BattleTech Guide: Armour - When, where and how much.

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  • Опубліковано 18 гру 2024

КОМЕНТАРІ • 76

  • @mksee66
    @mksee66 2 роки тому +5

    full front armor is a must in this game. Although rare, sudden enemy reinforcement from the rear can occur so if you don't have rear armor you're cooked.

    • @TheEdmon
      @TheEdmon  2 роки тому +4

      The thing to remember in BT is this: It's not what happens in the best case that kills you, it's what happens in the worst case.
      Build to deal with the situation where your surrounded and everything has gone wrong.

    • @snakept69
      @snakept69 Рік тому +3

      Rear armor can be skipped unless your mech is planning melee. By skip I mean the lip service of 10~15 for low lights and 30 for heavier stuff.
      While 95% of alphas from the back will pierce this armor they won't cause crits, thus keeping you mostly safe from a 1 time deal. Specially important Vs MGs. Other than that good planing is your best defense. Bullwark + Cover + Sentinel is an easy 60% dmg reduction and that makes your tanky mechs super tanky, specially Vs LRMs.

  • @cobrazax
    @cobrazax 3 роки тому +3

    i rarely use much rear armor. it cant benefit from any damage reduction, making it WAY less efficient than front armor.
    i focus almost everything on front armor, and add some light rear armor for closer combat mechs.

  • @DIRT4649
    @DIRT4649 6 років тому +8

    In single player maximum armour (and Bulwark if you can arrange it) is the only answer unless you want to rebuild your mechs every contract and\or train up more pilots because you're always outnumbered, evasion is worthless as anything other than a mitigation method for LRM\SRM spam and you will still get hit. Maybe allow back armour to drop a little and be really careful with your positioning, I keep it at 55 in base game and 65 in Roguetech because fast lights can mostly only carry PPC or Plasma at best (KILL THE TRASHCAN FAST) and you really should be stopping anything else getting behind you.

    • @TheEdmon
      @TheEdmon  6 років тому +2

      This is not quite true in the early game, where an extra ton or two of weapons makes a huge difference (both in standard and RogueTech). However, it is generally correct I think, once you start getting to medium-heavy 'mechs.

    • @DIRT4649
      @DIRT4649 6 років тому

      I don't disagree at all, early on an extra ML can make a difference but with how damn squishy lights are, you want to get out of them as fast as possible from an economic point of view in Roguetech. Once you start hitting even mediums the lights rapidly become a liability because you must move them out of position some of the time simply to keep the suicidal little buggers alive and if they've been hit (which will happen some of the time no matter how much evasion you have) they are effectively an empty drop slot unless you want to risk the very real chance the next shot cores them.

    • @ryzenforce
      @ryzenforce 3 роки тому

      @@TheEdmon The problem in the early game is that you mechwarriors miss a lot of easy 75%+ shot and that becomes costly and the reason you need to load up on armor. I prefer shoot less, but leave longer and not having my crew stand most of its time in the hospital and win vs 2:1 or 3:1 odds in every mission. But when I say this on the forum, I get called that told I don't know how to play.

    • @ryzenforce
      @ryzenforce 3 роки тому

      Exactly! Getting hit by enemy recruits on 6-7 chevron every single shot is becoming redundant when your crew can't hit anything at 7+ gun skill and 75% hit rate every round.
      All of your crew has that drawback except the crew you are given on certain missions (trainee for example) where warriors with 1 in gunning are able to hit constantly 6-7 chevron enemy 'mechs with 25% hit chance. The game is fixed and it shows.

  • @mrbroeders
    @mrbroeders 5 років тому +1

    For me - top half facing the enemy - full armour. Legs - half armour. Rear armour - half armour. Job done.

  • @Frenzy80
    @Frenzy80 4 роки тому +4

    I like your Vids and got it so far. But i didnt figure the 10% damage per ton out. Is it 10% from the Max damage?. So for instance 25 dmg per Ton would be 1. ML 100%, 2. ML 100%, 3. 50%, 4. ML 33% 5. ML 25%, 6. ML 20% per Ton? Does this also count for light mechs ? Because I like yielding the firestarter. But atm im still early in the campaign (2 skull Missions) and having a hard time. All the best from germany. Francois

    • @TheEdmon
      @TheEdmon  4 роки тому +3

      Hey, the idea is that it is always better to have more armour than anything else, because it is very weight efficient. You can't really go wrong with maxing out your armour and then adding weapons after.

    • @Frenzy80
      @Frenzy80 4 роки тому

      @@TheEdmon Okay thanks mate ^^

    • @mikewhitaker2880
      @mikewhitaker2880 4 роки тому +1

      actually you can go wrong doing max armor then weapons... but then i am going with decades of mechwarrior/battletech experience.... everything from tabletop rpg to most versions of varying PC games... it honestly depends on what mech your outfitting, what your outfitting it with, and ultimately the role in the lance/star that it fills... pilot skills also tend to add more to how the mech needs fitting... lets face it.. if your running a light mech than armor is never your first concern... weapons and other gear will be... because at some point that light mech will get one shot no matter how much its armored as it can only have X amount of armor... where as a heavy or assault mech can easily max armor no problem and still have tons of space for weapons.. enough in some cases to still one shot most lights....

    • @TheEdmon
      @TheEdmon  4 роки тому +1

      @@mikewhitaker2880 Yeah... nope. Sorry, the math supports going armour then adding weapons. You will always beat someone who isn't doing this, all circumstances being equal.

  • @thorveim1174
    @thorveim1174 2 роки тому +3

    my guess, "always, everywhere, as much as you can"

    • @TheEdmon
      @TheEdmon  2 роки тому

      Your guess is right! :D

  • @memeoverlord-pz5ns
    @memeoverlord-pz5ns 6 років тому +5

    I used LRM boat centurion with 100 armor across all mech. Until one battle it got sensor locked and two enemy mech hit it with LRMs. Since it had 4 LRM15 ++, i almost had a heart attack watching rockets hit him, fortunately damage was minimal, only launcher got crit. Then i downgraded it's firepower for decent armor. Now i have LRM boat highlander with full armor, i simply walk on enemies, draw fire, and retreat, works incredibly well.

    • @TheEdmon
      @TheEdmon  6 років тому +3

      It's not just being sensorlocked that good armour protects from, there are certain missions where enemies can teleport in behind you. If you are using fragile launch boats, it's going to be a bad time as that rear and side armour gets punched in from up close. It's never a mistake to tone the firepower down for armour, imo.

    • @memeoverlord-pz5ns
      @memeoverlord-pz5ns 6 років тому +1

      @@TheEdmon In main campaign there's mission where you have to stand in specified zone for number of rounds, while enemies surround you, but that's exception. It's not that hard to hide your glass LRM boat, but small chance of getting shot at exists. There are more cons than pros when making glass cannon, expensive weapons can be destroyed, pilot can die. Also your lance will have less armor overall and split damage across 3 mechs instead of 4, allowing enemy to focus down them faster.

    • @TheEdmon
      @TheEdmon  6 років тому +2

      Yeah, pretty much agree on all points here.

    • @cobrazax
      @cobrazax 3 роки тому

      @@memeoverlord-pz5ns
      well i first used a 4 LRM20 stalker. it had very limited armor (non at the rear) and heat problems too, at least in hot maps.
      it took too much damage too often, whenever i got flanked or ambushed...
      i changed it a bit to 2 LRM20 and 2 LRM 15, each type with both stab dmg bonus and damage bonus variants, for maximum variety in weapon targeting options.
      this enabled me to use more armor, and heat sinks.
      still, i often put my LRM boat in cover so it can almost double its effective armor, which makes it much more durable for its armor value.
      that i think is an ideal balance of firepower and armor.
      still, in most mechs i put minimal or no rear armor, and focus all on front armor. i usually dont have much tonnage for rear armor anyway, and i usually cant max front armor either...
      with leg armor i can usually cut a bit there, but i try to keep it a good amount above arm armor, as it can get hit very often from side attacks.
      for rear armor on close combat mechs, if u got the tonnage for it, i try to put at least 25 on each location, and sometimes 50+
      for longer range mechs...its usually 0 to 25.

  • @jaywerner8415
    @jaywerner8415 Рік тому

    Speaking from EXP from the Campaign, id say putting on armor in increments of 50 seems about right (for medium mechs and up). Generally 100 ISH armor (in the slots that allow it) for a Medium should be good enough for most combat scenarios.
    As for where to Put it, as noted it depends on the Mech. Although generally i would say "half" the Armor bar value is a good place to start then adjust as needed. Max the armor where your weapons are (particularly Concentrations of weapons), armor up the legs decently well, keep the Center as armored as possible and as for rear armor, generally 1/3 of the bar to 1/2 of the bar depending on tonnage. (IE if you have 100 do 50 or if its 150 do 50)

  • @Sorain1
    @Sorain1 6 років тому +2

    It's funny, but I've seen the AI implement that 'flee to show rear armor' strategy against me. They move, then brace instead of sprinting, but the basic point is that they show the armored side that's left (rear) to me. Though of course, the AI often fails to capitolize on that... and I often don't bother shooting that guy. On the other hand, I've seen the AI try that with a Hunchback 4G...

    • @TheEdmon
      @TheEdmon  6 років тому +2

      The A.I. is not very bright. If my recent "Stupid Assault" episode shows anything, it's that it's possible to win with 1:5 tonnage odds without taking any damage if you exploit how bad the A.I. is hard enough.

  • @Anon33467
    @Anon33467 4 роки тому +2

    Super helpful.

    • @TheEdmon
      @TheEdmon  4 роки тому

      Glad it helped you out :).

  • @Quincy_Morris
    @Quincy_Morris Місяць тому +1

    When some bloke shoots your thigh but somehow you don’t die that’s armore!

    • @TheEdmon
      @TheEdmon  Місяць тому

      When your comment hit a guy, from a 6 year old pizza pie, that's armore!

  • @chads2783
    @chads2783 6 років тому +3

    Q. When Where start Melee? Only Melee high heat/or Run?

    • @TheEdmon
      @TheEdmon  6 років тому +2

      You are looking for a guide on when it's a good idea to Melee? Instead of attacking with your standard weapons or running away?

    • @chads2783
      @chads2783 6 років тому +1

      Yea, Is just Damage/Stab/Heat. What do you consider when you switch to melee/standard weapons?

    • @TheEdmon
      @TheEdmon  6 років тому +2

      This is the second request for this, I will see about putting something together.

    • @Vagabond_Etranger
      @Vagabond_Etranger 6 років тому +1

      Melee is concentrated dmg, giving or receiving, just like precision shot. I avoid melee at all cost, have no support weapons, even though I run a grasshopper. Only melee if your heat is high, so as to cool down for 1-2 turns, then back to shooting again. If you're one of those that likes to melee, with a bunch of flamers, mg, sl, then melee to your heart's content.

    • @TheEdmon
      @TheEdmon  6 років тому +2

      Melee does have some key advantages, it has very high base chance to hit and ignores evasion. It does full damage even if you've lost all your weapons / arms / side torsos, etc. In RogueTech, evasion is very, very powerful and thus it's almost manditory in the early game to get anything done.

  • @E.D.998
    @E.D.998 7 місяців тому

    learned from MWO competitive: full armor, then remove 10% of the total amount, from the parts you can afford to lose. Play it, and add or remove by the feel of it. A good mech is one that finishes battle with 1 armor on every component, and nothing more. You need 10 battles to tune it, realistically.

    • @TheEdmon
      @TheEdmon  7 місяців тому

      This is a very different game from MWO though.

    • @E.D.998
      @E.D.998 7 місяців тому

      @@TheEdmon true, i Just started, that my two cents but i Will try your way for sure

  •  2 роки тому +2

    Having "right torso" on left side, and "left torso" on right side, and calling them "left hand mech" and "right hand mech", I'm unbelievably confused.

    • @TheEdmon
      @TheEdmon  2 роки тому

      Yeah, that confuses everyone at first, for sure.

  • @1kvolt1978
    @1kvolt1978 5 років тому

    Wow, this is a good one!

  • @WarwolfManimal
    @WarwolfManimal 3 роки тому

    Thanks love your vids

  • @davinperry5648
    @davinperry5648 5 років тому

    The new Raven makes it much easier to field a glass cannon, but the raven is still only a light mech.

    • @TheEdmon
      @TheEdmon  5 років тому

      It makes it much easier to win with your eyes closed XD.

  • @Emin.V.Aliyev1
    @Emin.V.Aliyev1 8 місяців тому

    You forgot to factor in damage reduction. With bulwark and other stuff you can get your damage reduction up to 80% meaning your 1 ton for 100 points of armor geta 4x value. Not a big deal but youre also assuming thaylt your weapon dmg per ton has a 100% hit rate which is not the case with evasion pips. When you consider all this. Armor per ton DRASTICALLY outweighs the value that a weapon provides per ton.

  • @sweetsour6783
    @sweetsour6783 5 років тому +2

    I find the game itself doesn't encourage me to use full armour all the time. Brawlers need maxed out armour. Scouts might as well have it maxed as well. Flankers need as much firepower as possible, such as a jenner, and can't afford to max their armour. And then you have really slow mechs with huge payloads. These mechs are the most powerful ones (think the hunchie or centurion or atlas or KC) but are too slow to be effective brawlers. I can't load them up with SRM's and med lasers, so I give slow powerful mechs like that long range weapons. Ranged weapons are less efficient in terms of dmg per ton/heat, but these mechs have higher payloads to make up for it. In order to exploit this concept I also don't max out the armour on these mechs. These fire support mechs stay away from the enemy, with long range weapons, and thus I find it a waste to max out their armour. Should I make them glass cannons? No. But do I need heavy armour everywhere? No. A fire support mech can, in my experience, get away with loading only 50% of its max armour.

    • @TheEdmon
      @TheEdmon  5 років тому +3

      There are a number of maps where the enemy can spawn in right next to you and/or behind you. There are also maps which are very small and/or open. Reduced armour for long range firesupport is a tactic that works well 90% of the time, but it's that 10% of the time that the unit gets caught and focused that's the issue. Since you have little control over mission RNG, it makes sense to run heavy armour and share it out around your lance.
      You can get away with it, but it's not a risk I generally take.

    • @sweetsour6783
      @sweetsour6783 5 років тому +1

      @@TheEdmon I'm watching your videos but it will take a while to see all your lance layouts. Do you generally run with 4 brawlers or do you build mechs to have both long and short range weapons? I don't like stock builds much because I like to specialize a mech to be either a long range or a short range fighter. As for the armour, I have definitely learned that making glass cannons is super risky, as you say. But I don't think an Atlas with 50% of its max armour, with long range weapons, could be called a glass cannon. It can still take quite a number of hits, especially as it will be at range.

    • @TheEdmon
      @TheEdmon  5 років тому +1

      @@sweetsour6783 It depends on what equipment I have available. On the ultra hard campaigns, I typically have to make do with whatever is laying around. If I wanted to minmax and make my game as easy as possible, I would spam LRM boats and/or SRM+ML brawlers. They offer the best damage / ton over the other weapons.

    • @sweetsour6783
      @sweetsour6783 5 років тому +1

      @@TheEdmon I did win the campaign using sensor lock and LRM boats, but my god it was tough at times. I found in the late game when fighting assaults I would often run out of missiles, it just took too many barrages to take down the enemies, and that was with using breaching shot!

    • @TheEdmon
      @TheEdmon  5 років тому

      @@sweetsour6783 Take more ammo, less launchers and pack JJ and use them to jump away from approaching enemies. Ace Pilot also helps a lot in the strategy.
      For reference, a good build for a stalker is 4xLRM15, 6-8 cans of ammo and 3 Jump Jets, with full or near full armour.

  • @suikodin2501
    @suikodin2501 3 роки тому +1

    Rear armor:
    A sprinting away mech contributes as much to the fight as a dead mech. The only time to rear armor is if you are going to have the mech in the fray (ie scout). Long range mechs should have 0 rear armor, because if you need rear armor on them, you have already lost. Any unused armor after a fight represents missed opportunity for offensive damage. So if you come back from multiple missions with undamaged areas, consider removing that armor from future fights.
    Mech combat is a lot about killing before getting killed. And as was beautifully illustrated with the left vs right fight, more firepower will swing a fight.

    • @TheEdmon
      @TheEdmon  3 роки тому +2

      That's not true, the A.I. will target rear armour if it can get it. Sometimes you can show it deliberately to draw fire away from other mechs. It also allows you to run around behind the enemy with confidence your back will hold if someone is behind you.

    • @Sukerkin
      @Sukerkin 3 роки тому

      Is … is … is that … Le Boeff?!?! :)

    • @Sukerkin
      @Sukerkin 3 роки тому

      @@TheEdmon Aye :). Just yesterday I had jumped in to get an advantageous position on the bad guys. My back was to some steep hills … guess where the reinforcements dropped? :eek:. If it was not for rear armour my Atlas would likely be dead!

  • @BNRmatt
    @BNRmatt 4 роки тому

    What mods are you running here?

    • @TheEdmon
      @TheEdmon  4 роки тому +1

      None, this is an old basegame video. Though the lesson of the day "always add armour first" is still as true now as it was then.

    • @BNRmatt
      @BNRmatt 4 роки тому

      How do you have a Mackie?

    • @TheEdmon
      @TheEdmon  4 роки тому

      @@BNRmatt In Battletech Revised, you can get the Mackie.

  • @tomservo5347
    @tomservo5347 3 роки тому +1

    Great explanation on armor. So basically BattleTech has infused the ages long contest between armor and offensive capabilities. Bought this yesterday after much deliberation as I get intimidated by stats. Right now I'm just playing skirmishes in order to get a feel for it. I find myself trying to lure the enemy into kill zones and fighting with a more defensive mindset.

  • @Meiershans
    @Meiershans 6 років тому

    What you think about the EWS Mod that makes harder to hit but weight 3t. I think its to heavy.

    • @TheEdmon
      @TheEdmon  6 років тому +1

      I agree, I'm not even sure what it does tbh. I don't notice any difference.

  • @josephknightcom
    @josephknightcom 4 роки тому +2

    Keep up the good content but... conciseness. audio mixing. This is my constructive feedback, ignore it as you see fit. Best wishes.

    • @TheEdmon
      @TheEdmon  4 роки тому

      This video is actually very old. Much has improved since this was posted, in the areas you describe.

  • @polishguywithhardtospellna8227
    @polishguywithhardtospellna8227 5 років тому

    14:07 .....or sharding? ha ha ha

  • @CMDRFandragon
    @CMDRFandragon 6 років тому +2

    R U th3b33f?

    • @TheEdmon
      @TheEdmon  6 років тому +1

      No, of course not. I just do a joking impression of him XD. Glad you think it's that good though lol.

  • @karlhunt
    @karlhunt 4 роки тому

    What am I watching? How often do you hit a point where mechs ACTUALLY start one shotting each other? I mean really...

    • @TheEdmon
      @TheEdmon  4 роки тому +1

      Not sure I understand your comment. But to answer your question, with precision strikes one shots are easily possible against most weight classes.
      This is more true now with Heavy Metal, as some of the UAC's and quirks are very overpowered.