Complete Teardown of the QS138 90H Motor | The Best Cheapest Motor?

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  • Опубліковано 27 лис 2024

КОМЕНТАРІ • 128

  • @MrDehicka
    @MrDehicka Рік тому +21

    Thanks from all of us QS138 owners for such a quality and detailed video!
    I have disassembled QS120 and QS138 before, so some little tips if you are do it to a healthy motor and then reassemble it back without a damage:
    Unscrew the hall magnet plate before taking the rear cover off. It is not shown in this video because it is between the two rear covers behind the hall sensor pcb.
    Mark the rear cover position over the casing so you can correctly position the hall sensors during reassembly.
    The easy way to take out the rotor is to secure it in the vice and just pull the stator away by hands with one quick motion. If you can not do it completely in one motion, it can damage the stator windings because the shaft end will try to stick to one side of the stator.
    If you plan to replace the shaft (you can get spares from QS), it is not easy to pull the shaft from the rotor. It is glued with permanent threadlock and you need to heat it up before pulling the rotor.

    • @GaiusGarage
      @GaiusGarage  Рік тому +1

      This was my hope & very good tips! Thank you!!

    • @Fellafoe69
      @Fellafoe69 Рік тому

      If you heat the shaft up it will permanently damage the magnets!

    • @toroddlnning6806
      @toroddlnning6806 Рік тому

      ​@@GaiusGarage would it be possible to convert this type of motor into a variable magnetic field motor. The rotor seems a bit hard to press back and forth. I was thinking about reducing the torque for regenerative braking. hydrogenerator from a boat propeller in reverse, maybe with some flywheels and gears to help.

  • @ryanm158
    @ryanm158 2 роки тому +8

    seriously impressed! I have a qs13870h V3 and this is the first insight I've had into getting at the hall sensors in the 138 motors. excellent content amigo
    ;) thank you!

  • @eastwood111
    @eastwood111 2 роки тому +18

    That’s pretty cool trick with the magnet in your hand to count the poles

  • @mrkelkel11
    @mrkelkel11 Рік тому +4

    Dropping by just to say thanks a bunch for this teardown! I'm using the QS138 on a PhD project, didn't want to tear down my brand new motor just yet :)

    • @GaiusGarage
      @GaiusGarage  Рік тому

      much appreciated! glad it's helpful. What's your PhD project covering?

    • @mrkelkel11
      @mrkelkel11 Рік тому

      ​@@GaiusGarage Its mostly about real-time torque ripple reduction under different speeds, loads and no. of motors, and I'm trying to achieve that solely through control, so no structural changes to the motor itself. I'm still reviewing literature and prepping for FEA (hence my gratitude for the teardown :)

    • @GaiusGarage
      @GaiusGarage  Рік тому

      @@mrkelkel11 Ah interesting! Would definitely love to read the dissertation once completed!

    • @mrkelkel11
      @mrkelkel11 Рік тому

      ​@@GaiusGarage Absolutely! Good luck with the ebike builds too, the Fardrivers are notoriously hard to tune (spent a month wrangling my 72360 for a 14kW, 9kWh moped build) but work like a dream once tamed.

  • @tuguybear930
    @tuguybear930 8 місяців тому +2

    Rewinding can seem and look daunting but just making notes as you disassemble helps and winding coils is easy. Just count the number of winds on the original coils. I've done it. It isn't so difficult.

  • @ize100
    @ize100 Рік тому +1

    Wow that's incredible figuring the magnet positions so simple but smart

  • @HubbHubbs
    @HubbHubbs Рік тому +1

    Brilliant vid, I dont even have these motors, but couldnt stop watching, I bet they are all pretty similar.

    • @GaiusGarage
      @GaiusGarage  Рік тому

      Thank you! actually a good deal of variation in terms of design between definitely popular EV motors

  • @renegarcia1807
    @renegarcia1807 Рік тому +2

    Very good job man very interesting and like I said the controller had nothing to do with that fire in the motor nicely done

  • @aaronjones356
    @aaronjones356 9 місяців тому +1

    I have one small correction, because you keep switching the terms:
    The STATor is STATionary, and the ROTor is ROTational
    If you're ever wondering which you are looking at just look at the beginning of the word! Very easy.
    Otherwise very useful and informative video. Thank you!

    • @GaiusGarage
      @GaiusGarage  9 місяців тому

      I may have misspoken somewhere - correct, the rotor is the thing with the magents that rotates inside the stator with the coils. Thank you!

  • @cesarhoyos6955
    @cesarhoyos6955 2 роки тому +2

    beautiful technology, thanks, I learned a lot about this motor

  • @fjrh8911
    @fjrh8911 Рік тому +3

    Very informative video, thank you! Would be interesting to get a clearer view of the magnets and laminates in the rotor.

  • @ELECTRICMOTOCROSSMACHINE
    @ELECTRICMOTOCROSSMACHINE Рік тому +1

    Thanks for doing the work for us!

  • @natygueta
    @natygueta Рік тому +1

    Awesome video brother!! Keep doing it bro!

  • @ElDiabloDirt
    @ElDiabloDirt Рік тому +4

    Great video. If you leave out the soldering issues, the motor actually looks really well built for its price.
    Two questions: Did you ever count the conductors per slot and/or the turns in series/parallel.
    And secondly did you analyze the phase distribution before cutting the winding? For 12slots/10poles there should be two coils of one phase in two neighboring slots. Maybe that's why there was a problem with the software saying 4 rmf poles when it's actually just 2?

  • @natygueta
    @natygueta 5 місяців тому

    Thank you so much brother ❤

  • @VictorFainello
    @VictorFainello 2 роки тому +5

    Wow. This was very informative. Thank you for showing us this. Do you mind measuring the rotor diameter with your calipers just so I can compare with a different brand of motor? Thanks

    • @GaiusGarage
      @GaiusGarage  2 роки тому +4

      The rotor is 84.85mm in diameter

  • @cesarhoyos6955
    @cesarhoyos6955 2 роки тому +2

    It is curious to see that if they soldered well inside the motor but not in the terminals, the terminals must be soldered, very good analysis.

    • @GaiusGarage
      @GaiusGarage  2 роки тому +5

      I think maybe the motor was manufactured by one party then shipped without the terminal lugs to a reseller. just my guess

  • @The205GTIman
    @The205GTIman 7 місяців тому

    Very interesting and useful! I have a qs180 incoming and will for sure check the lugs. Probably I will cut the 30mm2 phase wires and replace/enhance them with 95mm2 wires.
    I’m finding it difficult to understand why the bad connection of the p-wire lugs would overheat the coils inside the motor. I can understand that the p-wire lead into the motor would overheat when only a few strings are actually connected to the controller. But after the splitting of the phase wires inside the motor, into two parallel strings, twisted and connected with solder, every string should carry current. So then it is not logical to me why the phase wires inside the motor itself would also overheat.
    Maybe there was a problem with the controller after all and the ‘firing’ of the phases was not timed correctly? It seems weird that it would fail this way, just because of some poor connection at the lugs?

  • @russbarrow
    @russbarrow 2 місяці тому

    I must have missed something here. The hall board had some pretty small TO-92 halls that do not appear long enough to get close to the rotors diameter (where the magnets focus their energy). Was there a second magnet source?

  • @Enonymouse_
    @Enonymouse_ Рік тому +1

    The bad cables with the lugs also had no weather sealing at all.

  • @Codyhumburg
    @Codyhumburg 7 місяців тому +1

    Great knowledge shared here!

  • @christianpaulroldan4010
    @christianpaulroldan4010 Рік тому

    If you want to remove the rear cover, first you pull out the shaft carefully on a vise. That way you can remove the shaft on the cover easier

  • @Ali-Builds
    @Ali-Builds 2 роки тому +1

    Thanks for your great effort

  • @s10mods
    @s10mods 18 днів тому

    Do you still have these motor parts? Are you able to remove the nut on the back of the motor shaft and see if the shaft will come out of the rotor? I am wondering if swapping shafts would be easy or not. thinking of having a custom shaft made for a project.

  • @veldhuisracing
    @veldhuisracing Рік тому +1

    How did you end up getting the pulley off? I’ve tried an impact gun, but the only thing I’m moving is the skirts of the pulley…

  • @StrawberryredfiestaST
    @StrawberryredfiestaST 8 місяців тому

    Are you going to rewind it? Would be hella interesting, maybe this time in a delta configuration instead of a star config

  • @ИванМрянков
    @ИванМрянков 2 роки тому +1

    Thank you for this video ❤️

  • @daruspastorello
    @daruspastorello Рік тому

    Too bad you burnt your motor but this was a very interesting and informative video! Kudos!

  • @OddSerenity
    @OddSerenity Рік тому

    this motor easily rewind if he understand the winding data otherwise stator are fine

  • @seanmcqueen2186
    @seanmcqueen2186 4 місяці тому

    Do the screws for the shock mount go into the main housing?

  • @Codyhumburg
    @Codyhumburg Рік тому

    My favorite so far. Hey, what do you use as your phase wire termination block on you swingarm? (Bomber)

    • @GaiusGarage
      @GaiusGarage  Рік тому

      I just used one of those blocks that come with certain ebike kits. not really sure what the proper name is

  • @joaopauloxavier5318
    @joaopauloxavier5318 Рік тому

    Excelente! Sou do Brasil!

  • @maryousheq6655
    @maryousheq6655 5 днів тому

    Is it possible to disassembly main shaft from The rotor?

  • @n0s0ul333
    @n0s0ul333 Рік тому +1

    Great video! thanks for taechning me about the poles and pairs! Do you know the Kv of this motor?

    • @GaiusGarage
      @GaiusGarage  Рік тому

      Thank you! I actually don't know the KV of this motor off-hand. But since this is a PMSM AC motor the KV would be expressed in terms of frequency per voltage applied. so the formula is RPM/60 = frequency, and KV = frequency / voltage

  • @christianpaulroldan4010
    @christianpaulroldan4010 Рік тому

    Why not use vise grip? You can hold the shaft from the chain.

  • @painmad
    @painmad 9 місяців тому

    Hi, I found your video very interesting. I hope you are still around because I need to ask you something, I have a faulty hall sensor and need to replace it... only 1 place I found was on Alipress, I think is not possible that I am the only person that have a faulty hall sensor. THX

  • @madanpatil1578
    @madanpatil1578 2 роки тому +1

    Very good informative, Sir. Also please counts no of wires in slot. Wire gauge. And number of parallel wire also which is also for us.

    • @GaiusGarage
      @GaiusGarage  2 роки тому

      ah! I meant to do this but forgot 😖 I will add to the description

    • @GaiusGarage
      @GaiusGarage  2 роки тому

      I don't know the wire gauge but one is 0.5mm in diameter and there are 50 turns per coil

    • @VictorFainello
      @VictorFainello 2 роки тому

      @@GaiusGarage It appears to be a 22 or 23AWG. By 50 turns per coil I think you meant 50 strands, right? If so, that would roughly equal a 6AWG wire, which is the same thickness of a Sur Ron phase wire.

    • @GaiusGarage
      @GaiusGarage  2 роки тому

      @@VictorFainello 50 turns per coil in the stator so yes, 50 strands per coil but the phase wires were comprised of two coils so 100 strands total in the phase wires - they are 4AWG

  • @DPTech_workroom
    @DPTech_workroom Рік тому

    How much RPM can produce this motor in star connection and delta connection with 48v?
    In delta it should give more RPM and need to handle more current (need more thick wire)

  • @jamesford1709
    @jamesford1709 Рік тому

    They’re tamperproof torx bits, the first set you undid

  • @zacharycofer5929
    @zacharycofer5929 8 місяців тому

    How do you plan on rewinding it when you cut all the winding out of it without counting how many turns each one has?

    • @GaiusGarage
      @GaiusGarage  8 місяців тому

      I gave up on re-winding it. too much work when I can just sell the sell the rotor and stator for parts and put the proceeds towards a new motor, which is what I ended up doing

  • @peterfleming494
    @peterfleming494 2 роки тому +2

    Hi the qs138 v3 90h
    How many wire strands in each phase wires ??

    • @GaiusGarage
      @GaiusGarage  2 роки тому +1

      50 turns per coil but phase wires are made up of two coils so 100 strands in each phase wire

    • @peterfleming494
      @peterfleming494 2 роки тому +1

      @@GaiusGarage hi thanks, for the info, the wire strand diameter ?

    • @GaiusGarage
      @GaiusGarage  2 роки тому +1

      @@peterfleming494 0.5mm I think that's 24AWG

    • @peterfleming494
      @peterfleming494 2 роки тому

      @@GaiusGarage hi thanks

  • @jppatel4831
    @jppatel4831 Рік тому

    How many turns per slot you would have considered for rewinding the Motor? And also a number of wires in One Strand?

  • @dbc105
    @dbc105 Рік тому

    Good stuff, great vid, thanks. Do you know the difference between the 90H and the 70H? My guess is it is a bigger motor but I don't know that and in trying to look at specs it can be hard to get the same info on the same motor in 2 different places. Also, what controller were you running it with?

    • @GaiusGarage
      @GaiusGarage  Рік тому +2

      I honestly dont know what the "H" in 90 & 70 refer to. If I had to guess it would be related to the KV value of the motor..the rate at which it turn per volt. This is probably why the 70H often comes with a gearbox. The controller I was using is the Fardriver ND96530 - but I dont particularly recommend it mostly because the app and/or PC software to program it is total garbage. constant bugs that wont allow you to dial in the settings and support is shit

    • @dbc105
      @dbc105 Рік тому

      @@GaiusGarage Do you know if they are they physically about the same size? Not figuring the gearbox 70.

    • @GaiusGarage
      @GaiusGarage  Рік тому +1

      @@dbc105 the 70h is smaller

    • @dbc105
      @dbc105 Рік тому +1

      @@GaiusGarage I found what the name all means, 138 is the diameter of the rotor and 70 is the width of the magnets. So a 138 90H has magnets 20mm longer that in turn would mean the rotor is longer also. that is the way I understood it all and it makes perfect sense. I also saw that it looks as though they are either building or working on a 138 90H with gear reduction built in. Given the motor being at least 20mm wider I'm thinking it might be better to built with a jackshaft so the motor can be centered in the frame. I'm not yet building so that is just a guess.

    • @GaiusGarage
      @GaiusGarage  Рік тому

      @@dbc105 Ah! nice! it does make total sense. Thanks for the update on this! Mystery solved

  • @Vmaxfodder
    @Vmaxfodder Рік тому

    extra crispy ! get some dipping sauce !

  • @maarkkkm
    @maarkkkm 2 роки тому +1

    Great video, really in depth. Do you have another motor on the way?

    • @GaiusGarage
      @GaiusGarage  2 роки тому

      Thanks! yeah I have one swapped out already. Runs cool as can be now

    • @jamieforrester7108
      @jamieforrester7108 2 роки тому

      did you go with a different vendor? I'm curious how you could know how to avoid one with issues with the lugs like this motor experienced?

    • @GaiusGarage
      @GaiusGarage  2 роки тому

      @@jamieforrester7108 I dont think there is any way to know ahead of time but I did use a difference vendor for the new motor. Official Siacosys store on Aliexpress seems to be legit. I added the vendor who sold me the faulty motor to the description

    • @matickovac
      @matickovac 2 роки тому

      @@GaiusGarage Thanks for sharing. Isn't that the official QC motors shop on Aliexpress? And wouldn't the terminal be mounted by the producer, directly in the factory, and has nothing to do with the vendor?

    • @GaiusGarage
      @GaiusGarage  2 роки тому

      @@matickovac I don't think so - there are a bunch of these clone shops on Aliexpress and there are a few different "QS motor" websites -- I don't know if they're all affiliated or if it's branding. I *think* Siacosys is who actually develops (and manufactures??) these motors then they resell them to various vendors. But I suspect they sell them without the terminals crimped. The other motor I got from Siacossys was crimped correctly. but I'm really not sure how it works

  • @dcktater7847
    @dcktater7847 3 місяці тому

    Dont you know by chance the thickness of one wire and the number of them in the phase wire?

  • @renegarcia1807
    @renegarcia1807 Рік тому

    Thanks for your video very, very good!!!!

  • @GroovyVideo2
    @GroovyVideo2 Рік тому

    maybe cut wire bundle with vibrator tool ?

  • @wahida5355
    @wahida5355 11 місяців тому

    Where can i buy that kind of hall sensor pcb? My reading on green is not same with yellow and blue..

    • @GaiusGarage
      @GaiusGarage  11 місяців тому

      I don't think you can buy just the PCB. maybe you can pick up a motor that's for parts or reach out QS motor and ask if they can sell you one

  • @Ray88G
    @Ray88G 2 роки тому +1

    This is second case when I see one of these motors burned up like this .
    To prevent this from happening again I would suggest pot the motor with special heat conductive motor potting compound after re-winding it .
    Here's a very good example of what happens inside the motor with windings when it operates ..
    The windings rub up against each other ..
    ua-cam.com/video/lPNU2vniUIc/v-deo.html

    • @GaiusGarage
      @GaiusGarage  2 роки тому +1

      very interesting! thank you for the link. the new motor I have barely heats up even when riding aggressively. I think in this case, crimping the lugs onto enamel was the primary cause of the fire

  • @Vmaxfodder
    @Vmaxfodder Рік тому +1

    finally !!

  • @THEPAINOFITALL
    @THEPAINOFITALL Рік тому

    How much was the motor on aliexpress, it been blocked?

  • @Dat_Sun
    @Dat_Sun 2 роки тому +1

    How much does the electric motor weigh?

    • @GaiusGarage
      @GaiusGarage  2 роки тому

      I did not weigh it before disassembly. this information is likely available in the spec sheet

  • @Vmaxfodder
    @Vmaxfodder Рік тому

    great !!! now do a fardriver controller ! no one has done one yet !!

  • @rvvlogs4077
    @rvvlogs4077 Рік тому +1

    Please upload video on rewinding this motor

    • @GaiusGarage
      @GaiusGarage  Рік тому +1

      the stator was a bit damaged and I sold the motor for parts already so no rewinding video unfortunately

    • @rvvlogs4077
      @rvvlogs4077 Рік тому +1

      😊 thank you

    • @rvvlogs4077
      @rvvlogs4077 Рік тому

      How much price you sold the motor

    • @GaiusGarage
      @GaiusGarage  Рік тому +1

      @@rvvlogs4077 around $200 I think

  • @Adrian-hw1no
    @Adrian-hw1no Рік тому

    My engine also burned out, only the qs 138 70h model, the copper winding was replaced and everything is ok, but it overheats at low current, e.g. 150A, and the previous qs 138 50h did not heat up so much and was much weaker. The driver is FAR ND72530. I'm afraid that during the combustion the magnets may have lost their power and therefore the motor draws more A than it should, e.g. when it accelerates. If it's not the fault of the magnets, what could it be overheating from? I would be very grateful for help. Regards and have a nice day

    • @GaiusGarage
      @GaiusGarage  Рік тому

      hard to say, unfortunately. could be settings in the controller but I'm not sure what the correct ones would be

    • @Adrian-hw1no
      @Adrian-hw1no Рік тому

      @@GaiusGarage Hello friend thank you for your answer, and this driver with this engine works well for you? I don't know if it's not the driver's fault, I want to try votola em150 or 200.

    • @GaiusGarage
      @GaiusGarage  Рік тому +1

      @@Adrian-hw1no actually, I am very much unsatisfied with the Fardriver controller. Price is good and it does work, but app is garbage making good programming virtually impossible. documentation is inexplicable, and support is useless. I would use this only if you are on a budget. Many better options out there. I plan to make a video on why this controller sucks in the near future

    • @Adrian-hw1no
      @Adrian-hw1no Рік тому

      @@GaiusGarage Well, I think I'm going to change it to something else, what would you recommend instead?

    • @GaiusGarage
      @GaiusGarage  Рік тому

      @@Adrian-hw1no just depends on your budget. Kelly controllers are pretty good. BAC4000 and BAC8000 are great but more expensive. The EBMX X9000 looks really awesome but price is too much. Then there's the Votol controllers, which I think are made by the same company as Fardriver..I don't really have an experience with them. The bottom line is that all of the common controllers on the market will do a good job, if you can program them correctly. Unfortunately, these Chinese companies don't put seem to put very much effort into build intuitive and robust software or good English documentation

  • @jeffreyrh
    @jeffreyrh Рік тому

    What is the screw size for the 6 mounting holes on each side?

    • @GaiusGarage
      @GaiusGarage  Рік тому

      M8

    • @jeffreyrh
      @jeffreyrh Рік тому

      @@GaiusGarage Thanks! M8-1.25 and looks like about 12mm of thread depth.

  • @wahyuwiant1791
    @wahyuwiant1791 2 роки тому

    What about golden motor?
    Better than QS motor?

  • @СергейПавличенко-я4п

    Весёлый чувак. Есть моменты где показано как делать НЕ НАДО!

  • @josedelmontealmansa6259
    @josedelmontealmansa6259 Рік тому +1

    its epic owemzome!!!

  • @dilanmontgomery5505
    @dilanmontgomery5505 Рік тому

    So I had a ebike motor and Il couldn't figure out the hall sensors wires so I just deleted them all and I never saw a difference in performance or speed control am I gunna end up destroying something

    • @GaiusGarage
      @GaiusGarage  Рік тому +1

      you probably have a BLDC motor (as opposed to sinosoidal AC, like this QS138) or what you removed was not a hall sensor. the hall sensor tell the controller when to switch phases - it's like your brain reading the position of your legs to tell you when to switch for walking. if you did not know where your legs were at any given moment, you would not be able to coordinate a stride

    • @dilanmontgomery5505
      @dilanmontgomery5505 Рік тому +1

      @GaiusGarage ok ya I remember reading something blcd or we but thanks I didn't know the difference

    • @GaiusGarage
      @GaiusGarage  Рік тому

      @@dilanmontgomery5505 no problem! BLDC motor are more simple and just require a speed controller that switches the three phases at some rate - you don't need any other components, although you often have an additional signal wire that let's you increase or decrease that rate. With sinusoidal AC motors, the motor controller needs to know the position of the rotor relative to the stator and adjust the amplutide of the three phases accordingly. a hall sensor is one way to read the motor position, a sinusoidal encoder is another common one..probably some other techniques as well

  • @DieselBikeBuilder
    @DieselBikeBuilder 2 місяці тому

    Instead of using a flat tipped screwdriver, maybe invest in a brass punch.

  • @jacobclark89
    @jacobclark89 7 місяців тому

    I would be more concerned that the heat might have damaged the magnets

  • @vijaykorvekar1009
    @vijaykorvekar1009 Рік тому

    For how long can I run the motor at 15kw straight

    • @GaiusGarage
      @GaiusGarage  Рік тому

      I'm not sure - better to ask the manufacturer

  • @renegarcia1807
    @renegarcia1807 Рік тому +2

    Honestly I do not think it would be a good idea to reuse that stator to me it seems damaged as you mentioned

  • @Ray88G
    @Ray88G 2 роки тому

    That's not how you remove windings.
    You had to find one of the phases and remove all stops which in tje middle of stator teeth , then you un-wind the motir and see how it's wound .
    This way you also see how many turks there are .
    Now you will have difficult time figuring out how it was wound ..

    • @GaiusGarage
      @GaiusGarage  2 роки тому +2

      yeah no kidding lol. this was my original plan but it just seemed impossible to pull an individual winding out of a slot. I forgot to count the turns for the video but I can still do this from the windings that I pulled out. I probably will not attempt to rewind this motor, just seems like alot of tedious work and I'd prob screw it up anyway - lose count of turns, etc. plus, like I mentioned, there's some evident damages to the stator laminate so not even sure it's viable to do. will probably just sell for parts or turn into an art piece

  • @megicom
    @megicom Рік тому

    pls make winding video 😁✌

  • @NotaRobot_gif
    @NotaRobot_gif Місяць тому

    Did you get your money back?

  • @nicod974
    @nicod974 Рік тому +1

    If you pushed 13kw through this 4000w motor more than 10 seconds , no wonder why it's fried...

  • @authentic4225
    @authentic4225 11 місяців тому

    My wires are colored

  • @TheAtomstrike
    @TheAtomstrike 7 місяців тому

    нет пропитки лаком, нет изоляции лобовых частей обмоток. При работе мотора провода немного вибрируют, протирается лаковая изоляция и происходит замыкание