Challenge Trials can also include: "Challenging a Space Marine to ANYTHING" Chances are, you'll still lose, but you can at least pick the challenge. IIRC, one story had an Aspirant challenge the Librarian to a game of Chess
Gangs in 40k are a bit different than gangs in the real world. There are some similarities, like them forming in the poorest areas, using violence as a means of initiation, selling of illegal substances, goods and services, etc... Gangs, especially on hive worlds, are often used by the noble families of the world as a means of enforcement and fighting shadow wars against one another. On hive worlds, the gangs form in the lower levels of hive cities and in the underhives, regions underneath the hive cities that are the oldest parts of the hives. There is some major appeal for venturing into the underhives, lots of valuable salvage that can be sold for a profit, long abandoned habitation domes that can contain all sorts of goodies, archaeotech, maybe even a long forgotten STC, but there's all sorts of dangers, predators that will eat a person, dangerous wildlife of all sorts, roving bands of mutants, chemical runoff from all of the upper levels so toxic it might as well be lava, chaos cults, genestealer cults, xenos cults, xenos, chaos shrines, warp rifts, unexploded and unstable warheads, unstable void craft engine cores, long abandoned reactors, abominable intelligences, the ever-present risk of cave-ins and tunnel collapses, it's a place where only the brave, the foolish, the desperate, the outlaw or the brave, foolish and desperate outlaw goes. Hive and underhive gang life is so terrible that only the exceedingly violent, the extremely clever, the extraordinarily lucky and the psychopathic survive, and the rest get turned into perforated corpses that get turned into corpse starch by the corpse grinder guilds. Hive gangers are usually trying to scratch out a slightly better life than the average manufactorum laborer. Hive gangs can range from bands of bands of manufactorum laborers that simply ran away from their jobs and are now trying to scrape out slightly better lives to entire families of criminals to disgraced enforcers to religious fanatics. Most gangers don't know they're pawns for much bigger and more powerful power players. The smaller hive cities can easily have a couple hundred million individuals living in them, while the biggest hive cities can have a few hundred billion individuals living in them, the average hive city will have somewhere between 10-50 billion individuals living in them. Hive worlds will have dozens of hive clusters, which are clusters of hive cities relatively close to one another, and are often surrounded by dozens, sometimes hundreds, of smaller satellite hives. Every hive city, regardless of size, will have dozens to hundreds of manufactorums that will produce all of the goods that world exports out to the greater Imperium. Trillions of people live on hive worlds, so the average citizen is not going to notice that a few hundred million people make up the gangs and wasteland nomad outlaws. The space marine chapters that recruit from the hive gangs will send out chaplains to look for and take young boys(usually between 5 and 7) that match their physical and psychological requirements, then send them off to their fortress monastery to be trained. Space marine chapter training of all potential aspirants can range from repeated death marches to gladiatorial-style combat against one another to dumping in the wilderness to torture, that is meant to weed out the strong from the weak before they're given their first transplants.
Re, your statement on gangs, they form out of opposition to 'local' governments but are often loyal to broader governments. For example, gangs have participated in defending their nation when under attack in many historical events, and often can be loyal to a broader symbol of ideological authority, and especially rleigion. For example, gangs in Iraq and Syria were deeply islamist, and many of them formed the core base for organizations like Islamic State, while gangs in Central and Latin America are often very spiritual as well. Gangs fought for the French Resistance, etc. Also, in 40k, a 'gang' has a slightly different definition. They basically form as interest groups or community defence against other communities or stronger gangs. Basically, 40k hive gangs are more focused on defending their community or surviving than opposition to the government, and all are generally loyal to the broader Imperium, they just live in such desperate margins that 'kill or be killed' is how they survive. They might even despise the local governor, but imperial linguistics have shifted so much that the word 'emperor' is synonymous with the concept of a god in it's totality, (also meaning there are some examples where it's perfectly fine to worship your planet's sun as 'the emperor' (as seen in Eisenhorn) or have a polytheistic religion in which the Emperor is 'the one true god' similar to hinduism and Brahma. This linguistic quirk is often why chaos corruption is such a danger, because the idea that anything other than 'emperor' can be 'god' shatters a fundamental truth one has lived by their whole lives. There are examples where gang recruiting did not go well. The Night Lords recruited from actively pessimistic gangs on a planet entirely run by crime families, who had been terrorizing by the Imperium. By the end, they didn't care about the Imperium at all, and even turned traitor shortly before even Horus (who also grew up in a hive gang) did, when they grew so jaded and disgusted by what their gangland homeworld had become that they bombarded it from orbit
In hive worlds, the gangs are often pawns of the noble families, used to keep the manufactorum laborers in line and to fight shadow wars against one another. Most hive gangers don't know that they're pawns in much bigger power plays.
on the gangz subject, no, gangz, like any other type of enterprise, are born from a reunion of individuals that seek to a tribal-like type of dominance, that they commit crimes is not due to a social resentment, it is just a way they use to achieve their goals
They are absolutely fighting Orks, its the Crimson Fists! The Fists are especially not fond of Orks. My guess is that the attrition rate for aspirants making it to a full fledged battle brother of a chapter is somewhere around a 90-95% failure rate at best. The numbers aren't explicitly stated in any lore that I've found but based off of the brutality, difficulty, general apathy of their proctors, overall super human standards to continue or even survive and general context of different books about the trails it seems mind numbingly high. A good thing to remember with Astartes is their psycho conditioning is so powerful that even crazed hive gangers will be mentally molded into soldiers that follow orders without question, subconsciously. That conditioning can be broken (usually by the influence of chaos) or wear down over time, as seen with Dante, chapter master of the blood angels, who is over 1200 years old and who's conditioning has started to wear off and his is exhausted and beings to question the futility of the human struggle. However most space marines are killed long before it starts wearing off so he's more of an interesting case study. Sidenote: I love how the poster children for 40k are actual child soldiers that are horrifically molded into super human, psycho-indoctrinated slaughter trucks who will die the worst deaths imaginable for a war that never ends. And they're celebrated. Its grimdark to a T.
Think Mexican cartel who are shown in movies to be devoted Christian. So most gangs in 40k also believe in the imperial religion hence they are not heretic so are loyal to the imperium.
Guilliman's Codex Astartes is still seen as rather controversial by some fans of the setting. Mostly because they interpret it as having the Space Marine Legions turned from the mighty concentrated bulwark to the galaxy's largest picket fence rather than the defense in depth style organizational system Guilliman intended.
From my understanding, the surviving Thunder Warriors were highly stable compared to the average, and were thus more the exception than the rule. Still, I do believe that the average Thunder Warrior is indeed physically superior to a Space Marine. On the other hand, it's probably a good thing when 10% of your super soldiers don't have their hearts implode or kidneys detonate with the force of a thousand suns just because they breathed a little too hard. XD
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Challenge Trials can also include: "Challenging a Space Marine to ANYTHING" Chances are, you'll still lose, but you can at least pick the challenge. IIRC, one story had an Aspirant challenge the Librarian to a game of Chess
That's the worst possible choice lmao. An Astartes Librarian? The dudes who not only have at least double your IQ, but can also read your mind? Haha
Gangs in 40k are a bit different than gangs in the real world. There are some similarities, like them forming in the poorest areas, using violence as a means of initiation, selling of illegal substances, goods and services, etc... Gangs, especially on hive worlds, are often used by the noble families of the world as a means of enforcement and fighting shadow wars against one another. On hive worlds, the gangs form in the lower levels of hive cities and in the underhives, regions underneath the hive cities that are the oldest parts of the hives. There is some major appeal for venturing into the underhives, lots of valuable salvage that can be sold for a profit, long abandoned habitation domes that can contain all sorts of goodies, archaeotech, maybe even a long forgotten STC, but there's all sorts of dangers, predators that will eat a person, dangerous wildlife of all sorts, roving bands of mutants, chemical runoff from all of the upper levels so toxic it might as well be lava, chaos cults, genestealer cults, xenos cults, xenos, chaos shrines, warp rifts, unexploded and unstable warheads, unstable void craft engine cores, long abandoned reactors, abominable intelligences, the ever-present risk of cave-ins and tunnel collapses, it's a place where only the brave, the foolish, the desperate, the outlaw or the brave, foolish and desperate outlaw goes.
Hive and underhive gang life is so terrible that only the exceedingly violent, the extremely clever, the extraordinarily lucky and the psychopathic survive, and the rest get turned into perforated corpses that get turned into corpse starch by the corpse grinder guilds. Hive gangers are usually trying to scratch out a slightly better life than the average manufactorum laborer. Hive gangs can range from bands of bands of manufactorum laborers that simply ran away from their jobs and are now trying to scrape out slightly better lives to entire families of criminals to disgraced enforcers to religious fanatics. Most gangers don't know they're pawns for much bigger and more powerful power players. The smaller hive cities can easily have a couple hundred million individuals living in them, while the biggest hive cities can have a few hundred billion individuals living in them, the average hive city will have somewhere between 10-50 billion individuals living in them.
Hive worlds will have dozens of hive clusters, which are clusters of hive cities relatively close to one another, and are often surrounded by dozens, sometimes hundreds, of smaller satellite hives. Every hive city, regardless of size, will have dozens to hundreds of manufactorums that will produce all of the goods that world exports out to the greater Imperium. Trillions of people live on hive worlds, so the average citizen is not going to notice that a few hundred million people make up the gangs and wasteland nomad outlaws.
The space marine chapters that recruit from the hive gangs will send out chaplains to look for and take young boys(usually between 5 and 7) that match their physical and psychological requirements, then send them off to their fortress monastery to be trained. Space marine chapter training of all potential aspirants can range from repeated death marches to gladiatorial-style combat against one another to dumping in the wilderness to torture, that is meant to weed out the strong from the weak before they're given their first transplants.
Re, your statement on gangs, they form out of opposition to 'local' governments but are often loyal to broader governments. For example, gangs have participated in defending their nation when under attack in many historical events, and often can be loyal to a broader symbol of ideological authority, and especially rleigion. For example, gangs in Iraq and Syria were deeply islamist, and many of them formed the core base for organizations like Islamic State, while gangs in Central and Latin America are often very spiritual as well. Gangs fought for the French Resistance, etc.
Also, in 40k, a 'gang' has a slightly different definition. They basically form as interest groups or community defence against other communities or stronger gangs. Basically, 40k hive gangs are more focused on defending their community or surviving than opposition to the government, and all are generally loyal to the broader Imperium, they just live in such desperate margins that 'kill or be killed' is how they survive. They might even despise the local governor, but imperial linguistics have shifted so much that the word 'emperor' is synonymous with the concept of a god in it's totality, (also meaning there are some examples where it's perfectly fine to worship your planet's sun as 'the emperor' (as seen in Eisenhorn) or have a polytheistic religion in which the Emperor is 'the one true god' similar to hinduism and Brahma. This linguistic quirk is often why chaos corruption is such a danger, because the idea that anything other than 'emperor' can be 'god' shatters a fundamental truth one has lived by their whole lives.
There are examples where gang recruiting did not go well. The Night Lords recruited from actively pessimistic gangs on a planet entirely run by crime families, who had been terrorizing by the Imperium. By the end, they didn't care about the Imperium at all, and even turned traitor shortly before even Horus (who also grew up in a hive gang) did, when they grew so jaded and disgusted by what their gangland homeworld had become that they bombarded it from orbit
In hive worlds, the gangs are often pawns of the noble families, used to keep the manufactorum laborers in line and to fight shadow wars against one another. Most hive gangers don't know that they're pawns in much bigger power plays.
Always cool to see a luetin reaction
gangs form bcs of distrust of government... hmmm that's a new one o.O
on the gangz subject, no, gangz, like any other type of enterprise, are born from a reunion of individuals that seek to a tribal-like type of dominance, that they commit crimes is not due to a social resentment, it is just a way they use to achieve their goals
You shouldn't have problems with Helsreach since it's a fan movie I think
They are absolutely fighting Orks, its the Crimson Fists! The Fists are especially not fond of Orks.
My guess is that the attrition rate for aspirants making it to a full fledged battle brother of a chapter is somewhere around a 90-95% failure rate at best. The numbers aren't explicitly stated in any lore that I've found but based off of the brutality, difficulty, general apathy of their proctors, overall super human standards to continue or even survive and general context of different books about the trails it seems mind numbingly high.
A good thing to remember with Astartes is their psycho conditioning is so powerful that even crazed hive gangers will be mentally molded into soldiers that follow orders without question, subconsciously. That conditioning can be broken (usually by the influence of chaos) or wear down over time, as seen with Dante, chapter master of the blood angels, who is over 1200 years old and who's conditioning has started to wear off and his is exhausted and beings to question the futility of the human struggle. However most space marines are killed long before it starts wearing off so he's more of an interesting case study.
Sidenote: I love how the poster children for 40k are actual child soldiers that are horrifically molded into super human, psycho-indoctrinated slaughter trucks who will die the worst deaths imaginable for a war that never ends. And they're celebrated. Its grimdark to a T.
I recommend checking out the warhammer fantasy world. A good start would be “The Real History in Warhammer Fantasy” by Cody Bonds.
Think Mexican cartel who are shown in movies to be devoted Christian. So most gangs in 40k also believe in the imperial religion hence they are not heretic so are loyal to the imperium.
Guilliman's Codex Astartes is still seen as rather controversial by some fans of the setting. Mostly because they interpret it as having the Space Marine Legions turned from the mighty concentrated bulwark to the galaxy's largest picket fence rather than the defense in depth style organizational system Guilliman intended.
From my understanding, the surviving Thunder Warriors were highly stable compared to the average, and were thus more the exception than the rule. Still, I do believe that the average Thunder Warrior is indeed physically superior to a Space Marine. On the other hand, it's probably a good thing when 10% of your super soldiers don't have their hearts implode or kidneys detonate with the force of a thousand suns just because they breathed a little too hard. XD
Helsreach is fanmade
Just do helsreach bro im not on twitch 😂😂😂 im here for the waaagh