On a domestic EICR
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- Опубліковано 8 вер 2024
- Wobbly camerawork abounds in this video filmed ad-hoc during an Electrical Installation Condition Report performed on a domestic TT installation recorded on 27th August 2019. This is our first visit to this site, so familiarisation was required on this Victorian property whch has an extension built in the past forty years. The CU had been replaced by the previous owner as an apparent DIY job... well, at least I hope that's what it was and he hadn't paid for the cack-handedness. Still on the wall was the old 100mA RCD for fault protection, no longer needed now that all circuits are RCD protected in an insulated consumer unit as the RCD's provide disconnection of supply in the prescribed time seeing as the MCB's can't be guaranteed to because of the high Ze.
The installation was deemed as 'unsatisfactory' on the report. Various remedials are required including sorting the Class I garage lights that are unearthed. Also, r2 was slightly high on both socket rings and one lighting circuit reported IR of only around 4 MegaOhm, but poor junctions were observed where lighting has been modified. I'd like to see a second earth spike installed to try and lower that Ze a little. There were some other issues not shown here.
Western Power Distribution were called out on the day after we found a hole in the service head. Sterling service from them as always, they were there just a couple of hours later.
The laptop we use for Easycert is a refurbished Lenovo T430 available from Amazon on this affiliate link: amzn.to/2Lephpa - this one has a 3G modem card installed for no-hassle internet access on the go.
Despite the low battery in the camera, we had a lot of footage recorded on the day and about 25 minutes has been cut from this video to keep it at some kind of sensible length. Most of the cut footage was our form filling on Easycert, but that really deserves a video of its own rather than being shoehorned into this one. We show here one ring end-to-end, r1+r2 and IR testing, plus some testing on a lighting circuit, but r1+rn testing, RCD testing, Zs testing and the testing of most circuits is omitted from this video to prevent it being longer than the director's cut of Ben Hur.
The consumer unit is still untidy, but screws have been tightened, wires re-terminated and circuits placed into the correct terminals. The untraced circuit was pointed out to the homeowner and left switched off to allow them to spot if anything wasn't working that we may have missed.
Further links:
James Beck's EICR video, now fortified with extra dog poo: • Exploding fuses : test...
Do you like daag's?? amzn.to/2HBxbqk [affiliate link]
Kewtech croc clip leads (as I was asked about them): amzn.to/2Lqs8dj [affiliate link]
Good to see a full eicr, real world, not tailored. Love the practical test vids and fault finding stuff. 10/10 chaps. Awesome.
Thanks Chris
Chris Sykes I should have echoed these thoughts in my comments. Proper job Dave & Nigel!!!
@@matthewcollis-long5233 Thanks Matthew
Yes, great video chaps, I appreciate that it probably weren't a very profitable job for you both but nonetheless I appreciate the time and effort you both put in 👍
For me this is your best video.
But I enjoy all the videos you have done always interesting and informative
Very interesting and very well executed👍.
Just one question though I am a little bit confused as to why you had the green and blue test leads piggybacked for all the tests ? . Also you didn’t seem to test the earth bonding except for the Ze ? Ie I didn’t see you use a wandering lead to the gas and water bonding?
Fantastic video David and Nigel
Thank you.
Ps I know this video is a old one but I have only just come across it to day
I didn't realise I just watched a 50 min vid shows how much I enjoyed it
Maybe I shouldn't have edited it down and just left it as the raw footage!
Wow 50 minutes an epic rollercoaster of a video!
Artisan Electrics And I kept away 🥴
Yeah, it's a bit of a beast even after some heavy editing!
One thing that got me on occassions was that some of the stranded cable had a 1.0mm CPC which would put you at 0.95 ohms. Still high, but alot closer. Great Video as always
Thanks Chris, and I think that may be a mistake I made here as it's possible I misidentified the CSA of the CPC on this one!
Absolutely mint 👍🏼. It’s nice to see an EICR done properly. True professional, I wouldn’t go to the extent you went to, R2 to class 1 lighting & inspection of 1 or 2 class 1 lights. If I found connections like that, they would go straight back on the ceiling & the client informed. I use to go over & above, actually to the stage of fault finding. However as I now consider myself quite experienced, you are there to report on the existing condition, not repair their installation. It all started with this, I once remove a class 1 lighting unit from the ceiling with poor connections & decided to remake the connections, however while taking the lighting unit down which had a junction box located in the ceiling, the connections came out of the junction box & was shorting out. It took almost 2 hours to put this right. Moving a massive heavy bed, rolling the carpet back, lifting the floor & fitting a new junction box. Only to find the fault current had blew connectors off further down the circuit, turning the day into a fault finding pain in the butt. Lesson learnt.😁. Just be careful what your getting yourself into. The client was also fuming that I was there lifting her floors etc; Removing all sockets is a bit too far for me, dismantling should in general be kept to a minimum, if loose connections were found in all samples, It’s a C2. When the report is completed & handed to the client. I attach to the rear of the report a statement on my opinion of the installation. For example if the client was planning major renovations & the installation was satisfactory, but had been altered many times over the years by Everyman & his dog, I would probably recommend a re-wire.
Excellent points Patrick, there's nothing wrong with sampling and straight reporting. You're right that disassembly of fixtures can be a can of worms. There are certainly some installations where we want to look behind certain accessories, especially Class I lights, but we back off where their removal for inspection looks like a nightmare or risks plaster or paint flaking off. Like you, I've been in the position before where removing something has led to damage that I've then had to put right, and it's usually because DIY Dan used the wrong fixings or botched the connections in the first place so that it all goes to cock when I come along and disturb it.
David Savery Electrical Services u
Although I am not a professional electrician, what you teach me about my own home, and the electricians who visit it, is invaluable. My thanks. I would call you for a visit, but a trip to the Nordics for a 'garden light' install might not be practical for either of us :-)
It would be a hell of a call-out charge!
I love your description of the guy who designed the light fitting. Laughed so much I nearly spilt my beer!
If I ever meet that guy, he'll get a boot up the arse.
David Savery Electrical Services I feel this about petty much every light fitting these days...especially when it’s client supplied!!
50 minutes of video worth watching. Interesting stuff, even for a non-sparky like me!
Thanks!
Top video gentlemen!!!! Hope they get their Visonic alarm sorted..... I recognise that incessant cry for help from the panel!!!
Damn thing was chirping all day!
Thanks for making such a long video! It's nice following your thoughts regarding the installation and seeing how you do things.
Thanks Magnus.
Really enjoyed this. Great to see the whole process without too much cut out. Thanks
Thanks Nathan
Great detail again so us learners can follow along. Thank you
Great video David, as always Nige at his best. 😂👍
Thanks Richard
I think the day i open a BG board and it isnt a pile of wank i may fall off the steps and spill my beer.
Shite boards need a hammer to get the covers on lol
If they can't even folk out the money for a decent board, it gives an indication of what the workmanship is going to look like.
Terry Beard The hammer would better used to smash the piece of crap right off the wall
That's hilarious!
Who on earth uploads a video nearly an hour long? ;) wonderful as usual from start to finish. Informative, real world and with large dollops of humor spread across the 50 minute Netflix special of an EICR. Great approach to the remedial repair process. I've used BG a few times and it seems they are the go-to board for DIYers to fit on a Sunday afternoon? My guess is they just walk into Screwfix and look in the bargain bucket? Their new catalogue is out tomorrow (Monday 2nd September) let's hope they have a better range of boards? Thanks again for the mention regarding my experience with dog sh*t dancing while carrying out an EICR. Great lunch by the way chaps, I bet that place smelt delicious in the afternoon?
Cheers James. You're right of course, preloaded boards straight outta Screwfix and Sellotaped onto the wall. There are two spare ways in that board, but notice how the installer cut the busbar so they couldn't be used! It's amateur hour. Following on from those sarnies, the cab of the van smelled something like the dogs egg you featured in your video!
Agree wholeheartedly, absolutely superb entertainment and not just for saddos like me!!
J Beck Electrical I heard that Mk are discontinuing their disboards?,anyone else heard this?
@@matthewdale956 Only what eFixx said on Twitter a couple of weeks ago: twitter.com/efixx247/status/1163007138865676288 - not seen anything official from MK themselves, but at least one wholesaler is sounding the death knell: www.lewelectrical.co.uk/2019/08/23/mk-sentry-range-discontinued/
Great informative vid, I learn more watching the real thing than in any book, Thanks.
i am a trainee spark and learning a lot here. re inaccessible water bonding, you said you might do a long lead if you can find exposed pipes, but isnt accessible water & gas bonding required as part of BS7671? As well as bonding being immediately after main shut off tap/before any pipe junctions? From my limited experience, in this circumstance we would holesaw a hole in the back of a kitchen cupboard to expose the water bonding/enable one to be correctly fitted.
Briliiant video. Really enjoying watching & learning. Your dry, deadpan style of delivery is very engaging and entertaining
Good humor, great video, no bull. Keep up the good work Dave and Nige 👍
The left over cables and evidence of an old cu there, probably an old storage heater/panel heater installation. Sometimes if the installation hasn't been upgraded and the boards are the same make the old decommissioned storage heater board is a handy source for a matching 16 or 20A breaker if you find the ring is broken and you have to downgrade the circuit. Great well presented and highly entertaining videos. Keep up the good work. Hopefully have some more after this lockdown is over. Stay safe, all the best, Pete 👍
25:30 in and from the look of the incoming set up and unused circuits flapping in the wind I’d say Dr DIY has been here and removed unwanted off-peak equipment. That’s the sort of meter that supply companies install where there is no gas or oil to supply a wet CH & DHW, and electric space & hot water heating is utilised. I’d even go as far as to say Dr DIY has had a fiddle about with the service head and meter. Sorry if you cover this further on.
My original thought was the same, a decommissioned off-peak setup, especially as it was a two-rate meter on site, but then the cables dangling down were all in new colours so it didn't fit. Goodness knows what they actually used to drive, or why he didn't properly chop them off when the board was removed. The other ends were all cleanly cut. Very odd!
I'm surprised you trusted the other wires to hold up that fitting after the line simply fell out!
Spot on vid, not staged and tackling real time. Cheers lads
I’d love to spend a day helping you two clowns, just for the crac
We're a pair of assholes and are really boring in person; you'd be disappointed. Especially with Nige!
That consumer unit looks better than the inside of mine and the sticker on it says it was installed by a professional 😀😀
A professional what though?
Great video, answered loads of my questions about real world reports. Previous owner must have had poor eyesight as needed all that garage lighting and then took it with him!
Well, if they insist on appliances being prefitted with an electrical plug, changing a 5A round pin sockt to a 13A one seems the obvious solution. On this basis, don't be surprised to find pendant lights coming prefitted with 13A plugs and ceiling roses being replaced by 13A sockets - wired with at least 1.5mm^2 cable !
Just good common sense from a couple of experienced and entertaining sparks - keep up the good work
Thanks Steve
Top job as usual, not many these days would take the time out in order to produce the content.
Taking it slowly after a hot bank holiday!
Dave, great video as per usual.....the 1.67 x is for solid core calculations - stranded has less resistance than solid core so I would say Nige sorted the high ring reading on the Cpc’s 👍🏻
Thanks Pete, good point.
Fantastically informative video guys. I knew the alcohol would make an appearance at some point !!
Cheers Adrian. Sadly,it was someone else's booze this time!
Loving the in depth videos........tea was safe again........appreciated
Cheers Marky
After such a thorough EICR I hope you guys get some nice profitable remedial works out of it! 👍💷💰
Thanks Ian, we have a list from of stuff to provide pricing for!
Nigel is the spitting image of Frankie Boyle!
What Frankie Boyle would look like if he became a vagrant.
Cant wait for the 'Das Boot' style directors cut of this video.
Interesting, informative and funny. Another great vid
Thank you Mike
19:17 laughed out loud on a crowded train 🤣
Hi David, would the higher r2 values not be down to cpc being 1mm and not 1.5mm, so a different calculation to estimate them. With a 1mm cpc it’s about right.
Hi Karl. Yes, it is conceivable that I have misidentified the CSA on these so we are perhaps all good on the numbers as you say.
It, in all likelyhood, wasn't a 2.5mm2 T&E cable but rather an old 7/067 T&E which did indeed have a smaller CPC
Time to buy Nigel a set of insulated screwdrivers. We use click software using tablets that then upload to the laptop, no Wi-fi required on site.
Love the vids and sayings.
The old bugger has VDE screwdrivers, but he likes his silly PB Swiss ones that he bought himself. You can't argue with the stubborn old goat. I've no experience of the Click app, but there's no way on Earth you'll ever find me using a tablet on site! Can't stand the things. They're okay for watching Netflix in bed, but that's as much as I want to do with one!
Great video, would like to see one on the Electrical Cert software, as I've been reluctant to buy it myself.
Thanks Gareth, it'll happen eventually. Probably the next planned one after I poo one out on PAT testing!
I always r2 class one fittings.
At 26:01 not to use 1sq mm cable for socket outlet. This is similar in New Zealand:- minima 1 sq mm for lighting, 1.5 sq mm for power outlets (solid cables).
Great video as usual Dave! Oh and Nigel too
Second board set up to bypass the meter
When performing an IR test on a circuit where all loads can not be removed so the isolator is left in the open position. I think an astrix should be inserted after the test reading to denote that the test has only been performed upto the isolator point e.g
L-N >500*
E-N >500
L-E >500
I explicitly state it in the limitations, but a symbol such as an asterisk is fine so long as you define what it means so the next guy looking at it can interpret it.
looks like a single forklift tyne supporting the joist bearer lol
I think the joist behind his head had one too !
When you tested the cooker circuit was the 6mm new colour cable at both the board and the cooker switch (cooker switch was new brown blue cable)
Would have been nice for a main isolator to have been fitted when they changed the meter. Good work again guys, all the best.
I agree. It's nuts that they're not built into smart meters. It should be a basic right for any consumer side equipment to be able to be isolated at or after the meter, instead you get the DNO and suppliers offering inconsistent isolator installation services and charges or having a pissy fit when they find seals cut.
This is absolutely hilarious 😂 good video mate 👍
Nice one great vlog, I like these onsite ones,
Thanks Gary. Often tricky to film on the job.
Yeah I can imagine. I struggle with out the camera, have a good weekend
Hi, the Local Electricity board may let you have a PME earthing supply free of charge.
Great informative video guys!! 👍🏻 loving the Clusterfuck of cables!! 😂
Thanks Jamie!
Top vid once again David! 👌⚡️
Thanks Edward
Yay. Another Lenovo think pad lover. I have one, and another as backup when something went wrong, now mended, with the first. I like the look of them, although they're not quite as robust as the old IBM thinkpads used to be, but then, they're quite a lot cheaper than IBM ever were.
Yeah, it's great kit! I'd take that over a frickin' iPad out on site any day!
Brilliant. Ignore the keyboard warriors when they rattle on about sound or camera. Solid demo of how and ERIC should be done and the issues that crop up. Thank you
Thanks as always!
Thanks Dave & Nigel
Cheers Paul
Absolutely brilliant. Thank you. You pair are great to watch. Cheers.
Thank you SImon
I don't know why but I love seeing a fuse cut out upside down
Great video guys👍
Thanks Garry. No, I wouldn't test the whole board at once. If I'm testing because of an EICR or a CU upgrade, then I want to know the state of the individual circuits. Testing the whole board would probably just give me a low(ish) number without telling me which circuit or why.
Thanks for replying 👍
Enjoying the videos lads
Thanks John
Wouldn’t mind doing ecrs the way you do them. The company I used to work for would put in half a day for a single phase db or a full day for a triple phase regardless of circumstance for 1 electrician. You had no fucking chance of doing it properly and I know others never even took the cover off the consumer unit and just thought of numbers and entered them. Then he said what are you leaving for. Excellent video thanks.
I might be wrong but did I notice different wiring colours at the cooker isolation point from the old colours at the board?
D Plummer I noticed that also
The kitchen and utility room have been modernised, so we probably have all sorts of junctioning horrors hidden behind fitted furniture!
Awesome content as ever 👍
Why does Richie keep referring to Eddie as 'Nigel'? :D
Brilliant video
Thanks Paul!
Great vid, I would be just noting down all the problems not rectifying or investigating them. Customer can pay extra for the rectification work as you are only being paid for the test!
Yeah, a lot of people say the same. Personally, I prefer to fix the niggles rather than code them, and I do lob on a charge for it; it's not for free, but we're not short of work and I usually don't want to be booking another date to come back for the sake of some loose connections or busted accessories that we can take care of for a few extra quid the same day.
I would like to donate a belt to nige seeing his breakfast every time he bends over puts me off my coffee 😕😂 good upload
I'd like to belt Nige too.
Great vid David 👍
Cheers Derek. I was getting worried that I hadn't heard from you!
David Savery Electrical Services I’m always watching David 👀😲😀
Not right now I hope - I've got no trousers on!
I think we know that house is going to get a full rewire because it clearly needs it and it already needs decorating so you might as well. Otherwise you're just painting over rust and expecting another 10 years out of it.
Does the meter require the neutral to register the use of current, if not thats a lot of work to wire it like that.
I did think it a bit odd having 3 wires coming out of the main fused supply. It looks like the middle one (neutral to the meter) should be rated 100A to supply one LCD display ! Sounds about right !
It was prob for the other board which was removed previously by the looks of it maybe a separate economy 7 board
@@Klberts1234 Nah. It was just wrong !
Why do we investigate slightly higher resistance readings on a ring final circuit but don't bother with any other circuit... I suppose most of the time, we don't have anything we can cross reference it with.
Open fuse box no lock off device and your mate not using a fully insulated screwdriver sweet
Geez, I hate to be the one to point this out, but in the real world we sometimes work according to our own personal risk assessments, evaluations and competencies just like.... well... every other fucker who works on the tools, from plumbers to car mechanics.
Great job,these should be a lot more money for what we have to do 😢
Hi, another great vid. Just one thing that might explain your high r2 reading. You say it’s stranded copper- maybe the earth is 1mm as some older cables had a cpc of 1mm which is a different ratio factor. Keep them coming cheers.
Thanks John.
why does electricty meter only have 3 connections ?
Because the neutral to the board went straight from the service head, it didn't go though the meter. (DNO chap rectified it)
09:43 There are still a few of the original IBM Thinkpads knocking about at work!
Bulletproof kit. Make sure you rob 'em if they ever try and dispose of them!
IME all lights on one rcd side usually means there's a shared neutral they didn't rectify.
They split the two circuits onto different RCDs and there was no trip, so there was no borrowed neutral.
We use easy cert and have done for years. it would be great to see your views on it too. Generally we think it is good but like you, some things are annoying.
I've been meaning to put together a video on certification for a long time now. Easycert is good, its annoyances are minor. I think a lot of people are put off by the high initial price tag, but ongoing annual licences are cheap as you know.
David Savery Electrical Services . I’m more than happy with the price. We have told them about spelling mistakes and quite a few other things. I wish they would go that little bit further than just the model form. I would like to see location on PEB and possibly also a resistance result. I generally think the model forms could do with a good over haul. I’ve been using easycert for about 12 years. Look forward to seeing the vid on it.
Enjoyed that boys... Great proper real world eicr in a sex dungeon and R2 ring sting from pepperami's 😂 that meter and head looked to be properly tampered with, never seen a meter with a neutral not connected pmsl, why would that happen? Bizarre!
Ta. That meter connection was a new one on us too. Don't suppose it made any difference to the operation of the thing, but odd nonetheless.
What socket tester is that?
The little plug-in thang is a TIS 1005. Does all the stuff a normal plug-in tester does, but also gives a GOOD / CHECK / URGENT CHECK determination for the earth impedance. You have to take it with a pinch of salt as it's based on a fixed impedance of 1.1 Ohm which is the maximum permitted for a B32 circuit (such as a socket ring), so if testing a 13, 16 or 20A outlet or testing on a TT then it might not report as GOOD even though the circuit is actually acceptable.
@@dsesuk Thanks Pal, keep up the good content.
@ 46:15 Did you say your ring is suffering from high Onion Bhaji resistance ?
@ 49:09 I would have expected to have seem some evidnence of extra earth Bondagebeing supplied if there was a functional Sex Dundeon in the Garage.
Good example of some real world EICR work.
Nice vid Dave 👍🏻👍🏻 This is mainly my line of work....can be boring as fuck and stressful in equal measures especially on occupied dwellings......places full of crap...shit ya can’t get to...crappy readings ya can’t investigate..I’m sure you know the story 😂😂😂. Pity I don’t have a Nige to tighten them screws 😂😂😂 👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻
I hear you, EICR's are not our favourite pastime either!
👍 Spiffing video chaps 👍
Awfully kind of you to say so dear boy.
That board was absolutely shocking, not just messy, the state of those terminations. Amazing the place hadn't burned down. Oh and Thinkpads are the dogs balls, I've been a professional software developer for 30 years and I won't use anything else.
came across a board with not only cpc sharing sleeving. But 2 cpc not long enough and extended by a connector block with a single cpc to the cpc terminal bar. Thats not all another Live conductor extended by a wago all inside the board.
Nothing wrong with extending short conductors inside a board, sometimes when upgrading a CU there's no choice, and Wago connectors are perfectly fine for that. Extending two CPC's using one wire is a bit shonky though; you'd at least hope they used a thicker wire so the overall CSA wasn't reduced.... but likely not!
@@dsesuk Thanks for the reply.
Apparently the spark who changed the board is now residing in one of her Maj's hotels, I doubt it was for that board. I personablly I would have all the joints outside of the board in an IP rated junction box, So the only termination are the ones that came with the board.
Dave and Nigel keep up the good work.
Hi David, great instructional/entertaining video. Can you please shed some light on a problem I have encountered a number of times when carrying out an insulation resistance test during EICR testing. I have joined L+N together of a circuit then tested to earth only to get 0 ohms! I know that there are no short circuits and can only assume that there is something within the installation which is causing this to happen but don't know why or how this occurs particularly when there is no potential difference between L+N when testing to earth?
Is the main breaker isolated? Because if not, you've a short path from Neutral to Earth at the supply head (if TNCS) - I've done that...
Great video David, and great too see an EICR being done properly and thoroughly. Too many chancers out there these days who knock these things out in half an hour to an hour !
Out of interest, why do you pay to use the EasyCert software ? Surely it’s much easier and cheaper to use the NICEIC on line certification, which is free to members ?
Keep up the great work, enjoyed all your videos to date 👍
Thanks Darren. I haven't tried the NIC software, but I don't think it is free to use. Under their "How much does it cost FAQ", the answer is given as "Nothing. NICEIC Online Certification is free for all NICEIC registered contractors to use. You simply pay £1 for each form or certificate you complete". So... uh.. it's free except for the £1 charge per cert?? Sounds like a fuck-over considering I pay so much for membership. I've issued 192 certs since this time last year, so an EasyCert licence at £47.97/annum works out better value for money and it's more customisable with logos so I can produce something more professional looking.
Fair enough mate, I can see your reasoning now.
I wasn’t aware of all the ins and outs with the costing of them, I work for quite a large company and we have one registration with NIC that covers all of us, so don’t have any idea what they are paying. I thought it was just jobs that you have to notify that are chargeable ? But obviously you have done your research on this, so know what you are talking about.
Look forward to the next video ! 👍
@@darrenqualters2341 I asked them on Twitter about it and have this response: "Hi Dave - Ahh. Well, it is free in the fact there is no set up cost, license fee or annual subscription - like some systems - but yes costs £1 per certificate. Free-ish might be better". Seems then that there's a cost per cert as well as the cost per notification so it wouldn't work out as better value for me!
Maybe the other board they took out was for the cannabis farm ?
Something nefarious which had probably bypassed the meter!
Was thinking exactly the same thing.
Think someone was growing whacky weed too ...... on a side note, I REALLY REALLY like when you do the long videos sometimes ( I know UA-cam algorithm punishes you!!) they are majorly appreciated by me for one.
Cheers boys 👍👍👍
I would imagine removal of economy 7 board myself and maybe a radio relay when the bg board was installed
@@Klberts1234 It was indicated that the 'other board' fed a workshop in the same area as the wires that had been left were more neatly terminated at their other end.
A few nasty cracks in this video.
Especially when Nige bends over.
@@dsesuk Yes I noticed the camera seemed to favour that?
Oh fu$@% I just hit the 7:32 mark. Bit gratuitous isn't it?
@Nigel Marsh Forget the belt Nige, don't tell me you took all those socket faceplates off by hand... Get yourself an electric screwdriver gun.
@Nigel Marsh I very rarely use a drill to take off faceplates but I think if I were on this one and had to take off every plate, I would.
11.54 The line probe should be the last probe on the terminals when testing live, it stops a live probe been waved about lol... ie earth or neutral first then the line
You angling for a sponsorship with Lenovo? tbf, I had a Lenovo X200 which was great but recently "upgraded" to a Dell.
Nice job chaps. Question for anyone. What do you do when there are about 4 million mr16 down lights, pull them all down, disconnect them all, destroy ceiling decoration and test, or sample?????
To hell with that. I would put L-N IR testing as a limitation on that circuit as it would be impractical to wire out all those transformers. I'd still test LN to Earth though. As for inspecting them, a visual on a percentage to ensure the heat from the lamps isn't damaging surrounding areas *if* you can remove them from the ceiling without taking out chunks of plasterboard, otherwise it's another limitation on the report.
@@dsesuk Yup, What I did, real old plaster ceilings with all that wood and lime plaster, blurgh.
Silly question but can you not just do a 250v Ir test L-N? Rather than LIM it so you’re still getting the results?
No, it doesn't work like that. If there's a load present, then reducing the test voltage will still give a zero result because the test current is passing through that load. The only way to guarantee the result you're getting reflects the fixed wiring and not something hanging off it is by testing when there is definitely no load present, something that's just not practical on existing installations as you could be there for hours disconnecting and wiring out loads, then having to reconnect them all afterwards.
Thanks for the reply David! Excellent informative work really helpful for a newby tester. Quick question then what would be your quick way of locating a fault short circuit issue on a lighting circuit?
Ceiling roses are not Class II if they were you would not be able to unscrew the cover. I don't believe any accessory is deemed Class II.
Thanks Peter, a slip of the tongue that one, roses are not Class II as they have an earth passing through them. I should have said 'insulated', but that's off-the-cuff filming for you.
Sorry mate you have to do a test on the earth wire to the stake,not from The fuse board for a true Ze reading...All those earth wires give multiple parallel earth paths ,I had a TT with a ZE at fuse board of 18 ohms and when I actually tested the stake it was 360 ohms
He did!
He didn't they were all in the earth block still on the right
Balls. You're right chaps, the damn thing went through the earth block on the right. Honestly not sure how I missed that, it was right in front of my nose. We've got a shopping list of things to do there, so I'll re-test and we'll be looking to put in a second rod to see if we can bring things down a bit.
@@dsesuk I think most of us have made that mistake time goes fast on eicr👍
David Savery Electrical Services yes it’s easy to miss some thing,on my patch we are expected to do a eicr in just over half a day ,truth is you can’t do it properly it’s all rush rush...So you finish up making up some of the results and only worrying about the most relevant results
Good craic 👍
Doesn't that installation need a 100mA Type S RCD between the meter and the board?
Not where it's an insulated enclosure and all circuits are RCD protected. The RCD's here are providing the fault protection as well as the role of additional protection.
@@dsesuk When would/would it have been a requirement to fit a 100mA Type S RCD?
@@ashmanelectricalservices4318 My understanding of it, and it may be wrong as the regs are awkward to interpret on this, is that if this were, say, a 16th Edition split load board with some circuits 30mA RCD protected and some not, then the 100mA Type-S provided fault protection to all circuits to ensure a satisfactory disconnection time that the MCB's might not be able to deliver because of the high TT impedance, and it also offered discrimination (or selectivity as we're now apparently calling it) by being of a higher rating than the RCD provided in the board for additional protection. If the enclosure was metallic, then again a 100mA Type-S would offer fault protection against the metalwork going live should an incoming tail come into contact with the enclosure, that tail being before the connection to any RCD installed within the board. In this case, the CU is plastic, so no need to worry about incoming tails shorting out onto any metalwork, and all circuits are RCD protected at 30mA, so no need to have an RCD upstream of a higher rating. Of course, the requirement of Amendment 3 for switchgear enclosures to all be metallic had everyone scratching their heads again as you had the headache of new TT installs using metallic enclosures, but if you wanted to install a 100mA RCD for fault protection for the metallic enclosure then Amendment 3 meant you couldn't install the RCD into a plastic box, and if it was itself in a metal enclosure then how do you rig it so the incoming tails can't short on the enclosure before they get to the 100mA RCD? The answer, I believe, was that you could bring your tails in via an insulated tails gland and maintain their double insulation right up to the main switch. So on a new TT install or on a CU change for such, you could today fit a dual RCD or full RCBO metal board and still omit the 100mA RCD so long as the tails enter though an insulating gland, remain double-insulated up to the main switch, the main switch is double-pole and all final circuits are RCD protected at 30mA. So, to cut a long story short, the 100mA Type-S was needed for older installations where you had some circuits lacking any other RCD protection and/or a metal enclosure installed before the invention of tails glands! That's my take on it anyway, but I'm happy to hear what anyone else has to say about it!
David Savery Electrical Services I would say that a stand alone rcd could be installed in a plastic enclosure as this would not be considered a CU or similar switchgear assemblies as required by BSEN 61439-3 distribution boards for operation by ordinary persons .
I do agree that they are not necessary to be installed between the meter and the CU but if you wanted to then installed in a plastic enclosure is compliant.
@@ishkebab It's one of those that you can go around in circles on; plenty of discussion on the interweb forums about whether a standalone RCD can be in a plastic enclosure, but no definitive answers backed up by the regulations it seems. Here's an example: www.electriciansforums.net/threads/stand-alone-rcd-enclosure-metal-or-plastic.122187/ - Personally, I agree with you Ian. If the DNO install an isolator, then it's in a plastic enclosure, so if I want to install a standalone RCD a metre further down the line and an insulating enclosure is electrically safer than metal and I install it correctly so that the terminals within are torqued to avoid loose connections, then that is surely no more of a fire risk than the kit installed by the DNO. It seems to be a bit of a grey area unless I'm missing something, but it's also something of a moot point as any new CU you install today will have full ground fault protection for all final circuits so an upstream RCD probably isn't needed unless you want it as a back-up... unless (again) I'm missing something!
Why does you camera show the colour of those neutral lines as being purple? That's some seriously odd colour balancing.
It got cut in the editing, but Nigel and I were commenting on the strong blue colours of those cables which were rather vibrant to the naked eye!
Another Great Video. My guess is it was definitely a sex dungeon.
Brilliant video,I would love a review of different test software as I’m about to “finally go over to “ online certification,why don’t you use the Niceic online one as you are registered with them?,also are there three phase options within the software as I have a three phase disboard on a domestic job I’m doing
Cheers 🍻
Thanks Matthew. It might be a while before I get a video uploaded on that, I've been meaning to do it for over a year as it is! I've never looked at the NICEIC offering; maybe it's okay, probably it's a bit cranky. I do know for sure that they've had a lot of I.T. problems with it over the past few months judging by the emails they send out to all their members apologising for it being available or broken. I think it was down for an extended time a few months go which was causing real headaches for people. When I was with NAPIT, all they had were editable PDF's which seemed very low-tech but I don't know if that's changed. The advantage of using a package like Easycert is that I'm in control, technical support is (or ought to be) fast as it's a paid product and I can customise the certs/reports with my logos for a professional finish. If you use any paid package (and they'll all support three-phase installations), then the important thing is to export and save each cert you produce as a PDF so that you've always got it for reference. When Nige ran his own business he used Easycert but he never exported his certs as he just kept them in the Easycert library, but of course he lost access to that when he ended his subscription. I think he had to go back and export every one before they pulled the plug on him. I export mine as I make them, and I store them in an electronic file I have for each client. That way, if I choose to switch to someone else, I'm not losing access to any data.
David Savery Electrical Services thanks for getting back so quick,I’ll look into easycert,also need a bloody laptop any suggestions mate ?
Something with a good battery life! It'll also need to be Windows based if you're running an application such as Easycert, although a web-based option such as Electraform ought to work on Chromebooks or Mac laptops. I had a cheap HP mini laptop with an excellent battery, but it was sloooooowwww, so I bought my ThinkPad T430 refurbished off Amazon and haven't looked back. I've since put in a bigger battery and a 3G modem so now I have a robust machine which is quick, despite being a few years old, lasts all day on a charge and gets me online so long as I have a data signal. The best advice when it comes to laptops is to buy the best you can afford. Scrimping on costs can leave you with a machine that's not up to the job. My HP was cheap, but it was money down the drain as using it was crippling.
David Savery Electrical Services cheers 🍻