Is Fictional Magic Sinful To Enjoy? - SPECULATIVE FAITH
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- Опубліковано 13 вер 2024
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I just want to say that I respect you highly because the way you're able to talk about these topics it shows that you are positive in your heart what you believe in you know what I'm saying and I've learned a lot from you. Some Christians and I've talked to talk about how it's evil it's evil it's evil but I like the way you dissect the topic and it's like I understand what you're saying.
So glad to be useful, Melissa. Thanks for the encouraging feedback! -Paeter
@Caitlyn Carvalho Ironic selectively, I guess. I think over the years I've heard fewer Christians express concern over fictional magic. But I definitely remember the height of the Harry Potter scare and found it ironic that the same fear and concern was not directed at the Lord Of The Rings and Chronicles Of Narnia properties, which hit their height of popular recognition around the same time. -Paeter
@Caitlyn Carvalho I'm not familiar with that situation at all. But just given those details it sounds like the issue is something related to her personality that Harry Potter didn't cause, such as poor judgment or a mental disorder. -Paeter
@Caitlyn Carvalho I don't know of a good argument based on scripture and reason that would rule out the enjoyment of fairytale-based media. But if you have any specific concerns I'd be happy to explore them with you! -Paeter
@Caitlyn Carvalho Sure, I might use that expression. (Sorry for the confusing username. Uploading to my other channel right now.) -Paeter
Stories are stories. If they have redeeming quality and you don’t let them own you, then no, it’s not sinful to enjoy a good fantasy story.
Well the difference between fantasy fiction and the bible/real life
In fantasy fiction you may have laser beams or fireballs, burning real life you have recreational drugs, horoscopes, tarot cards, labelling on crystals, sacrifices to idols (the origin behind slavery), dream catchers etc.
I don’t do magic in real life and I’m joying my life that god as giving me and I’m trying my best to in joy life why I still can
Drugs are modern day magic
That was brilliant. Thanks man
Well, I more or less just read the article, but was happy to do it! Thanks, Danny! -Paeter
@caitlyncarvalho7637I haven't watched any One Piece, so I couldn't comment on that specifically. But I think anime is a story medium like any other, and can have both good and worthwhile content as well as content that should be avoided. -Paeter
@caitlyncarvalho7637 I haven't read the books or seen much of the adaptations, so I can't specifically comment on them. But I think Christians who are able to enjoy Greek Mythology as imaginative fantasy that does not inform their thinking about spiritual realities can do so without concern that they are being unfaithful to Yahweh. -Paeter
I like this point of view on this topic.
Thanks, Andrei, I enjoyed sharing this article! -Paeter
@caitlyncarvalho7637 As with so many things it greatly depends on the individual strengths and weaknesses of the individual viewer. Are there any specific elements that you think might be of concern? -Paeter
Great channel! Thank you so much!
My pleasure! Thanks for watching! -Paeter
@caitlyncarvalho7637 Back from vacation, sorry for the delay! I'm not very familiar with the specifics of Pokemon, but I don't see why they would necessarily be a problem. That said, if you have more specific concerns and details you can provide I'd be happy to talk about it more! -Paeter
@caitlyncarvalho7637 I don't see why that would be a problem from a scriptural standpoint, but I'm open to considering what your specific concerns might be! -Paeter
@caitlyncarvalho7637 Scripture doesn't refer to mermaids one way or the other as far as I know. -Paeter
@caitlyncarvalho7637 I don't see why God would not choose to heal someone a Christian is praying for just because they are singing as they do it. That's really entirely up to God. He does the healing. -Paeter
Really good and clear breakdown of the topic. I am of the same view. 😊
Thank you, Rudy! I appreciate the encouragement! -Paeter
@caitlyncarvalho7637 Hmm, I couldn't tell you. Interesting, though. -Paeter
@caitlyncarvalho7637 I don't see why that would be a problem. Is there a reason someone has given you why it would be wrong to read it? -Paeter
@caitlyncarvalho7637 Not necessarily. The prophets used rough language at times and Jesus told some tragic and haunting stories to illustrate truths. What do you mean when you use the term "American dream"? -Paeter
Hey, I'm really enjoying your thoughts on this subject.
Thanks! Credit really goes to Speculative Faith on this one. -Paeter
@caitlyncarvalho7637 I guess that would depend. Given that it's "fantasy", it would depend on what it means to be a "witch" in that particular world, and whether or not Christianity or some symbolic representation of it is present in the story. -Paeter
@caitlyncarvalho7637 Good question. For example: you've got Harry Potter Witches, Glinda The Witch Of The North in Wizard of Oz, as well as those who practice Wicca. Three very different concepts of what it means to be a witch. -Paeter
@caitlyncarvalho7637 To do a thorough comparison I'd need to watch The Wizard of Oz and HP movies again. But off the top of my head: HP witches are are not aligning themselves with spirits to accomplish magical feats, they are using spoken formulas that are about technical verbal precision rather than a disposition of the heart. In real world occult activities, I believe there is usually if not always a spirit involved that the practitioner is gaining help from in some way. And Glinda's powers have no specified origin or mechanism at all. -Paeter
By the way, awesome video as always.
Thanks, Jack! Big props to SpecFaith for this one! -Paeter
@caitlyncarvalho7637 I don't see a problem, provided the Christian is not having their beliefs influenced by false ideas, or they are not writing in a way that influences others with false ideas. -Paeter
@caitlyncarvalho7637 About which part? -Paeter
I have a thing with magic. If it’s fantasy such as Kingdom Hearts or Harry Potter, I will take with caution. Keep in mind to never practice witchcraft or sorcery, no matter how “good” it looks on the screen, it’s not worth condemning your soul. But however movies like The Craft, I would absolutely NOT allow that to be viewed.
And if people want to learn about the craft, a spoiler review is the best way
Seems a bit strange to think watching anything like Harry Potter or saying "Wingardium Leviosa" is going to condemn your soul, or make you want you to practice witchcraft. Wowsers.
I know this is 3 years old, but wow does it seems very naive about what is in fictional stories. Even the Narnia series has magic in it that isn't inate, and isn't from the book's version of God. Fantasy has a huge variety of magic systems, with different practices and sources. To say that any of this is sinful to enjoy is just kinda wrong, or worse, seems to be deliberatly instilling fear. Just read what you like... they are stories, enjoy them as stories.
So yes or no
With cartoons such as Regular show its absolutely ungodly indeed because a lot of episodes have twists of witchcraft
Edit: with magic like in Pinocchio which is a plot device for holy portrayal is on the holy matter
In a fictional sense, i understand Magic makes a great literary tool to explore fanciful situations that would be impossible in real life.
Overall, im not here to be entertained by the magic itself, im more interested in the story that is set in this fantasy setting
The bottom line is, if fantasy magic makes you actually wanna practice it in real life, Stay away from it
That sounds like a pretty good distillation! Thanks! -Paeter
@@greenergrass4060 I used to have it happen with me, Ki, Hamon, Stands, I was an idiot thinking they work.
My story has an antagonist who is the last person alive with magic (for the reasons of making a villain through magic)
@@greenergrass4060 what if you no longer have that temptation
What about the fictional gods? Like tolkeins eru eluvitar? And his line of "lesser gods" i have no problem with enjoying magic in fiction, but what about the gods?
I don't see why stories with fictional gods would be harmful unless they influence you negatively. But if you have a specific concern in mind I'm happy to explore it with you. -Paeter
@@christiangeekcentral idk i was just wondering if the bible said anything on it, yknow how people twist scripture these days. But your channel has been very helpfull.
@@christiangeekcentral actually, i do have a question. Would it be sinfull to listen to a band that has lyrics refrencing to prayers of other religions? Or that makes albums dedecated to real occult practices they partook in? (Messing around eith a ouja board) Even though they arent nessesarily promoting it, (due to the fact that it caused them harm) i know this sounds lie an oddly specific question, if it siunds confusing i can go into dept on specifics
@@igydkygs00kwhi Hey, life is all ABOUT oddly specific questions that need oddly specific thought and care, so thanks for sharing this with me! Really interesting! Merely listening is not, I think, harmful in itself. Its what our minds do with what we're listening to that's far more important. For example, I remembering hearing about a very conservative Christian mom who was a "fan" of Marilyn Manson, but from a place of compassion. In his songs, she heard the heart cry of someone living apart from God, and his music moved her to have compassion for people in that place. Similarly, I like the one or two songs he contributed to the Matrix movie soundtracks, but I like them largely for the musical style and general feel rather than the lyrics(which I tune out). As Christians we have the freedom to interact with and even enjoy things that may have been created with evil purposes in mind. I think we see this in how scripture handles the topic of eating meat that had been part of a pagan animal sacrifice. (1 Corinthians 8 and Romans 14 are passages I'd highly recommend becoming familiar with if you aren't already.) I hope that's helpful! A great question, thank you! -Paeter
@@christiangeekcentral thank you so much!!!! The specific theme in question is the mars voltas bedlum and goliath, your channel is such a blessing.
Is watching the series The magicians sin to watch? Ofc I'm not going to try and do these magic because the magic in the series looks fictional
Thanks for the question! I haven't watched any of that show, so I can't react to its content at all. But if a show does not lead you to sin in the way it influences your thoughts, emotions or actions, I would generally say it should be fine. -Paeter
Question. How would this relate to the scripture about abstaining from the appearance of evil.
It sounds like you're referring to the KJV translation of 1 Thessalonians 5:22. The NIV & ESV represent the original Greek more clearly. In verse 21 we're told to test everything and hold on to what is good. (The actual context is specifically to potential prophecy, but in principle we can still arguably apply it to other areas.) Once we've tested and determined what is good, we are to "abstain from every form of evil", or in other words, abstain from doing evil, whatever form it might take. In the case of enjoying fictional magic, we'd first want to identify whether or not enjoying fictional magic is actually an evil thing to do. (Not whether or not it "appears to be" evil, which is subjective from person to person.) I would argue that in most cases, possibly all, it is not sinful to enjoy stories containing fictional magic, or even to specifically enjoy the elements of fictional magic in those stories. Does that answer your question or did you have something more specific in mind? -Paeter
@@christiangeekcentral that answers two questions actually, but makes me want to ask a third. Why do you use multiple versions and not have a standard? I know that sounds pointed but I honestly want to know.
Another great question! I use multiple translations as part of my effort to get closer to the original language texts. As in any language, Hebrew and Greek words can have multiple meanings and senses. No single English translation is capable of carrying through the full meaning of all words from the original languages. Some translations will bring out one meaning of a word while others may choose a different English word that slightly brings out another facet of the original. So combining the use of multiple translations with using Greek & Hebrew Lexicons I find that I get closer to a full sense of why and how the specific words of the original language were chosen and used, and as a result hopefully a better idea of the author's intent. -Paeter
@@christiangeekcentral are you familar with the Textus Receptus or the letters sent back and fourth between Westcott and Hort?
@@MichaelSmith-fm5ln A little. It's been a long time since I did some digging on the KJV's origins and the TR. So my memory of that stuff is pretty bad these days. -Paeter
I love fictional Magic... But you have to find the balance between the pure joy of fictional Magic and real magic.
As a Christian & a musician can I practice a magic that is based around God's will I.e. a type of "white magic" that opposes "black magic"?
Magic isn't just relegated to fantasy in West during present day. It's a real active force. I want to enjoy magic in fiction but I also don't want to make light of it. Like its just all pretend now. That's an ignorant & dangerous point of view.
Yes Disney media is entertaining and a part of generations of childhoods... Heck, adults love it too!
Meanwhile, Disney uses their multimedia empire to weave real life evil spells on our children via music, movies, sexual content etc.
Don't practice it in real life and you should be good, I think.
The way I view it is in these fictional wizards and majic is that in this entertainment the characters are given powers at the beginning as if they were implemented by God himself
I can see that working. It reminds me of the way I often see magic in fiction as being a sort of "natural law" or intangible science, rather than the sorcery referred to in scripture which was about appropriating power from demons/gods or some other source that circumvents submission to God. -Paeter
@caitlyncarvalho7637 I think that would be a good reason to avoid them if ALL board games were, by their very nature, used for divination. But board games are as different from each other as individuals instances of "books" or "movies". So I'd say each should likewise be evaluated on a case by case basis. -Paeter
@caitlyncarvalho7637 The only one I know of that IS used for a form of divination is the Ouija board. -Paeter
(For the weapons of our warfare are not carnal, but mighty through God to the pulling down of strong holds;)
5 Casting down imaginations, and every high thing that exalteth itself against the knowledge of God, and bringing into captivity every thought to the obedience of Christ; its in corinthians
You should check out bible ref on this verse for a better explanation. The imaginations referred to in Corinthians are also translated as arguments, meaning they're probably not talking about fantasy and imagination. I could be wrong but that seems to be the general consensus that they aren't.
Absolutely not.
???
@@igydkygs00kwhi Not sinful
Are you joking? Are you condoning magic and superheroes because it's only Fantasy? And it's ok to watch these Fantasies because their powers are natural (born with them). And Disney's magic is ok because it's different from the bibles magic. Let me guess, witches are ok and Dracula and x-men too.
Let's start with the bible... Sin is sin, whether in the physical or in the mind Ex20:14,Mat5:28. And the bible talks a lot about the imagination, lust, cunning and deceitfulness of the heart Gen6:5, Ps82:12, Jer3:17, jer17:10(heaps in jeremiah), Rom1:212co10:5. 2tim4:3-4, col2:8.
Entertainment is largely about serving our flesh and not God. If you are comfortable watching movies of this world and playing games that feed your flesh with murder and fantasy then maybe you are not as close to God as you think. Mat 7:13-14 KJV 13 Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat: 14 Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.
I think, at the heart of our two positions, is likely a foundational disagreement related to analysis, exegesis and appropriate application of scripture. (Methodology, possibly source manuscripts, etc.) That being such an extensive issue to try and resolve I don't think we'll be able to come to agreement through an exchange here. But I do appreciate you taking the time to share your thoughts and reactions to the video! Thanks! -Paeter
@@christiangeekcentral lot's of big words to say it's ok to watch sin if we ignore the holy spirit and the scriptures.
I'm not sure how you separate yourself from being entertained by sin and merely observing it.
I can see the difference say when you are watching the news but not if it's in a game or movie.
It is possible to watch sin but not in the spirit.
You need to show me in the word of God where it is ok to do this or otherwise repent from your teaching.
@@christiangeekcentral thanks for your replies. I just had a look at a post you did 4 years ago about why isn't there more Christians fantasy.
We probably won't agree without the holy spirit.
Can you you give some scriptures to back your point of view thanks
@@scottandchels6813 That last sentence is a pretty broad request. It would likely involve me trying to reproduce here what I've already produced more extensively, using scripture, elsewhere already. So instead I'll invite you to explore more of what I've already presented regarding this general topic, and then you're welcome to comment under those videos in relationship to them. A good starting point might be "Can Christians Be Evil In Games?" ua-cam.com/video/xhHIZ1ukACc/v-deo.html which includes comments with application to many areas of entertainment. "Is Fiction Entertainment Sinful" ua-cam.com/video/D-0iLwRT_EE/v-deo.html covers enjoyment of fiction in general. And you can explore various other topics I've touched on using scripture by looking at the playlists "The Truth Is In There" ua-cam.com/play/PLxnq878sgMBx7QQolg7fXR05z_VxKwD5U.html and "In Search Of Truth" ua-cam.com/play/PLxnq878sgMBxtiWiDpfMW5QgFlOY0dvVc.html Hope that helps give you a good idea of where I'm generally coming from and why! Thanks! -Paeter
Hello there brother i come in love and hope too change your mind about these things that we call fictional stories. First i would like too say sin is sin and you are right about that but what you are describing is not sin the bible defines what sin is not you or me. Lets start with the bible as you stated ok. First i would like too demonstrate that sin is only sin if there is a law attached too it and when this happens sin becomes activated and boom your sinning here is my verse too prove that.
Romans 7:7-11
7 What shall we say, then? Is the law sinful? Certainly not! Nevertheless, I would not have known what sin was had it not been for the law. For I would not have known what coveting really was if the law had not said, “You shall not covet.”[b] 8 But sin, seizing the opportunity afforded by the commandment, produced in me every kind of coveting. For apart from the law, sin was dead. 9 Once I was alive apart from the law; but when the commandment came, sin sprang to life and I died. 10 I found that the very commandment that was intended to bring life actually brought death. 11 For sin, seizing the opportunity afforded by the commandment, deceived me, and through the commandment put me to death.
This verse tells us exactly that in fact Paul says that he was alive apart from the law and that without the law sin was DEAD. We cant go spouting and labeling this is a sin and thats a sin thats the same as writing a new book of the bible and inserting these laws that you have just created like don't read, watch, or partake in ant type of fictional story these laws are not from God but from you. Here is the next verse,
Romans 14:22-23
22 So whatever you believe about these things keep between yourself and God. Blessed is the one who does not condemn himself by what he approves. 23 But whoever has doubts is condemned if they eat, because their eating is not from faith; and everything that does not come from faith is sin.[c]
This verse is mainly referring too food but a principle can be applied from these verses as well as the whole chapter. This goes too say each person is different and if you approve of something that is not inherently sinful your conscious bears witness too you in that regard, but if you doubt rather its good or not, your eating or in this case fictional magic does not come from faith and since it doesn't too you it is sin.
There is a whole biblical presentation i have for this type of subject just because i want too educate other people especially other Christians about what i believe and why on this matter because i am a geek who likes video games, comic books, anime, manga, toy collecting and stuff like that and unfortunately there are Christians who think everything is sinful even though the bible tells us what's sinful and what God hates they insist on adding geeks too that list.
We can continue this conversation if you like but i ask that you be respectful too me and i will do the same because you seemed too come off as very condemning and seems like you want too argue. It is obvious we have different opinions but that doesn't mean we can't have a productive conversation.
I have a lot more too say on this but i would be typing for hours proving each point and refuting each verse that is commonly used too say geeky activities are sinful mainly Philippians 4:8 and Psalms 101:3. So with that i wish you farewell and God Bless-Nick
So this means the Harry Potter is not sinful because the magic in that is different from the bible magic
Well I wouldn't want to state that there is nothing sinful in any of the content of the Harry Potter books. Characters do evil things and morality is not always perfectly represented. But I would say that reading about the fantasy magic in Harry Potter is not what the biblical warnings against sorcery were intending to keep us away from. -Paeter
Sorry for asking questions but I was playing some video games and there were fortune tellers that told you where to go when you were lost, and I was wondering if I should play that game because it has Divination in it?
@@kylefritts7709 No need to apologize! I love chatting about things like this! It sounds like the heart of the issue is whether or not we should perform activities in the context of a game world that would be sinful if we performed them in the real world. I've spent a good amount of time wrestling with this topic myself and made a video awhile back that attempts to address it, which you can find here: ua-cam.com/video/xhHIZ1ukACc/v-deo.html
I hope that helps!
-Paeter
Depends on the context of the magic, Harry Potter’s magic is the sinful matter because it is promoting the pleasure of sorcery.
Pro 4:1-27 KJV 1 Hear, ye children, the instruction of a father, and attend to know understanding. 2 For I give you good doctrine, forsake ye not my law. 3 For I was my father's son, tender and only beloved in the sight of my mother. 4 He taught me also, and said unto me, Let thine heart retain my words: keep my commandments, and live. 5 Get wisdom, get understanding: forget it not; neither decline from the words of my mouth. 6 Forsake her not, and she shall preserve thee: love her, and she shall keep thee. 7 Wisdom is the principal thing; therefore get wisdom: and with all thy getting get understanding. 8 Exalt her, and she shall promote thee: she shall bring thee to honour, when thou dost embrace her. 9 She shall give to thine head an ornament of grace: a crown of glory shall she deliver to thee. 10 Hear, O my son, and receive my sayings; and the years of thy life shall be many. 11 I have taught thee in the way of wisdom; I have led thee in right paths. 12 When thou goest, thy steps shall not be straitened; and when thou runnest, thou shalt not stumble. 13 Take fast hold of instruction; let her not go: keep her; for she is thy life. 14 Enter not into the path of the wicked, and go not in the way of evil men. 15 Avoid it, pass not by it, turn from it, and pass away. 16 For they sleep not, except they have done mischief; and their sleep is taken away, unless they cause some to fall. 17 For they eat the bread of wickedness, and drink the wine of violence. 18 But the path of the just is as the shining light, that shineth more and more unto the perfect day. 19 The way of the wicked is as darkness: they know not at what they stumble. 20 My son, attend to my words; incline thine ear unto my sayings. 21 Let them not depart from thine eyes; keep them in the midst of thine heart. 22 For they are life unto those that find them, and health to all their flesh. 23 Keep thy heart with all diligence; for out of it are the issues of life. 24 Put away from thee a froward mouth, and perverse lips put far from thee. 25 Let thine eyes look right on, and let thine eyelids look straight before thee. 26 Ponder the path of thy feet, and let all thy ways be established. 27 Turn not to the right hand nor to the left: remove thy foot from evil.
Read Ephesians 5 and don't look for ways to be entertained by evil. We are supposed to be holy, people.
I agree! The challenge is in identifying when we are being "entertained by evil" versus merely observing evil in that which is intended to entertain. -Paeter
@@christiangeekcentral Can you please explain your point more clearly for me thanks.
@@scottandchels6813 Sure! In a given Star Wars movie, I might enjoy much of the experience. The action, the characters, etc. But part of those stories also promote false thinking, inspired by eastern philosophy or moral relativism. Those are part of the entertainment product, intended by the film makers to be a part of my entertainment experience. But I am not entertained by those elements. Rather than be entertained by them, I recognize them as false and harmful thinking. I am not entertained by them, even though I am observing them in a product that is meant to entertain me. The challenge is for us to move through life (both in and out of entertainment experiences) with discernment and caution about the conversations and activities we experience. Although we may be presented with sin as entertainment(a crass joke from a co-worker, or something else in a piece of entertainment) it does not necessarily become something we are entertained by while it is being presented to us for that purpose. -Paeter
@@christiangeekcentrallight side and dark side are like Karma
But don't movies with Witchraft or Magic allow demons to enter into our lives?@@christiangeekcentral