New Nissan Leaf! Is Nissan Even Taking EVs Seriously Anymore?
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- Опубліковано 3 гру 2023
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I am a former mechanic who went deeper into the Electrical controls arena. I am an EV and Alternative energy guy. I also am a Leaf lover.
The simplicity and dependability of the Leaf is hard to beat and guess what, they don't burst into flames as often as their competitors.
There is a lot to be said for their no active thermal cooling battery pack.
There is not an issue with coolant leakage and shorting. No issues with refrigerant leaking or component failures. No failed coolant pumps or relays and circuits to run them.
I think the battery chemistry could be tweaked in the future but it is hard to beat the basic hatchback for usability. I want the leaf to stay around forever or a variant.
I think that if they went with an added ducted blown air system for cooling under heavy load or while rapid charging it could be a plus.
I worked on and used a lot of air cooled engines in the past that even held up to desert heat and torture just fine if air was moving over them.
Just put a better heat sink system in and keep the tech as simple as possible.
We need vehicles in the future that are designed to be repaired. That is how you lower a carbon foot print, make them last longer and build them to be repaired.
Agree, the Lead series where great, hope they continue it
"they don't burst into flames as often as their competitors."
"As often"! LO-fargin'-L!!!!!!!
Name the numbers of reported Leaf EV fires and you will see what I mean. I t is almost nonexistent
.@@jimsmalleimb7709
I am seriously thinking about getting another one while I still can. Some are not going to like this comment but I am of the opinion that the leaf rides better and feels better driving down the road than a Tesla. Obviously Tesla has better driveline tech but the leaf has better build quality than Tesla. Nissan cars have been put together very well and very solid. Their vehicles have durability that comes near Toyota and Honda. I have owned and maintained many through the years. It was always just normal wear items and maintenance that I was doing on them. I have known many off road guys who had nothing but praise for their Hard body trucks in the past. I like simplicity in engineering. It makes for a more reliable and longer lived vehicle.
@@phileasler5401
I’m a Leaf owner and can testify to the fact that their batteries hold up well. They didn’t add a battery cooling system simply because it doesn’t need it. I drive around in one of the hottest places on the planet where temps are consistently around 105+ degrees in the summer and my battery has never got into the hot zone. I honestly think Nissan knows what they are doing. I’ve owned many cars in my lifetime and this 2022 Leaf of mine is the best yet. It’s cost me pennies on the dollar compared to all the ICE buckets I’ve owned.
So you're telling their next attempt at a cheap EV is going to be built in such a way that it doesn't meet requirements for the $7500 tax credit. Real smart, Nissan.
Nissan quality and reliability is absolutely abysmal
Lease dude, does get the 7500 reduction in lease
@@tonychasey7990actually it’s not I’ve owned 3 leafs, great vehicles
The "tax credit" is bullshit. It forces the rest of us to pay for your stupidity.
The tax credits will go away when Donald Trump is elected.
I am not against driving an EV but I absolutely hate the large touch screen functions the majority of them come with and I find them highly dangerous to use while driving. Drivers are not allowed to dial their cell phone while driving, yet more and more cars are designed with essentially tablets instead of dash buttons that require so much attention to find the right function and button to press that I feel they are unsafe to operate due to the distraction these 'tablet's cause. I will consider an EV when insurance companies wake up and put more and more pressure on government and automakers to regulate and force reduced use of touch screens in favor of conventional operator safe button and switch designs and vehicles stop being operated like a cell phone gadget.
Buy a Volvo xc40 2024 recharge if that is your problem.
If I were to get an ev it would likely be a chevy bolt EUV. I don't mind a touch screen for Infotainment. But I want physical buttons for my hvac controls.
From what we've heard essentially since the late 90s, nissan has been in a perpetual state of broke most of the time. This does not surprise me the R35 platform is nearly 20 and the 350z platform Is still going in a lightly modified platform, given it's 20 years old.
...those tragic CVTs...
Even without fixing the Leaf, they could have extended the battery warranty to a tiered system beyond any other car., 9yr / 120Kmi full, reduced coverage after that. By standing behind their air-cooled battery & advertising a low replacement price they could have sold a lot more, looks like they just gave up
Very tough EV market....lead, follow, or get out of the way. The Tesla Model Y outsold the Toyota Corolla in Q1, despite being almost double the price. Tesla Model Y is the first EV to become the world’s bestselling car.
I don’t think Nissan cares about the small car market for evs in the US. So, they are building for the market that does want small evs. That plus all the uncertainty to date for the ira makes sense to me.
Good analysis Jon.
As the Japanese makes go, Nissan is at the bottom of the ladder. They made decent quality vehicles in the 70's through the 90's. As of the 2000s, their build quality is crap and they have essentially built disposable transportation. I wouldn't buy a Nissan even an EV. They are a tarnished Japanese brand that really is an embarrassment to all of the other Japanese brands.
Another channel told me Mitsubishi was the bottom rung. Now I'm confused.
Funny thing. I was watching this and a Nissan commercial comes on in the middle. They are watching you Jon! 🙂
That's pretty cool, but creepy too!
The decision to build the new leaf in Europe is a reflection of consumer preferences. Americans insist on driving huge cars while Europeans are happy with the smaller ones. I wish more smaller cars were available in North America, like VW ID3 for example, but that's not what most people want.
Does the new Leaf address the thermal battery management for the traction batteries and does it have the NACS or CCS connector?
Nissan is the king of rental car fleets. Previous leader of Nissan is an escaped criminal living in Lebanon. Not viable for the masses until it's low $20's.
Infinity- when a 1993 Daewoo is 2 much money
Nissan turning over a new Leaf, Kinda!
I hope the batteries get Thermal Management this time.
Surely they will.. surely.
They better.
Sounds like Nissan needs a change of management.
I used to sell new Nissans back in 2012 to 13. I've been around cars my whole life... all brands. Nissan ,by far had the worst reliability and build quality I've ever seen. Phord was a close second ..
What about the current Frontier? Seems a great value relative to the competition. And you still get a decent, simple, smooth, naturally aspirated v6 engine across all trim lines - even the base truck, while everyone else went to small complex "peaky" turbos.
Nissan't.
As I type this, I have just gotten home in a 2018 Nissan Rogue that, at ~85,000 miles, has been in the shop a lot more than any other car I've had, and, despite being an ***SUV***, feels like it's gonna puke up its suspension after one time I almost did SUV things with it (drove through a gravel road with LOTS of low water crossings). Also, I'm extremely angry at them for their "key recall" that they "fixed" by making it so that the key can't fold into the remote anymore. I also feel like I'm just the tip of the iceberg because this is a CVT car. Meanwhile, around me, a bunch of 1990's Toyotas drive seemingly without incident. -_-;
I thought the Phord Escape was bad til I rode in a rogue.. for the short time I sold new Nissans, I always tried my hardest to steer people away from the Rogue. Get rid of that thing while you can. It's only going to get worse
Jon, has that landrover book behind you got the final chapter 😮 the demise of landrover 😢
No, it's from 2003 and it's subtitle is "Series One to Freelander"
If Nissan would update the Leaf with NACS, liquid cool the battery, and make it price&range competitive with the Chevy Bolt (or at least the Kona EV), they'd have no problem selling them. That's all they'd have to do iMHO, no new platform, save money and don't change anything else, just update those 3 things. As it is now, why would I buy a product worse in most regards than a Chevy Bolt, that somehow costs as much as a Model 3.
Especially with the tax credit, if the Leaf moves out of US production, there goes any competitive advantage you had
Because the Bolt seats are absolute garbage?
My understanding is that the cars would still qualify for incentives if they are leased, not purchased. Perhaps Nissan believes they can push more people to lease the leaf while taking advantage of the cheaper Chinese batteries.
I suspect Congress will close that little loophole soon. I did a video on it, and the author of the legislation was furious that using a lease to get the incentive was never the intention.
Sadly Nissan is the new Mitsubishi. Competent but otherwise uncompetitive cars that stay on the market way past their shelf life. More sadly, they seem to be following the same path in the EV segment.
My friend is leasing a 2022 Leaf 40kW that he got simply as a value play for a sub-$200/month deal. It works for his 50 mile commute, but is useless as any kind of road trip vehicle due to its outdated battery and charging technology.
Mitsubishi needs better design and more models like a large SUV, the two right now aren't cutting it
Hmm. Nissan is doing things cautiously because of their financial instability, so I don’t imagine this as a misstep just yet. I feel Nissan doesn’t see the tax rebates continuing for much longer as EV sales slow and people get ready for the new US presidential election. Also, Nissan has their main European operation in the UK with most Leaf sales coming from the ones built there. So I think it’s an ok idea for now. What I think is the defining factor is the Leaf specs, which I hope they get right.
I tend to agree and alluded to in the video. I suspect the UK and European markets are larger for the next gen Leaf than the US, thus the focus on manufacturing there.
But it precludes a competitive offering in the US. Thus creating the situation it's trying to avoid.
@@AllCarswithJonYeah, they’re missing out on the US market. Maybe they have something else planned for the US market.
Nissan have sort of become a two car company. The Z car and the Patrol. The rest are not much more than warm transport when it’s cold , and cold transport when it’s warm
No EV hate, I get it for the ones that commute and charge at work or home.... They make sense in those situations.
BUT EVs dont work for the majority (not too mention the people that just dont like EVs)... If they did they work and they're wanted, people wouldn't need $$$ incentives to entice people to buy them. If EVs were really wanted theyd be selling at or over MSRP (the ICE market has always confirmed that). Not too mention the lack of gas tax everyone else is paying for road repairs (registration fees on these should be amended on this IMHO).
Just wait until these batteries on these new EVS die and have to be replaced. You'll be faced with a costly decision either way. Shell out the thousands of dollars to put a new battery in it. Or, Pay thousands of dollars to scrap it. Because what they are not telling you is the fact that if you scrap an EV these days you have to pay to do it because of all the Recycling and Disposal fees associated with those huge battery packs
@@tonychasey7990educate yourself, EV batteries are usually not replaced regularly.
The oil industry is subsidized by US$ 6,000,000,000,000 yearly worldwide, when oil is no longer critical (because of renewable energy) guess what happens?
The EV credit is not for the customer, it is for the old car industry, but they will go bankrupt anyway
@@casperhansen826agree, EVs are the way to go, people critical of EVs are just horse and buggy drivers of the 20 century
it's because EVs cost way more than gas cars, due to production costs, that's why people are hesitant to buy and getting hybrids instead, even with the recent price cuts led by Tesla, which aren't working so they have to keep cutting more, people are turned off by the price and charging issues right now, I would go for a hybrid as well
@@phileasler5401 No...
Like I said, they make sense for some.... You're the reason for alot of dislike against EV agenda... They work for you and your life situation, great. Im not changing my lifestyle around a vehicle to make one work for me... Just because the novel idea of electric vehicles fits your particular situation, by no means reflects youre ahead of anything over anyone...
Nothing from Nissan Inspires me!!! Of course, it has to be expensive because they can’t afford for anything to loose money!!
Just goes to show that trade wars and tax exemptions are not benefitial in the long run
Nissan for over a decade has looked like a zombie brand that keeps stumbling forward on momentum alone.
I think a lot of current car brands will not exist or will be what Saab is now just some patents and names Owned by a Chinese company. In about 15 years.
Part of me wants to say "No Way! Not in just 15 years!"
But 15 years ago GM and Chrysler were going bankrupt....
nissan / infinity is so far in the shitter all they do now is show concept cars, and the WOW factor to get people talking then. Nothing ..... when Carlos Ghosn. left .....the company went down the drain he was competitive and had vision.. now there all over the place dying on the vine
Yet there's plenty on the road every day...
Yikes. I really like the Bolt but the charge is extra slow. It was exciting being behind a huge shopping center at 2am with most of the lights out ( can you say sitting duck-this was 2019). I understand the Leaf was even slower. Everytime a new efficient EV is introduced. The old ones are behind the curve. What's up with Nissan and the other Japanese brands? But especially Nissan a company that's been building EV's awhile now?
they've been dragging their feet the past decade, and lobbying to slow things down, they only started getting serious the past 3 years, same reason why they never did anything with the Prius and Leaf, they don't want to keep moving
EVs won't become mainstream only after they are truly better than gas-powered cars in the minds of customers. Much like in the early 1900s, when gas, steam, and electric vehicles competed for customers. EVs were very popular as cabs in New York, and with women who found starting a gas car to be un-lady-like. The electric starter changed all of that. Same sort of thing needs to occur here. 500+ mile range and pricing equivalent to gas cars.
If Nissan couldn’t release an e-power hybrid in the USA, then Nissan wouldn’t release the Leaf anytime soon in the USA considering e-power hybrids have been around for 7 years.
Nissan is terrible they are still using the same GTR platform from what. 15 years ago now. Their new 400ZX is just the same frame from the 20-year-old Nissan 350 z
Nissan isn’t terrible. The GTR is too legendary to not recycle. Better than Hyundai which uses old Mitsubishi engine technology.
Pensioners will be suited to Toyotas with a 150 mile range 😢
I suspect that Nissan is simply keeping its foot in the door with EVs just in there is a new revolutionary battery ob tge scene. So they are keeping their options open. But they don't look like they love EVs and at this point nor do I. They are still not a viable economic proposition. As long as they are less useful than a gas car, they have to stop being twice the price.
Nissan Leaf has a terrible reputation in Australia Jon. For crap range, tragic resale & dead batteries that cost more from Nissan than the car's value. Nice, Nissan. Ours are even made in Japan & are still crap.
Australia & EVs simply don't fit. A 2,200km East Coast high speed rail Melb > Canberra > Syd > Newcastle > Brisbane would cost much, much less than thousands of distant charging stations. Let the Leaf fall.
Newsflash: there are other places in the world than Australia where the LEAF thrives.
Guess they had to give their UK factory something to build. If not that, then what.
Cube
Hmmm Leaf for $38k or Model 3 for $30k .... hmmmm 🤣
Yeah, not a hard decision.
if as you say, you are only guessing, then nothing is certain?
nothing is officially released yet other than 'it's coming', it's styling direction is going to be based on the concept I showed in the video, and it'll be built in Britian.
More detailed specifics will be coming later from Nissan, as it gets closer to production
They're not taking US market seriously because there's no US EV market....
I mean it's only 8% of the market, but about 2.4% of Nissan's business
@@AllCarswithJon what would that be without government subsidies that will hopefully be gone by January 2025?
@@Noneofyourbusiness2000 Probably not very different considering Nissan's current cars don't really qualify for a tax credit anyway (Leaf does, but only half, and even then it's not competitive)
I would probably buy a Subaru if I could get msrp.
Don't buy obscure foreign brands, or you'll be left high and dry when you need repairs/ parts later (or try to resell) when they leave the market, like Isuzu, Suzuki, Daewoo, Daihatsu, Yugo, Saab, Renault and soon Volvo and Mitsubishi.
At least defunct US brands like Pontiac and Mercury sold in enough volume and share most parts with many other GM and Ford cars to make sense.
A couple of foreign makes like Honda and Toyota are a safe bet, again , sell in enough volume for parts and proven reliability/resale value.
But stay away from small, niche car makers, their reliability is always poor and when they go bankrupt, you're stuck with a worthless $30,000 irreparable unsellable lump.
I took a class on EV's recently, these have no water cooling for the battery, do not buy a Leaf, Leaf has to be on of the worst EV's you could possibly buy.
I slept in a Holiday Inn last night, and I say the LEAF is a good, reliable entry level EV.
Tesla on its way to 400 mile range 😊
So about 350 in reality
Nissan - that says it all not desirable even as rental cars
EVs need multi-speed automatic transmissions or CVTs. After an onboard ICE, a multi-speed transmission is the best range extender for an EV. And solid state batteries are a must too.
I disagree. Electric motors work differently than internal combustion engines and don't need gears because they're just as efficient spinning fast as they are slow. (more or less; you wouldn't benefit at all as an end user).
Nissan hasn't had much money since the 90s and has gone through financial trouble after financial trouble it makes sense why they keep regurgitating the same chasis. They're trying to save money.
@scott8919 but isn't there an upward limit to how fast they could spin? Wouldn't even a 2-gear setup improve them? Honestly, it's a question I've had but not 'dug into' yet?
@@AllCarswithJon Really only makes sense in high-end performance EV's for top speed reasons. A multi-speed gearbox reduces efficiency to the point where in normal driving (which for most people is below 80mph), you're giving up multiple percentage points of efficiency compared to just having a single speed gear reduction and not having the top speed, which your average consumer would never use anyway. Porsche Taycan has a 2-speed gearbox in the rear for example, it's also significantly less efficient than something like the Model S.
Why, so they can fail?
Toyota brand idiots will buy a wooden push trolley, if it had a Toyota badge on it 😂😂😜🤪🥴
Why yes they would
It's about time an auto manufacturer stoped taking their EV seriously. Battery technology isn't there yet. They're too expensive, heavy, charge too slowly, and you're lucky if they last 7 years before they need to be replaced.
All of those reasons are exactly why they should take them seriously. You need to get your supply chain and manufacturing set up, start now and get all of that together, figure out what works and doesn't work, invest in and gain experience with the tech, and once you do that (even if you just burn through cash in that business division for a few years), you'll be there. You can't just sit on your hands for the next 5-10 years, then decide you're ready to jump in the game... you'll be way behind.
Especially if/when the Chinese enter the US Market. BYD with their Blade batteries have insane charging performance, cycle counts as large as your average LFP, and they put them in cars costing $25-30k. That should be setting off alarm bells in every OEM's head. BYD are crushing the EV space in Asia and Australia, BYD and Tesla and MG are dominating in Europe, hell BYD even has a massive Mexican presence. It's only a matter of time before these things hit the US/CAN market and everyone else is years behind in terms of development (except maybe Tesla)
@@Black-Villain battery technology won't be there in 5-10 years. They have plenty of time and don't need to waste the money in the interim.
@@Noneofyourbusiness2000 I think that's very short sighted for many reasons. For one, that completely ignores their business outside of the US, like Europe, China, South America, etc. If they do no development, you're essentially giving your market share away to competitors or the Chinese. Secondly, if/when the Chinese companies come, they're going to come hard, with their already-developed tech and expertise, we're already seeing it in Europe. If the OEMs aren't careful, we could and very well might have another repeat of the 70s Japanese Invasion on our hands
@@Black-Villain What if subsidies evaporate, which they hopefully will? Sales will plummet and they could be stuck with excess inventory, tooling, contractual quotas from suppliers ect. I think that they might be forward thinking and you are the short sighted one.
@@Noneofyourbusiness2000 I don't think subsidies will affect the future (mind you, Tesla didn't have any from like 2017-2021). If anything, losing them will drastically hurt traditional US manufacturing and production. The EV market is happening worldwide, where these companies need to compete, you're not just playing ball in the US any more.
Like I said, what happens when BYD comes in, without tax incentives, and brings a product to market that's both cheaper and better than what traditional OEMs can make regardless of incentives? Or Tesla, who has forced suppliers to create 48V low-voltage system architecture components and full underbody castings to reduce costs. We have to prepare for these things, and we can't do that by sitting on our asses, or we'll be back in the 70s
hybrid is the best
For the 1990’s that’s correct
Anybody that takes EV's seriously is living in a pipe dream! Absolutely more disastrous to the environment than standard ICE automobiles.
Thank you. You hit the nail on the head.
Battery technology is a golden key along with charging centres. Transition from fossil fuels is bound to be messy, contradictory, mess of porridge.
Doubt that statement, been driving a Ev for 13 years…
gas cars are one of the biggest sources of pollution, it's easy to just say EVs are bad
@@phileasler5401 I'm sure the slave masters in China and Africa thank you for keeping them in business!
All of the major carmakers are running from EV because they know it's not where it needs to be, and they are rushing tech that is wasteful and dangerous. I feel bad for EV buyers at this point, who are going to find that newer, better technologies will make their battery cars obsolete before the country gets on board.
It's a stepping stone, not the answer to climate change--especially when you look at the forced labor issues, the devastating mining and finite resources problems, the amount of raw power--from coal and diesel generators--it takes to produce the cars and batteries, the cost or resources and land to produce the amount extra energy the grid will need in order to handle the load of a fully electric auto world, the massive insurance premiums, the insane cost of minor repairs and bodywork, and the sheer risks surrounding the use of high capacity batteries (which is well documented before EVs become the trend).
no, they're not running from EV, it's just because sales are slowing for now, new buyers are hesitant and getting hybrids instead which are selling well, there is nothing else better, hydrogen is still a decade away from building infrastructure and systems, EV is the future whether people are ready or not, yes there are issues with production, but technology always has a downside, same with gas and others, once price and charging are fixed, it will take off
That fact the we are even debating it means the tech isn't there yet. Automakers are asking the public to buy EV as beta testers, when they ought to have the basics figured out first--like how not to spontaneously combust, lose power in cold and heat, actually have range on par with ICE, etc.
Since most Americans live in big cities--meaning apartments and middle- to low-income housing, the charging issues are real inhibitors--all because the tech isn't there yet.
By the time the batteries get close, Toyota will have the silicon or hydrogen fuels ready. Betcha.
Couldnt get through this review. Ariya has won several awards including JDPower's Best Interior for ALL Compact SUVs, not just EVs. Yet this reviewer calls it unremarkable, give me a break...
"Is Nissan Even Taking EVs Seriously Anymore?"
Not if they are intelligent. EVs are built exclusively for rich people as toys or complete idiots.
Nissan Ariya, $37,500 after tax credit of $7500 ( yes I did get the credit for preorder), 304 epa miles, average ~340 miles per charge. My 22 mile commute I average 200 mpge.
@@phileasler5401 : That's almost $30K more than the purchase price of all the cars I have owned since 1991 COMBINED. You got seriously ripped off like everyone who buys any new car, EV or not. The EV is just a little bonus for a special kind of stupid.
Keep working, and one day you'll be able to afford one. No need to lash out in jealousy. I can't afford a Lear jet, but I don't call their owners idiots.😂
@@Plisken65 : A Learjet is a luxury, not a necessity. A car is a necessity. If you don't understand that difference, you are the pure definition of the word "idiot" and prove my point perfectly.