UBOAT Intercept Vectors
Вставка
- Опубліковано 25 лис 2024
- Tutorial on the marine navigation concepts of Dead Reckoning, Relative Motion, and how to determine proper Target Intercept Vectors.
Dead Reckoning/Constant Bearing - Decreasing Range (CBDR): 2:10 - 11:30
100% settings and making use of the hydrophone operator: 11:30 - 23:30
Demonstration of CBDR: 23:30 - 26:00
Dead Reckoning example: 31:00
I probably would have paid a lot better attention in my geometry courses if the instructor gave me word problems that started with: "You are a sonar operator tracking an enemy surface ship 74 kilometers away bearing 229 with a speed of 7 knots/hr. Plot an intercept course and calculate an ideal torpedo firing solution." I would have been ALL over that homework assignment! Great tutorials!
Vector math on a polar coordinate plane is pretty cool. I spent a lot of time vetting maneuvering board concepts.
thats how im teaching my son geometry... and when it comes to finance and accounting/stock logistics im using eco sims that are data heavy...
Exactly this. Math would have been so much fun!
Funny you say that but I struggled with the pure math classes in college but as soon as I got into the structural engineering classes (Not an engineer myself, just a technologist) I found it making way more sense even felt easier. Just knowing that the info I was working through would size a beam, or column, or moment loading on something "real" made it click. I could totally see the same with geometry like this!
I thougt the exact same thing
Some useful timestamps for people:
Dead reckoning/Constant Bearing - decreasing range: 2:10 - 11:30
100% realism and making use of the sonar operator: 11:30 - 23:30
Demonstration of constant bearing - decreasing range: 23:30 - 26:00
Dead reckoning example: 31:00
Great tutorial as always
Oh awesome, thank you! I'll add that to the description!
spent hours searching how to intercept mathematically. all the videos that claimed to teach it were actually just eyeballing it. this is what i’ve been looking fof
Look up silent hunter 3, most people explain it in that. Back in the day I bought the collectors edition which gave you the big map and the physical recognition manual for all the ships. I'm pretty sure some laminated the map so they could physically plot on it. It was amazing back then. Sitting with my headphones on, really quiet thinking I could hear a ship faintly in the distance. Plotted my course and sure enough it was one.
You explain things really, really well and in detail.
I just fired the game back up after playing it forever over a year ago, so.......
Got to know how all these newfangled features work so I don't put my boat on the fritz, and then I have to get Fritz to fix the boat......🙄🤐
But really I am blown away how you explain things and that you tackle things I haven't seen anywhere else, very, very helpful.
Thanks, I appreciate the feedback! I bought the game like 4 or 5 years ago and shelved it because they would not let me enter my own firing solutions. Came back a month or so ago, and they had this thing going called "unstable beta" and supposedly had my TDCs finally! You have no idea how many people on the forums answered all my questions with "It's not that kind of game." It's like the player base had to be forcefully dragged into a simulation with a TDC. Then I had people recommending that I watch tech-spec videos on how historical TDCs worked! I know how they work, I wanted to know how I was supposed to use it with the interface the devs imposed on me? ...anywho, so here we are. Figured it out on my own, after much pain and suffering. Hopefully like-minded folks will appreciate the commentaries. 😁
@@xljedi2335 Wow, only a month + , it's a completely different game now compared to 4 years ago.
I played it with the TDC mod in early release and I loved it, now it's a bit different, but historically accurate I think, not an expert on that, but I do think the devs pay attention to historical authenticity, at least when I read the writing on all the equipment it looks spot on as well as the German voice acting, I am German living in the US for a very long time now.
Now we have a TDC and more, I am not sure if the player base had to be dragged into a simulation, the TDC mod was vastly popular and I think players wanted a more simulation like experience, that was at least my impression, I am certainly quite happy with what we have right now, the mod author of the TDC mod worked with the devs to integrate it into the game.
Anyway, I already previewed your TDC tutorials on my phone, at work, which means I can only pretty much listen to the videos, so I have to give them a proper viewing at home.
It seems you have the TDC very much figured out and your pain and suffering wasn't in vain because people will benefit from your videos.
I am very happy I came across your channel via a random YT recommendation just today, funny how things work out sometimes.
Another great video! Something to add: Sonar contacts are less accurate than spotted smoke, which is less accurate than spotted ships. Generally speaking, use hydrophone to get within range to hopefully spot smoke, then to spot ship. The way the game plots these three types of contacts makes a big difference.
Thanks. This has been very helpful. Initially I quickly skimmed and was daunted that it seems such complexity was involved. But I decided to watch the video from start to finish and It's actually quite simple. You explained it very well, while also demonstrating the UI as you go along-wasn't daunting at all! And now on a new game, I'm already 3 sinks down with plenty of fuel to go. Empty torpedoes will be what sends me home, which is how it should be.
When I first started messing around with Orbiter Space Flight Simulator about 17 years ago, the learning curve was steep. It took me about a year to successfully launch the space shuttle, and rendezvous with the ISS. Lots of mental math, and spatial orientation puzzles to solve. That's exactly how I feel now with the vectored intercept concept. I love a challenge like this, and appreciate you showing how it can be done. Looks like another steep learning curve is in my future.
Orbital mechanics are far more complicated. You'll enjoy this game. The biggest learning curve is figuring out how to control the gyro turn of a torpedo, but once you have that down you'll be a seawolf in no time.
Yes tdc please, great videos you leave all others miles behind .
Opened up UBOAT for the first time in nearly a year to explore the updates since the full release. I've played the game some before, but not to this level of realism, and this tutorial was exactly what I needed to take that step. Great explanations - pretty obvious that you understand both the mechanics of the game as well as the mathematics behind it all. Subscribed.
Kinda reminds me of my days racing sailboats. If you've got a boat on a converging path off in the distance, and it's not moving relative to whatever is in the background behind it (provided you're not out of sight of land), then you know you're on a collision course. If it appears to be moving forward against the background (i.e. "gaining trees" as we would call it), then it's gonna cross ahead of you. And conversely, if it's "losing trees" (i.e. appears to be moving backwards against the background), then you know you're gonna cross ahead of it. Important to note these things, especially if the other boat happens to be a fully loaded 900 ft. freighter!
Amazing video man, Im still learning on 54% realism but this will and is a great help! Video is on the long side but explains stuff really well. Subbed! (pun not intended)
Great video, this helped me quite alot in finding / intercepting contacts on more realistic settings.
Since I got this game I've felt like an a-hole just guestimating and blundering around the ocean trying to find stuff, this should help a lot!
Subscribed half way through your tutorial! Great tutorial on intercepts.
Awesome, thank you!
This is such a great video. It has so many useful points. I've watched it twice!
This video is so helpful and SUPER interesting. Thank you so much for the content.
Glad you enjoyed it!
My brain is melting, this is too much for one sitting.
Perhaps, just take it a step at a time.
Thanks for the tutorial on dead reckoning! I never know how fast theyre moving. I always assume 12-14km/h. I like to assume higher speed to get to the cross roads first. Also, i have difficult time knowing if they are running on angles. I guess its about experience in knowing what the amount change in bearing means and alot of assumptions. The change in bearing and estimated distance with hydrophone is the only certainy i have.
There are many ways to arrive at good approximations for successful intercepts. Experiment with your own ideas and see what works. I find that I use different methods for different situations.
I love it just like Stokes52 already said this is so much better then any math class i had to take. Now i can engage propeller or radio massages. I always ignored them cause i didnt really know how to do that and guessing wasnt fun at all ^^
Such a great video. Thank you!
Oh man! I loved your last video and was so looking forward to the next. Woohoooo! It's here.
Awesome! I might try to post another before the end of the week.
Awesome video man. Thank you.
Perfect tutorials, Can't wait to get into it.
Thanks a lot, very useful and precious hints !
Thank you so much for these excellent tutorials ❤
You are so welcome!
Very helpful! Thank you!!!
If its direction is 68 degrees to the port, you must draw a line from the port to the square that they told you, because if you see the line, it is heading straight. Usually ships head in a straight line if they are traveling in territorial waters.
Another gem. Thanks, much appreciated
Thanks, I appreciate the feedback!
Brilliant stuff. Thank you!
Great tutorial. I learned a lot. Thanks!
These videos are really really useful.. thank you :)
Amazing video ! I think "cheating" with centering the screen and using the position of interception is good when we beginning at this. ^^
This video tutorial is a good reminder that I should have paid closer attention in trigonometry back in secondary school! Bookmarked for later viewing as there is a lot to unpack here. How did you learn all this stuff? I will check if you have other such tutorials on this game which I just discovered last week! Thanks!
Oh! The hydrophone tells you the direction that ship is bearing to true north? I didn't know that. And aslo i never clicked that button little auto intercept button before. I never knew it existed. Lol super helpful video
Your hydrophone is always reporting relative. It's odd that the devs would show the bearing in the hydro contact window based on true north. If you mouse-over the small hydro-bearing icon on the right side of the screen it gives you the relative bearing (as it should). I guess the devs figure, if you can see the relative bearing on mouse-over at right, they might as well also show you the converted bearing to true north in the window at left? Or possibly, maybe they thought folks would want it so they could click that heading on the gyrocompass to point their sub at the target?
@@xljedi2335 yeah, i reckon if you point your ship at the target, its like zeroing out an indicator to reduce error. you could get an idea of targets heading 0-2 or 0-358 degrees you see the targets traveling left or right of the sub alot easier. Then, you can dead plot a course to your next hydrophone location, getting closer to see if the targets moving away or closing in.
Great video! Would love a tutorial on how to do an overhaul when you blow the approach.
Sure, I'll add to the list for this weekend maybe. ☺
Love this stuff!
This is absolutely incredible. I am not a mathematics genius but this is very understandable and will deepen the play level for me with Uboat. I bought the early access but am only not starting to play the game and i like the idea of using dead reckoning and vectored intercept I also liked the Crew management information you laid out.
However, i wanted to ask you something about the way you laid out the dive schedule in the previous episode so that you maximize using batteries to save on fuel and maximise crew performance. Obviously later in the war the Germans spent most time on the surface at night so what in the early war is the reason not to do the same surely it is better hunting? I thinking your reasoning would be burning through too much diesel?
Anyway loved the episode very impressed by the vector mathematics. Thank you this was a big hole in my game. Cheers Mate
We have this dilemma; as sub sim fans we read the historical accounts and learn how the real captains hunted their targets. The reality being the crew looking on the horizon for smoke. So in the game we put our crew on watch to duplicate, and then we find out quickly that our detection range is a fraction of what our hydrophone is capable of. So how can we min-max our target detection in the game? We scan with the hydrophone. The dilemma being; that's not historically accurate. So you have to weigh that one for yourself.
The 3 hour interval that I use in the dive schedule has nothing to do with fuel economy. I consider the dive schedule my "Target Detection Mode". Notice that at half-ahead or slower your detection radius for the hydrophone basically covers a complete grid square. When you surface and run for 3 hours, it is enough time to get you to the next grid square where you submerge and scan the area. So my dive schedule is setup to blanket my patrol zone after plotting a search pattern based on legs that are set to keep me centered in the grid squares.
@@xljedi2335 I enjoy the level of detail and whilst it is true U-boats didn't hunt in this way there is something very satisfying about it. On the Crew side that makes perfect sense. Going to set up a new game now. Thanks Again this is great.
Very cool, thank you.
Based on old SH3/4/5 experience (just bought UB on the full release) I don't believe the constant bearing intercept is tactically optimal. While mathematically interesting and a needed technique for calculating 'what is possible', I like to arrive in a prospective firing position with time to adjust if the target has altered course or speed. I also like to run at a lower speed on the surface whenever possible - minimize bow wave and wake, and conserve fuel. I will use your method as a baseline, but make tactical decisions about half/full/flank speed, and adding several degrees of 'cheat' to the intercept angle whenever possible, to arrive a bit early. Easy enough to slow down when you are closing on the projected target course line.
@@pnzrldr you can adjust your intercept speed to whatever you want. You can intercept any offset position you like with a stationing adjustment. However, we are only looking to get within hydro range of the radio contact so that extra granularity is unwarranted.
If you plotted the exact position and TC, then you can either eyeball it as I usually do or, if you want to be specific, you could plot a station position you wish to occupy relative to the target and then intercept that location. I don't find myself doing that too often, but you certainly could if you wanted to.
Great guide!!!
Great video. Very interesting. Could you do one one the four-bearing method? I know there are some out there but when I do my calculations the target ship is always way closer than I expect. I would like to see your take on it because your takes seem to make more sense. 😄
I could apply what I know for maybe 3 examples and see how close we get? It gets a bit trickier if you plan to take the bearing observations while moving. In which case, you would be plotting a DRM line (Direction of Relative Motion) as opposed to TC (True Course) that would require a vector addition step to convert DRM to TC. It would be nice if one of the maps we could draw on was just a maneuvering board graphic. 🤔
@@xljedi2335 Just for reference. I learnt my current calculation method from this video, which I thought was pretty interesting, but for some reason it doesn't quite work for me - and I am following the instructions to the letter: ua-cam.com/video/Yl2BeZNSkuo/v-deo.html.
TMA methods in this game are ultimately going to be tedious and not fun. ...but we can talk about what you would have to do to make it work. The video you posted is the simplest type, where ownship is stationary, and it's still very tedious. I don't like that method because you have to sit still for too long while the target is moving away. It is very much counter to the mindset of the Kriegsmarine wanting to move at flank to intercept.
@@xljedi2335 I get what you are saying about it being tedious. Since it is quite new to me (I was never a math prodigee) I find it very interesting to do but it does make it tedious because I never get the desired result. 😄
One question about your method in this video. Does it matter if you use 7 kilometers per hour in stead of 7 knots (you mention 'by proxy') or is it just that you use 7 something against 13 something for the angle to work?
@@florynhollander7766 that’s right, only the vectors being equivalent scales is relevant. In some cases I might use 100’s of meters as a proxy; but it would work in yards or NM just as well.
Whoa, you can spin the meters?! If you're not facing north, 0 bearing isn't always north? I've got a lot to learn!
Relative vs. True, the zero bearing is the nose of your ship, it can point in any direction.
Followed this step for step, and then compared my finding to the game's built in intercept course. The game says I should travel 400km NE to intercept a ship moving at 14 knots SW. This game is bunk. Try number 2 off of a fellow Uboat radio transmission. The steps provided sent me in the opposite direction.
There are situations where you get false readings from the intercept tool. It is not always right, but as you play with it, you will get a feel for when you should question the data. Just reposition yourself a bit if things look odd and take another reading.
Great video! For that last contact, I think you guessed its starting position in that square? If you suspected it was heading for bergen, would it have helped to draw a reverse course from bergen with the given 68 degrees and had a more accurate starting position estimate? If so that might have given you a much more accurate intercept
The square was a given from the radio contact info. So, I typically would start at the reported square and then make a guess at where they might be headed.
Great concept, showing exactly what tools to use, thanks for that.
But the explanation of the method itself doesn't start until about 30 minutes in. And that was not a great contact to use, as you got sidetracked, saying it could be just dead reckoning and it's really just a chasing contact itself. Maybe an artificial contact just using a marker would have been easier. IMHO
I'll add that the game really needs a better eraser tool for all these lines as I try to figure this out. The existing one is picky ;-)
Awesome video! Just one question:
Can you do another video with manual interception for the hydrophone contact?
In this video, you showed how you manually calculate an interception for a target where you know the speed and it's direction.
But what if you have a hydrophone contact that just says:
"Hydrophone contact at relative bearing 224, distance 50-80km, medium speed"
How does a manual calculation here work, because for your method I would have to draw a circle that represents the speed of the target also I would have to know it's direction.
Both information is unavailable to me. So I really wonder how you would do the same strategy for hydrophone contacts. In the video you always press the "intercept" button. I would like to know how it works with out.
I heard from other fellow skippers that they use a "four bearing" method, but I don't understand this at all.
- subscribed to your channel and liked the video.
I show you how to do it with the hydro-contact tools at 11:30. However, the community here seems to want to know more about TMA methods. So, I will give it some thought. Generally speaking, the methods are tedious and not very much fun. I suspect most would do just as well to point your nose at the contact, surface and run in that direction at flank. However, I can give it some thought.
Amazing video! Is there a mod that disables the automatic calculation of an intercept course?
I believe there might be, but why in the world would you want it? I ask because it's so easy to self-manage the reveal of information and so helpful to have the ability to use the tool to check your work as you practice.
Oh great Uboat professor! I have a question I couldn't find online if you have the time: When you get a message about targets moving very slow, slow, medium, fast...etc. Could you provide a range of how fast in kts/kmh those speeds mean? Like is a very slow ship 7kmh or 10kmh? It's been a bit tough as a newbie getting the hang of that... thanks!
Professor? Ha, you so silly. Based mostly on prior naval sim experience, I have had decent luck assuming 7kts for slow and 10kts for medium. If the indication is "Fast" I might assume I can't catch it unless inbound, but 13 to 16kts maybe for fast? I would think 16kts would put you in the path of anything in this game. Warships can do 20-23kts for "very fast" but I would assume they are moving at flank and probably not cruising at that speed too often.
@@xljedi2335 Thanks so much for this! Super helpful!
Hey, great video, cheers! One question: How did you set up your map to have all tools (e.g. compass, depth meter), ... all at once? I can't seem to do that
Take a look at the Type IIA Sceduling video, I explain how to setup the UI, among other things.
At ~ 7:00 you said you were using kilometers as a proxy, would the more accurate way to do it be with nautical miles?
Doesn't matter, it's a relative scale. So as long as the scale is the same for my vectors and their sizes are relative, the answers will be correct. Good question though! I am just looking for a representation of a 7 length vector and a 13 length vector. It could be yards, cubits, furlongs... wouldn't matter just a proxy. Had I used NM, I would've also said "proxy".
@@xljedi2335 ahhh, a misunderstanding of what proxy means on my part. Thanks for the quick response :]
Slow, Medium, Fast and Very Fast
Out of curiosity, what are the speed values, or speed ranges you assign in game when you are presented with the terms: slow, medium, fast and very fast? I know it will vary with ship type, but sometimes you don't know what you're up against until within visual range. Your videos are well done, and you have a knack for being able to convey their contents to the viewers.
I have had decent luck assuming 7kts for slow and 10kts for medium. Fast? I would probably assume I can't catch it unless inbound, but 13 to 16kts maybe? I would think 16 would put you in the path of anything in this game. Have you seen warships cruising at 20+ kts? Maybe 20-23 for very fast? Currently I have about 400hrs logged in Uboat, so haven't been too far beyond mid 1940, and playing mostly with the Type II's thus far. My encounters have been mostly with small freighters, convoys chuggin along at 7kts, and the occasional tanker moving at medium speed.
@@xljedi2335 Thanks for your input. I have looked at the maximum speeds on various ships, especially some warships, and if memory serves me (I'm gettin' long in the tooth, you know...), I noticed a few that were pretty high... like 75+ km/hr The fastest I saw a ship moving along in game was a cruiser doing around 67 km/hr, he was a little bit upset with some perceived slight on my part. The game usually tells you in the popup if the ship is slow, medium, fast and I've seen very fast when you mouse over the target's azimuth, and I wondered how that factored, or translated into (your) calculations. Some sims tell you that 6-10 is slow, etc. I've looked over the manual for UBoat, and I haven't seen any recommendations. I tried to apply common sense, and I wasn't too far off of the speeds you replied with. My rule of thumb is: "don't screw with warships if you don't have to..." I like your vector technique, and I want to start putting it into practice, and I was curious about how you determined what target speed to use initially. Now I have a pretty good idea. Thank you immensely for your response. Keep up the good work on the videos. Now, if only the net cutters worked on anti-sub nets.
Nice vid to explain constant bearing, but I have some concerns: Or you should explain why you add a circle of 13 knots value to the 7 knots value, or much more simply: You should tell that the lenght of these 2 circles really DON'T MATTER, the 2nd circle must just add-up to be your intercept speed, e.g. if the target runs at 8 knots, and you want to intercept at 12 knots, your second circle would have a diameter being 50% longer starting from the target, and as long as this is true both circles can have any size. This would make the whole explanation much easier to understand and to execute. Greetings!
Hi nice guide. With what mods are u playing? Thx
Stated previously that he's not using any mods
No mods, just the base game at 100% settings.
Is celestial nav. a viable option in this game? Does it have correct skybox for the date and a way to measure height angles of bodies?
I have not checked into it. Someone else may be able to opine though.
How do you get that protractor and stop watch and how do you rename your points?
The protractor is a standard drawing tool available in the map without any mods. Stopwatch is also a standard feature with the 1.0 release. I talk about setting up the UI in my Crew Scheduling video.
Can you use the 3min 15sec method to determine target speed in kmh using bearings? E.g. take an intercept bearing, wait 3m15sec take another bearing, then measure distance travelled, speed is that distance x 10?
Sure, set your speed at zero. Click the intercept button, mark M1, start the timer and watch the intercept line move over 3:15 time interval, mark M2 and measure the distance. Gives you both TC and speed.
@@xljedi2335 Very cool! I had a related question, which is when using the chronometer to measure speed, doesn't the calculation depend on the observed length of the target, which is distorted if approaching at an acute angle?
@@TheSonicfrog No, the only thing that distorts the chrono is your own ship speed. Remember, the aspect ratio (or distorted view) which makes the ship appear shorter, also causes the ship to appear to move slower. So the two offset perfectly and it takes the same amount of time for the ship to pass the wire, regardless of your view angle. It's just important that your ship is NOT moving. It's your ownship motion that would skew the measurement.
@@xljedi2335 So to clarify, I should stop my boat before using the chronometer?
@@TheSonicfrog I would note however that the 3:15 rule is geared toward converting km to knots. If we were playing in the Pacific with a US fleetboat, we might use the 3:00 minute rule (as opposed to 3:15) to convert yards to knots. You all should get used to using knots for speed. kmh and mph are relevant if our sim involved driving a bus down the road. You want to fly planes, or be the captain of a naval vessel? You think about speed in knots.
you forgot to turn the dive schedule back on when you started looking for contacts again around 30:00
I do forget things from time to time, but that was deliberate. I showed you first the concept, then I showed how to intercept a hydrophone contact, the final item was to show you a radio contact intercept. So I needed to stay on the surface and just wait. The radio intercepts can be less accurate due to imperfect intel, as the video shows, but we are able to get close enough that our hydro picked them up and we then vectored in on the target. Thanks for the feedback! Glad you pointed that out, because others may have wondered the same thing.
I don’t get the change of intercept point when I change speed. I’m assuming I have a different game setting. Can you advise which setting might be giving it to you and not to me? ❤
We have the same settings. It only works if your sub is in a position where your submerged speed would be enough to intercept the ship. Often times, that means the target is approaching you. if you don't see the change, wait for a few minutes and just watch how the M1 location moves. That will give you a bead on direction, and you can plot your overhaul maneuver.
@@xljedi2335 Thanks very much! ❤️🇦🇺
😍 Question: when using the schedule does the crew also automatically handle filling the bottles?
What bottles?
@@xljedi2335 The compressed air
I don't understand the point for drawing your own velocity along the target vector (at about 7:40). All it does is extend the target course line and you don't seem to use it for any references afterwards. Wouldn't this method get the same result without that step?
Good question, thank you. I'm adding two vector radials together. If we didn't draw our radial vector at 7:40, how would you know where to plot the point on our bearing-to-target line at 8:35 in order to determine the vector intercept course? 🧐
@@xljedi2335 Oh, I see now. It helps to watch it on fullscreen and not my phone. I thought when you drew the bearing line you moved along that line with the magnitude of your own velocity, but you were actually plotting the intersection of the circle you drew earlier. That's the part I mis-understood. When you added the vector it wasn't just along the course of the target, it was meant to be the entire circle or all vectors. I've seen this done a different way where you draw the bearing line first and then assume you will intercept at the end of the target's vector. Then you plot your speed as a circle with the same magnitude to see where it intersects the bearing line. Exactly the same as you are doing here, I just got hung up on the order and the fact you happened to draw your own vector along the course of the target. I really enjoy your videos, please keep them coming!
Why does it seem every contact I get is going away from me at speeds I can only catch up to at full speed and then at a crazy angle?
Plot an overhaul using the method I mentioned in Strategic Navigation. Spend movement points to get into a better position.
@@xljedi2335 yeah. I tried that. But I could only catch at full speed. Then barely.
@@Anthony_Culotta The IIA in the North Sea typically encounters ships moving at about 7kts in the early war.
How do you get all the gauges to open up at the same time like that? Is that a mod?
I show how to do it in the first 5 mins or so of my Type IIA Crew Scheduling video.
I'm trying really hard not to use that convenient button where the game basically just tells me where my target is. and I'm finding it damn near impossible to accurately mark it. and if its going medium speed and is moving away from me I basically have no interest in trying to catch it. the only way I'm going to catch it is if I surface, and then I have no means of finding it.
I can deeply empathize with your desired playstyle.
Reading the memoirs of sub commanders a couple things became apparent: 1) they did not rely too heavily on the hydrophone or TMA (Target Motion Analysis) to locate targets and determine True Course (TC) rather, they would make surface observations at a distance where the ship was just over the horizon, so they would watch how the masts moved. 2) this approach required one thing that they had in abundance that we do not, TIME. If you have nothing better to do for hours/days than watch a ship zig-zagging then you can get a pretty good read on TC. 3) They would perform overhauls to catch targets by moving at or near flank on surface and keeping the target just over the horizon. This would allow them to work their way into a more advantageous position ahead of the TC.
In the 3rd chapter of Herbert Werner's memoir (Iron Coffins) he describes such an encounter while serving with Commander Paulssen aboard the U557. They observed and chased a ship on surface at flank for hours. The target was doing 14 kts, they made up ground on it over several hours, and because the target was zig-zagging they were able to advance on it more rapidly than if it had been cruising in a straight line. The point being, they didn't dip-down and use hydro to locate and advance on their targets. It was largely based on line of sight and using the curvature of the earth to stay below the horizon during the day and planning final approaches for attack at night on the surface. When Paulssen gave the final firing solution instructions he was in position for a 50° angled attack with the target at 1000m. He fired a spread of 2 torpedoes, and one hit and sank the ship.
What I've laid out in the few videos posted so far is the first step in moving toward the style of gameplay you'd like to achieve. The commanders and crew had the advantage of attending naval academy, understanding (adeptly) the principals of observation, marine navigation, and target intercept... all coupled with an over-abundance of TIME. Typically, it's patience and time that would discourage me from employing historical intercept methods.
I do however, from time-to-time, feel that I have to justify my methods to myself. So, I will use the hydrophone to find a target, perhaps use some TMA methods to determine TC. Then it would be a sprint on surface for an intercept using Dead Reckoning and maybe a vector intercept. Then, hopefully with the practice I have had laying out my attack strategies using the shortcut tools, I am able to determine a good firing solution and launch a 2 torpedo salvo to cover any error I may have introduced... and be successful.
For the scenario you describe, I would recommend you take a look (as a follow-up) at my Strategic Navigation video which you could use to plot an overhaul and put yourself in a good position to attack just like Paulssen in the U557. If interested in TMA concepts we might all decide to give that a try in a future video. In the mean time, use the shortcuts, become adept at understanding how big the target looks in your scope at 1.5x magnification (are you within the 2km kill radius?) and how the AoB advances based on your approach angle. You desire to complete the strategic exercise without the aid of game tools, but first let's get very good at the tactical because if we don't actually sink the ship when we arrive, it will be a bit discouraging. ...but keep your head up, and reload!
mhmm.. my interception lines don't react to changes to my velocity. :)
That's because you are not ahead of the target and interception at submerged speed continues to be impossible. All you have is the M1. In that case, just watch how the line changes over 3 minutes and 15 seconds. Plot M2, connect the dots, and you have both TC and Speed.
Maybe I'm just dumb but none of this is making sense to me. I have no idea where he's getting the numbers. He said 7 knots, but it shows km they are not the same. Then he comes up with a random speed, and I'm just so lost.
I use the measurement of km as a proxy for knots. It's only important that the two speed vectors I plot are using the same scale. It doesn't matter if it's km or miles, or nautical miles, or feet/meters. There's nothing random about the speed estimates, either it is precisely known info from the radio contact, or it is estimated given the radio contact info of "moving slow". I equate slow to 7 knots.
@xljedi2335 I understand what you're saying now. I was just being dumb lol. Thanks for responding. It's been very confusing, but I think I got it now.
Do the AI change speeds? When I finally tried it, I was not meeting up with the target. Or maybe I'm doing it wrong?
@@Numbers2Read They don't often change speed, no. They can change direction, particularly if you are tracking a target along a coastline.
@xljedi2335 That's what it must be. Thanks again.
I might be missing something but i don't think this is your first rodeo...
Wow. Step one. Use the map tools to determine direction. 🤦🏼♂️ needless to say I would of been a terrible captain 🤣 I was so frustrated like angle related to what.
Too much hypothesis of what an enemy ship may do and i hate making maths to intercept an enemy. I want to battle and not go back to school. This is not fun at all sorry this game is making me very bored i am disappointed. Ubisoft's Silent Hunter was more fun
What I discuss in these videos was all learned while playing Silent Hunter. We are plotting an intercept based on radio contact info. I did the same thing in Silent Hunter a decade ago. Sadly, math is not for everyone. 😔
Can you give the link to a handbook or textbook that explains this?
I know its basically trigonometry and vector math. I work with differential equations in finance and I trust I would be able to get it, but I'm honestly too lazy to look for the source on my own. However if you do link me I'll gladly study the math behind it!
The math comes from an understanding of solving a range of maneuvering board problems. There is a pretty broad field of sources available out there on the use of maneuvering boards for marine and radar navigation. I would look for "5090 Maneuvering Board" and maybe start with this link: archive.org/details/maneuveringboard00unit/mode/2up
@@xljedi2335 thank you so much!