SH!T CHAT: Last orders on old lamps
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- Опубліковано 9 лют 2025
- A look at lighting that’s destined to disappear from shop shelves near you in the near future. My glamorous (and somewhat harassed) assistant and I present the technologies new UK and EU legislation will soon consign to nought but memory.
Yes, even today’s young apprentices will eventually be able to say “you bloody kids nowadays with your LEDs! I remember when you could get lamps you could warm your hands over and others that weren’t at their operating output immediately at switch-on…. Harrumph!” before unwrapping a Werther’s Original to suck on while your dentures sit in a glass beside you. Of course, your grandkids won’t care; they’ll think you’re just an old bore who’s behind the times because you never upgraded from the Playstation 8, you still think that old crooner Ed Sheeran sounds ‘cool’ as he sings to grannies on cruise ships and your house smells like musty farts.
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Links:
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Pretty sure that in T12/8/5, MR16/11, PAR64/56/46/38/36/30/20/16 etc the number is the diameter in ⅛"
So... I win and Nige is a massive liar!
I thought that, they were made way before millimetres were adopted as a UK measurement.
@@oninbridders Seemingly G4, GU4, GX5.3, G9, GU10, G13 (on T8/12) GX53 etc are named after their pin spacing in mm though en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bi-pin_lamp_base
Yes. t8 is an inch diameter
(8x 8ths )
What you should do when converting a switchstart fluorescent fitting to LED is remove the PFC cap, short out the choke and replace the starter with the one supplied with the tube, which is just a fuse. That way you can insert an LED tube either way and it will work (the “dead” end of the substitute tube is shorted out internally). Wiring mains to one lampholder will result in a 💥bang💥 if an LED tube is inserted the “wrong” way round, or a 💥POP💥 if someone tries a real fluorescent tube!! (that’s why there’s a fuse in the substitute starter).
Good point. I should have mentioned the fuse (it's been a while since we last performed a conversion).
44:54 I've put up bulkhead fittings with integrated LEDs in 2016 that are still doing fine. On paper, they're not repairable, but the driver is a separate unit that can easily be replaced. Now, the LEDs are a different matter, but in this particular design they seem to be underdriven leading to long life. The retrofit LED lamps you're proposing are probably driven close to the limit leading to a shorter life.
Great to see Sh!t chat back, very interesting as I did not know so many types were being phased out.
Very nice tsummary
MR16 was first 12V because it was not possible to make a compact quarz bulb with a high voltage and so very long and thin filament, wich would not explode when the filament breaks. Also low voltage halogen lamps have a higher efficiency due to a more compact filament. MR16 and GU10 were intentionally not designed for canned spotlights sunk in the selling but for accent display lighting in retail businesses or living rooms. MR11 and MR8 were especially used in glas displays or vitrines or cab9nets lights. Side note, the good old iron transformers cause no problems but the modern electronic ones cause problems.
The R7s Lamps are rather difficult to replace with LEDs as they are high power wich would require a lots of cooling make the bulky an unusable. Also decorative fittings using them need 360° light, something that is not possible when properly cooling these lamps to prevent premature failure. Also there are not only two start types, but 4 common types, with 1kW ~190mm and a 2kW ~250mm.
CFLs were dead since LED filament came. I don't think many buy the still, so they would have dispersed from their own. In my opinion they were an interesting technical approach but turned out as dead end. Todays technology does vary, there are very good ones but also a lots of garbage like with LED. Ineffizient LEDs suffered the same end, even thue those very still lamps that would last a century. Fluorescent as well are a thing of the past.
Wiring N and L to one end of the LED tube is not a good practice, as on the other Sid the pins are shorted together wich might lead to problems when a customer replace a faulty tube.
1800mm has gone in the 90s, as they were often BC capped lamps, and in the 90s Osram GEC as last manufacturers. stopped their production of these lamps.
I actually really like G4 halogens in accent features lights, but only when you use high quality lamps i.e. Osram German made ones. For under cabinets, again useless. G9 are similar, too much low quality lamps. In conjunction with crappy fixture like you described, it is good they are gone to history.
Indeed LED lighting with very high CRI are still rare and especially expensive, but they have improved massively.
The problem with the glass lamps, there is no heath inking at all--> often a cause of death.
Sadly a reccomodation, like you mentioned, of making less lamp repairable won't have a effect. Manufacturers have to be forced to use a universal widely available accessories like with incandescent and the traditional lamp technology's.
Thanks for the detailed reply - good to hear from someone who knows more of the history.
The surewire or octopus system is just the joint box method (nothing new there) which we were still taught when I started my apprenticeship (16th Ed) its a great method., simple, clean and one cable at light and switch even on a 2 way .... just these days you would need to locate the joint box in a cupboard or something for accessibility.
Got LAP BC 9w led lamps throughout my house (or i did before the missus wanted fancy fittings putting up). None have failed in 4 years daily use. They are very good. Colour temp good, no flicker.
Yeah LAP are often derided... I've seen stuff from name brands that is 10x worse (see John ward's review of that MK cheapo shite)
Receipts printed on thermal paper and not kept in the dark will be illegible after 5 years (convenient for the store). Scan / take a photo of a receipt if you're purchasing hundreds of dollars worth of bulbs / things, or go to a store which will give you a proper receipt on A4.
It can be advantageous to buy from the likes of Screwfix/Toolstation where, if you have an account, you have a record of your previous orders online. Many a time I've had to hunt back to find details of something I bought for exchange/refund!
I like incandescent in table lamps. Everything else can be LED, I have enough 40&60w clear candle lamps to last me a lifetime
There’s something slightly primal (ie🔥) to the gradated colour temp/watt of incandescents, that LED doesn’t really deliver, and why I still like the light and smooth dimming from my ancient 6ft floor R7S lamp. Despite it costing the planet, it does substitute somewhat for heating and as a bonus occasionally fries insects
I am the technical manager of a historic independent cinema. The place is full of incandescent bulbs which not only give the right colour of light but also can be smoothly and slowly faded right down to off. Currently I am stocking up with lots of spares!
I thought I had tuned into an episode of "Eric & Ernie" - pity there was no rendition of "Bring Me Sunshine" at the end of the video! 🤣
Did you ever see fluorescent lighting tubes with a metal strip from one end to the other end caps? we had them on the railway for lighting in carriages and the metal strip seemingly was used to aid starting up, we also called them the pisser strips as you got a shock off them when installing with the power on.
Fantastic video David as always very interesting and informative.
👍⚡️❤️
The CRO in the background is a nice touch
Nothing can replace the spooky atmosphere of a mercury discharge lamp - I use to wander up alleyways just to see the glory of those 'bowling pin' lamps.
Not the first time Nige has fished in the "tray of gay"
I know you said the PL-L and PLCE (the E is for 4 pin) aren't being phased out yet but when they do they are quite often found in housing estates from the 2000's in pendants, the pendants have electronic circuitry built in which probably won't be compatible with led,I don't know if there are led versions.
There may be LED versions, but PL lamps are so prolific I doubt we'll see their demise for a while yet.
You might well save money on electricity bills by switching from incandescents, but you'll probably offset any savings by having to turn the radiator up in the rooms previously lit/heated by them to compensate.
A customer once told me he didn't want to upgrade from halogen to LED because the light helped keep his room warm!
We had one with 18x50w MR16's... no transformers to be seen anywhere. I had a horrible suspicion... that they were in series off 240.. I was fortunately wrong. The transformers ( a bank of 200VA wirewound units) were walled up in an eaves space
Wow Avo model 8 on your top shelf. That takes me back a bit.
A vid on that and the Fluke 8020A beside it to come. Eventually. Hopefully.
I have in my shed, a model 8 that was adapted so a blind person can use it!!!!!!!!
Avo was the go to kit when I was an Apprentice - but then I am an old bastard and not an electrician.😉
@@normanboyes4983 The AVO model 8 was great for testing transistors and electronic components as it was a device that could draw a bit of current during a resistance test. When we went digital the high impedance didn't really prove much.
"you're the one who likes to lick the balls of these notifications" lol 😂
Figuratively and literally.
The halogen floodlight bulb is also used for Severy’s to keep food hot. So i would love to see how that can be retrofitted with led and still be effective
philips LED bulbs are absolute trash now
Completely agree.
Especially at the insane cost that they now ask for the Master ExpertColor ones.
Funny you should say so. Everything Philips is now trash actually. I just replaced a 15 month old Philips LED that was in a lamp that was on a timer. It did 6-7 hours a day before it failed. Less than 3000 hours. That's beyond pathetic. And last late year I had to demand a refund on a 18 month old 34" 16:9 1080p computer monitor because it developed a weird stain behind the 'glass' that looked like a vertical snail trail but disappeared if you turned it off for a few days. ua-cam.com/video/bPIfcOzGJAw/v-deo.html At first they returned it to me saying they couldn't replicate the problem, hence the reason I showed the time and date - that was the day after I got it back. Even the second time they claimed they couldn't replicate it, so I rejected it and required a refund - I'm not playing that game.
But I have on my desk a 13 year old Philips 4:3 19" LCD that works perfectly (after I replaced the low quality CapXon capacitors on the power supply ua-cam.com/video/h36-GE6sEQs/v-deo.html ).
Never again will I buy Philips and I will advise everyone to avoid their products.
@@TonyRule the snail trail looks like a panel fault and usually only appears when panels warm up.
@@magnets1000 I agree - panel fault. It reappeared in exactly the same spot and identical shape. I managed to get a decent photo of it both times too. It started to appear at about 12 months and was most obvious with a dark grey background and gradually got worse. Initially, it didn't bother me as I could barely see it as I mostly use a program with a plain black background, it but as it got much worse eventually it really annoyed me so I had to do something about it. To their credit, they didn't quibble when I put my foot down, not that it would have stopped me anyway - we have quite strong consumer laws in NZ. They didn't have any RMA stock or anything with a similar specification.
"Never seen a fusion lamp fail."
I've fitted thousands of fusion fluorescent tubes in supermarkets, they do occasionally arrive dead from the factory, but I reckon that's about 1 in 1000. I've also seen them fail prematurely, but again that's equally as rare.
We haven't fitted them in large quantity to be honest, but we've not been let down where we have used them.
taking this as a recommendation from both
Fusion fluorescent tubes are garbage only lasting 2-3 years usually, the phosphor doesn't even get a chance to degrade before the pitiful amount of emitter on their cathodes is used up and they start flashing. Philips and Osram tubes generally last much longer, say 5+ years ..although all modern fluorescent tubes are garbage compared to ones made 20+ years ago that could last 10+ years in regular daily use
My mum's got some reading lights that use 12V MR16s that I can't get LEDs to work in.
They have a high frequency AC power supply and on them I don't think it's the minimum load causing issues (though it might be), but I think it's the power supply frequency. Some lamps work better than others. Some never work, they all get really hot and ones that start off working stop after ten minutes or so.
On my to do list is swapping out the driver for a more standard 12V DC power supply.
Also, I love seeing the audio on the scope behind you.
Unfortunately as you say, the driver needs to be changed. Often the halogen driver is a bigger beast than LED models allowing retrofit to happen, but it does mean getting busy with the screwdrivers if you're confident enough to have a crack at it!
The 'scope in the background is a nice touch
A last minute afterthought. That old model has a warm-up characteristic which means if you level it at the start, the line will sink until it's up to temperature. You'll notice by the end of the video that the waveform is well below the midline of the display!
@@dsesuk Imagine how irritating that must be in a lab enviroment lol.
What? The CFLs are going too? Those are super handy for outdoor lighting. Lasts forever in that application.
Been looking for LED 12V MR11's for a client's motor home. Tried Sylvania examples conveniently available from Wickes and they're fine on the DC supply. They're a couple of millimetres deeper than halogens though so the retaining rings won't fit. Other known manufacturers offerings are no shallower. I understand why they're deeper but they're not much use in certain fittings. Any recommendations welcome
The only MR11s I've used were Philips, largely because that's all I could get out of CEF/Eddies. I use them rarely. In the past they were a handy solution for where two to four downlights were needed in a small area like a W/C. When I last used them about three years ago, I also had difficulty fitting them into the downlights as their face protruded just enough to prevent the retaining clip from fitting. I remember spending some time resolving it, but I can't recall how I managed it. It is a pain when the new models don't match the dimensions of what they're supposed to be replacing and I hadn't considered automotive uses. Are they common in caravans and campers?
@@dsesuk don't know how common they are but this particular motor home (2007 model I think) is lit entirely by G4 and MR11. 12V so if the van isn't hooked up to mains they work off the leisure battery. I guess a reasonable choice of lamps at the time rather than some obscure automotive variant.
I think working out how to replace G4s will be a challenge for the next few years since they're integrated into some cooker hoods and bathroom cabinets, plus various decorative fittings
@@dg2908 There are some 'disc' style G4 lamps on the market which work better in some luminaires than the capsule models. I know I say don't buy off the internet, but I've had some success with this model and brand in the past: amzn.to/3x61UU4 - especially in kitchen undercabinet lights and cooker hoods.
@@dsesuk The older Sylvania wich where still made in Belgium were the best led lamps ever made. Today I would use Signify (Philips) or ledvance (Osram) professional grade lamps
Got a few MR16s in my kitchen, when I traced them the "fitters" tapped the feed from the cooker hood extractor FCU (which is hidden above the cupboards so not visible) obviously the two cables didn't fit so they just left it hanging loose with about 1 turn on the screw
When I as a apprentice, all the lights at sporting fields, where 1500 watt incandescent lamps
My electric fire uses a 60w lamp which is red and the heat from it spins a fan above it to simulate a flame, I did change to led as it uses 2 lamps but the flame affect stoped. Was thinking of fitting a small pc fan to create the air needed to make the affect but couldn’t be bothered fitting a 12v transformer so just put the original 2 x 60w lamps back in. Might have to stock up on a few of these or revisit the small fan option
Yes, those sort of fires use the heat from the lamp for the flame effect. It's the same with the 'optimist' models that use an ultrasound speaker to create a mist from water that the heat from red halogen lamps uses to rise for a smoke effect. No good with LED lamps, but it's only for display and has no bearing on the room heating of the appliance. Those lamps may prevail as they're not being used for general room lighting.
G9 in our oven.. I wonder if the LED replacement will be able to tolerate the pyrolytic cleaning mode of the oven ?
I still have a G4 in mine, although the lamp holder is knackered and it doesn't work without some wiggling.
@@dsesuk Time to horde 👍
If you were a foot taller David, I'd think you'd be a brilliant Greg Davies impersonator. Keep it up.
I think you'll find he's impersonating me. Only without the good looks.
Top man Nigel, tall poppy needed cutting down there
The lumen cap on the R7S thing might be due to them being used for food warming maybe?
I generally leave the starter sockets in-line as the replacement “starter” usually contain a fuse.
We use R7s lamps for heating, think they will still be available for specialist uses or we is buggered!
Are they the infrared ones or the standard models? I'm not sure what Wattage a 2700 lumen lamp would be in that form to be honest, so you may be okay if your current requirements are below that. For now anyway.
They are often used in bain marie's in restaurants to keep the food warm for buffets etc but it is the standard r7 not infared. Obviously led will be useless here as there will be no/less heat, the most recent one I worked on had 6 400w lamps. I wonder what the alternative will be for things like that.
@@dsesuk original 12 x 400W in a couple of passes in a kitchen...
@@cfcduffysafc If they have a commercial purpose outside of domestic lighting, then they'll still be available. What we're talking about here is on the high street for Jack and Jill Public.
The entertainment industry is finding that although lamps (eg 1000W R7, some PARs) may still be produced, the demand has fallen to the point that manufacturers are discontinuing some
For editing photos I kneed a full spectrum light bulb which can only be achieved by an incandescent bulb. Glad I bought two dozen about twenty years ago. I have one fluorescent bulb which is daylight balanced, replacement bulbs cost £20. Are any of the LEDs full spectrum daylight balanced?
I'm afraid I don't know John. What kind of lamps do you currently use? I wonder if there will still be some such which get around the legislation and remain sold as for use in applications like photography?
@@dsesuk I finally found a tungsten bulb with envelope being a tungsten to daylight filter.
www.theimagingwarehouse.com/ProductGrp/Daylight-Corrected-Print-Viewing-Tungsten-Bulbs
Hope this helps any photo printers out there.
This modern lighting makes showing prints a nightmare as the print colour changes with each lamp it is viewed under, especially paper with colour brighter in it, which also changes with age of the print.
Try these “Philips LEDspot ExpertColor GU10” I don’t think you’ll have reliability issues with Philips premium products, they’re rated for 40k hours
OOOH Dave, I love your audio input onto the scope in your rack! I hope you haven't copyrighted that idea????
Could have done with the amplitude being turned up a notch, but it looked funky.
Oh it's a lava lamp! I thought it was apparatus from your butt sport collection. Doh.
Who would have thought 47 minutes about lamps could be so interesting, in tech I would have fallen asleep by now listening to 'Boring Moran' as he was affectionately known rambling on about 'bloody bulbs' for 47 minutes..... kudos to Nige tho, I never knew that the number related to the distance between the pins.
Ah, well don't listen to Nige on pin spacing as it turns out he was wrong! The 'T' number refers to the tube size in imperial units as others have commented on and is a G13 fitting (pins spaced 13mm apart)!
One end of the T10 is a short, you wire it so it will go either way around.
If you don't when the customer changes it, bang!
It's clearly explained on the instructions.
It uses the shorted end to take one leg of the power through.
This is true, and in the past we were very explicit with our labelling, but you're right, it's best wired either way around.
It would also be great to see a culling of shitty junction boxes that are a potential fire hazard, the screw less technology has proved its worth in electrical safety.
Some good information there, pity Nigel could not keep up with you at the end and needed a knee nap. slightly different topic but was covered by your octopus talk, never understood why its legal to put in a junction box (not including maintenance free) under floors, behind walls etc where no one has any idea of where they are. In the U.S. i believe that all connections need to be accessible, ie behind light switches, sockets etc. Wouldn't half make the fault finding sparky's job a lot easier. Keep up the good work chaps.
A good design ought to ensure there are no hidden junction points and, as you say, other countries don't permit such. I wouldn't use a screw junction somewhere it cannot be accessed and 526.3 has that as a no-no (going on to list exceptions such as maintenance-free). I think it's less of a problem these days as most competent sparks will avoid it or use the likes of Wago/Ideal connectors where they have to. I usually find such horrors remain the handiwork of DIY'ers and builders.
G9 or GU9 lamps are often used for oven lamps
They don't make a heat proof led conversion
I wonder what they will do?
They'll probably continue selling them, blister packed individually at £3.99 each and labelled as 'oven lamps'. That would probably get them around the legislation as they would have a purpose outside of room lighting.
@@dsesuk there all the bloody same they run at far higher temps than the oven will ever reach
But yeah they will be packaged as special oven use blubs
I love playing in the mystery box 📦 😂😂
"LED lamps are available in the G9 form-factor, although like the G4, they tend to be larger and may not fit in the physical shade."... too true... the replacements are enormous and have no chance of fitting in loads of lights... hopeless.
And while we are at it put a E27 spot in the gay tray and tell me something to replace it with that won't make the world look a dim yellow colour. Aaarrrrgggh.
Thus it has always been... i remember trying to fit the jamjar SL18's in the 80s (David demo'd one in the video).... many many fittings simply couldn't cope with the size. the weight was also an issue...
I have one of these uplights from the naughties putting out some 6-7000 lumen. It's a lovely lamp, lights up the living room single handedly with some accent lamps to make the atmosphere. I'll have to stock up on those.
(As a bonus it also roasts moths, flys and other insects stupid enough to go anywhere near the top).
I hoard 100 watt and 200 watt lamps as they are invaluable as a lamp limiter. No other modern technology will do what a lamp limiter does.
It’s a pain in the hoop that I now have relatively new disco/stage lighting consigned to the scrap heap…
What lamps do they use Stevie? You might be able to still get them if they have a use exempting them from the legislation.
@@dsesuk my showtec sunstrips use bog standard halogen GU10 50W lamps. Disco sequencers are on 60W reflector spot lamps. Soundlab vorma uses 3x linear halogen tubes. Disco scans are on 12v 100w reflector lamps (these may be exempt for now as you say…) got some lights that are using 300w 120v halogen capsules….
I do have quite a lot of LED disco lighting, but it can’t match the effect of the halogen stuff. I’ve converted my 12v 50w halogen moon flowers to LED with reasonable success.
"Hurrah!" - another DSES video. But, "nobody likes G9s" - I do! They work well in touch-dim bedside lights and despite so far throwing away £10 of supposedly dimmable LED G9s I'm still searching for one that works. It's going to be cheaper to buy new lamps than keep trying. Just because it goes in the hole doesn't mean you'll like it
What sorcery have you discovered to get G9s into the holder? I have broken dozens of lamps and not a few holders, simply trying to put the damn lamp in..... it was like someone said 'GU10 is the epitome of a crap lampholder design' and someone else said 'hold my beer'
I'VE GOT SOME WIND 🤣🤣🤣
Here's to a bright future for the pair of you.
David - excellent video as always. What GU10 downlight fitting would you recommend that is class 2 that I can put my own choice of lamp in?
I don't fancy Debbie McGee much!!
Thought your MFT on the wall at the back was a defibrillator for Nige!
On the 1000V setting, it might do the job.
Any tips on a good replacement driver for a MR16 12v halogen light in the center of a shower extractor ? Can the existing connector be replaced with a GU10 socket ? it has screws on it. Really don't want to replace the whole fitting, the ceiling is made of wooden slats, horse hair and crap by the look of it :0
This is a good question Leah, one I perhaps should have addressed in this presentation. These have a halogen driver that sits outside the fan assembly, so that can be changed for a LED driver although access may have to be gained via the attic or the fan pulled down to get to it from below. Once the halogen driver has been changed for a LED model, a LED MR16 lamp can be fitted. We've converted several of these over the years with success. A driver of only 6W will be plenty for the task, but we've no particular brands we're wedded to. I've used Sebson and Long Life Lamp Company drivers from off Amazon in the past without any issues.
You three are a right pair if ever their was one.
T12 is the tubes diameter, I think - measured in eights of an inch - so 1.5 inches. A T 8 bing an inch
29:30 Wherever possible, I convert the fitting to a class 1 and earth the bastard. Alot of them are just pretending to be class 2 anyway as many have sections of single insulation only within the metal fitting. Bloody dangerous.
I hear that.
yeah, the standards ALLOW reinforced insulation (usually PTFE or that horrible xlpe tough stuff) that LOOKS like single insulated... then a cheapo manufacturer copies it and actually USES single insulated soft pvc... trouble waiting to happen
Excellent video guys, glad to see most of them going to be fair. Also love your moaning, I moan about all the same stuff, a lot! 😂
How many lumens is Nige's freshly shaved noggin rated at, will he be phased out?
You *can* stack a load of LED 5.3’s on one old transformer. Not that I would but those horrible curved wall fittings won’t house a GU10 so can be a handy shortcut
yeah got a few 200-250VA lumps... i keep them because ONE day i will back to back them for a quick and dirty isolation transformer :) One day...
The T 12 is so called because it is in parts of an inch ,each part being 1/8 of an inch. T8 is 8/8ths of an inch or 1 inch in width . A T12 is therefore 12 /8ths of an inch or in other words 1&1/2 inches in width. With these lamps it’s all about girth
Great episode as usual though I don't know if at 18'13" into it you had depleted your internal power supply David and automatically switched over to full power back up but it I found it particulary funny. :) What is the 6" ish tablet on the wall above your TIS MFT with info displayed on it?
I try to make these vids look like I know what the hell I'm on about, but most cuts you see are me stalling or "errrrrmmmm"ing as I try to remember where the hell I am and what the hell I was wibbling on about! The tablet is a cack Samsung thing I bought years ago which was so mind-meltingly slow out of the box I decided never to buy a Samsung product again! It's okay for running a screensaver though, in this case a Star Trek LCARS one.
@@dsesuk well I think you are doing a fab job on here so keep the wibbling coming , and not forgetting your Debbie McGee ;) Interesting to hear about you also being an enjoyer of things Star Trek based, as am I. I do wonder how many Sparks who are have an avid interest in electrical theory such as JW and SparkyNinja and so on grew up being fans of all the franchise Star Trek and that fed their interest.
@@dsesuk You utter geek and I totally want one 🤣
I’ll be keeping me T12s going, they’re much more interesting than boring LED with their unusual colours and flickery antics. It is time for tungsten to finally go though, although for some applications (lava lamps, ovens, microwaves) they’re still holding the fort!!
I find it ridiculous that the new Mathmos lava lamps are using LED with a small heater to make the wax move. I don’t feel they’re gaining anything apart from higher manufacturing costs which gets passed onto the consumer 👎🏻
15:50 I’ve already been informed that manufacturers such as Tridonic have stopped production of their CFL TC & Combo range as of March 2021. ?🤷🏻♂️
Have youever considered a rack tour? It looks like their is a dual CD followed by 2 scopes, above almost looks euro rack.
BTW i'm looking for some stadium floods that hit 70000+ lumens ideally under 600 Watts, any suggestions?
Logic analyser above scope HP?
@@AndyK.1 I asked the wife about a rack tour and she slapped me across the mush. There's a HP 54200A digitising osilloscope in there which sounds like an aeroplane taking off when powered up, a Gould Advance 'scope below it, two old school Farnell LF1 signal generators, a Scolmore beer fridge and the rest is of little interest to be honest!
@@dsesuk lololol rack tour wife lol
@@dsesuk hahaha
Well my mum managed to stockpile about 50 MR16's about a decade ago for about 20 downlights. And yes, all in the extension, all installed by the cheapskate builder and all run off one driver per room that thankfully I found behind the first downlight I pulled down when I was decorating last year (one driver 6 lamps FFS). All cans and GU10's now 👌
We had another one a couple of years ago where the builder had hidden drivers behind the skirting. It beggars belief what goes through the mind of some!
are you aiming to be a participant in "antiques roadshow 2050" with that collection?
Love you guys……always cheers me up with this “Shite chat” …..but it’s worth knowing nonetheless 👍🇮🇲💪❤️🏴
Hopefully, there's a nugget of something in among the foulness Andy!
@@dsesuk just finished watching , I’ve gleaned a few nuggets, looks like my T12 battens are going to need to come out of the garage soon , the only non LED lights left in my abode 👍🇮🇲💪
Love the scope in the background ;)
Seam connected to the mic
@@AndyK.1 Actually, the Rode mic was only connected to the 'scope - the audio was picked up on a Tascam USB mic. But don't tell anyone, it'll be our secret!
So we'll ditch the halogen bulb from the lava lamp and instead put a heater in to create the same effect....
Integrated LED light fittings - I get the customer to buy their own so they are responsible for getting them exchanged if they fail early.
Hi everyone.. im quite desperate to get an answer for question : (sorry to go out of topic here but i thought Dave would be the one who knows 100% answer)
Is capping of cables regulation?
I know it's a good practice but if I haven't capped my wires.. did i go outside ob BS7671?
Many thanks for your answers
*I have got client on my ass to argue with me
Cables don't have to be capped. Capping doesn't meet the requirement for mechanical protection and only serves to protect against nicks from the plasterers trowel or other first fix tool swinging on site. That's why you can get plastic capping - doesn't even have to be steel; it's just there as a layer of protection until they're covered over. Most new builds shun it and you just see the cables clipped to the walls before being boarded over. Running the cables in prescribed zones and RCD protecting them (to meet today's standard) is their method of protection.
@@dsesuk many thanks David for such a quick and spot on reply on subject..
I have never been in position where customer thinks he knows better 🙂 and trying to squeeze money from me for repair work by other "spark"
Who said that my work need capping. ( In channel)
Thanks again for your help 👍
@@callimero2409 Whenever I'm faced (rarely it has to be said) with a customer who has taken the advice of another spark and is questioning what I've done, I ask them to point out the specific regulation or guidance they think I've supposedly not followed. If they can find something and prove I haven't done it by the book, then I'll put it right at my own expense. It's never happened though, because the response is always baseless - something along the lines of "well, I don't think it's right" or "I wouldn't have done it that way." Usually it goes the other way and I'll dig out the regs to show why I've done it the way I have which soon has them slinking off with their tail between their legs. Put ten sparks in a room and you'll get ten different ways of doing a job. Two will be wholly wrong, the rest will be different interpretations each as valid as the other!
@@dsesuk hi dave, this is my first experience with issue like this one.. at the moment I’m in position where customer didn’t pay my invoice for work, wants me to pay for “repair work” without chance to rectify what she wrote down in email..most of her points are rubbish any way..
She even wants to claim money of me for damaged ceiling..how else I should run a cables when there is a bathroom above kitchen I worked on. (Also explained when I quoted that will have to cut into ceiling) I even replaced most of damaged plaster and screwed it back to places where I needed to go through joists.
This really brings me to your earlier videos where you describing plan of work in official letter included with quote…
I did it only verbally..and it’s just not good enough at the situation like mine
I just want to thank you for replies 🤝
I needed the laughs from this episode. Thanks guys. :) DSES HQ looks like an Aladdin's cave of electrical history and general cool stuff. Did Nige see the brief for this video? or did you shove him in the deep hole with the gay box? I have had a load of Osram lamps fail recently after a few weeks of use. Pile of poo.
Nige went in with his eyes closed and his sphincter wide open!
Do theses changes include that 1960s/70s lava lamp on your right 👍
No, as the lamp used in that has a purpose outside of lighting
@@dsesuk I haven’t seen a lava lamp for years last one I saw was my sister’s had on in there bedroom back in 1975 . Horrible red and green it was .
Fantastic video as always mate And no disrespect intended the lamp looks cool
Hi Dave, it's the old sod from North Wales again, what happened to Nigel's hair? On a more serious note although LED lamps use less current over the filament lamps, the LED lamps have a poor power factor compared to the filament lamps being a resistive load with a power factor of 1, at the moment it is not possible for the electricity companies to measure PF with the older meters, but the so-called smart meters they will be able to should the supplier wish to do so in the near future. Big Clive has spoken about this in the past...
I would like to hear your views on this. Regards, Ray..
Well, it's a good point Ray, but not something I'm personally going to lose any sleep over. The power factor on domestic lighting ought to be small enough that it won't put a dink in my beer fund should my energy provider charge for it. Other loads may be of more concern however.
@@dsesuk Hi Dave, so many other electronic devices have a poor power factor, devices using switched mode power supplies like computers, TVs etc. all these devices contribute to an overall poor power factor, I wonder what the power factor of an EV charger is? in the near future we may be concerned more about Smart Meters, which at the end of the day maybe only smart for the suppliers, the public are being told they will save money by having a Smart Meter, it is just as much use as the fake plug in power savers..
I'm sorry to bend your ear Dave, but I have always held your opinion in high esteem. Regards, Ray..
Off topic, but have u seen that edmunsons are selling new honeywell fuseboards exclusively 😏. What do you make of that if anything at all
I haven't. Are these branded as Honeywell or are they the MK ones now produced under licence?
@@dsesuk there branded as honeywell but believe mk are behind it
@@funhaus_crew Interesting as my understanding was Honeywell had sold off the manufacturing to Circpro who were licenced to sell under the MK brand.
So because some dumb government agency says these are inefficient, ordonary people have to spend potentially £1'000's on more or less a complete lighting rewire.
Well as long as the government is paying then I'm all for it.
Otherwise nope not happening with me, I'll stock up before I have rewiring done.
Thanks for the advanced warning.
Takes a while to phase out the old. But it will be better for Sparkies:)
Granted the CFL has been replaced with better options, but I didn't really expect it to be taken to the cleaners.
I was rather surprised by that one too.
Talking about light fittings that are replaceable i have come across some JCC bollard lights that are Led, only fitted in 2019 with failed Led lamps with built in Drivers but JCC won't sell them on their own so you have to buy the complete bollard lights!
You can't put anything different as far as I'm aware as the lamp and driver kits come with their own fixings brackets to fix to the bollards.
Pisses me off when manufacturers sell light fittings but don't sell replacement parts
JCC are garbage.
David, what’s going to happen with the dimmable touch lamps (table lamps) ? They only work with halogen lamps. They dim in three stages, dimmable LED lamps don’t work in them as the gear inside the fittings are not LED dimmers?
need replacement probably... or a load resistor that kinda nullifies the saving of LED
I thought that, but some of them use pulse-width modulation like a LED dimmer (i.e. they rapidly switch on and off) and can work with dimmable LEDs.
@@dsesuk yes the much more recent ones... the older (200x ones) are kaput.. BTW David... they say 'the light source in this luminaire is non replaceable'... which is clearly a lie, every sparky has a surface mount rework station in the van, right?
(joking aside, i keep a cheapo soldering station and roll of non RoHS compliant proper solder in the van)
So do I buy a shit load of them and hold on to the untill 2025 and sell on.
The G4 was at one time very popular in the touring caravan industry
I hadn't thought of automotive when putting this together, but I suppose that's an industry that has embraced LED to reduce the loading on leisure batteries?
@@dsesuk Not many think about us lowly leisure industry scum bags 🤪🤣 several of the 12 volt halogens will be effected but as you say the industry has jumped on LEDs and even before that the customers did themselves, as you say to extend battery life, which was a god send really as most fitting were 10 watt and so often customers would replace a bulb/lamp with 20 watt and destroy the fitting 😉
The idea of a central junction box to run lighting cables too is not a new idea, I worked on some prefabricated home from the 50s/60s that used the same idea, the cables were twin pvc with an earthed wire mesh outer sheath with none standard colours for the cores (purple, orange etc)
Kip's mystery box was also an old one, so nothing new as you say. Just not something that's too common I find.
As most of those light fittings have been replaced by L.e.d at most wholesalers anyway over the last few years the existing light fittings are going to be getting on a bit in years so probably best to fit new light fittings anyway
It’s pretty shit to have to replace fittings. I’ve got bayonet fittings that must be 60 years old and still absolutely fine. To be changing after 20 is a bit of a joke.
@@chrisb4009 I thought that especially with Led Light fittings where you would of thought the parts would still be available as the light fittings are still being made and the cost of them and material usage to construct a full bollard light and I wouldn't of thought it would be that out of date for new product lines.
I think its sad that proper bulbs are going all this LED stuff is a load if carp
Simply brilliant again dave & nige
And there's me still using Roman Oil Lamps...
I’m most disappointed the r7s 118mm is going. I did already know though. So what wattage is 2700lm
In the UK the 120w lamp that's sold as equivalent to the 150 of the previous generation outputs about 2250lm.
Anyone know the difference between r7 and r7s? Never found out
So Nigel, what 1st attracted you to the millionaire mr savery.
maybe the Queen or The Prime Minister can do a deal with Philips now to put Dubai lamps in the shops...
I have every confidence that they're all over it.
So long as I can still get gas mantles, I'll be fine.
Big Clive says they are somewhat radioactive LOL
MR16 used to die so quickly, they won't be missed other than by sellers of them.
Damnable things Clive. Any kitchen you go into that has them always has the odd one or two that have been out for weeks because the homeowner is too exasperated to bother changing them!
@@dsesuk When a friend got his new flat I bought him a set of LED lamps for his living room/kitchen. Not one died so far in 4 years.
Its like watching a sweary version of the Chuckle Brothers 🙂.
to you... feck off'
@@TheChipmunk2008 😂
T12 is 12/8in and T8 is 8/8in
I knew Nige wouldn't know something I didn't know. Y'know?
Dave another superb Cinematic experience 👌 no 1 does it better than you (you treat your apprentice too well we can learn few thing from you)Thank you which clip on Bluetooth mic do you use
Thanks. The mic is a Rode Wireless Go. An excellent bit of kit!
thank you
R7S in LED are good. You can get those cheap Chinese flood lights, except the led is changeable because it's an R7S. Non-changeable floodlights are hopeless.
70W is ok. I haven’t seen above 125w. And the price is eye watering
Looks like the huel is working for Nigel