probably about to awaken at some point but the titans forcefully put her to sleep, that’s why there’s like the dream and nightmare theme all over and I think the old gods always mention that the song that is sang is also "theirs"
I am not surprised if Azeroth would ever lash out. Like would you be happy existing inside a cage constantly being pocked and prodded by all the other cosmic forces
Sylvanas and Illidan carry the the biggest signs saying,"You may hate me but you will be grateful for what I did for you 😝".
Xal'atath is working in favour of Xal'atath. But I would love if Azeroth is manipulating it (nudging in the right direction) to free herself. After millennia of watching us Azeroth pick up few this.
this bit of lore has me thinking that everyone is bad now, titans just wanted azeroth for her power, sargeras did, and void lords all the same but now here we are to mess all 3 of them up to get her free on her own from everyone's influence
I feel like your right, except I wouldn't be surprised if we find out Sargeras went mad in his struggle to free Azeroth. He was once the champion of the Pantheon, maybe he went crazy being the only being in the universe struggling to free her.
It doesn't mean that they're "bad". Simply that interests do not align. The Titan pantheon still have protected Azeroth many times and done good many times. It's simply in their nature to want to order things. That doesn't mean they're evil.
It's in the nature of every conscious being that arose from a particular cosmic force to seek out the expansion of it's own realm above all others.
These beings are not good nor bad per se.
Most azerothians are by-products of the order pantheon's works (or have been deeply influenced by this) so it's natural for it's denizens to desire aligning themselves with order, light and life magic above all others.
If something good came out of the Shadowlands lore-wise is that it showed us a realm shaped by death, necromantic and shadow magic that is not only completely functional but also a vital cogwheel in the machinery of the universe.
Do the dragons know now the Titans’ true machinations?
@@zasshulad2619 I mean they are actively, and have in the past, fucked with the nature of Azeroth and her children. I mean, the whole point of dragon flight was the incarnates were actually right, and that the titans manipulated the dragons and forced them into changing their nature in order to serve their will. Sure, the caressed our cheeks and "helped" secure their interests when things were beginning to get bad. But it still doesn't change the fact it was done out of a selfish nature of persevering their order. Everything they did was taking our influence for granted. I'm sure with the legion gone and the void being handled, when the titans return to Azeroth, they will end up being just as bad as the void, legion, or even Zovaal.
18:40 I think the most straightforward impression is he was aiming at the prison, if not Azeroth herself. So his initial goal by encompassing the world was to corrupt her directly into another Dark Titan, then as we yanked him off he went "screw this, if I can't have her, nobody can!" and stabbed as hard as he could, hoping to weaken or break the prison enough that Azeroth is loosed from the grasp of the other titans.
As far as "this world is a prison" interpreting I still like that conspiracy video by Xaxxas that essentially implies that "The Shadowlands" is itself another construct by the titans trying to order the realm of death. A bit of a convoluted interpretation, but it does make more sense out of the Jailer and Sylvanas's motivations. The notion basically being that Zereth Mortis and all that is also titan infrastructure using Azeroth's "prime worldsoul" essence to order the other cosmic domains.
This could be it or maybe it was such a surprise that he just flung the sword in the general direction to cause maximum damage. Because he is a spiteful oaf like that :P
If Azeroth is the centre of everything it stands to reason that she needs ALL the cosmic energies (light, void, life, death, order, disorder) in order to become this special beeing. Maybe Azeroth's supposed to bring ballance to all these forces in the end. But I guess if that happens there will be no more war in Warcraft.
„You were supposed to destroy the Sith, not join them“
It’s funny how Sylvanas is right but only by coincidence.
And no, xal'atath is working for herself.
Sylvanas was right by the story of SL, LMAO
@@TrueStiven LMAO do you still believe she had any right, knowledge or control? The Death system worked well. The only change that was needed was in Bastion. She was angry that families were being separated, but as we can see, there was no ban on traveling between dimensions. She was the Jailer puppet all this time. He used her, lied to her, and threw her away when she was no longer useful. Just like Sylvanas did with the Horde. Poetic justice
Sylvanas talked about mortals being condemned by the system to have no control over their life nor death nor life in death. This is absolutely clear and only clickbaiter or idiots would make anything different out of it after Sylvanas CONSTANTLY talked about what she meant in SL.
@@marcinbiay1074 Player was nothing else as the other Death Gods' puppet and without Sylvanas nothing would have changed at all. She didn't reach her final goal thanks to the betrayel but she reached a lot and it was ONLY because of her.
The player character and their NPC masters only focussed on her the whole time, what was stupid anyway, since killing her would have changed nothing at all, in contrary.
The main reason she was needed for had been "opening the veil", everything after that was at best a bonus and she wasns't crucial for that when it came to Zovaal's plan to use Zereth Mortis for his own goal.
There isn't one time when the other Death Gods are questioned, especially the one who actually created Domination Magic.
And Bastion the problem? The fake Arbiter machine isn't? Maldraxxus is sheer hell, an eternity on a warfield in endless struggle, only a brainwashed gamer would find that acceptable as long as they are not actually sent there and get what endless condamnation this fate would be. Revendreth is purgatory, so yeah... also not really something you would like at all. Ardenweald? That's just for VERY few beings. Pretty much no mortal will go there - and it's likely heavily corrupted by the Titans, who - don't forget - created the Emerald Dream Ardenwald is somehow heavily linked to... (and interesting backdoor into the Realm of Death for the Titans, no?).
sylvanas was just poorly written in that expansion, they are basically pretending the expansion didn't happen which is the right thing to do.
really excited to see where the story goes as we get closer to Midnight.
Seems like it will go Deeper
Sylvanas was ahead of her time. I hate hiw she was written in Shadowlands after the Jailer betrayed her.
I will never serrrrve she says while serving consistently.
@@gohomehero 🤡
Honestly the way they should’ve played it is having two halves of her soul meet like different personas (akin to Uther) and have the “good” one with memories merely up to her death by Arthas, but have their own unique damages; but then later work with Tyrande through the guidance of Elune to have the good half absorb the other darker half and become “whole”
At least that way you’d manage to get both the redemption AND the vengeance carried out via “kill” in one Fel-swoop.
@@Aussielight That would be stupid. Tyrande won’t ever work with Sylvanas.
I hate how she was written from BFA all the way through shadow lands.
at 17:12 the word you're looking for is "benevolent" - personally, I hate it when I'm thinking of a word and it just doesn't come, so I'm just trying to help with that : )
I'm getting a Star Wars prequel vibe from all this. Xalatath is like count dooku making an army which forces us to make an earthen army... just for it to turn on us...
I think it would be interesting to see Azeroth not as this benevolent holy and sacred soul of the world, but to see her more angry and resentful the way we saw Argus. Maybe we can help her before all hope is lost, so she doesn't quite become so tortured that she only knows pain and rage, but still have a focus on being a victim of the titans and every other cosmological force.
I've had a similar hope as well. Not a nurturing, motherly character but more like an angry older sister. Who's sick of everyone's shit. I'm also hoping Azeroth's somewhat mentally immature in a way. She doesn't pop out with loads of exposition knowing every darn thing but instead is still also making sense of the universe and her place in it.
there is a multiple theroys out there that say argus was part of Azeroth. Cause why does some scenes show blue in her soul and later not anymore :)
Argus will be a really important thing later on im sure of it.
She has already endured eons of elemental lord wars, the old god's corruption, the troll empires mining her kazarite, several burning legion invasions, US mining her Azerite and being stabbed with a blade by planet sized satan. I'm not sure what we mortals can do to win her over after all that.
@@Boxkar24 Be careful with that, though, nothing is more annoying than a powerful, utterly alien being that just acts like a random human teenage girl (or boy). We got this often enough, becasue it's simply lazy writing.
@@miriamweller812 True, and I assume a being of her stature learns at seriously high geometric rate, what human can learn in a centaury she learns in a few picoseconds.
they got realy good in tiyng the story together. As they intruduced the earthen at first I wasn't really impressed but with the story of the expansion they grew much more on me than dracthyr for example They represent the story shift from titan-focused to azeroth-focused in such a beautiful way. they are like the players(gameplaywise) compelled by rather strict rules . They take the role of magni as connection to azeroth but by making it a whole playable race. and the story really fills in a lot of plotholes right at the start of the worldsoul saga, wich is great. seems like they're finally finding out of the mess that was created since wod.
Sargeras' motives for stabbing Azeroth to me remain the same as when Legion ended. A last ditch effort to destroy Azeroth and ensure that the void lords would never get the chance to twist Azeroth's world soul into a void corrupted titan. Though i do recall somewhere in 7.3 that Sargeras intended to harness Azeroth's power in a similar way that he harnessed Argus' world soul to regenerate his demonic forces more quickly.
Now that we know Azeroth was in a prison, I actually think Sargaras was attempting to stab the shield that was containing her.
Off-topic, I saw the whisper of Furyw and it made me realise how much I miss the leveling series of Furyw and you. Was always a joy to see them pandas.
Amazing work as always. “Benevolent” force is what you were looking for, Benign is like “non-threatening” or “inert” so still close.
Random question but do you think the world soul saga will touch on the themes we left off in shadowlands? Or is it more likely that Metzen’s vision and the original story don’t have room for the First Ones?
Unless I’m missing something, this seemingly implies that the Earthen stumbled upon something 5,000 years before TWW that caused someone to wipe their memory. Probably too many of them exposed to the world soul. Between memory wiping machines and life resetting machines, the Titans are sounding like bad guys
There still isn't a single shred of proof for that though....... literally all we have is unreliable narrator interpretations by Dagran, who I don't trust for objective knowledge.... who hears something from Archaedas, who I don't trust for objective knowledge.... who heard something from Khaz'goroth, who doesn't have objective knowledge either. I don't even think any of the Titans are bad guys except Sargeras, and maybe Eonar.
The light is starting to look like the bad guy and always has been. Scarlet crusade foreshadowed it in vanilla.
We know that the Earthen are scheduled to regularly go on an wipe their memories in the Archives. Could be a safety measure by the Titans to make sure they don't break free.
EDIT: I also wouldn't say the Titans are "bad guys". Just like every other force, they have their own agenda. A lot of the time our goals aligned, that's why they and their forces were allies in the past, but we have butted heads with Titan machines since Vanilla, so it's not new.
The most obvious reason for the mind wipe is the Titans "repairing" them.
There is this theater event where the Earthen tell the story about this tyrannic Keeper servant they got rid of with the help of the Keeper (if that is actually truth or just brainswashed into them who knows).
At the end of it, when his body is dragged away, he threatens the earthen with the wrath of his sister Galan.
Under water you can find "Galan's Edikt":
""I, Watcher Galan, erect this monument to forever be a warning. The earthen shall know the wrath of the titans if they defy their will again.
From this day forward, they will be bound more tightly to my will and that of our titan overlords. If they again defy us or the titans no longer require their aid, they will be forcefully deactivated with extreme prejudice.
Such is my will.
Such is the will of the titans.""
So it's pretty clear that the Eartens WERE force into line after that and even tighter than before.
@@laertesindeed Uh, they have shown that their order is a fascist extreme often enough. Sure, just like the human fascists, you are fine as long as you are accepting their laws. But good luck if you go against any single part of it.
For some reason peopel see "order" as naturally good, but order can stand for absolute everything. 2.WW germany was an extrem rule of order...
Just like "freedom", "state", "law" and many other terms, order can stand for many different things, from good to absolute evil.
Slavery is a form of order. Genocide is a form of order. Again: "Order" by itself means nothing.
Nice to hear your wonderful voice again
I don't see this from the disc quest at all. It was Dagran making an interpretation, after hearing Archaedas make an interpretation, who heard something from Khaz'goroth that is an interpretation. We don't have any objective information that the core chamber is anything other than good.
Further...... if the Azeroth World Soul was speaking to Magni back in Legion, then it "WANTED" him to save the Titans in their legion captivity. That voice which he calls a "she" wanted him to help the Titans. Objectively. Irrefutably. Undeniably. That voice also "WANTED" Magni to repair the Heart Chamber. And that voice "WANTED" Magni to save and repair the Awakening Machine in ringing deeps. Now, either that voice was the Azeroth World Soul and all of the above means she likes the Titans..... or.......... that voice is not Azeroth and never was. If that voice is from the Light instead of the world soul....then that voice could be the same as how the Naaru spoke into our minds during Burning Crusade on Outland. And if indeed that voice is from the Light, then it could have been speaking through the crystal Thraegar just like it sometimes speaks through crystalline naaru. This could genuinely mean that the Light was using the thraegar back then to break through the core chamber so they could force the Light upon the Azeroth World Soul. Or...... what is also possible, is that since the Light is an equal and opposite of the Void, that various Void voices and whispers were corrupting the Thraegar and making them attack the core chamber, again so the void could get into the core and force Void upon the world soul.
Or maybe the voice always was Azeroth, and she wanted to save the Titans in Legion cause only with their help did we stand a chance against Sargeras. She wanted to fix the Chamber of Heart maybe because it is a tool capable of healing, communicating and infusing anything regardless of order alignment into her. Finally she did herself through Magni repurpose the Awakening Machine to make/wake earthen with free will, ones that would easily align with her.
@@Nullermanden If your head canon is true, that means the azeroth world soul is Dominating earthen, and enslaving them to do only what she wants. She is more dangerous than Zovaal........ "if" your head canon is true. Which it does not have to be.
@@laertesindeed It seems my reply came off as rude and dismissive of your hypothesis while that was not at all my intention. Sorry.
I only wanted to present another explanation of these events that I think is more plausible.
Also saying that Azeroth is giving Earthen free will is not to me comparable to saying she is dominating them, while yes, the result seems to be that they will ally with her.
Of course the prime world soul is more dangerous than Zoval. I don't think anyone would deny that.
PS: While your hypothesis seems to me like it makes unfair assumptions about Azeroth's feelings, I do quite like it. :)
@@Nullermanden In reverse order.... I didn't make any assumptions about the feelings of any world soul inside Azeroth....I simply listed what a voice told Magni to do in past expansions which is "not" consistent with having any negative intentions toward the Titans. It is still undecided whether that voice Magni was hearing was from the azeroth world soul or from the Light; which is why I had to list out two If-Then statements. Next....we have absolutely no evidence that Azeroth was giving free will to new Earthen in the awakening machine recently; all the lore in game says that Earthen had been made and then tested to see if there was any void corruption and if there was, they'd be redownloaded into a new body and tested again. Moreover, that Earthen made from the awakening machine in ancient Khaz Algar were also occassionally showing a free will that made them question their jobs.....and it was this ancient free will that allowed them to rebel against the bad choices of Dornic and Galan......something which they were congratulated on, by the way, when the Keeper who was higher in the hierarchy than Dornic and Galan were showed up and said what Dornic and Galan did was not acceptable. That Keeper told the Earthen they would never have to be ruled by any watchers like those....so again, demonstrating the Titans were not enemies of free will. The Titans and titankeepers "have" free will.....according to the journal writings of an Earthen who left his job and joined the freysworn; because the free will he already had long in the past was reiminiscent in what he believed the titankeepers and Titans to have already.
Lastly, nope.....I didn't see any rudeness in your reply. And while I think that people with headcanon making videos as content creators are increasingly a problem for fans of the "real" lore......... that doesn't mean that every time I identify someone as having head canon, that somehow I am demeaning them. I am not. Because it is possible for you to have a head canon and you're not claiming that is what the game showed. Whereas those problematic content creators "do" use their channels to make false claims about what the game actually shows or logically supports.
@@laertesindeed But then again you did seem to assume that the voice wouldn't have helped the Titans if it despised them, which would not be true if the survival of the voice or something of comparable importance depended on helping the Titans. Enemies of enemies aren't necessarily friends, but I would, like you, not assume that the voice regards the Titans as enemies either, only that the voice, if being Azeroth, would have told Magni these things regardless so as to survive.
About free will; we have no evidence that Azeroth gave free will, but wether it be by time alone or exposure to the Coreway ancient earthen on Khaz Algar gain the ability to have feelings and to rebel, and those newly activated have feelings and wills unbound by edicts from the get go. As is written in the Reconstructed Ledger earthen don't usually have these qualities, which I read to mean that they weren't part of their original design and that the Titan edicts have no control over the new ones. This is not something the Titans are known to be against, but it is inconvenient to not have them follow edicts which is why the colossi are walking in land after they all renounce the edicts.
I would read them but can't find these journal writings of an Earthen who left his job and joined the freysworn. Can you site them, please?
A little silliness from my side: The reason I call these things hypotheses are that to me headcanon was what someone believe unwavering without it being canon potentially ever, while hypotheses are ideas one can discuss as openly as we here do.
In my head I see Azeroth as a proud adoptive mother of a bunch of kids with gremlin energy.
The things things that make them weak ultimately make them strong. The Curse of Flesh taught the Titanforged how to fight for survival. The Orcs were an invading force and now are among the greatest champions.
"I don't care if you're a god. If you put 20 of my kids in one room, and they don't stand in the glowing circles, they will kill you."
@RodimusUnleashed "The Alliance would rather side with the Horde over the Titans"
That's what called MCU writing.
NO, Sylvanas was not talking about the world soul, she was being poetic about our lives.
Obviously, but social media clowns love to parrot the shit they make up for some reason.
Sylvansa explained over and over again what she meants, anyone with half a brain cell should have gotten it.
Hmmm kind of. She wasn't talking specifically about the world soul being trapped in a titan machine, but it's still in the ballpark. She was talking about the structures of creation itself being a prison. The Jailer was going to use the world soul, too. This story is about souls and free will, which is Sylvanas' playground.
@@miriamweller812 Shasowlands still doesn't have great writing.
I stick to the idea that Azeroth represents "free will". If Domination magic is a thing, then "Freedom" magic might be its own. It makes sense that it's a Prime Worldsoul, because it has the freedom to become whatever it wants to be. So if it wants to support the Titans, then that shifts the balance and makes them win. Same for the Void. The Dragon Aspects can wield Titan-like magic and remain unchanged, because its the same magic but not beholden to the titans.
Yeah, I think "(free) Will" is the seventh force that was already hinted at, because it's the one thing that opposes all other forces.
I think the same and I think this could lead to a interesting and mature story if they wanted to explore the ideas of free will and destiny. WoW audience is now in their 30s mostly probably so why not.
@@EnhancedNightmare It's just MCU tier writing.
"This place is a prison
And these people aren't your friends
Inhaling thrills through $20 bills
And the tumblers are drained and then flooded again
And again
Ther're guards at the on ramps armed to the teeth
And you may case the grounds from the cascades to puget sound,
But you are not permitted to leave
I know there's a big world out there like the one i saw on the screen
In my living room late last night,
It was almost too bright to see
And i know that it's not a party if it happens every night
Pretending there's glamour and candelabra
When you're drinking by candlelight
What does it take to get a drink in this place?
What does it take, how long must i wait?
what does it take to get a drink in this place?
what does it take, how long must i wait?
How long must i wait?"
-"This Place Is A Prison" by The Postal Service
Sorry I got distracted and sang this entire song, instrumental parts included. What were we talking about?
Xalatath wants to take azeroth's power for herself. she's aligning with the void as it's the most powerful way for her to get what she wants. if she were working for the void lords, it'd be more like a business arrangement. The War Within = the war within mortal beings, as well as the war within azeroth herself. she is fighting with the void's corruption, good vs bad. i believe she wants to be free because she stands a better chance at defending herself that way. i mean look at it this way, she's trapped in a room and someone stabbed her and she had no way of defending herself. not to mention, she's been aware this entire time about all the horrible ways entities have tried to kill her. imagine you're trapped in a room and outside that room things are constantly trying to kill you. she is traumatised. she has ptsd. she wants to leave that room to be free to make her own choices. the titans are trying to force her to be good, entities want her to be bad. maybe she can exist as both? what if the war within is just making peace with the good parts of yourself as well as the bad? it's about making peace with the choices you've made, and moving on past the trauma. i believe anduin's story directly reflects azeroths struggles. she could exist as a light and void being, like calia menethil.
For the Dark Lady ....always
First the planet lures us with a song and now its siren isle? World soul my ass, there's a giant siren prison down there. Its Britney!
We get to the final raid of The Last Titan and the opening line for the final boss is “It’s Britney, bitch.” 🤣
They shared a moment where azeroth stared into sargeras eye...what was said maybe she ask him to save her
I like your idea you said a while ago, where Xal'atath is the part of Azeroth that is corrupted by the void.
Kinda like a split personality type of thing. Both see differently but want the same thing.
hey man, thanks for the vid. Sylvanas 🦐will be happy now. The writing of this game has become so bad though, I genuinely don't understand how people enjoy the modern writing in retail WoW... i find most if not all of the characters to be insufferable
She’s still in shadowlands looking over the maw. Her return will be epic, much like Illidians in part 3 of this saga. Or it better be.
@scott6430 They'll do that when they run out of options and/or need to get buzz.
I think the World Soul is some sort of cosmic entity of immense potential that has yet to mature into its full power, whatever that may be, and as it grows it can be influenced by the Cosmic forces around it.
All of the cosmos seems to be at war with each other (the ultimate War in Warcraft’s universe). Life, Death, Chaos, Void, Light, and Order are all against each other in some sort of eternal stalemate and Azeroth’s worldsoul is the one thing that can tip the scales in one side’s favor enough for them to overpower the rest.
As far as I know, unless they're trying to retcon some things, Sargeras just wanted to destroy all world souls so they couldn't be corrupted and become ultra powerful beings that even the titans wouldn't be able to stop. I do like the retcon this time though, the fact that he might've wanted to do it because he learned of the titans schemes works okay too.
that mog.... gets me every time
TLDR they have no idea what direction they’re taking with the lore
It's ABSOLUTE clear that they planed their whole story since years and only change details.
It's prettys insane how Blizzard holds together such a massive story over so many years without creating gaping plot holes.
Something most movies are unable to in a ~2 hour plot line.
@@miriamweller812 You must think the MCU is high tier and relevant to reality. And also say that about New Star Wars and Benedict Cumberbatch's Sherlock/other quirky Brit show and anything else praised by reddit/tumblr/other like approved weeb stuff.
In the staff of sargeras lore in the Warlock orderhall it's explained that sargeras glimpsed azeroths soul and becamr infatuated with her. I think from that point on his motivations may have skewed from commit mass delete to smth else
Garrosh AND Sylvanas have done nothing wrong!
I mean, we knew Azeroth was a prison for the old gods since ulduar, at least.
They changed the meaning of said prison, but what she said was right before shadowlands was even an idea.
Wait, Chamber of Heart? Is that Daddy Dagoth Ur's bedroom? May I come in? 😳
Come, Nerevar.
We still have the Anti-Titan Iridikron roaming around somewhere. If you want to get to the center of the world, his powers would seem useful.
I think that Sargaras was aiming for the world core, that if Sargaras wanted too, he could have cut the world in two. He was aiming at something, the world core. I’m willing to bet you, if we make it through the coreway to the world core, we will find the pointy end of Sargaras’s sword poking through.
Alright since the Queen was right, bring her and boy Nathanos back and let’s get Calia at the of The Horde.
Nah. The Horde will just remain a council, and that will somehow work because the writers say so.
This is a fantasy game with alien planets and battle robots, and THAT to me is the most unrealistic thing in the whole franchise.
@@donjezza10 Why shouldn't it work? The Horde is made for that more than anything else, since it's a clusterf*ck of outsiders. Actually you either need sheer tyranny to rule that or something like at least a coucil, where the different parts of this clusterf*ck at least FEEL represented.
@aidanfedorochko3728 They already made Sylvanas say Fascist talking points.
The subscription was a prison, then The Dark Lady left… then I had no reason to stay🧂💀🦇
TWW > Shadowlands. Tho
@@slime8177 Thats what I call a low bar sir. I loved the questing and the lore of TWW but I have no strong reason to continue subbing after reaching end game and achieving some things.
Cool leave then
@@mast3734imagine still playing world of Warcraft
@mast3734 ha you sound like me talking to the screaming democrats😹🧂🇺🇸 I did, but in love and memory as an Ali turned Horde pre BC and ever since a passionate PvPer. But the quality slipped to far when the game went unity/woke
World of the Woke-Cra…🤦♂️
So how I'm seeing this: The Titans wanted only Titan Influence, Azaroth knows that only one influence is bad, so got the Thraegar to sabotage the worldcore(tm) to insure a balance of influences.
What if Zoval was working for Azeroth the whole time
Maybe Sargaras looked at the eye of Azeroth and fell in love. And she said that she is imprisoned and so he rallied the burning legion to go free her (is it overkill? No. As you see, the forces against him was able to stop him even with that). You can see that before he stabbed her, he was doing that weird creepy cuddle thing with the planet until the clouds were lifted. Maybe he was working on lockpicking until he was pulled away by the titans, and so he was like, “Uh, no time. I hope this can help you break free!” It was after that point that Azeroth had enough voice to reach those on the surface so even though she bled her prison was damaged so she could work out her freedom?
he looked at the eye of amanthul and now he wants that amanthussy
Great, now I imagine Sargeras humping the planet under that cloud cover while licking a vulvano or so... -.-
I don’t think they’ll retcon Sargeras’ motivations behind the Burning Crusade. It seems reasonable that his Plan A could still be the destruction of Azeroth to keep it from the void’s hands. Once it’s obvious he won’t get that chance, he plunges the sword into the planet to fracture the the prison the Titans had built around her, giving her a fighting chance to resist the Void with her own means.
And then follows BFA in which she immediately begins setting pieces in play to defend her. Magni, Heart of Azeroth wielding champions, empowering denizens of the planet with her very blood, (slight detour to the afterlife), reclaiming the Dragons, and now the radiant song.
Ma queen is always right
she slumbered, now she got stabbed and woken up, and she is like hell nah
I got a theory here me out. The Old Gods where and are Azeroth's defense mechanism - it's here fears and her nightmares, a reflection of her inner psyche attempting to defend the beautiful light within - aka the world soul. That is my wild theory but a more plausible question is do we think this is why Yogg was able to introduce the Curse of Flesh to the Titanic keepers? It was actually a gift from Azeroth through a curse of an Old God? Like using the enemies magic to the betterment of ourselves? Like how we have accepted Warlocks, Demon Hunters, and Death Knights into our alliances and hordes? Idk shits getting wild.
Perhaps Azeroth is predestined to be touched by each node on the axes of cosmic power. So far, Light, Fel, Chaos, Life, Death, primordial elements. Infused by all powers, she becomes master of all domains. Could she be becoming the free-willed omnibeing for which Zereth Mortis was the protype, the analog of fleshly to the prototype’s mechanism? All these attacks must occur, and all fail, in order to complete her “education” and ascendance?
...Next Xpace after the world soul saga, 'The Jailer did nothing wrong!'.
She's his wife. That's why he tried to free her. The forbidden marriage. (or at least, they hooked up)
But, she also told him "I can't be without you, i cannot lose you twice! If they brake us apart, kill me instead."
But he failed...
They also porked, and now she's pregnant, about to give birth to the ultimate mutant who'll be able to rule the universe.
Devious work right there
They did say that we can't always be the good guys . What if those who didn't side with Sylvanas are the bad guys. I think Azeroth called for Sylvanas to be Warchief.
Kel'thuzad's right to a point. And he highlights several flaws with dalaran and the mages there. And how they ran things.
Found a few books and 1 book that you only see you can interact with if you mouse over. In the Erathy light hippies in the midle lower ground between the stone dwarfs and spiders. Havent searches EVERY house but there are some books there that iv found.
I don't know if politics consumed my UA-cam or what but every other video I see is yours a ton I've never seen...I love it! I got some catching up to do
Love your Videos great listen with the lore and story. How it had evolve of the years and history changing though out Warcraft. What I think is Azeroth a neutral entity and all sides in the war are trying to get the world on there side. We have seem some aspect of what each side but not fully with Order, Chaos, Death, Void and Light. Life is something we have no fully explored yet and would like what their goal with Azeroth.
9:49 the customizable main character in cutscenes:
With the exception of her newfound guilt, I’ve always failed to see how Sylvanas didn’t get everything she wanted in the end.
@loganstickler7237 Do you think Black Panther and other MCU stuff is relevant to reality
I still stand by the lore that azeroth is the soul of order everything we do is just hold balance on all of the extremes we come across and whoever would get control of said soul who turn the tides of the cosmic war.
Actually, it’s prisons all the way up, prisons all the way down; just as they are in a azerothian prison, we exist in a gnostic prison.
With Azeroth being influenced by all cosmic powers, I think she will awaken with all those powers becoming the being that will bring balance to the cosmos. Also, if Azeroth influenced the earthen, whats not to say she also influenced the old gods?
Well then, I knew this is going this way :D
Titans are bunch of business corporate rats that just want to overtake everything.
I knew that Zovaal's story will come somewhere
Should have it where some being come to azeroth, with a giant army taking over everything, the person in charge goes from planet to planet absorbing the power of each worldsoul, and everything we've done in the game has drawn attention to azeroth, the big bad wins and takes over the world soul (essentially the players are the actual villains). All the big players in the story line essentially die in the final fight and portals are opened up to a new world where we and others escape to, essentially resetting the game, where we are no longer the "hero".
My theory is that Azeroth Is the origin of all the universe forces light, dark, life, death, ect; the Titans, even though they descended from her, they imprisoned it because they saw it as chaos that went against their ordering.
pretty good lore going on.
We need to get that thraegar customisation option for the earthen down the line!!!!!
So once Sargaeras shattered Worldcore with his sword, Xalatath gained access to Worldsoul, starting influencing it with darknsess, and becasue fo this, Hallowfall crystall started shifting?
Bring back our Queen! -All Foresaken everywhere.
i mean yeah it is a prison but like what are us azerothians suppose to do, break every single force keeping the universe together? insert tony stark "im sorry but azeroth is closed today."
I would bet that Sargeras wanted to simply remove the Titan's toy from the equation, as his last revenge. I don't think he should be considered a "hero". He would of, if he hadn't been recalled back to the Seat of the Pantheon, used Azeroth like he did Argus but because he was running out of time, and knew it, he did the one last thing he could do and that is, if he can't have Azeroth, nobody else can or should, including the Titans. If you had knowledge of your enemies, insider knowledge, would you not want to sabotage the thing that they consider most important? However, what confuses me is, if Azeroth *is* so important to the Titans and they witnessed him stab Azeroth, why have they not returned to check the damage and commence repairs? What knowledge do they hold of Azeroth? Do they still believe that because they ordered the planet that their safety guards are in working shape? Wild theory here but, I don't think the Titans are coming back. I don't think they CAN come back. I think we're going to have to go to them and we're going to find out their fate, because its weird to me that they have this worldcore, this big whole matrix they are needing and not once do they check in on it, to ensure it is working or not corrupted, and I think there is a good reason for that.
Nobbel.... you've got mail!
The Earthen are not the chosen people. Azeroth just cried out and do to what ever properties the titans gave the Earthen, they were the most receptive to the call.
It's not even clear what freed them. COULD be Azeroth - but also anything else for example the void, which is known for messing around like that.
Not only she, Azshara and Medivh also know sketchy things
What if like forces trying to send agents into Azeroth, Azeroth has been trying to send her messages/agents out (crystals, thraegar etc)
What if Sargeras would remove the sword after smashing it into the world, so we can go there and free her.
Just like what happened to Illidan. The Banshee is my queen.
I think azeroth as the "prime" world soul is responsible for the universe existing, and if any one power is able to infuse azeroth with enough of their flavour of magic will then effect EVERYTHING when she wakes up how ever she wakes up, be is a suden wound from a fell infused sword or when she is "suposed" to awaken, to all the powers she is like a weapon a big old reset button, and the final move of sargeras was to either destroy/wake azeroth with a suden jolt of fell magic that she would wake up and BOOM universe reset and due to the vast amount of fell he would "win"
this goes for all the powers some are playing the long game like the old gods, titan, and light, and zoval and sargeras were going to do it in one big instant blast, and the enemy zoval was "warning" us about at the end instead of trying to all work together was a power outside the ones we know succeeding in infusing the world soul with all flavours for a multi colour reset.
thats some great lore.
Soooooo...apparently both The Primus and Sargaras were both considered masterful tacticians? That's awfully interesting.
I mean, the (extremely shady) Primus is seen as the Death God of this hell of war that is Maldraxxus, so by that alone he should be somehow good at tactic. Tactic without strategy is a certain way to an awful defeat, though. Strategy is WAY more important.
@@miriamweller812 WC doesn't have credible strategy. Just look at Anduin.
Maybe after Sargeras seen Azeroth's eye he fell in love? ....And the sword was to try free her so so um he could make the babies.
Guarantee she comes back some point in this saga
The writers still simping for Sylvannas it seems oh joy
Light and Order were always thought of as "good", but we've seen time and time again how impositive they can be. Meanwhile, the Jailer - someone wronged by the Titans** (edit: Pantheon of Death) - wanted to set Azeroth free (and use her good stuff for something, maybe push the Titans away or fight the Void Lords), and the Old Gods just want her good stuff to do bad stuff (setting themselves free, spread chaos, yadda yadda).
What if the master Il'gynoth mentions is not N'zoth, but whoever Azeroth turns into (supposedly something greater than a Void Lord) when influenced by the Old Gods - and we follow her? Remember they don't experience time linearly.
The Jailer never meet the Titans he was wronged by the Pantheon of Death. Argus didn't ruin the Mechanism of Death until after the Jailer was sent into the Maw. Personally I think Azeroth is one of the 1st Ones.
@@Hellfire918this is the line of thinking I subscribe to. Like the precursors from Jak and Daxter, the progenitors are (possibly) not gone but rather in stasis. In this case taking the form of a (prime) world soul.
This doesn’t address the 7th force, which is an idea that intrigued me and I hope will not go unexplained. The rogue hero spec ‘Fatebound’ keeps me hopeful that we will learn the canon relationship between Fate and Free Will, and whether or not Azeroth represents this concept.
@@Hellfire918ah, I see... let me fix that
Maybe the original Zovaal was, the dominated one seems more like a puppet of someone else.
@senhorkorracha Let me guess you every think Marvel movie villain had a point and the world would be better if they all won.
We always knew our queen was right
@Dulkh4n MCU doesn't have great writing.
Hi Nobble¡ great video as always. Do you think dragons will be included in the "azeroth army", given that azeroth reascended them to aspectral power? Regarding the feelings from azeroth, are they feelings or SENSATIONS? feeling pain, sorrow or conscience doesnt mean decision making. I think its really curious to consider.
I think so. Think that a lot of things we see at the end of dragonflight were menat for the future (aspects/tyr return, maybe elisande timeline bit) + this flows nicely with velen's prophecy from his short story.
I want Sylvanas back
She's building her Empire in the Maw right now (I mean, really, what do peopel think to put something like her there, she will just raise another Forsaken army, bigger than ever before).
Sylvanus wasn't talking about Azeroth, the being, she was talking about the cosmic cycle of mortality and being reborn in the shadowlands. She wasn't right, it's a coincidence of wording.
We know, but they messed up Metzens writing, and he’s TRYING to fix it
@chrisbuckley7345 They already made Sylvanas a pawn of the Jailer.
Xalatath is Azeroth, I don’t have all the details laid out yet - but just saying it now, she’s some piece of Azeroth
It's not unlikely that Xalatath is somehow a part of Azeroth that was cut off mabye in the process of the Titans' first tries to corrupt Azeroth.
It's also not unlikely that the "upstart goddess" Elune was created that way...
its so funny that tww proofs so many 6-7 year old speculations right :D
i'm looking really far here, but with everything the titans did, with their need to absolutely control everything, i'm looking forward to fighting them one by one in azeroths behalf as the final final boss of wow itself. on the way we're probably fighting both light and void, but that's where it's at for me. and hell, you can give each titan their own patch. we killed a titan already - argus. so why not step up to the pantheon with azeroths powers of freedom in our back. for supereeaaaaaaaaaaarth.. uh.. azeroooooth!
What is the timeline on sargeras becoming a fell god?
Like he was a good titan before the legion. Did he go all demon lord before the other titans did stuff on azeroth or before?
What if the "curse of flesh" isn't old god influence like the titans told us but actually azeroths
Holy shit what's that Sword you have equipped?