1:08:47 "People want democracy" I think people are more concerned with the ideals of balanced and fair representation itself rather than the tools supposed to give effect to these ideals. Remember, democracy "rule by popular vote" is just a tool of political appointment, nothing more, nothing less, everything else is just narrative. Democracy doesn't need defending but fair and balanced representation does. The moment you start defending democracy, you stop looking for a better alternative, you are effectively positing democracy as the only available solution. That's the real threat, that no one is looking to design democracy's replacement.
Many apologists of democracy as an ideal system (maybe all) forget that in general the choices in an election are made by naive people that are willing to believe in lies if the lies are presented in a agreable way. The greeks are praised as the inventors of democracy but almost never is mentioned that Socrates (and Plato) were capable of foreseeing the dangers of such a system of political choice. In my country, a formal democracy, we live in a hell of corruption and there is no way out at sight mainly because the corrupt politicians make the laws and therefore are always doing 'legal' things. I don't think that in the USA it is different. The great majority of the american people is not interested in finding the truth. They are happy to be entertained, to eat, to drink and going to church. What I think makes America (the USA) a good country is because there is always a good amount of citizens willing to fight and do not permit that the fundamental liberties be stolen by the corrupt politicians. In my country such fighters do not exist (at least I don't know any that are not partisan and are really looking for the benefit of the nation as a whole).
You have nailed it on the head regarding the US. I have lived here since 1976 and have become increasingly embarrassed (starting around 1996) about the “average” American citizen.
Democracy is about free speech which is talk and not action. That is why political promise, which is talk, is the most important aspect. The game is citizens are free to vote for another political promise if the last one did not materialize or not materialize close to what is promised.
Democracy is more than fair and balanced representation. Democracy is a guarantee my voice will be heard, justice will be given and Truth will be understood and accepted and journalist will be informed and trusted and no Big Lie will never be accepted. There is no freedom without Democracy.
From what Fukuyama says, Trump is the Antithesis of what is meant by the rule of law, and what a leader of a modern democracy is supposed to represent. How many laws seem to no longer apply to Trump, and how excessively Trump benefiting financially from his position...what Fukuyama calls a neo-patriarchal state.. He is also creating laws that should be done by the legislative branch, much more so than ever before.
There is a formula/golden standard of democracy: one man one vote and free speech. It seems political incorrectness to criticize the democracy in America, as well as Taiwan. Obviously politics is different from political science. When people enjoy their democratic dream don’t wake them up; if you do they’ll be mad at you.
Democracy is meaningless unless backed up by a strong prevailing foundational culture (Judeo-Christian belief) and values (preservation of the rule of law through strong Constitutional governance) as well as strong intermediating institutions (family, church, civil, social, etc.) as well as political structures that are responsive to the needs of the people as well as accessible to them easily e.g. open primaries where any candidate from a party can run regardless of the consent of a party's governing establishment to stand for election by the people. President Trump illustrated this principle brilliantly a true win for 'democracy.'
Beautiful, but preconditions do not exist on this world to have a classroom theoretical belief and religion just magically happened. The pre-conditions are you need capable leaders and capable people. These preconditions need very hard works and strong minds.
The thing that bothers me is that Fukuyama keeps getting Weber’s ‘definition’ is that he keeps stating it wrong, it’s not “legitimate monopoly on force” but rather “monopoly on legitimate force”. There can be other force vendors - The Klan, Gangsters, Vigilantes, etc - but they can only vend illegitimate force.
Hi, please let me take a moment to say a word about thorium fission, for him is a nuclear energy source that was first developed at the Oak Ridge national laboratory in the 1960s and is a completely safe non-carbon producing non-nuclear waste producing Energy source with in estimated easily obtainable natural reserve of 10,000 years, Let me repeat it again, there is enough thorium ore lying around to last the entire world economy 10,000 years. The molten salt thorium fission process, Furthermore is operated at one atmosphere, So when I say molten salt thorium fission is completely safe That is to say get is not capable of exploding, As pressure on both sides of the reactor containment wall are the same. Thorium fission is also as stated in incredibly clean producing no long-lasting nuclear waste whatsoever, in fact waste plutonium 232 from Standard light water reactors and atomic bombs can be incorporated into the molten salt Core and the remains of its potential energy can be extracted, furthermore with close to a 75% efficiency Capture oppose to the .7% of the standard light water reactor we can afford to not only make this a Carbon neutral but a carbon negative virtually closed loop energy system. Thorium fission beads out nearly every other conceivable energy source except for Fusion which as always is 50 years away from possible viability. So in other words we could in a cost efficient manner using the well-known, Haber-Bosch, Process extract carbon out of the atmosphere. Let me finally just say, that most of the wars being fought in the middle east and Central Asia, can be regarded in general, as resource wars, a massive transfer to a thorium based economy would not only make everyone Energy independent overnight but would help to eliminate the need for such self-destructive behavior. Thank you for taking the time to read this and please feel free to research any of this that you care to, peace.
In the mind of Prof Fukuyama, the only system of government that will work for all the inhabitants on earth is the Democratic system of government. This is not in accordance with reality though? To me, he is too obsessed with the system of government which should only be a means to an end. Ultimately it is the people that is more important. Regardless of whether it is democracy, communism, dictatorship or whatever, if the needs of its citizens are not met, it will fail and no system will last forever.
He sure picks and chooses his points to emphasize, and glosses over some rather obvious problems. He suggests that our system has reformed away from a patronage system started by Andrew Jackson and corrected by T. Roosevelt and W. Wilson. He illustrates this by pointing out our civil service examinations, but does not mention that these exams are basically for the vast lower ranks of civil servants, and NOT for the upper ranks of government institutions. After a successful presidential campaign, top campaign staffers and major donors, from which many will be appointed to the Cabinet, White House staff, Ambassadorships, Department heads, etc., etc. Not simply a newer, modern form of "Patronage" system, Professor???
@@mojito4493 Yes, President Putin and President Xi are now presidents for life, because they are very good presidents, strong-men who know that authority is what makes a country great.
t h if you like detention camps and human rights violations and a less than ideal standard of living , under a totalitarian government whom breaths down you neck than yeah it’s a success.
Detention camp human right violations etc have very different description depending on who is saying it. For example the chinese call it as re-education center (?), self reprisals (?) etc, they sound better right? As to less ideal it rightly pointed out there are differences, and each should adopt the best possible could. I see China should worry about the vast gap of wealth accumulation among the populace, because it could breed discontent and bring extreme poor to some.
I call China a success model based on the better life it has brought to the majority of the population. Many years ago (still modern era), many overseas Chinese got to send back money and goodies to help their families or relatives, things like writing pens bicycles sewing machine medicine and even basics like cooking oil. Now you want to send them "free elections "? Did free bring anything good? To be fair and honest we thought they are good not very long time ago but we must admit the free elections are creating nusense now, government are not doing well. What I can China would be run by honest and capable leader, retain them as long as necessary. Should one undesirable one mistakenly chosen, the mechanism must be able to eliminate him. Great internal fights, probably yes,
I agree with most of Fukuyama's thesis here but I would challenge his definition -- borrowed from Max Weber -- of the state which is "a legitimate monopoly of force over a specific geographical area." While a state such as North Korea certainly has power over a geographical area, its MORAL legitimacy is in question. I don't consider totalitarian governments to be morally legitimate and so their exercise of power is not legitimate even though they are a state. So this would also include China and other totalitarian regimes. For me, a state gets its moral legitimacy from the consent of the governed, through democracy. That said, it is understandable that morally legitimate governments such as US and Germany are in a position to recognize N Korea and China as "legitimate" governments in a legal sense because they must conduct business and diplomacy in order for laws and treaties to exist between them.
A manufactured model of democracy. We have seen demogauges elected to serve and protect certain groups. The major flaw is the subservience and manipulation of all institutions. The rationality principle is manipulated by popular media, which blurs the argument that people are capable of making rational decesion. The evidence of this is Pakistan. The absolute rights principle is controversial. The best political model, in my view and experience is that of China.
Fukuyama doesn't understand China Period. People need to be a little be of the open mind. Democracy or not, China became the 2nd largest economy proves that China must be doing something right. At least right for China, Isn't it?
1:08:47 "People want democracy" I think people are more concerned with the ideals of balanced and fair representation itself rather than the tools supposed to give effect to these ideals. Remember, democracy "rule by popular vote" is just a tool of political appointment, nothing more, nothing less, everything else is just narrative. Democracy doesn't need defending but fair and balanced representation does. The moment you start defending democracy, you stop looking for a better alternative, you are effectively positing democracy as the only available solution. That's the real threat, that no one is looking to design democracy's replacement.
Without quality control om players, so that democracy acts as a stage of performance of clowns.
Many apologists of democracy as an ideal system (maybe all) forget that in general the choices in an election are made by naive people that are willing to believe in lies if the lies are presented in a agreable way. The greeks are praised as the inventors of democracy but almost never is mentioned that Socrates (and Plato) were capable of foreseeing the dangers of such a system of political choice. In my country, a formal democracy, we live in a hell of corruption and there is no way out at sight mainly because the corrupt politicians make the laws and therefore are always doing 'legal' things. I don't think that in the USA it is different. The great majority of the american people is not interested in finding the truth. They are happy to be entertained, to eat, to drink and going to church. What I think makes America (the USA) a good country is because there is always a good amount of citizens willing to fight and do not permit that the fundamental liberties be stolen by the corrupt politicians. In my country such fighters do not exist (at least I don't know any that are not partisan and are really looking for the benefit of the nation as a whole).
You have nailed it on the head regarding the US. I have lived here since 1976 and have become increasingly embarrassed (starting around 1996) about the “average” American citizen.
But do you know that at best, democracy is actually a rule of the majority over the minority.
Democracy is about free speech which is talk and not action. That is why political promise, which is talk, is the most important aspect. The game is citizens are free to vote for another political promise if the last one did not materialize or not materialize close to what is promised.
Excellent!
59:51 "...part of the reason I wrote these books is to teach myself how this stuff came about..."
Democracy is more than fair and balanced representation. Democracy is a guarantee my voice will be heard, justice will be given and Truth will be understood and accepted and journalist will be informed and trusted and no Big Lie will never be accepted. There is no freedom without Democracy.
Sorry. You are delusional about democracy. You have the dysfunctional rogue state terrorist US of A as proof of that.
From what Fukuyama says, Trump is the Antithesis of what is meant by the rule of law, and what a leader of a modern democracy is supposed to represent. How many laws seem to no longer apply to Trump, and how excessively Trump benefiting financially from his position...what Fukuyama calls a neo-patriarchal state.. He is also creating laws that should be done by the legislative branch, much more so than ever before.
Democracy and individualism both are equally required
Oligarchs absolutely do meet in closed rooms discussing who will be president
They didn’t give him enough time to speak in this video.
having mixed feelings watching this in 2021
It's ironic, but based on Fukuyama's defination of democracy, America, in reality is far from being a democracy.
There is a formula/golden standard of democracy: one man one vote and free speech. It seems political incorrectness to criticize the democracy in America, as well as Taiwan. Obviously politics is different from political science. When people enjoy their democratic dream don’t wake them up; if you do they’ll be mad at you.
but American civilization could produce so many first rate thinkers and intellectuals and scientists.
@@lifeisneverthesame910 still far from being a democracy
@@onlycityboy how many countries in this world could be called as democratic?
that's correct a far from democracy
Democracy is meaningless unless backed up by a strong prevailing foundational culture (Judeo-Christian belief) and values (preservation of the rule of law through strong Constitutional governance) as well as strong intermediating institutions (family, church, civil, social, etc.) as well as political structures that are responsive to the needs of the people as well as accessible to them easily e.g. open primaries where any candidate from a party can run regardless of the consent of a party's governing establishment to stand for election by the people. President Trump illustrated this principle brilliantly a true win for 'democracy.'
Beautiful, but preconditions do not exist on this world to have a classroom theoretical belief and religion just magically happened. The pre-conditions are you need capable leaders and capable people. These preconditions need very hard works and strong minds.
US No.1 !!!!!wow
BASED Hoppean Francis Fukuyama!
The thing that bothers me is that Fukuyama keeps getting Weber’s ‘definition’ is that he keeps stating it wrong, it’s not “legitimate monopoly on force” but rather “monopoly on legitimate force”. There can be other force vendors - The Klan, Gangsters, Vigilantes, etc - but they can only vend illegitimate force.
Hi, please let me take a moment to say a word about thorium fission, for him is a nuclear energy source that was first developed at the Oak Ridge national laboratory in the 1960s and is a completely safe non-carbon producing non-nuclear waste producing Energy source with in estimated easily obtainable natural reserve of 10,000 years, Let me repeat it again, there is enough thorium ore lying around to last the entire world economy 10,000 years. The molten salt thorium fission process, Furthermore is operated at one atmosphere, So when I say molten salt thorium fission is completely safe That is to say get is not capable of exploding, As pressure on both sides of the reactor containment wall are the same. Thorium fission is also as stated in incredibly clean producing no long-lasting nuclear waste whatsoever, in fact waste plutonium 232 from Standard light water reactors and atomic bombs can be incorporated into the molten salt Core and the remains of its potential energy can be extracted, furthermore with close to a 75% efficiency Capture oppose to the .7% of the standard light water reactor we can afford to not only make this a Carbon neutral but a carbon negative virtually closed loop energy system. Thorium fission beads out nearly every other conceivable energy source except for Fusion which as always is 50 years away from possible viability. So in other words we could in a cost efficient manner using the well-known, Haber-Bosch, Process extract carbon out of the atmosphere. Let me finally just say, that most of the wars being fought in the middle east and Central Asia, can be regarded in general, as resource wars, a massive transfer to a thorium based economy would not only make everyone Energy independent overnight but would help to eliminate the need for such self-destructive behavior. Thank you for taking the time to read this and please feel free to research any of this that you care to, peace.
In the mind of Prof Fukuyama, the only system of government that will work for all the inhabitants on earth is the Democratic system of government. This is not in accordance with reality though? To me, he is too obsessed with the system of government which should only be a means to an end. Ultimately it is the people that is more important. Regardless of whether it is democracy, communism, dictatorship or whatever, if the needs of its citizens are not met, it will fail and no system will last forever.
Correction: China has NOT done the stupid, world-destroying wars that we have done.
i see it
He sure picks and chooses his points to emphasize, and glosses over some rather obvious problems. He suggests that our system has reformed away from a patronage system started by Andrew Jackson and corrected by T. Roosevelt and W. Wilson. He illustrates this by pointing out our civil service examinations, but does not mention that these exams are basically for the vast lower ranks of civil servants, and NOT for the upper ranks of government institutions. After a successful presidential campaign, top campaign staffers and major donors, from which many will be appointed to the Cabinet, White House staff, Ambassadorships, Department heads, etc., etc. Not simply a newer, modern form of "Patronage" system, Professor???
Democracy is a Failure.
China and Russia are doing things way better
@@mojito4493 Yes, President Putin and President Xi are now presidents for life, because they are very good presidents, strong-men who know that authority is what makes a country great.
@@bobbarkeriii2597 Then you are happy to be treated like child.
China's model is a success.
One bird in the hand worth two in the bush.
t h if you like detention camps and human rights violations and a less than ideal standard of living , under a totalitarian government whom breaths down you neck than yeah it’s a success.
Detention camp human right violations etc have very different description depending on who is saying it. For example the chinese call it as re-education center (?), self reprisals (?) etc, they sound better right? As to less ideal it rightly pointed out there are differences, and each should adopt the best possible could. I see China should worry about the vast gap of wealth accumulation among the populace, because it could breed discontent and bring extreme poor to some.
I call China a success model based on the better life it has brought to the majority of the population. Many years ago (still modern era), many overseas Chinese got to send back money and goodies to help their families or relatives, things like writing pens bicycles sewing machine medicine and even basics like cooking oil. Now you want to send them "free elections "? Did free bring anything good? To be fair and honest we thought they are good not very long time ago but we must admit the free elections are creating nusense now, government are not doing well. What I can China would be run by honest and capable leader, retain them as long as necessary. Should one undesirable one mistakenly chosen, the mechanism must be able to eliminate him. Great internal fights, probably yes,
@Coolbread Rye USA's Democracy is an EPIC FAILURE! Democracy is not only unsustainable, it's a Dead ideology! xD
I agree with most of Fukuyama's thesis here but I would challenge his definition -- borrowed from Max Weber -- of the state which is "a legitimate monopoly of force over a specific geographical area." While a state such as North Korea certainly has power over a geographical area, its MORAL legitimacy is in question. I don't consider totalitarian governments to be morally legitimate and so their exercise of power is not legitimate even though they are a state. So this would also include China and other totalitarian regimes. For me, a state gets its moral legitimacy from the consent of the governed, through democracy. That said, it is understandable that morally legitimate governments such as US and Germany are in a position to recognize N Korea and China as "legitimate" governments in a legal sense because they must conduct business and diplomacy in order for laws and treaties to exist between them.
Pikachu
A manufactured model of democracy. We have seen demogauges elected to serve and protect certain groups. The major flaw is the subservience and manipulation of all institutions. The rationality principle is manipulated by popular media, which blurs the argument that people are capable of making rational decesion. The evidence of this is Pakistan. The absolute rights principle is controversial.
The best political model, in my view and experience is that of China.
Fukuyama doesn't understand China Period. People need to be a little be of the open mind. Democracy or not, China became the 2nd largest economy proves that China must be doing something right. At least right for China, Isn't it?
US No.1 !!!!!wow