@steveanderson4768 and they would never be able to use it to any real value because even the rich have their limits to what they will spend and the ultra rich don't care if it's custom they just want the big name attached to it that says they are rich.
@@Xparkman30 yeah they don’t care about individuality. They just want the Ferrari name on it or the Lamborghini name on it or the Bugatti name on it. That’s all they care about.
💯. I used to design booking and press machines. Project time usually landed in the 6-8 month time frame with machine installed on factory floor. This is assuming the company provided CAD files up front and no changes were made along the way. And thats with 1 engineer working on it. Still much faster than this nonsense.
Does it? If you’re doing a draw in a stamp or drawing it out like a potter, how does one increase fatigue than the other? The beauty of this is that it can do things stamping can’t do, one he mentioned, another is forming shapes that are simply not possible with stamping.
@@FloofyTanker it really depends. Look at Tesla, they can get the bodies designed and made within a year (sorta time span, generally less) and the whole car within 3 years from paper to floor, majority of that design time is on the drive systems, the design (body/interior/entertainment system) and making it work on road (including crash tests) I only worked in Australia and our car designs were meh at the best of times, the cars did not really evolve in shape drastically to force a massive factory change IE the Holden Commodore and ford falcons only had about 3-4 massive iterations in the design.
It’s the same concept as 3D printing. It’s not for repeated assembly line manufacturing. It’s mainly for a variety of unique products and applications. Plus molds are expensive.
I've personally run off production lots of a single type of part with a 3D printer. You can do sequential printing that prints multiples of the same part one after another on the same print bed during the same run. Switch a file and multiples of a different part. So I have to disagree. A 3D printer can absolutely be used for mass production. With multiple machines the scale of production goes up as well. It all depends on the item size and machine build volume.
What type of mass production are you guys talking about? 100 parts a day or less? There's a reason that factories use molds and simple repeatable movements with large scale machines, because 3d printers just simply do not fill the scale required to produce enough money outside of a niche role to keep a business afloat, much less long term sustainable and growable. One big machine, industrial capacity and reliability. Hundreds of 3d printers, millions of little parts and much more expensive per part and considering life time. This machine and 3D printers are great for one offs and prototypes, but neither can or will work in an industrial or large scale commercial format. Too complex, too much movement, not designed with 24/7/365 heavy usage. One person working out of a small shop or garage, maybe.
@@namelesscage look into SLS printing. It is a form of 3d printing which is used in production. Not everyone is using $200 Walmart printers although production batches in the 10000s and more can and are being done in print farms of similar machines. Some machines are run for even larger batches. Look into continuous belt printers.
Except even less practical as this only does work on malleable sheets which is something presses have been doing well for centuries with very few drawbacks compared to injection molding.
@@skitidet4302 so to clarify you are saying that pressing doesn’t need a 3d printer equivalent because it is more efficient than injection molding was to 3d printing therefore there is no need for a dedicated machine for when those inefficiencies that do exist make a press impractical. If so that is a fair enough opinion though depends on how much these really cost.
@@dragonlogos1 Yea, You can press almost any shape you would want, and if you for some reason want some weird shape that you can't press, you can just weld it on later. Injection molding however has more severe limitations, there are many things that you would want to do that you simply can't do. You often have to design to fit the technology instead of the technology fitting the design. This is true to some degree with pressing but not nearly as bad, it's mostly just optimization. However, for real manufacturing, 3d printing is pretty horrendous as well. What's the best case? You create the part using a real expensive machine that slowly welds on more material? For 99.99% of conceivable jobs this is going to be vastly more expensive and time consuming than just cutting out pieces out of sheets of steel and welding them together. Do you know how much welding wire cost? It's A LOT more than steel! Then add in the time and quality control issues... oh and the power to run an welder for days straight.
Correction: Forming sheet titanium is totally possible and has been done for decades. I think what you might mean is cold forming, which is more true, but still not completely. Titanium is difficult to form without heat, and so either simple forming and hot presses are the typical route.
Destin from Smartereveryday has an EXCELLENT video on this subject, if you haven't seen it, you're missing out on some mind blowing technological advances. Seriously bananas stuff and worth watching.
Yea I'd you can afford metal lol. Finding metal that hasn't been recycled and amalgamated with other garbage to the point its so weak will probably be expensive soon.
What is the cycle time? A big press can run steady at 7-10 strokes per minute 24-7 if you want. Them robots look like it takes forever just to get a few parts per day. You gonna buy a thousand robots?
Downside is the parts it can produce in a day. A press can produce much many more pieces in the same of time. Although as you pointed out, the setup time is infinitely shorter. This is great for prototyping
Setup time for a part in a stamping factory can take about a few hours. It only involves changing the die u are stamping. Making the die takes a few weeks. U dont set up a new factory or a new production line for every single new part you manufacture.
@@sultanhusnoo8552 few weeks for the die, yes your right you are missing the cost. You may also need more than one die for a single part. producing a new die is normally not practical for small runs or prototypes. It is difficult for any newer technology ( be that this, turrets, lasers or press brakes)to keep up with the production speed of stamping.
@@elingeniero2000 digitizing a part might be as expensive as creating a die. Costs money to digitize parts, far from free. This machine is for prototyping or super limited runs. Need 100 or more, die will be cheaper and faster.
If I’m not mistaken, the heat in front of an airplane isn’t from friction with air, but actually from the intense compression of the air in front of it.
Yes, that heat, that is in front of the object going through the gas, is from the compression of the gas. But there is also heating from the gas moving along side the object. Probably this feller was using the most easily understandable ideo for the most amount of people to understand in a good, informative, attention grabbing Short.
It does not take years to set up a machine for stamping sheet metal. If you need a small run you can set it up in a place similar to where you just were.
They wouldn't have to take a couple years to set up if the government stopped interfering in private businesses. A whole plant could be built from ground up in 6 months to a year.
Golf ball dimple an entire car to make it more aerodynamic. * Edit : I know about how it works, and that it has been done. I was being a smarta**. However with newer technology it could be done at much less expense to prototype compared to back then.
The point of golf ball dimples is to achieve an effect called tripping the boundary layer... You don't have to put dimples all over your car to trip the boundary layer and induce turbulence. Besides, tripping the boundary layer is only beneficial in a very specific set of circumstances. For most cars tripping the boundary layer is detrimental to gas mileage.
It's amazing and depressing at the same time.. because we All saw the projected future as kids or from the 50s to the 90s and we are never going to see what we thought we would. Like space elevators.
This is amazing!!! This will allow so much custom work. It’s going to be expensive at first but in the future it will be more widely available. This is really cool
Sheet titanium = sheet metal Sheet aluminum = sheet metal Sheet steel = sheet metal Semantics aside, most people do envelope most all sheet steels under the umbrella of sheet metal.
@@MrGregsRnR I get what you mean lol, sheet ti isn't toooo common. And usually it's not formed it's cut & welded in common place applications outside aerospace stuff.
It's stated in a video they can form titanium at room temperature, something that often isn't achieved with pressing as you have to heat the titanium to make it more pliable? I'm not a metallurgy expert, but it is exciting what they're able to do with any sheet metal.
I think a much simpler design could be made for cheaper set ups Put a series of high density crush foams under the part You could even have a reool Put a sacrificial crush material on the under side to press against Keep adding crush material layers like a 3d printer in reverse For weak thin materials like paper or foil you could use Styrofoam For stronger thicker materials you could use low density concrete, etc You might not get all the freedoms of the multi jointed double arm set up But you could make very sturdy simple pathway for very cheap $50,000 ish for a matching the machine in the video capabilities 12"*12" set up for $2-$5k You could also use a roto hammer to apply pressure, greatly reducing how beefy you need the structure There could be problems with resonance causing fractures and weakening the part of the crush material in unintended ways But i think it could be overcome or isolated with some tweaking You could also make a movable typeface design Essentially have a CNC aim the punch on a lightweight system, then have a different rig press the punch Like how a printing press is set and pressed, you essentially you aim hit aim hit, like a mouse directing a giant swinging a hammer
That joke always was dead: a metal stretcher exists, it's often combined with a shrinker by using a different set of beaks. In its simplest form it's a manual tool that can be carried by one person.
@@Random-ed2xf i think this is such an understatement! It’s not an easy modification at all. This is like a day and night difference from robot welding, which is a completely different and difficult task (and a relatively high level of customization). I think reshaping brings this to another level. For the reshaping you need to know the exact behavior of the robot on behalf of reaction forces and pathtaking, of the material, of the wear and tear. The control system must be highly sophisticated because the robot works autonomous and on an inhomogenous material with possibly changing environment parameters. Every error adds up. You can’t simply „teach“ it like it might be possible with welding. And the cost of ownership and processing cost per part will still be huge.
I remember when I first saw this it was put across as this amazing new thing. But I know custom sheet metal guys who have been doing advanced metal forming for decades. The difference here is that types of materials that may be formed.
Yeah completely the same as the old way except for the time, energy, cost of ownership, required skills, and logistic management involved but besides those things totally not a useful tech
Theres a whole video on this type of machine. It complicated but actually worth it vs having a steel/graphite mold made for pressing. Metal has no problem stretching a bit theres a ton of testing to know how far you can stretch certain metals thin before they cross the threshold of being too brittle.
Same with forging, you can heat treat to allow for the stresses to be relived but also yhese stresses can be used to kodify then physical properties to your benefit. Lots of questions for the eningeers designing the part.
@@gribboffroad6963 first off, no one creates technology like this unless there was a need to be met. In other words, the fact that it exists proves there's a need. But it does things that no other technology can do. Primarily it forms metal in the same way that stamping does, but it can do more complex shapes than pressing can. It was really built to support iterative design however. Iterative design is a process of doing as much engineering as necessary, but as little as possible so that the part can be built and tested to refine the design. It isn't exactly prototyping, but it isn't mass production either. In order to do that with metal, a press isn't used because the process of making dies is too slow and costly to do it efficiently. So you're forced to either use simple shapes, or slowed down by the assembly of simple shapes into complex ones. With this machine, you can put a piece of sheet metal in the machine and out comes a very complex formed part in a few hours.
@tylerfb1 For sheet metal this is medieval tech it is the exact same as plate armor in that time period just with robots instead of people doing the work. Calling this a new way of doing it is insane.
@@havtor007 Obviously humans learned how to form metal since we first refined it, and the molecular mechanics involved don’t change. But this is not hammered or rolled sheet. This shapes metal like a press but it has capabilities that have never existed before.
I wouldn’t call this process “new”… well at least I wouldn’t call it new. We’ve been trying this out since 2010, but only to the extent of custom pots n pans. The only accurate application I remember using for was making a topographic mold of a mountain range.
It's just like 3d printing. You can even make out individual layers where the machine went over line by line, like on layer printers. Idk why people are critically pointing out the disadvantages of that or its unsuitability for mass production as if the designers didn't know those things when they designed this _obvious special application tool._ They made those tradeoffs because that's the purpose of what they were doing. I think it's neat for prototyping.
The shapes formed from stamping strengthens the metal (due to even application of pressure) unlike robo-forming which weakens it, and the extra cost for surfacing the metal for finishes and tempering makes it more expensive for vehicle production. The application I see for this is rapid reproduction of sheet metal parts for rare out of production cars and aircraft. by scanning the old worn out metal and roboforming the replacement part. Though that may also be taken over by 3d printing using metal powder.
Its good for prototyping and small runs only. A factory takes a few years to set up but those that do stamping typically do it for thousands of parts and some factories do it for dozens of companies. The factory takes years to setup but the die for a part only takes a few weeks to make and maybe a few hours to swap out from one to the other. Also, as some1 mentionned, this also causes stress on the metal. Small runs or prototyping only for this.
I've seen around 100500 new technologies that were promising to revolutionise "rapid prototyping". Turns out all the engineers who were capable of utilizing such tech to its full extent to actually DO the rapid prototyping stayed in 1970's. Woopsie😅
Great for prototyping, doing small runs and producing shapes that can't be stamped. Its never going to threaten stamping but it will allow new things to be done.
I believe this will be a common thing in the future. With Little 3D scanning and some Robo-forming, you can bend any sheet to any form. Be it a fixing a crushed car plates, a custom plate for any use, or re-engineering of already existing forms for optimization. The possibilities are endless and the development of the technology itself is going to be so progressive in ten years this will probably be in one out of ten car repairs shops or so.
I spent eight years setting up stamping presses, the press isn't the issue. This robotic setup is great for R&D and prototyping or even low quantity manufacturing, but not large scale production. The design and production of the die itself can be expensive, but you need to calculate the trade-off of that cost versus the slow production rate of the robotic method. Either way it's pretty cool
The one use I see off the bat is making sheet metal molds for composites. Once you have the sheet you glass it on the back, add pegs and you're all set for a great mold for prepreg or wel layup
Everytime I open comments on such videos. There are always people who have a different perspective, who carefully Criticize stating their observations and knowledge. Every new innovation will receive criticism just bcoz it doesnt fit for one or another application. I guess thats how the world works. Im just so delighted to see fellow engineers commenting here.
This is really great for hobbyists and small facilities, because in order to stamp metal in the normal way, you have to spend the time and money to build the cast and die. With this, you don't have to have a cast and die
You gotta remember that when you’re doing normal manufacturing your manufacturing thousands and thousands and thousands of the same part it makes it hard to make one thing and see if it’s good for prototyping because you have to make thousands of product and then see that they don’t work to make other products. It’s really expensive. So this metal sheet forming is actually exceedingly beneficiary for prototyping because it takes a few days for you to have your prototype and then you can decide if you want to make more or if you need to make a change
Looks really cool & I’m intrigued to see where it goes. I think the stepped nature of it will minimize its applications or drive much higher times for precision pieces
Looks like you could form intricate details too. How difficult is forming on a third axis? Sort of 3D printing. Seems like this should have been possible sooner.
In silversmithing this way of making is called chasing and repousse. You set the work in pitch (it's resistant wax) and hammer it in and out to make complex shapes
I was thinking exactly the same thing. It looks like a technology that is very useful for prototyping. But I am also curious to the accuracy of this technology. If you're deforming material like that you are slightly stretching a lot of other places.
This will not be fast enough for mass production but I can see it offering massive cost and time savings when used for iterative design, prototyping and testing.
It's not friction. It's adiabatic compression that heats up the air. The air molecules cannot get out of the way quickly enough. The plane turns into a giant piston compressing the air, heating it up.
wolf said it.. not for mass production! I do rem hearing that the hood for a Dodge car in Detriot took a full minute to make top and bottm shells slap together on hot metal..whammo: hood is made, and removed.. it was so volatile at at least once the site exploded!
Its like 3D printers for sheet metal, traditional plastic molds are still faster and better at scale, but 3D printers are Cheap and makes any custom design in a few hours.
That is pretty awesome, it would be perfect for things like prototyping and small runs of parts as well, that way if you want to change something you don’t have to make all new stamps
This is actually an old concept. I remember doing some research about Steel Pan instruments made in T and T. I think it was the government who was looking to invest in barrel sinking like this to speed up the manufacturing and have them go straight to the tuners. The project stopped due to lack of funding. Maybe this can start up again and more people could start playing?
Its a prototyping tool. Since you can quickly iterate the paths in the software suite and the part in CAD. The reason we use stamps is because its fast and cheap per part, but the dies wear out. Cars manufacturing run really lasts as long as the number of dies that got made are calculated to last. This here is painfully slow and expensive. Those robots in constant move an applying force eat up a lot of energy and run the maintenance clock up quickly.
It’s not meant to compete directly with stamp lines. It’s meant to do things stamping cannot do, like forming complex shapes, and it’s meant for iterative design. Iteration is not a thing with stamping, it takes too long and costs too much. Iterative design is not exactly prototyping either, so this lies somewhere in between.
Other methods don't take a couple of years to setup. To change the design, you change the tool. The advantage of this method OTOH is its flexibility, and therefore interesting for prototyping.
People have got this wrong. Roboforming isn't best for prototyping. It's for shaping titanium at room temperature (as he touched on at the end of the clip). Right now, shaping titanium is very difficult.
Also it is not the friction against the air that makes the airplane hot, it is actually the compression of the air at that speed that makes the plane hot.
This would be great for restoration pieces that only need to be made in very small amounts like replacement metal for old cars. How much does the machine cost?
I've been working as a prototype maker for the automation industry, and there's a reason we never get the contracts in the end 😅 Yeah, and we made stamp forms, they took a day or two. Not several years. So this might be a quick way to get one piece, but you need a hundred that things gonna be expensive!
Installing a new press line takes a couple of months, not years. The planning process is almost as long as the setup time for something this. Getting the configuration right takes time I'd admit, a year is good, less is great. But even that process is getting shorter and shorter as we improve technology.
A die for a stamping machine requires thousands of dollars to make, while this requires a person proficient with a CAD software to edit a couple of numbers. You can make thousands of different parts with this one set up, while a die will only ever make one part. That die will make the parts hundreds of times faster, but for prototyping that is not useful. This also can make shapes that a die cannot make. It does seem to have some serious tool marks though. Cool technology for sure.
Maintenance cost of Roboforming process is more as compared to conventional press / stamping method.... Conventional factories take time to setup but run operations for much much longer period of time without any error.
The real strength is being able to change a part quickly without extra cost. If you need a part changed, it would be a lot quicker and cheaper than manufacturing a new die.
What I'm hearing is since it only takes a few days to setup each year is going to have a new design and then each year won't be able to have interchangeable parts and repairs are going to become even more expensive than they already are.
No. You can't use this process for mass production. Also, every car manufacturer in the EU has to have parts available for 7-10 years after production start even if there is a new model coming out in that time.
No one meant how long the machine setup takes. They're talking about mass production. You can stamp a hood every 5 seconds for hours, and you're not going to waste expensive robots to do something that's way slower.
Speaking of melting aluminum due to friction at supersonic speeds, instead of forming aircraft out of soft metals, why not charge the surface of the "air"craft with sub-micro-tenatic plasma the way that extraterrestrial "flying?" craft do? Then you would also be able to travel through liquids as rapidly as you can through atmosphere because there would be no resistance whatsoever while also bending time, which, in essence, is really bending reality ... to your will.
It's definitely for smaller batches. If you are cranking out 2000 cars a day, you wouldn't use this to form the sheet metal. If you are cranking out 25 cars a day, you would.
$20,000 hood. It's good for prototyping
Just be rich, be so rich 200,000 k feels like 20$
How about the guys at Bitchin Rides? and all the custom cars that they do this would be mind blowing in the right hands
@@nexiuz2233 true dat
@steveanderson4768 and they would never be able to use it to any real value because even the rich have their limits to what they will spend and the ultra rich don't care if it's custom they just want the big name attached to it that says they are rich.
@@Xparkman30 yeah they don’t care about individuality. They just want the Ferrari name on it or the Lamborghini name on it or the Bugatti name on it. That’s all they care about.
This is not for mass production. This is more for very small runs or just prototyping. It also causes more fatiguing of the metal.
Maybe heat treat it after forming?
And surface finish is sh*t
@@tukangiseng heat treating will not fix fatigued metal. Its still going to be fatigued after the heat treatment. And its still going to look like ass
💯. I used to design booking and press machines. Project time usually landed in the 6-8 month time frame with machine installed on factory floor. This is assuming the company provided CAD files up front and no changes were made along the way. And thats with 1 engineer working on it. Still much faster than this nonsense.
Does it? If you’re doing a draw in a stamp or drawing it out like a potter, how does one increase fatigue than the other?
The beauty of this is that it can do things stamping can’t do, one he mentioned, another is forming shapes that are simply not possible with stamping.
As an ex die maker it does not take years, maybe a couple weeks max.
It takes a couple weeks to build the factory?
@@JohnnyDoeDoeDoe depends what country and square meterage, it's entirely possible to build a factory in a couple weeks, especially if it's precast.
@@troyjenkins5299how fast to interchange the entire assembly line to make a different part?
That's the part that takes weeks. Going from bare lot to full factory takes years. Often because the machinery has a huge lead time.@@FloofyTanker
@@FloofyTanker it really depends. Look at Tesla, they can get the bodies designed and made within a year (sorta time span, generally less) and the whole car within 3 years from paper to floor, majority of that design time is on the drive systems, the design (body/interior/entertainment system) and making it work on road (including crash tests) I only worked in Australia and our car designs were meh at the best of times, the cars did not really evolve in shape drastically to force a massive factory change IE the Holden Commodore and ford falcons only had about 3-4 massive iterations in the design.
It’s the same concept as 3D printing. It’s not for repeated assembly line manufacturing. It’s mainly for a variety of unique products and applications.
Plus molds are expensive.
Not at all like 3d printing
I've personally run off production lots of a single type of part with a 3D printer. You can do sequential printing that prints multiples of the same part one after another on the same print bed during the same run. Switch a file and multiples of a different part. So I have to disagree. A 3D printer can absolutely be used for mass production. With multiple machines the scale of production goes up as well. It all depends on the item size and machine build volume.
What type of mass production are you guys talking about? 100 parts a day or less? There's a reason that factories use molds and simple repeatable movements with large scale machines, because 3d printers just simply do not fill the scale required to produce enough money outside of a niche role to keep a business afloat, much less long term sustainable and growable.
One big machine, industrial capacity and reliability. Hundreds of 3d printers, millions of little parts and much more expensive per part and considering life time.
This machine and 3D printers are great for one offs and prototypes, but neither can or will work in an industrial or large scale commercial format. Too complex, too much movement, not designed with 24/7/365 heavy usage. One person working out of a small shop or garage, maybe.
@@namelesscage look into SLS printing. It is a form of 3d printing which is used in production. Not everyone is using $200 Walmart printers although production batches in the 10000s and more can and are being done in print farms of similar machines. Some machines are run for even larger batches. Look into continuous belt printers.
So, basically what 3d printing is compared to injection molding?
Exactly.
Yes
Except even less practical as this only does work on malleable sheets which is something presses have been doing well for centuries with very few drawbacks compared to injection molding.
@@skitidet4302 so to clarify you are saying that pressing doesn’t need a 3d printer equivalent because it is more efficient than injection molding was to 3d printing therefore there is no need for a dedicated machine for when those inefficiencies that do exist make a press impractical.
If so that is a fair enough opinion though depends on how much these really cost.
@@dragonlogos1 Yea, You can press almost any shape you would want, and if you for some reason want some weird shape that you can't press, you can just weld it on later.
Injection molding however has more severe limitations, there are many things that you would want to do that you simply can't do. You often have to design to fit the technology instead of the technology fitting the design. This is true to some degree with pressing but not nearly as bad, it's mostly just optimization.
However, for real manufacturing, 3d printing is pretty horrendous as well. What's the best case? You create the part using a real expensive machine that slowly welds on more material? For 99.99% of conceivable jobs this is going to be vastly more expensive and time consuming than just cutting out pieces out of sheets of steel and welding them together. Do you know how much welding wire cost? It's A LOT more than steel! Then add in the time and quality control issues... oh and the power to run an welder for days straight.
Correction: Forming sheet titanium is totally possible and has been done for decades. I think what you might mean is cold forming, which is more true, but still not completely. Titanium is difficult to form without heat, and so either simple forming and hot presses are the typical route.
Bender from Futurama
1.0 baby!
I am Bender. Please insert girder.
⚙️
Bender Bending Rodriguez, the 40% Titanium beer drinking and cigar smoking Mexican industrial bending robot
Bender's cousin Shaper or Former.
Destin from Smartereveryday has an EXCELLENT video on this subject, if you haven't seen it, you're missing out on some mind blowing technological advances. Seriously bananas stuff and worth watching.
This is cool for R&D, 1 off parts, and small batch production. Very neat.
Nice for prototyping without having to build presses for each individual attempt or making custom pieces
maybe the day will come where you can download a file and the machine will form a classic car for you.
Yea I'd you can afford metal lol. Finding metal that hasn't been recycled and amalgamated with other garbage to the point its so weak will probably be expensive soon.
You wouldn't download a car
3D printing guns kicked the door open.
STC
What is the cycle time? A big press can run steady at 7-10 strokes per minute 24-7 if you want. Them robots look like it takes forever just to get a few parts per day. You gonna buy a thousand robots?
Downside is the parts it can produce in a day. A press can produce much many more pieces in the same of time. Although as you pointed out, the setup time is infinitely shorter. This is great for prototyping
Setup time for a part in a stamping factory can take about a few hours. It only involves changing the die u are stamping. Making the die takes a few weeks. U dont set up a new factory or a new production line for every single new part you manufacture.
@@sultanhusnoo8552 few weeks for the die, yes your right you are missing the cost. You may also need more than one die for a single part. producing a new die is normally not practical for small runs or prototypes. It is difficult for any newer technology ( be that this, turrets, lasers or press brakes)to keep up with the production speed of stamping.
@@elingeniero2000 digitizing a part might be as expensive as creating a die. Costs money to digitize parts, far from free.
This machine is for prototyping or super limited runs.
Need 100 or more, die will be cheaper and faster.
@@theboringchannel2027do you think we don’t make dies using digitalized information? Who doesn’t design in a digitalized state in this day and age?
And custom work, legacy replacements parts, local logistic availability. Really it has a lot of uses.
If I’m not mistaken, the heat in front of an airplane isn’t from friction with air, but actually from the intense compression of the air in front of it.
Yes, that heat, that is in front of the object going through the gas, is from the compression of the gas.
But there is also heating from the gas moving along side the object.
Probably this feller was using the most easily understandable ideo for the most amount of people to understand in a good, informative, attention grabbing Short.
Under pressure dadadadada
Smarter every day did an episode on this. It was pretty cool
It does not take years to set up a machine for stamping sheet metal. If you need a small run you can set it up in a place similar to where you just were.
They wouldn't have to take a couple years to set up if the government stopped interfering in private businesses. A whole plant could be built from ground up in 6 months to a year.
Golf ball dimple an entire car to make it more aerodynamic. * Edit : I know about how it works, and that it has been done. I was being a smarta**. However with newer technology it could be done at much less expense to prototype compared to back then.
That’s been done already and it works. You want to buy a dimpled car?
Sir, they're called speed holes. Get it right. 😂
Did you watch Mythbusters as a kid?
The point of golf ball dimples is to achieve an effect called tripping the boundary layer... You don't have to put dimples all over your car to trip the boundary layer and induce turbulence. Besides, tripping the boundary layer is only beneficial in a very specific set of circumstances. For most cars tripping the boundary layer is detrimental to gas mileage.
@timothyfeist7364 the show started the year I graduated and left for the Air Force.
I watched a video on this a few years ago I’m glad to see it start taking off on a larger scale
Sounds like getting a replacement will be expensive
I remember when they first started doing this, it wasn't that long ago either! But it looks like it's come pretty far already.
Technology is so wild these days it's amazing
It's amazing and depressing at the same time.. because we All saw the projected future as kids or from the 50s to the 90s and we are never going to see what we thought we would. Like space elevators.
This is medieval tech done using robots instead of people.
Nothing new other then robots doing it.
This is amazing!!! This will allow so much custom work. It’s going to be expensive at first but in the future it will be more widely available. This is really cool
Thats forming titanium... Not sheet metal... Titanium is britle and has to be formed in a specific manner.
Sheet titanium = sheet metal
Sheet aluminum = sheet metal
Sheet steel = sheet metal
Semantics aside, most people do envelope most all sheet steels under the umbrella of sheet metal.
@@MrGregsRnR I get what you mean lol, sheet ti isn't toooo common. And usually it's not formed it's cut & welded in common place applications outside aerospace stuff.
Or shit metal in that case 😂😂
I think you need like 250,000 pound press.
I know they didn't have one when they made the SR71. But they sure wanted one.
It's stated in a video they can form titanium at room temperature, something that often isn't achieved with pressing as you have to heat the titanium to make it more pliable?
I'm not a metallurgy expert, but it is exciting what they're able to do with any sheet metal.
I think a much simpler design could be made for cheaper set ups
Put a series of high density crush foams under the part
You could even have a reool
Put a sacrificial crush material on the under side to press against
Keep adding crush material layers like a 3d printer in reverse
For weak thin materials like paper or foil you could use Styrofoam
For stronger thicker materials you could use low density concrete, etc
You might not get all the freedoms of the multi jointed double arm set up
But you could make very sturdy simple pathway for very cheap
$50,000 ish for a matching the machine in the video capabilities
12"*12" set up for $2-$5k
You could also use a roto hammer to apply pressure, greatly reducing how beefy you need the structure
There could be problems with resonance causing fractures and weakening the part of the crush material in unintended ways
But i think it could be overcome or isolated with some tweaking
You could also make a movable typeface design
Essentially have a CNC aim the punch on a lightweight system, then have a different rig press the punch
Like how a printing press is set and pressed, you essentially you aim hit aim hit, like a mouse directing a giant swinging a hammer
Ha, we used to joke with newbies to “go find the metal stretcher”… that joke’s now dead! 😂
We still tell em to get the wire stretcher and sky hooks or go to the tool crib for a long stand.
That joke always was dead: a metal stretcher exists, it's often combined with a shrinker by using a different set of beaks. In its simplest form it's a manual tool that can be carried by one person.
I would.bring back a ball peen hammer. Have fun.
The biggest benefit to it is its versatility and how it can adapt
It has so ultra high costs that it’s only worth it for super well funded special machinery.
Most manufacturers have tons of these robots for welding. So most of the cost is already sitting around and easy modifications.
@@Random-ed2xf i think this is such an understatement! It’s not an easy modification at all. This is like a day and night difference from robot welding, which is a completely different and difficult task (and a relatively high level of customization).
I think reshaping brings this to another level.
For the reshaping you need to know the exact behavior of the robot on behalf of reaction forces and pathtaking, of the material, of the wear and tear. The control system must be highly sophisticated because the robot works autonomous and on an inhomogenous material with possibly changing environment parameters. Every error adds up.
You can’t simply „teach“ it like it might be possible with welding.
And the cost of ownership and processing cost per part will still be huge.
I remember when I first saw this it was put across as this amazing new thing. But I know custom sheet metal guys who have been doing advanced metal forming for decades. The difference here is that types of materials that may be formed.
Yeah completely the same as the old way except for the time, energy, cost of ownership, required skills, and logistic management involved but besides those things totally not a useful tech
I'm not a metallurgist, but I have to wonder what kind of stresses this puts the material under. It's not just bending the metal, but stretching it.
Same issue with stamping no?
I mean, most presses do the same thing
Theres a whole video on this type of machine. It complicated but actually worth it vs having a steel/graphite mold made for pressing.
Metal has no problem stretching a bit theres a ton of testing to know how far you can stretch certain metals thin before they cross the threshold of being too brittle.
Same with forging, you can heat treat to allow for the stresses to be relived but also yhese stresses can be used to kodify then physical properties to your benefit. Lots of questions for the eningeers designing the part.
So, no different than stamping
This could have its uses for niche items, but not mass production.
It’s technology solving a problem that doesn’t exist.
Oh it exists. Otherwise this tech wouldn’t.
@@tylerfb1 prove it exists
@@gribboffroad6963 first off, no one creates technology like this unless there was a need to be met. In other words, the fact that it exists proves there's a need.
But it does things that no other technology can do. Primarily it forms metal in the same way that stamping does, but it can do more complex shapes than pressing can. It was really built to support iterative design however. Iterative design is a process of doing as much engineering as necessary, but as little as possible so that the part can be built and tested to refine the design. It isn't exactly prototyping, but it isn't mass production either. In order to do that with metal, a press isn't used because the process of making dies is too slow and costly to do it efficiently. So you're forced to either use simple shapes, or slowed down by the assembly of simple shapes into complex ones. With this machine, you can put a piece of sheet metal in the machine and out comes a very complex formed part in a few hours.
@tylerfb1 For sheet metal this is medieval tech it is the exact same as plate armor in that time period just with robots instead of people doing the work.
Calling this a new way of doing it is insane.
@@havtor007 Obviously humans learned how to form metal since we first refined it, and the molecular mechanics involved don’t change. But this is not hammered or rolled sheet. This shapes metal like a press but it has capabilities that have never existed before.
I wouldn’t call this process “new”… well at least I wouldn’t call it new.
We’ve been trying this out since 2010, but only to the extent of custom pots n pans. The only accurate application I remember using for was making a topographic mold of a mountain range.
It's just like 3d printing. You can even make out individual layers where the machine went over line by line, like on layer printers. Idk why people are critically pointing out the disadvantages of that or its unsuitability for mass production as if the designers didn't know those things when they designed this _obvious special application tool._ They made those tradeoffs because that's the purpose of what they were doing. I think it's neat for prototyping.
The shapes formed from stamping strengthens the metal (due to even application of pressure) unlike robo-forming which weakens it, and the extra cost for surfacing the metal for finishes and tempering makes it more expensive for vehicle production.
The application I see for this is rapid reproduction of sheet metal parts for rare out of production cars and aircraft. by scanning the old worn out metal and roboforming the replacement part.
Though that may also be taken over by 3d printing using metal powder.
Its good for prototyping and small runs only.
A factory takes a few years to set up but those that do stamping typically do it for thousands of parts and some factories do it for dozens of companies. The factory takes years to setup but the die for a part only takes a few weeks to make and maybe a few hours to swap out from one to the other.
Also, as some1 mentionned, this also causes stress on the metal. Small runs or prototyping only for this.
I've seen around 100500 new technologies that were promising to revolutionise "rapid prototyping". Turns out all the engineers who were capable of utilizing such tech to its full extent to actually DO the rapid prototyping stayed in 1970's. Woopsie😅
Seems like this will be good for rich people buying expensive tailored cars. Not for a wage slave peasant like myself
Great for prototyping, doing small runs and producing shapes that can't be stamped.
Its never going to threaten stamping but it will allow new things to be done.
I believe this will be a common thing in the future. With Little 3D scanning and some Robo-forming, you can bend any sheet to any form. Be it a fixing a crushed car plates, a custom plate for any use, or re-engineering of already existing forms for optimization. The possibilities are endless and the development of the technology itself is going to be so progressive in ten years this will probably be in one out of ten car repairs shops or so.
I spent eight years setting up stamping presses, the press isn't the issue. This robotic setup is great for R&D and prototyping or even low quantity manufacturing, but not large scale production. The design and production of the die itself can be expensive, but you need to calculate the trade-off of that cost versus the slow production rate of the robotic method. Either way it's pretty cool
One thing I like about this is that it is essentially forging, the final part should be exceptionally strong unlike shitty 3d printing.
good video, audio is a little scuffed.
Its viable for customised design for automotive and aerospace industries.
They actually need something like this.
Inductive 3D is a good idea to consider as well as the pressure of the arms and press the button train the arms came firsthand literally
The one use I see off the bat is making sheet metal molds for composites. Once you have the sheet you glass it on the back, add pegs and you're all set for a great mold for prepreg or wel layup
Everytime I open comments on such videos. There are always people who have a different perspective, who carefully Criticize stating their observations and knowledge. Every new innovation will receive criticism just bcoz it doesnt fit for one or another application. I guess thats how the world works. Im just so delighted to see fellow engineers commenting here.
Traditional ways are the way to go because they stamp a part every 5 seconds or so. Plus they have superbe surface finish amd accuracy.
This is really great for hobbyists and small facilities, because in order to stamp metal in the normal way, you have to spend the time and money to build the cast and die. With this, you don't have to have a cast and die
You gotta remember that when you’re doing normal manufacturing your manufacturing thousands and thousands and thousands of the same part it makes it hard to make one thing and see if it’s good for prototyping because you have to make thousands of product and then see that they don’t work to make other products. It’s really expensive. So this metal sheet forming is actually exceedingly beneficiary for prototyping because it takes a few days for you to have your prototype and then you can decide if you want to make more or if you need to make a change
¿No provoca tensiones o fatiga de materiales en las piezas acabadas? Es pura curiosidad, no una crítica.
Looks really cool & I’m intrigued to see where it goes. I think the stepped nature of it will minimize its applications or drive much higher times for precision pieces
Looks like you could form intricate details too. How difficult is forming on a third axis? Sort of 3D printing.
Seems like this should have been possible sooner.
This isn't for mass production. It's like a 3D printer. It's mostly for prototyping and maybe some complex things like the titanium stuff, as you said
In silversmithing this way of making is called chasing and repousse. You set the work in pitch (it's resistant wax) and hammer it in and out to make complex shapes
What's the name of the company?
I was thinking exactly the same thing. It looks like a technology that is very useful for prototyping.
But I am also curious to the accuracy of this technology. If you're deforming material like that you are slightly stretching a lot of other places.
Check out the smarter every day episode to answer this, really interesting
This is how the seamless UFO are made.
If you're doing low volume stuff, use composites. Lighter and stronger.
This will not be fast enough for mass production but I can see it offering massive cost and time savings when used for iterative design, prototyping and testing.
It's not friction. It's adiabatic compression that heats up the air. The air molecules cannot get out of the way quickly enough. The plane turns into a giant piston compressing the air, heating it up.
wolf said it.. not for mass production! I do rem hearing that the hood for a Dodge car in Detriot took a full minute to make top and bottm shells slap together on hot metal..whammo: hood is made, and removed.. it was so volatile at at least once the site exploded!
Its like 3D printers for sheet metal, traditional plastic molds are still faster and better at scale, but 3D printers are Cheap and makes any custom design in a few hours.
That is pretty awesome, it would be perfect for things like prototyping and small runs of parts as well, that way if you want to change something you don’t have to make all new stamps
This is actually an old concept. I remember doing some research about Steel Pan instruments made in T and T. I think it was the government who was looking to invest in barrel sinking like this to speed up the manufacturing and have them go straight to the tuners. The project stopped due to lack of funding. Maybe this can start up again and more people could start playing?
Its a prototyping tool. Since you can quickly iterate the paths in the software suite and the part in CAD. The reason we use stamps is because its fast and cheap per part, but the dies wear out. Cars manufacturing run really lasts as long as the number of dies that got made are calculated to last.
This here is painfully slow and expensive. Those robots in constant move an applying force eat up a lot of energy and run the maintenance clock up quickly.
It’s not meant to compete directly with stamp lines. It’s meant to do things stamping cannot do, like forming complex shapes, and it’s meant for iterative design. Iteration is not a thing with stamping, it takes too long and costs too much.
Iterative design is not exactly prototyping either, so this lies somewhere in between.
This would be good for rapid proto typing that leads to more efficient stamping creation.
Other methods don't take a couple of years to setup. To change the design, you change the tool. The advantage of this method OTOH is its flexibility, and therefore interesting for prototyping.
People have got this wrong. Roboforming isn't best for prototyping. It's for shaping titanium at room temperature (as he touched on at the end of the clip). Right now, shaping titanium is very difficult.
Flexibility versus speed, sometimes that might be a good trade. If you’re doing small runs, it’s probably even worth it.
I can see this as being used for Prototyping, Custom Designs, and *_maybe_* as an interim solution for wartime production.
also very good for small quantity production. As those arm you can program to do anything. Stamps can only stamp their stamp
Also it is not the friction against the air that makes the airplane hot, it is actually the compression of the air at that speed that makes the plane hot.
For prototyping sheet metal it's amazing. Then for mass production, it will be better to CNC a stamp. That's cool
This would be great for restoration pieces that only need to be made in very small amounts like replacement metal for old cars.
How much does the machine cost?
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This is great if you want to customize the part everytime coz dials are expensive but not really any good for mass production
I've been working as a prototype maker for the automation industry, and there's a reason we never get the contracts in the end 😅
Yeah, and we made stamp forms, they took a day or two. Not several years. So this might be a quick way to get one piece, but you need a hundred that things gonna be expensive!
For some reason everything with dies is anyways exaggerated as super expensive. 3d printer: quick and cheap. Stamping: moonshot project
The Lunch Line food Trays will....POP !!!!
Installing a new press line takes a couple of months, not years.
The planning process is almost as long as the setup time for something this.
Getting the configuration right takes time I'd admit, a year is good, less is great. But even that process is getting shorter and shorter as we improve technology.
Amazing tech. How about using similarly amazing microphone?
All manufacturing innovations are exciting to me. 😊
No mention of the company that does this. It’s Machina Labs in Chatsworth, CA
A die for a stamping machine requires thousands of dollars to make, while this requires a person proficient with a CAD software to edit a couple of numbers. You can make thousands of different parts with this one set up, while a die will only ever make one part. That die will make the parts hundreds of times faster, but for prototyping that is not useful. This also can make shapes that a die cannot make. It does seem to have some serious tool marks though. Cool technology for sure.
Maintenance cost of Roboforming process is more as compared to conventional press / stamping method.... Conventional factories take time to setup but run operations for much much longer period of time without any error.
The real strength is being able to change a part quickly without extra cost. If you need a part changed, it would be a lot quicker and cheaper than manufacturing a new die.
I feel like it worth noting that the sr71 is mostly titanium so we can build aircraft out of titanium it just might not be as costs effective
it is much, much, much slower than press manufacturing, but, for prototyping its awesome. just like 3d printing
It doesnt take years to setup the old school stamping presses. This is some cool tech that would be great for custom parts.
What I'm hearing is since it only takes a few days to setup each year is going to have a new design and then each year won't be able to have interchangeable parts and repairs are going to become even more expensive than they already are.
No. You can't use this process for mass production. Also, every car manufacturer in the EU has to have parts available for 7-10 years after production start even if there is a new model coming out in that time.
No one meant how long the machine setup takes. They're talking about mass production. You can stamp a hood every 5 seconds for hours, and you're not going to waste expensive robots to do something that's way slower.
Prototyping and niche high value products; I could see this being great for.
Speaking of melting aluminum due to friction at supersonic speeds, instead of forming aircraft out of soft metals, why not charge the surface of the "air"craft with sub-micro-tenatic plasma the way that extraterrestrial "flying?" craft do? Then you would also be able to travel through liquids as rapidly as you can through atmosphere because there would be no resistance whatsoever while also bending time, which, in essence, is really bending reality ... to your will.
Extremely cool, can it be done so it doesn't look like 3d printing?
Would it be correct to say that this is to stamping the way that 3d-printers are to injection?
Right, except all the old heads in charge will scoff at it, ignore it it and continue doing everything "the way it's always been done"
It's definitely for smaller batches. If you are cranking out 2000 cars a day, you wouldn't use this to form the sheet metal. If you are cranking out 25 cars a day, you would.
Kuka robotics are just impressive
Looks like an improvement of the english wheel. How old was that?