I'd argue that the aesthetic profiles (Mel and Vorthos) are even more important in 40K than they are in Magic. Or at least Vorthos is. The fantasy/lore of each army is a big part of them, and the dedication it takes to assemble and paint them all pushes you to get at least a little invested in that sort of thing.
@@thepoorhammerpodcast didn’t even know those two profiles existed, and boy they are necessary when discussing 40K. Vorthos is like, a good chunk of the entire community as painting and reading lore is the primary way for a lot of people to enjoy 40K, myself included.
Melvin (Mike when I learned it) seems really good too. The gameplay = story aspect. This character does this because of story and it translates well in game.
@@thepoorhammerpodcast Ah, Was going to mention that Mark actually added a "new" article (and by new I mean 2015...). Yeah, Would have been cool to see how you feel the Factions would fit into them.
Another thing about these personalities is that while everyone has all 3 of these, I think that oftentimes two will inform the one. Example, I have a stronger Johnny than Timmy or Spike, but how I choose to self express, or the catalyst for an idea, can be informed by Timmy or Spike. Like, "this army/list is very strong, but I want to win MY way," or "Man this model is freaking cool, I wonder how I can make it work effectively?"
Those are exactly my thoughts. I would think, I am like 50% Johnny, 40% Spike and 10% Timmy. This varies depending on context and the three interact with each other. ("Is it really strong enough?" - "Does this work how I want it to work?" - "But this model....")
Seeing admech in Spike was a shock to me but the explanation made a lot of sense. I see myself as a Timmy-Johnny-Spike (in that order) and just love the look and flavor of admech and the jankyness of how they play. Its like standing in the control room of chernobyl and just marveling at all the cool buttons and knobs and indicators. I never would have considered how that would usually appeal more to spikes. Fascinating stuff!
I think they were off the mark by labelling Ad Mech - and especially GSC - as mainly Spike-type factions. I see them as leaning more heavily towards Johnny for much of the same reasons as Thousand Sons. I really like your control room metaphor! Johnny *wants* to be in that control room with a million buttons. Even if there's an easier, or better, path to victory. Spike *tolerates* it - IF it's the best path to victory. Or if he sees that he can just ignore 90% of the buttons and focus on the "important" ones. Timmy *dislikes* being in that room. He will want to leave, even if staying is the best path to victory. He wants fewer - but bigger - buttons
@@RagDollRatnew player here, and I grabbed GSC units because I read books and played some games, and have always been a fan of the Nids and GSC, so got into the game when the Leviathan box dropped and got a combat patrol of GSC because I wanted to make a cult based on the Hive Fleet I am making
I feel like a Timmy-Spike combo is especially toxic if they aren't self-aware. EDIT: After watching up to the Custodes part, I realized that I am a Timmy-Spike lmao
im currently working on that, too. i feel so shitty about getting all caught up in my frustrations and wanting to win; it needs to be fun for everyone, not just me
That's interesting! I think there's very little overlap in (possible) positive or negative traits between Timmy and Spike. Which can be a good thing, if the positives cancel out the negatives. But can also make it pretty miserable to play against someone that has the negative traits of both. Timmy is probably the most likely to pout when you kill his units. Because then he doesn't get to do the exciting thing! Spike doesn't care if all their units are killed, if that helps them win the game. But Spike probably has the highest risk of being a sore loser. A "bad" Timmy-Spike wants their units to kill all of your units, but will get mad when their own units are killed. And then be a sore loser afterwards. But a "good" Timmy-Spike celebrates when exciting stuff happens for either player. And can enjoy the act of *playing* to win whether or not they actually win.
Maybe I'm a "good" Timmy-Spike? I don't play meta lists because I buy models based on aesthetic, but I memorize rules, measure sight lines carefully, MathHammer religiously to figure out which of my units should go into their units, and enjoy winning on points. But at one and the same time, I play Evil Sunz Orks, everything I have goes FASTA and my favorite part of the game is yelling WAAAAAGH! Having fun with my opponent is way more important than winning, but I'll still read all my opponents rules and data sheets before the game and come up with detailed game plans.
@@scotwilcox1771 I think it's a misconception that Timmy is the only one who play to have fun. All the archetypes play to have fun - they just have different definitions of what "fun" means. A "bad" Johnny/Timmy/Spike is someone who thinks only their own idea of fun is valid, someone who only cares about *their own* enjoyment of the game, and/or acts poorly when what they consider fun doesn't happen. A "bad" Timmy-Spike isn't someone who plays metalists or strong factions. There's absolutely nothing wrong with any of that! A "bad" Timmy-Spike is someone who gets annoyed if Johnny is focused on his complicated combo rather than joining in a "WAAAGH" yell at that moment. That's not having fun. That's insisting on having fun in a way that makes Johnny have less fun. For perspective, I'm somewhat of an anti-Timmy. I love the social aspect of the game, friendly banter and having a laugh while playing. But I mostly find Timmy's idea of having fun in a game very unappealing. And I tend to have the least fun when playing against Timmys. I have fun by *competing* , trying to play my absolute best, and thinking of clever solutions to in-game problems.
I tried a few factions before falling for the sisters, it's the beauty of the models and the joy of painting them that drives us. I'm predominantly a Johnny but I'm convinced asthetics drives sisters players. I love my big dumb Space Wolves but, assembling and painting Sisters just hits different.
Wow you guys summed up Tau perfectly and made me realize why I sold my army. I'm like 70% Timmy and that faction was miserable to play. I tried making some weird combos and refused to play certain units, and it just got me continually curb stomped. You're forced to Spike so hard despite their being an illusion of Johnny and Timmy.
This was a really interesting video. I’d love to see a psychographics video of all of the SM chapters (loyal and traitor). Keep up the great work lads! The Emperor protects!
As more of a johnny style player generally, I am not scared to admitt hat Custodes bring out my inner timmy and GSC brings out my inner spike. I play super casually so I can get away with really dumb lists a lot, so I might not be the best point of comparison.
I used to play purely hyper competitive modern and then legacy, I recommend that every spike out there find another part of the hobby they love. Magic burnt me out, because I couldn’t put in the time to get any better, so I don’t play much magic anymore. I went to warhammer where I read one book about the guard fell in love and built the guard army my heart told me to instead of the meta. Some day I’m sure I’ll build a super comp stomp tau list or something someday when they are broken. If it’s a hobby and not a job, Find the hobby you love and then engage your competitive side because when a hobby is purely competitive it’s becomes a chore in my experience.
I'd probably argue after listening to this that there's defo more archetypes than simple Timmy, Johnny and Spike - mainly I think between Timmy and Johnny you've got players who cater their armies to narrative or lore-based stuff - they're not so concerned with rule interactions etc as they're making an army that more fits a narrative or style, but they're not really Timmy because they're not just picking the biggest, coolest things because they're constraining themselves to the external source of the lore surrounding that faction. I'd say a lot of Horus Heresy players fit into this archetype, as well as stuff like 40k players who play stuff like Marine chapters that aren't necessarily competitive but they want to represent their lore on the tabletop. Additionally I'd also argue that there's at least 2 kinds of Spike - so you've got the Spike who represents competitive players who want a challenge, and that's your Genestealer Cults or AdMech players, who want to win games but find their enjoyment in the challenge of developing new or complex tactics, or original list building. A lot of the faction-specific channels on here like say Blood Angels Commander fall into this list, as they're happy to play a faction they like even if at times they're the underdog, but enjoy finding ways they can win against the odds. They're good sports, but they're still there to win. Then there's the other type of Spike player - who doesn't care about the complexity of the game or developing new tactics and simply wants to win at all costs. They mainly care about the meta right now, they're happy to jump between armies to whatever meta is overpowered right now rather than adjust their tactics for a chosen faction. They're the easiest to name; they're a Dave. Because That Guy is nearly always called Dave (sorry Daves). A true Spike is the kind of person who comes up with the Speedwaagh because they wanted to see what would happen. Once it becomes apparent it's ridiculously overpowered they move on and try to do something more challenging. A Dave is the kind of guy who hears about it then immediately buys 9 trucks on ebay. Then cries when a month later GW say he can only have 3.
I would have considered sisters a Johnny army because of how much fun the hero building and the buffs are but I see your point on the spike aspect. but that may be bias as a big Johnny, I love making heroes more than playing the game. Herohammer is my favourite part of the hobby. I have never run a list not capped on Hqs(at least in the main detachment)/Leaders in 40k/Aos
My nature is that I want to win, but only because I was the better player. I always loved Eldar who had very specific roles for their models and had to be used correctly to be effective but were highly effective when you did so.
I was happy I found a Johnny playstyle for Votann with custom subfactions: +1S to beam weapons, making the thunderkyn conversion beamer S7 -> 8 and bonus to charge towards judgement tokens allowing a good chance to charge from deep strike. I'm sad I haven't been able to build my army up to play anything higher than 500p games to experience these mechanics meaningfully before the 10th rules reset.
totally late, but I would like to make a case for Jonny knights: as the big outlier that feels like playing a different game, knights allow for uniqueness, especially because, for practical reasons, they are played less than other factions. Jonny loves that. In 9th, this was accentuated by the character building aspect of it. Having all your mechs as characters and giving them cool relics and traits allowed for a lot of customisation. And then 10th came and reduced it all to enhancements. Shame that.
I’m a nearly 100% Johnny Harley player. EVERY SINGLE painted Harley of mine has a first and last name made up using Scots-Gaelic/Sindarin. I ONLY run “true troupes” (one troupe troop with one of every pivotal role) and I don’t mix troupes. My Twilight troupe doesn’t have a Troupe Master because the co-lead players haven’t beat out the other for the title yet.
That's Vorthos IIRC. Johnny is about expressing yourself through excessively niche rules combos you do to show how clever you are. Vorthos is about having head canon, RP, obsessing over lore accuracy etc.
Big Johnny player. I will be reading a ton of rules and one will catch my eye, and then I will build a whole meme list around that specifically. Weird Forge World character has a unique rule? That deserves a whole army to take advantage of it.
You know, I went into this episode (yes it's old I just go through random older episodes when they strike my fancy) expecting you guys to get the psychographics all wrong, because Magic players get them wrong _constantly._ Like they have such clear and understandable niches but people just devolve and devolve them into absolute parodies of themselves. But you guys really got it down and for the most part, I made an effort to try to estimate what psychographic I think each army fell into and I matched up pretty close with you guys. One thing that I think might help determine a Spike army is that Spike really likes resource management, so any of those armies that have a reserve of points or dice that they can use to manipulate the game and massage RNG are pure Spike fuel. Spike loves getting to manage resources efficiently. The one part that really threw me off is I fully expected Space Marines to be the dead middle (Timmy likes the big armor men, Johnny likes the sheer breadth of units and auras to mix and match, Spike likes that they're GW's golden boys and thus are guaranteed first crack at all the new mechanics and gameplay modes, and when Space Marines are bad they're rarely bad for long because Marines being bad is literally bad for business). Then I thought, "oh Space Marines aren't the middle because they're making sure they make a choice, they're not gonna give any to the middle of the chart", and then you put like three armies all in the middle, lmao. But I do feel like the ones you put in the middle were solid choices. Just an overall solid episode!
I think I am a Johnny - Spike - Timmy. Playing Grey Knights, I want to mainly play Terminators and Paladins to them deep Strike them in. And then get the best result by using a slant list.
I try and be Timmy, but I end up being Spike. As an Engineer, by profession, I see everything about gaming, in general, breaking down to a mathematical equation and probability fields. My joy is in optimization.
Being a predominantly Timmy player, hearing you discuss how a Spike sees the Drukhari codex probably explains why I have such a bad winrate with them. All I think is, "the haemonculus looks like a cool guy, why wouldn't he be in my army multiple times?"
Such interesting topic, this doesn't only apply to the game, you could track very specific personality traits on a much broader audiences of you expand a bit more on each arequeotype? Kind of player? Style? Whatever, although I dont play tabletop (why do I listen to this Podcast then? Becuase is really good and well execute, even if you don't care much for the actual game, is a very interesting thing to listen too if you are on 40k lore and models) I can see myself more into the the Jonny-Timmy type player, I prioritize enjoyment and expression above winning (although I like to show my skills at some extent so spike still living on me) there's a wonderful video call "how your personality define what type of game you play" which relay a lot in this article but expand on it a bit more, a lot of these type of video are super interesting to watch, since it give more insight on what type of person you are base on how you play and not the other way around (but in not a psychologist so dont take too serious)
I like that it's said that everyone has parts of all three. Still, there's no way I'm bringing a Sprocyst and a bunch of Hormagaunts and not leaning into that Johnny aspect. I try to win obviously, but I'd feel dirty playing Crusher Stampede (ever) or Leviathan with Warrior spam. A win doesn't mean anything if I have to use something that is clearly broken in order to achieve it.
Real Like your Podcast, and I'm happy to know that there are other nerds like me who play MTG and WH. So I realy like the crossreverences inbetween. Greatings from Germany
Ive heard the term "Timmy" applied before but i didnt know what it meant. Now that I know, my Seraphon/Ironjawz ass is 100% a Timmy with the occasional Spike kicker.
Another good video. However i feel that associating That Guy with Spike is a little dubious (not that you did that much), i'm not that familiar with the profiles but i doubt the intention is to paint one of the 3 in a negative light/cast Timmy and Johnny as more 'virtuous' so to speak. Really we all know that the That Guys can be any of the three. I remember being tabled by a Spike but he was really nice and the only one willing to play a pick up game with a stranger.
Odd in my country there are two more . And they are the dominant ones. First is, we all have to have it just as bad ,as everyone else and the one that takes pleasure from other people not having fun. Making their combos not work, make the game a slog, etc. It is more important to them, then winning.
I would be interested to see the background of players in relation to their profile. How many NEETs are Spikes, how many lawyers are Johnnys, ect. Theres a doctor in my play group and he's straight Timmy, just wants to stomp monsters around.
As a heavy Timmy-slant player, GSC seems very heavily appealing to me as a cool Spike list, I just wish they had like one or two named characters with rules, that persisted in the lore and were available to play on the tabletop. It seems odd and so obvious to me that we dont have any named character attempting to openly politick for the tyrranids by bold-face lying about what the GS do. Its a shame that they tend to eat any and everyone associated with the GSC as soon as the invasion arrives
I'm a total Timmy, as I'm still fairly new, but I fully intend to play Ad Mec with lots if Kastelans, Skorpecs, and Khataphrons, as well as a giant F off knight. Why you ask? Because my Skitariii can swarm like tiny ants under giant robots, cannons, tanks, and walkers. Big guns, big fire power. It'll also interest the Johnny side to be like "I want to bring back House Taranis in all red, black, and white glory" lol. Spike will come experience.
I didn't know I was a Timmy. I play well and try and be competitive, and I also feel I have to express myself, but damn every Timmy thing is cool. I have to field the big stompy thing or whatever has a turbo laser annihilation beam, I can't stop myself it is too cool. I want to win really bad, but I'd rather have fun
I am def a Timmie and damn proud of it. :) I started admech back in 8th after 20 year away from the game. I just loved how they looked! but then 9th came along and i havent played them due to too much rules and stuff to remember. So i started custodes and went to 30k instead. So now nearly 5k painted admech is sitting collecting dust on shelf. And now i wanted to play AoS aswell and started SoB! cant wait to throw opponent monsters around :) Admech might see play in 10th.
I'm definitely Timmy/johnny big dumb but not so dumb at times. Love knights thousand sons, custodes. But my true live is chaos undivided or dark eldar.
I did a breakdown like this for DnD. I have decades of gaming experience and degrees in clinical and social psychology. I was banned for it from the forum. Funny thing is, people denied being what they are... while actually demonstrating exactly that they were it. =/
I'm a big Timmy with a splash of Johnny, not very Spikey in general, but something about Drukhari and Adepta Sororitas appeal to me. Not sure if it's the theming or something else, but those 2 factions just seem to pull my attention.
I'm mostly Johnny and I play GSC, but I don't disagree with your assessment. I think the uphill battle thing that guard has is even more present with GSC, and pulling off the weird combos with a lot of setup are the Johnny parts. However.... I'm not exactly winning when I go play them. I don't understand all the other armies or practice enough to win like a spike would.
They do Psychic pretty well actually, for a while they were the strongest Psychic army, with the Maleceptor being actually broken during that point. Then add in Shadow in the Warp and they'll be messing up other Psykers while they're at it.
I most certainly tend towards Timmy though I do like to make combo every once in a while. That being said I hate how many stratagems there are, I hate the secondary objectives and I hate turn doctrines
I don't ever play named characters because i feel like them dying or being critically injured in these random fights doesnt make sense to me. So I make up a custom warband or chapter or regiment and it's THEIR story. Each game is a story in my custom armies' lore. I run lists that have some good models but I nerf myself without named characters like Magnus to carry my Thousand Sons
I feel like I'm probably 45% Timmy and 45% Johnny and like 10% Spike. I really like running fluffy games like for my SM I like to bring a wide array of the Primaris Options if I can, and for my Druhkari I like run real space raids rather than focus on one part. I also really like custom stuff, I love the narrative custom hero stuff and making my own subfactions and stories behind them. But part of me still wants to win, so if my opponent is bringing some daemon primarch or big chungus unit I'll bring a knight with my SM or some Reapers with my Druhkari. Etc but winning is the least important to me of the three
And here i am just thinking that the units are cool and my urdge to collect things like a magpie make me kind of want to play the game but really want to 3d print them and paint them
Great video, but I think you are significantly off on both Drukhari and Aeldari. You're off on Drukhari because of a fundamental misunderstanding part of Timmy as a psychographic. You have taken to heart that Timmy likes big and Timmy likes options, but have failed to recognize that Timmy likes WIDE too. Yes Timmy plays Eldrazi, but Timmy is also the reason Doubling Season is a $100 card (cause it ain't in a competitive deck and only does so much for Johnny strategies). Yes Imperial knights are very big, but attacks that roll a shit load of dice are also Timmy, and 20 Wyches with upgrades can make 85 hit rolls, and that is extremely Timmy. As for the Aeldari, I think it is both less Timmy and more Spike than you gave it credit for. As for the Timmy side, I would argue that the main appeals to Timmy are: big/wide, tough, impactful, and cool looking, and arguably they shy away from complex. They have the ability to go big, I will give you that, but typically wraiths, aspect warriors, and outcasts all represent smaller more specialized units. The only units that can go wide are guardians, and they don't reward you for it the way actual wide armies do. The typical toughness for the codex is T3. You don't tend to have a single unit that is that impactful, rather you have a variance of units that cover eachothers' weaknesses. And as for cool looking, you pointed out spiders, but about half their line is still in finecast and some characters are still in metal. And their complexity is fairly self apparent as a squishy highly mobile army. As for the Spike side, Strands of Fate is a variance reducer, their main psyker doesn't have to deal with perils of the warp, their psychic powers are consistently support powers that reduce variance, and Battle Focus allows you to emphasize positioning without costing you shooting. Overall I believe Aeldari are near the middle favoring Johnny.
I'd add that your relative levels of Timmy, Spike, and Johnny fluctuate even between opponents. You have that friend you love to beat hard. You have that kid you take it easy on because it's just such good sport goofing off with them. You have that friend who made you read the three thousand word treatise on their Chapter's history - and you're secretly jealous your lore isn't as good. Your level of Timmy, Spike, and Johnny fluctuates personally and interpersonally.
Tyranids are a timmy trap but are a 100% Johnny faction, i mean cmon it has a ton of weird mechanics no one else has, tyranids have sporocyst, a fortification thats a monster and gives birth to summons every round, or harpy an aircraft that births summons in drive byes xD
Yeah they just need to balance them to actually be good. I'll bring a Sportscast every game, but I know it is absolute garbage. I understood why Tyranids were top tier and broken, but it's a little frustrating getting repeated nerfs to the broken things and no buffs to the things no one else wants to ever touch. It's like they don't know WHY people gravitate toward the broken things. Like, great, Warrior spam is broken because of Leviathan, so why did you nerf Warriors instead of...Leviathan?
I can't find a favorite faction I want to buy my first army and have it be a easy paint job but I am not inclined upon buying blood angels or ultramarines I thought eldar as a first army but then I wasn't sure after considering a first army they may be a little tough I like the color gold so I might do a custom army. Its hard as I have several favorites eldar, necrons, genestealer cults, adeptus custodes, astra militarum specifically maccabian janissaries, blood angels, iron hands, raven guard, salamanders, nightlords, thousand sons, emperor's children, iron warriors, alpha legion. My play style preference is ambush tactics or guerilla warfare.
GSC there is no Jimmy? Guys Muscle Beach has been a thing for ages. GSC players are always looking for way to run 20+ Aberrants regardless how poop they are on the game.
I'm sorry about your furnace, I change them out for a living. Also you have the combo player and fucking stack grinder swapped lol in terms of magic goes vs. how you described it
I completely agree, from an aesthetic point of view it's quite Timmy (or it just procs my Timmy lol). It's a very over the top army with the pipe organ missiles, small ladies with guns as big as them, nun mechs etc... I do have to agree with them though that gameplay wise they're more spike/johny
The esthetic us very Timmy but if you meet SOB play (hi, its me) you'll find that they wont use the tanks. Maybe a rhino for some Flamer Redistributors most but mostly no tanks (shame tho. Hoping the Tank changes in 10th will make them a viable choice
I think everything in 40K has at least a little Timmy. The universe is so over the top and dumb in a good way and The minis are so in your face about their aesthetic, that you just have to be a Timmy to play 40k.
40K is built, first and foremost, on Rule of Cool. There's a certain baseline of Spectacle that runs through every army, that Timmy can attach to. If committed enough to a particular brand of Cool, Timmy will tolerate anything. That said, some armies facilitate Timmy's fun better than others. Some, like Knights or Orks, are _made_ for Timmy.
Me at the start of this episode: "Man, I bet I'm mostly Johnny with a fair amount of Timmy mixed in." Brad and Erik describing any army I play: "This is the most Timmy shit I've ever seen."
(Vorthos moment) The moment I realized I wanted to build Knights was when I was flipping thru the codex and each sample Knight had actual written backstory, and my brain reflexively made the backstory for my first knight. It's like making a D&D character, you shouldn't be allowed to field a Knight if they don't have a name and backstory. -edit:Vorthos not Johny. Also I just realized Johnny has Stifle on his shirt, and it's the perfect card. Timmy wouldn't run interaction, Spike runs goodstuff like Counterspell, Bolt, etc. Only Johny would run Stifle to counter one ability. But Stifle is also his worst fear, it ruins his perfect intricate combo.
More like a Vorthos moment, as you’re doing it for story. Unless you like how the units play exactly how you’d imagine irl, then Melvin. Whereas Johnny looks at how to combo abilities to do something crazy even if it doesn’t win them the game, so long as they did the complicated stupid move.
Timmy is the kind of guy, who loves playing "high risk" strategies. It doesn't matter that it didn't work out the past 19 times, because the ONE TIME it does work out, it's going to be absolutely amazing and he'll speak about it for days. Hell, everyone in the LGS speaks about it for days. To Timmy, Warhammer is a "playground", in which they want to have fun. Johnnys come in all different shapes and sizes. Some want to show off their cool kitbashes, some want to tell you about the lore of their custom hero, some want to show you this cool synergy they found. But at its very core, the Johnny wants to say "Look at cool thing I did". To Johnny, Warhammer is a stage, in which they present themselves. Spikes generally care about "proving something". Usually it's winning, but sometimes it's also making a bad thing work. To a Spike, there is a challenge, and they want to show you that they can overcome it. To them, Warhammer is a skill test, in which they have to prove that they have the skills. --- I would argue that Johnny can find some joy in Orks, especially kitbashing. Johnny is the kind of guy, who has a one-of-a-kind model for everything in his army. His Gorkanaut has been kitbashed from two jets and looks like a transformer. His Warboss uses a 3D printed space marine armor, painted like ultramarines, and then "hastily" painting black and white over to show his Warboss is a true Goff git. All of these are about self expression too.
I think there is an aspect to the armies that has gone partially ignored here - the dice. There was some talk of how Spike wants to minimize randomness/dice chance, but my Timmy brain jumps with glee when picking up giant handfuls of dice, doesn't matter how they roll or if they are even useful - flinging two handfuls of cubes like birdshot is just plain fun.
We like warp spiders because we like warp spiders, not because their minis haven’t been updated. This can also apply to a lot of other aspect warriors :(
Perfect placement for T’au. Came for the Battlesuits, still here for the Battlesuits, but I’ve been forced into a Spike playstyle to avoid getting tabled too quickly If I’m playing with someone newer to the hobby or someone I’ve built a rapport with, I skew towards a less competitive battlesuit bash list. But for every other match it feels like I have to constantly be playing 3D chess to have a fighting chance and I know how frustrating that can be to play against
Yeah I have a friend who just has the leviathan box tyranids, and I have been trying to run stuff that is fun for them but most of my stuff is xv8 and hammerhead tanks. Most everything I have is brutal to play against for that box.
Man you hit the nail on the head for Tau, got into them purely for lore and aesthetics for my first army. First couple of games with friends and I am shooting all their stuff off of the board and doing nothing else. Felt terrible. So I got GK for my second army and being able to customize my list for the game to be more interactive is amazing. Plus the fact that i play in more than one phase with GK hahaha
I'm almost completely a Timmy, I know that I can't play enough to "get good" so I instead play to have fun instead as it feels less bad about a butt kicking, though I'm older and I think as you get older you try to maximize fun with the little free time you have.
I'd argue that the aesthetic profiles (Mel and Vorthos) are even more important in 40K than they are in Magic. Or at least Vorthos is. The fantasy/lore of each army is a big part of them, and the dedication it takes to assemble and paint them all pushes you to get at least a little invested in that sort of thing.
We had probably a 30 minute debate about just skipping and doing Melvin/Vorthos or Vorthos deep dive first. It's guaranteed we'll cover it.
@@thepoorhammerpodcast I would love to see that video. Just finding out these concepts have really opened my eyes to what kind of gamer I am.
@@thepoorhammerpodcast didn’t even know those two profiles existed, and boy they are necessary when discussing 40K. Vorthos is like, a good chunk of the entire community as painting and reading lore is the primary way for a lot of people to enjoy 40K, myself included.
Melvin (Mike when I learned it) seems really good too. The gameplay = story aspect. This character does this because of story and it translates well in game.
@@thepoorhammerpodcast Ah, Was going to mention that Mark actually added a "new" article (and by new I mean 2015...). Yeah, Would have been cool to see how you feel the Factions would fit into them.
The difference between a Johnny and spike T'au player is "of course I have a stormsurge" versus "why would I need a stormsurge?"
This is me wanting a baneblade for guard or wanting a Fellblade or smthm
And Timmy says "Hey guys, look at my Manta! " 😂
@@shanecrowe8517 Yup!
Ta'unar Supremacy.
Another thing about these personalities is that while everyone has all 3 of these, I think that oftentimes two will inform the one.
Example, I have a stronger Johnny than Timmy or Spike, but how I choose to self express, or the catalyst for an idea, can be informed by Timmy or Spike. Like, "this army/list is very strong, but I want to win MY way," or "Man this model is freaking cool, I wonder how I can make it work effectively?"
Looking back I saw this happen to myself in 8th edition. "Riptides are really cool. It's meta to take 3, you say?"
Those are exactly my thoughts. I would think, I am like 50% Johnny, 40% Spike and 10% Timmy.
This varies depending on context and the three interact with each other. ("Is it really strong enough?" - "Does this work how I want it to work?" - "But this model....")
I see a new Poorhammer Podcast, I click Like immediately. Now to watch it while I work. You guys rock!
Absolutly Same :D
Nothing better than a perfectly listenable podcast about my favorite hobbies(all while on company time). Same
those guys are srsly underrated
Currently doing the same while organizing inventory :D perfect work podcast
@@LOOPS188 dude me too! We must be long lost twins!😅😅😅
Seeing admech in Spike was a shock to me but the explanation made a lot of sense. I see myself as a Timmy-Johnny-Spike (in that order) and just love the look and flavor of admech and the jankyness of how they play. Its like standing in the control room of chernobyl and just marveling at all the cool buttons and knobs and indicators. I never would have considered how that would usually appeal more to spikes. Fascinating stuff!
Same here but I'm thinking of adding imperial knights for the timmy side of me to go ham
I'm the exact same way. It's part of why I'm REALLY considering getting that new Seraphon box set or a Knight box set when it gets released again
I think they were off the mark by labelling Ad Mech - and especially GSC - as mainly Spike-type factions. I see them as leaning more heavily towards Johnny for much of the same reasons as Thousand Sons.
I really like your control room metaphor! Johnny *wants* to be in that control room with a million buttons. Even if there's an easier, or better, path to victory. Spike *tolerates* it - IF it's the best path to victory. Or if he sees that he can just ignore 90% of the buttons and focus on the "important" ones. Timmy *dislikes* being in that room. He will want to leave, even if staying is the best path to victory. He wants fewer - but bigger - buttons
Very curious what the new edition will bring for us admech players on the reducing complexity front
@@ElOvnen I like your take on it! It really scratches the Johnny itch
Classic Spike. Doesn't even just destroy you. Finds the most financially responsible and convenient way to destroy you.
Editor hitting another freaking home run with that Timmy Johnny Spike fire triangle.
Im not usually this fast to a video but Im glad to be here! Love all of your content!
When y'all were describing Johnny I looked over to my Baneblade and smiled, not two seconds later I hear "I had to play... Only tanks."
There's no way to Johnny a Necron army you say, pleading with me as I deploy 29 Canoptek Scarabs and a single pyschomancer to our 500 point game.
The three player types are essentially: Experience --- Expressive --- Mastery
I ended up going for Genestealers but more for johnny reasons than spike reasons.
yea gsc are VERY HEAVILY Johnny and not spike at all
@@RagDollRatnew player here, and I grabbed GSC units because I read books and played some games, and have always been a fan of the Nids and GSC, so got into the game when the Leviathan box dropped and got a combat patrol of GSC because I wanted to make a cult based on the Hive Fleet I am making
I agree, cause I'm a very big Johnny, and that pushed me into GSC.
I feel like a Timmy-Spike combo is especially toxic if they aren't self-aware.
EDIT: After watching up to the Custodes part, I realized that I am a Timmy-Spike lmao
im currently working on that, too. i feel so shitty about getting all caught up in my frustrations and wanting to win; it needs to be fun for everyone, not just me
That's interesting! I think there's very little overlap in (possible) positive or negative traits between Timmy and Spike. Which can be a good thing, if the positives cancel out the negatives. But can also make it pretty miserable to play against someone that has the negative traits of both.
Timmy is probably the most likely to pout when you kill his units. Because then he doesn't get to do the exciting thing! Spike doesn't care if all their units are killed, if that helps them win the game. But Spike probably has the highest risk of being a sore loser.
A "bad" Timmy-Spike wants their units to kill all of your units, but will get mad when their own units are killed. And then be a sore loser afterwards.
But a "good" Timmy-Spike celebrates when exciting stuff happens for either player. And can enjoy the act of *playing* to win whether or not they actually win.
Maybe I'm a "good" Timmy-Spike? I don't play meta lists because I buy models based on aesthetic, but I memorize rules, measure sight lines carefully, MathHammer religiously to figure out which of my units should go into their units, and enjoy winning on points. But at one and the same time, I play Evil Sunz Orks, everything I have goes FASTA and my favorite part of the game is yelling WAAAAAGH! Having fun with my opponent is way more important than winning, but I'll still read all my opponents rules and data sheets before the game and come up with detailed game plans.
@@scotwilcox1771 I think it's a misconception that Timmy is the only one who play to have fun. All the archetypes play to have fun - they just have different definitions of what "fun" means.
A "bad" Johnny/Timmy/Spike is someone who thinks only their own idea of fun is valid, someone who only cares about *their own* enjoyment of the game, and/or acts poorly when what they consider fun doesn't happen.
A "bad" Timmy-Spike isn't someone who plays metalists or strong factions. There's absolutely nothing wrong with any of that! A "bad" Timmy-Spike is someone who gets annoyed if Johnny is focused on his complicated combo rather than joining in a "WAAAGH" yell at that moment. That's not having fun. That's insisting on having fun in a way that makes Johnny have less fun.
For perspective, I'm somewhat of an anti-Timmy. I love the social aspect of the game, friendly banter and having a laugh while playing. But I mostly find Timmy's idea of having fun in a game very unappealing. And I tend to have the least fun when playing against Timmys. I have fun by *competing* , trying to play my absolute best, and thinking of clever solutions to in-game problems.
Posting this before I watch it, I hope there is the player who builds a list that’s funny/ fun and/or HORDES for numbers of models
Update, mix of Johnny and Timmy…
I hope there's something in there describing me and my jank all Phobos army.
@@loganbrown2959 they also forgot Vorthos, who is the lore-player.
I tried a few factions before falling for the sisters, it's the beauty of the models and the joy of painting them that drives us. I'm predominantly a Johnny but I'm convinced asthetics drives sisters players. I love my big dumb Space Wolves but, assembling and painting Sisters just hits different.
Wow you guys summed up Tau perfectly and made me realize why I sold my army. I'm like 70% Timmy and that faction was miserable to play. I tried making some weird combos and refused to play certain units, and it just got me continually curb stomped. You're forced to Spike so hard despite their being an illusion of Johnny and Timmy.
This was a really interesting video. I’d love to see a psychographics video of all of the SM chapters (loyal and traitor). Keep up the great work lads! The Emperor protects!
I love seeing the crossover as someone who plays Magic and previously played 40k, and am now looking at getting back into 40k with 10th ed.
As more of a johnny style player generally, I am not scared to admitt hat Custodes bring out my inner timmy and GSC brings out my inner spike. I play super casually so I can get away with really dumb lists a lot, so I might not be the best point of comparison.
Day 2 of asking for a “what would we put in a boarding patrol box” for each faction video.
I used to play purely hyper competitive modern and then legacy, I recommend that every spike out there find another part of the hobby they love. Magic burnt me out, because I couldn’t put in the time to get any better, so I don’t play much magic anymore. I went to warhammer where I read one book about the guard fell in love and built the guard army my heart told me to instead of the meta. Some day I’m sure I’ll build a super comp stomp tau list or something someday when they are broken. If it’s a hobby and not a job, Find the hobby you love and then engage your competitive side because when a hobby is purely competitive it’s becomes a chore in my experience.
I'd probably argue after listening to this that there's defo more archetypes than simple Timmy, Johnny and Spike - mainly I think between Timmy and Johnny you've got players who cater their armies to narrative or lore-based stuff - they're not so concerned with rule interactions etc as they're making an army that more fits a narrative or style, but they're not really Timmy because they're not just picking the biggest, coolest things because they're constraining themselves to the external source of the lore surrounding that faction. I'd say a lot of Horus Heresy players fit into this archetype, as well as stuff like 40k players who play stuff like Marine chapters that aren't necessarily competitive but they want to represent their lore on the tabletop.
Additionally I'd also argue that there's at least 2 kinds of Spike - so you've got the Spike who represents competitive players who want a challenge, and that's your Genestealer Cults or AdMech players, who want to win games but find their enjoyment in the challenge of developing new or complex tactics, or original list building. A lot of the faction-specific channels on here like say Blood Angels Commander fall into this list, as they're happy to play a faction they like even if at times they're the underdog, but enjoy finding ways they can win against the odds. They're good sports, but they're still there to win.
Then there's the other type of Spike player - who doesn't care about the complexity of the game or developing new tactics and simply wants to win at all costs. They mainly care about the meta right now, they're happy to jump between armies to whatever meta is overpowered right now rather than adjust their tactics for a chosen faction. They're the easiest to name; they're a Dave. Because That Guy is nearly always called Dave (sorry Daves). A true Spike is the kind of person who comes up with the Speedwaagh because they wanted to see what would happen. Once it becomes apparent it's ridiculously overpowered they move on and try to do something more challenging.
A Dave is the kind of guy who hears about it then immediately buys 9 trucks on ebay. Then cries when a month later GW say he can only have 3.
I would argue "All the Dakka!" Is very much a johnny/Timmy moment.
I would have considered sisters a Johnny army because of how much fun the hero building and the buffs are but I see your point on the spike aspect. but that may be bias as a big Johnny, I love making heroes more than playing the game. Herohammer is my favourite part of the hobby. I have never run a list not capped on Hqs(at least in the main detachment)/Leaders in 40k/Aos
My nature is that I want to win, but only because I was the better player. I always loved Eldar who had very specific roles for their models and had to be used correctly to be effective but were highly effective when you did so.
Im a MAJOR johnny in all aspects. Id rather win 1 game with a haunted list than win 1000 games by mastering the meta list.
I agree that chaos space marines as an army lean more towards Johnny and Spike. However, CSM has some of the most Timmy models in the game!
Be a spike in tournaments, be Timmy and Johnny outside tournaments.
As a Magic player crossing over into Warhammer I appreciate this video
I was happy I found a Johnny playstyle for Votann with custom subfactions: +1S to beam weapons, making the thunderkyn conversion beamer S7 -> 8 and bonus to charge towards judgement tokens allowing a good chance to charge from deep strike. I'm sad I haven't been able to build my army up to play anything higher than 500p games to experience these mechanics meaningfully before the 10th rules reset.
You have no idea how happy I am to finally learn wtf Timmy, Johnny and Spike is. Yeah I could have looked it up but I didnt. So thanks
totally late, but I would like to make a case for Jonny knights: as the big outlier that feels like playing a different game, knights allow for uniqueness, especially because, for practical reasons, they are played less than other factions. Jonny loves that. In 9th, this was accentuated by the character building aspect of it. Having all your mechs as characters and giving them cool relics and traits allowed for a lot of customisation. And then 10th came and reduced it all to enhancements. Shame that.
I’m a nearly 100% Johnny Harley player. EVERY SINGLE painted Harley of mine has a first and last name made up using Scots-Gaelic/Sindarin. I ONLY run “true troupes” (one troupe troop with one of every pivotal role) and I don’t mix troupes. My Twilight troupe doesn’t have a Troupe Master because the co-lead players haven’t beat out the other for the title yet.
That's Vorthos IIRC. Johnny is about expressing yourself through excessively niche rules combos you do to show how clever you are. Vorthos is about having head canon, RP, obsessing over lore accuracy etc.
Big Johnny player. I will be reading a ton of rules and one will catch my eye, and then I will build a whole meme list around that specifically. Weird Forge World character has a unique rule? That deserves a whole army to take advantage of it.
Lol pictured Vegeta in tfs dbz abridged broly movie , he's going "he's so cool, but he's so dumb?!" In my head 🤣🤣
You know, I went into this episode (yes it's old I just go through random older episodes when they strike my fancy) expecting you guys to get the psychographics all wrong, because Magic players get them wrong _constantly._ Like they have such clear and understandable niches but people just devolve and devolve them into absolute parodies of themselves. But you guys really got it down and for the most part, I made an effort to try to estimate what psychographic I think each army fell into and I matched up pretty close with you guys. One thing that I think might help determine a Spike army is that Spike really likes resource management, so any of those armies that have a reserve of points or dice that they can use to manipulate the game and massage RNG are pure Spike fuel. Spike loves getting to manage resources efficiently.
The one part that really threw me off is I fully expected Space Marines to be the dead middle (Timmy likes the big armor men, Johnny likes the sheer breadth of units and auras to mix and match, Spike likes that they're GW's golden boys and thus are guaranteed first crack at all the new mechanics and gameplay modes, and when Space Marines are bad they're rarely bad for long because Marines being bad is literally bad for business). Then I thought, "oh Space Marines aren't the middle because they're making sure they make a choice, they're not gonna give any to the middle of the chart", and then you put like three armies all in the middle, lmao. But I do feel like the ones you put in the middle were solid choices. Just an overall solid episode!
I think I am a Johnny - Spike - Timmy. Playing Grey Knights, I want to mainly play Terminators and Paladins to them deep Strike them in. And then get the best result by using a slant list.
I try and be Timmy, but I end up being Spike. As an Engineer, by profession, I see everything about gaming, in general, breaking down to a mathematical equation and probability fields. My joy is in optimization.
Being a predominantly Timmy player, hearing you discuss how a Spike sees the Drukhari codex probably explains why I have such a bad winrate with them. All I think is, "the haemonculus looks like a cool guy, why wouldn't he be in my army multiple times?"
Such interesting topic, this doesn't only apply to the game, you could track very specific personality traits on a much broader audiences of you expand a bit more on each arequeotype? Kind of player? Style? Whatever, although I dont play tabletop (why do I listen to this Podcast then? Becuase is really good and well execute, even if you don't care much for the actual game, is a very interesting thing to listen too if you are on 40k lore and models) I can see myself more into the the Jonny-Timmy type player, I prioritize enjoyment and expression above winning (although I like to show my skills at some extent so spike still living on me) there's a wonderful video call "how your personality define what type of game you play" which relay a lot in this article but expand on it a bit more, a lot of these type of video are super interesting to watch, since it give more insight on what type of person you are base on how you play and not the other way around (but in not a psychologist so dont take too serious)
I like that it's said that everyone has parts of all three.
Still, there's no way I'm bringing a Sprocyst and a bunch of Hormagaunts and not leaning into that Johnny aspect.
I try to win obviously, but I'd feel dirty playing Crusher Stampede (ever) or Leviathan with Warrior spam.
A win doesn't mean anything if I have to use something that is clearly broken in order to achieve it.
Real Like your Podcast, and I'm happy to know that there are other nerds like me who play MTG and WH. So I realy like the crossreverences inbetween. Greatings from Germany
Ive heard the term "Timmy" applied before but i didnt know what it meant. Now that I know, my Seraphon/Ironjawz ass is 100% a Timmy with the occasional Spike kicker.
Another good video. However i feel that associating That Guy with Spike is a little dubious (not that you did that much), i'm not that familiar with the profiles but i doubt the intention is to paint one of the 3 in a negative light/cast Timmy and Johnny as more 'virtuous' so to speak. Really we all know that the That Guys can be any of the three. I remember being tabled by a Spike but he was really nice and the only one willing to play a pick up game with a stranger.
There's a reason I jumped into the hobby Knights first.
Odd in my country there are two more . And they are the dominant ones. First is, we all have to have it just as bad ,as everyone else and the one that takes pleasure from other people not having fun. Making their combos not work, make the game a slog, etc. It is more important to them, then winning.
I would be interested to see the background of players in relation to their profile. How many NEETs are Spikes, how many lawyers are Johnnys, ect. Theres a doctor in my play group and he's straight Timmy, just wants to stomp monsters around.
As a heavy Timmy-slant player, GSC seems very heavily appealing to me as a cool Spike list, I just wish they had like one or two named characters with rules, that persisted in the lore and were available to play on the tabletop. It seems odd and so obvious to me that we dont have any named character attempting to openly politick for the tyrranids by bold-face lying about what the GS do. Its a shame that they tend to eat any and everyone associated with the GSC as soon as the invasion arrives
I'm a total Timmy, as I'm still fairly new, but I fully intend to play Ad Mec with lots if Kastelans, Skorpecs, and Khataphrons, as well as a giant F off knight. Why you ask? Because my Skitariii can swarm like tiny ants under giant robots, cannons, tanks, and walkers. Big guns, big fire power. It'll also interest the Johnny side to be like "I want to bring back House Taranis in all red, black, and white glory" lol. Spike will come experience.
Literally got into daemons (first ever army) because of the bloodthirster and belakor lol. Spot on
As a Timmy-Spike magic. Picking up Tau, Orks, and Ad mech feels meant to be lol.
I didn't know I was a Timmy. I play well and try and be competitive, and I also feel I have to express myself, but damn every Timmy thing is cool. I have to field the big stompy thing or whatever has a turbo laser annihilation beam, I can't stop myself it is too cool.
I want to win really bad, but I'd rather have fun
I thought "im probably Timmy", and yea I bought Orks a while back 😂
I am def a Timmie and damn proud of it. :) I started admech back in 8th after 20 year away from the game. I just loved how they looked! but then 9th came along and i havent played them due to too much rules and stuff to remember. So i started custodes and went to 30k instead. So now nearly 5k painted admech is sitting collecting dust on shelf. And now i wanted to play AoS aswell and started SoB! cant wait to throw opponent monsters around :) Admech might see play in 10th.
I'm somewhere between Timmy and Johnny. I enjoy throwing silly stuff onto the table and figuring out how to make them work.
Honestly I'm having trouble distinguishing between Timmy and Johnny.
Timmy feels like a more specific form of Johnny, to me.
Been a few years since I’ve heard talk of the psychographics. I guess Johnny has absorbed Vorthos.
I'm definitely Timmy/johnny big dumb but not so dumb at times. Love knights thousand sons, custodes. But my true live is chaos undivided or dark eldar.
I did a breakdown like this for DnD. I have decades of gaming experience and degrees in clinical and social psychology.
I was banned for it from the forum.
Funny thing is, people denied being what they are... while actually demonstrating exactly that they were it. =/
I'm a big Timmy with a splash of Johnny, not very Spikey in general, but something about Drukhari and Adepta Sororitas appeal to me. Not sure if it's the theming or something else, but those 2 factions just seem to pull my attention.
Now I need this but AoS and next year TOW
I'm mostly Johnny and I play GSC, but I don't disagree with your assessment. I think the uphill battle thing that guard has is even more present with GSC, and pulling off the weird combos with a lot of setup are the Johnny parts. However.... I'm not exactly winning when I go play them. I don't understand all the other armies or practice enough to win like a spike would.
I had no idea tyranids did psychic. I've only ever thought of them as ripper beasts
They do Psychic pretty well actually, for a while they were the strongest Psychic army, with the Maleceptor being actually broken during that point.
Then add in Shadow in the Warp and they'll be messing up other Psykers while they're at it.
@@kamikeserpentail3778 I really just wasn't aware of that in the lore. I knew that had the shadow, but I thought that just nullified enemy psychers.
I most certainly tend towards Timmy though I do like to make combo every once in a while. That being said I hate how many stratagems there are, I hate the secondary objectives and I hate turn doctrines
I don't ever play named characters because i feel like them dying or being critically injured in these random fights doesnt make sense to me. So I make up a custom warband or chapter or regiment and it's THEIR story. Each game is a story in my custom armies' lore. I run lists that have some good models but I nerf myself without named characters like Magnus to carry my Thousand Sons
Johnny, Timmy, Spike means I just suck and winning and love needless complexity
I feel like I'm probably 45% Timmy and 45% Johnny and like 10% Spike. I really like running fluffy games like for my SM I like to bring a wide array of the Primaris Options if I can, and for my Druhkari I like run real space raids rather than focus on one part. I also really like custom stuff, I love the narrative custom hero stuff and making my own subfactions and stories behind them. But part of me still wants to win, so if my opponent is bringing some daemon primarch or big chungus unit I'll bring a knight with my SM or some Reapers with my Druhkari. Etc but winning is the least important to me of the three
And here i am just thinking that the units are cool and my urdge to collect things like a magpie make me kind of want to play the game but really want to 3d print them and paint them
Great video, but I think you are significantly off on both Drukhari and Aeldari.
You're off on Drukhari because of a fundamental misunderstanding part of Timmy as a psychographic. You have taken to heart that Timmy likes big and Timmy likes options, but have failed to recognize that Timmy likes WIDE too. Yes Timmy plays Eldrazi, but Timmy is also the reason Doubling Season is a $100 card (cause it ain't in a competitive deck and only does so much for Johnny strategies). Yes Imperial knights are very big, but attacks that roll a shit load of dice are also Timmy, and 20 Wyches with upgrades can make 85 hit rolls, and that is extremely Timmy.
As for the Aeldari, I think it is both less Timmy and more Spike than you gave it credit for. As for the Timmy side, I would argue that the main appeals to Timmy are: big/wide, tough, impactful, and cool looking, and arguably they shy away from complex. They have the ability to go big, I will give you that, but typically wraiths, aspect warriors, and outcasts all represent smaller more specialized units. The only units that can go wide are guardians, and they don't reward you for it the way actual wide armies do. The typical toughness for the codex is T3. You don't tend to have a single unit that is that impactful, rather you have a variance of units that cover eachothers' weaknesses. And as for cool looking, you pointed out spiders, but about half their line is still in finecast and some characters are still in metal. And their complexity is fairly self apparent as a squishy highly mobile army.
As for the Spike side, Strands of Fate is a variance reducer, their main psyker doesn't have to deal with perils of the warp, their psychic powers are consistently support powers that reduce variance, and Battle Focus allows you to emphasize positioning without costing you shooting.
Overall I believe Aeldari are near the middle favoring Johnny.
Bruh literally all of the armies I want to collect fall into the timmy category 😅
I'd add that your relative levels of Timmy, Spike, and Johnny fluctuate even between opponents. You have that friend you love to beat hard. You have that kid you take it easy on because it's just such good sport goofing off with them. You have that friend who made you read the three thousand word treatise on their Chapter's history - and you're secretly jealous your lore isn't as good. Your level of Timmy, Spike, and Johnny fluctuates personally and interpersonally.
What about when you collect almost every faction?
Tyranids are a timmy trap but are a 100% Johnny faction, i mean cmon it has a ton of weird mechanics no one else has, tyranids have sporocyst, a fortification thats a monster and gives birth to summons every round, or harpy an aircraft that births summons in drive byes xD
Yeah they just need to balance them to actually be good.
I'll bring a Sportscast every game, but I know it is absolute garbage.
I understood why Tyranids were top tier and broken, but it's a little frustrating getting repeated nerfs to the broken things and no buffs to the things no one else wants to ever touch.
It's like they don't know WHY people gravitate toward the broken things.
Like, great, Warrior spam is broken because of Leviathan, so why did you nerf Warriors instead of...Leviathan?
I can't find a favorite faction I want to buy my first army and have it be a easy paint job but I am not inclined upon buying blood angels or ultramarines I thought eldar as a first army but then I wasn't sure after considering a first army they may be a little tough I like the color gold so I might do a custom army. Its hard as I have several favorites eldar, necrons, genestealer cults, adeptus custodes, astra militarum specifically maccabian janissaries, blood angels, iron hands, raven guard, salamanders, nightlords, thousand sons, emperor's children, iron warriors, alpha legion. My play style preference is ambush tactics or guerilla warfare.
My two armies are Custodes and Chaos Knights. Timmy all the way.
Can I ask what IS a good table top wargame if I wanted to be competitive?
im timmy for nids, but not cuzthe big bugs, but cuz the small cute bugs xD
Me, a Vorthos, stitting here crying.
im just a painter, and maybe a little timmy. hell i am trying to make a living with painting models
Ah yes, glad to see Wargaming is following the greater good with a wonderful Caste System
Could 480 guardsmen take out a titan if they charged it in melee asking for a friend
GSC there is no Jimmy? Guys Muscle Beach has been a thing for ages. GSC players are always looking for way to run 20+ Aberrants regardless how poop they are on the game.
I'm sorry about your furnace, I change them out for a living. Also you have the combo player and fucking stack grinder swapped lol in terms of magic goes vs. how you described it
Games Workshop: Space marines are the most autistic beings in the galaxy.
Poorhammer: Hold my chew toy.
The crisis suits dragged me screaming and kicking into being a dedicated T’au player
Johny - plays against themselves (opponents are just timers)
Spike - plays against the ladder (opponents are just fodder)
Timmy- TIMMY!!!
Timmy- plays against boredom (opponents are their allies)
@@jamestarbet9608the EXACT comment I was about to leave!
I think SoBs definitely have SOME Timmy to them; the exorcist battle tank with a pipe organ firing missiles is a little tough to overlook lol
I completely agree, from an aesthetic point of view it's quite Timmy (or it just procs my Timmy lol). It's a very over the top army with the pipe organ missiles, small ladies with guns as big as them, nun mechs etc... I do have to agree with them though that gameplay wise they're more spike/johny
The esthetic us very Timmy but if you meet SOB play (hi, its me) you'll find that they wont use the tanks. Maybe a rhino for some Flamer Redistributors most but mostly no tanks (shame tho. Hoping the Tank changes in 10th will make them a viable choice
I think everything in 40K has at least a little Timmy.
The universe is so over the top and dumb in a good way and The minis are so in your face about their aesthetic, that you just have to be a Timmy to play 40k.
@@nv7513 I'll never give up my immolator suicide bombs, never.
40K is built, first and foremost, on Rule of Cool. There's a certain baseline of Spectacle that runs through every army, that Timmy can attach to. If committed enough to a particular brand of Cool, Timmy will tolerate anything. That said, some armies facilitate Timmy's fun better than others. Some, like Knights or Orks, are _made_ for Timmy.
Me at the start of this episode: "Man, I bet I'm mostly Johnny with a fair amount of Timmy mixed in."
Brad and Erik describing any army I play: "This is the most Timmy shit I've ever seen."
(Vorthos moment) The moment I realized I wanted to build Knights was when I was flipping thru the codex and each sample Knight had actual written backstory, and my brain reflexively made the backstory for my first knight. It's like making a D&D character, you shouldn't be allowed to field a Knight if they don't have a name and backstory. -edit:Vorthos not Johny.
Also I just realized Johnny has Stifle on his shirt, and it's the perfect card. Timmy wouldn't run interaction, Spike runs goodstuff like Counterspell, Bolt, etc. Only Johny would run Stifle to counter one ability. But Stifle is also his worst fear, it ruins his perfect intricate combo.
More like a Vorthos moment, as you’re doing it for story. Unless you like how the units play exactly how you’d imagine irl, then Melvin. Whereas Johnny looks at how to combo abilities to do something crazy even if it doesn’t win them the game, so long as they did the complicated stupid move.
Timmy is the kind of guy, who loves playing "high risk" strategies. It doesn't matter that it didn't work out the past 19 times, because the ONE TIME it does work out, it's going to be absolutely amazing and he'll speak about it for days. Hell, everyone in the LGS speaks about it for days. To Timmy, Warhammer is a "playground", in which they want to have fun.
Johnnys come in all different shapes and sizes. Some want to show off their cool kitbashes, some want to tell you about the lore of their custom hero, some want to show you this cool synergy they found. But at its very core, the Johnny wants to say "Look at cool thing I did". To Johnny, Warhammer is a stage, in which they present themselves.
Spikes generally care about "proving something". Usually it's winning, but sometimes it's also making a bad thing work. To a Spike, there is a challenge, and they want to show you that they can overcome it. To them, Warhammer is a skill test, in which they have to prove that they have the skills.
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I would argue that Johnny can find some joy in Orks, especially kitbashing. Johnny is the kind of guy, who has a one-of-a-kind model for everything in his army. His Gorkanaut has been kitbashed from two jets and looks like a transformer. His Warboss uses a 3D printed space marine armor, painted like ultramarines, and then "hastily" painting black and white over to show his Warboss is a true Goff git. All of these are about self expression too.
I think there is an aspect to the armies that has gone partially ignored here - the dice. There was some talk of how Spike wants to minimize randomness/dice chance, but my Timmy brain jumps with glee when picking up giant handfuls of dice, doesn't matter how they roll or if they are even useful - flinging two handfuls of cubes like birdshot is just plain fun.
I am a magic player trying out 40k. Since you guys are the same way, I find your explanations of things easy to understand. Keep up the great podcasts
Alpha legion, Timmy and Spike argue so much that Johnny takes over.
That amount of shenanigans means that the design is working as intended. If you're not confused then you're not looking at alpha legion. I love it.
"Spike...finds a way" sounds like a perfect description of Tyrannids thematically.
We like warp spiders because we like warp spiders, not because their minis haven’t been updated. This can also apply to a lot of other aspect warriors :(
Perfect placement for T’au. Came for the Battlesuits, still here for the Battlesuits, but I’ve been forced into a Spike playstyle to avoid getting tabled too quickly
If I’m playing with someone newer to the hobby or someone I’ve built a rapport with, I skew towards a less competitive battlesuit bash list. But for every other match it feels like I have to constantly be playing 3D chess to have a fighting chance and I know how frustrating that can be to play against
Yeah I have a friend who just has the leviathan box tyranids, and I have been trying to run stuff that is fun for them but most of my stuff is xv8 and hammerhead tanks. Most everything I have is brutal to play against for that box.
Man you hit the nail on the head for Tau, got into them purely for lore and aesthetics for my first army. First couple of games with friends and I am shooting all their stuff off of the board and doing nothing else. Felt terrible. So I got GK for my second army and being able to customize my list for the game to be more interactive is amazing. Plus the fact that i play in more than one phase with GK hahaha
It is always fascinating/strange to me how people get so competitive in games that are not designed primarily with competition in mind.
competitiveness is a personality trait
I'm almost completely a Timmy, I know that I can't play enough to "get good" so I instead play to have fun instead as it feels less bad about a butt kicking, though I'm older and I think as you get older you try to maximize fun with the little free time you have.
This is stupid and I'm here to watch every second of it and comment and drop a like